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Flaps
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Wed May 06, 2015 9:34 pm

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 19):
Obama derangement syndrome. Symptoms include entertaining wild conspiracy theories about the president.

Perhaps this condition would not exist if the president had not made a career out of lying, trampling the constitution and attempting to take powers reserved for congress for himself. If the government itself at all levels, all branches and all party affiliations were not so rampantly corrupt this condition may not exist.

The bottom line is the government of the United States cannot be trusted in anything that it says or does. If you look only at the rampant speculation it may seem silly. However when you look at the actions the government has taken, particularly over the past 10 years or so, who would have thought we would see the things we already have?

Trust in the government has reached an all time low. It seems absurd yes. In light of all the other absurdities we have seen out of this government (IRS scandals, VA scandal, DOJ scandals, Benghazi, Clintons email scandal, the fund raising scandal I could go on for pages) who really is to say what is real and what isn't?

While this case may be overblown the reaction to it ought to be a warning. The people are rapidly losing the last remnants of trust and faith in their federal government.
 
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Moose135
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Wed May 06, 2015 10:03 pm

Quoting Flaps (Reply 50):
The bottom line is the government of the United States cannot be trusted in anything that it says or does.

Like "Iraq has WMDs and are going to use them against us..."
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blueflyer
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Wed May 06, 2015 11:37 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 45):
I have also taken the extreme measure of reading the letter issued by Governor Abbott, and it appears that he has directed the State Guard to "monitor" the military operations; something they might be routinely expected to do, anyway. I could be as simple as a phone call.

I prefer a governor who has the huge courage to look a crackpot in the eye and call him a crackpot, not deploy state assets in reaction to unfounded and ridiculous rumors unsupported by even the shadow of a hint of a fact. Either he believes in these rumors, or he is pandering to those who do. Neither elevates him. Even Perry thinks this is ridiculous.

Should he also send the State Guard to Wal-Mart to make sure the stores that have been closed in Texas aren't really the entrances to a huge network of tunnels through which weapons will be funneled as the last crackpot theory is? Or alternatively turned into these FEMA encampments? Crackpots can't even agree on which crackpot theory to believe in. Should Abbott react to all of them, none of them, some of them? Which one is too crackpot?

Quoting Slider (Reply 43):
I'm curious as to why the objection to a state asserting its own constitutionally protected authority?

And what authority is being asserted?

[Edited 2015-05-06 16:42:53]
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Thu May 07, 2015 1:47 am

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 49):
Sending some low level groups of folks in some type of uniform to spy on Special Forces is plain stupidity. Makes you wonder what type of spying Texas is continually doing on military bases. Maybe it's time to shut some down and send the military personnel to saner states.

The SF guys will just treat them as another OPFORCE. It is quite usual during these exercises to have other military units to go actively looking for the escapees. Having the TX national guard out will just give the SF forces an extra challenge and if some guardsmen come too close, they risk getting their butts kicked.

Jan
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sccutler
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Thu May 07, 2015 1:53 am

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 48):
As Mir said, no one is objecting to TX sending it's on Guardsmen out, they're just (rightfully) making fun of the crazy conspiracy theorists.

Well, to be honest, if you read Governor Abbott's letter, it's not difficult to sense that he may be doing so right out in the open.

But (like I said), there does seem to be a lot of hysteria - and it ain't Abbott's.

Seriously - "Texas Governor Deploys State Guard to Stave Off Obama Takeover."
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Mir
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Thu May 07, 2015 12:45 pm

Quoting Flaps (Reply 50):
The bottom line is the government of the United States cannot be trusted in anything that it says or does.

Fine. The US military is duty-bound to not obey illegal orders. They take that duty seriously. And while there may be some grey areas, a takeover of a state to enforce sharia law or take away everyone's guns is not grey at all - that's an illegal order. So they're not going to do it. Anyone who thinks they might has no respect for the institution that is the US military.

-Mir
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einsteinboricua
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Thu May 07, 2015 2:04 pm

Quoting Flaps (Reply 50):
trampling the constitution and attempting to take powers reserved for congress for himself

Trampling the constitution...a famous phrase. Yet no one can come up with examples.
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DocLightning
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Thu May 07, 2015 9:03 pm

Rick Perry:

“It’s OK to question your government. I do it on a regular basis,” he said on May 5, per the Dallas Morning News. “But the military is something else. Our military is quite trustworthy. The civilian leadership, you can always question that, but not the men and women in uniform.”

