Here We Go Again-Black Friday

zippyjet · Fri Nov 29, 2013 11:52 pm

It's happening again. People acting like a mob, sheeple all trying to get that so called door buster for the holidays. I'm in amazement at how far we've descended into stupidity and mediocrity. There have already been incidences of violence.
1. Some shopper couldn't get that $89.00 TV at a WalMart so he ran out and took the Salvation Army Kettle and all.
2. In Chicago, another lovely shopper made his door buster a five finger discount and ran out the store where his buddy
was waiting in a getaway car. The cops chased them. A cop got stuck trying to stop the perps and they took off.
The cop shot at least one of the perps. He can now give his nare do well family or friends a bullet for Christmas.
3. Several fights in parking lots for parking spaces.
4. Many instances of trampeling and people got knocked over and hurt.
I can probably list a dozen more instances and chances are more stories will come out as the night wears on.

This whole Black Friday crap which now engulfs Thanksgiving demonstrates how our society is gullable and pliable. A sad sordid state of affairs.

Now please bear in mind I'm a holiday hater and proud of it. This time of the year is just a big fat nusciance. If I had the time and the funds, I'd be travelling and checking out other nations, having a great time doing A. Net trip reports, reviews on Trip Advisor and having fun and screw the holidays. I'd seek out areas where this holiday hype and BS is minimal.

For those of you which are the majority, by all means enjoy the holidays, spend till your cred cards are skinnier than Taylor Swift, get drunk till you puke (don't drive or operate machinery soussed). Listen to that God awful HOliday music and embrace those stupid obnoxious commercials put forth by the big retail giants. Just check your attitude at the door. People get too stressed out over this time of the year and become less than likeable.

OK my rant is done for now! Lets hear your stories of Black Friday Hell and please share what you don't like about the holidays. If you call me a meany and or scrooge so be it. I'll wear those labels if need be.
For those of you like me who detest all the holiday crass commercialism and especially lame commercials holiday or otherwise I invite you to visit

AR385 · Fri Nov 29, 2013 11:59 pm

I have a question. This Black Friday mob thing. Is it really because the deals are that good, or because it´s become a tradition to be part of the mob? A fun thing, let´s just say.

Quoting zippyjet (Thread starter):
Now please bear in mind I'm a holiday hater and proud of it.

I hate them too. Although holidays for me would be circumscribed to the December ones.

Quoting zippyjet (Thread starter):
OK my rant is done for now! Lets hear your stories of Black Friday Hell and please share what you don't like about the holidays.

I´ve never been part of Black Friday. Living in the US, I would travel to Europe on the Wednesday evening and come back on the Sunday. Fantastic fares, no crowds in Europe and fantastic weather.

cjg225 · Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:00 am

This is why we do our shopping online.

I'm sitting here on Amazon right now looking for gifts.

fridgmus · Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:09 am

My Christmas shopping is limited to my niece & nephew and was finished a long time ago! I hate this Black Friday BS with a passion. People spending money they don't have on people they don't like (in some instances). All the holidays are very low-key in our family, as they should be.

I went to the grocery store today for a few things and it was almost empty! That's all the venturing out I'll be doing this weekend.

Enjoy,

F

LittleFokker · Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:36 am

Slept in, goofed around on the internet for awhile, got ready for work, had lunch, and went to work. I bought nothing and it feels great!

Quoting AR385 (Reply 1):
I have a question. This Black Friday mob thing. Is it really because the deals are that good, or because it´s become a tradition to be part of the mob? A fun thing, let´s just say

I think there's plenty of truth to your supposition. For the life of me, I can't understand why some people are willing to wait hours in line to get into a nightclub that plays bad music way too loud and serves overpriced drinks (and charges you to get in!!!!!), when there's probably a bar just a block away that you can get into right away for free and get served more reasonably priced drinks. I guess there's just a mentality that exists that causes certain people to think they need to be there because "everybody" else is. I know I don't have it.

Quoting cjg225 (Reply 2):
This is why we do our shopping online.

