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Ken777
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Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 6:03 pm

Amazing as it is, kansas appears on the brink to return to the Dark Ages of Segregation.

This time it is Gays who are in their sights and their "excuse" is that their new law is in the name of "religious liberty".

So a hospital can refuse to treat a gay person it it is against their "religious beliefs"

A policeman can refuse to help a gay in trouble if it is against their "religious beliefs"

An employer can fire a gay person if it is against their "religious beliefs"

It looks to me like the yo-yos in the state legislature have simply pulled out all the old games when there was segregation based on color and simply moved it to the gay community.

Quote:

f that sounds overblown, consider the bill itself. When passed, the new law will allow any individual, group, or private business to refuse to serve gay couples if “it would be contrary to their sincerely held religious beliefs.” Private employers can continue to fire gay employees on account of their sexuality. Stores may deny gay couples goods and services because they are gay. Hotels can eject gay couples or deny them entry in the first place. Businesses that provide public accommodations—movie theaters, restaurants—can turn away gay couples at the door. And if a gay couple sues for discrimination, they won’t just lose; they’ll be forced to pay their opponent’s attorney’s fees. As I’ve noted before, anti-gay businesses might as well put out signs alerting gay people that their business isn’t welcome.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/outward/2...gation_bill_is_an_abomination.html

If this bigotry actually gets the OK from the Supreme Court in the future there is no reason why kansas can't add people of color and/or jews to the law. After all, that would be their "religious beliefs".

Great conservative state, that kansas.


Edit to repair Topic Name

[Edited 2014-02-17 10:07:36]
 
kstateinALB
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 6:43 pm

Um, although the bill passed the House (stupidly), it has been said that it is unlikely to pass through Senate.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...riage-kansas-idUSBREA1D1FC20140214
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einsteinboricua
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 7:29 pm

Quoting kstateinALB (Reply 1):

Beat me to it. Republicans in the Senate have taken issue with the bill.

Good to know there are some sane Republicans in the Senate who realize that to defend traditional values, discrimination is not needed.
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oly720man
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 7:29 pm

What next? Gays wear a pink badge? Gay business owners having "Gay" painted on their premises. Mandatory gay gene tests? (I know there isn't one, but it's been in the news and common sense doesn't seem to be on the same planet as this lot)

Quoting Ken777 (Thread starter):
"religious liberty"
Quoting Ken777 (Thread starter):
"religious beliefs"
Quoting Ken777 (Thread starter):
"religious beliefs"
Quoting Ken777 (Thread starter):
"religious beliefs"

And there is no limit on what someone may claim is a strongly held religious belief. Is there?

I presume that premarital sex can see a girl stoned to death. It's in the bible.

Anyone having an affair. Kill both of them. It's in the bible.
wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
 
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einsteinboricua
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 7:57 pm

Quoting oly720man (Reply 3):
And there is no limit on what someone may claim is a strongly held religious belief. Is there?

The only limit is that which you find inconvenient.

Eating pig-derived products makes you "unclean", yet that doesn't stop people from eating bacon or pulled pork. (not that anyone would...bacon is a gift)   

Has pork been banned anywhere in the states?

Women are forbidden to talk in church or lead men, yet many women have gone on to office or take up positions in the church.

Working on the Sabbath should be met with death. How many people work on the Sabbath? And by work, it means doing anything that can be considered work (cooking, cleaning, driving, etc.)

Divorced and remarried? According to the Bible, you've committed adultery...which is punished with stoning. Any couples put to death here for divorcing?

I can keep on going  
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sccutler
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 8:05 pm

I believe this is being done a s symbolic gesture, with minimal chance of reaching the Governor's desk.

But, I also believe it is an inappropriate intrusion of government into the lives of the citizens; nothing, now, impedes a person from standing on principle, refusing service to whomever they choose; they must, of course, bear the consequences (whatever they may be, ridicule, adulation, prosecution or persecution) that come with that choice, but is that not essentially proof that you have the "courage of your convictions"?

