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Airstud
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Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 11:17 am

In the past week, I've had these periodic shooting, crushing, squeezing, aching type pains in my chest - all of them on the left side, which of course is scary. So I did what unmarried men are believed incapable of doing and I called to schedule myself a doctor's appointment (at one point the pains were so frequent & scary that I kinda wanted to go to a Urgent Care Center but the pains kinda subsided since then).

After telling the appointment lady what I wanted to see the doc about, she said that she had to have me speak to a nurse about these partic'ler symptoms. Uy. I had already decided, before I called, that each pain was a heart attack but sometimes I decide that I might not be a doctor, so I was hoping the doc would see me and tell me that they weren't heart attacks. So when the appointment lady said I have to speak to a nurse, that meant that they WERE heart attacks, see. However, I was on hold for a couple minutes before the nurse came on the line. Being placed on hold means that they weren't heart attacks.

Nurse Elyse came on the line and said, "I understand you're having chest pains and that they're getting WORSE?"

I told her they're not exactly getting worse, but that they're occurring and that they seem not to have any plans to go away. She asked me a series of questions about other symptoms, all of which I was able to honestly deny having. I have no dizziness, no tingling, no numbness or shortness o' breath or lightheadedness... those are 'symptoms,' apparently, even though they just kinda sound like a good weekend.

No fambly history of heart disease except my dad might take pills to reduce his cholesterol - he might not; you can't really tell with that Champion o' Non-communication.

She asked me about the pains' severity on a scale of 1 to 10 with 1 being the least and 10 being the pain I get when I see the grammar they try to get away with on cbsnews.com; and I told her it wasn't easy to answer because my imagimanation runs away with me. I decide, upon each occurrence of the pain, that it's a heart attack, however a small part of me knows that a heart attack is a horrible thing and I therefore choose NOT to be having one, and if it really WERE a heart attack the pain would be beyond 10 on a scale of 10, wouldn't it?

I didn't like her response of "not necessarily." The kind of family I grew up in, when my sister got a bad headache she would earnestly believe that she had a brain tumor and would then actually require hospital treatment for the anxiety attack she had thus helped herself to. So when I quip that I'm having like eleven heart attacks, but I then have to answer a nurse or doctor's question seriously, I expect for them to rule out "heart attack" as an actual possibility, and not just as "not likely" but rather as "hilarious."

Regarding my recent experiences evincing a heart attack, she wouldn't rule it out. At all.

(She didn't say that's what they ARE, just... not yet ruled out.    For now, the whole "ruled out as hilariously not the case" is not where we're at. )

I had a lipid panel done last October as part of a routine physical and the results all came back "normal," including cholesterol. You can't have normal cholesterol in October and then have a heart attack in February, right? Certainly not when your diet is free of red meats and contains mostly poultry, fish, fruits and vegetables!!!

The nurse is OK with me seeing the doctor on Tuesday, the earliest available appointment; unless my symptoms get worse, in which case ER, etc.

Chest pains on the left side are a heart attack; however, the fact that I have a healthy diet, am not more than 15℔ overweight, had healthy blood work results just last October, have no fambly history of heart disease and have none of the other symptoms she asked about means NOT a heart attack.



And then it occurred to me that the nurse's name was "Elyse" and that "ELYYYYSSE!!!!!" is what Mr. Keaton shouted in the final-season episode of Family Ties as he was collapsing on the living room floor from... a heart attack.

I'm screwed.
Pancakes are delicious.
 
diverted
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 12:11 pm

I've had something similar since I was probably 10 years old. (Precordial Catch Syndrome) Every now and then I'll get shooting pains, like you describe, left side of the chest. I used to do the same, and drive myself crazy thinking my heart was about to stop. Went and spoke to the doctor and had an instance right then and there. The only way I've found to deal with it is to exhale completely, and take a very deep breath. Sometimes it takes a couple tries, but inevitably I'll hear/feel a "pop" similar to a balloon popping and instant cessation of pain. Only downside to this method is the pain gets substantially worse before vanishing completely.


I also find that laying in awkward positions exacerbates it too.

