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cptkrell
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Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:53 pm

While we're thinking about the last football game of the season, what do y'all think about Commissioner Goodell's thoughts on eliminating the after touchdown extra point kick? The way I understand proposed new rule, a scoring team would be awarded 7 points for a touchdown. They would then have the option to make an extra point by a passing or running play only. It would add 1 point if successful, but the touchdown would be reduced to 6 points if unsuccessful.

His theory is that the extra point is practically guaranteed with a kick through the uprights and the new system would add excitement to the game. The idea is getting a lot of raised eyebrows locally and on more than one national sportscast that I've seen.
all best; jack
 
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Boeing717200
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:58 pm

The two point conversion has made it interesting enough. The odds of making a two point play are very low so most touchdowns will end up being 6 points. Non starter.
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ANITIX87
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 1:23 pm

Quoting Boeing717200 (Reply 1):

The two point conversion has made it interesting enough. The odds of making a two point play are very low so most touchdowns will end up being 6 points. Non starter.

The average conversion rate for 2-pt conversions hovers right around 50%. If EVERY team attempted a 2-point conversion after every touchdown we would, on average, see no change in the outcomes of games.

I think a better option is to move the extra point back to the 25-yard line and making it a 43-yard field goal. Even from there, success is basically guaranteed, but it might help a little bit.

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rfields5421
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 2:04 pm

Quoting cptkrell (Thread starter):
The way I understand proposed new rule, a scoring team would be awarded 7 points for a touchdown. They would then have the option to make an extra point by a passing or running play only. It would add 1 point if successful, but the touchdown would be reduced to 6 points if unsuccessful.

So a team can have

7 pts - guaranteed

vs

8 pts - if successful
6 pts - if unsuccessful


No team will go for the extra point any time except if the point is essential to win the game.

No head coach is going to survive if he loses that one point with an unsuccessful attempt and will lose a point.

Consider this situation - score tied at 21-21 - 20 seconds to go in the game - does the team attempt the conversion and the win, or a guaranteed loss.

It really won't change anything.
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 3:51 pm

I think they should widen the hash marks to college width and move the extra point back to the 10 or the 15. Originally the extra point was implemented to complete the conversion and if a team missed an extra point they would get 0 points for the touchdown. If one wants to make that extra point really matter go back to that situation and leave the play from where it is, and I think it would be a bit more interesting especially if a team missed it.
 
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 4:11 pm

I think they should implement a super bonus. You go for two straight 2 point conversions and get them, then you get an extra point. Making it worth 5 points and changing the odds to favor the conversion.
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nighthawk
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 4:28 pm

I've always thought that field goal was a little pointless - i've yet to see one missed (not that I watch a lot of American Football).

Why not do it the same way as in Rugby - the kick is taken in line with where the touchdown occurred. That way it also tries to encourage scoring in the centre of the pitch, so that the kick is easier.
 
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 4:40 pm

Quoting nighthawk (Reply 6):

Why not do it the same way as in Rugby - the kick is taken in line with where the touchdown occurred

I think that is a great idea.
 
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 5:03 pm

Quoting cptkrell (Thread starter):
add excitement to the game

If they want to do that, here are my suggestions, instead of getting rid of the extra point:

1.) Move kickoffs back to the 30-yard line! They did that before, then apparently decided that they needed more touchbacks or something. The way it is now is ridiculous. Practically a guaranteed touchback. Lame.

2.) Make field goals harder. Narrow the verticals, raise the crossbar, whatever.

3.) Simplify what it takes to catch a ball. I never realized catching a ball involved so many things that aren't actually catching a ball.

4.) Make fumbles reviewable (says San Francisco).

5.) Make field goals 4 points. So two field goals can possibly outscore a touchdown, unless the other team goes for 2. This would go along with #2.

The extra point is kind of silly, but since they added 2-point conversion options, I think it's fine the way it is.
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Mir
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 5:03 pm

Quoting nighthawk (Reply 6):
I've always thought that field goal was a little pointless - i've yet to see one missed (not that I watch a lot of American Football).