If the bill somehow survives the Senate (mighty improbable), and is signed into law, it will not survive an equal protection challenge.
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mt99
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 8:19 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 5):
I believe this is being done a s symbolic gesture,

Symbolic to what effect? What the point?
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sccutler
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 8:29 pm

Quoting mt99 (Reply 6):
Symbolic to what effect? What the point?

So that the legislators who filed it can point to the legislation (which, presumably, they believe to be appealing to more of their constituents than the proportion who find it repugnant) and say, "Look, I tried..."

For perspective, remember this: In every state's legislature (and, for that matter, the US Congress), a scant few bills introduced ever make it into law; that's why you'll sometimes see some really wild bills filed, secure in the knowledge that the particular legislation has de minimis chance of becoming law. Sometimes, it can just be to satisfy a promise to a particular constituent group, others, it can be "trade goods," legislation that you can agree to kill in exchange for support from another legislator for something else of greater priority.

Legislation, it is said, is like sausage; no matter how much you like what comes out the back door, you'd best not know the process by which it was made!
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Ken777
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 8:38 pm

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 4):
not that anyone would...bacon is a gift)

For a while my daughter was a vegetarian. During that time both bacon and pepperoni were excluded because they were "spices".
 
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seb146
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 9:39 pm

What's happening in Kansas with this bill is what the right wants: Church to rule the state. This is what happens when we legislate one flavor of morality. "Because my moral code says XYZ, we are going to make it law." How is that a good thing?
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Ken777
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 10:25 pm

Quoting seb146 (Reply 9):

What's happening in Kansas with this bill is what the right wants: Church to rule the state.

But what "Church"? Certainly not the Roman Catholic Church, or any other traditional, responsible church.

That leaves the holy rollers and religious freaks.

I'd actually like to see this one go to the USSC so we can see how each of the Justices vote on this pile of garbage.
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Mon Feb 17, 2014 10:43 pm

Quoting Ken777 (Thread starter):

This time it is Gays who are in their sights and their "excuse" is that their new law is in the name of "religious liberty".

If there's one thing the last decade or so has taught us, it is to never trust anyone who is too comfortable using the words "liberty" or "freedom" when discussing politics of any type. They universally mean the opposite when they do.

Quoting seb146 (Reply 9):
This is what happens when we legislate one flavor of morality. "Because my moral code says XYZ, we are going to make it law." How is that a good thing?

My above statement applies double when the word is morality!

What's ironic Seb is that these are the same people who complain about "big govt" and too many rules. But messing with people's personal lives? All good. . .

SMH
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sccutler
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 12:27 am

Quoting seb146 (Reply 9):
What's happening in Kansas with this bill is what the right wants: Church to rule the state. This is what happens when we legislate one flavor of morality. "Because my moral code says XYZ, we are going to make it law." How is that a good thing?

I fear I am belaboring the point, but it must be noted: this is not what "the right" wants (if for no other reason than there is no homogeneous group called "the right," which adheres rigidly to an identical set of beliefs and demands).

It is, instead, what the people who want this, want.

If it makes one feel better to marginalize a group by ascribing to them motives and beliefs which they do not universally possess, they can do so, but it is done at the expense of credibility and it is intellectually lazy so to do.

Quoting DarkSnowyNight (Reply 11):

What's ironic Seb is that these are the same people who complain about "big govt" and too many rules. But messing with people's personal lives? All good. . .

Not at all so. Some believe this, no doubt -- but again, you can scarcely make this broad-brush assertion with any shred of credibility.

The ACLU defends civil liberties for lots of people, and not always the particular people (or the particular rights) you would choose - but the work they do is important.
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falstaff
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:42 am

the

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 10):
But what "Church"? Certainly not the Roman Catholic Church, or any other traditional, responsible church

Not the Episcopal or Methodist churches either.

Quoting sccutler (Reply 12):
I fear I am belaboring the point, but it must be noted: this is not what "the right" wants (if for no other reason than there is no homogeneous group called "the right," which adheres rigidly to an identical set of beliefs and demands).

I am what a lot of people would consider a right wing gun nut, but I find discrimination abhorrent as do all of my right wing friends.

