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Aeroflot001
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Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Thu Feb 18, 2016 5:49 pm

The White house has confirmed that President Obama and the First Lady will travel to Cuba and Argentina next month.
The visit to Cuba is dubbed as historic as a sitting president hasn't visited the island in 90 years. The last president to visit Argentina was Bush 43 in 2005 for the summit of the America's. Mauricio Macri (the newly elected President of Argentina) must be jumping for joy, he is considered pro-market, centre-right etc.

Thoughts and comments, it sure will be interesting to see Air Force one at HAV and EZE (Provided they use those airports? AEP is far too small and I believe that El Palomar Air Force Base is as well)

Thoughts and Comments.
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Thu Feb 18, 2016 7:33 pm

Good, it is about time we end this pointless embargo on Cuba. While I disagree with the obsolete embargo, it makes it even worse that we do not embargo the other multitude of countries that are worse than Cuba.

Wonder how long it'll take before the President is bashed for this... sigh
 
Osubuckeyes
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:45 pm

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 1):
Wonder how long it'll take before the President is bashed for this... sigh

He already was last night by Rubio in the town hall. Rubio was asked by Anderson whether he would go to Cuba, and Rubio stated that he would not and he believes that Obama is going about Cuba all wrong. Rubio stated that the opening of Cuba should be more akin to the opening of Burma rather than just opening up to an oppressive regime. Though I will say this is not the first time he has criticized the Cuba policy so he is relatively consistent in his stance.

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 1):
While I disagree with the obsolete embargo, it makes it even worse that we do not embargo the other multitude of countries that are worse than Cuba.

Embargos for the most part are obsolete outdated anyways.
 
wingman
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:23 pm

Quoting Osubuckeyes (Reply 2):
Embargos for the most part are obsolete outdated anyways.

I agree and love the idea of this trip. Unless you're China and can afford Great Firewalls, the fastest, cheapest, and least destructive way to change countries like Cuba and Myanmar is with high speed internet and Starbucks. Not saying it's 100% for the better, but it beats the hell out of embargoes or Shock and Awe.
 
photopilot
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 1:15 am

Quoting wingman (Reply 3):
the fastest, cheapest, and least destructive way to change countries like Cuba and Myanmar is with high speed internet and Starbucks.

Faster internet.... yes please.
Starbucks.... oh Please dear god NO!!!!! Unless you've been to Cuba and enjoyed a great café Cubano, you simply won't understand how pathetic the garbage from Starbucks really is.

As to Obama's visit to Cuba, for a similar situation look how Nixon's '72 visit to China started the process of normalizing relations. This is an excellent move in a series of excellent moves by the US administration to normalize relations with Cuba. The biggest fear is a pendejo like Bush / Rubio / Trump getting into power and undoing all the progress made.
 
wingman
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 1:27 am

Quoting photopilot (Reply 4):
Unless you've been to Cuba and enjoyed a great café Cubano, you simply won't understand how pathetic the garbage from Starbucks really is.

I know, just meant it for symbolic purposes. I have the fondest memories of my little cuban caffeine bombs in Miami. That and a pressed sandwich for lunch, hard to beat.
 
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WarRI1
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 1:49 am

Quoting photopilot (Reply 4):
As to Obama's visit to Cuba, for a similar situation look how Nixon's '72 visit to China started the process of normalizing relations

Normalize relations? I find that comical along with the benefit's we received from our relations with China, who just deployed Missiles on disputed Islands they claim. Oh the joy and brotherhood. We have destroyed our middleclass and impoverished our citizens while the wealthy continue to send jobs elsewhere.


Permission was just granted to two US businessmen from the US to build a factory to build tractors, Does that all seem a little familiar? Hold on to your ass US and Mexico, let us see how we all like the jobs from the US and Mexico going to Cuba. Maybe Carrier and Ford acted a little too fast building their factories in Mexico. Wow! all for a cup of Cuban coffee and sandy beach's. Such a deal. Trump and Sanders are correct, we are ruining our country and people. I do not care a whit about Obama going to Cuba , but I do give a shit about our corporations sending jobs to another Communist Country
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photopilot
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 2:24 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 6):
Hold on to your ass US and Mexico, let us see how we all like the jobs from the US and Mexico going to Cuba.

