kaitak
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 5:10 pm

Stop for a moment and think about this: this is something done by one (or a group of) "human beings" to another, in the year 2015:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-31121160

We know IS is capable of immense cruelty, but this plunges new depth. It gives us an insight into their mentality; it's a nihilist mentality. The suspicions that they might be open to a deal, in exchange for a failed suicide bomber, seemed to suggest that IS was open to reason. Now, they've shown that they are not. They are just mindless killers, who see no value in human life and as long as they are left like this and left to spread their tentacles, more and more people will be subject to their rule.

The real question now is ... how long do we give them? Exactly what are we waiting for; what are we expecting them to do that will real, focused action being taken against them?

Yes, the air strikes were helpful, but now, a message needs to be sent. Those responsible for this outrage and others need to be found; the IS movement needs to be crippled. But who is going to do it? Who is going to take responsibility for it? Of course, we have to accept a likelihood that IS's action are aimed at drawing in "boots on the ground", but again, the same point has to be made: in the year 2015, can it be acceptable that a group such as this, with its ideology and its flagrant disregard for human dignity, be allowed to have control over such a wide area and nearly half a million people.

Where is the line in the sand?

[Edited 2015-02-03 09:11:52]
 
DDR
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 5:38 pm

I was against boots on the ground but not any more. These bastards need to be taken out and killed. Every last one of them,. They are just a bunch of thugs. This is not about religion. This is about savage brutality.
 
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Tugger
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 5:39 pm

Horrible. But then we know that is the norm for these cretins. I am guessing they primarily want to use this to drive a wedge between the powerful tribes in Jordan (Lt. Kasasbeh's clan is of the Bararsheh) and the Jordanian government. Tribal influence is big in Jordan and support even more so. The question is where will the resulting anger be directed? Toward the "shoes" who did this or the Jordanian government (who some say should not be involved in the conflict)?

Perhaps certain resources may be able to be utilized/reviewed to see what "heat blooms" occurred in the region in the recent past and then match them up to the visuals in the video. And then maybe someone can put a missile into there....

Tugg
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mham001
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 5:47 pm

Quoting kaitak (Thread starter):
But who is going to do it? Who is going to take responsibility for it?

I think we all know who will bear that burden.
 
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KPDX
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 5:51 pm

Ugh....


Something needs to be done, and soon. Obviously this organization has no regard for what others think or want. They will do as they please, and they probably feel they can do it without severe consequences.

While perhaps not on the sheer scale of Hitler in the late 1930s, there is only so much until something needs to be done...

Wake up, people.

[Edited 2015-02-03 10:18:04]
 
PC12Fan
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 6:16 pm

I hope the term carpet bombing will be in the news again - soon.

Yes, it's a brutal display of force but extreme violence is the only language these cancers of humanity understand.
Just when I think you've said the stupidest thing ever, you keep talkin'!
 
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Braybuddy
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 7:05 pm

Difficult and all that it would be to do, we need to stop publicising these executions. These thugs thrive on the headlines they are generating around the world. Deprive them of the oxygen of publicity and their executions become worthless to them.
 
B747forever
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 7:27 pm

Quoting pvjin (Reply 10):
A few days ago another bunch of Somali immigrants gang raped a Swedish woman on a ship going from Stockholm to Turku,

Oh, I see. So those were really not Swedes then. Unfortunately nothing the media here have reported.

Quoting Braybuddy (Reply 11):

Difficult and all that it would be to do, we need to stop publicising these executions. These thugs thrive on the headlines they are generating around the world

The whole video is out there, about 22minutes long. It is a very long "intro" in which the captured pilot seems to explain about the operation he participated in.
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CaliAtenza
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 7:54 pm

Quoting pvjin (Reply 10):
Indeed, when ISIS fighters return to Sweden they will be given help to cope with whatever psychological traumas they might have gained while slaughtering and raping innocent civilians, also Swedish tax payers will help them to find a job.

http://www.expressen.se/nyheter/komm...en-vill-ge-jobb-till-is-krigare-1/

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=1fd_1421747826

If I was a Swede I would genuinely try my best to get out of there ASAP, what a depressing place Sweden has become, a bit like castrated modern day DDR where social democracy is the de facto state ideology and criticizing immigration is an absolute taboo.