Sometimes it happens to me 15 times in a week, and sometimes not for months.

It's more common for it to start in children and adolescents, but it's not unheard of in adults.

Hopefully one of the resident medical experts that frequent this forum can expand on it a bit. My Dr. said it was no cause for concern, and in the 15+ years I've dealt with it, its never been more than a minor inconvenience.

If you wanna do some further reading on it,

http://www.precordialcatchsyndrome.o...nd-treatments-for-precordial-pain/

http://syndromespedia.com/precordial...ome-treatment-symptoms-causes.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precordial_catch_syndrome
 
wingman
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 4:45 pm

I had an episode like this many years ago and actually went to doctors twice. The one time in Tokyo I even got a full EKG work up. Bottom line both docs told me that if you can replicate the pain by touch it isn't a heart attack. So that's always my first move..trying to pinpoint the pain source by touch and applying pressure. Happily I have always been able to replicate the pain. If you work out and do upper body exercises you're definitely liable to incur some kind of strain on muscle, tendons, or ligaments in the chest area. This might be the cause, and at least check that out first before you panic.

The other keys are type of pain (squeezing, sweats, pain down arms, and difficulty breathing). If you get any of those when the pain hit call 911 brother. A call center nurse ain't gonna save you.
 
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seb146
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 5:33 pm

Coming from a family with heart issues, I would agree with Wingman. Could it be your shoulder? Maybe you broke your collar bone? Or, maybe you pulled and strained your left pectorals. You should be concerned with your heart, but it could be any number of things. Just say calm so you don't expand the problem, if it is your heart.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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Moose135
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 5:35 pm

Quoting wingman (Reply 2):
Bottom line both docs told me that if you can replicate the pain by touch it isn't a heart attack. So that's always my first move..trying to pinpoint the pain source by touch and applying pressure.

I've had the same conversation with a couple of doctors. First time, my doctor poked me and asked "Does that hurt?" When I say yes, he said "It's not your heart." Several years later, my new doctor (I'd moved between occurrences) did the same, but gave me the explanation behind it.
KC-135 - Passing gas and taking names!
 
jetwet1
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 5:51 pm

Next time it starts up, get to an ER, have an EKG, it's just not worth the risk of playing with this.

Quoting Airstud (Thread starter):

I had a lipid panel done last October as part of a routine physical and the results all came back "normal," including cholesterol. You can't have normal cholesterol in October and then have a heart attack in February, right? Certainly not when your diet is free of red meats and contains mostly poultry, fish, fruits and vegetables!!!

I had a full medical 3 months before my heart attack, I passed it with flying colors.
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 6:42 pm

Go.

To.

The.

ER.

Right.

Now.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
-Carl Sagan
 
seat64k
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:19 pm

Quoting Moose135 (Reply 4):
I've had the same conversation with a couple of doctors. First time, my doctor poked me and asked "Does that hurt?" When I say yes, he said "It's not your heart." Several years later, my new doctor (I'd moved between occurrences) did the same, but gave me the explanation behind it.

For the uninitiated like me, could you explain why? Does the heart attack prevent you from feeling external pain?
 
Ken777
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:21 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 6):

Go.

To.

The.

ER.

Right.

Now.

Best advice ever and the nurse should have given it when you called. And it might be best if you didn't rive - call a close friend or a cab. Even an ambulance.
 
mandala499
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:27 pm

So what if you're not overweight and exercise regularly... had a few friends like that... and they got heart attacks...

Chest pains? It's not always a heart attack, but if it bothers you or that you're worried, go to the ER.
I regularly have these. EKG and it was fine... it was other things...

Stress or anxiety or depression could also produce these pains... been there done that... (still recovering)...
When losing situational awareness, pray Cumulus Granitus isn't nearby !
 
Okie
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:46 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 6):
Go.

To.

The.

ER.

Right.

Now.

Follow the Dr's instructions.

You are asking a serious health question to A.net mensa members that could involve a dirt nap.   

Try a health professional. A blood test for certain enzymes and an EKG and a scan goes a long way towards a correct prognosis.

