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DDR
Posts: 1738
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 11:09 pm

RE: Russia In Syria

Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:34 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 137):

It must be the end of the world because I am in total agreement with KiwiRob.

In my personal opinion, the U.S. has done enough damage in the region, although I believe it was not intentional. We should give the Russians a chance and see how they do.
 
wingman
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RE: Russia In Syria

Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:46 pm

Quoting DDR (Reply 150):
In my personal opinion, the U.S. has done enough damage in the region, although I believe it was not intentional. We should give the Russians a chance and see how they do.

Sounds nuts but I agree. Lessons I've learned from the ME:

Iran: theocratic regime in place with total control over government and country - stable

Iraq: Autocratic despot presiding over stable country (you know..in relative terms) removed by US - situation totally FUBAR

Saudi: some kind of combo of the above in place with full support of US in complete contradiction of whatever socio-economic nonsense we pretend to espouse for this region - stable

Libya: Iraq Part II: The History of American FUBAR cont'd

Syria: Russia says keep the nutjob that's already there..there. US says let's try Iraq and Libya again.

I'll go with the Russkies on this one just because our track record is such a sloppy mess. If the GOP takes the White House we'll be back for another 10 year $2T FUBAR party so might as well give someone else a crack in the meantime.
 
DDR
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RE: Russia In Syria

Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:54 pm

Wingman, welcome to my respected users list!
 
tu204
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:21 am

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 147):
The selfproclaimed president for life, justwhat your Putin is aspiring to, or maybe the title of Czar of all Russians.

Totally missed my point.

That was that places like France, Canada and the US whine about respect of other's borders and sovreignty and in Syria they just spit all over it. The irony.
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 6:38 am

Quoting tu204 (Reply 153):
Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 147):
The selfproclaimed president for life, justwhat your Putin is aspiring to, or maybe the title of Czar of all Russians.

Totally missed my point.

That was that places like France, Canada and the US whine about respect of other's borders and sovreignty and in Syria they just spit all over it. The irony.

Stop looking for excuses for your government's Donbass and Crimea adventure.

Jan
 
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pvjin
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 8:05 am

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 154):
Stop looking for excuses for your government's Donbass and Crimea adventure.

Most Crimeans like being part of Russia. I think people of any given area should be able to decide their ruler and what country they want to belong to. Not so sure about Donbass, but a significant amount of people there seem to support Russia too.
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 8:15 am

Quoting pvjin (Reply 155):
Most Crimeans like being part of Russia. I think people of any given area should be able to decide their ruler and what country they want to belong to. Not so sure about Donbass, but a significant amount of people there seem to support Russia too.

I read that Ukraine has more than a million internal refugees, mainly people from the Donbass and Crimea, who want the places to stay Ukrainian, but got driven out by the militias / Russians. I think this number would make quite a difference in a referendum, if they were allowed to vote. The referendum in Crimea was openly rigged, with no alternative option, only "Join Russia now" or "Join Russia later" and the opposition silenced. Plus a large number of the existing Russian population of Crimea have not originated there, but moved there as part of the Soviet / Russian military. The Crimean Tartars, who came back in the 1990s were mostly driven out again.

Jan
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:54 am

Quoting Acheron (Reply 145):
The funny thing about Russia hitting towns without ISIS presence, is that a week ago, there was...

Well no... this is not true!

RT
8 ISIS targets hit during 20 combat flights in Syria – Russian military

Russia has struck eight Islamic State (ISIS/ISIL) targets in Syria, the country’s Defense Ministry said, adding that "civilian infrastructure" was avoided during the operations.

“Today, Russian aerospace force jets delivered pinpoint strikes on eight ISIS terror group targets in Syria. In total, 20 flights were made,” spokesperson for the Russian Defense Ministry, Igor Konashenkov, said.

“As a result, arms and fuel depots and military equipment were hit. ISIS coordination centers in the mountains were totally destroyed,” he added.

--50%
read more here:
http://www.rt.com/news/317101-russia-isis-strikes-intelligence/


                             
 
tu204
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 10:44 am

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 154):
Stop looking for excuses for your government's Donbass and Crimea adventure.

I'm not making excuses. In my opinion my government acted correctly in that situation.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 156):
I read that Ukraine has more than a million internal refugees

And there are that many if not more Ukranian refugees inside Russia.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 156):
Plus a large number of the existing Russian population of Crimea have not originated there, but moved there as part of the Soviet / Russian military.