Quoting sccutler (Reply 12):
The ACLU defends civil liberties for lots of people, and not always the particular people (or the particular rights) you would choose - but the work they do is important.

I disagree with them a lot, I agree with enough of what they do to know they are important. They stand up for rights of everyone.
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blueflyer
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:45 am

Perhaps they'll understand how stupid they look the day someones passes an equally symbolic bill allowing Republicans, or better yet, Kansans to be banned from businesses.

Quoting sccutler (Reply 12):
I fear I am belaboring the point, but it must be noted: this is not what "the right" wants (if for no other reason than there is no homogeneous group called "the right," which adheres rigidly to an identical set of beliefs and demands). It is, instead, what the people who want this, want.

I do think you have a valid point, there is no more one "right" than there is one "left" (although I think the left is more united these days), but when most of the legislators who voted for this bill will be returned to office for another term, "the right" (at least in Kansas) will, in full awareness, own them, not just a narrow (minded) base. At some point, sanity needs to come before party, but I fear that Todd Akin and Richard Mourdock were the exceptions, not the rule.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 8):
During that time both bacon and pepperoni were excluded because they were "spices".

And pizza is a vegetable. Congress said so!

[Edited 2014-02-17 17:48:04]
 
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seb146
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 2:59 am

Quoting sccutler (Reply 12):
this is not what "the right" wants (if for no other reason than there is no homogeneous group called "the right," which adheres rigidly to an identical set of beliefs and demands).

It is, instead, what the people who want this, want.

*sigh*

I have posted ad nauseum about my thoughts regarding the right wing vs. Republicans.

What this bill in Kansas shows is what the right tells people eventually gets to come up for a vote. Think about it:

Kansas has only "conservative" and right-wing news sources telling the population how the "liberals" are doing everything they can to take rights away and make this a police state. People in Kansas are either too lazy or working too much to do any research, so they go with what they are told. And vote accordingly. So, they send wing nuts to the state legislature and governor's mansion and Congress. The right-wingers on K Street are popping champagne right now over this. This POS bill shows how they can control the masses.

Another example: right-wing media is telling everyone the right will win both the House and Senate in November. My prediction is Democrats will get some seats back in the Senate and probably get a narrow lead in the House because the voters who would vote for Republicans/right-wingers will simply stay home because they are being led to believe their party is a shoo-in. Sad but that is probably what will happen.
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aerorobnz
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 3:15 am

sooner or later the inbreeding had to have an effect on the mental faculties of Kansas. Oh dear, if it was suitable to cull off a giraffe in denmark for lack of genetic variation then surely Kansas needs some attention too.... 
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einsteinboricua
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 4:02 am

Quoting seb146 (Reply 15):
Another example: right-wing media is telling everyone the right will win both the House and Senate in November. My prediction is Democrats will get some seats back in the Senate and probably get a narrow lead in the House because the voters who would vote for Republicans/right-wingers will simply stay home because they are being led to believe their party is a shoo-in. Sad but that is probably what will happen.

I wish. Gerrymandering has ensured the House for Republicans for the rest of the decade (or until Democrats get back some state assemblies and governorships in order to rearrange the districts to more favorable terms). The Senate is on the verge of switching to GOP control. It all depends on how Landrieu, Begich, Hagan, and perhaps Walsh manage to defend their seats. Pryor's seat is gone, so are SD and WV. Democrats have nearly 50% chance of flipping McConnell's seat to their control (latest poll shows Grimes leading), and GA's seat still leans red, but barely.

IF the Senate flips to Republicans, it's only for two years. Come 2016 they'll have more seats to defend than Democrats do in this cycle. Remember the 2010 wave. While the House will remain unchanged, the 2010 wave was a message against Obama. Come the 2016 elections, there's no Obama running for office and I'm inclined to believe that many states that flipped red or elected TP folks will come back to their senses and either switch it back to blue or elect a more moderate GOP candidate. I wouldn't mind a GOP-led Senate if the likes of Rubio, Cruz, Lee, and Paul were not there.

