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mham001
Posts: 5745
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:52 am

Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 9:34 pm

PacificBeach88 wrote:
BMI727 wrote:
Please find an example of conservatives attempting to set up "safe spaces" to avoid opinions they don't like. I'm not saying it's never happened, but I've never heard of it.


Breitbart.com, RedStates.com (who made you sign a Republican party pledge before joining), every Evangelical Church ever, 9 out of 10 country clubs, gated community galas, Bob Jones University, Liberty University, 4 out of 5 dentist's offices, 85% or more of corporate boardrooms w/ anti-investor clauses, any Mormon or Jehovah's Witness church, the no-homo allowed Boy Scouts for nearly 100 years, Kim Davis' clerk of court offices, employees of Hobby Lobby that may need reproductive services, any Catholic who may need birth control, airport bathrooms for Republican Congressmen who have "wide stances".....shall I go on?


No please don't, you look foolish.

And you really should not mention gays in the Boy Scouts, being that gays in the Boy Scouts were solely responsible for mass child-rape for years.
 
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PacificBeach88
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 9:44 pm

seb146 wrote:
For quite a few years, the party of "small government" has been anything but. The party of "small government" has tried like everything to legislate everything they possibly can. Who can sign what contracts, who can worship whom, what language to speak, what media to follow, what opinions to have....

And we do not give a damn what consenting adults do between each other are called "brownshirts" Go figure...


This is the only way the Republican party will be able to win national elections again. If they unite with the Libertarian aspects of the party, with the small government side, and truly be about a smaller, more free, less prison focused party. A socially liberal / economically conservative party like Ike was.

I've written the Hillary campaign, and I expect her to know better than anyone that she needs to fill EVERY open judicial opening within her first 180 days in office. This is something most new Presidents don't understand. Having a judiciary that leans more in your direction is critical in your 3rd, 5th, or 7th years in office. Especially, if the Senate looks to flip to Democratic control as predicted. Looks like Dems will control 52+ seats come January. Given Harry Reid's "nuclear option", all of those openings except for SCOTUS can be filled by simple majority vote. There are 91 openings that only need a 50 vote + the VP as tie breaker, with 1 SCOTUS nomination that needs 60.
 
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PacificBeach88
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 9:51 pm

mham001 wrote:
No please don't, you look foolish.

And you really should not mention gays in the Boy Scouts, being that gays in the Boy Scouts were solely responsible for mass child-rape for years.


You ignored my point. Why aren't those considered "safe spaces"? You can't can you? The whole idea of "safe spaces" is to only surround yourself with like minded people. Tell me that isn't the Republican party these days, or at least up until Trump stole your party. Remember the 2012 Presidential Republican debates? Do you need links? Or will you still try to deflect and run away like a scared child?

And you're going to make gay people responsible for "child rape" instead of all of the so-called "straight" people who were / are pedophiles. If you don't understand the difference between a married man, with children, who rapes other children be they girls or boys, then you really have no business posting on this site.
Last edited by PacificBeach88 on Sat Aug 27, 2016 10:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18742
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 10:20 pm

mham001 wrote:

And you really should not mention gays in the Boy Scouts, being that gays in the Boy Scouts were solely responsible for mass child-rape for years.

You spelled Catholic Church wrong, for whom pedophilia and playing three card monte with child molesters must be a religious rite at this point. You got a citation for "mass child rape" or are you just fantasizing?
 
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PacificBeach88
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 10:23 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
You spelled Catholic Church wrong, for whom pedophilia and playing three card monte with child molesters must be a religious rite at this point. You got a citation for "mass child rape" or are you just fantasizing?


Yes!

It never ceases to amaze me that so many of the religions / organizations that spewed hate and intolerance towards gay people were the very same institutions where children were most likely to be harmed. Sick. How many "gay pride parades" had child rape charges filed against them vs. the Catholic Church or other evangelical church?
 
mham001
Posts: 5745
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:52 am

Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 10:31 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
mham001 wrote:

And you really should not mention gays in the Boy Scouts, being that gays in the Boy Scouts were solely responsible for mass child-rape for years.

You spelled Catholic Church wrong, for whom pedophilia and playing three card monte with child molesters must be a religious rite at this point. You got a citation for "mass child rape" or are you just fantasizing?


Are you going to deny that thousands of boys were raped in the Boy Scouts? Sure, I could mention the Catholic Church too but why would you bring it up when it was predominantly gay men raping boys there too.
Last edited by mham001 on Sat Aug 27, 2016 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
mham001
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 10:33 pm

PacificBeach88 wrote:

And you're going to make gay people responsible for "child rape" instead of all of the so-called "straight" people who were / are pedophiles. If you don't understand the difference between a married man, with children, who rapes other children be they girls or boys, then you really have no business posting on this site.