I'll tell you in on a little secret here, Crimea didn't "orginiate" in Ukraine and "moved" there due to the Soviet leadership's decisions.   

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 156):
The Crimean Tartars, who came back in the 1990s were mostly driven out again.

What?  
 
agill
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:19 am

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 157):
read more here:
http://www.rt.com/news/317101-russia...ence/

Judging by the videos the don't seem to be hitting anything.
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:10 pm

Quoting Agill (Reply 159):
Judging by the videos the don't seem to be hitting anything.

I am only taking this as your own judgement - unless you have you own Intel sources - in this case you are most welcome to name them.

 

ISIS HQ, command point, ammo depot destroyed in Russian military Syria night op

The footage shot by drones shows Russian airstrikes on ISIS infrastructure near Idlib and al-Latamna.

The bombing of the IS ammunition depot to the southwest of Idlib was carried out after confirmation from several intelligence channels, including air reconnaissance. The footage clearly shows a large area of impact, created partly by weapons catching fire after the strike.

read more here + picitures/videos

http://www.rt.com/news/317180-footage-russian-military-strike-isis/

                                
 
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moo
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:22 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 160):
The footage shot by drones shows Russian airstrikes on ISIS infrastructure near Idlib and al-Latamna.

That will explain the weapon impacting off the on-screen cross hairs, which is probably what Agill was referring to...
 
Acheron
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 1:54 pm

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 154):
Stop looking for excuses for your government's Donbass and Crimea adventure.

So, when are we going to impose sanctions on Israel for the unlawful annexation of the Golan Heights in 1981?


Anyway, apparently the russians were going for undeground depots as this video claims the room collapsed after the bombings

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeRvzWwOfuc
 
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Kiwirob
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 2:43 pm

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 156):
I read that Ukraine has more than a million internal refugees

Don't believe everything scopio writes, he's full of missinformation.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 156):
mainly people from the Donbass and Crimea

from what I've been told less than 20,000 mostly Tartar's have left Crimea from Ukraine, everyone else (mostly ethnic Russians) stayed, they got what they've been wanting since 1991. On this same vein would you have denied theScots independance or the Catalians and now from watching the news today the South Tyrol region of Italy want reunification wtih Austria and Venice wants independance and to leave Italy.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 156):
The Crimean Tartars, who came back in the 1990s were mostly driven out again.

Really I still know a few Tartars who are happily living there.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 156):
The referendum in Crimea was openly rigged, with no alternative option, only "Join Russia now" or "Join Russia later" and the opposition silenced.

This is the third referendum on the topic, the other two went the same way, vast majority supported removing themselves from the clutches of the inept Ukranian govt. How hard is it to get this through to you, you defend people rights and all that but turn a blind eye to Crimeans rights to be free of Ukraine.
 
dfwjim1
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 3:28 pm

Is Russia paying the total expense of their being in Syria or is the Syrian government covering all of part of the expense?
 
tu204
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RE: Russia In Syria

Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:58 pm

Quoting dfwjim1 (Reply 164):

Is Russia paying the total expense of their being in Syria or is the Syrian government covering all of part of the expense?

Of course Russia is paying for everything.

But the way it works afterwards, and not just for Russia but for the U.S. too is:
"So now you see how effective x and y systems are. You are more than welcome to place an order for them. By the way, we did just save your arses."
 
DLFREEBIRD
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 3:26 am

i don't mean to sound stupid, but it's hard to keep up.

how far back have we been messing with Syria? 13 years? and when exactly did we decided that Bashar should be replaced?

just curious why all of a sudden people are blaming Obama Adm. I would like someone, who honest and not trying to make excuses for the Dems or Repub. Just explain it without leaning left or right. In other words. Just the facts.

thank you in advance.
 
solarflyer22
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 4:39 am

Quoting dfwjim1 (Thread starter):
I have been reading about Russia's buildup of military forces in Syria over the past 2 to 3 weeks and I am curious as to what other members of this board think the outcome of this buildup will be. Will Russia participate in action against ISIS? Could a Russian presence in Syria lead to conflicts with U.S., European forces and possibly even Israel?

I definitely think they'll hit ISIS so they can say its anti "terrorism" operation but the reality is they want to keep their port in Tartus - and they're willing to fight to keep it. You need a southern warm water port to protect traffic in and out of Crimea.

Quoting DLFREEBIRD (Reply 166):

how far back have we been messing with Syria? 13 years? and when exactly did we decided that Bashar should be replaced?