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...ry-to-texas-stop-being-insane.html

Now when Rick Perry tells you you've gone full-potato cray, maybe you should listen to him. For that matter, when I agree with Rick Perry, maybe you should listen to us.
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LMP737
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Fri May 08, 2015 3:24 am

Quoting Flaps (Reply 50):
Perhaps this condition would not exist if the president had not made a career out of lying, trampling the constitution and attempting to take powers reserved for congress for himself. If the government itself at all levels, all branches and all party affiliations were not so rampantly corrupt this condition may not exist.

And where was all this concern down in Texas back in 2005 when a similar exercise took place? Oh that's right a good ole boy was in office. What seems to be the biggest concern among these people? Guns. There's your reason.

Quoting Flaps (Reply 50):
Benghazi
Quoting Flaps (Reply 50):
Benghazi

Benghazi is a witch hunt that has uncovered nothing. Yet in spite of that Republicans keep digging it up.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 57):
Rick Perry:

“It’s OK to question your government. I do it on a regular basis,” he said on May 5, per the Dallas Morning News. “But the military is something else. Our military is quite trustworthy. The civilian leadership, you can always question that, but not the men and women in uniform.

I can't help but see the irony of an elected official who once aspired for the highest office in the land saying that.
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DLFREEBIRD
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Fri May 08, 2015 7:01 am

who's going to pay for the 8 weeks of monitoring?
 
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TWA772LR
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Fri May 08, 2015 1:00 pm

Meanwhile on Namek...

Seriously though, not even six months into his term and he's being a dumbass. Looks like I'll be moving to Australia sooner than o thought.
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rfields5421
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Fri May 08, 2015 1:35 pm

Quoting DLFREEBIRD (Reply 59):
who's going to pay for the 8 weeks of monitoring?

It is the STATE GUARD - not the NATIONAL GUARD.

It is an all volunteer force which is not US military. As defined by the Second Amendment - the Texas State Guard is a militia. That militia is composed of six Civil Affairs regiments, two Air Wings, a Medical Brigade and a Maritime Unit. Most member do have prior US military service, but many members have no US military experience/ service. The Texas State Guard does have a Basic Orientation Training course for non-prior service military members.

State guards were specifically authorized by the US Congress after the National Guard units called up for WWI and WWII.

The purpose is to ensure that some quasi-military organization was available for state governors to for assistance in civil disasters - such as flood relief/ rescue, hurricanes, etc.

The State of Texas bears all expenses for the State Guard - including the $121 per day paid to personnel activated for this 'mission'.
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Fri May 08, 2015 11:35 pm

Quoting DLFREEBIRD (Reply 59):
who's going to pay for the 8 weeks of monitoring?

Refer to rfields5421's comment. Just a remark (a tad off topic) but often I'll hear about some form of military waste doing X or Y. A stadium flyover for example, cool, but can cost a lot of money. Don't get me wrong, the military wastes a ton and I really wish some politicians and/or top brass would try and tackle it, but often an event like a flyover will be a flight to some obscure location that the unit would have flown anyway. Instead of getting the X amount of flight hours and having a flight do some touch and goes at X airport, they instead use those couple hours to do a fly by

Just something to keep in mind when talking about the military. In this case, it seems like TX wouldn't have paid this money if they weren't "defending the state from itself." Who knows, maybe this mobilization will take the place of something down the line meaning no money was lost. Not too familiar with how state defense forces work
 
sccutler
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sat May 09, 2015 1:35 am

So, now that the hystericals have decried Gov. Abbott's "mobilization," what, exactly, has he "mobilized"?

Just lookin' for, like, facts and stuff.
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Max Q
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 8:35 am

Quoting sccutler (Reply 63):
Just lookin' for, like, facts and stuff.

Easy now partner.



We don't deal with that stuff around here.
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rfields5421
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 11:32 am

Quoting sccutler (Reply 63):
what, exactly, has he "mobilized"?

Texas hasn't published any numbers, and my sources in the state say less than 30 people have been put on duty status so far. Most of the 'observation' is being done by the State Guard full-time staff, and planning for on-site monitoring if the State Guard can determine where the US military people will be.

There will only be about 1,200 US military special forces people involved, across seven states from Texas to California. So there will likely be less than 500 total in the state of Texas.