I highly recommend you investigate the difference between child molesting and pedophilia. Also look into which groups prefer to do what to whom.
 
MaverickM11
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 10:35 pm

mham001 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
mham001 wrote:

And you really should not mention gays in the Boy Scouts, being that gays in the Boy Scouts were solely responsible for mass child-rape for years.

You spelled Catholic Church wrong, for whom pedophilia and playing three card monte with child molesters must be a religious rite at this point. You got a citation for "mass child rape" or are you just fantasizing?


Are you going to deny that thousands of boys were raped in the Boy Scouts? Sure, I could mention the Catholic Church too but why would you bring it up when it was predominantly gay men raping boys there too.

Citation. Now.
 
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PacificBeach88
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 10:40 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
Citation. Now.


THIS! This is 2016, not 1956. Mham, are you really going to try to hide behind the fact that child abusers / sexual predators have their very own grouping? They aren't gay. They aren't straight. They are pedophiles! What really gets their rocks off are kids! No men, not women....KIDS!
 
MaverickM11
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:33 pm

PacificBeach88 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
You spelled Catholic Church wrong, for whom pedophilia and playing three card monte with child molesters must be a religious rite at this point. You got a citation for "mass child rape" or are you just fantasizing?


Yes!

It never ceases to amaze me that so many of the religions / organizations that spewed hate and intolerance towards gay people were the very same institutions where children were most likely to be harmed. Sick. How many "gay pride parades" had child rape charges filed against them vs. the Catholic Church or other evangelical church?

Well the whole point of the Christian Right is to proclaim to be saved by a poor, brown, middle eastern socialist so that you have full authority to be as ugly as humanly possible to all poor, brown, middle easterners, and socialists. Glory! Can you imagine if the Catholic Church was held to the same standards as the Clintons? The entire organization would be in jail.
 
mham001
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:48 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
Citation. Now.


Exactly what is it that you are pretending not to know? That thousands of boys were molested in the Boy Scouts? Or that the Catholic Church was/is heavily infiltrated by gay men?

PacificBeach88 wrote:
THIS! This is 2016, not 1956. Mham, are you really going to try to hide behind the fact that child abusers / sexual predators have their very own grouping? They aren't gay. They aren't straight. They are pedophiles! What really gets their rocks off are kids! No men, not women....KIDS!


That is factually incorrect. If you do not understand the psychological differences between child molesters and pedophiles, and their tendencies, then I'm not going to bother.

It always amazes me however that gays would bring up the Boy Scouts and the Catholic Church as persecutors of homosexuals while the real victims are forgotten. Revisionism at its finest.

MaverickM11 wrote:
Can you imagine if the Catholic Church was held to the same standards as the Clintons? The entire organization would be in jail.


As they should be.
 
MaverickM11
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:00 am

mham001 wrote:
Exactly what is it that you are pretending not to know? That thousands of boys were molested in the Boy Scouts? Or that the Catholic Church was/is heavily infiltrated by gay men?

Great. So then it should be no problem providing a source for your claims.
 
 
mham001
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:41 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
mham001 wrote:
Exactly what is it that you are pretending not to know? That thousands of boys were molested in the Boy Scouts? Or that the Catholic Church was/is heavily infiltrated by gay men?

Great. So then it should be no problem providing a source for your claims.


I am surprised you want to go there. There is no good news for those who choose to claim blissful ignorance. But let me Google 'boy scout molestation victims' for you. Oh, first page is FULL of hits....

Since the 1920s, the BSA has maintained a highly confidential set of "ineligible volunteer" files, nicknamed the "perversion files".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boy_Scout ... te_note-21

Interestingly, a similar search 'girl scout molestation victims' produces exactly one relevant hit - for a lawyer.

Anyway, back to your education of fairly-current events....

Vatican City, Jan 13, 2016 / 04:13 pm (CNA/EWTN News).- The influential Cardinal Oscar Maradiaga has acknowledged the presence of a “gay lobby” in the Vatican. In a new interview, he says that Pope Francis has adopted a gradual approach to address it – and that Catholic teaching won’t change.

The Honduran newspaper El Heraldo asked the cardinal whether there actually was an attempted or successful “infiltration of the gay community in the Vatican.”

Cardinal Maradiaga responded: “Not only that, also the Pope said: there was even a ‘lobby’ in this sense.”

“Little by little the Pope is trying to purify it,” he continued. “One can understand them, and there is pastoral legislation to attend to them, but what is wrong cannot be truth.”


http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/ ... ing-15439/
 
MaverickM11
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:56 am

mham001 wrote:

There is not one mention of "gays" or "homosexuals". Where is the connection you're dreaming up?
mham001 wrote:

Vatican City, Jan 13, 2016 / 04:13 pm (CNA/EWTN News).- The influential Cardinal Oscar Maradiaga has acknowledged the presence of a “gay lobby” in the Vatican. In a new interview, he says that Pope Francis has adopted a gradual approach to address it – and that Catholic teaching won’t change.