Okie
 
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casinterest
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:57 pm

Quoting Airstud (Thread starter):
In the past week, I've had these periodic shooting, crushing, squeezing, aching type pains in my chest - all of them on the left side, which of course is scary

I get these from time to time, but it is usually right after I have done some weights with my chest. The best I can describe mine is like someone picks a spot and sticks a needle in it for about 2 seconds. Then it is gone. I asked my doc about it and he said the same thing as Diverted wrote about. This was after I had an EKG to make sure everything was OK. The doc did tell me that my cholesterol was not optimal and that I should watch what I drank and ate a bit better. I have cut back quite a bit on beer and sodas along with bringing my own healthy lunch instead of rushing into a fast food place and taking the bad stuff . I actually feel a lot better and the pains have gone away a bit. Might also be that I am swimming more so my muscles are a bit more cardiac active again.

If you have any doubts at all, you should be at the doctor before you have read this. It may be nothing, but it is better to confirm it.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 8:29 pm

Quoting seat64k (Reply 7):

For the uninitiated like me, could you explain why? Does the heart attack prevent you from feeling external pain?

Cardiac pain comes from the heart. Chest wall pain comes from the chest wall and hurts when you poke it.

THAT SAID, the actual numbers show that this is not a safe assumption in men over 40 or so. An EKG takes 5 minutes and does not harm the patient in any way other than possibly making him rip out some chest hair when he goes to pull the leads.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
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DocLightning
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sat Feb 13, 2016 8:34 pm

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 8):

Best advice ever and the nurse should have given it when you called. And it might be best if you didn't rive - call a close friend or a cab. Even an ambulance.
Quoting Okie (Reply 10):

Follow the Dr's instructions.

You know, I might be a pediatrician, but they kind of drill the concept of "heart attack" into you in med school.

Step 1: Make sure you are not having a heart attack. Or an aortic dissection. Or a spontaneous pneumothorax. Any of these can kill you very quickly.
Step 2: If it's not, then take your sweet time figuring out what it is.

Now, please listen to me if you haven't done so already.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
-Carl Sagan
 
vikkyvik
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sun Feb 14, 2016 5:29 am

Quoting Airstud (Thread starter):

Wow, I had similar for a few months a few months ago. It was generally at night, when I was sitting around in the living room doing nothing in particular (aka surfing A.net or whatnot).

The first few times, I assumed I had done something muscular, or dislocated my sternum or something (not really, but I did try and stretch to see if I could "crack" my chest, or whatever). It went away fairly quickly (5-10 minutes).

The last time I recall it happening, it was just as I was going to bed. This time was worse, and took maybe 20 minutes to go away. I was not particularly comfortable, lying there in bed. That one eventually went away, and it hasn't happened since, that I remember.

I'm generally very slow to go see a doctor about anything, but I'm thinking I should definitely do that very soon.
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QFA380
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sun Feb 14, 2016 7:28 am

I've had similar issues for around 3 years, occasional chest pain that seems to originate in the left part of my chest. It comes and goes. I went to the ER and had an ECG, they said I was fine however referred me to a cardiologist. They didn't tell me at the time but they potentially suspected Brugada Syndrome. When I went to my GP to get the referral she had never heard of it but when she opened up wikipedia and the first line was 'can cause sudden cardiac death' I was (proverbially) shitting myself.

Had an echocardiogram at the cardiologist a week later and he said that it was all normal.

The pains seem to come and go still but generally I put them down to the gym, the way I sleep with my elbow above my head which stretches out the pecs or plain old mild anxiousness/I have mild hypochondria.

The power of placebo is truly incredible and along that line of thinking is the ability to amplify sensations within your head. As a young fit male, never broken anything, I have not felt any real severe pain in my entire life. I get the impression that usually when heart attacks strike you'll know about it.

Despite this it is good to be sure, definitely beats dying suddenly (although you probably won't really notice it).


This does not constitute medical advice but I suggest everyone loosely monitors their intake of electrolytes and make sure their potassium, calcium, magnesium and sodium (very healthy people often do not get enough) are adequate enough.
 
