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MD11Engineer
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RE: Your Favorite And Least Favorite Bond Movies 2015.

Sun Nov 29, 2015 11:25 am

Connery was the Bond actor the author Ian Fleming had in mind. The character, with exagarrations, is actually based on a mix of two real WW2 spies, who worked for the British (one a wealthy German heir of a shipping company, and the other an equally wealthy Serb friend of his, who both used the image of a playboy as a cover for their real work. The German got eventually caught and executed by the Gestapo).
I'll have to search to find the article, where I read this.

Jan
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CXB77L
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RE: Your Favorite And Least Favorite Bond Movies 2015.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 2:45 pm

For me personally:

Best Bond: Sir Sean Connery - best actor to play Bond; Timothy Dalton - most faithful portrayal of literary Bond.

Let me explain: I think Connery is the best actor to have played Bond. I don't think any of the other actors to have played Bond come close to Connery's acting talent, with the exception of Craig. Connery's performance in his first two films were nothing short of magnificent. He 'owned' the character. Connery is Bond.

But Dalton gave the more accurate to the novel portrayal. His was the Bond who was every bit the world-weary professional killer that hated his job and only killed when he had to, and who would drown his nightmares with a few too many stiff drinks. His was the Bond who was very much human rather than superhero, and who had seen death too many times to glamorise it. I think Dalton had the best portrayal of James Bond. He played Bond the way it was meant to be played.

The way I see it, Connery was the best actor to have played Bond; Dalton was the best Bond. But the former statement doesn't do any justice to Dalton's by the book portrayal; neither does the latter do any justice to Connery's superlative early performances which no one has so far got near (52 years later, I still think From Russia With Love is the best Bond film ever made). If I had to rank the actors, Connery would be number 1 and Dalton a close second.

Best Bond Movies:
1. From Russia With Love
2. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
3. Dr No
4. Goldfinger
5. Thunderball

Best Bond Song: Goldfinger by Dame Shirley Bassey

Worst Bond: Sir Roger Moore

Worst Bond Movie: Die Another Day

Worst Bond Song: Die Another Day

Quoting bmacleod (Reply 21):
Roger Moore brought humor into Bond's character, and although I enjoyed it, many Bond fans were turned off by it.

... myself included. I'm very much a 'Fleming purist' when it comes to Bond films. I believe Fleming's novels is the standard by which Bond films are to be judged, and the Fleming way is the only way to play Bond. In my view, every film should seek to interpret the literary Bond as faithfully as possible; the only difference being the time and place that the character's missions take place.

Moore was, in many ways, the polar opposite to Fleming's Bond. Where Fleming's Bond was cold and ruthless, Moore's Bond was a gentleman and a charmer. Where Fleming's Bond was a killer, Moore's Bond was a lover.

Quoting zckls04 (Reply 30):
"women want to bed Bond, men want to be Bond".

I don't think that would apply to Fleming's Bond. Bond's job isn't glamorous. His job is to be "as cool about death as a surgeon. If it happened, it happened. Regret was unprofessional." He smokes and drinks his humanity away, all the while living the high life due to his belief that he won't waste is days trying to prolong them, but rather living life to the full because as a 00, he has a low life expectancy and any day could be his last.

Don't know about you, but I certainly don't want to be him. I think the films has turned up the glamour of Bond's high life without adequately addressing the dangers of his job and its effect on Bond's psyche.

Quoting bmacleod (Reply 33):
I've heard Dalton was seen as too stone-faced and serious to be an effective and appealing Bond...even Daniel Craig smiled more and was more "mellow" than Dalton.

I think the fact that not many people have read the books is part of the reason why not many people warmed to his performances. I don't think it is a reflection of Dalton's performance at all.

Quoting zckls04 (Reply 35):
Dalton IMO was the best Bond, because he actually knew how to act. The Living Daylights wasn't the best of stories admittedly, but was still the best Bond movie in a decade. Licence to Kill was superb.

Problem is he came right after the Roger Moore period, so all people wanted was silly one-liners and gadgets. Dalton's character was a lot closer to the books.