The Honduran newspaper El Heraldo asked the cardinal whether there actually was an attempted or successful “infiltration of the gay community in the Vatican.”

Cardinal Maradiaga responded: “Not only that, also the Pope said: there was even a ‘lobby’ in this sense.”

“Little by little the Pope is trying to purify it,” he continued. “One can understand them, and there is pastoral legislation to attend to them, but what is wrong cannot be truth.”


http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/ ... ing-15439/

Of course the catholic church uses gays as a scapegoat--what are you expecting?? Conflating sexuality with predators is a trope the christian right and republicans have been using for decades to denigrate anything that mystified them, whether it was women, or blacks, or natives, or gays, or transgendered, and on and on. I wouldn't expect the catholic church to be honest, moral, or ethical if their life depended on it. But sure let's wander down that path...then what are all the higher ups doing hiding and protecting the pedophiles? Are they gay too? And again, where is the connection between homosexuality and pedophilia? Citation or GTFO.
 
mham001
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 2:47 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
mham001 wrote:

There is not one mention of "gays" or "homosexuals". Where is the connection you're dreaming up?
mham001 wrote:

Vatican City, Jan 13, 2016 / 04:13 pm (CNA/EWTN News).- The influential Cardinal Oscar Maradiaga has acknowledged the presence of a “gay lobby” in the Vatican. In a new interview, he says that Pope Francis has adopted a gradual approach to address it – and that Catholic teaching won’t change.

The Honduran newspaper El Heraldo asked the cardinal whether there actually was an attempted or successful “infiltration of the gay community in the Vatican.”

Cardinal Maradiaga responded: “Not only that, also the Pope said: there was even a ‘lobby’ in this sense.”

“Little by little the Pope is trying to purify it,” he continued. “One can understand them, and there is pastoral legislation to attend to them, but what is wrong cannot be truth.”


http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/ ... ing-15439/

Of course the catholic church uses gays as a scapegoat--what are you expecting?? Conflating sexuality with predators is a trope the christian right and republicans have been using for decades to denigrate anything that mystified them, whether it was women, or blacks, or natives, or gays, or transgendered, and on and on. I wouldn't expect the catholic church to be honest, moral, or ethical if their life depended on it. But sure let's wander down that path...then what are all the higher ups doing hiding and protecting the pedophiles? Are they gay too? And again, where is the connection between homosexuality and pedophilia? Citation or GTFO.


Sorry but I'm not going to "GTFO" of anywhere and if you don't like it, gtfo yourself.

And for the last time, I didn't say anything about "pedophilia". Educate yourself.
 
Hillis
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 3:48 am

Dreadnought wrote:
Get a dozen small and medium sized minorities worked up and angry at everyone else and convince them that the Democrats stand for them, and you build yourself a majority coalition.


Yes, there's no reason for minorities to be worked up and angry about the way their race, creed or way of life have been treated in America? I mean, so their ancestors were slaves; so they had to put up with lynchigs, Jim Crow, segregation; so their ancestors (and some of them still living) were put in prisons in the desert because they looked like an enemy in 1941 (even with their sons dying for this nation in Europe); so their ancestors were virtually wiped off the map by the white man and their reminants put on small, worhless pieces of land; so they are discriminated against because of their sexual orientation, or their color, or their religion/

So what, right? Therein lies the problem with you, Chuck. If it isn't you, you don't really give a damn about the anger they feel, or the distrust they have, be if for whites, police, etc.

You see they have a right to be angry, as many of them have never gotten a fair shake in this nation. Compare that to the current pity-party many whites are having because they're losing their 400-year grip on the political, social and economic dominance in this land, and they don't compare.

Until the white man is enslaved, or slaughtered, or put behind barbed wire because of their color; until they have to put up with things like Jim Crow, or lynchings en masse; until their population is systematically wiped out by a conquering force, I don't want to hear about how bad you have it, and how silly you think it is for minorities, be they racial, religious or sexual, to be upset about anything. Donald Trump is driving people like you based on fear and paranoia of minorities, and you have bought into it. That is the problem, not the anger among minorities.
 
BMI727
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Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 9:29 pm

Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 4:15 am

PacificBeach88 wrote:
This is the only way the Republican party will be able to win national elections again. If they unite with the Libertarian aspects of the party, with the small government side, and truly be about a smaller, more free, less prison focused party.

The difference between Democrats and Libertarians on social matters is that Libertarians believe that "all men" means that and Democrats do not.

PacificBeach88 wrote:
Why aren't those considered "safe spaces"?

Because they aren't specifically set up to exclude and shield people from dissenting opinions. That is the primary purpose of a "safe space." There is a difference between a "safe space" and a meeting of campus Democrats for instance.