Syria is not even a country. Al Shams (arabic) means the Sun. The "Levant" comes from Italian and just means where the Sun is rising. Syria comes from Assiryian(s) in antiquity which was a tribe.

They West just drew some lines on a map around some tribes and named it something. Surprise, surprise...it doesn't work too well. Everything West of Iran's western flank to Libya is basically MadMax territory.

Its essentially the same thing in Israel too, just based on religion instead of a tribe. These aren't real nation states, its all one big charade.
 
coolian2
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 5:36 am

Not content with Russia attacking the wrong targets, it seems a US operation has attacked Doctors Without Borders.
 
diverted
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 10:28 am

Quoting coolian2 (Reply 168):
Not content with Russia attacking the wrong targets, it seems a US operation has attacked Doctors Without Borders.

It wouldn't be the first time.
See--Iran Air, Chinese Embassy, etc.

Quite honestly, let the Russians have at it in Syria. They seem to be the only ones who have a plan. Do I care that they want Assad to remain in power? Of course not. We wouldn't have to deal with the whole ISIS issue had Dubya Dick and Donald not decided to go play in the sandbox. What would toppling Assad accomplish? Where would it leave Syria in a year? Probably the same as Libya currently.

If the Russian are the only ones who won't pussyfoot around the issue then let em have at it. I can't say I agree with a lot of Putin politics, but I'll let 'em have ethis one.
 
DLFREEBIRD
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 11:09 am

Quoting coolian2 (Reply 168):
Everything West of Iran's western flank to Libya is basically MadMax territory.

it's kind of hard to swallow that our so called " intelligence agency" didn't catch onto this in the 13 years we've been there.
 
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pvjin
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 11:22 am

Quoting DLFREEBIRD (Reply 170):

I'm constantly wondering whether western policymakers are idiots, bribed by weapons manufacturers or both? Only ones benefiting from these absolutely failed policies in Middle East are organizations like ISIS, refugee businesses and weapons manufacturers.

Perhaps our politicians should try googling for the definition of insanity, the famous quote often attributed to Albert Einstein?

[Edited 2015-10-03 04:27:59]
 
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Aaron747
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 3:54 pm

Quoting pvjin (Reply 171):
Perhaps our politicians should try googling for the definition of insanity, the famous quote often attributed to Albert Einstein?

That would imply the ability to employ reason and logic. You're already onto the wrong group of people for that!
 
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SOBHI51
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 5:40 pm

Quoting pvjin (Reply 144):
by helping Assad to get rid of the religious nutjobs

Go back to the start, there were people looking for freedom from a tyrant, it was a peaceful movement, no religion involved, but of course you have your agenda and you stick with it. Why is it not acceptable to you for Syrians to have a democracy or is it only for some countries?

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 147):
I knew some Syrians refugees years ago who neither liked Assad nor the Islamists.

This is the sentiments of the majority of Syrians.

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 157):
spokesperson for the Russian Defense Ministry, Igor Konashenkov, said.

And we should believe that because?

Quoting Acheron (Reply 162):
Anyway, apparently the russians were going for undeground depots as this video claims the room collapsed after the bombings

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeRvzWwOfuc

It seems it's a missile wich went down over 2 meters but did not explode.
 
DDR
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:49 pm

Quoting diverted (Reply 169):

I think the fear is that the Russians aren't going after ISIS but are going after anti Assad forces. This of course escalates tensions between Russia and the United States. We all will suffer if the U.S. And Russia go to war. Everyone of us.

Yes the Middle East is a mess because of George Bush. But, there is a different leader in charge now. I honestly think he is doing his best to get the U.S. out of the region.

Rehashing what former incompetent U.S. Officials did or did not do, does not help us at this point.
 
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pvjin
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:00 pm

Quoting DDR (Reply 174):
I think the fear is that the Russians aren't going after ISIS but are going after anti Assad forces. This of course escalates tensions between Russia and the United States. We all will suffer if the U.S. And Russia go to war. Everyone of us.

The west should simply do what Russia is doing and give Assad a lot of weapons so he can go kick all terrorists/rebels out of Syria. It's the only way to peace, assuming letting Syria fall under rule of ISIS isn't an option.

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 173):
Go back to the start, there were people looking for freedom from a tyrant, it was a peaceful movement, no religion involved, but of course you have your agenda and you stick with it. Why is it not acceptable to you for Syrians to have a democracy or is it only for some countries?