  

Quoting zckls04 (Reply 35):
Meanwhile, if there were a black Bond

This is where I disagree. If I have anything to say about this at all, there won't ever be a black Bond, because that's not the character that Fleming wrote.

Quoting zckls04 (Reply 35):
I'd rather have the actor that's best for the series, whoever that may be.

Not anybody can play James Bond. The actor must not only be able to act the part, he must also look the part. Fleming has given his description of James Bond's appearance in his novels - about six feet tall, slim build, black hair side-parted but falling down to a comma above his right eyebrow, blue-grey eyes, scar down his right cheek, has a 'cruel' look about his mouth. Sure, none of the actors to have portrayed Bond have looked exactly as described, but they mostly fit the bill on one way or another. Dalton, in my view, was the closest.

Quoting zckls04 (Reply 41):
Is race really one of those basic elements though? I don't feel like Bond's whiteness is a particularly important part of what makes him Bond.

Yes, it is. Bond is white, and although not expressly stated in Fleming's novels, his mannerisms clearly indicate that.

Whether fictional or not, Bond has an established background which includes him being white. One question I've always struggled with is why there is a push to make Bond black. Why Bond? Why not introduce a new character to the franchise who does the same job as Bond in the MI6 and is Bond's ally? Or even create a whole new franchise based on a main character whose job is an MI6 assassin?

Quoting kevin (Reply 49):
Michael Fassbender would make a great Bond.

I think Fassbender is a bit too old now. Assuming Craig comes back for one more in 2018, the next Bond won't make his debut until 2021. In that case, I'd like to see Henry Cavill or Nicholas Hoult as James Bond.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 50):
Connery was the Bond actor the author Ian Fleming had in mind.

Actually, no. Connery wasn't Fleming's first choice. Fleming wanted David Niven or Cary Grant. I believe they were considered (and quite possibly offered) the role before Connery was. The producers were the ones that wanted Connery.

[Edited 2015-11-30 06:49:56]
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Polot
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RE: Your Favorite And Least Favorite Bond Movies 2015.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 4:26 pm

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 51):
Actually, no. Connery wasn't Fleming's first choice. Fleming wanted David Niven or Cary Grant. I believe they were considered (and quite possibly offered) the role before Connery was. The producers were the ones that wanted Connery.

Connery wasn't even the producers first choice. Other actors considered either didn't have the right "look", couldn't commit to multiple films, or turned them down.

That said when it comes to the casting of Bond it really comes down to the strength of his movie(s). Remember the outcry when Daniel Craig was announced as the next Bond (a short blond guy as Bond!)? Then Casino Royale turned out to be fantastic, as did Skyfall, and despite Quantum of Solace being mediocre at best now Craig is often considered one of the better Bonds.
 
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RE: Your Favorite And Least Favorite Bond Movies 2015.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 5:24 pm

Quoting bmacleod (Reply 21):
Best to worst Bonds:

1. Sean Connery
2. Daniel Craig
3. Pierce Brosnan
4. Roger Moore
5. Timothy Dalton
6 (Worst) George Lazenby.

Not singling you out, but Dalton is rather underrated IMHO, certainly under-appreciated as Bond.

Let's face it--NO Bond movie is going to have an award winning acting performance. They're either action movies or campy (by design) but Dalton played an understated Bond.

Quoting Polot (Reply 32):
I don't think Dalton was a bad Bond, he was just given weak stories as it was an era where the Soviet Union was waning and there was a cultural desire for stronger female characters and the writers just didn't know how to approach that. He reminds me a lot of Craig's bond, but Daniel Craig was given much better material.

I still think License to Kill is underrated, although The Living Daylight's story suffers some from subsequent historical events that obviously the writers couldn't have predicted (the Afghani rebels basically evolving into the Taliban).

Really good observation here--timing is everything with the Bond franchise.

Craig came along and they gave Bond a dark edge, to match the times--plus think of this obsession with "dark" dramas and such these days. The Christian Bale Batman reboot comes immediately to mind vs the campiness of Keaton. Similarly, Bond has tracked on the cultural pulse.