PacificBeach88 wrote:
A socially liberal / economically conservative party like Ike was.

There is a lot of revisionist history about the 1950s.

Hillis wrote:
so their ancestors (and some of them still living) were put in prisons in the desert because they looked like an enemy in 1941 (even with their sons dying for this nation in Europe)

Which conservative did that to them?

Hillis wrote:
I don't want to hear about how bad you have it, and how silly you think it is for minorities, be they racial, religious or sexual, to be upset about anything.

A favorite leftist tactic: call everyone a racist and avoid a debate.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18742
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:55 am

mham001 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
mham001 wrote:

There is not one mention of "gays" or "homosexuals". Where is the connection you're dreaming up?
mham001 wrote:

Vatican City, Jan 13, 2016 / 04:13 pm (CNA/EWTN News).- The influential Cardinal Oscar Maradiaga has acknowledged the presence of a “gay lobby” in the Vatican. In a new interview, he says that Pope Francis has adopted a gradual approach to address it – and that Catholic teaching won’t change.

The Honduran newspaper El Heraldo asked the cardinal whether there actually was an attempted or successful “infiltration of the gay community in the Vatican.”

Cardinal Maradiaga responded: “Not only that, also the Pope said: there was even a ‘lobby’ in this sense.”

“Little by little the Pope is trying to purify it,” he continued. “One can understand them, and there is pastoral legislation to attend to them, but what is wrong cannot be truth.”


http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/ ... ing-15439/

Of course the catholic church uses gays as a scapegoat--what are you expecting?? Conflating sexuality with predators is a trope the christian right and republicans have been using for decades to denigrate anything that mystified them, whether it was women, or blacks, or natives, or gays, or transgendered, and on and on. I wouldn't expect the catholic church to be honest, moral, or ethical if their life depended on it. But sure let's wander down that path...then what are all the higher ups doing hiding and protecting the pedophiles? Are they gay too? And again, where is the connection between homosexuality and pedophilia? Citation or GTFO.


Sorry but I'm not going to "GTFO" of anywhere and if you don't like it, gtfo yourself.

And for the last time, I didn't say anything about "pedophilia". Educate yourself.

You're the one that made the claim that it was gays raping children in the Boy Scouts and the Catholic Church, and yet to no one's surprise you can't back it up. Hey if it feels true then that's good enough right? Who cares about whatever collateral damage it does to the accused group--it doesn't affect your lying ass! Now let me guess if you were called a homophobe (which you've made clear you are) for making up vile accusations you can't support, you'll get all bent out of shape and tell me minorities just call republicans names when they can't make their case (which you haven't).
 
MaverickM11
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:09 pm

PacificBeach88 wrote:
You ignored my point. Why aren't those considered "safe spaces"? You can't can you? The whole idea of "safe spaces" is to only surround yourself with like minded people.

Colin Kaepernick is demonstrating how well the right deals with differing viewpoints. Spoilers! It's not very well. And how many more RINO cleanses will the right need until it's uh...a safe space to push their agenda? I'm not even sure what the end game is here? Get rid of every last RINO like a good ole' communist purge until you're neck deep in your own feces and can't win an Alabama mayoral election?
 
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seb146
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 4:32 pm

BMI727 wrote:
Hillis wrote:
I don't want to hear about how bad you have it, and how silly you think it is for minorities, be they racial, religious or sexual, to be upset about anything.

A favorite leftist tactic: call everyone a racist and avoid a debate.


You say "calling everyone a racist to avoid debate." The rest of the world says "calling a spade a spade."
 
Hillis
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 7:55 pm

seb146 wrote:
BMI727 wrote:
Hillis wrote:
I don't want to hear about how bad you have it, and how silly you think it is for minorities, be they racial, religious or sexual, to be upset about anything.

A favorite leftist tactic: call everyone a racist and avoid a debate.


You say "calling everyone a racist to avoid debate." The rest of the world says "calling a spade a spade."


Sorry, BMI, but show me where I called everyone a racist? I didn't. But I must have hit close to home if you felt you had to respond.

And Seb is right: if it walks like a duck, flies like a duck, quack likes a duck, it is safe to say it is a duck. And the minority of whites in this nation who are screaming about how put upon they are are the perverbial duck-trying to lable those they hate with the very thing they're guilty of.
 
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PacificBeach88
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 8:00 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
PacificBeach88 wrote:
You ignored my point. Why aren't those considered "safe spaces"? You can't can you? The whole idea of "safe spaces" is to only surround yourself with like minded people.

Colin Kaepernick is demonstrating how well the right deals with differing viewpoints. Spoilers! It's not very well. And how many more RINO cleanses will the right need until it's uh...a safe space to push their agenda? I'm not even sure what the end game is here? Get rid of every last RINO like a good ole' communist purge until you're neck deep in your own feces and can't win an Alabama mayoral election?