ANITIX87
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sun Feb 14, 2016 1:23 pm

Family history does not exclude you from having a heart attack: my dad's mother died of one and was the first in her family to do so (and still the only, so far).

Weight and health do not exclude you from having a heart attack: my mom's sister died of one at 29 years old and was in perfect health, played professional volleyball, and got regular medical check-ups.

Cholesterol has very little bearing on whether you have a heart attack: my uncle has severe blood clotting issues and his cholesterol is so good the doctors thought the last test he had was wrong. He is at very high risk of heart attack because of the clotting issue despite having perfect cholesterol.

Listen to DocLightning. He's a doctor and if he says to go to ER, you damn well better go to the ER.

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andz
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sun Feb 14, 2016 4:27 pm

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 12):
rip out some chest hair when he goes to pull the leads.
Quoting ANITIX87 (Reply 16):
Listen to DocLightning. He's a doctor and if he says to go to ER, you damn well better go to the ER.

He doesn't believe in skin prep though which is vital to a good ECG signal. I had a stress test last week and when the tech stuck on the first electrode I stopped her and insisted she do it properly. Shave the site, wipe with webcol and allow to dry, unfortunately they didn't have abrasive pads to really do a good job.
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Airstud
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sun Feb 14, 2016 5:11 pm

EKG was normal, so was the blood work. It seems the heart releases an enzyme called "troponin" during a heart attack, and here I thought you had to be part of the digestive system if you wanted to release a enzyme (stay in school, kids!!)

Chest X-ray was normal tambien, no pneumothorax.

As I was driving TO the hospital, see, I was sorting out exactly what I was going to say upon presenting myself, and my first few "drafts" had all sorts of confessions about how silly I feel, in ambulatory health, to be coming in and taking up their time, etc. Then I decided why don't I just tell them my blamed symptoms and they take it from there.

As Dr. Mumm (dude went through childhood being named "Mumm?"    ) was giving me the scoop (why it's probably not a heart attack, what the xray will help rule out, etc.) he said something like "I think it's good that you came in" even though I actually hadn't recited my "I shouldn't have come in" shpiel from my earlier drafts.

That made me think that maybe "I think it's good that you came in" is like the "It's not you; it's me" of talking to hypochondriacal dorks in the ER...
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Okie
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Sun Feb 14, 2016 5:19 pm

Glad you are Okay.
Now you have real results from a professional to work towards solving your issue.

Okie
 
Airstud
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Tue Feb 16, 2016 9:49 pm

Stress is the diagnosis.

It's been more than two years now since my mother died; so the whole "respect for the dead" thing has played out and the myriad unvarnished memories of what an unfettered gigabitch that obnoxious woman was... Well they're back.   



(My doc gave me a shrink referral.)
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seb146
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Tue Feb 16, 2016 11:53 pm

Quoting Airstud (Reply 20):
Stress is the diagnosis.

Glad to hear that is all it is. Always remember that this is the place to chime in "you're an idiot!" and "no, you are an idiot!" and not asking for medical diagnosis.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Wed Feb 17, 2016 12:44 am

Quoting Airstud (Reply 18):

EKG was normal, so was the blood work. It seems the heart releases an enzyme called "troponin" during a heart attack, and here I thought you had to be part of the digestive system if you wanted to release a enzyme (stay in school, kids!!)

Yes, we used to look for an enzyme called CK-MB but cardiac troponins are much more specific and sensitive and basically was adopted almost universally in the time frame between 2004 and 2008 or so. Every one of your cells is a bag of enzymes. The trick to diagnosing damage to a given set of cells is to find an enzyme expressed by that cell and not by any other cell. So if it's liver damage, then your AST and ALT will be high (AST is produced by other cells including muscle, but not ALT). If it's pancreatic damage, then pancreatic lipase will be high. Heart, troponin.

Quoting Airstud (Reply 18):

As Dr. Mumm (dude went through childhood being named "Mumm?"    ) was giving me the scoop (why it's probably not a heart attack, what the xray will help rule out, etc.) he said something like "I think it's good that you came in" even though I actually hadn't recited my "I shouldn't have come in" shpiel from my earlier drafts.