Perhaps if you understood the facts before making wild assumptions you'd modify your tone and viewpoint.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repor...n-cuba-since-1959/article28761433/

The tractors are little 25 hp ones to be built for DOMESTIC use within Cuba and perhaps eventually to other Latin American countries.. It's a great step to help Cuba solve their food production issues.

Quote:
"The Oggun tractor plant, named after a god in Cuba’s syncretic Santeria religion, will assemble commercially available components into a durable and easy-to-maintain 25-horsepower tractor selling for less than $10,000, Mr. Clemmons and Mr. Berenthal said. The men believe they can sell hundreds of the tractors a year to Cuban farmers with financing from relatives outside the country and to non-government organizations seeking to help improve Cuban agriculture........"
 
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WarRI1
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 3:02 am

Quoting photopilot (Reply 7):
The tractors are little 25 hp ones to be built for DOMESTIC use within Cuba and perhaps eventually to other Latin American countries.. It's a great step to help Cuba solve their food production issues.

I know the facts, an example only, you know how it all started in China, a little item became a big item, a river became a flood. One job became 1 million jobs and on and on. My tone can be abrupt it seems, but I do not take this bull lightly. This is serious stuff. Canada has felt the sting of the global economy I am sure, maybe not as bad as the US, but trust me I have been there enough to see the results.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
Pyrex
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 3:52 am

Quoting Aeroflot001 (Thread starter):
Mauricio Macri (the newly elected President of Argentina) must be jumping for joy, he is considered pro-market, centre-right etc.

If he is all those things why should he be jumping from joy of meeting Obama?

Quoting photopilot (Reply 4):
a pendejo like Bush / Rubio / Trump

Ah, there it is, the typical liberal civility.
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Aeroflot001
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 6:05 am

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 9):
he is all those things why should he be jumping from joy of meeting Obama?

First of all, you're from Portugal, that's cool, I'm a Portuguese language student and I'm heading there next month. Anyhow back on the topic. Regardless of his domestic policies, Obama represent the United States and the Critisna Kirchner administration strained relations between both nations. Macri spoke to Obama on day one and immediately offered and invitation to Obama, part of Argentina's agenda is to attract foreign investment.
 
L-188
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 9:32 am

It is just play acting on Obama's part to pretend he has had a legacy of anything but spreading death with wars in Syria and Libya.

The thought of our wanna-be dictator president visiting a known dictator such as Castro is amusing, Birds of a feather I guess.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Stealthz
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 9:58 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 11):
It is just play acting on Obama's part to pretend he has had a legacy of anything but spreading death with wars in Syria and Libya.

And his predecessor was a benevolent father figure that kept America safe and did not send your military into futile adventures based on personal grudges?
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!....well that might have changed!!!
 
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pvjin
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 11:12 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 11):
The thought of our wanna-be dictator president visiting a known dictator such as Castro is amusing, Birds of a feather I guess.

He already met King Abdullah of Saudi-Arabia, that's much worse. At least Castro doesn't support terrorism or extreme religious intolerance. Admittedly neither does King Abdullah anymore as he's dead.

[Edited 2016-02-19 03:14:24]
"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - Martin Luther King Jr
 
L-188
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 11:15 am

Quoting stealthz (Reply 12):
nd his predecessor was a benevolent father figure that kept America safe and did not send your military into futile adventures based on personal grudges?

Just one, Iraq......Obama is up to what 2-3, plus the folks that have died in places like the russian invasion of the Crimea and eastern Ukraine, because of this presidents complete lack of fortitude.

Wouldn't surprise me to find out he would sell out the Brits to the Argentines while he is down there. Actually his timing is a bit surprising since he seems to have more in economic common with their previous president.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
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pvjin
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 1:23 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 14):
Just one, Iraq......Obama is up to what 2-3, plus the folks that have died in places like the russian invasion of the Crimea and eastern Ukraine, because of this presidents complete lack of fortitude.

