Bikers Attack Range Rover Driver (vid)

alberchico · Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:13 am

Has anyone been following this story ? Its been big news here in the NYC area.

http://jalopnik.com/everything-you-n...t-the-terrifying-suv-vs-1440131015

http://oppositelock.jalopnik.com/the...-see-1435594427/1436603736/@orlove

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...t-free-officials-article-1.1473800

To me it appears that the bikers started the confrontation and then it escalated out of control. I guess many people in a dangerous situation like that would have reacted by stepping on the gas.

zkojq · Thu Oct 03, 2013 4:21 am

Scary. Looks like a scene from GTA.

Quoting alberchico (Thread starter):
the bikers started the confrontation and then it escalated out of control

They seemed to be looking for trouble so I have no sympathy for them. Pity the Range Rover driver didn't manage to remove more of them.

WestJet747 · Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:41 pm

I have zero sympathy for the bikers, especially the first one who had to be an utter moron to brake-check only a few feet in front of a moving SUV.

I'm hoping all of these goons are promptly rounded up and charged.

What makes this even more heinous is that the bikers had a total disregard for the wife and child in the vehicle.

Quoting alberchico (Thread starter):
I guess many people in a dangerous situation like that would have reacted by stepping on the gas.

I can't say for certain without actually being put in that situation, but I probably would have.

RussianJet · Thu Oct 03, 2013 2:50 pm

I think both parties behaved completely unacceptably. If you find yourself in an incident like the one that we first saw sparking this whole thing off, you call the Police - you don't ram people out the way. It's understandable reaction to some extent, but it's not the correct one. However, the bikers definitely caused this whole thing.

WestJet747 · Thu Oct 03, 2013 3:44 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 3):
If you find yourself in an incident like the one that we first saw sparking this whole thing off, you call the Police - you don't ram people out the way.

I discussed this very briefly with a colleague who is from NYC. He says that depending where you are in the city, the response times by police for a "minor" call like this would be terrible.

I understand your argument from the standpoint of a guy in a big SUV...but in this case he also had his wife and small child to consider. I don't have a kid, but I can safely say that if they were threatened I would have no problem running over the threat.

RussianJet · Thu Oct 03, 2013 3:50 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 4):
I understand your argument from the standpoint of a guy in a big SUV...but in this case he also had his wife and small child to consider. I don't have a kid, but I can safely say that if they were threatened I would have no problem running over the threat.

Like I say, it's understandable. However, I'm not 100% clear on what actually went on at the start. It looked as though they just boxed him in for no good reason, other than perhaps to make mischief. Had something happened prior to that? Were they actually trying to attack at that stage?

WestJet747 · Thu Oct 03, 2013 4:07 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 5):
Had something happened prior to that? Were they actually trying to attack at that stage?

You can't reliably tell from the video, but some reporters are saying that one of the bikers was yelling and may have punched the SUV's door/window once or twice which prompted the driver to take off. I don't know how accurate those accounts are, it's just what I heard on the news. If that happens to be true, then I don't blame the driver.

RussianJet · Thu Oct 03, 2013 4:09 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 6):

You can't reliably tell from the video, but some reporters are saying that one of the bikers was yelling and may have punched the SUV's door/window once or twice which prompted the driver to take off. I don't know how accurate those accounts are, it's just what I heard on the news. If that happens to be true, then I don't blame the driver.

It's a shame we don't have a clearer picture on that aspect. For me, it's pretty crucial in determining the proportionality of the driver's reaction.

smittyone · Thu Oct 03, 2013 4:35 pm

I wonder if the bikers would have been so 'badass' in this case had they perceived a reasonable potential for the driver to be legally armed.

Thanks to the laws in a place like NYC, thugs can be pretty certain that any 'law abiding' types are easy picking.

(Edit: Not my intent to start a gun debate but something to think about. That guy in the SUV must have felt pretty helpless, with his family at risk besides.)

[Edited 2013-10-03 10:02:37]

alberchico · Thu Oct 03, 2013 4:46 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 5):
However, I'm not 100% clear on what actually went on at the start. It looked as though they just boxed him in for no good reason, other than perhaps to make mischief. Had something happened prior to that?

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=720_1380571291

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=3cd_1380579664

Apparently what they do is clear up a stretch of highway in order to perform stunts. By brake checking the SUV they were probably trying to get him to back off and give them some room. The NYPD received some 200 911 calls from concerned motorists that day regarding the behavior of bikers. Considering the way that they were recklessly driving throughout the city something was bound to happen.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/201.../jHju3V1xAOsdF6Q2vT8BaL/story.html

It now seems the man who was run over did not have a Massachusetts license despite being a resident of that state. So what was he doing riding a bike ???