Yes, because, as I said, you don't dick around with chest pain. He probably got the sense that you felt silly for being there. When you do this job for a while, you get pretty good at reading people.

I'm glad to hear that the final cause is that you're just crazy.  Wink  duck 

[Edited 2016-02-16 16:45:52]
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
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Aaron747
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Wed Feb 17, 2016 3:20 am

Quoting Airstud (Reply 20):
Stress is the diagnosis.

Stress is no joke.

Long story short, the stress of being married to my ex gave me everything from migraines to chest pain to heart palpitations, the latter of which made me convinced I had something potentially fatal and led to panic attacks. I had several stress tests, cardiac CT, echo, and the works at my own request. Things really got scary when I did a 24-hour Holter and it reported several runs of SVT in my sleep - which the doc at the time failed to explain was totally benign, especially as they were asymptomatic. 2nd and 3rd opinions later and I found a very good English-speaking cognitive behavioral therapist who worked with me to break the cycle of Internet research and a fear reaction to every palpitation.

Now fast forward seven years and I almost never have them anymore and nearly all my anxiety symptoms dissipated following my divorce. Emotional freedom was the proof I needed that stress was the cause of all that nonsense. Interestingly work-related stress only seems to manifest as headaches these days. But make no mistake - stress can be a powerful engine of somatic symptoms, and getting it under control can save your sanity.
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fr8mech
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Wed Feb 17, 2016 4:05 am

If you won't listen to our resident Doc, maybe you'll pay attention to someone was an EMT for 10 or so years and made the run more times than he can count to the idiot...patient...that "was just having some chest pain"....if it happens again, even with the amorphous diagnosis of:

Quoting Airstud (Reply 20):
Stress

Get thee to a hospital. Not an urgent care facility. Not the shaman or holistic healer that happens to live upstairs. Do not drive...do not walk...do not wait for a friend to drive you, unless he happens to have red lights and a siren. Call an ambulance.

That having been said. Glad it wasn't a heart attack.

Now, deal with your stress or it will be. Or, it will be a stroke. Or, any number of other physiological manifestations of your stress that can kill you...dead...right now...or even later.

Oh yeah...and ditch your doctor. If neither the appointment lady nor the nurse told you to hang up and call 911 immediately, there's a problem.
When seconds count, the police are minutes away.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
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Airstud
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Wed Feb 17, 2016 6:31 am

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 24):
If you won't listen to our resident Doc

Er...you got that I did go to the ER, right?
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fr8mech
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Wed Feb 17, 2016 6:50 am

Quoting Airstud (Reply 25):
Er...you got that I did go to the ER, right?

Not immediately evident, no.

You apparently went to the hospital after:

Quoting Airstud (Thread starter):
I called to schedule myself a doctor's appointment

and, apparently had a conversation with a nurse that would have been accompanied by a laugh track if it happened during prime time, especially since it should have lasted about 10 seconds.

And then you did this:

Quoting Airstud (Reply 18):
As I was driving TO the hospital,

Please. Don't drive yourself to the hospital if you're having chest pains...you may wreck and kill somebody.  
When seconds count, the police are minutes away.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
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jetwet1
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Wed Feb 17, 2016 4:22 pm

Quoting Airstud (Reply 20):
Stress is the diagnosis.

Oh, that can be a killer as well, trust me on that one, learn to get a handle on it quickly, as my surgeon explained to me

"What is the worst thing that can happen to you?"

Me "stupid answer type thing"

Him "No, you die, everything else is childs play compared to dropping dead"

Not very deep or meaningful I know, but it hit home with me.

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 23):

Dude, great ex you have.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 24):
Oh yeah...and ditch your doctor. If neither the appointment lady nor the nurse told you to hang up and call 911 immediately, there's a problem.

This, this 100 times this, as Doc said "you don't dick around with chest pain"

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 26):
Please. Don't drive yourself to the hospital if you're having chest pains...you may wreck and kill somebody.