Probably be less than 500 Texas State Guard members trying to find 500 special forces troops across the entire state.

It's not really the numbers that matter much. It is Greg Abbot's continual pandering to extremists and conspiracy nuts. And wasting state money. He's been doing that for a dozen years, and I can't believe anyone is shocked that he continues the same nutcase behavior after becoming governor. He knows that element will vote, so anything to make the US government, US military, look bad - Abbot supports.
Not all who wander are lost.
 
sccutler
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 4:48 pm

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 65):
Probably be less than 500 Texas State Guard members trying to find 500 special forces troops across the entire state.

So what, exactly, makes you believe that the State Guard is trying to "find" the Special Forces troops?

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 65):
It's not really the numbers that matter much. It is Greg Abbot's continual pandering to extremists and conspiracy nuts.

For example... what?

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 65):
He knows that element will vote, so anything to make the US government, US military, look bad - Abbot supports.

Nothing (that I have seen) in Governor Abbott's records supports any animus on the part of the Governor against the military.

---

Again, looking for a little more light to go with the heat. Not seeing it, eyes wide-open.
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
 
luckyone
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 4:52 pm

Quoting Flaps (Reply 50):
The bottom line is the government of the United States cannot be trusted in anything that it says or does. If you look only at the rampant speculation it may seem silly. However when you look at the actions the government has taken, particularly over the past 10 years or so, who would have thought we would see the things we already have?
Quoting Flaps (Reply 50):
Trust in the government has reached an all time low. It seems absurd yes. In light of all the other absurdities we have seen out of this government (IRS scandals, VA scandal, DOJ scandals, Benghazi, Clintons email scandal, the fund raising scandal I could go on for pages) who really is to say what is real and what isn't?

It seems absurd yes, but similar logic is what resulted in Ruby Ridge, Waco, and the OKC bombing.
 
sccutler
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 5:02 pm

Quoting luckyone (Reply 67):
It seems absurd yes, but similar logic is what resulted in Ruby Ridge, Waco, and the OKC bombing.


Call me interested;

Explain that. Be specific.
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DocLightning
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 5:43 pm

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 58):
I can't help but see the irony of an elected official who once aspired for the highest office in the land saying that.

Yes, it always amuses me to see GOP politicians who trash the government while not only working for it and in it but making sure that it funnels tons of lucrative contracts to their friends in various industries.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
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luckyone
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 6:17 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 68):

Paranoid distrust of the government, in particular by disgruntled quacks. Ruby Ridge was the result of a paranoid cultish group that thought the government was evil and part of the imminent apocalypse and isolated themselves in BFE Idaho, and ended up in a shoot out with the US Marshalls...The Weaver family used many of the same arguments to defend their actions.

David Koresh of the Branch Davidians was delusional and believed that he was a lot more special than he really was, and the Waco Siege resulted....which lead to our friend Timothy McVeigh and his own paranoid delusions (shared by many of his friends).

A smattering of McVeigh's quotes...seem harmless enough on the surface, until you realize where he's coming from.
"Taxes are a joke. Regardless of what a political candidate "promises," they will increase. More taxes are always the answer to government mismanagement. They mess up. We suffer. Taxes are reaching cataclysmic levels, with no slowdown in sight. [...] Is a Civil War Imminent? Do we have to shed blood to reform the current system? I hope it doesn't come to that. But it might." -- We're still hearing this from some Tea Party people

"The government is afraid of the guns people have because they have to have control of the people at all times. Once you take away the guns, you can do anything to the people. You give them an inch and they take a mile. I believe we are slowly turning into a socialist government. The government is continually growing bigger and more powerful and the people need to prepare to defend themselves against government control." -- we're still hearing this from Tea Party people

"Those who betray or subvert the Constitution are guilty of sedition and/or treason, are domestic enemies and should and will be punished accordingly."

"It also stands to reason that anyone who sympathizes with the enemy or gives aid or comfort to said enemy is likewise guilty. I have sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic and I will. And I will because not only did I swear to, but I believe in what it stands for in every bit of my heart, soul and being. I know in my heart that I am right in my struggle, Steve. I have come to peace with myself, my God and my cause. Blood will flow in the streets, Steve. Good vs. Evil. Free Men vs. Socialist Wannabe Slaves. Pray it is not your blood, my friend."