What right does the United States have to prevent people of Crimea and Eastern Ukraine from choosing which country they want to belong to?
"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - Martin Luther King Jr
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 9:15 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 11):
The thought of our wanna-be dictator president visiting a known dictator such as Castro is amusing, Birds of a feather I guess.

Well pvjin stole my thunder, look at some of the people any president, D or R meets up with. Our middle eastern government friends are often not the best of people. I could see your line of reasoning if you were just as critical as a president meeting with the Saudi king but you're not.

Why is Cuba some boogey man country? What makes 2016 Cuba so bad, or at least any worse than a lot of the countries we have relations with?
 
L-188
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 9:17 pm

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 16):
What makes 2016 Cuba so bad, or at least any worse than a lot of the countries we have relations with?

Well we can start with Fidel and Raul Castro and work back from there.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 9:55 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 17):
Well we can start with Fidel and Raul Castro and work back from there.

Ok... again, what makes them:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 16):
any worse than a lot of the countries we have relations with?


It's not that I think the Castros are great guys, I don't. I just don't see them particularly worse than many people we deal with and are even friends with. Can you outline why they are besides naming a couple names?
 
photopilot
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 10:20 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 17):
Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 16):
What makes 2016 Cuba so bad, or at least any worse than a lot of the countries we have relations with?

Well we can start with Fidel and Raul Castro and work back from there.

The whole Cuban Revolution was about throwing out a US backed puppet dictator (Batista) and the foreign companies that were in essence raping and pillaging Cuba. What's had the USA so upset for so many years is that they couldn't get Cuba to bend her knees and kowtow to US interests and the Miami mafia.
 
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flyingturtle
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 10:37 pm

Are Cubans still granted permanent resident status in the U.S. if they manage to get there?


David
Reading accident reports is what calms me down
 
L-188
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 19, 2016 11:04 pm

Quoting flyingturtle (Reply 20):

Are Cubans still granted permanent resident status in the U.S. if they manage to get there?

Yes, That is a law that needs to be changed.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
photopilot
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Sat Feb 20, 2016 12:10 am

Quoting flyingturtle (Reply 20):
Are Cubans still granted permanent resident status in the U.S. if they manage to get there?

Yup, it's the Cuban Adjustment Act, otherwise known as the Wet-Foot / Dry-Foot policy.
 
Derico
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Sat Feb 20, 2016 9:10 am

A visit from a US president is nowhere as significant as it used to be in Argentina, given that trade and other ties are not as essential for Argentina as before. And given where Obama is in his presidency, it is at best a token symbolic visit. Whether he came or not would not alter in the slightest things in Buenos Aires, or in Macri's political agenda. His idea seems to be that he needs as many world leaders to come down as he can to further highlight his divergence with CFK. It's all for internal consumption, and I don't even think most people care whether foreign leaders come or not. They didn't in the last 10 years and no one raise it as some sort of lamentation.

Point to be made is that Mothers of Plaza de Mayo already say the US is playing dirty with the visit, since apparently it coincides with the 1976 military government take over.
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flyingturtle
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Sat Feb 20, 2016 12:08 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 21):
Yes, That is a law that needs to be changed.
Quoting L-188 (Reply 21):
Yup, it's the Cuban Adjustment Act, otherwise known as the Wet-Foot / Dry-Foot policy.

I can't think of any other country doing this... except perhaps Western Germany giving automatic citizenship to GDR residents, but this is understandable.

I hope for a peaceful transformation of Cuba towards more tourism, more trade, and more democracy. I hope they don't turn into a US casino and playground a second time. (It was interesting to read that many of the Chicago mafia bosses convened in Havana without disturbance of any kind...)