To be fair, I am a pretty logical rational person, however, once I figured out what was going on two things happened, confusion and denial, it was only as I was being wheeled into the operating theater that it dawned on me how stupid I had been, my brain was telling me I wasn't really having a heart attack, so it was okay to make the 5 minute drive.

I am thankful to this day that I made it to the hospital in one piece and more importantly didn't crash or hit anyone.
 
txjim
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Wed Feb 17, 2016 8:22 pm

It’s also possible that an EKG does not tell the entire story. After training for a long mountain hike, I went 4-5 months after the trip before I started seriously running again. I experienced a burning pain below my heart which I attributed to heartburn. In a regular checkup, Doc did an EKG with no issues.

Fast forward to January 2015 when the burning pain showed up in a different form as I was doing nothing more than walking the dog. Pain was higher up and more painful than before but, heartburn, right? As it turns out, I had a checkup scheduled with my Doc the following week so I discussed the problem thinking we’d check gastrointestinal sources. Nope, another EKG (which looked normal) followed by a recommendation for a stress test.

A week and a half later I’m telling the medical tech about my heartburn and how this is really not necessary as he’s preparing me for the test. He also halts the test halfway through, performs the post-test echocardiogram and points out the obvious differences between pre and post test images. This was followed by an impromptu meeting with the Cardiologist that afternoon followed by a Cardiac Catheterization the following day followed by bypass surgery a couple days later. It took a couple weeks for the stress test to be scheduled but things move at the speed of light after the test.

I got lucky, did not have a heart attack prior to surgery. Feel better today than I have in years.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 22):
Yes, because, as I said, you don't dick around with chest pain. He probably got the sense that you felt silly for being there. When you do this job for a while, you get pretty good at reading people.

I hate to think what my doctor and the med tech were thinking as I assured them this was heartburn. Probably something along the lines of 'Crap, another engineer!"
 
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Aaron747
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 2:03 am

Quoting jetwet1 (Reply 27):
Dude, great ex you have.

My fault for choosing her and missing the signs of psycho hose beast syndrome. Anyway ancient history, and valuable learning experience.

Quoting txjim (Reply 28):
A week and a half later I’m telling the medical tech about my heartburn and how this is really not necessary as he’s preparing me for the test. He also halts the test halfway through, performs the post-test echocardiogram and points out the obvious differences between pre and post test images.
Quoting txjim (Reply 28):
It’s also possible that an EKG does not tell the entire story. After training for a long mountain hike, I went 4-5 months after the trip before I started seriously running again. I experienced a burning pain below my heart which I attributed to heartburn. In a regular checkup, Doc did an EKG with no issues.

I still shake my head whenever there's news of someone dropping dead at a marathon or some other event. The holy trifecta of heart testing is ECG / pre-post stress test echo / nuclear testing. It's not that hard to have those tests done before putting the heart through that kind of work. As a cardiologist explained to me - think of everything on a bell curve. The majority of cardiac events strike people on the low / high workload end of the curve.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Airstud
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 2:09 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 29):

"Nuclear testing?"   
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fr8mech
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 2:23 am

Quoting Airstud (Reply 30):
"Nuclear testing?"
http://www.mayoclinic.org/tests-proc...est/basics/definition/prc-20012978

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 29):
It's not that hard to have those tests done before putting the heart through that kind of work.

The problem with us running types is that we think we are cardio-supermen.   

47 years old. Resting heart rate of ~50, BP 118/65. Un-medicated cholesterol: 162 w/HDL 61. I am bullet-proof...NOT.
When seconds count, the police are minutes away.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
Ego Bibere Capulus, Ut Aliis Sit Vivere
 
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WarRI1
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 2:55 am

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 31):
47 years old. Resting heart rate of ~50, BP 118/65. Un-medicated cholesterol: 162 w/HDL 61. I am bullet-proof...NOT.

At my age, you have seen a bunch of people who thought they were and they were not. Smart of you to realize there is no guarantee.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
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Aaron747
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 3:03 am

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 31):
The problem with us running types is that we think we are cardio-supermen

A kid on my high school tennis team dropped dead in the middle of a match with our rival school. He was also on track and field and had developed hypertrophic cardiomyopathy (abnormal thickening of the heart muscle). Most people in the school thought he was the healthiest kid anyone knew, so it was a massive shock.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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fr8mech
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 3:10 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 32):
At my age, you have seen a bunch of people who thought they were and they were not. Smart of you to realize there is no guarantee.