''In June, the Registry notified the National Driver Register that Mieses was a habitual traffic offender whose right to drive in Massachusetts was revoked until 2017, records show.''

If he was driving without a license that will hurt him in any civil litigation...

[Edited 2013-10-03 09:47:57]

soon7x7 · Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:12 pm

Bunghole bikers!...One recently was killed pulling a wheelie on the Southern State Parkway, Long Island...Instant suicide, as he subsequently was run over by 5 vehicles..."What did you expect?!"...Stupid is as stupid does. One less dangerous driver on the road for the rest of us.

Acheron · Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:14 pm

A mob of bikers being douchebags?. Unsurprising.

Crotch rockets seem to turn most people into complete assholes. I would have ran over as many of them as I could on the way out.

Quoting SmittyOne (Reply 8):
Thanks to the laws in a place like NYC, thugs can be pretty certain that any 'law abiding' types are easy picking.

(Edit: Not my intent to start a gun debate but something to think about. That guy in the SUV must have felt pretty helpless, with his family at risk besides.)

That assumes that only the driver would have been armed and not shot in the back by one of these assholes that could have carried a gun as well.

I mean, what are the odds of someone among 200 people not having a gun as well?. Heck, they already had a knife capable of slashing a tyre.

AirPacific747 · Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:22 pm

I hope the bikers learned that this is not the way to handle such a situation. A few weeks ago I saw a clip on youtube from an epsiode in Russia where almost the same thing happens. A gang of motorbikers threaten a guy in a car who reacts by ramming one of the motorcycles and drives away. Probably the guy in the Range Rover understandably was very scared and feared for his wife and childs and his own life and had to protect himself the only way he could.

Dreadnought · Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:30 pm

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 12):

I hope the bikers learned that this is not the way to handle such a situation.

Doubtful. Next time, they will escalate more violently and faster.

AirPacific747 · Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:39 pm

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 13):

And so will the driver. Fantastic.

ImperialEagle · Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:44 pm

The bikers were idots. As if being on a bike somehow relieved them of any responsibility---- they felt above the law.
They are lucky more of them didn't get run over because if it had been my family being threatened like that there would have been a lot more run over.

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 3):
you call the Police

A lot of people have been injured and killed waiting for the police to get there. Sometimes you just have to be as aggressive as your attackers and protect yourself and your loved ones. The world is full of crazy, lawless people. I am from Atlanta. I can tell you all about it.

RussianJet · Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:48 pm

Quoting ImperialEagle (Reply 15):
A lot of people have been injured and killed waiting for the police to get there. Sometimes you just have to be as aggressive as your attackers and protect yourself and your loved ones. The world is full of crazy, lawless people. I am from Atlanta. I can tell you all about it.

Sure, but from the first video it appeared that did nothing but ride antisocially, hence my comment. If they were threatened with a gun or something straight off then obviously I wouldn't expect him just to sit there and drum his fingers for a few minutes or ten until the help arrived.

WingsFan · Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:48 pm

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 14):

I hope the bikers learned that this is not the way to handle such a situation

Impossible! The only lessons these idiots will learn is to not make the video footage public.

Such a shame. I can't believe these hundreds of bikers can bring an entire neighborhood under lockdown without being challenged by cops, at the same time blatantly disregard the most basic traffic rules.

WingsFan

CaliAtenza · Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:59 pm

reading about this on another forum, it seems these guys are a legit criminal gang and they do this more often than not in the NYC area. They tend to target Asian or other wealthy looking people. The "brake checking" move that one of the bikers did in the beginning is all part of their routine. They will then try to beat up the driver or steal money from them...

pvjin · Thu Oct 03, 2013 8:11 pm

Next time those idiots do something like that someone should go and overrun as many of them as possible, worthless losers they are.

NoUFO · Thu Oct 03, 2013 8:54 pm

Quoting caliatenza (Reply 18):
The "brake checking" move that one of the bikers did in the beginning is all part of their routine.

This one probably won't do that routine anymore. I read his doctors suspect he's paralyzed. If so, that asshole could work the brakes on his wheelchair, though, and see if he can scare next door's grandma.