And then we all know what happened in Oklahoma City 20 years ago...So while it takes a special kind of nut to pull off stuff like this...I get particularly nervous when the GOVERNOR of a state that's got more than its fair share of these folks starts pandering to loons who are using the same phrases, almost verbatim. It doesn't help that I admitted a patient around the 20th anniversary of the bombing who'd been stockpiling weapons. There's no reasoning with these people.
 
Ken777
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 6:46 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 45):
State Guard to "monitor" the military operations; something they might be routinely expected to do,

Routine? Ya gotta be kidding.

Shut down a few bases to help that ignorant governor understand the value of having military personnel in the state.

Quoting Flaps (Reply 50):
Perhaps this condition would not exist if the president had not made a career out of lying, trampling the constitution and attempting to take powers reserved for congress for himself.

Obviously you are talking about the lies about those mythical WMDs in Iraq.

Quoting Flaps (Reply 50):
Trust in the government has reached an all time low. It seems absurd yes. In light of all the other absurdities we have seen out of this government (IRS scandals, VA scandal, DOJ scandals, Benghazi, Clintons email scandal, the fund raising scandal I could go on for pages) who really is to say what is real and what isn't?

IRS and DOJ type scandals are ongoing type of problems and are related to actions of individuals. That is never going to change. The 3 letter names might change, but not the underlying human faults.

The VA problem? Core cause is not being able to get the needed medical professionals to take care of patients. Maybe we raise taxes and fund the VA at a level where they can offer market level salaries to attract medical professionals. Might be about a doubling in a lot of areas.

There is also a need to pay for adequate facilities. I'm talking about sq ft of space, modern equipment that can handle the load - all the way down to sufficient parking. More money and that is going to take tax dollars.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 53):
The SF guys will just treat them as another OPFORCE. It is quite usual during these exercises to have other military units to go actively looking for the escapees. Having the TX national guard out will just give the SF forces an extra challenge and if some guardsmen come too close, they risk getting their butts kicked.

Now that could be fun. Maybe they can get some video on it and put it on YouTube.  
 
luckyone
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 6:53 pm

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 71):
The VA problem? Core cause is not being able to get the needed medical professionals to take care of patients. Maybe we raise taxes and fund the VA at a level where they can offer market level salaries to attract medical professionals. Might be about a doubling in a lot of areas.

This is a big DUH that should've been addressed once we...ohh I don't know...started deploying hundreds of thousands of young men into Iraq, making ZERO changes to the healthcare infrastructure that was inevitably going to be charged with taking care of these guys who are going to come back, and in theory be eligible for care. This is a Bush and Obama failure. Outright. This also tells me that Republicans for all their bleating only care about "the troops" as much as is required to get a ballot in the box. All those years Republicans had control of Congress and did they do anything for the men and women getting blown up once they got home? Not really. I spend about half my duty hours in a VA hospital...and it's disgusting what these people are asked to put with, and it's distressing to watch individual hospital administration try their best with the scraps they're given.
 
sccutler
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 9:33 pm

I wryly note that no one has yet identified the actual actions being taken.

Perhaps a pause in the tinfoil hat preparation is in order...
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DocLightning
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 9:50 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 73):
I wryly note that no one has yet identified the actual actions being taken.

Does it matter? The fact that a governor and senator are giving any credence to the idea that members of the Armed Forces might be trying to engage in an act of tyrannical sedition is the relevant point.

You may or may not trust the government or the Armed Forces in general, but there is nothing more patriotic than supporting the troops themselves. And suggesting that they might do something like this just turns my stomach.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
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rfields5421
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sun May 10, 2015 11:32 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 66):
So what, exactly, makes you believe that the State Guard is trying to "find" the Special Forces troops?

Abbott has specifically directed the state guard to monitor the actions of the US military personnel participating in the exercise. How do you monitor their actions is you can't observe them.

Quoting sccutler (Reply 66):
For example... what?

Lawsuits against the federal government, lawsuits against the US military. As Attorney General, Abbott supported any extremist group which called the federal government on anything. He has spend near a billion dollars of taxpayer money on lawsuits by the state against the federal government which the state has not won a single one. But he was able to go to extremist groups and cite his 'record of Fighting Obama' for his election campaign.

Heck, he whole platform and TV commercials were all about how far to the right Abbot could be in his history as Attorney General and would be as Governor.