Thing is...I really can't do a darn thing about it. Can I? I guess I can do all those tests before running my half-marathons, but what's the difference between a 13.1 mile race and a 12 mile training run? Nothing.
When seconds count, the police are minutes away.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
Ego Bibere Capulus, Ut Aliis Sit Vivere
 
Airstud
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 3:22 am

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 34):
what's the difference between a 13.1 mile race and a 12 mile training run? Nothing.

Um, 1.1 miles actually.

  
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fr8mech
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 3:31 am

Quoting Airstud (Reply 35):
Um, 1.1 miles actually.

Or, 8'ish minutes. And, free cheap beer at the end of one and good beer from my fridge at the end of the other. Though, I ran one race last year where we got 4 drink tickets that were good for the various bourbons that were available, plus a slice of pizza. Nummy.

Doc. Question:

I fired back those 4 shots (plus a beer) and the pizza after running that race. Didn't even feel a buzz. What's the physiology behind that, if any?

[Edited 2016-02-17 19:41:27]
When seconds count, the police are minutes away.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
Ego Bibere Capulus, Ut Aliis Sit Vivere
 
jetwet1
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 7:24 am

Quoting txjim (Reply 28):

As I said above, with me, I went through a full physical 3 months before my heart attack and passed it with flying colors.

The heart attack itself felt like heart burn, however, I developed the numb left arm a couple of minutes into it, that was the big trigger for me that I was in trouble, thankfully, our local PBS radio station had been running a series of "These are the signs of a heart attack" pieces that I had caught on my drive home from work, it literally saved my life.

Yes, they received a nice donation from myself and my current employer.

Quoting txjim (Reply 28):
I hate to think what my doctor and the med tech were thinking as I assured them this was heartburn. Probably something along the lines of 'Crap, another engineer!"

More likely "crap, another one has been on WebMD.com"

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 29):
The holy trifecta of heart testing is ECG / pre-post stress test echo / nuclear testing.

Here (Vegas), they have pretty much done away with the stress test and go with the nuclear as a first choice.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 31):
The problem with us running types is that we think we are cardio-supermen.

The surgeon who did my heart surgery ran marathons, he had a heart attack a month after me, scary really.
 
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fr8mech
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 7:47 am

Quoting jetwet1 (Reply 37):

The surgeon who did my heart surgery ran marathons, he had a heart attack a month after me, scary really.

Not really scary...inevitable. Sounds fatalistic, but it's not. It's acceptance.

Live life to the fullest.
Live every day likes it's your last.
Blah, blah, blah

As far as I'm concerned...live to live.
When seconds count, the police are minutes away.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
Ego Bibere Capulus, Ut Aliis Sit Vivere
 
Airstud
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 7:56 am

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 38):
inevitable

  

Surely you don't mean every man everywhere is going to have a heart attack?!?!



('Cause, see, I don't want one of those...)
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fr8mech
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:03 am

Quoting Airstud (Reply 39):
Surely you don't mean every man everywhere is going to have a heart attack?!?!

No, I mean every body will eventually die.

Quoting Airstud (Reply 39):
('Cause, see, I don't want one of those...)

I can certainly think of worse ways to die than a heart attack. At least the sudden, dead-right-there (DRT, as we called them) heart attack victims.

Of course, a heart attack can provide a warning. I know 2 people that are living perfectly normal lives after having a heart attack.
When seconds count, the police are minutes away.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
Ego Bibere Capulus, Ut Aliis Sit Vivere
 
Airstud
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:14 am

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 40):
every body will eventually die

Gross.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 22):
He probably got the sense that you felt silly for being there.

Now that I've had a few days to replay my interactions with Dr. M. in my head, I realize how ridiculous it was of me to relay DocLightning's specific concerns. "You have to check for heart attack, aortic dissection, and spontaneous pneumothorax," like a licensed M.D. working in the ER needed a dropout to point out to him how to handle things.    Uy. Embarrassing.

