Shooting In Dallas Love Field -KDAL

11725Flyer · Fri Jun 10, 2016 9:56 pm

And the advertising video is showing Grand Theft Auto. Somewhat ironic.

caljn · Fri Jun 10, 2016 10:38 pm

Quoting hivue (Reply 3):
Yeah. It's a problem for us -- a lot like rampant football hooliganism in Britain. (Oh, oops... is that a stereotype?)

I call False Equivalency!

There is, in fact, a problem with DAILY gun violence in the US. "hooliganism" on the other hand, few and far between. And people rarely die.

zippy · Fri Jun 10, 2016 11:02 pm

Quoting smokeybandit (Reply 46):

95% of the time when a cop fires his gun, it's justified, and it's barely a blip on the news radar. Just those 1% of the rest makes the news, along with another 4% that are justified, but the news media tries to claim otherwise.

Quoting caljn (Reply 51):
There is, in fact, a problem with DAILY gun violence in the US. "hooliganism" on the other hand, few and far between. And people rarely die.

There IS a problem with gun violence in the United States both police originated and otherwise. The stats on police involved shootings in the United States are, IMO, quite grim. It's not "mindless gun bashing".

http://theindependent.ca/2015/04/14/...-fatal-police-shootings-in-canada/

The United States saw 2.9 fatal police shootings per million people in 2014. UK? 0.04. Canada? 0.7. That works out to over nine hundred dead bodies at the hands of law enforcement in the United States in one year.

SoJo · Fri Jun 10, 2016 11:03 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 1):
It's Texas. I'm surprised it doesn't happen more.

You are my hero....

mham001 · Sat Jun 11, 2016 3:59 am

Quoting mozart (Reply 19):
The UK has a problem with hooliganism, although it has receded markedly since the 1990s. However, much fewer fatalities.

Related however, the Brits drink themselves to death at a crazy rate, far, far more than our gun murders, 14.2 per 100,000 in 2014. More than our alcohol and gun murders combined.

Beardown91737 · Sat Jun 11, 2016 4:11 am

Video released by Dallas Police Department

https://youtu.be/dc5hbPvUB5I

HGL · Sat Jun 11, 2016 6:14 am

While any homicides are unfortunate and it may be preferable to avoid a shooting where possible, it is interesting to see that attention is generally only given when an offender is shot. Rarely do we see comments about law enforcement officers being killed in the line of duty.

Yet every year several officers have their lives cut short and not only by gunfire. Some are beaten to death, others deliberately run down by motor vehicles. I am not seeking to justify any killing but reminding people that it isn't a one way street with bad cops killing innocent angels. The following figures are for the United States as a whole.

Officers Killed in the Line Duty
Cause Of Death	2014	2015	2016*
Assault	3	3	-
Bomb	-	6	-
Gunfire (not accidental)	47	39	19
Vehicular Assault	10	8	6
Source: Officer Down Memorial

* Period January 01 to June 10 only.

[Edited 2016-06-10 23:21:14]

Indy · Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:14 am

Quoting HGL (Reply 56):

Yet in 2015 nearly 1000 people were executed by police. And nearly 10% of those were unarmed. Seems like there is a war going on in the US between the police and the people. That is a lot of killing.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/inv...-police-fatally-shoot-nearly-1000/

HGL · Sat Jun 11, 2016 8:27 am

Quoting Indy (Reply 57):
1000 people were executed by police

Execution suggests carrying out capital punishment or killing someone in accordance with the law. It is not the same as murder, which is unlawful homicide. Any officer believed to have committed unlawful homicide should be prosecuted and placed on trial before a judge and jury in the same way as any other alleged offender.

Quoting Indy (Reply 57):
nearly 10% of those were unarmed

So over 90% were armed with a gun or some other weapon and were identified as posing a risk to the officers or other people. While I note that some of the people who were shot were subsequently found to be unarmed, were the officers involved in each instance aware of that or could be sure of that at the time they pulled the trigger?

Quoting Indy (Reply 57):
there is a war going on in the US between the police and the people

In Crime in the United States, 2014 published by the FBI, police made an estimated 11,205,833 arrests during 2014—498,666 for violent crimes, and 1,553,980 for property crimes. 965 person being killed by police does appear high but when compared to 11.2 million arrests that represents <0.009%. Too many people dead, yes. A war on the people, hardly.