It really frightens me that even from here Finland over 50 people have left to fight in Syria / Iraq, most of them ending up fighting for ISIS. I'm absolutely certain that a lot of ISIS fighters will eventually return to Europe and commit major attacks here, it's not matter of "if" but "when".

So far in year 2015 we have had three major acts of violent crime committed by Muslim immigrants. A Somali guy in Oulu chopped two people to death with an axe. A few days ago another bunch of Somali immigrants gang raped a Swedish woman on a ship going from Stockholm to Turku, thankfully for the criminals they all have Swedish nationality so the crime will be investigated by Swedish police. Third, a couple of days ago a 17 year old teenager got murdered and her body burnt by a 25yo immigrant of Middle Eastern origin, according to some he was that girl's ex boyfriend.

News sources:

http://www.helsinkitimes.fi/finland/...th-in-axe-rampage-in-oulu-pub.html

http://www.thelocal.se/20150202/eigh...es-questioned-over-ferry-gang-rape

According to this article the court used a translator of Somali language as their aid in the process.

http://www.ts.fi/uutiset/kotimaa/730...koraiskaus+Kolme+miesta+vangittiin

http://www.iltalehti.fi/uutiset/2015020319137978_uu.shtml

Uncensored image of the criminal, named Ramin Azizi: http://i.imgur.com/egiYlb5.jpg

While these attacks probably weren't motivated by religion it tells a lot about huge problems Finland and Sweden have with integration of refugees from Muslim countries, when it comes to violent crime certain ethnic groups are insanely overrepresented.

Maybe mass deportations are going to be needed....
 
flanker
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:05 pm

ISIS. Cancer of the Earth. These SAVAGES need to be skinned alive.


http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=6e0_1422982365

Quoting PC12Fan (Reply 6):
I hope the term carpet bombing will be in the news again - soon.

Yes, it's a brutal display of force but extreme violence is the only language these cancers of humanity understand.


  

I do hope that the Jordanians stick to their promise and carry the executions of the ISIS prisoners in the harshest way possible.

The time for "reasoning and feel good bullshit diplomacy" is over.

[Edited 2015-02-03 12:08:39]
 
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falstaff
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:23 pm

Quoting KPDX (Reply 5):
While perhaps not on the sheer scale of Hitler in the late 1930s, there is only so much until something needs to be done...

Hitler and his crew started small and worked their way up. Their oppression of Jews and the "politically unreliable" started small too. They didn't start out murdering Jews by the millions, it took ten years for that to happen. The Nazis couldn't invade Europe and begin a genocide with only a few thousand people. They had to grow until they had millions of followers to carry out their wishes. ISIS may be the same thing. They may not be all that powerful now, but what about ten years from now?
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Dreadnought
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:27 pm

Quoting kaitak (Thread starter):
The suspicions that they might be open to a deal, in exchange for a failed suicide bomber, seemed to suggest that IS was open to reason.

Anyone who ever thought that they were maybe open to reason needs a whack upside the head. Theirs is an ideology even more deeply ingrained than any any other in history. It will not stop until they are all killed, or they kill (or subjugate) all of us.

Quoting Braybuddy (Reply 11):
Difficult and all that it would be to do, we need to stop publicising these executions. These thugs thrive on the headlines they are generating around the world.

You assume they would stop, if they don't get the publicity. In fact, for every videotaped execution, there are many thousands that are done with no such publicity. They do it because they like it - because they think that slitting the throat of an infidel is a godly act - their good deed of the day.