Even David Dewhurst - the LT Gov - has said publicly that Abbot's action in this case is going overboard. And he's already had several disagreements with Abbot's far right pandering. Dewhurst is perhaps the most solid strong conservative in Texas. He doesn't play to the media or crackpots. He is just a good solid conservative.

--------------------------------------

For those who don't understand the State Guard concept.

Today in North Texas Army National Guard helicopters were out assisting with rescues of folks trapped in homes by flood waters, etc.

The State Guard Medical Battalion has mobilized a small group to assist with medical needs of people impacted by the flooding. The National Guard doesn't have the type of trained people for such activity. The State Guard does. After a day or two, the State Guard will be able to turn that function over to the Red Cross and the Texas Baptist Men's Emergency Relief.
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MaverickM11
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Mon May 11, 2015 6:31 am

Quoting sccutler (Reply 73):
Perhaps a pause in the tinfoil hat preparation is in order...

I assume you're addressing Cliven Bundy--I mean Abott?
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Max Q
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Mon May 11, 2015 10:11 am

Well, Chuck Norris is mobilized..
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sccutler
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Mon May 11, 2015 12:13 pm

One can "monitor" with a phone call; I rather suspect any "monitoring" is more in this vein.

Still curious what precipitous actions have actually been taken. Haven't heard of any (which certainly does not mean they don't exist).

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 76):

Quoting sccutler (Reply 73):
Perhaps a pause in the tinfoil hat preparation is in order...

I assume you're addressing Cliven Bundy--I mean Abott?

Well, no, was really referencing all of the breathless proclamations about the Governor's letter. Apologies for excessive subtlety (can that even be a thing?).
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bhill
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Mon May 11, 2015 3:52 pm

Errrr....how would they know????

Dumbass..
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Tue May 12, 2015 4:50 am

Quoting sccutler (Reply 73):
I wryly note that no one has yet identified the actual actions being taken.
Quoting sccutler (Reply 78):
Still curious what precipitous actions have actually been taken. Haven't heard of any (which certainly does not mean they don't exist).

What does this even mean? (honest question)
 
sccutler
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Tue May 12, 2015 12:02 pm

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 80):
What does this even mean? (honest question)

Fair question, too.

Lots of sturm und drang over the Governor's actions - but no one seems to know what Governor Abbott has actually done, besides writing a fairly innocuous letter. No rows of citizen soldiers stalking the regular military, no stand-offs of tanks and guns.

Best I can tell, the Governor said, in essence, "we'll monitor the training exercise..." - and that's all. And that is simply nothing about which to get all panty-wadding crazy.
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
 
johns624
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Tue May 12, 2015 12:32 pm

Do they constantly monitor Ft Hood and Ft Bliss to make sure there aren't full armored columns heading out to take over?
 
sccutler
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Tue May 12, 2015 4:59 pm

Quoting johns624 (Reply 82):

Do they constantly monitor Ft Hood and Ft Bliss to make sure there aren't full armored columns heading out to take over?

Not likely.

Are they monitoring Jade Helm "...to make sure there aren't full armored columns heading out to take over"?

Does anyone who is having kittens here have the remotest clue what is happening?
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
 
rfields5421
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Tue May 12, 2015 8:48 pm

I gave you a reasonable answer on what the State Guard is doing.

But Abbott really doesn't care if the State Guard does anything or not. All he cares about is that he has received priceless publicity for his 'courageous stand' against a covert military takeover. And has likely stopped an Obama sponsored takeover of Texas citizens weapons. I've probably gotten over 200 e-mails from friends with those sentiments, and seen many more FB posts from across the country. (Just because someone is a right wing nut-case doesn't mean he can't be a friend, or relative. (I can and have dropped friends, but relatives...)

Abbott is the worst kind of politician who has no principles or values - only what ever will make his radical supporters happy.

That is an OPINION based on several years of closely following Abbott's actions in office and his public statements.

If you can't see that, I hope the Kool-Aid taste good.
Not all who wander are lost.
 
bhill
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Tue May 12, 2015 9:53 pm

Quoting johns624 (Reply 82):
Does anyone who is having kittens here have the remotest clue what is happening?

Yeah...being part of a UNION is a bitch.......really, he should start working on his Federal reps to amend the Constitution to allow states to leave the Union....otherwise he is just a'Palin....
Carpe Pices
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Tue May 12, 2015 10:25 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 81):
Best I can tell, the Governor said, in essence, "we'll monitor the training exercise..." - and that's all. And that is simply nothing about which to get all panty-wadding crazy.