I know more and more things are moving to online only. However, I actually enjoy the experience of walking into a brick and mortar store, holding products in my hand to compare them in the manners that are important to me, and the modicrum of interaction with others that takes place. I hope brick and mortar stores never go away completely.

zippyjet · Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:41 am

Quoting AR385 (Reply 1):

Believe it or not, most of the stuff is the same price at other times of the year. A friend bought a Samsung TV for $499 US $ in August. Guess what? It's advertised as a big door buster at yes $499! NOw there are a very small number of items that are "loss leaders." These are the items that have been the root of a lot of the fighting and trampeling.

Yes, the Black Friday BS is becoming a social schtick. Especially with Generation's X and younger. And here is why.

* The crass materialism has spawned the herd/mob mentality. Big retail is hypnotizing the masses into thinking they are getting a steal of a deal.
* The New Morality- Family is on the back burner for hedonistic stimulation and conspicuous consumption satiates those impulses.
* Speaking of that New Morality lifestyle, the masses especially the younger generations can't stay in one place too long. They can be challenged when it comes to occupying themselves with perish the thought having to spend quality time with their loved ones. The 1950's NOrman Rockwell/Leave It To Beaver models are long dead and buried. Suprisingly even with technology (Internet, Smart Phones) people can't seem to occupy themselves without infringing on others. (These BS retail blitzes).
* Corporate America has their workers by the you know what...If they don't work the holiday and spend time with their families they get a big fat pink slip.
* It's trendy to camp out and smell like a dumpster for days just to get those cheap goods made in China and save a bit of money.

Sadly, it will take something catastrophic to reverse this trend. And though I detest the holidays and the commercialism I don't want a thing like that to end the madness. And as long as the number of non essential government workers keeps rising there will be a demand for the retail madness since they all have paid extra time off courtesy of us the overtaxed citizens who work in private industry.

There's a caste system in regard to Christmas and New Years.

I. Those with loose credit limits head to the airport and fly to places like MCO and LAS
II. The next caste below are the retail shopping addicts who think they are stealing a deal.
III. The next group down invade the movie theatres and spend too much on overpriced snacks and lame blockbuster movies.
IV. The rest do stuff like the Knockout Game or have kids with different baby daddies of course un-married.

The spoiled indulgent kids open their presents early XMAS morning then are bored by lunchtime and get on the nerves of their parents and the parents would rather do anything but have to spend time at home with their spawn. So off they go. Those of us who want to decompress and spend time with close friends and family be damned. We are the second class citizens.

[Edited 2013-11-29 17:48:32]

And, so far in my 11 plus years these holiday passengers have been the worst and we haven't even gotten to the horrible holidays from hell Christmas and New Years.

And, while I'm on my rant of the dispicable straight from hell holidays did you know at least in the states, the biggest day for folks croaking is Christmas? Seems right. The holiays are a cruel joke and if there is a hell which I hope there's not it's always President's Day, Thanksgiving, Christmas and New Years Day with horrible music, nasty vapid people and round the clock door busting black Friday sales. If we just could skip the holidays for one year I'd be a happy camper.

[Edited 2013-11-29 18:32:22]

planeguy727 · Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:58 am

For those that do not buy into the holiday stuff (pun intended)

http://www.facebook.com/Nunuvum

PacNWjet · Sat Nov 30, 2013 2:02 am

Quoting zippyjet (Thread starter):
For those of you which are the majority, by all means enjoy the holidays, spend till your cred cards are skinnier than Taylor Swift, get drunk till you puke (don't drive or operate machinery soussed). Listen to that God awful HOliday music and embrace those stupid obnoxious commercials put forth by the big retail giants. Just check your attitude at the door. People get too stressed out over this time of the year and become less than likeable.

The people who get the most attention are not necessarily the majority. There are more of us than might be readily apparent who enjoy the holidays with quiet dignity.

zippyjet · Sat Nov 30, 2013 2:35 am

Quoting PacNWJet (Reply 7):

Y'all are in the closet then. These lame excuses bring out the worst in people. Trust me if I could I'd travel or hole up in a fortress/bunker till these damn occasions are over for another year.

KaiGywer · Sat Nov 30, 2013 2:55 am

I was working an overtime gig at Walmart yesterday.... It just reaffirmed why I don't go BF shopping. Although at our Walmart, there were no fights or disturbances, so I didn't get to arrest anyone

Quoting cjg225 (Reply 2):

This is why we do our shopping online.