On the contrary, since many, many people in the west seem to believe that they are simply misunderstood, or that they will just go away if we ignore them, need to be exposed to how brutal they are.
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DocLightning
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:33 pm

For those of you who want boots on the ground to throw down this brutal regime: what's your long-term plan? Why ISIS and not Boko Haram or God's Army?

If we put boots on the ground, this will happen to American servicemen and women. And to what end? How long are we going to stay there to ensure that a democratic secular state is set? "As long as it takes?" That might be decades. I mean, we've done this in Iraq before and the result was that we replaced Saddam Hussein with ISIS. Insanity is when you keep doing the same thing and expect a different result.

Is the US military the best took to build a nation?

The fundamental problem is that we are dealing with an entire culture that believes that violence is a way to solve religious disputes. Throw in tribalism and resource insecurity and you have a problem that cannot be solved without shaking the foundations of the entire culture.

Let's compare IS and KSA for a moment:

Penalty for blasphemy, apostasy, homosexuality in both jurisdictions: death

For slander or drinking alcohol: 80 lashes in IS, typically some number of lashes in KSA

For adultery: death by stoning both jurisdictions

For stealing: amputation of hand both jurisdiction

The differences are mostly practical and pragmatic: KSA is willing to do business with the US and is willing to partner against a common enemy. IS is not.

So if we are going to send Western troops in again to fight alongside the various Islamic nations there, then we need to throw some conditions on them. They will take religion out of their governments and institute constitutional secular democracies. They will educate their children (boys and girls) and see to their safety and health. They will use their considerable economic resources to upgrade their national infrastructure. This will be a long and slow process that will take a few decades, but it can result in stable democracy and that's a valid goal.

And if they won't, then...I say we move our assets out of there. Put our money where our mouth is.
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bennett123
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:55 pm

It could be a case of getting them before they get us.

Clearly local partners are needed. Most of the boots need to be local.

As for Boko Harem, the current govt in Abuja seems to lack the stomach take these people on.

As for publicity, I do not see this "oxygen of publicity" argument.

Anyone having sympathy for IS needs to know what they are.

Furthermore, everyone needs to grasp that there can be no compromise. Anything less than force will just be seen as weakness.
 
A332DTW
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:03 pm

My empathies to the pilot's closest loved ones. I could never imagine losing someone in that fashion... absolutely evil.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 18):
They will use their considerable economic resources to upgrade their national infrastructure

Not that I want to stray off on some third topic and get into a debate, but I just find it silly for us to force another country to upgrade national infrastructure when we ourselves don't really lead by example of maintaing our infrastructure all that well. Just does not make sense to me.
 
kaitak
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:17 pm

I think there may be an elephant in the room, hidden by low light and and wearing a full niqab.

Are western intelligence agencies aware of IS holding weapons of mass destruction, which could be used against them, if they did mount a "boots on the ground" invasion. Yes, I know they are hammering them from the skies, but that's not exactly surgical. Do we need to know more about the pull they have on young Muslims? What is the essence of their message. We hear all about the legal threats against Muslim who go to Syria and come back, but what is the essence of their message, that draws people out there.

If not, then what? At the moment, IS seems - according to maps - to be very spread out, from Raqqa in Syria to cities in Northern Iraq; that's a big distance. Given the technological superiority, is it not possible to split them? OK, doing so now would not be without its problems, but it seems that they are only going to grow. At what point does this become "geopolitically" unacceptable. Can we set out a chain of events that will occur is there is NO external interference (apart from airstrikes)?

IS continues to grow; takes Baghdad, or tries to and then, Iran intervenes and then ... civil war in Iraq, because the Sunnis - even those who don't want ISIS - certainly won't want an Iran backed Shia state. So, ISIS spreads south, pushed back from the Iranian border, but still heads south. Next stop Kuwait? What happens then? That would almost certainly be a red line. So, are we saying then that as long as ISIS is confined within the borders of present day Iraq, it's acceptable. What if Iran chases ISIS back, which they would almost certainly be able to do (and would not have much scruples about using certain types of weapons - certainly not the IRGC anyway). Would Saudi Arabia accept this - Iran controlling land right up to its borders?

