AAPilot wrote:

Rotherham voted to leave. Not surprising guess they are tired of the muslim rape gangs.

The British rape gangs that have absolutely nothing to do with the EU?

Francoflier wrote:

Looks like the UK's out.

I wish them luck. They'll need it...

We will. The £ is already down at levels not seen since 1985. From $1.50 to $1.35 in six hours. FTSE expected to drop about 8%. But it's not just us, the € is way down as well, almost at parity with the $.

AAPilot wrote:

You need to make Farage your next PM.

You cannot be serious. He's not even an MP.

AAPilot wrote:

Make the UK great again.

Yeah, because that's a trivial task. Pound crashed, FTSE crashing. Yay, things are so great.

Freefall. Mmm.. let's wait and see what happens over the next 72 hours, and into the next week and follows..

Keyword: Democracy. Voter turnout was very high.

VapourTrails wrote:

Freefall. Mmm.. let's wait and see what happens over the next 72 hours, and into the next week and follows..

Keyword: Democracy. Voter turnout was very high.

I agree, a free Democratic Vote by the people who have a vested interest in their destiny.

Wow, that's a bit of a surprise.

Politically I'm happy as I think the UK has been hampering the EU's progress.

Financially it looks like it will be a disaster, potentially for the whole planet.

I'm devastated! As a Scot living in France, I hope that there's another referendum on Scottish independence. If not, if, after almost 7 years of working as a civil servant here, paying taxes, doing my job, are you Bexiteers going to compensate me if I get deported? If I have no job in the UK, are you going to pay me my unemployment insurance? Will my 7 years of pensions contributions be honoured? What are you going to do with all the pensioners who live in Spain and in the Dordogne? My papers for French nationality are going to be posted on Monday, now, I have no country, I'm proud of Scotland but entirely ashamed of the name printed in my passport.

Well, Brexit has passed. When will the official leave take place? Will it happen all at once like Hong Kong, or in phases?

Scotland and N. Ireland voted each to stay. Scotland had their UK secession vote a couple years ago with a vote to stay in the UK. With the UK leaving the EU, would the Scots have another secession vote to leave the UK and join the EU as an independent nation?

In the case of Northern Ireland, would/could they also have a vote to leave the UK and turn around to join the EU? Or even reunite with the Republic of Ireland, seeing as they have immense ties, and will now have a border to patrol?

Oh, wow.

The latest polls before opening of the polling stations said that the UK would remain, with about 52-54% of the votes saying so. But there's a well-known effect in opinion polls - people have a tendency to respond in a way which is "societally acceptable". So you can detract a few percent points from these 52-54%, which made the Leave perfectly possible, but not certain.

For Switzerland, this will have very dire consequences. We need all the benefits of a EU membership, but we're not willing to join the EU. So we had to sign a series of treaties. Now the UK needs such a special treatment too, making the EU diplomats really busy. Switzerland will not find an open ear in Brussels for years to come.

We better join the EU now.


David

TWA772LR wrote:

Well, Brexit has passed. When will the official leave take place? Will it happen all at once like Hong Kong, or in phases?

The leave begins when the UK government invokes article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. It stipulates that the secession from the EU must be finalized two years later. Of course they will settle on certain grace periods - about 13% of the UK laws are stipulated by EU laws, and to replace or amend them it will take some time.


David

WarRI1 wrote:

Keyword: Democracy. Voter turnout was very high.

I agree, a free Democratic Vote by the people who have a vested interest in their destiny.

Well, if the demographics of the vote are anything like the polls before, the pro Brexit crowd will have lost the lead before they are out, simply because many of the "leave" voters will have died.
It's a wonderful example of old people imposing their will on the young folks. Only there is no election in two, four or five years to correct it.

But it is a great experiment to see of in or out is better.
It is probably all turning out to be a lie, I would be very surprised if the vote in the end was more than the decision to give up any say in the EU, but the rest remains the same. Just like for Norway or Switzerland.