I'm sitting here on Amazon right now looking for gifts.

Quoting LittleFokker (Reply 4):
I know more and more things are moving to online only. However, I actually enjoy the experience of walking into a brick and mortar store, holding products in my hand to compare them in the manners that are important to me, and the modicrum of interaction with others that takes place. I hope brick and mortar stores never go away completely.

I like brick and mortar stores too the other 364 days a year.

zippyjet · Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:50 am

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 9):

You may want to modify that to 334 days a year. The way these facists are going the whole damn month of November will be one long marathon Black Friday.

cjg225 · Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:59 am

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 9):
I like brick and mortar stores too the other 364 days a year.

Sort of.

I like brick and mortar stores for some things. And I am also the jerk who goes to the store to look/touch/feel a product and then goes home to purchase it online. lol I am terrible with that when it comes to books. I use B&N to hunt for books and then I buy them on Amazon.

zippyjet · Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:09 am

Quoting cjg225 (Reply 11):

Nothing wrong with that because chances are eventually you will buy something else at the store. That's what the brick and mortar stars bank on which makes sense. Been there done that. But, Black Friday and all the hype and extension sucks big time.

ltbewr · Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:45 am

At a Garfield, NJ Walmart near me, an idiot who wanted to buy a bunch of $98 TV's got into a fight, then assaulted a local cop on duty in that area of the store, on the way to the police car he was so unruly he was maced. Now he is in County Jail on $20,000 bail. So, for a cheap TV he faces expensive bail bond fees, lawyer fees, jail, losing his job and his family hating him forever.
At a Secacus, NJ Walmart, close to the Lincoln Tunnel to NYC, they had anti-Walmart protests with a few 100 showing up, in the nearby street then some decided to block traffic - 13 went to jail there.
I didn't go out this morning due to a doctor's appointment, I made 2 stops, one at a Target store, got some deals the same as 8 PM last night, and a 20% off coupon for next week.
Then I went online and got a new Virgin non-contract LG smartphone with 4G-LTE, 4.1 Android for $90, that went for $149-179 recently. I'll pick it up at a Best Buy store tomorrow when I do some shopping in the area tomorrow - some of the stores there will still have bargains, coupon deals and doorbusters and far less stupid shoppers.

Ken777 · Sat Nov 30, 2013 5:17 am

I'm enjoying the Holidays with the family. Started yesterday with family & friends in for dinner. Today we did manage to go out late (after all the rushes) and get one good deal. We really don't need to fight the heavy traffic, but I might take our 12 year old granddaughter to the mall for a few hours so she can look around. Too close to the teen years not to take her.

B777LRF · Sat Nov 30, 2013 11:52 am

What is it with calling this time of year 'the holidays'? It's sodding christmas, for crying out loud, holidays is something we get 6 weeks of every year (those of us, that is, who are lucky to work in the right country).

As for the materialism gone rampage idiocy, all I can say is: bah, humbug. I drag my sorry, shopping hating, arse down to a couple of malls every year, usually second last day before christmas, and purchase the overpriced tat a daughter, girlfriend, parent, niece, girlfriends kids, auntie or uncle has put an 'x' next to in a flashy wish list they've power pointed. I then have a minor heart attack surveying the subsequent emptiness of my wallet, but I would rather borrow from a Nigerian loan shark then shop on a sales day, what mixing with 1000s of unhinged idiots just to save a few shekels!

Francoflier · Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:40 pm

Quoting zippyjet (Thread starter):
In Chicago, another lovely shopper made his door buster a five finger discount and ran out the store where his buddy
was waiting in a getaway car. The cops chased them.

Wait a minute. Why would he shoplift on Black Friday?
There is a crowd, but also added security guards.
Or did he want to snap that 50% off TV because he thought stealing it at full price was not a good deal?

From over here, Black Friday looks like 'The People of WalMart.com' on a crystal meth fueled rampage...

cptkrell · Sat Nov 30, 2013 2:35 pm

Quoting B777LRF (Reply 15):
What is it with calling this time of year 'the holidays'? It's sodding christmas, for crying out loud, holidays is something we get 6 weeks of every year (those of us, that is, who are lucky to work in the right country).