But that's for a different thread.
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luckyone
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 4:37 am

Wasn't Kansas also the state that gave us Carrie Nations (she who said William McKinley assassination was God's justice for his drinking) and the Women's Temperance Movement which spearheaded Prohibition. Hmmmm, how well that moral crusade worked out.

I'm going to take up my own moral crusade and introduce bills that allow me to exercise my religious freedom to to abstain from having to work with, employ, or recognize the rights of fat and lazy people (gluttony and sloth...).

I've also decided that I don't have to talk to people or serve those who shave.

I can throw stones at those who wear multifabric cloth.

And I can do all this because in the eyes of God once you've done one, you've done them all. So they're gay too.

[Edited 2014-02-17 20:47:34]
 
FlyingSicilian
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 4:45 am

Quoting luckyone (Reply 18):
Wasn't Kansas also the state that gave us Carrie Nations (she who said William McKinley assassination was God's justice for his drinking) and the Women's Temperance Movement which spearheaded Prohibition. Hmmmm, how well that moral crusade worked out.

And of course the Westboro Baptist "church"...
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DocLightning
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 5:16 am

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 17):
IF the Senate flips to Republicans, it's only for two years.

They can do a lot of damage in two years if the preachers are in charge.
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sccutler
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 6:31 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 20):
They can do a lot of damage in two years if the preachers are in charge.

Thank God they aren't!
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RyanairGuru
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 7:07 am

Quoting seb146 (Reply 15):
Democrats will get some seats back in the Senate and probably get a narrow lead in the House because the voters who would vote for Republicans/right-wingers will simply stay home because they are being led to believe their party is a shoo-in. Sad but that is probably what will happen.

Actually no, the right wing media will have switched their message by October to say that the Democrats are going to win because they buy votes with hand outs (or something like that) and with a good dose of "defund Obamacare" and homophobia thrown in for good measure they will drive massive turnout.

Any hope of low conservative turnout in this election cycle is merely dreaming. The best the Democrats can hope for is that the primaries produce some Akin-sytle nutjobs who are simply unelectable by the silent majority, and will also drive Democrat turnout (especially youth and female voters) out of sheer disgust.

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 17):
Landrieu, Begich, Hagan

Of those I think that Hagan stands the best chance.

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 17):
I wouldn't mind a GOP-led Senate if the likes of Rubio, Cruz, Lee, and Paul were not there.

  

If it was just the old McCain-McConnell-Graham types then it wouldn't be anything to be too afraid of. Alas it isn't so.
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einsteinboricua
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 2:30 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 20):
Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 17):
IF the Senate flips to Republicans, it's only for two years.

They can do a lot of damage in two years if the preachers are in charge.

Depends on how many seats they pick up. But even to override any Obama veto, they'd need to convince Democrats to join them. I doubt the GOP will reach up to 67 seats, so at most, the Senate will grind to a standstill with GOP demanding stuff (defund Obamacare and more tax cuts), Obama vetoing it, and the Senate unable to overrride it.
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bhill
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:18 pm

How in the hell can ANY law with "religion" ANYTHING be codified? So much for the 1st Amendment. This completely flummoxes me anytime any party does an end run around our Constitution! The ONLY people that benefit from this are the lawyers.....'cause you KNOW it's gonna go to court if passed.
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Tugger
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:34 pm

We just want the gays to leave the children alone.....

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/...-11e3-95c6-0a7aa80874bc_story.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/o...s-again-leave-kids-alone-in-sochi/

So it's not that we don't like you or want to segregate you, we're not fear-mongering or anything like that, we just want to keep the children safe.

  

Just curious, if these Kansas politicians support religion and the rights of people of religions to act on their religious convictions, I assume that they will allow those churches and religions that honor and perform same-sex marriage to do so. Right? I mean, ones religious convictions are important and should not be infringed upon.

Tugg
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einsteinboricua
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Tue Feb 18, 2014 10:29 pm

Quoting tugger (Reply 25):
I mean, ones religious convictions are important and should not be infringed upon.

My (former) religious convictions called upon stoning an adulterer.