ImperialEagle · Thu Oct 03, 2013 8:59 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 16):
I wouldn't expect him just to sit there and drum his fingers for a few minutes or ten until the help arrived.

Oh yeah. I knew what you meant----just clarifying my opinion on it.

Since I am now "semi-retired" from Funeral Service

the guys send me out of town a lot on fairly local transfers.
I like to get out of the "office" and take in the sights anyway. I am constantly watching some of the idiots on the road using their vehicles as weapons just because they dislike someone's driving habits. The Tractor-Trailer rigs are the absolute worst. I see it all the time. Terrible. They swoop right on up to someone's bumper---within inches. Sometimes the other driver didn't even do a thing and I've had them do it to me as well. You really have to be a dumb-a$$ to play chicken with a hearse.That's how a lot of the bodies I transfer ended up in the hearse anyway! I've had to re-attach a lot of heads and limbs in my day and using a vehicle as a weapon is just bad news any way you look at it.

Did those dumb-a$$es on the motorcycles think they could "win" doing battle with a 'Rover? Idiots.

I have observed that in the cities where there a lot of bicyclists, motorists are expected to look out for them but they seem to have no regard for the motorists at all. I was at a Four-Way Stop type intersection in Atlanta last week and people on bicycles were sailing right through the Stops with total abandon. WTF? I know it's Atlanta and all that but do these people think they are above the law or just invincible?

mham001 · Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:30 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 3):
If you find yourself in an incident like the one that we first saw sparking this whole thing off, you call the Police

Thats pretty funny. In that you think this would save you in the next seconds. Anyway, it is said he did - several times and yet he drove for miles without seeing a cop.

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 5):
It looked as though they just boxed him in for no good reason, other than perhaps to make mischief.

They also sometimes stage an accident and with intimidation, extort money for "rear-ending" a poor defenseless bike.

Quoting alberchico (Reply 9):
If he was driving without a license that will hurt him in any civil litigation...

He has never had a license.

EA CO AS · Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:50 pm

Quoting ImperialEagle (Reply 21):
I have observed that in the cities where there a lot of bicyclists, motorists are expected to look out for them but they seem to have no regard for the motorists at all.

This. Both for bicyclists and motorcycle riders alike.

bristolflyer · Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:59 pm

At the last count it looks like the RR driver isn't facing any charges. One of the biker

Quoting NoUFO (Reply 20):
This one probably won't do that routine anymore. I read his doctors suspect he's paralyzed.

I think the guy who did the brake checking wasn't the guy who got run over.

vikkyvik · Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:39 pm

Quoting bristolflyer (Reply 24):
I think the guy who did the brake checking wasn't the guy who got run over.

It wasn't. The guy who did the brake checking was charged with reckless driving and endangering a child or something like that.

The guy who got run over hasn't been charged with anything to my knowledge.

My favorite quote is from his aunt:

"This man with a Range Rover and luxury lifestyle — it's OK for him to do something to someone because he rides a bike or has tattoos?" she said.

I guess she didn't watch the video....

Continental · Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:06 pm

I'm not sure if I'd be able to get away in my Honda Accord. I'd probably get stuck on a motorcycle.

mham001 · Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:08 pm

This will be a windfall for Range Rover.

ual747den · Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:19 pm

I don't blame the guy at all, if these guys tried that with me my 9 would be picking them off one by one and I would justify it because my life was threatened. Same idea this guy used the weapon he had which was his car and I don't blame him one bit.

alberchico · Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:22 pm

Quoting mham001 (Reply 27):
This will be a windfall for Range Rover.

Some smart ass has already started a Facebook page for the rover involved in the incident:

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Justice-For-Rover/718479728166870

And a company in Texas that created armored vehicles has released a quick commercial touting the ways their product could have protected the occupants during a similar incident:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7tQR6KtkIU

Mike89406 · Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:41 pm

Although the paralyzed guy didn't necessarily harass the driver he should've waited for the area to be safe to help his friend. He put himself in harms way so there's that.

Had the SUV driver stopped and called 911 someone could've brandished a weapon and off'd him and family in seconds. Sometimes you don't have time to think and have to decide if you want to live or not.

Seems like justice will be served but hopefully doesn't become a civil rights issue like Trayvon. The wife of the comatose biker wants justice, silent protests and social media to raise money. Only a matter of time before Al Sharpton gets involved.