Origin of the term holiday comes from "Holy Day", a day of dedication to religious observance.

In more modern days, holiday is described as a day of either religious or secular commemoration. So, if one subscribes to the secular persuasion, I guess holiday could be an appropriate term for some mentally-challenged choosing to fight crowds and wait in line for hours to get into a Walmart, etc.

varigb707 · Sat Nov 30, 2013 2:57 pm

I love all those Black Friday horror stories, with all the tasering, fist fighting, pushing and shoving. It's bad, when somebody dies as a result of other people's wild and savage attitude.
Here's a couple of links, for your amusement...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-shopping-hysteria-takes-hold.html

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2....tello-spain-walmart-fight.cnn.html

http://youtu.be/5DGexLhV3LM

http://youtu.be/NlcCPQzgKGA

http://youtu.be/g624BKN7nzI

Only in America. Gotta love it though.

oly720man · Sat Nov 30, 2013 2:59 pm

And the UK had much the same rush to buy the stuff the shops want to get rid of, along with fights, arrests, the odd broken limb and an overriding desire to get something because it's cheap.

http://news.sky.com/story/1175499/bl...day-stampede-at-uk-shopping-centre

Mir · Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:14 pm

Quoting cjg225 (Reply 11):
I like brick and mortar stores for some things. And I am also the jerk who goes to the store to look/touch/feel a product and then goes home to purchase it online. lol I am terrible with that when it comes to books. I use B&N to hunt for books and then I buy them on Amazon.

Why not just support the store and buy from them? Because if enough people do what you're doing, eventually there will be no more brick and mortar stores to look/touch/feel products in. Stores aren't there as some sort of exhibit, they're there as businesses, and if you value what they provide you should try and support them when you can so that they can continue to provide it.

Quoting B777LRF (Reply 15):
What is it with calling this time of year 'the holidays'? It's sodding christmas, for crying out loud,

And Hannukah, and Kwanzaa. Many different holidays. Thus, the "holiday season".

-Mir

cptkrell · Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:41 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 20):
Quoting B777LRF (Reply 15):
What is it with calling this time of year 'the holidays'? It's sodding christmas, for crying out loud,

And Hannukah, and Kwanzaa. Many different holidays. Thus, the "holiday season".

And interestingly (or maybe not interesting as the case may be), the next time Hannukah and Thanksgiving will coincide date-wise will be 77,798 years, or, in the year 79,811. Wonder what Black Friday will be like then?

Centre · Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:05 pm

Quoting cjg225 (Reply 2):
This is why we do our shopping online.

I'm sitting here on Amazon right now looking for gifts.

Did the same here....Finished my annual jeans purchase in less than half an hour from Amazon. All were 50% off... I know what I'm looking for, just waiting for the right deal.

Ken777 · Sat Nov 30, 2013 5:30 pm

Quoting cjg225 (Reply 11):
I use B&N to hunt for books and then I buy them on Amazon.

Actually I go to B&N with various coupons, get 40% off best sellers and get great bargains in their Bargain Book section. I don't see any benefit in buying through Amazon - especially for the Bargain Books, which are warehouse clearance items.

Quoting francoflier (Reply 16):
Why would he shoplift on Black Friday?

When you look at the crowds and all the bumping around it's my guess that the pock pickers are the ones making out like bandits. But then that's what they are.

Vanguard · Sat Nov 30, 2013 6:14 pm

Oh great! Another US import to the UK. If trick or treat wasn't enough we now have to have black Friday mob-shopping. It's as I'd we celebrate thanksgiving. Why do we do it? .........

WestJet747 · Sat Nov 30, 2013 7:14 pm

Quoting zippyjet (Thread starter):
Now please bear in mind I'm a holiday hater and proud of it. This time of the year is just a big fat nusciance. If I had the time and the funds, I'd be travelling and checking out other nations, having a great time doing A. Net trip reports, reviews on Trip Advisor and having fun and screw the holidays. I'd seek out areas where this holiday hype and BS is minimal.