Those people may have very well been religious extremists who simply used "democracy" as an excuse to get rid of Assad so they could turn Syria into an Islamic state. Look at Libya, they got rid of Gaddafi, and what they have now? A civil war between different factions, including Islamic terrorists. Why on earth should I think anything different would have happened in Syria if Assad had stepped aside?

The truth is that in countries like Syria, Iraq and such democracy equals chaos, they are too religiously and ethnically divided to function as soft democratic states with a lot of freedoms. The Sunni vs Shia / Iran vs KSA tension further escalates the situation when your country supports Salafist terrorists and Iran supports Assad.
 
Acheron
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:30 pm

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 173):
Go back to the start, there were people looking for freedom from a tyrant, it was a peaceful movement, no religion involved, but of course you have your agenda and you stick with it. Why is it not acceptable to you for Syrians to have a democracy or is it only for some countries?

It might have been at some point, but thats what you get when your adoptive country, Turkey and other Gulf States like to pretend they can play like the big boys, but it takes more than big wallet to play geopolitics and you lot suck a it.

These past few days the Gulf States and others were reminded that they are barely a regional "power" at most but largely irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.
 
diverted
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:39 pm

Quoting DDR (Reply 174):
I think the fear is that the Russians aren't going after ISIS but are going after anti Assad forces. This of course escalates tensions between Russia and the United States. We all will suffer if the U.S. And Russia go to war. Everyone of us.

Yes the Middle East is a mess because of George Bush. But, there is a different leader in charge now. I honestly think he is doing his best to get the U.S. out of the region.

So then what's the big issue? Let them. Roll out the red carpet for the Russians as we're packing up and heading home. The USA and Russia absolutely do not need to go to war, and I hope they never do. But if Putin is willing to flex his muscles and rubles, let him have at it.

We should have learned the first, second, or third go around, but we don't. If Obama was smart he'd make a publicity stunt out of it; how he's keeping American forces at home and letting Russia waste their resources. Spin it like that and, well, the GOP will still hate him, but who cares?
 
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SOBHI51
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sat Oct 03, 2015 10:37 pm

Quoting pvjin (Reply 175):
Those people may have very well been religious extremists who simply used "democracy" as an excuse to get rid of Assad so they could turn Syria into an Islamic state.

Syria was never known as having extremists, on the contrary, it is a fact that all religions lived in peace with each other, till 2011 there is Jews living in Syria, not sure they are still. No it all started as a peaceful non religious movement by the Syrians against the tyranny of the Assad family.
 
Acheron
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sun Oct 04, 2015 4:52 am

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 178):
No it all started as a peaceful non religious movement by the Syrians against the tyranny of the Assad family.

Until the Gulf States and Turkey felt the need to hijack it and send their paid little rats over there, maybe.

Anyway, more Assad propaganda according to you, probably.

Quote:
I asked if there was anything the West could do to help. "Stop supporting the opposition, stop supporting armed groups in Syria," was a recurring answer.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/flaviu...tm_hp_ref=good-news&ir=Good%20News
 
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SOBHI51
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sun Oct 04, 2015 6:27 am

Quoting Acheron (Reply 179):
e:
I asked if there was anything the West could do to help. "Stop supporting the opposition, stop supporting armed groups in Syria," was a recurring answer.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/flaviu...tm_hp_ref=good-news&ir=Good%20News

Christians have lived in Syria for over 2,000 years -- Jesus walked, preached, and taught on this land according to the Bible -- but the ongoing conflict has been so brutal that I wondered if that history might come to an end.

It proves my point that when all started in 2011 it was a cry for freedom.
Now i share the fears of all minorities in Syria, as even for me as a Muslim, i don't want that country to be ruled by extremists. All those hundred of thousands dead people didn't loose there lives to replace a tyrant with religious nut cases.
 
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pvjin
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RE: Russia In Syria

Sun Oct 04, 2015 7:43 am

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 180):
Now i share the fears of all minorities in Syria, as even for me as a Muslim, i don't want that country to be ruled by extremists. All those hundred of thousands dead people didn't loose there lives to replace a tyrant with religious nut cases.

Well, that scenario is inevitable if the current regime of Assad falls. FSA and such most certainly have no capabilities whatsoever of building a successful and strong enough government as a replacement.
 
tu204
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RE: Russia In Syria

Mon Oct 05, 2015 8:54 am

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 180):
It proves my point that when all started in 2011 it was a cry for freedom.
Now i share the fears of all minorities in Syria, as even for me as a Muslim, i don't want that country to be ruled by extremists. All those hundred of thousands dead people didn't loose there lives to replace a tyrant with religious nut cases.