I saw the whole uproar over this non-issue. So he sat respectfully, and refused to stand for the Anthem. Many religious people already do this. Millerites / Jehovah's Witnesses / some Adventists offshoots / Quakers / some Muslim offshoots do not stand for the Anthem or recite the pledge of allegiance in many cases. This is the ultimate in 1st Amendment freedoms. I know a lot of conservatives only believe in freedom of guns and freedom of religion, just so it is one they like, worship, or respect. Or a great religion like football. *eyeroll*
 
BMI727
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Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 9:29 pm

Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 8:01 pm

seb146 wrote:
You say "calling everyone a racist to avoid debate." The rest of the world says "calling a spade a spade."

Not the sane part.

Hillis wrote:
Sorry, BMI, but show me where I called everyone a racist? I didn't. But I must have hit close to home if you felt you had to respond.

And Seb is right: if it walks like a duck, flies like a duck, quack likes a duck, it is safe to say it is a duck. And the minority of whites in this nation who are screaming about how put upon they are are the perverbial duck-trying to lable those they hate with the very thing they're guilty of.

Let's think about this for a second. Right here:
Hillis wrote:
Until the white man is enslaved, or slaughtered, or put behind barbed wire because of their color; until they have to put up with things like Jim Crow, or lynchings en masse; until their population is systematically wiped out by a conquering force, I don't want to hear about how bad you have it, and how silly you think it is for minorities, be they racial, religious or sexual, to be upset about anything.

You just said in no uncertain terms that certain people should not have a voice because of their race. Explain how that is not racist.
 
Hillis
Posts: 1307
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:15 pm

BMI727 wrote:
Let's think about this for a second. Right here:
Hillis wrote:
Until the white man is enslaved, or slaughtered, or put behind barbed wire because of their color; until they have to put up with things like Jim Crow, or lynchings en masse; until their population is systematically wiped out by a conquering force, I don't want to hear about how bad you have it, and how silly you think it is for minorities, be they racial, religious or sexual, to be upset about anything.

You just said in no uncertain terms that certain people should not have a voice because of their race. Explain how that is not racist.


Let's talk about it. Where do I say they can't say anything? i didn't. I said that I-me, myself-don't want to hear about such hypocrisy. I have not suggested that someone stop them from speaking, or that someone stop you from speaking.

But you knew that, didn't you? And you were actling like you didn't.

The fact is that all this hysterica by conservative whites that ideas like "diversity equals white genocide", or that the belief that whites are REALLY being discriminiated against is nonsense. Neither is true on a grand scale.

I don't see minorities trying to pass laws forbidding whites to vote; but white conservtives are passing laws where they can to make it nary impossible for minorities to vote.

I don't see Muslims or other faiths working to try to spy on Christian, or to suggest that they possibly wear special ID's to mark them in public. But we do hear from white conservative Christians saying that about Muslim, and the standard-bearer for the conservative party in this nation condoning such things.

I don't see LGBTQ's demanding that laws be passed that forbid straights from marrying, or that they be discriminated against in the workplace, by health care professionals and their private lives. But I do see conservatives in this nation still working to say it's OK to have laws that say those very things about LGBTQ's.

That's what's meant by "I don't want to hear about it". Maybe you aren't smart enough to understand that, but I'm wondering.

Donald Trump, and many conservatives, are doing just what Hitler did in the 1920's: stoking racial fear and prejudice, trying to blame all the nations problems on a relative few that they are scared of, in an attempt to win political power. Combine that with the rapid change in the demographic makeup of this nation, where whites are losing majority status, you have a recipe for a demogogue like Donald Trump. And far too many ar so scared they'll follow him into the sea like the provebial Lemming.
 
BMI727
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:49 pm

Hillis wrote:
Where do I say they can't say anything? i didn't. I said that I-me, myself-don't want to hear about such hypocrisy.

So your just clarifying that you don't think that racism needs to be national policy, just that it is your personal policy. That's a fair point, but you haven't explained how your opinion is not racist.

Hillis wrote:
I don't see minorities trying to pass laws forbidding whites to vote; but white conservtives are passing laws where they can to make it nary impossible for minorities to vote.

There are no white conservatives trying to do that. If voter ID laws are discriminatory then so are attempts to register guns.

Hillis wrote:
I don't see LGBTQ's demanding that laws be passed that forbid straights from marrying, or that they be discriminated against in the workplace, by health care professionals and their private lives. But I do see conservatives in this nation still working to say it's OK to have laws that say those very things about LGBTQ's.

Find one proposed law that would force gays to be discriminated against at work.

And, lest we forget, any Democrat or supporter of Democrats is sitting firmly in a glass house on matters of citizens' private lives as long as any of them are still supporting soda taxes.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18742
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:30 pm

BMI727 wrote:
There are no white conservatives trying to do that. If voter ID laws are discriminatory then so are attempts to register guns.