Field goals are missed on occasion. Just ask the Chargers, who made it into the playoffs because of a missed field goal. And the field goal is a reward for making it down the field far enough that you can kick the field goal, so I would be very opposed to seeing those go away.

-Mir
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cptkrell
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 5:59 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 9):
Quoting nighthawk (Reply 6):
I've always thought that field goal was a little pointless - i've yet to see one missed (not that I watch a lot of American Football).

Field goals are missed on occasion.

I guess the operational word here is 'occasion'. Goodell pointed out that in the past season, 5 field goals where missed out of 1,256 attempts. Not that I've made up my mind on a rules change, but if I have to take a restroom break when the extra point comes up I don't fret missing the try.
all best; jack
 
Mir
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 6:28 pm

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 10):
I guess the operational word here is 'occasion'. Goodell pointed out that in the past season, 5 field goals where missed out of 1,256 attempts.

That's definitely wrong. If a kicker misses three field goals in a year he's having a fantastic year. There are 32 teams, so even if all of their kickers were having amazing years there would still be about 128 field goals missed every year.

-Mir
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Flaps
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:08 pm

I think if the league wants to make the game more interesting they should start by eliminating Goodell instead of the PAT. He's done nothing positive for the game during his long running ego trip.
 
StarAC17
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:21 pm

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 8):
Move kickoffs back to the 30-yard line! They did that before, then apparently decided that they needed more touchbacks or something. The way it is now is ridiculous. Practically a guaranteed touchback. Lame.

This is a safety thing as the kickoff is the most dangerous play in the game. If you want some true excitement then you would move the kickoff back to the 30 and ditch the fair catch.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 8):
Make fumbles reviewable (says San Francisco).

Make all plays challengeable from a central location which is what is done in hockey.
If a coach disagrees with the ruling there is someone watching that game that has every angle available can give an answer almost immediately.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 8):
Make field goals 4 points. So two field goals can possibly outscore a touchdown, unless the other team goes for 2. This would go along with #2.

Bad idea for most general fans of football as it takes away a lot of the entertainment value of the game. It would make the game very conservative because there is less incentive to go for it in no-mans land (mid-field to the opposing teams 35)

Quoting Mir (Reply 9):

Quoting nighthawk (Reply 6):
I've always thought that field goal was a little pointless - i've yet to see one missed (not that I watch a lot of American Football).

Field goals are missed on occasion. Just ask the Chargers, who made it into the playoffs because of a missed field goal. And the field goal is a reward for making it down the field far enough that you can kick the field goal, so I would be very opposed to seeing those go away.

-Mir

I think nighthawk is referring to the PAT and not regular field goals.
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:21 pm

Hire more EPL forwards....make the uprights narrower and make the hash marks MORE oblique....see it bennnnnd!
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vikkyvik
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:43 pm

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 13):
This is a safety thing as the kickoff is the most dangerous play in the game.

I know the reasoning. But why have a kickoff at all then? May as well have each team start from the 20.

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 13):
Bad idea for most general fans of football as it takes away a lot of the entertainment value of the game. It would make the game very conservative because there is less incentive to go for it in no-mans land (mid-field to the opposing teams 35)

Not sure I understand your reasoning here.
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ER757
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:43 pm

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 13):
Make all plays challengeable from a central location which is what is done in hockey.
If a coach disagrees with the ruling there is someone watching that game that has every angle available can give an answer almost immediately.

Spot on! Need to pick up the pace on the replay challenge thing. I have no problem with reviewing a questionable play but it takes far too long now. I can watch the two or three angles that they show on TV and make the call in about ten seconds, why does it take eons for trained professional officials?
 
cptkrell
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 9:47 pm

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 13):
I think nighthawk is referring to the PAT and not regular field goals.

Yeah, and I made the terminology mistake by referring to Point After Touchdown as Field Goal. My bad. The issue (Goodell's issue) is PATs being almost automatic.
all best; jack
 
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 10:04 pm

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 8):
1.) Move kickoffs back to the 30-yard line! They did that before, then apparently decided that they needed more touchbacks or something. The way it is now is ridiculous. Practically a guaranteed touchback. Lame.