Oh. Well doing anything short of laugh at it/ignoring it is more than he should have done IMO. Nothing to go nuts about but I see it very silly and obvious pandering to a very fringe group. In other words, he doesn't have to do very much to look extremely silly
 
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johnboy
Posts: 3099
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 1999 9:09 pm

RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Wed May 13, 2015 6:59 am

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 65):
Texas hasn't published any numbers, and my sources in the state say less than 30 people have been put on duty status so far.

I'm sure every pissant titty bar on the outskirts of that area is bringing in more girls to get some of that Texas state money as we speak.
 
johns624
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Wed May 13, 2015 12:41 pm

Quoting bhill (Reply 85):
Yeah...being part of a UNION is a bitch.......really, he should start working on his Federal reps to amend the Constitution to allow states to leave the Union....otherwise he is just a'Palin....

Not my quote.
 
sccutler
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Wed May 13, 2015 4:00 pm

So, in essence, the message is this: because the perceived issue is one which you (the collective "you," not any particular individual) characterize as ridiculous (and let us assume for the sake of discussion that it is), elected officials should, in all circumstances, disregard any of their constituents who express concern about it. Gotcha.

The interesting thing, though, is that not everyone agrees on every issue (if you've ever been politically active on a nuts-and-bolts level, you might realize that no one agrees on any issue, but that's another conversation). And recent polling data suggests that nearly half of Americans, nationwide, have concerns along the same lines as those very gently addressed in Gov. Abbott's letter.

So, do we now favor an approach to governance in which elected representatives simply disregard the concerns and issues of importance as expressed by a meaningful proportion of their constituents if they deem those concerns to be unimportant?

It is a serious question.

Look, I get it; those of you who are politically divergent from Governor Abbott are going to mock him, without regard to the substance of what he has done. That is, of course, your right (it is the obligation of a free people to always question, test, challenge the actions of their elected representatives), but no one (yet) has articulated anything the governor is actually done which is out of line. He wrote an innocuous letter that spent more ink lauding the military than challenging it -actually, if you read the letter, the Gov did not even challenge the military at all. If that doesn't fit in with your narrative, choose to ignore it, but do so from a position of honest self-evaluation.
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
 
bennett123
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Wed May 13, 2015 8:10 pm

The danger comes if the Gov SEEMS to endorse these views. Last thing needed is to encourage the "Rambo" Club.

Does the US Army have any track record of staging coups at home.

I can think of several Armies, who have much more experience in this sort of thing.

IIRC, doing the Cold War, during military exersizes, areas were routinely designated as "Blue Land" and "Orange Land".
 
sccutler
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Wed May 13, 2015 8:20 pm

Quoting bennett123 (Reply 90):

The danger comes if the Gov SEEMS to endorse these views. Last thing needed is to encourage the "Rambo" Club.

Yep. That's politics, ain't it?
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Wed May 13, 2015 10:28 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 89):
So, in essence, the message is this: because the perceived issue is one which you (the collective "you," not any particular individual) characterize as ridiculous (and let us assume for the sake of discussion that it is), elected officials should, in all circumstances, disregard any of their constituents who express concern about it. Gotcha.

Yes, I think there are plenty of instances where you can absolutely ignore the fringe elements

Quoting sccutler (Reply 89):
those of you who are politically divergent from Governor Abbott are going to mock him

Often ends up the case, I try my best to be an equal opportunity criticizer. I absolutely don't think Abbott was looking out for his constituents, I believe it was completely political.

Now I'm not saying this is the most absurd thing ever or he should get kicked out of office. If I lived in TX, I wouldn't even consider something as petty as this grounds for voting against him. I just think he would be fine ignoring the Alex Jones type conspiracy nuts and doesn't need to take a political stab at Obama at every opportunity

I totally get your point and I'd agree if it wasn't so outrageous and so political. Just my opinion? I suppose it is. I'm free to have an opinion that another opinion is fringe. I generally give opposing views the light of day (such as Russia when they're almost certainly wrong/corrupt/trolling) but I have a threshold and have no problem with outright rejecting someone's views if they're way fringe. Maybe he's addressing a different group of people, but from what I've seen, they're off the charts nuts by some of the things they're saying
 
rfields5421
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Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:45 am

RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Wed May 13, 2015 10:33 pm

Quoting sccutler (Reply 89):
elected officials should, in all circumstances, disregard any of their constituents who express concern about it.