And what next? Jordan? I think Israel has made it clear that if IS were to enter Jordan, it would take action and Israel would not be any more happy about Iran moving west.

So, the longer "we" (and we can all define who "we" is/are) wait, the less pleasant the options become. There's a lot to be said for the US staying out and leaving ISS and Iran to knock the living you-know-what out of each other, but then what? The humanitarian aspect seems to be well down everyone's list of priorities. We know what they are capable of, but it seems to be the old case of somebody, everybody and nobody. Everybody knows that something needs to be done and somebody needs to do it, but nobody wants to be that person and really, regardless of the revulsion that people feel about today, the most likely outcome is that there might be a spate of heavier bombings for a while, but ISIS will just be left to its own devices and until Iran or the KSA decides its interests are threatened, nothing will happen. Apart from lots more innocents getting killed or flogged for the merest of transgressions.
 
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Aesma
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:22 pm

The last intervention in Iraq killed far more civilians than IS so far, just saying.
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ER757
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:59 pm

Beyond words - these scum are the lowest life form on the planet. Yes, they need to be taken out by whatever means necessary, but the problem is they are not like an organized army that has bases and move as a united front. They're dispersed and hard to spot amongst the civilians in the area. If they were concentrated, then yeah, drop a nuke on 'em and be done with it. But this is a different type of enemy. To engage them, I really believe it needs to be by the countries in the region (Saudi Arabia, Iran, Turkey, etc). They need to clean up the mess in their neighborhood. Sure other countries should lend support, especially those that have lost people in these barbaric executions, but they shouldn't take the lead. It would only foment anti-western sentiment in the area and lead to possibly more converts to extremism.
 
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Aaron747
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:28 pm

Quoting kaitak (Thread starter):
The suspicions that they might be open to a deal, in exchange for a failed suicide bomber, seemed to suggest that IS was open to reason. Now, they've shown that they are not.

The entire deal with the Jordanian pilot and Japanese hostages was never about showing they can negotiate - this is a ridiculous notion. Factions within ISIS clearly couldn't decide which action to take as Kenji Goto passed from Syria to Iraqi control at least twice according to intelligence sources. ISIS is actively looking for ways to further legitimize itself by tangible effects on media coverage and state actors, as this helps their recruiting. They are seeking power and are not negotiators plain and simple.

Quoting kaitak (Reply 21):
IS continues to grow; takes Baghdad, or tries to and then, Iran intervenes

That is basically the limit of the territory they can cover - they are no match for Iran ultimately. The Kurds have been giving them hell lately as well.

Quoting ER757 (Reply 23):
To engage them, I really believe it needs to be by the countries in the region (Saudi Arabia, Iran, Turkey, etc).

This should be the thrust of all Western negotiations with countries bordering captured ISIS territory. It may be difficult for Iran to work together with Turkey and KSA, but many of the people ISIS have targeted are Shia.
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mham001
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 11:02 pm

The more we drill, the less relevant the region becomes. Drill baby drill.
 
F9Animal
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 11:03 pm

I can't believe I watched the video. It made me even more angry. Can we still use nepalm? Hope the US gets serious, and joins other nations to wipe this scum off of the earth.
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DDR
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Tue Feb 03, 2015 11:43 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 18):

Ok, so then we should just do nothing and allow them to keep killing. Really? And by the way, American service men are not cowards. They would gladly fight to defend innocent civilians. That's what they do.

Isolationist thinking will not stop ISIL.
 
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cjg225
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 12:06 am

Quoting F9Animal (Reply 26):
Can we still use nepalm?

Technically, it would be a war crime.
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Dreadnought
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 12:16 am

Quoting cjg225 (Reply 28):
Technically, it would be a war crime.