Thats the thing. Often and especially in that part of the world a tyrant is the better of the few options.

I don't see how democracy want work in places like Syria or Iraq if you take into account that they were artificially created and their territories consist of several different nationalities that do not like each other too much.
It is nieve to try to make democracy work where it won't and in the process destroy a stable system that has worked for decades.

The only thing this will lead to is destruction, internal conflict and death which is perfect breeding grounds for extremism, which then spills over into neighbouring contries or even over to Europe/Americas.

Quoting pvjin (Reply 181):
FSA and such most certainly have no capabilities whatsoever of building a successful and strong enough government as a replacement.

I am not even convinced that there is too much difference between the FSA and the ISIS. Seems to me that ISIS manages to get their hands on quite a lot of the equipment that FSA were given, and quite a few individuals switch allegiances and decide they are better off with ISIS.

So in my opinion, smash them all. Targeting just ISIS has obviously not worked for the last couple years.
 
DLFREEBIRD
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RE: Russia In Syria

Mon Oct 05, 2015 10:56 am

very true. I wonder if Russia knows that.

[Edited 2015-10-05 03:59:32]
 
Acheron
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RE: Russia In Syria

Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:27 pm

Quoting tu204 (Reply 182):
I am not even convinced that there is too much difference between the FSA and the ISIS. Seems to me that ISIS manages to get their hands on quite a lot of the equipment that FSA were given, and quite a few individuals switch allegiances and decide they are better off with ISIS.

It is a joke...

Quote:
US-trained Division 30 rebels 'betray US and hand weapons over to al-Qaeda's affiliate in Syria'
Pentagon-trained rebels are reported to have betrayed US and handed weapons over to Jabhat al-Nusra immediately after entering Syria
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-al-Qaedas-affiliate-in-Syria.html

US foreign policy is run by a bunch of imbeciles.
 
tu204
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RE: Russia In Syria

Mon Oct 05, 2015 5:40 pm

Quoting Acheron (Reply 184):
US foreign policy is run by a bunch of imbeciles.

I was trying to say just that but in a more politically correct way 

Bad as he may be, Bashr Al-Assad is legally the head of the Syrian Arab Republic. Any other individuals inside that country are unlawfull combatants. In my view, this is enough justification right there to shoot them where they stand.

Compare this with a bunch of individuals walking around with AK's in Madrid, London, Paris or Washington DC.

I want all readers to try any understand this one very important fact: The Russian Federation is the only entity that is acting lawfully during the whole process because the Russian Aerospace Forces are the only entity invited to act on Syrian territory by the lawfull and internationally recognized Syrian leadership. Everyone else that is bombing even ISIL on Syrian territory is breaching Syrian airspace. From a legal point of view, anyone tresspassing Syrian airspace without approval can be shot down and have no grounds to whine about it.
 
Scipio
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RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 12:25 am

Quoting tu204 (Reply 146):
Bashar Al-Assad is the legal head of Syria and he asked for Russian assistance.

Hafez al-Assad, Bashar's father, came to power as the result of two coups. That makes the regime illegitimate in Russia's own logic.
 
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SOBHI51
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RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 12:30 am

Quoting tu204 (Reply 185):
invited to act on Syrian territory by the lawfull and internationally recognized Syrian leadership.


Lawful? A rigged election is not the proper way to elect a president. So lawful he is not. A 20 minutes discussion to change the constitution to fit one person is a fraud. So he is not the lawful president.

Quoting tu204 (Reply 185):
The Russian Federation is the only entity that is acting lawfully during the whole process because the Russian Aerospace Forces are the only entity invited to act on Syrian territory by the lawfull and internationally recognized Syrian leadership

Not because they are guaranteed a port in the Med? Not because Putin is dreaming of a new Prussian Empire?