So the other six state governors are 'ignoring' their constituents?

Abbot's sole reason for doing this was to get publicity - favorable for his political base - who do question the military and define it as a threat to freedom in this country.

Abbot's action gives support for those folks/ theories.

Rick Petty dealt with the same exercises in the past with mild interest, and not spending any extra state money.

Greg Abbot isn't a stupid person. It's a shame that after the longest governorship in Texas history - a very mediocre leader, we get someone 'worse'.
Not all who wander are lost.
 
luckyone
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Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:50 pm

RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Thu May 14, 2015 12:27 am

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 86):
Oh. Well doing anything short of laugh at it/ignoring it is more than he should have done IMO. Nothing to go nuts about but I see it very silly and obvious pandering to a very fringe group. In other words, he doesn't have to do very much to look extremely silly
Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 92):
I absolutely don't think Abbott was looking out for his constituents, I believe it was completely political.

Which just goes to show you how much of a goon squad the GOP is at the moment and how absurdly desperate they are to blame anything on Obama.
 
LMP737
Posts: 6032
Joined: Wed May 08, 2002 4:06 pm

RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Fri May 15, 2015 10:12 pm

Looks like conspiracy monger/charlatan Alex Jones is one of the people beating on this particular drum.

http://www.salon.com/2015/05/15/alex..._his_paranoid_worldview_seriously/
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
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einsteinboricua
Posts: 8364
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:11 pm

RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Fri May 15, 2015 10:31 pm

Quoting bhill (Reply 85):
he should start working on his Federal reps to amend the Constitution to allow states to leave the Union

You're forgetting that to amend the constitution, yes you need 3/4 of each chamber to approve of the amendment but also 3/5 of states to ratify.

Quoting sccutler (Reply 81):
"we'll monitor the training exercise..." - and that's all. And that is simply nothing about which to get all panty-wadding crazy.
Quoting sccutler (Reply 89):
but no one (yet) has articulated anything the governor is actually done which is out of line.

He hasn't done anything out of line. What we're criticizing is that he gave legitimacy to right-wing conspiracies by "monitoring". Some would say that he's seeking to appease his constituents. Well, I'll bet the majority of his constituents don't expect the military to take over Texas and impose martial law like some people claim.

As governor I would have said "I am not aware of any plans from the military to take over Texas and I can assure you Texas is firmly under our control." Then I'd seek help from the federal state representatives and senators to assure their constituents about that. A sane answer that seeks to pacify the loons without giving credibility to their claims.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
LMP737
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Joined: Wed May 08, 2002 4:06 pm

RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sat May 16, 2015 1:00 am

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 96):
A sane answer that seeks to pacify the loons without giving credibility to their claims.

The problem with loons like this is that it does not matter what you say or what your facts are. In the end they will not believe you anyway.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
AviRaider
Posts: 178
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2007 10:07 pm

RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sat May 16, 2015 4:19 am

Speaking as a born and raised Texan and religious and mostly conservative in value, I really do find Abbott's position on this puzzling. Texas is likely the most patriotic state in the nation; where the military is held in high esteem. So for the state government (Abbott) giving into a crackpot conspiracy theory is baffling. I don't really know anyone here that is taking this seriously. My guess, this is just Abbott's way of making his mark as a tough Governor, despite being wheel chair bound, and want's to appear strong on state's rights.

[Edited 2015-05-15 21:19:47]
 
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einsteinboricua
Posts: 8364
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:11 pm

RE: Texas Has Officially Gone Off The Deep End

Sat May 16, 2015 12:43 pm

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 97):
Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 96):
A sane answer that seeks to pacify the loons without giving credibility to their claims.

The problem with loons like this is that it does not matter what you say or what your facts are. In the end they will not believe you anyway.

The fact that there would be an R next to me name is credibility enough. Remember: a D after the name is bad (it represents liberal, socialist, communist, Sharia) while an R is good (conservative, patriot, Christian, free market).

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 96):
You're forgetting that to amend the constitution, yes you need 3/4 2/3 of each chamber to approve of the amendment but also 3/5 3/4 of states to ratify.

Corrected myself...mixed the numbers.

You need 2/3 of each of the chambers of Congress and 3/4 of states to ratify.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."

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