LOL, since when?

The policy should be, "You kill one of ours, we kill 100 of yours". Let's start with the ones at Gitmo. Let's return them where they come from. From 30,000 feet without a parachute. Any other ISIS/Al Qaeda/Taliban "fighters" we capture, we interrogate, get what we can out of them, and shove them out an airplane. With a big slab of bacon stuck in his ass.
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Rara
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 12:58 am

While this news certainly is shocking and disgusting, let's not forget that this is precisely what it's meant to be. These people don't do that for fun, or because they think it's just, or because they're medieval primitives (although they most certainly are). They do it to shock us, to gain maximum publicity and coverage, and to provoke us into irrational action. These are people who want to turn cultures against each other and who want to maximise suffering and violence, because in their crude and disguided belief, their God will make them victorious.

Here we see their strategy at work:

Quoting DDR (Reply 1):
I was against boots on the ground but not any more. These bastards need to be taken out and killed. Every last one of them,. They are just a bunch of thugs. This is not about religion. This is about savage brutality.

If you didn't think a military ground intervention was a good idea before this killing, you shouldn't think so now - otherwise you allow ISIS to manipulate your thoughts.

Quoting F9Animal (Reply 26):

I can't believe I watched the video. It made me even more angry.

FFS don't do that. That's EXACTLY what they want you to do - don't give in.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 29):
The policy should be, "You kill one of ours, we kill 100 of yours".

The Nazis would have wholeheartedly agreed. Only their quota was a bit lower. "Ten Italians for one German" was their motto in the Ardeatine massacre (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ardeatine_massacre), in which more than 300 innocent people died.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 29):
Let's start with the ones at Gitmo. Let's return them where they come from. From 30,000 feet without a parachute. Any other ISIS/Al Qaeda/Taliban "fighters" we capture, we interrogate, get what we can out of them, and shove them out an airplane. With a big slab of bacon stuck in his ass.

Vivid proof that medieval revenge fantasies aren't limited to the Islamic world. Spoken like a true Jihadist!
Samson was a biblical tough guy, but his dad Samsonite was even more of a hard case.
 
flanker
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 1:15 am

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 29):
The policy should be, "You kill one of ours, we kill 100 of yours". Let's start with the ones at Gitmo. Let's return them where they come from. From 30,000 feet without a parachute. Any other ISIS/Al Qaeda/Taliban "fighters" we capture, we interrogate, get what we can out of them, and shove them out an airplane. With a big slab of bacon stuck in his ass.

I actually really like your plan and while we are at it, have women do it. The snackbarians can't get their virgins if they are killed by a woman. Will put the fear of God in those savages.

                 




[Edited 2015-02-03 17:23:20]
 
Cadet985
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 1:26 am

First off, I send prayers to the family of the Jordanian pilot.

Quoting kaitak (Thread starter):
The real question now is ... how long do we give them? Exactly what are we waiting for;

Well, I doubt Obama will send ground forces in unless US interests are threatened. He may even be foolish enough to wait until they hit a consulate or embassy. But I think that the red line here, is Israel. Israel has been relatively quiet on the issue of ISIS, but I expect that will change when Netanyahu addresses Congress.

Here's how I see the situation playing out.

ISIS, along with Hezbollah and Hamas attack Israel. Israel responds as any country with a decent military would. Keep in mind that Israel has a large storage depot with US arms and equipment. Despite sentiments against Israel, I do believe that a lot of countries would come to Israel's aid and defense and start fighting ISIS. All of this, is to keep Israel from taking the ultimate self defense measure...nuking countries supporting ISIS.

That may not be exactly the way I personally want it to play out out, but that's how I see it happening in today's political area. Personally, since ISIS has shown time and time again that they'll even kill Muslims, I think the Muslim world at large needs to align with Israel and fight off ISIS, and stop any bickering for the time being.