I agree with this. I wondered why every kick is out of the end zone now, I thought legs were getting stronger.
 
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 10:26 pm

Quoting cptkrell (Thread starter):
His theory is that the extra point is practically guaranteed with a kick through the uprights and the new system would add excitement to the game.

Heard this on the radio: make the player scoring the touchdown kick the extra point...
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srbmod
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 10:40 pm

The thing is that kickers are getting better. In the 2011 NFL season, there were 90 successful field goals of 50+ yards and the following season, that number increased to 92. This season saw the NFL record for longest field goal (63 yards, which was set in 1970 by Tom Dempsey and tied by three other players and two of those three successful 63 yard field goals were in Denver.) finally broken with a 64 yard field goal. It took nearly 20 years before someone even tied Dempsey's record and the way things are going, in another decade, 60 yarders may be as common as 50+ yarders are today. When I was in high school, our football team had a kicker my junior and senior years that was kicking 65 yarders in practice and in pregame warmups as if they were nothing (I watched him kick a 70 yarder before a game.). I think his longest one in an actual game was something like 61-62 yards and would have been good from 65-67 yards (The guy was good enough to get a full ride at a major college despite only playing for two years and spent several years in the NFL.).


Perhaps eliminating the PAT isn't such a bad idea. The team can either opt to take the 7 points or gamble on a two-point conversion and if the conversion is unsuccessful, they are penalized a point, so the TD becomes 6 points.
 
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 10:42 pm

I've got no problem with changing the PAT. Eliminate the place kick, let them go for 2 or drop kick it, like Flutie did a few years back. That'll make things interesting.

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Revelation
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Tue Jan 21, 2014 10:43 pm

Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 2):
I think a better option is to move the extra point back to the 25-yard line and making it a 43-yard field goal. Even from there, success is basically guaranteed, but it might help a little bit.

I like your idea better. Unlike Goodell you are trying to address the actual problem, which is that PATs are too easy. Lord knows what problem he is trying to solve.

PATs still can add some drama. For instance in the NEP-IND playoff game two weeks ago, the NEP punter got injured and the franchise quarterback Brady was the backup holder. Now suppose Indy would have been able to lay a solid hit onto him? Could have changed the game...

Let's not take the foot out of football. It should be a bigger element of the game, rather than a smaller one. In my mind I think it gives an advantage to teams who really understand the game and ones that have a strong special teams coach and program.

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 10):
Goodell pointed out that in the past season, 5 field goals where missed out of 1,256 attempts.

As above, this probably is the number of PATs not FGs.

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 13):
Make all plays challengeable from a central location which is what is done in hockey.
If a coach disagrees with the ruling there is someone watching that game that has every angle available can give an answer almost immediately.

Absolutely! One of the few times the NHL has gotten something right. Almost everything else about the NHL is banana republic.

Quoting ER757 (Reply 16):
Spot on! Need to pick up the pace on the replay challenge thing. I have no problem with reviewing a questionable play but it takes far too long now. I can watch the two or three angles that they show on TV and make the call in about ten seconds, why does it take eons for trained professional officials?

I'm not sure it matters. Given how much $$$ the NFL makes per game, there should be NO problem having one or more officials per game watching in real time, having all the views queued up for instant review.

The way it's done now is absurd. Game stops, official trots to the silly stall where he looks at the play, we all wait forever...

I forget why they NFL ended up doing it this way. One reason might be the NFL trying to save money on replay officials, another might be the fact that the officials are unionized and rejected remote (presumably non-union) replay officials.

Either way, it seems the NFL has the $$$ to solve this. ''

On the other hand, these are the same folks who went with the fake officials for a few weeks until everyone involved admitted the obvious: the fake officials were no good at their job...
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N1120A
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:22 am

I love the idea of moving the PAT back to be a 43 yard kick. There is a much higher chance of failure, though its still a reasonably easy kick, and you keep the 2 point conversion in the same place. Also, they should implement the college rule that a blocked PAT may be returned for 2 points.