Best regards
Thomas

scbriml wrote:

AAPilot wrote:

Rotherham voted to leave. Not surprising guess they are tired of the muslim rape gangs.

The British rape gangs that have absolutely nothing to do with the EU?

Francoflier wrote:

Looks like the UK's out.

I wish them luck. They'll need it...

We will. The £ is already down at levels not seen since 1985. From $1.50 to $1.35 in six hours. FTSE expected to drop about 8%. But it's not just us, the € is way down as well, almost at parity with the $.

AAPilot wrote:

You need to make Farage your next PM.

You cannot be serious. He's not even an MP.

AAPilot wrote:

Make the UK great again.

Yeah, because that's a trivial task. Pound crashed, FTSE crashing. Yay, things are so great.

Pound crashing was entirely predictable given the volatility. Come back in a week and it will be back to normal levels.

flyingturtle wrote:

TWA772LR wrote:

Well, Brexit has passed. When will the official leave take place? Will it happen all at once like Hong Kong, or in phases?

Scotland and N. Ireland voted each to stay. Scotland had their UK secession vote a couple years ago with a vote to stay in the UK. With the UK leaving the EU, would the Scots have another secession vote to leave the UK and join the EU as an independent nation?

The leave begins when the UK government invokes article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. It stipulates that the secession from the EU must be finalized two years later. Of course they will settle on certain grace periods - about 13% of the UK laws are stipulated by EU laws, and to replace or amend them it will take some time.

David

There is no need to replace any laws, the EU doesn't mind ! In fact countries that are far from being EU members adopt some of EU's laws, even its currency !

Now about article 50, I've seen predicted that the government wouldn't invoke it right away, we shall see. It might wait until there is another government.

One thing is for sure, the day the UK stops paying into the pot is the day access to the free market is rescinded.

RobK wrote:

Pound crashing was entirely predictable given the volatility. Come back in a week and it will be back to normal levels.

Nah.. the Pound will be on a roller coaster until the time when the leave agreement is signed.
Until then no one knows how much access they will have to European markets and without that there can't be a stable exchange rate.
I wouldn't be surprised if the waiting time kills off a bank or two.

Best regards
Thomas

DNDTUF wrote:

I'm devastated! As a Scot living in France, I hope that there's another referendum on Scottish independence. If not, if, after almost 7 years of working as a civil servant here, paying taxes, doing my job, are you Bexiteers going to compensate me if I get deported? If I have no job in the UK, are you going to pay me my unemployment insurance? Will my 7 years of pensions contributions be honoured? What are you going to do with all the pensioners who live in Spain and in the Dordogne? My papers for French nationality are going to be posted on Monday, now, I have no country, I'm proud of Scotland but entirely ashamed of the name printed in my passport.

I would bet my house on you being an independent country within 5 years, so I wouldn't be too worried.

zckls04 wrote:

DNDTUF wrote:

I would bet my house on you being an independent country within 5 years, so I wouldn't be too worried.

I am very interested to see what happens in Ireland (too).

What I find very bizarre is the following:

I would assume most of the people that campaigned for the UK leaving the European Union, to regain independence and sovereignty in their eyes ("even with economic costs", as some said), are the same ones who will in a couple of years try to persuade the Scots that they should not exercise the same aspirations as the English and Welsh just have exercised. In fact, they will trot out the economic card, saying that economic safety is more important than the moral principle of sovereignty. How would any person not take that as an insult to their intelligence I am not sure, especially since at the time those same individuals will likely still be negotiating the details of the UK leaving the EU, all while trying to convince Scotland not to leave the UK! That's just completely daft and untenable as a position.

A great triumph of tribalism and ignorance over social progress.

This is almost as stupid a result as Trump being elected president and maybe even worse than Clinton being elected president

Vive la idiocracy!

On the plus side there are more French living and working in the UK than Brits in France so it will be interesting to watch the tit-for-tat battle over regulation of foreign workers.

Well, the natural result is that Nigel Farange and his ilk can no longer blame the EU or immigrants when the English economy crashes, the government runs massive deficits, and the infrastructure generally collapses.