Marc
 
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WarRI1
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 1:42 am

I ask, where is the outrage on the Arab Street about Muslims killing Muslims? Let us wait and see how this plays out. I do not expect much from the Muslim World on this issue, they never disappoint me.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
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Aaron747
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:00 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 33):

Well the Jordanians are certainly pissed off - perhaps you're watching the wrong news.

http://m.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-31121160

Jordan's security minister has also announced the person IS wanted released as well as other AQ prisoners will be summarily executed immediately.

[Edited 2015-02-03 18:01:34]
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WarRI1
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:08 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 34):
Well the Jordanians are certainly pissed off - perhaps you're watching the wrong news.

The news I watched, not Fox either, said there is great division in Jordan on the issue of Jordan even joining the battle against Isis already.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
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Aaron747
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:15 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 35):

That's because the King's opponents don't want to be allied with the US. But they will sing a different tune soon - Obama just increased Jordanian aid to $1B per annum, and the pilot's family apparently shouted down protesters saying the government is capable of carrying out revenge.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
A332DTW
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:17 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 35):
The news I watched, not Fox either, said there is great division in Jordan on the issue of Jordan even joining the battle against Isis already.

Just like there is division in any country when they're asked about getting involved in a ground war. What specifically do you want ordinary citizens to do? Some are hitting the streets calling for revenge, others would rather not get involved.

I just hope the Jordanian officials don't respond in haste, and respond with a cool head.
 
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WarRI1
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:26 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 36):
Quoting A332DTW (Reply 37):

Trust me, I believe in retaliation. I do not believe we will see a large scale rush to fight ISIS by any Arab, Muslim nation. This is personal for Jordan now, let us wait and see. Do not hold your breathe for too much action. What I see is the good old USA getting bled dry fighting for those who will not, because they do not care enough, or deep down believe in what is happening. The Muslims are good at killing Muslims is the way I see it, except when it comes to non-Muslims trying to save them from themselves. Then it is Christians against Muslims, a whole new ball game.

[Edited 2015-02-03 18:30:00]
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Aaron747
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:34 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 38):
The Muslims are good at killing Muslims is the way I see it, except when it comes to non-Muslims trying to save them from themselves.

You need to be clear about which Muslims you're talking about. ISIS are even killing fellow Sunnis now, which is why they are bound for failure. If you want to see a real bloodbath though - wait and watch when they encroach on the Iranian border.

At the very least, people surrounding the ISIS scourge are realizing there is nothing religious about them.

[Edited 2015-02-03 18:35:28]
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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WarRI1
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:44 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 39):
You need to be clear about which Muslims you're talking about. ISIS are even killing fellow Sunnis now, which is why they are bound for failure. If you want to see a real bloodbath though - wait and watch when they encroach on the Iranian border.

We all know there are many good people, Muslim and Christian, one cannot help but indict many as the record shows. Christian and Muslims who keep their mouths closed are self indicting. This is terrorism in the name of Allah, let us not be afraid to call it what it is. Chop heads, burn and kill. What is the law imposed on the subjected of these madman? Is it not Sharia Law, or some form of it? I certainly think so. I most certainly will support Iran in this matter. I do not think ISIS is dumb enough to directly confront Iran. I certainly hope they are.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
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Aesma
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:46 am

Quoting cadet985 (Reply 32):
ISIS, along with Hezbollah and Hamas attack Israel. Israel responds as any country with a decent military would. Keep in mind that Israel has a large storage depot with US arms and equipment. Despite sentiments against Israel, I do believe that a lot of countries would come to Israel's aid and defense and start fighting ISIS. All of this, is to keep Israel from taking the ultimate self defense measure...nuking countries supporting ISIS.

That may not be exactly the way I personally want it to play out out, but that's how I see it happening in today's political area. Personally, since ISIS has shown time and time again that they'll even kill Muslims, I think the Muslim world at large needs to align with Israel and fight off ISIS, and stop any bickering for the time being.