In fact, just for fun, I'll open a business (restaurant, store, whatever) and hang up a sign that says "We don't serve Christians. Other beliefs welcomed". Hey, my "firmly held religious beliefs" tell me to not trust Christians (for whatever readon). The law provides me with protection, so there's nothing anyone can do. Of course, I'll go bankrupt, but the point will still stand. By disguising it as a "bill to protect religious liberty", the door is opened to all religions. Want to avoid it? Call it what it is: "a bill to discriminate against people not like you", or "a bill for Christians to discriminate without feeling guilty about it". Go to Sunday service and call it a week.
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TSS
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Wed Feb 19, 2014 8:28 am

If Kansas is serious about this, then they should set up a state-funded gay relocation program wherein the state of Kansas pays all costs for local gays to move to another, more gay-friendly state. Win-win for everyone involved.   

Of course, if Kansas isn't willing to pony up the funds for this project then I guess they weren't serious to begin with.   
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sw733
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Wed Feb 19, 2014 1:45 pm

Quoting TSS (Reply 27):
If Kansas is serious about this

They aren't. It's already dead.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/outward/2...dmit_it_s_discrimination_kill.html
 
luckyone
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Wed Feb 19, 2014 2:21 pm

Quoting sw733 (Reply 28):
Quoting TSS (Reply 27):
If Kansas is serious about this

They aren't. It's already dead.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/outward/2...dmit_it_s_discrimination_kill.html

My faith in humanity is slightly sounder...for now.
 
sccutler
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:33 pm

Quoting luckyone (Reply 29):
My faith in humanity is slightly sounder...for now.

"For now" is a good addition - never, ever, stop challenging, exercising skepticism, at the actions of government. Whether they're doing something with which you agree, or with which you take great issue, odds are when they pass a law, they're restricting liberty just a *little bit* more... a tiny cut... after thousands of which, you're dead.

---

The bill's failure was as I predicted, above; then again, it was not the work of a genius to envision this outcome.

[Edited 2014-02-19 07:33:56]
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einsteinboricua
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:16 pm

And here I thought only Republicans would come up with these crazy ideas...seems a Democrat there is also joining the cuckoo club

Spanking

Suitable for another thread or simply add to the basket of Kansas proposed laws.
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luckyone
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:23 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 30):
"For now" is a good addition - never, ever, stop challenging, exercising skepticism, at the actions of government. Whether they're doing something with which you agree, or with which you take great issue, odds are when they pass a law, they're restricting liberty just a *little bit* more... a tiny cut... after thousands of which, you're dead.

Indeed. I'm wary of people who want to legislate "values protection." More often than not they want somebody else to protect *their* values, so they don't have to.

“When a religion is good, I conceive it will support itself; and when it does not support itself, and God does not take care to support it so that its professors are obligated to call for help of the civil power, it’s a sign, I apprehend, of its being a bad one.” - Benjamin Franklin
 
sw733
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:35 pm

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 31):
And here I thought only Republicans would come up with these crazy ideas...seems a Democrat there is also joining the cuckoo club

When it comes to politics, both sides are usually bat crap crazy. Anyone who thinks one side isn't is bat crap crazy themselves.
 
Ken777
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Wed Feb 19, 2014 5:59 pm

I believe that the best part of the new Slate article was"

Quote:

I’ve been thinking a lot about this quote from Adam Liptak’s New York Times piece on the series of federal court decisions striking down state gay-marriage bans: “It is becoming increasingly clear to judges that if they rule against same-sex marriage their grandchildren will regard them as bigots,”
http://www.slate.com/blogs/outward/2...dmit_it_s_discrimination_kill.html

That's something to celebrate!
 