HAHAHAHA!!! Who am I kidding? Of course he'll continue to blame the EU and immigrants for all of England's woes even 20 years into the future if he's still around.

Aesma wrote:

Politically I'm happy as I think the UK has been hampering the EU's progress.

Now we've voted to leave, you think the EU will flourish?

There will be more countries queuing up to leave. Depending the the result of the election next year, that could include France!

DNDTUF wrote:

I'm devastated! As a Scot living in France, I hope that there's another referendum on Scottish independence. If not, if, after almost 7 years of working as a civil servant here, paying taxes, doing my job, are you Bexiteers going to compensate me if I get deported? If I have no job in the UK, are you going to pay me my unemployment insurance? Will my 7 years of pensions contributions be honoured? What are you going to do with all the pensioners who live in Spain and in the Dordogne? My papers for French nationality are going to be posted on Monday, now, I have no country, I'm proud of Scotland but entirely ashamed of the name printed in my passport.

Well needless to say Queen Nicola of Scotlandia is already calling for another independence referendum. But I would suggest you take things a little more carefully. Nothing is going to happen for at least two years.

Congrats on leaving the EU. And now kiss Cameron goodbye

Congrats UK! This will be interesting.

Most interesting to me is that London voted 60/40 to stay.

As in the USA, the divide between urban enclaves (left) and everywhere else (right) are becoming fault lines in policy debate. Clinton will carry every US city bigger than 0,5 million just as LEAVE carried the non-London English shires.



Pu.

Forget gold ... my money is going into popcorn manufacturers

The next few years are going to be a very interesting time in both the UK and the EU.

scbriml wrote:

There will be more countries queuing up to leave. Depending the the result of the election next year, that could include France!

Nah, they will all sit tight and watch how it Britain fares with that decision. If they fare well, you may very well be right. If Britain gets effectively just "reduced" to the Status "Pay in full, adopt all the rules, have pretty much no say" like Norway or Switzerland, they won´t. And won´t for a very long time to come.

Ridiculous if Europe realizes WInston Churchils dream of a united Europe with Britain on the sidelines. Its almost more ridiculous that the people most scared of Germany being the Hegemon in Europe, just pushed Germany a good deal along exactly that way . .....

best regards
Thomas

pu wrote:

Most interesting to me is that London voted 60/40 to stay.

As in the USA, the divide between urban enclaves (left) and everywhere else (right) are becoming fault lines in policy debate. Clinton will carry every US city bigger than 0,5 million just as LEAVE carried the non-London English shires.

It's not a matter of left vs right. There's plenty of urban right in the form of business owners, financial/services industries, etc. that know they will be hit by a Brexit.

In any case London is stuck with the UK, to me it's more interesting what will happen with Scotland and maybe NI as well.

Already the far right wng parties in the Netherlands and France are calling for their own votes.

This is where the movement in Britain started (arguably). The right wing of the Tories and new party UKIP started the calls that eventually led to this referendum taking place. If people like Wilders and Le Pen take up this as a campaign focus point it could indeed start becoming inevitable that votes take place. Some 54% of the Dutch people stated in an opinion poll that they too would like to vote on EU membership.

I was going to do some short trading but it's not allowed due to the market conditions.

Then I tried buying bear trackers but they're already through the roof !

scbriml wrote:

Aesma wrote:

Politically I'm happy as I think the UK has been hampering the EU's progress.

Now we've voted to leave, you think the EU will flourish?

There will be more countries queuing up to leave. Depending the the result of the election next year, that could include France!

Several of the things French people don't like about the EU are what the UK likes, like an unfettered free market, no social security as part of it, no right to choose a French company over an EU one, etc.

scbriml wrote:

Well needless to say Queen Nicola of Scotlandia is already calling for another independence referendum. But I would suggest you take things a little more carefully. Nothing is going to happen for at least two years.

Of course things will happen right away. Every company in the UK that was considering investment in the EU, and every EU company that was considering investment in the UK, will put everything on hold.