As previously stated, any killings are unfortunate but we know that it is unlikely that the right to bear arms is going to be removed any time soon and as long as the police need to be armed there will be police shootings.

MrHMSH · Sat Jun 11, 2016 2:46 pm

Quoting mham001 (Reply 54):
Related however, the Brits drink themselves to death at a crazy rate, far, far more than our gun murders, 14.2 per 100,000 in 2014. More than our alcohol and gun murders combined.

And? People die in a multitude of ways. If you'd like to discuss British alcohol related-deaths, then start a thread on it, although the response you'll get is fairly simple: British people choose to drink themselves to death, whereas gun homicide victims don't. This is about guns.

Aesma · Sat Jun 11, 2016 3:22 pm

Quoting hivue (Reply 3):
Yeah. It's a problem for us -- a lot like rampant football hooliganism in Britain. (Oh, oops... is that a stereotype?)

The difference is the UK (and Europe in general) actually did something about hooliganism.

Quoting FlyingSicilian (Reply 42):
Statistics, a last bastion for a weak argument.

While early, initial reports are this case was one of a person being threatening and harming others. the fact it was near an airport seems somewhat irrelevant.

Well you tell us you own a gun (handgun ?) and your neighbor too, but is that in Sicily ? My family is in Tuscany and Piedmont and they don't own guns. Italy has a mafia problem, with numerous gun murders associated, but outside of that, gun violence is limited.

blueflyer · Sat Jun 11, 2016 3:48 pm

Quoting HGL (Reply 56):
While any homicides are unfortunate and it may be preferable to avoid a shooting where possible, it is interesting to see that attention is generally only given when an offender is shot. Rarely do we see comments about law enforcement officers being killed in the line of duty.

The killing of an officer in the line of duty has been "breaking news" for just about as long as local news have existed on television. And then the vigil, and the funeral...

Police brutality, not so much. Not until every cell phone came with a video camera that could record the evidence. Until then the population by and large (and especially the white population that, for better or worse, still control most of the levers of power in the US) had competing versions to choose from, and almost always sided with the police because of the inherent trust we place in people in uniform (trust well placed in the majority of cases I should add).

Now, when a police officer does behave badly, we do have evidence (sometimes) and we do not side with the police version reflexively. I think the pendulum has swung back. Too far as it usually does and it will eventually settle somewhere in the middle.

If you love statistics so much, though, I encourage you to look at the rates at which grand juries issue indictments.

mham001 · Sat Jun 11, 2016 5:10 pm

Quoting MrHMSH (Reply 59):
And? People die in a multitude of ways. If you'd like to discuss British alcohol related-deaths, then start a thread on it, although the response you'll get is fairly simple: British people choose to drink themselves to death, whereas gun homicide victims don't. This is about guns.

Actually, this was about a police incident at an airport.

I didn't make the first US/UK comparison regarding preventable deaths and stereotypes but since it was made, too bad. I know you get defensive because it truly is a soft spot for the constant US gun critic sitting in England.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 60):
The difference is the UK (and Europe in general) actually did something about hooliganism.

When will they do something about their alcoholism?

One thing missed about gun murders, it generally doesn't cost society years of misery before it happens. Such as hooliganism.

mham001 · Sat Jun 11, 2016 8:57 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 60):
The difference is the UK (and Europe in general) actually did something about hooliganism.

But have they?

In today's news,

Soccer Fans Riot for 3rd Straight Day in France

MARSEILLE, France — England fans rioted Saturday at the Old Port in Marseille and the police used tear gas for a third straight day in an effort to disperse rowdy crowds hours before England was scheduled to play Russia in the European Championships.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/12/sp...s/soccer/euro-2016-riots.html?_r=0

MrHMSH · Sat Jun 11, 2016 10:07 pm

Quoting mham001 (Reply 62):
Actually, this was about a police incident at an airport.

It's still relevant. It doesn't take much for these to go nasty.

Quoting mham001 (Reply 62):
I didn't make the first US/UK comparison regarding preventable deaths and stereotypes but since it was made, too bad. I know you get defensive because it truly is a soft spot for the constant US gun critic sitting in England.