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 10):
I guess the operational word here is 'occasion'. Goodell pointed out that in the past season, 5 field goals where missed out of 1,256 attempts. Not that I've made up my mind on a rules change, but if I have to take a restroom break when the extra point comes up I don't fret missing the try.

You mean PATs, not field goals. Field Goals are missed far more often.

Quoting Flaps (Reply 12):
I think if the league wants to make the game more interesting they should start by eliminating Goodell instead of the PAT. He's done nothing positive for the game during his long running ego trip.

Excellent!

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 15):
I know the reasoning. But why have a kickoff at all then? May as well have each team start from the 20.

They have been talking about doing just that.

Quoting mham001 (Reply 18):
I agree with this. I wondered why every kick is out of the end zone now, I thought legs were getting stronger.

No, they banned the wedge (probably a good thing) and now moved forward the kick, to decrease head injuries.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 22):
PATs still can add some drama. For instance in the NEP-IND playoff game two weeks ago, the NEP punter got injured and the franchise quarterback Brady was the backup holder. Now suppose Indy would have been able to lay a solid hit onto him? Could have changed the game...

You can't hit the holder, just like you can't hit the kicker.
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LittleFokker
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:28 am

Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 2):
I think a better option is to move the extra point back to the 25-yard line and making it a 43-yard field goal. Even from there, success is basically guaranteed, but it might help a little bit.

Would it still be worth one point? Since you are making it the same distance as a 3 point field goal, what would be the incentive for teams to try for one point?

Quoting homer71 (Reply 19):
Heard this on the radio: make the player scoring the touchdown kick the extra point...

This is a better suggestion, though I don't know how place kickers would like the reduced role on the team....

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm actually in favor of keeping status quo. Yes, PAT kicks are boring and successful 99.9% of the time, however, when that 1 miss does occur, it sure is exciting! See the following video for a great example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBZ5chM_eL8

Not only did that miss cost the Saints the game, but they were eliminated from the playoffs with that loss.

Also, another point that I haven't seen considered is that with the current system, teams can line up for a kick, but have the opportunity to run a fake play and turn it into 2 points. Moving the kick back to a different yardage line or eliminating it ruins the potential for the play fake. I think the success rate on 2 point tries is in the neighborhood of 54%. Some of those successes are a result of play fakes, and I don't think the teams should lose the ability to use them.

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 3):
Consider this situation - score tied at 21-21 - 20 seconds to go in the game - does the team attempt the conversion and the win, or a guaranteed loss.

It really won't change anything.

  
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vikkyvik
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:54 am

Quoting LittleFokker (Reply 24):
Since you are making it the same distance as a 3 point field goal, what would be the incentive for teams to try for one point?

It's probably still a better chance of success than a 2-point conversion try.

Plus, PATs are already at a 3-point field goal distance. You can kick a FG from the PAT location....
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ha763
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 2:10 am

Quoting Revelation (Reply 22):
Quoting ER757 (Reply 16):
Spot on! Need to pick up the pace on the replay challenge thing. I have no problem with reviewing a questionable play but it takes far too long now. I can watch the two or three angles that they show on TV and make the call in about ten seconds, why does it take eons for trained professional officials?

I'm not sure it matters. Given how much $$$ the NFL makes per game, there should be NO problem having one or more officials per game watching in real time, having all the views queued up for instant review.

The way it's done now is absurd. Game stops, official trots to the silly stall where he looks at the play, we all wait forever...

The thing is that the NFL already a system in place that can do it - the replay assistant. Each game has a replay assistant that reviews each score, turnover, and all plays after the 2-min warning and is the only one that can call for a review during those times. The NFL just needs to expand the replay assistant's role to be the one doing the reviews for the entire game.
 
BMI727
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 2:29 am

I'd be okay with eliminating the kick and only attempting two point conversions if the scoring team chooses to.