I wouldn't call myself a "holiday hater", because I do enjoy the long weekend here and there, but I do not enjoy Christmas. My idea of a great holiday is going to parties with family and friends or traveling around...not the exchanging of gifts that half the people are not going to enjoy or ever use. And on that note, I also refuse to celebrate my birthday. I have no desire to be the center of attention for simply being alive.

Quoting LittleFokker (Reply 4):
For the life of me, I can't understand why some people are willing to wait hours in line to get into a nightclub that plays bad music way too loud and serves overpriced drinks (and charges you to get in!!!!!), when there's probably a bar just a block away that you can get into right away for free and get served more reasonably priced drinks.

Different people have different motives. I have a select few clubs that I go to because I legitimately like the music and they bring in DJs I particularly like. I seldom drink at these clubs though because the drinks are a massive rip-off, and I don't need alcohol to enjoy music and dancing.

Quoting photopilot (Reply 25):

Quoting Vanguard (Reply 24):
Oh great! Another US import to the UK.

Tell me about it. We share a land border with the US - Black Friday has already reared its ugly head up here.

AR385 · Sat Nov 30, 2013 7:32 pm

Quoting Vanguard (Reply 24):
Oh great! Another US import to the UK. If trick or treat wasn't enough we now have to have black Friday mob-shopping. It's as I'd we celebrate thanksgiving. Why do we do it? .........

Don´t worry. It arrived here two years ago. It´s called "El buen fin" ie The Good Weekend. There´s a lot of trampling and stuff like that too, I´m afraid.

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 26):
I also refuse to celebrate my birthday. I have no desire to be the center of attention for simply being alive.

Call me egocentric but that´s my favorite of the entire year.

cptkrell · Sat Nov 30, 2013 10:59 pm

Quoting Vanguard (Reply 24):
Oh great! Another US import to the UK.

"We" probably didn't export it to the UK. "You" folks are simply becoming as inane and stupid as us because of Concorde, etc. Time for worldwide birth control.

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 26):
And on that note, I also refuse to celebrate my birthday.

I usually forget my OWN birthday unless someone else reminds me of it or I get a notice that it's time for a license renewal or some such other B.S.

Quoting Mir (Reply 20):
Why not just support the store and buy from them?

I actually did today. Went down to the local saloon and watched Ohio beat Michigan by 1 point (sigh). But paid for a few adult beverages.

Quoting LittleFokker (Reply 4):
I think there's plenty of truth to your supposition. For the life of me, I can't understand why some people are willing to wait hours in line

I sweared (swore?) to myself after getting out of the Army I would NEVER wait in a line for ANYTHING. Of course, it's been practically impossible to uphold my personal credo for over a half-century, but you get my point? (I also swore that I'd never make-up a bed, too. But that's been not entirely successful also).

zippyjet · Sun Dec 01, 2013 12:50 am

Quoting francoflier (Reply 16):

As mentioned it's a "shoppertunity" or should I say Shopliftertunity. And then you have the idiots of the Knockout Game/Jackass generation who think they have balls and rip off the stores and sheeple. And many of them hope to get themselves as the next You Tube Twitterverse sensation.

The whole sordid affair makes me sick. This has been the longest damn weekend and they all get to come home tomorrow (Sunday) can hardly wait! And I wish my fellow crewmembers stamina, humor and fortitude.

WarRI1 · Sun Dec 01, 2013 1:31 am

We have a growing percentage of classless people, maybe caused by immigration, no jobs, desperation, who knows. It is certainly whipped up by the incessant drumbeat of business. Door buster sales. A person who is a door buster for personal gain is usually a thief, or a vandal. Not something to be encouraged, yet it is.

PHX787 · Sun Dec 01, 2013 7:57 am

I think this is less of a consumerist-minded society issue as much as it is a general societal behavioral issue.

I guarantee NONE of these mobs will ever happen in Japan should a similar "black friday" even happen here.

When there's a huge sale on something, there's always an orderly line, and the companies tend to always predict how many people are going to order that product, so there's little if ever selling out before everyone is served.

And remember, prior to the 1990s bubble, Japan was a gigantic consumerist society....and still remains that way even though the economy has been sluggish, until recently.

ha763 · Sun Dec 01, 2013 9:14 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 31):
I guarantee NONE of these mobs will ever happen in Japan should a similar "black friday" even happen here.