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seb146
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:08 am

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 31):
And here I thought only Republicans would come up with these crazy ideas...seems a Democrat there is also joining the cuckoo club

Kansas has always been a little farther to the right than usual. My family was from Topeka and I always thought the state, as a whole, was just a little off. Don't get me wrong: every state has it's quirks, but Kansas is a special kind of crazy. The last time I was there was 1996. The Fred Phelps wackos were protesting my cousin's church. They allowed gays to worship. The horror!! The strangest thing, I thought, was when we were at Walgreens near the capitol building picking up a prescription. We could hear protesters from the capital and we could hear gun fire from a different direction. My grandmother turned her hearing aid off. Kansas is just it's own animal, IMO.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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aerorobnz
Posts: 8346
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2001 3:43 pm

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 9:22 am

Quoting seb146 (Reply 35):
We could hear protesters from the capital and we could hear gun fire from a different direction

It's almost a pity it wasn't from the same direction and didn't result in the entire Fred Phelps group laying in a pool of their own blood on the roadside outside the church.
Flown to 147 Airports in 62 Countries on 83 Operators and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
ECAMActions
Posts: 303
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:37 pm

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:46 pm

Quoting Ken777 (Thread starter):

It's a mental illness. Gays can seek help to get rid of and suppress their homosexual desires. Those that embrace it should expect that people will want to avoid them.
 
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DeltaMD90
Posts: 8928
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:25 pm

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:57 pm

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 37):
It's a mental illness.

I suspect you have scientific proof to back this up? Peer reviewed please, not some whacky religious "scientific study" or something

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 37):
Gays can seek help to get rid of and suppress their homosexual desires.

Why? "Mental illness," socialization, personal choice, I don't think it matters. You gotta have pretty weak skin to let it bother you

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 37):
Those that embrace it should expect that people will want to avoid them.

And those who oppose it can expect to see their numbers dwindle and dwindle and rightly be called bigots*

--

*IDC what one personally thinks. Even if you're gay and you oppose gay marriage and "become straight" or whatever, more power to ya. When you start messing with other people's rights that's where you cross the line
 
ECAMActions
Posts: 303
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:00 pm

Just another part of our social and societal decay. The Russians are starting to look very smart.
 
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DeltaMD90
Posts: 8928
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:25 pm

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:04 pm

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 39):
Just another part of our social and societal decay

I take it you don't have the science to back it up then?* Just your personal opinion? Well I think the better argument is that society is overcoming their disgusting past stereotypes. Doesn't really matter what any of our opinions are, we don't base civil rights on our opinions or some holy text

*I'm sure science is just some liberal hoax or something, no?  
 
luckyone
Posts: 3113
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:50 pm

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:05 pm

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 37):
It's a mental illness. Gays can seek help to get rid of and suppress their homosexual desires. Those that embrace it should expect that people will want to avoid them.

A mental illness is defined as the impaired ability to function or support ones self. We get up just fine, and do our jobs, take care of ourselves and our families IN SPITE of some people telling us we shouldn't. So perhaps our abilities are *enhanced*. Guess what...a lot of us love God too.

Ignorance is a mental illness. The ignorant can seek help to get rid of a suppress their ignorant desires. Those that embrace it should expect that people will want to avoid them. Trollllllllin'.
 
ECAMActions
Posts: 303
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:37 pm

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:38 pm

Quoting luckyone (Reply 49):

You can't argue with history.
 
garnetpalmetto
Posts: 5352
Joined: Tue Oct 21, 2003 1:38 am

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:40 pm

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 50):


You can't argue with history.

You're right, you can't. Clearly the treatment of the LGBT community as second-class citizens in the US will come to an end, just as it came to an end for women and African-Americans. And that day can't come soon enough!   
South Carolina - too small to be its own country, too big to be a mental asylum.
 
ECAMActions
Posts: 303
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RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:45 pm

How long before we let pedophiles become first class citizens? Or are they part of the lbtg?
 
luckyone
Posts: 3113
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:50 pm

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:45 pm

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 50):
You can't argue with history.

Nope, but you seem to think you can.

History: HIV virus found in tissue samples in the 1950s and 60's of (heterosexual) patients in AFRICA, Leopoldville/Kinshasa to be precise (that's a city, in Africa)...none of whom had ever been to San Francisco or a bathhouse. Long before AIDS hit the San Francisco gay community. God bless you.

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 52):
How long before we let pedophiles become first class citizens? Or are they part of the lbtg?

AND the first sign of an argument lost is....to change the subject. God bless you.

[Edited 2014-02-20 07:46:58]
 
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DeltaMD90
Posts: 8928
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:25 pm

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:52 pm

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 50):
You can't argue with history.