It would also speed up the game somewhat. The current sequence is scoring play, confirm the TD, kick the PAT, go to media timeout, then kickoff. If they eliminated the kick, the media timeout and replay confirmation could be done concurrently.
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bohica
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:51 am

Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 2):
I think a better option is to move the extra point back to the 25-yard line

+1 I like that idea better.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 8):
Make field goals 4 points.

I was thinking that points for field goals should be distance based:
Up to 30 yards - 2 points
31 to 55 yards - 3 points
56+ yards - 4 points




Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 8):
Make fumbles reviewable

ALL turnovers should be automatically reviewed unless it's obvious.

Quoting ER757 (Reply 16):
I have no problem with reviewing a questionable play but it takes far too long now. I can watch the two or three angles that they show on TV and make the call in about ten seconds, why does it take eons for trained professional officials?

The referee can usually make the decision in a short period of time. The issue that takes up most of the time, depending on the play, is figuring out where to spot the football.
 
Mir
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:57 am

Quoting bohica (Reply 28):
ALL turnovers should be automatically reviewed unless it's obvious.

All turnovers are already reviewed. The issue is that not all fumbles are turnovers. The one in the SEA/SF game was a fumble, but was ruled to be not a turnover because the officials decided, incorrectly, that Seattle had recovered the ball.

-Mir
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vikkyvik
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 6:48 am

Quoting bohica (Reply 28):
I was thinking that points for field goals should be distance based:
Up to 30 yards - 2 points
31 to 55 yards - 3 points
56+ yards - 4 points

Not so crazy about that idea, because you're possibly rewarding a team who actually hasn't driven the ball as far down the field.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 27):
media timeout

You just summed up my major dislike of the NFL in two words. That's actually the major reason why I didn't like the one NFL game I've actually attended. At least when you watch on TV, you can go do something during the media timeouts (or watch the commercials, if all else fails), and you don't have to sit there and watch the players aimlessly milling about on the field, waiting for TV to come back.

The other two sports I watch are much better - baseball takes commercials during pitching changes and between half innings, and tennis takes commercials during side changes and between sets....all of which are natural breaks in the game. And sometimes, if the commercials run a bit long, you'll actually miss a bit of the game. Makes it feel much more like a sport, and less like a TV show.

The sequence I hate the most is touchdown - commercial break - kickoff - commercial break - drive. God that's annoying.
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rfields5421
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:16 am

Quoting ER757 (Reply 16):
I can watch the two or three angles that they show on TV and make the call in about ten seconds, why does it take eons for trained professional officials?

You don't see all the cameras which record the play. Only the one or two that the TV director picks out for you to see.

The replay official must view all the angles to see if something is missed.

He then must apply a specific rule to the call, decide if the official on the field made the correct call, and provide clear and convincing evidence to overturn a call on the field.

It must be documented for both the field officials to review later to help them understand, and it must be documented for the league office.

Finally, the replay official must explain to the field official what he sees, why he is overturning the ruling on the field, and often has to have the video shown to the official on the field.
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planeguy727
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:16 pm

How about just eliminate the PAT and move on. TD=6, FG=3. Increases the pace of the game. There is already very little "foot" in football so who will really notice.

It might, however, knock the place kicker from the top scorer rank on most teams.
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rfields5421
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:06 pm

Quoting planeguy727 (Reply 32):
It might, however, knock the place kicker from the top scorer rank on most teams.

That possibility ended when Vince Lombardi got fed up with losing so many field goal attempts with Paul Hornung as his kicker - and went with a full-time kicker. Making only 12 out of 38 field goal attempts in 1964 - it was obvious to all that leaving 78 points off the scoreboard was unacceptable if a team wanted to win a championship.

For example - Phil Dawson - San Francisco current kicker - 2013 - 96 pts from field goals, 44 pts from PAT.

The next highest scorer on the SF team was Vernon Davis with 78 pts from 13 touchdowns.

While a good team will have about twice as many touchdowns as field goals - but the touchdowns will be spread over several players - usually 3 to 5 tops scorers.
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ltbewr
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:23 pm

I have to wonder if the NFL Commissioner is trying to put up a distraction issue over the long-term brain injury problem.
Don't eliminate PAT's, but do consider moving the point of the PAT another 10 yards or so, giving the defenders more of chance of tipping the ball and making PAT's less automatic.
 