David
Reading accident reports is what calms me down
 
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WarRI1
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Sun Feb 21, 2016 3:26 am

Quoting flyingturtle (Reply 24):
I hope for a peaceful transformation of Cuba towards more tourism, more trade, and more democracy. I hope they don't turn into a US casino and playground a second time. (It was interesting to read that many of the Chicago mafia bosses convened in Havana without disturbance of any kind...)

You can just bet that with increasing affluence will come increasing corruption once again. Cuba will eventually succumb once again, if it has not already. I am sure there is corruption now even under the Communist regime.

[Edited 2016-02-20 19:51:41]
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
Aeroflot001
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Wed Feb 24, 2016 7:29 pm

Quoting Derico (Reply 23):
And given where Obama is in his presidency, it is at best a token symbolic visit. Whether he came or not would not alter in the slightest things in Buenos Aires, or in Macri's political agenda. His idea seems to be that he needs as many world leaders to come down as he can to further highlight his divergence with CFK.

I agree, Obama is on his way out so it is at best a symbolic visit. I do doubt that he would have visited had Scioli been elected. Every President since George Bush Sr. has visited Argentina. FDR and Eisenhower did as well. Let's see what happens on the 24th, his visit will definitely be dwarfed by the visit to Cuba first.
 
AR385
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:33 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 8):
I know the facts, an example only, you know how it all started in China, a little item became a big item, a river became a flood. One job became 1 million jobs and on and on. My tone can be abrupt it seems, but I do not take this bull lightly. This is serious stuff.

This is something I do not understand. Americans keep complaining about jobs going to other countries. Yet, they still flock to Wal-Mart en masse, Target, and such. How do Americans expect to have cheap goods but at the same time feel such chauvinistic incoherence at jobs going abroad?. It can´t be both ways. Americans are angry about illegal immigration, but still want cheap goods? It´s so idiotic that it sometimes generates a sense of amusing shame.

Quoting Aeroflot001 (Reply 10):
Macri spoke to Obama on day one and immediately offered and invitation to Obama, part of Argentina's agenda is to attract foreign investment.

Wrong. Macri had been speaking to the White House begging Obama to come, ever since he was declared President elect of Argentina. He got lucky, as he was able to convince him to come, and it represents a sign of legitimacy to this current Argentine government as opposed to the craziness of the dysfunctional CFK.

Quoting L-188 (Reply 14):
Wouldn't surprise me to find out he would sell out the Brits to the Argentines while he is down there.

Would be a decent gesture as opposed to their behavior during the Malvinas War

Quoting Derico (Reply 23):
A visit from a US president is nowhere as significant as it used to be in Argentina, given that trade and other ties are not as essential for Argentina as before.

You are so very wrong. Trade and ties are very essential as Macri is not going to get Yuans, Venezuela is unable to help at the moment (and for a long time won´t) Brazil is imploding and Argentina sorely lacks the money for infrastructure projects that should have been coming on line yesterday. Unless Argentina gets access to credit, and it won´t until they come to an understanding with the holdouts, you will keep having blackouts, unheard of in a country like Argentina every time the temps exceed 37C. The printing money machine has stopped and many provinces are bankrupt. Argentina desperately needs access to foreign cash. A visit from Obama, as lame duck as you may consider him to be, would go a long way to signal to the world that Argentina is normal again.

Quoting Derico (Reply 23):
Whether he came or not would not alter in the slightest things in Buenos Aires, or in Macri's political agenda. His idea seems to be that he needs as many world leaders to come down as he can to further highlight his divergence with CFK. It's all for internal consumption, and I don't even think most people care whether foreign leaders come or not. They didn't in the last 10 years and no one raise it as some sort of lamentation.

You surely cannot be so naive. Argentina has a deficit of over 7.5% and inflation of around 35% and no practical foreing reserves. Provinces are bankrupt and they live literally month to month, depending on how much money the Federal Governement is able to sen them. See Alicia Kirchner, which lately looks more like a beggar than a Governor.

Macri is trying to 1) Get foreign cash NOW and 2) Get Argentina back on the foreign capital markets. Again, Venezuela is gone. Do you think a President would be so naive as to host leaders of other nations just for "internal consumption"?
 