Dalton's Bond was woefully underwritten, but License to Kill isn't a bad movie unto itself. I agree with you here.
 
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flyingturtle
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RE: Your Favorite And Least Favorite Bond Movies 2015.

Tue Dec 01, 2015 2:11 am

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 50):

Patrick Dalzel-Job was one of them.  


David
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flyingturtle
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RE: Your Favorite And Least Favorite Bond Movies 2015.

Sun Dec 13, 2015 10:38 am

Hi, I have plotted your film and actor preferences.  

http://i63.tinypic.com/34pmdnc.png for the films,


http://i64.tinypic.com/2wexqgo.png for the actors.

I did this with principal component analysis (PCA). Basically speaking, PCA does a correlation analysis, and invents XY coordinates to put the data points on a map. In these pictures, when arrows A and B point in the same direction, then the data in variables A and B correlate highly positively with each other. When A and B point in the opposite direction, they also highly correlate with each other - but in a negative way. Are they perpendicular, then they have no correlation at all.

And then, a map is made... it neatly says that the movie preferences of Surfpunk and Pyolet do not agree, while Slider agrees with Surfpunk. And the other diagram says that Craig, Moore and Connery have nothing in common, they each appeal to a different group of Bond movie fans, while there was not enough data on Dalton, Lazenby and Brosnan.


David
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zippyjet
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RE: Your Favorite And Least Favorite Bond Movies 2015.

Thu Dec 17, 2015 12:58 am

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 51):
Quoting bmacleod (Reply 21):

You say you are familiar with the original Fleming novels. Please tell me Live and Let Die was not the hackneyed dated crap as it's 1973 Cinematic Tour De Farce? When I saw it with my sister in the theatre in '73 it was OK. But instead of growing on me it just gets older, dated and trite. Too over the top, bombastic, too corny, like a too long episode of Love American Style. And it not being John Barry for the music also made it my worst Bond movie. But who am I to say. Very few people feel the way I do about being the worst Bond movie. Interstingly enough one year later Man With The Golden Gun is the polar opposite. Only dated items/themes were the Kung Foo stuff and those fugly Rambler/AMC cars.

David Niven or Carey Grant as Bond? Thank the Lord those were just bad pipe dreams. It was bad enough with David Niven as old Fart 007 in the second Casino Royale. A bad dated farce circa 1967 featuring the music of Burt Bacharach. Need I say more? No offense to the late Niven but I always associated him with the prissy mincing ham actors from Broadway and musical movies. Sort of light in the loafers (no offense) Carey Grant? That horrible New York City Snob mixed with British? He was so 50's. Part of the Gerbil Pack: Grant, Hudson, Niven. And who can forget that Flinstone's episode featuring "Cary Granite?"

Did you catch it? Second Casino Royale. A great trivia question? The first was a CBS golden age of TV early 1950's B/W TV show. Bond was American with a Chicago accent and they called him Jimmy. Interesting 50's TV moldy oldie adaption of the super spy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casino_Royale_(Climax!)

Regarding the PC stuff: remaking Bond ethnically. Normally, I don't care but, Fleming wrote his novels post WW II (1950's) If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Now, I llike what they've done with Moneypenny. From elderly dowager with tortoiseshell glasses to the hot Black chick with the killer legs is a major improvement and positive tweak. Also Felix Leiter has been almost everything except Transgender. The current gadget guy is a bit young and twerpy. Following Desmond Llewellin is a tough act to follow but, they are not the stars. Not to get on an anti-PC rant but changing Bond's ethnicity would be akin to making Roseanne Barr the next Wonderwoman or, Betty White as Super Girl.
I wouldn't mind seeing a future bond movie where the main villian is a devious hot chick. Or at least have Amazonian hottie actresses Adrianne Curry or Maitland Ward play a scantily clad torture mistress showing plenty of leg while administering to Mr. Bond. http://www.sitiosargentina.com.ar/imagenes-2010/adrianne-curry-12.jpg Mr. Bond, I'm going to inject you with embalming fluid while riding you...

Mr. Bond, my toes have a lethal cheese. Your last meal 007!
I'm Zippyjet & I approve this message!

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