Israel is not important in ISIS plan, they have no reason to attack it before having conquered several other countries.

Aligning with Israel doesn't make sense since Israel isn't even in the fight at the moment, they're too busy creating the next generation of jihadis.

By some indications Israel is quite happy with the existence of ISIS, and if they would attack Iran they would cheer : http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/1.623717
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Elite
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 3:22 am

Quoting Rara (Reply 30):
If you didn't think a military ground intervention was a good idea before this killing, you shouldn't think so now - otherwise you allow ISIS to manipulate your thoughts.

Well to be fair, reacting to current events isn’t allowing others to manipulate one’s thoughts. I understand your argument, but in an extreme example, those in favor of the US staying neutral in WWII quickly changed their minds when Japan attacked Pearl Harbor. Continually assessing information and making a logical and calculated decision is a good thing.
 
A332DTW
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 3:31 am

According to CNN, the Jordanian government has executed 2 terrorist prisoners.
 
Cadet985
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:04 am

Quoting Aesma (Reply 41):
By some indications Israel is quite happy with the existence of ISIS, and if they would attack Iran they would cheer :

Israel is worried about ISIS, and preparing for what many there see as almost inevitable. Trust me.

Marc
 
F9Animal
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:09 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 35):
The news I watched, not Fox either, said there is great division in Jordan on the issue of Jordan even joining the battle against Isis already.

If it was a Jordanian journalist, or say an aid worker perhaps. ISIS brutally murdered one of their military pilots. Me thinks Jordan is brewing big time. I also think this senseless, barbaric execution will strengthen the local Jordanian population to want ISIS destroyed.

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 38):
Trust me, I believe in retaliation. I do not believe we will see a large scale rush to fight ISIS by any Arab, Muslim nation. This is personal for Jordan now, let us wait and see. Do not hold your breathe for too much action. What I see is the good old USA getting bled dry fighting for those who will not, because they do not care enough, or deep down believe in what is happening. The Muslims are good at killing Muslims is the way I see it, except when it comes to non-Muslims trying to save them from themselves. Then it is Christians against Muslims, a whole new ball game.

Sadly, I see this eventually turning into a war on religion. If it hasn't already gotten there. Seems like religion has started many wars throughout our existence. ISIS in my opinion is as filthy as the Nazi's were. Eventually, ISIS will be destroyed, but that won't happen until ISIS strikes a nerve on every Nations level.

I understand most Muslims are peaceful, and I respect that. However, ISIS, the Taliban, and all of these muslim terrorist organizations are casting very dark shadows on the religion. Eventually, the peaceful may become irrelevant. This video is incredible, and should be watched by everyone!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ry3NzkAOo3s

[Edited 2015-02-03 20:11:51]
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
A332DTW
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:16 am

I haven't seen the video, just out of moral reasons, but apparently ISIS puts a bounty on several Jordanian Airmen specifically listing their names at the end of the video. I assume Jordan will up their security inside its borders.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...ge-burdning-death-muadh-al-kasabeh

[Edited 2015-02-03 20:23:12]
 
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Pellegrine
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:26 am

Horrible when I first read of it....., everyone thinks of being burned a small bit...and then extrapolating it to your whole body, and subsequently dying of it? Eeeek. Yet, when we move forward, we have to move in a realistic way, not a reactionary one.

Middle Eastern forces allied with Western powers don't really do much without consultation of them, so it will take a more concerted effort of Europe/US to get rid of this scourge.

Western powers need to evaluate Iran's position better (they aren't really for crazy/rogue/fanatical IS), and bring Turkey into the fight even though they want plausible deniability.

Low-RCS attack and reconnaissance drones like the US operates in Yemen. IS doesn't have the tools to shoot them down really. And you aren't risking any lives if they do.
oh boy, here we go!!!
 