It's like me accusing you of having bad breath and you respond by telling me my farts stink.

Quoting mham001 (Reply 62):
One thing missed about gun murders, it generally doesn't cost society years of misery before it happens. Such as hooliganism.

'Gun murders don't cost society years of misery, but hooliganism does'. I could have sworn 10,000 deaths would be worse for a society than hooliganism.

Quoting mham001 (Reply 63):
But have they?

We haven't had any major stadium incidents since Hillsborough, after which all English league stadiums were made into all-seaters, and the authorities are better prepared.

So yes, they have. This is probably the worst incident for a while and it's not in the same league as gun deaths.

Aesma · Sat Jun 11, 2016 10:13 pm

Plenty hooligans are stuck in the UK as they have to report to a police station every day. 180 cops from around Europe are in France to help authorities identify hooligans. Bans from stadiums are very common.

MaverickM11 · Sat Jun 11, 2016 10:48 pm

Quoting mham001 (Reply 63):
But have they?

Oh are we equating guns to hooligans now? Wow that's a pointless stretch.

Quoting MrHMSH (Reply 64):
It's like me accusing you of having bad breath and you respond by telling me my farts stink.

We can never talk about guns because 'something bad is also happening' plus you're a foreigner! How dare you talk about the United States!

[Edited 2016-06-11 15:49:38]

mham001 · Sat Jun 11, 2016 11:54 pm

Quoting MrHMSH (Reply 64):
It's still relevant. It doesn't take much for these to go nasty.

Police shootings would be the subject here, if you were the Subject Police. But you're not.

Quoting MrHMSH (Reply 64):
It's like me accusing you of having bad breath and you respond by telling me my farts stink.

Then you need to take that up with whomever made the initial comment above. And all those who responded. Somebody might mention something about glass houses though.

Quoting MrHMSH (Reply 64):
'Gun murders don't cost society years of misery, but hooliganism does'. I could have sworn 10,000 deaths would be worse for a society than hooliganism.

I did not say that.

English alcoholism however, is worse for society than US gun murders. Just ask the French today. The picture above tells it all.

Aesma · Sat Jun 11, 2016 11:58 pm

In France if police kills someone we hear about it for months or years. Sometimes police didn't even cause the death directly (like the teens who died in an electric transformer in 2005) and we still talk about it (including a trial) ten years later.

MrHMSH · Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:06 am

Quoting mham001 (Reply 67):
Police shootings would be the subject here, if you were the Subject Police. But you're not.

Still relevant.

Quoting mham001 (Reply 67):
Then you need to take that up with whomever made the initial comment above. And all those who responded. Somebody might mention something about glass houses though.

Our house doesn't have bullet holes in it.

Quoting mham001 (Reply 67):
I did not say that.

What's this then:

Quoting mham001 (Reply 67):
English alcoholism however, is worse for society than US gun murders. Just ask the French today. The picture above tells it all.

If you asked the French whether they'd rather deal with some hooligans or mass shootings I suspect they'd take the hooligans. A few injuries and a mess to clear up is much better than deaths and corpses to clear up. I'm sorry, but it's not even remotely on the same planet as gun murders. Hooliganism is for football tournaments, death is for life.

And also, not caused by alcoholism. The English fans sung some unpleasant songs, then some ultras came up and attacked and they overreacted back.

mham001 · Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:28 am

Quoting MrHMSH (Reply 69):
What's this then:

I think tyou are referring to this line?

Quoting mham001 (Reply 62):
One thing missed about gun murders, it generally doesn't cost society years of misery before it happens. Such as hooliganism.

Which says, (or I meant it to say) that hooliganism is part of the misery that society at-large must pay for rampant British alcoholism. Those hooligans will likely die from alcohol and become the statistic, but how many more years of suffering by society before it happens? Far, far more damage than created by your typical gangbanger gun murder. The misery and suffering created within society while an alcoholic slowly drinks himself to death is incalculable. When will you English do something about that?

Quoting MrHMSH (Reply 69):
And also, not caused by alcoholism. The English fans sung some unpleasant songs, then some ultras came up and attacked and they overreacted back.