I would have expected you to know that Japan has their own "Black Friday" type sale that predates the Black Friday sales in the U.S. The New Year's Fukubukoro sales have existed since the Meiji era and have had similar mobs and fights over the merchandise in the past. The amount of crowd control they have now is unbelievable and stretches for blocks if warranted.

If the stores and malls in the U.S. would do just some crowd control outside of the entrances, like keeping them away from the doors, it would make the crowds less likely to push down and trample people. More retailers could also do things like keep the expected popular merchandise off the floor and have people line up to get something with the bar code on it or a number and then pick up the item in another area of the store or after it is paid for.

Bongodog1964 · Sun Dec 01, 2013 2:00 pm

Quoting AR385 (Reply 1):
I´ve never been part of Black Friday. Living in the US, I would travel to Europe on the Wednesday evening and come back on the Sunday. Fantastic fares, no crowds in Europe and fantastic weather.

To late its here now as well

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 27):
Quoting Vanguard (Reply 24):Oh great! Another US import to the UK."We" probably didn't export it to the UK. "You" folks are simply becoming as inane and stupid as us because of Concorde, etc. Time for worldwide birth control.

You certainly did courtesy of Walmart, they have now introduced "Black Friday" to their Asda stores here in the UK they even advertise it as "Black Friday" The result has been a broken arm on a lady trampled in a rush plus a number of other incidents.

SpaceshipDC10 · Sun Dec 01, 2013 3:07 pm

Quoting ha763 (Reply 31):
More retailers could also do things like keep the expected popular merchandise off the floor and have people line up to get something with the bar code on it or a number and then pick up the item in another area of the store or after it is paid for.

Yes, but then people would have time to reflect on what they are about to do, with the risk for part of them to change their minds, which is never good for Wal-Mart & Co. The crowd frenzy always serves their interests best.

Ken777 · Sun Dec 01, 2013 9:37 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 30):
When there's a huge sale on something, there's always an orderly line, and the companies tend to always predict how many people are going to order that product, so there's little if ever selling out before everyone is served.

Unfortunately that doesn't work for items selected to be Loss Leaders. There is an intentional limit on quantity to motivate people to show up at that store brand before going to others. Normally it's away from the front door as the retailers want people to go through the store and see other merchandise.

cjg225 · Mon Dec 02, 2013 12:01 am

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 34):
Unfortunately that doesn't work for items selected to be Loss Leaders. There is an intentional limit on quantity to motivate people to show up at that store brand before going to others. Normally it's away from the front door as the retailers want people to go through the store and see other merchandise.

Exactly. It is very specific marketing and inventory policy. It's planned.

2707200X · Mon Dec 02, 2013 1:15 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 30):
I think this is less of a consumerist-minded society issue as much as it is a general societal behavioral issue.

I think you certainly have a point, a lack of common respect for people and a sense of greed, it seems like its an "Only in America" does this happen type story. I think more specifically it is the mentalite of the shoppers who camp out and must be the ones to get in first that are the real trouble makers. I think a lot more of the regular shoppers who may be less prone to volatility and shopping rage would just rather enjoy the Thanksgiving meal and sleep in the next day or go to work or something rather than camp out and get into pissing matches with other people.

ltbewr · Mon Dec 02, 2013 11:45 am

Today, is 'Cyber Monday'. Instead of mobs at the stores, millions of people at work will be online seeking and buying stuff instead of doing their work unless employers can block shopping sites or supervisors crack down on people not doing their job. Some will take a 'sick day' if not penalized to stay home to cyber shop. The last thing we need is less productivity in our workplaces.
As to the 'Black Friday' issue, perhaps we need academics, economists and accountants to thoroughly study if there are true net benefits of such extreme discounting, the costs of staffing including security and if it means people really spend on regular priced or less discounted stuff when going for the 'prize' items. It might wise to look at those businesses that didn't open Thanksgiving night and had reasonable opening hours the next day (like after 6 AM) and offered slightly less price discounts and the net profits they had. It may be determined that those retailers that pushed 'Black' Thursday and Friday is not worth it for the bottom line.

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