Channex757 wrote:

Already the far right wng parties in the Netherlands and France are calling for their own votes.

This is where the movement in Britain started (arguably). The right wing of the Tories and new party UKIP started the calls that eventually led to this referendum taking place. If people like Wilders and Le Pen take up this as a campaign focus point it could indeed start becoming inevitable that votes take place. Some 54% of the Dutch people stated in an opinion poll that they too would like to vote on EU membership.

But nobody in the right of government in France would be crazy enough to do a referendum. And they don't need to.

The only way a referendum can happen is if Marine Le Pen is elected president, and if that happens, all bets are off anyway.

He's gone.

DLFREEBIRD wrote:

He's gone.

My prediction of he will be gone by Christmas. Yes. Who will be the next PM?

Aesma wrote:

But nobody in the right of government in France would be crazy enough to do a referendum. And they don't need to.

The only way a referendum can happen is if Marine Le Pen is elected president, and if that happens, all bets are off anyway.

All bets are off in Britain too. This result wasn't part of the 'plan' after all. Even last night polls were indicating a win for Remain.

There is a scenario that could be constructed where the hard Right does in France and other nations what UKIP have done in Britain, and then ally with elements in mainstream Conservative parties. More calls for votes are coming out now as the day develops too, from other nations.

The next big question is Scotland and Northern Ireland. Scotland in particular doesn't want to leave the EU. How soon and how powerfully can the SNP and parties in NI get their voice heard to demand independence votes? The circumstances of the last Scottish vote no longer apply. Wales however voted to Leave.

Disaster.

Simple as that. The EU might collapse within 5-10 years now. I think the EU had become too big, but it should have been reformed instead of countries opting out.

I can hear Putin laughing in the background.

VOTE, n. The instrument and symbol of a freeman's power to make a fool of himself and a wreck of his country - Ambrose Bierce

Congratulations, democracy.

I changed my mind.
I hope now that Scotland and North Ireland will quit The UK. They deserve to stay in the EU.

It appears that the first "hard" result of Brexit will be Britain losing its S&P AAA rating.

best regards
Thomas

sebolino wrote:

I changed my mind.
I hope now that Scotland and North Ireland will quit The UK. They deserve to stay in the EU.

Could be right....might get London thrown in as well.




Pu.


(my first successful image used in new forum regime)

What I don't get is the massive vote to leave in Wales seeing that they're a net gainer by all accounts of EU funding.

Then again from all the lies that have been peddled I'm not really surprised.

I think a lot of the brexit supporters in my office for example are going to be shocked that if we do have an EEA type arrangement then there will still be free movement of people.

2 things saddened me today

a) A guy in the office shouting that we can now 'send them all back' and then turning to the German girls sitting next to him an saying 'Erm not you off course'

b) Someone I know who has moved to Europe and only speaks English and has no intention of learning the local language whinging how she can't stand people speaking foreign on the bus, foreigners kids taking school places, etc as being her reason for voting out

Farage has shown himself to be a thoroughly disgusting individual with his "We won it without a shot being fired" comment and then taking back his NHS 'promise'

Very disappointed but not particularly surprised.. We were fed a constant barrage of lies and distortions and when you have that vs rational economic and social reasons for remaining, fear and hatred was always going to win out.

I do sincerely hope that Scotland get another chance at a referendum.. This is the 'material change' the SNP can claim for another referendum.

vrbarreto wrote:

2 things saddened me today

a) A guy in the office shouting that we can now 'send them all back' and then turning to the German girls sitting next to him an saying 'Erm not you off course'

b) Someone I know who has moved to Europe and only speaks English and has no intention of learning the local language whinging how she can't stand people speaking foreign on the bus, foreigners kids taking school places, etc as being her reason for voting out

Very saddening indeed.
Unfortunately, you'll always get these kind of over-simplistic (and dumb) emotional reactions. And it's because the Euroskeptics are opposing the feeling to be part of a nation to the membership of the EU. Far right and populist Lepen family is doing exactly the same in France for years.
It looks like they won this time.
I may be wrong of course, but I fear many "Leave" voters will dearly regret their vote in a few months/years.