CaliAtenza
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:32 am

Quoting kaitak (Reply 21):
S continues to grow; takes Baghdad, or tries to and then, Iran intervenes and then ... civil war in Iraq, because the Sunnis - even those who don't want ISIS - certainly won't want an Iran backed Shia state. So, ISIS spreads south, pushed back from the Iranian border, but still heads south. Next stop Kuwait? What happens then? That would almost certainly be a red line. So, are we saying then that as long as ISIS is confined within the borders of present day Iraq, it's acceptable. What if Iran chases ISIS back, which they would almost certainly be able to do (and would not have much scruples about using certain types of weapons - certainly not the IRGC anyway). Would Saudi Arabia accept this - Iran controlling land right up to its borders?

ISIS is not gonna take Baghdad. They couldn't even hold on to Kobane, and we (the Coalition, but mainly Iraqi ground forces) are getting ready to take back Mosul. The Peshmerga are already giving them hell on the outskirts of Mosul.
 
CaliAtenza
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:38 am

What I am more concerned about though, are stories like this:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/02/03/politi...orism-michael-steinbach/index.html (ISIS recruiting US teenagers...)
 
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WarRI1
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 5:00 am

Quoting F9Animal (Reply 45):

I sure hope this motivates Jordan and others to finally decide to stand up and want to destroy these monsters. What I do not really understand is how bad do things have to be for Muslims to realize we are not the monsters, it is their fellow Muslims who are. I am afraid this is and always has been a religious war.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
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EA CO AS
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 5:10 am

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 29):
The policy should be, "You kill one of ours, we kill 100 of yours". Let's start with the ones at Gitmo. Let's return them where they come from. From 30,000 feet without a parachute.

  

This, this, a thousand times this. Let orange jumpsuits rain from the skies.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

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SOBHI51
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 5:52 am

I waited for a long time before i share my feelings, the anger i felt and the feeling of helplessness was too much for me to write without loosing it.
But i will start by addressing all who never miss an occasion to attack countries in the ME or Islam, pilot Moaz al-Kasasbeh was on a mission to attack ISIS targets when his plane went down due to mechanical problems, air forces from UAE, KSA, Jordan and Bahrain are cooperating with western air forces in the fight against ISIS.

The idea of ISIA, Hammas, and Hezbollah joining together to attack Israel is a joke.

ISIS is NOT a religious group, they are killing for the pleasure of doing it, they are trying a scare tactic, they know they are weak, cowards who hide among civilians, so making carpet bombing or the use of napalm impossible without a substantial loss of life among civilians.

We need to forget about our differences, unite, forget what religion we follow or don't, remember that this danger coming not to our area but it will directly or indirectly affect all of us, let's forget our differences, what we think about others way of life, religion or habits, let's remember we are all humans facing the same barbaric enemy, an enemy with no religion nor morals.

To my brother Muslims, let's forget about Shiia or Sunni's, those animals don't give a damn about sects what they care is domination and killing.

May pilot Moaz al-Kasasbeh rest in peace, and let his tragic death be a wake call to all of us.

[Edited 2015-02-03 21:54:06]
I am against any terrorist acts committed under the name of Islam
 
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pvjin
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Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 5:53 am

Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 49):

That's indeed the real threat. ISIS isn't just some random terrorist organization made from bunch of illiterate thugs from a chaotic conflict zone, significant amount of their fighters are first or second generation immigrants from the EU / North America / Australia & NZ.

Quoting Rara (Reply 30):
These are people who want to turn cultures against each other

That was even without ISIS, Muslims in western countries joining ISIS is a sign of exactly that development.
"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - Martin Luther King Jr
 
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RJAF
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RE: Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 6:27 am

I'm so proud to say that this brave man is one of ours. Watch Jordan take care of business now! RIP Muaz!
Chance favors the prepared mind
 
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SOBHI51
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RE: Islamic State (IS) Burns Jordanian Pilot Alive

Wed Feb 04, 2015 6:40 am

Quoting rjaf (Reply 48):

Go get them.
I am against any terrorist acts committed under the name of Islam

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