Does Narnia not get the news? Two voter ID laws were just struck down in TX and NC in the last month alone.
 
BMI727
Posts: 11300
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:33 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
Does Narnia not get the news? Two voter ID laws were just struck down in TX and NC in the last month alone.

Then expect the same treatment if you want to get guns registered.
 
MaverickM11
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:39 pm

BMI727 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Does Narnia not get the news? Two voter ID laws were just struck down in TX and NC in the last month alone.

Then expect the same treatment if you want to get guns registered.

Your party has to win an election first, booboo. Then you can tell us what kind of treatment to expect.
 
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PacificBeach88
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:49 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
BMI727 wrote:
There are no white conservatives trying to do that. If voter ID laws are discriminatory then so are attempts to register guns.

Does Narnia not get the news? Two voter ID laws were just struck down in TX and NC in the last month alone.


Not to mention WI, KS, OH, and MI to boot. 6 states by GOP controlled goats (that was supposed to be govts but spell check made it even better) all smacked down by the courts with more to come.

https://www.thenation.com/article/5-maj ... n-10-days/
 
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PacificBeach88
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:54 pm

Speaking of "trigger warnings", "safe spaces", and "micro-aggressions" for Republicans, you might want to avoid Comedy Central's Rob Lowe Roast tomorrow night. Ann Coulter and the horse she rode in on, get skewered.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/tv/2 ... /89505556/
 
BMI727
Posts: 11300
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Sun Aug 28, 2016 11:07 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
Your party has to win an election first, booboo. Then you can tell us what kind of treatment to expect.

It just comes down to the fundamental question liberals have to answer: Do you believe that "all men" means everyone or not?
 
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seb146
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Aug 29, 2016 12:51 am

BMI727 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Your party has to win an election first, booboo. Then you can tell us what kind of treatment to expect.

It just comes down to the fundamental question liberals have to answer: Do you believe that "all men" means everyone or not?


That is why Republicans are fighting so hard for whites and "liberals" fight so hard for equality for everyone. If ALL LIVES MATTER then you on the right would be outraged over the Orlando shooting. Or the North Carolina bathroom bill. Or voter ID laws. Or when an unarmed person is shot with his hands up. Or when Natives are being forced off their land.

Show me one piece of "liberal" legislation that excludes whites.

I'll wait.....
 
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HGL
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Aug 29, 2016 2:41 am

BMI727 wrote:
Hillis wrote:
Where do I say they can't say anything? i didn't. I said that I-me, myself-don't want to hear about such hypocrisy.

So your just clarifying that you don't think that racism needs to be national policy, just that it is your personal policy. That's a fair point, but you haven't explained how your opinion is not racist.

I too don't see anything racist in what Hillis wrote. I read it more along the lines of "don't come running to me complaining that you chipped your nail varnish while someone else is suffering from a terminal illness."

BMI727 wrote:
Find one proposed law that would force gays to be discriminated against at work.

That is not necessary. In these very forums you yourself have constantly argued that people should have the right to discriminate. You have argued that it is your fundamental right to discriminate against any group you wish to and that any law designed to reduce adverse discrimination is a violation of your freedom. Of course, I recognise saying that you should have the right is not saying that you necessarily would exercise it. However, history shows that people have been perfectly happy to discriminate against others on various grounds, including but not limited to race, sex, marital status and gender identity.
 
BMI727
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Aug 29, 2016 3:32 am

seb146 wrote:
If ALL LIVES MATTER then you on the right would be outraged over the Orlando shooting.

Where were the conservatives cheering for that shooting?

seb146 wrote:
Or the North Carolina bathroom bill.

An unenforceable distraction.

seb146 wrote:
Or when an unarmed person is shot with his hands up.

The forensics do not support that assessment.

seb146 wrote:
Show me one piece of "liberal" legislation that excludes whites.

It's not always on racial grounds. Look at the soda tax for example.

HGL wrote:
I too don't see anything racist in what Hillis wrote.

He outright said that he was not interested in the opinions of anyone who is white because they are white. Such an attitude is blatantly racist.

Furthermore, not long ago Donald Trump stated that the opinion rendered by a Hispanic judge should not count because of his race. Trump was rightfully criticized for his open display of racism. So when Hillis says the same thing it's magically okay?

HGL wrote:
In these very forums you yourself have constantly argued that people should have the right to discriminate.

People should have the right to discriminate as long as it does not infringe on someone else's rights, but that is very different from a law forcing people to do so.

HGL wrote:
However, history shows that people have been perfectly happy to discriminate against others on various grounds, including but not limited to race, sex, marital status and gender identity.