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 2:10 pm

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 30):
You just summed up my major dislike of the NFL in two words. That's actually the major reason why I didn't like the one NFL game I've actually attended. At least when you watch on TV, you can go do something during the media timeouts (or watch the commercials, if all else fails), and you don't have to sit there and watch the players aimlessly milling about on the field, waiting for TV to come back.

Last time I went I was a dozen rows behind the cheerleaders - problem solved!

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 30):
The sequence I hate the most is touchdown - commercial break - kickoff - commercial break - drive. God that's annoying.

NFL football alone justifies purchase of a TiVo. Between the pre/mid/post game blather, all the silly tv timeouts and dead time, etc, it transforms the experience. I've got use of the 30 second forward skip and six second back skip down pat so I can zip through a drive if I chose to do so.
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mham001
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:02 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 29):
All turnovers are already reviewed. The issue is that not all fumbles are turnovers. The one in the SEA/SF game was a fumble, but was ruled to be not a turnover because the officials decided, incorrectly, that Seattle had recovered the ball.

I'm trying to figure out why the replay is so limited. I see little reason why some guy up in the booth somewhere can't quickly review every play, or at the very least, allow the coach to throw the red flag whenever he wants. If he's wrong, it costs him a timeout eliminating the waste of time issues.The Vernon Davis catch ruled incomplete pass for example. And why can't the official who does not know the rule book be corrected? Harbaugh did know the rule book and should have been allowed to challenge that kicker penalty.

The NFL should be embarrassed.
 
vikkyvik
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:27 pm

Quoting Revelation (Reply 35):
NFL football alone justifies purchase of a TiVo. Between the pre/mid/post game blather, all the silly tv timeouts and dead time, etc, it transforms the experience. I've got use of the 30 second forward skip and six second back skip down pat so I can zip through a drive if I chose to do so.

Absolutely. I have DirecTV with the NFL Package, and I wouldn't watch nearly as many games if I couldn't record them and skip commercials and such. NFL media timeouts are exactly four forward-clicks long - I think my forward click is 30 seconds, so that makes sense.
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StarAC17
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:54 pm

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 15):
Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 13):
Bad idea for most general fans of football as it takes away a lot of the entertainment value of the game. It would make the game very conservative because there is less incentive to go for it in no-mans land (mid-field to the opposing teams 35)

Not sure I understand your reasoning here.

If a team is down by 7 points with a moderate amount of time left then they can take the option of kicking a field goal for four points and got the ball back they would have a decent shot at tying or winning the game, instead of realizing you have to take the shot. This will make decisions more conservative and make the game less exciting. One think that made the SEA/SF game so exciting is that they went for it much more than.

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 31):
You don't see all the cameras which record the play. Only the one or two that the TV director picks out for you to see.

The replay official must view all the angles to see if something is missed.

This should be done at a central location with the head of officiating supervising it.

Quoting LittleFokker (Reply 24):
I'm actually in favor of keeping status quo. Yes, PAT kicks are boring and successful 99.9% of the time, however, when that 1 miss does occur, it sure is exciting! See the following video for a great example:

I agree.

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 34):
I have to wonder if the NFL Commissioner is trying to put up a distraction issue over the long-term brain injury problem.
Don't eliminate PAT's, but do consider moving the point of the PAT another 10 yards or so, giving the defenders more of chance of tipping the ball and making PAT's less automatic.

Probably but this league doesn't care about safety one bit because before long there will be an 18 game season and one more team for each conference in the playoffs. What the league is trying to get rid of is strong and powerful defenses being the deciding factors in the games.
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vikkyvik
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 7:11 pm

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 38):
If a team is down by 7 points with a moderate amount of time left then they can take the option of kicking a field goal for four points and got the ball back they would have a decent shot at tying or winning the game, instead of realizing you have to take the shot. This will make decisions more conservative and make the game less exciting.