You are right, I can't. Too bad history says something about Africa and AIDS... hmm...

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 52):
How long before we let pedophiles become first class citizens? Or are they part of the lbtg?

Pedophiles are citizens, what are you talking about? So are homosexuals. What is a first class citizen?

No, pedophiles are not part of LBGT. What does banning consensual homosexual adults have to do with pedophilia? Does gay marriage cause pedophilia? What does the science say about pedophilia? Yeah, I know, the dreaded "s" word, science. Sorry, I don't constantly shoot at the hip with random stereotypes I've heard people say
 
ImperialEagle
Posts: 2372
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 10:53 am

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:54 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 5):
I also believe it is an inappropriate intrusion of government into the lives of the citizens; nothing, now, impedes a person from standing on principle, refusing service to whomever they choose; they must, of course, bear the consequences (whatever they may be, ridicule, adulation, prosecution or persecution) that come with that choice, but is that not essentially proof that you have the "courage of your convictions"?

Yes. You cannot legislate morality and the Government needs to stay out of the bedroom!

Quoting sccutler (Reply 12):
this is not what "the right" wants (if for no other reason than there is no homogeneous group called "the right," which adheres rigidly to an identical set of beliefs and demands).

   The "Log Cabin Republicans" are proof of that!  bigthumbsup 

Quoting sccutler (Reply 12):
Not at all so. Some believe this, no doubt -- but again, you can scarcely make this broad-brush assertion with any shred of credibility.

Credibility isn't an issue with the liberal extremists.

Quoting seb146 (Reply 15):
I have posted ad nauseum about my thoughts regarding the right wing vs. Republicans.

We know, we know  
Quoting seb146 (Reply 35):
every state has it's quirks,

Just can't get past that "lock-step" mentality can you? Every state is obviously made up of people from all walks of life.

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 42):
Not being able to control your sexual desire is a mental illness

Wow, Hugh Hefner sure must have enjoyed being so sick all these years.  
Quoting luckyone (Reply 46):
Better to keep quiet and let people think you a fool than to open your mouth and prove it. You can spew and belch rhetoric all you want
Quoting luckyone (Reply 49):
Now I know you're a troll

Well, he isn't the only one on this blog. At least he is in good company.  

[Edited 2014-02-20 07:58:11]
"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough!"
 
luckyone
Posts: 3113
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:50 pm

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:04 pm

Quoting ECAMActions (Reply 55):
Just because it wad found in some blacks in Africa in *the 1950s deosnt make the fact that the homosexuals in san fransisco spread it in the 1980s.

So we've gone from it STARTED in San Francisco gays to "they spread it." Progress, or back pedaling? You decide. Nobody disputed it hit the San Francisco gay community. You're the one who implied that it's a gay disease that started there--and it's not and it didn't. The majority of the first AIDS cases in this country were not even gay men (also a fact). They were just the ones that gave preachers something to fill their pockets about. You clearly know next to nothing about how disease works and spread, much less virology.

[Edited 2014-02-20 08:04:35]
 
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DeltaMD90
Posts: 8928
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:25 pm

RE: Kansas Brings Segregation Back Against Gays

Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:10 pm

Oh snap, a peer reviewed scientific study! http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF01542377

Quote:
There were no examples of regression to child victims among peer-oriented, homosexual males. The possibility emerges that homosexuality and homosexual pedophilia may be mutually exclusive and that the adult heterosexual male constitutes a greater risk to the underage child than does the adult homosexual male.

First hit on google. It's that easy ECAMActions, where are your peer reviewed sources? Gay people being harmful to society, pedophiles being predominantly homosexual, etc.

Read up on the scientific method. We have ways of getting as close to the truth as humans can. Your claims are just laughable stereotypes either not supported by science or even completely debunked by them. You care about being right, don't you?

Edit: A single peer reviewed paper isn't the end all be all. It's good evidence, but you need to build up your evidence before you should accept it. I just don't feel like digging up a bunch of articles. If you can counter it with your own peer reviewed papers then we can play ball

[Edited 2014-02-20 08:11:31]

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