Clearly fueled by alcohol, unless that picture was photoshopped? Heineken seemed to be the fuel of choice last night.

MaverickM11 · Sun Jun 12, 2016 1:04 am

Quoting mham001 (Reply 70):
Far, far more damage than created by your typical gangbanger gun murder.

You got a citation to back that up or are you just throwing stuff against the wall and hoping something sticks?

Quoting mham001 (Reply 70):
The misery and suffering created within society while an alcoholic slowly drinks himself to death is incalculable. When will you English do something about that?

Maybe they could take a page from the NRA, ignore the problem, and provide everyone with a pulse with easier access to alcohol? Oh and make sure the government can't spend a dime studying the problem, cuz obviously there's no problem to study.

Quoting MrHMSH (Reply 69):
A few injuries and a mess to clear up is much better than deaths and corpses to clear up. I'm sorry, but it's not even remotely on the same planet as gun murders.

One of the more bizarre connections but it's a lot easier pointing at something else than ever solving a problem.

PlanesNTrains · Sun Jun 12, 2016 3:16 am

Quoting smokeybandit (Reply 8):

Video here. There is no graphic content. I'm amazed at the bystanders. If someone's shooting a gun, I'm not hanging around

The one guy keeps fiddling with his luggage. The lady just stands next to her car and watches. It's like "Uh, are you ready to clue in yet?" lol

Quoting WesternDC6B (Reply 47):
Not like peaceful, safe Malmö.

Ya, and if you ever find all my daughter's wordly possessions that were stolen from her while passing through there, please let us know.

Quoting mham001 (Reply 54):
the Brits drink themselves to death at a crazy rate

Wouldn't you?

Quoting MrHMSH (Reply 59):
whereas gun homicide victims don't. This is about guns.

Apparently, this guy did. Shouting "Shoot me!" would seem to indicate that.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 60):
Italy has a mafia problem, with numerous gun murders associated, but outside of that, gun violence is limited.

The US has a drug/gang problem. So?

-Dave

mham001 · Sun Jun 12, 2016 3:29 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 71):
You got a citation to back that up or are you just throwing stuff against the wall and hoping something sticks?

Why would I do that when you said the last time that the website (Catholic Charities) is a fabrication because it contradicted your own (source-less) claims? I can easily point you to the UK Office of National Statistics and the FBI, but they won't say what you want them to say and you'll claim its all a big lie......

No time for that.

Thunderboltdrgn · Sun Jun 12, 2016 8:20 am

The past days there have been several new shootings.

A few days ago music artist Christina Grimmie was gunned down while signing autographs after a performance
at a concert venuel in Florida. Then the past night there have been a mass shooting at a bar in Orlando.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/12/us...e-dies-in-shooting-at-concert.html
http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/...traveled-orlando/story?id=39780792

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2...do-shooting-nightclub-pulse-gunman
http://abcnews.go.com/US/multiple-in...nightclub-police/story?id=39789552

[Edited 2016-06-12 01:21:25]

SOBHI51 · Sun Jun 12, 2016 8:49 am

Quoting thunderboltdrgn (Reply 74):
Then the past night there have been a mass shooting at a bar in Orlando.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/12/us/orlando-nightclub-shooting/index.html
Pulse describes itself as "the hottest gay bar" in the heart of Orlando.

Could this be a reason for the shooting?

solnabo · Sun Jun 12, 2016 11:47 am

Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 75):
Could this be a reason for the shooting?

A homophobic Trump fan I guess

MaverickM11 · Sun Jun 12, 2016 2:18 pm

Quoting mham001 (Reply 73):
Why would I do that when you said the last time that the website (Catholic Charities) is a fabrication because it contradicted your own (source-less) claims?

You still have your panties in a bunch because I called a shady organization shady? I trust the Clinton Foundation long before the Catholic church to do anything positive. Even the catholic church down the street has had two priests recently go to jail in the last few years.

Quoting mham001 (Reply 73):
I can easily point you to the UK Office of National Statistics and the FBI, but they won't say what you want them to say and you'll claim its all a big lie......

I guarantee they won't say what you're trying to say, because it doesn't even pass the sniff test.

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