When I lived in NY there were many times where motorcycles were driving recklessly, popping wheelies on the freeway, driving fast while splitting the lanes. All some one has to do is open a door or swerve and the bikers are toast.

mham001 · Fri Oct 04, 2013 2:06 am

The upcoming Terrain Control System 2014 Range Rover Sport (for Sportbike)

DeltaMD90 · Fri Oct 04, 2013 2:27 am

Even if the guy had a gun, how much you wanna bet one or two of the hundreds of bikers were armed? I doubt I'd be using a gun if I was in that situation

alberchico · Fri Oct 04, 2013 2:52 am

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 32):
Even if the guy had a gun, how much you wanna bet one or two of the hundreds of bikers were armed? I doubt I'd be using a gun if I was in that situation

Well considering that the SUV driver was allegedly slashed in the face with a knife, some of them were carrying weapons.

EA CO AS · Fri Oct 04, 2013 4:13 am

Attorney Mark Geragos was on AC360 tonight arguing that the driver of the SUV was criminally liable for driving over the biker in question. I'm no attorney, but I have a hard time believing he's liable when the biker in question was one of many other bikers who had intentionally created a roadblock using their bikes and bodies with the intent of unlawfully detaining the SUV and its occupants.

[Edited 2013-10-03 21:13:53]

Mike89406 · Fri Oct 04, 2013 4:59 am

Here's another video of the same group in 2011 attacking a Toyota Prius. http://youtu.be/aReFR6GaqKw
Type in Hollywood Stuntz on Youtube and you'll find more vids.

[Edited 2013-10-03 22:19:04]

Maverick623 · Fri Oct 04, 2013 4:59 am

Quoting NoUFO (Reply 20):
I read his doctors suspect he's paralyzed. If so, that asshole could work the brakes on his wheelchair

"And if you can't drive with a broken back, at least you can polish the fenders."

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 32):
Even if the guy had a gun, how much you wanna bet one or two of the hundreds of bikers were armed? I doubt I'd be using a gun if I was in that situation

Yep. Even if you had a 30 round magazine, you might pick off one or two before the mob overwhelms you. The vehicle was a far more effective weapon.

bristolflyer · Fri Oct 04, 2013 8:43 am

Quoting Mike89406 (Reply 35):
Here's another video of the same group in 2011 attacking a Toyota Prius. http://youtu.be/aReFR6GaqKw

Wow, that's incredible - totally lawless. How many red lights did he go through (on the wrong side of the road)? Looked like he was doing about 40mph on that sidewalk.

Mike89406 · Fri Oct 04, 2013 9:18 am

Quoting bristolflyer (Reply 37):

Yeah I lost count, lol. Problem is Edwin Mieses'd family are going after the SUV drivers money and playing the sympathy card. They hired a high profile lawyer should be interesting.

Kiwirob · Fri Oct 04, 2013 9:25 am

Quoting ual747den (Reply 28):
I don't blame the guy at all, if these guys tried that with me my 9 would be picking them off one by one and I would justify it because my life was threatened.

You're kidding right, so you jump from your SUV and start unloading on the bikers, you'd have to expect out of the 200 of so guys on bikes many of them are also probably armed, you'd end up with a bloodbath in the streets, this was one situation that having weapons would have made it so much worse than done any good. Once the bullets start flying your wife and child in the car are probably in far more danger than they were before.

moo · Fri Oct 04, 2013 9:47 am

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 3):
If you find yourself in an incident like the one that we first saw sparking this whole thing off, you call the Police

One of the articles states that he did apparently call the police very early on, but they failed to respond.

Quoting alberchico (Reply 33):
Well considering that the SUV driver was allegedly slashed in the face with a knife, some of them were carrying weapons.

As his tyres were slashed as well, I'd say thats proof enough.

cmf · Fri Oct 04, 2013 10:43 am

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 34):
Attorney Mark Geragos was on AC360 tonight arguing that the driver of the SUV was criminally liable for driving over the biker in question. I'm no attorney, but I have a hard time believing he's liable when the biker in question was one of many other bikers who had intentionally created a roadblock using their bikes and bodies with the intent of unlawfully detaining the SUV and its occupants.

I spent yesterday at a law firm and it it was pretty interesting to see how people who frequently handle cases like this were split down the middle. The only thing they agreed on is that there are a lot of open questions and it is the answers to them that will decide.

smittyone · Fri Oct 04, 2013 12:56 pm

Quoting Acheron (Reply 11):
That assumes that only the driver would have been armed and not shot in the back by one of these assholes that could have carried a gun as well.