Then let them and it will work out. I believe that when the founding fathers wrote "all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights" that they meant "all men." Not "all men who aren't too rich." Not "all men who aren't gay." Not "all men who buy diet soda." And not "all men who aren't racist."
 
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seb146
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Aug 29, 2016 3:40 am

BMI727 wrote:
seb146 wrote:
If ALL LIVES MATTER then you on the right would be outraged over the Orlando shooting.

Where were the conservatives cheering for that shooting?

seb146 wrote:
Or the North Carolina bathroom bill.

An unenforceable distraction.

seb146 wrote:
Or when an unarmed person is shot with his hands up.

The forensics do not support that assessment.

seb146 wrote:
Show me one piece of "liberal" legislation that excludes whites.

It's not always on racial grounds. Look at the soda tax for example.

HGL wrote:
I too don't see anything racist in what Hillis wrote.

He outright said that he was not interested in the opinions of anyone who is white because they are white. Such an attitude is blatantly racist.

Furthermore, not long ago Donald Trump stated that the opinion rendered by a Hispanic judge should not count because of his race. Trump was rightfully criticized for his open display of racism. So when Hillis says the same thing it's magically okay?

HGL wrote:
In these very forums you yourself have constantly argued that people should have the right to discriminate.

People should have the right to discriminate as long as it does not infringe on someone else's rights, but that is very different from a law forcing people to do so.

HGL wrote:
However, history shows that people have been perfectly happy to discriminate against others on various grounds, including but not limited to race, sex, marital status and gender identity.

Then let them and it will work out. I believe that when the founding fathers wrote "all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights" that they meant "all men." Not "all men who aren't too rich." Not "all men who aren't gay." Not "all men who buy diet soda." And not "all men who aren't racist."


Force yourself to read Daily Kos and Huffington Post. As much as I hate Breitbart and Fox for their blatant disregard for facts, I still read them. I suggest you, BMI, do the same. You don't have to like it, as long as you do it. And, for the love of all that is holy, do not just go by what Breitbart says HuffPo says. Go to the actual HuffPo site and read the article instead of relying on second hand information. You will see that plenty of right wingers said the Orlando victims had it coming or that the bathroom law is discrimination on it's face or there are blacks shot dead by police with their hands up, not just the one you want to hold up as "all" or the soda tax or whatever. If you are not outraged, you are not paying attention.
 
BMI727
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Aug 29, 2016 3:43 am

seb146 wrote:
Force yourself to read Daily Kos and Huffington Post.

I read those more than any right wing source. The only time I read those is if someone links to something ridiculous.

seb146 wrote:
You will see that plenty of right wingers said the Orlando victims had it coming

Find one.

seb146 wrote:
there are blacks shot dead by police with their hands up,

Who said that? The medical examiner didn't.
 
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HGL
Posts: 330
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Aug 29, 2016 5:07 am

BMI727 wrote:
He outright said that he was not interested in the opinions of anyone who is white because they are white. Such an attitude is blatantly racist.


Hillis wrote no such thing. He wrote about people complaining how bad they were off against a background of a history of a lot of others being far worse off and subject to systematic discrimination. He at no stage said that white people are not entitled to express an opinion. That is something that you have chosen to inject into what was actually written.

BMI727 wrote:
I believe that when the founding fathers wrote , that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights" that they meant "all men." Not "all men who aren't too rich." Not "all men who aren't gay." Not "all men who buy diet soda." And not "all men who aren't racist."


While you might quote the founding fathers favourably, your view was certainly not shared by conservatives generally for several decades after they were written. I have no idea what the founding fathers actually and sincerely meant and how much was simply rhetoric.

Did the founding fathers believe that women should have the vote? Did they believe that black-skinned people could move about freely, buy property and arm themselves? Certainly they did not sufficiently pursue the notion of "all men are created equal" as they continued to tolerate slavery and they wrote only of men, not women. What was their attitude to the first nations? Some might have been amenable to the inclusion of women, but it wasn't an idea that caught on. Although New Jersey had passed a law in 1776 permitting women to vote, women were disenfranchised in that State in 1807. Other States simply would not permit women to vote and appeals to the Supreme Court in the 1870s continued to fail, notwithstanding reliance on the 14th Amendment. The 19th Amendment which finally banned electoral discrimination on the grounds of sex was only passed in 1920!
 
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seb146
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Aug 29, 2016 5:18 am

BMI727 wrote:
seb146 wrote:
Force yourself to read Daily Kos and Huffington Post.