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WarRI1
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 26, 2016 2:22 am

Quoting AR385 (Reply 27):
This is something I do not understand. Americans keep complaining about jobs going to other countries. Yet, they still flock to Wal-Mart en masse, Target, and such. How do Americans expect to have cheap goods but at the same time feel such chauvinistic incoherence at jobs going abroad?. It can´t be both ways. Americans are angry about illegal immigration, but still want cheap goods? It´s so idiotic that it sometimes generates a sense of amusing shame.

You and I are in agreement on not understanding the stupidity and yes selfishness of the American people. It ranks at the top of my frustration list. I never shop Walmart, and have never set foot in one as far as I can remember. I look at every label of origin on everything I shop for cloths, tools food, tire, automobiles, building supplies, even tooth past and tooth brushs, virtually everything.

I just had an argument in the Drug store over greeting cards, the Chinese made on top, US made on the lower shelf. I just found a US made frying pan and I considered it a victory. Sad and ridiculous, but that is what we are these days. That is why I support some of Trumps ideas and fully support Bernie Sanders. I know when someone is screwing me over, and obviously so does he.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
L-188
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Fri Feb 26, 2016 11:46 pm

[quote=AR385,reply=27]Quoting L-188 (Reply 14):Wouldn't surprise me to find out he would sell out the Brits to the Argentines while he is down there.
Would be a decent gesture as opposed to their behavior during the Malvinas War[/quote

1. There are no such islands as the Malvinas, They are the Falklands.
2. The Aggies were on the side of villainy on that one.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
AR385
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Sat Feb 27, 2016 12:11 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 29):
1. There are no such islands as the Malvinas, They are the Falklands.
2. The Aggies were on the side of villainy on that one.

You are wrong on that side. The name Islas Malvinas, which is the name by which I CHOOSE to call them, is as valid and correct as the one you choose to call them by. At least I am able to accept some people may choose to call them Falklands.

The Argentines, which you choose to disrespect and call them Argies, sure were wrong in their 1982 alcohol infused, bellicose, stupid adventure. But throughout history, it is debatable wether they are the "villain" in the matter.
 
L-188
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Sat Feb 27, 2016 3:34 am

Quoting AR385 (Reply 30):
The name Islas Malvinas, which is the name by which I CHOOSE to call them,

To paraphrase a line from "Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade"......"You choose poorly"

Quoting AR385 (Reply 30):
it is debatable wether they are the "villain" in the matter.

Not really, a tin-hat military dictator invents a conflict to deflect attention from his own crimes and government and invades another county.

Quoting AR385 (Reply 30):
The Argentines, which you choose to disrespect and call them Argies,

No it was just easier to spell on those stupid small Ipod keyboard.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Aeroflot001
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RE: Obama To Visit HAV And EZE In March 21,22 & 23,24

Sun Feb 28, 2016 4:59 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 29):
1. There are no such islands as the Malvinas, They are the Falklands.
2. The Aggies were on the side of villainy on that one.
Quoting AR385 (Reply 30):
You are wrong on that side. The name Islas Malvinas, which is the name by which I CHOOSE to call them, is as valid and correct as the one you choose to call them by. At least I am able to accept some people may choose to call them Falklands.
Quoting L-188 (Reply 31):
Not really, a tin-hat military dictator invents a conflict to deflect attention from his own crimes and government and invades another county.

I'd really prefer to avoid this subject as it significantly drifts away from the topic. I doubt that the islands will be discussed whatsoever with Obama, especially given that Macri is in office and has scaled back the rhetoric. The name is engraved in culture as well. Regardless of political stance, an overwhelming majority of Spanish speakers, including Chileans who provided assistance to the British, call them Malvinas while speaking Spanish as do Portuguese speaking countries. Based of the original French name of Malouines, the French still refer to them as such again regardless of political stance, Îles Malouines. Several world Organizations also refer to them as Islas Malvinas in Spanish as well and Falkland Islands in English.



Anyhow, any information on the airports that AF1 will use?

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