I mean, what are the odds of someone among 200 people not having a gun as well?. Heck, they already had a knife capable of slashing a tyre.

Agree...I'm not saying that actually pulling the weapon would be a smart move. My question was a little more philosophical regarding whether aggressive individuals might think twice about getting violent if they believe they have a good chance of getting shot in the face for it.

Mobs are comprised of cowards who draw their strength from the group. Even if a shootout would end poorly for the SUV driver and his family, that won't help the guy who starts banging on the window to begin with and he knows it!

Dreadnought · Fri Oct 04, 2013 1:04 pm

Quoting cmf (Reply 41):
Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 34):
Attorney Mark Geragos was on AC360 tonight arguing that the driver of the SUV was criminally liable for driving over the biker in question. I'm no attorney, but I have a hard time believing he's liable when the biker in question was one of many other bikers who had intentionally created a roadblock using their bikes and bodies with the intent of unlawfully detaining the SUV and its occupants.

I spent yesterday at a law firm and it it was pretty interesting to see how people who frequently handle cases like this were split down the middle. The only thing they agreed on is that there are a lot of open questions and it is the answers to them that will decide.

Lawyers don't look at a scene such as this and form an opinion on who was in the right or wrong. They look at a video like this and see dollar signs popping up everywhere. The guy in a coma will certainly sue for millions, as will various other bikers in the video. The City can be sued, and so forth.

ual747den · Fri Oct 04, 2013 1:36 pm

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 39):
You're kidding right, so you jump from your SUV and start unloading on the bikers, you'd have to expect out of the 200 of so guys on bikes many of them are also probably armed, you'd end up with a bloodbath in the streets, this was one situation that having weapons would have made it so much worse than done any good. Once the bullets start flying your wife and child in the car are probably in far more danger than they were before.

Nope Im not kidding at all I can assure you the first thing that would have happened is my window would have came down and a 9 would have came out. These guys aren't going to stick around when someone has the means to defend themselves they are going to shit their pants and run away. I'm not saying that im some tough guy thats going to get out of my car and shot it out in the street but the guy who is breaking my window out is going to get one chance to take a look at the barrel of my gun before I squeeze the trigger, just like my house if you are coming in I am going to protect myself and if that means I take your life to do it than so be it, my life is far more important to me than yours.

cmf · Fri Oct 04, 2013 2:05 pm

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 43):
Lawyers don't look at a scene such as this and form an opinion on who was in the right or wrong.

None of them will make a single cent on this case. Despite the picture painted they are professionals and it represented their professional opinions based on just the video. The key point is that it isn't a clear case even to people dealing with this type of issues professionally. Generalised preconceived opinions about an industry isn't related to the issue at hand..

slider · Fri Oct 04, 2013 3:24 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 3):
you call the Police - you don't ram people out the way. I

LOL! Tell ya what--next time you find yourself in imminent harm, meekly stay in one spot, call the police and try to negotiate with someone trying to kill you, harm your family and your property. Tell me how that works out.

Man, you get the hell out of that situation as best you can and as fast as you can!!

Quoting SmittyOne (Reply 8):
I wonder if the bikers would have been so 'badass' in this case had they perceived a reasonable potential for the driver to be legally armed.

Amen. All it would have taken was even the remote threat of harm and that situation would have dissolved. Showing a weapon would have been enough.

cmf · Fri Oct 04, 2013 3:27 pm

Quoting Slider (Reply 46):
Showing a weapon would have been enough.

More likely resulted in multiple deaths.

Dreadnought · Fri Oct 04, 2013 4:19 pm

Quoting cmf (Reply 47):
More likely resulted in multiple deaths.

That's OK if it's the right people.

I would not have started blasting at nearby bikers. But the moment one of them put a helmet through my window, or opened my door aggressively, I would feel fully justified in shooting him, and taking advantage of the moment of confusion that inevitably followed to attempt to escape.

Kiwirob · Fri Oct 04, 2013 4:27 pm

Quoting ual747den (Reply 44):
I'm not saying that im some tough guy thats going to get out of my car and shot it out in the street but the guy who is breaking my window out is going to get one chance to take a look at the barrel of my gun before I squeeze the trigger

Yup and then how many out of the 200 or so bikers do you think also have weapons, remember these guys are next to impossible to identify, the bikes don't have rego's and they are wearing helmets so all those that were armed would then have a nice time shooting at you and your wife and child, you might take out the guy who smashed out your window but I'd feel pretty confident that you'd end up just as dead.

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