When I was real young and working at UCSF (and later at other hospitals), I loved learning new terminology and then going to Stedman's Medical Dictionary to learn as much as I could about the science being referenced. I constantly wished back then that I could afford my own copy so I could bury my nose in it and just totally get my learn on after work each night. (Except now I remember how, when I did learn stuff at work, I would swagger around as if this knowledge made me special (in an enterprise already full of doctors, P.A.'s, nurses). As they say in Italy, "He who knows little, quickly tells it.")

(So, probably a good thing that I never could afford my own copy.    )

[Edited 2016-02-18 03:23:00]
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jetwet1
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Thu Feb 18, 2016 5:58 pm

Quoting Airstud (Reply 41):
Gross.

Not really, it's a fact, come to grips with it and

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 38):
Live life to the fullest.
Live every day likes it's your last.
Blah, blah, blah

You will quickly figure out this is true.
 
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fr8mech
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Fri Feb 19, 2016 1:30 am

Quoting Airstud (Reply 41):
Gross.

Why? It will happen. You may not see it coming or even know it happened, or you'll see it way off and note and worry about its approach, but it will happen.
When seconds count, the police are minutes away.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
Ego Bibere Capulus, Ut Aliis Sit Vivere
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Fri Feb 19, 2016 3:28 am

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 36):

Doc. Question:

I fired back those 4 shots (plus a beer) and the pizza after running that race. Didn't even feel a buzz. What's the physiology behind that, if any?

The pizza may have slowed absorption. Also, after running a race you're kinda hopped up on your own endorphins and enkephalins and endogenous cannabinoids, so...
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
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Airstud
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Fri Feb 19, 2016 3:37 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 44):
The pizza may have slowed absorption. Also, after running a race you're kinda hopped up on your own endorphins and enkephalins and endogenous cannabinoids, so...

OK: I haven't heard of "enkephalins," but I'm uneducated, so I defer.

However, "endogenous cannabinoids?" I'm QUITE confident you made that one up.
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DocLightning
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Fri Feb 19, 2016 3:43 am

Quoting Airstud (Reply 45):

However, "endogenous cannabinoids?" I'm QUITE confident you made that one up.

No, I did not. Do you think that the human brain has receptors that evolved just so we could smoke weed?

No, plant neurochemicals like opioids and cannabinoids evolved to interact with specific receptors that are present in the animal nervous system.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endocannabinoid_system
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
-Carl Sagan
 
Airstud
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Fri Feb 19, 2016 3:48 am

Jeez - it's like he thought I was serious or something...

But anyway, I thought a "receptor" was a thingy created by T-lymphocytes, that hang out on the surface of the cell and do immunology-type things.

One of the few science-y things I was able to absorb is that B-cells create antibodies and T-cells receptors, 'cause "antibody" has a "B" in it and "receptor" has a "T" in it.

See?

Need any more help practicing medicine, I'm here...

[Edited 2016-02-18 19:52:58]
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DocLightning
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Fri Feb 19, 2016 3:56 am

Quoting Airstud (Reply 47):

But anyway, I thought a "receptor" was a thingy created by T-lymphocytes, that hang out on the surface of the cell and do immunology-type things.

A receptor is any protein on the surface of a cell that binds a ligand (that's the name for a thingie that binds to a receptor) and transmits a signal across the plasma membrane.

Just about every cell type in the human body (as in I can't think of any exceptions) expresses multiple types of receptors on its surface.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
-Carl Sagan
 
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fr8mech
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RE: Chest Pains Thread

Fri Feb 19, 2016 3:58 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 44):
enkephalins and endogenous cannabinoids, so

You know, I typically feel that I'm fairly smart and I know I'm intelligent, then I read the linked Wiki article about these things and am humbled. I'd have to read that thing half a dozen times to get a good feel for it.

Thanks Doc.
When seconds count, the police are minutes away.
It’s hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it’s damn near impossible to win an argument with a stupid person. ~B. Murray
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