Killing innocent children and women puts Putin in the same league as Bibi
 
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SOBHI51
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RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:01 am

Quoting Acheron (Reply 188):
Prussians are Germans

Stand corrected Russian Empire

As for all your usual very polite comments an Arabic proverb comes to mind : The dogs can bark but the caravan will keep going forward. So keep on insulting.
 
solarflyer22
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RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:08 am

Quoting tu204 (Reply 185):
I want all readers to try any understand this one very important fact: The Russian Federation is the only entity that is acting lawfully during the whole process because the Russian Aerospace Forces are the

Correct. Iran has a mutual defense pact with Syria since the 1980s Iran-Iraq war which is never mentioned in the Western media. Sryia supported Iran in that War while every Arab and Western nation supported Saddam Hussein with billions in arms and even in the face of Sarin gas usage.

Quoting Scipio (Reply 186):
Bashar's father, came to power as the result of two coups. That

Really. A Coup doesn't make a leader legitimate? Funny, I think its the British and Americans that oh I don't know toppled a democratically elected leader in Iran in coup de tat and re-installed the Shah for 26 years.

There is no moral high ground for the West, especially in MENA. Every single thing they accuse their enemies of doing, they themselves have done in even greater numbers.
 
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SOBHI51
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RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:12 am

Quoting Acheron (Reply 188):
I seriously doubt a Monarchy of glorified camel herders has any right to talk about lawful and legitimacy.

I speak on my behalf only, i don't have the honor or the right to speak on behalf of KSA, so respond to my posting and not spread your usual hatred.
Do you think Assad was elected properly?

Quoting Acheron (Reply 188):
If you think this is only about a port in the Mediterranean, you have no clue

They have no other port on the Med, who doesn't have a clue, read your maps, if you know how.

Quoting Acheron (Reply 188):
Congrats

Coming from a citizen of a country with a history of massacres during there long civil war and there relation to Hitler, congrats is accepted.

Pot. Kettle. Black, man go look in the mirror for the obelisk in your eye before looking for a piece of hay in mine.
 
User avatar
SOBHI51
Posts: 3950
Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2003 1:32 pm

RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 4:20 am

Quoting solarflyer22 (Reply 190):
Really. A Coup doesn't make a leader legitimate?

Maybe it does, but rigging the elections, a one man only candidate, changing the constitution in less than 20 minutes after the death of the father and tailor it to fit his son who was not at the legal age to become president, that makes him a non legitimate president.
 
Acheron
Posts: 1852
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2005 1:14 am

RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 5:41 am

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 189):
The dogs can bark but the caravan will keep going forward. So keep on insulting.

I guess that saying is more apt to whenever the Gulf States "bark" at Russia's actions in Syria.

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 191):
I speak on my behalf only, i don't have the honor or the right to speak on behalf of KSA, so respond to my posting and not spread your usual hatred.

Yet you feel the right to speak on behalf of Syrians and what they should do or shouldn't do while you are safely far away, just because you happened to share the nationality of those who did stay.

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 191):
Do you think Assad was elected properly?

I don't care. At this point in time, the Assads are the legitimate rulers of Syria and have been simply based on the fact that they were recognized as such by the rest of the World since Hafez took over.

You just can't change your mind 15 years laters and not expect to be called on your BS.

Just because some backwards Gulf states decided to alter the balance of things and thought they could play the big boys game, with the US' permission, doesn't change that. At the end of the day the Gulf States are still bottom feeders in the game.

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 191):
They have no other port on the Med, who doesn't have a clue, read your maps, if you know how.

Like I said, you have no clue and are completely missing the point if you think this is only about Tartus. Not my fault you can't see beyond your nose.

It's also about keeping your religious fanatics as far away from Russia's territory as possible. At least 2000 Jihadist Chechens are within the ranks of several islamic groups, including those in Saudi Arabia's pay roll. It is in Russia's best interests they don't make it back, for one.

It is about stopping the spread of a really toxic version of islam such as Wahabbism. It is also about keeping the status quo of regional power balance as the KSA and it's allies simply cannot be trusted.

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 191):
Coming from a citizen of a country with a history of massacres during there long civil war and there relation to Hitler, congrats is accepted.

Ah, but unlike you, I'm willing to admit that happened and it was a horrible for the country with people still believing Franco was great( after all, my family had to flee the country for being republicans and anarchists) and pretend nothing happened. The same can't be said about you, who preaches about the "mighty progressive" Saudi Arabia who still beheads people on phony grounds while talking about "democracy" in a country you no longer live in, and haven't for quite some time.
 
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pvjin
Posts: 3586
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 4:52 pm

RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 10:03 am

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 187):
Lawful? A rigged election is not the proper way to elect a president. So lawful he is not. A 20 minutes discussion to change the constitution to fit one person is a fraud. So he is not the lawful president.