I don't think that will be too big an issue, really. Plus it will give the leading team more need to score, as well, instead of punt it away. And it would make two-point conversions more common, as the teams may have to score 8 points.

So I think any loss of excitement is more than made up for in other ways.
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dragon6172
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:46 pm

TD = 6 points

The spot of the point after try kick (not LOS) will be the spot used for the following kickoff (30 yard line minimum). Missed extra point kicks result in no added points and kickoffs from the 30 yard line.

2 - point attempts still made from 2-yard line, with the following kickoff made from the 30 yard line.

Kickoffs following field goals are made from the 30 yard line.

In regards to replay... I like the idea of a centralized league review setup. With the added idea that there be "double blind" process. So, for example, there will be a review official assigned to each game at the league office. When a play is in question, the review official begins the review and also sends it to an official who will not be told what the call on the field was. These two officials make their individual calls on the play. These two calls, combined with the call on the field, results in whether the play stands or overturned. Majority wins.

Example A:

TD score called on the field.
Review official at league office questions whether the ball crossed the goal line and begins review process.
Review official determines that play should stand.
Double blind official determines that knee was down at 1" line.
Play stands as called.

Example B:

Sideline interception call on field.
Review official at league office questions whether both feet were in bounds and begins review process.
Review official determines that right toe did not come down in bounds.
Double blind official determines that toe did not come down in bounds.
Play overturned. Incomplete pass.

You get the idea.
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Boeing717200
Posts: 1926
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Thu Jan 23, 2014 2:05 am

Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 2):

I think a better option is to move the extra point back to the 25-yard line and making it a 43-yard field goal. Even from there, success is basically guaranteed, but it might help a little bit.

The problem with this is that it takes away any real possibility of a fake for 2. No one is going to fake into what amounts to a 30 yard pass play with a punter or what is in most cases a second string QB. If they wanted to make it interesting, leave the extra point and two pointer at the 2, but give the coach an option to move it back to the 30 for 3, or another 5 if they actually do fake it.gotta give 'me something for having those kinds of nads.

[Edited 2014-01-22 18:13:55]
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Beardown91737
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Thu Jan 23, 2014 7:28 am

In the 1970s, the World Football League (US) gave 7 points for a TD and the try for point was a 1 point attempt from scrimmage.

In 2000, the XFL implemented TD=6 and the PAT scrimmage play was worth one point. Later in the first and only season, a PAT scrimmage play from the 5 was worth 2 points and from the 10 it was worth 3.

I would favor staying with current NFL rules, which leave open the possibility for fakes and also to score 2 on a broken kicking play.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 30):
The sequence I hate the most is touchdown - commercial break - kickoff - commercial break - drive. God that's annoying.

  
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cptkrell
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Sat Jan 25, 2014 5:45 pm

[quote=Revelation,reply=22]Given how much $$$ the NFL makes per game, there should be NO problem having one or more officials per game watching in real time, having all the views queued up for instant review.[/quote

Theoretically, I guess the NFL makes NO money per game. They are non-profit and tax-exempt since their 501(c)6 status from 1966. A lot of folks don't realize this. However, you're right...they could certainly afford to up the officiating ante (operating expenses).
all best; jack
 
rfields5421
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Mon Jan 27, 2014 2:01 am

The NFL is a trade association - and is actually a very small organization.

31 of the 32 NFL teams are the for profit corporations which make a lot of money, but also have a lot of expenses.

The Green Bay Packers are a community based group. There are stockholders - but there are strict limits of sale or transfer of stock ownership. It is a very unique and wonderful sports franchise.

I would love to see Jerry Jones issue a report like this - http://www.packers.com/news-and-even...110909-2f1d-42d7-9478-2d1a474cd3d6

[Edited 2014-01-26 18:06:05]
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N1120A
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RE: Eliminate Extra Point Kick In NFL?

Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:39 pm

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 25):
Plus, PATs are already at a 3-point field goal distance. You can kick a FG from the PAT location....

Sure, but the point is to make it the average FG distance - which is 43 yards.
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