On the other hand, it's maybe a chance for the EU to keep clear members that are fully engaged in the union.
UK was always kind of "in but not too much".

I wonder who will win the elections now?

Oh what a beautiful thing to wake up into a day where Brexit is not a dream but a reality, I had already lost hope after some inaccurate polls. And it's midsummer here, so I will have plenty of drunkard company to celebrate with!

Yet again the boomers get what stupid racist or ill-informed idiocy they want and pull up the ladder on everyone else.

Just die off already.

tommy1808 wrote:

Nah, they will all sit tight and watch how it Britain fares with that decision. If they fare well, you may very well be right. If Britain gets effectively just "reduced" to the Status "Pay in full, adopt all the rules, have pretty much no say" like Norway or Switzerland, they won´t. And won´t for a very long time to come.

For starters, this just serves as fuel to nationalist movements within the countries to elect politicians that want to take their countries out of the EU. The UK bit the bullet and was the first to try. There are countries that benefit from joining the EU, but others are becoming exasperated. Finland, for example, was very vocal regarding bailouts for Greece so if there's a nationalist movement elected there I wouldn't be surprised if it opted to follow Norway's example as well.

But then, if the UK wished to exit the EU, why would it try to join the single market? It would mean having to follow EU laws (with some exceptions) while not having a say. And that would also mean paying into the EU for the right to access the market. Dumb move if you ask me.

tommy1808 wrote:

It appears that the first "hard" result of Brexit will be Britain losing its S&P AAA rating.

I think the UK already lost its AAA status long ago, with all 3 major rating agencies.

coolian2 wrote:

Yet again the boomers get what stupid racist or ill-informed idiocy they want and pull up the ladder on everyone else.

Just die off already.

If you don't like it move to some fairytaleland. I would recommend Sweden, a real multicultural paradise.

pvjin wrote:

coolian2 wrote:

Yet again the boomers get what stupid racist or ill-informed idiocy they want and pull up the ladder on everyone else.

Just die off already.

If you don't like it move to some fairytaleland. I would recommend Sweden, a real multicultural paradise.

He is welcome here. Just like the many highly educated Finns that are moving here now, because of the bad Finnish economy. We just hired a Finnish software developer. Really good guy!

Anyway, if the UK can continue to have good trade relationships with Europe I think they will be fine. But if the EU decides to punish them for the Brexit things will get bad soon.

If you want to have good relations, it only works if both gain something from it. The problem is that Brexit supporters promised to protect British industries and jobs by keeping out EU competition and EU workers. If you do this, I do not see the benefit for the EU. If you do not do this, I fail to see the point of leaving the EU.

AAPilot wrote:

You need to make Farage your next PM.

You cannot be serious. He's not even an MP.

The British constitution allows for a person who is no an elected MP to serve as Prime Minister. As crazy as that sounds.

Bad move by Britain. Now they have to deal with a new Scottish referendum, I think.

UK aerospace will take a big hit, according to analysts.

planewasted wrote:

pvjin wrote:

coolian2 wrote:

Yet again the boomers get what stupid racist or ill-informed idiocy they want and pull up the ladder on everyone else.

Just die off already.

If you don't like it move to some fairytaleland. I would recommend Sweden, a real multicultural paradise.

He is welcome here. Just like the many highly educated Finns that are moving here now, because of the bad Finnish economy. We just hired a Finnish software developer. Really good guy!

Yep, you swedes did the right decision when you decided to stay out of the euro. Now without our own currency we can't devalue, and that's what strangles our economy more than anything. Add EU's Anti-Russian sanctions on top of that and no wonder why the economy sucks so bad. EU and euro are literally destroying the future of this country's youth.

Well, the UK did not disappoint, I wish you guys well

The status quo has been dismissed and a new path, perhaps a better path for all, will emerge.

(ps. I hate the new emoticons in this new forum layout)