Yeah, perhaps Assad should have instead made Syria a kingdom, then he would be the legitimate ruler in your eyes as apparently the Saudi king is too.
 
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Kiwirob
Posts: 13632
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:16 pm

RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 10:35 am

Quoting pvjin (Reply 193):
Yeah, perhaps Assad should have instead made Syria a kingdom, then he would be the legitimate ruler in your eyes as apparently the Saudi king is too.

To my way of thinking there is no difference between a President for Life and a King, especially when said President hands over to power to his children, who then become President for Life. It's happened in Syria, Azerbaijan, looks like it will happen in Kazakhstan and Turkmenistan as well.
 
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SOBHI51
Posts: 3950
Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2003 1:32 pm

RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 11:58 am

Quoting Acheron (Reply 192):
Yet you feel the right to speak on behalf of Syrians and what they should do or shouldn't do while you are safely far away,

I was born Syrian i have a million more time to express my opinion than you do.When i read your postings all i can find is insults on top of each other, wonder what kind of a dialog you can have with a person like you, only a person who have nothing to say use those tactics.

Quoting Acheron (Reply 192):
after all, my family had to flee the country for being republicans and anarchists)

We have one thing in common.

Quoting Acheron (Reply 192):
and haven't for quite some time.

I was there 02/2011.

Quoting Acheron (Reply 192):
in a country you no longer live in

All my family is there and i have a house there.

Quoting pvjin (Reply 193):
Yeah, perhaps Assad should have instead made Syria a kingdom, then he would be the legitimate ruler in your eyes as apparently the Saudi king is too.

A kingdom is run by a king and usually he rules it for life, a republic is ruled by a president who should be elected for one or two and a maximum certain number of years according to the constitution, president for life is not legal, nor accepted, and handing powers to your son makes a joke of whatever democracy that said president is preaching.

Quoting Acheron (Reply 192):
I don't care.

So your opinion doesn't count.

Quoting Acheron (Reply 192):
You just can't change your mind 15 years laters and not expect to be called on your BS.

It's now over 40 years of the Assad regime, whose's talking BS?
 
Acheron
Posts: 1852
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2005 1:14 am

RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 2:53 pm

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 195):
I was born Syrian i have a million more time to express my opinion than you do.

If you didn't have the guts to stay and change things, no you don't. Like I said, it is easy to talk while sitting comfortably in your home.

Kinda like the FSA leadership, who sits comfortably in Turkey while everybody else gets killed.

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 195):
When i read your postings all i can find is insults on top of each other, wonder what kind of a dialog you can have with a person like you, only a person who have nothing to say use those tactics.

I actually find your comments far more insulting, thinking everybody else is stupid and won't see how you whitewash the KSA actions while you complain about Syria or Iran doing the same thing.

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 195):
So your opinion doesn't count.

You can bury your head in the sand if you want, but it is a fact that Assad's family were recognized as the legitimate rulers of Syria a long time a go by the international community, so, at the end of the day, it is your opinion the one that doesn't count.

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 195):
All my family is there and i have a house there.

But you don't live there. At this point you are just a tourist
 
wingman
Posts: 4171
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 4:25 am

RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 3:05 pm

Quoting Acheron (Reply 192):
after all, my family had to flee the country for being republicans and anarchists
Quoting Acheron (Reply 196):
If you didn't have the guts to stay and change things, no you don't.

You'd fit right in at the US State Department I guess.
 
Acheron
Posts: 1852
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2005 1:14 am

RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 3:24 pm

Quoting wingman (Reply 197):
You'd fit right in at the US State Department I guess.

Hardly. That job requires to much shortsightedness, which I don't have.

Thing is, you can have an opinion on the matter but pretending to talk for people on another place you didn't stick around, saying they should do this or do that or whatnot, yeah, that doesn't fly with me.

Like the Cubans exiles who keep arguing about overthrowing the Castros, but they want others to do the bloodletting for them while they sit comfortably in a bar in Miami
 
dfwjim1
Topic Author
Posts: 2590
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2011 8:46 pm

RE: Russia In Syria

Tue Oct 06, 2015 3:53 pm

I was just reading in the Wall Street Journal that Russian jet fighters have been challenging Turkey's air force over the last few days so I am wondering if Turkey would actually shoot down a Russian aircraft if need be or would they attempt to force it down? It seems like with Russia getting involved in Syria the potential for this conflict to become more than a regional conflict have really increased.

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