I read those more than any right wing source. The only time I read those is if someone links to something ridiculous.

seb146 wrote:
You will see that plenty of right wingers said the Orlando victims had it coming

Find one.

seb146 wrote:
there are blacks shot dead by police with their hands up,

Who said that? The medical examiner didn't.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... oting.html

The way you post is just like someone who thinks Breitbart and Fox are the only legitimate sources out there. They are not. Daily Kos and HuffPo are not either. But, in my experience, those who check all four are more knowledgeable than those who only rely on one "fair and balanced" source.
 
mham001
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Tue Aug 30, 2016 2:15 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
You're the one that made the claim that it was gays raping children in the Boy Scouts and the Catholic Church, and yet to no one's surprise you can't back it up. Hey if it feels true then that's good enough right? Who cares about whatever collateral damage it does to the accused group--it doesn't affect your lying ass! Now let me guess if you were called a homophobe (which you've made clear you are) for making up vile accusations you can't support, you'll get all bent out of shape and tell me minorities just call republicans names when they can't make their case (which you haven't).


I supported everything *you asked for*. And you kick and scream and throw a tantrum when the Catholic Church admits to an "infiltration of a gay lobby" in the Vatican, as if that somehow helped their cause. You are so blinded that you fail to see what an embarrassment that was for them, but "It's a conspiracy against gays!". I could go on and produce the studies that clearly show the preferences of various groups of molesters against various ages (hint; hetero men have little-to-no interest in pubescent boys and separately, somewhere around 90% of victims of the clergy were boys aged 13-17, the Church does not want to say exactly) but you would scream about that as well. Even the gay pediatrician here was caught misrepresenting the definitions. There is no point.

Image
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18742
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Tue Aug 30, 2016 2:28 am

mham001 wrote:
I supported everything *you asked for*. And you kick and scream and throw a tantrum when the Catholic Church admits to an "infiltration of a gay lobby" in the Vatican, as if that somehow helped their cause. You are so blinded that you fail to see what an embarrassment that was for them, but "It's a conspiracy against gays!". I could go on and produce the studies that clearly show the preferences of various groups of molesters against various ages (hint; hetero men have little-to-no interest in pubescent boys and separately, somewhere around 90% of victims of the clergy were boys aged 13-17, the Church does not want to say exactly) but you would scream about that as well. Even the gay pediatrician here was caught misrepresenting the definitions. There is no point.

Believe me I know what an embarrassment the abuse scandal is for the Catholic Church--they're just pissed that an organization with the morals and ethics of the Qaddafis got caught and they'd be soon parted with what they worship: money!

You've supported nothing other than your ability to flap your jaw and repeat homophobic tropes. Give us a link, any link, that supports your fantasy that it's the gays that are responsible for the sexual abuse in the Catholic Church and Boy Scouts. I know nothing would make you happier than to blame it all on us so come on--where is the proof??
 
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seb146
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Tue Aug 30, 2016 3:26 am

mham001 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
You're the one that made the claim that it was gays raping children in the Boy Scouts and the Catholic Church, and yet to no one's surprise you can't back it up. Hey if it feels true then that's good enough right? Who cares about whatever collateral damage it does to the accused group--it doesn't affect your lying ass! Now let me guess if you were called a homophobe (which you've made clear you are) for making up vile accusations you can't support, you'll get all bent out of shape and tell me minorities just call republicans names when they can't make their case (which you haven't).


I supported everything *you asked for*. And you kick and scream and throw a tantrum when the Catholic Church admits to an "infiltration of a gay lobby" in the Vatican, as if that somehow helped their cause. You are so blinded that you fail to see what an embarrassment that was for them, but "It's a conspiracy against gays!". I could go on and produce the studies that clearly show the preferences of various groups of molesters against various ages (hint; hetero men have little-to-no interest in pubescent boys and separately, somewhere around 90% of victims of the clergy were boys aged 13-17, the Church does not want to say exactly) but you would scream about that as well. Even the gay pediatrician here was caught misrepresenting the definitions. There is no point.

Image


The Catholic Church, who hates gays, says that gays have infiltrated the church. At the same time, priests are taking advantage of adolescent boys. So, blame the gays because that is easy to make that leap? WTF kind of logic is that???

If gays had infiltrated the church en masse, there would be more of a show, don't you think? Not that tired sacramental wine, but the good stuff from Napa or Bordeaux. And, the fashion would be updated as well. Plus, all this spending money on palatial mansions for only one person? Nope. AirBNB or house party. You are a friend of so-and-so? Great! Grab a cocktail and enjoy some appetizers!
 
MaverickM11
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Wed Aug 31, 2016 1:42 pm

seb146 wrote:
The Catholic Church, who hates gays, says that gays have infiltrated the church. At the same time, priests are taking advantage of adolescent boys. So, blame the gays because that is easy to make that leap? WTF kind of logic is that???

Exactly. I don't know why anyone would believe anything the catholic multi level marketing con says, but especially something so transparently self serving as blaming the people they hate for their own crimes.
 
NoTime
Topic Author
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Oct 17, 2016 11:15 pm

North Carolina GOP Office Hit by Suspected Firebomb - http://abcnews.go.com/US/north-carolina ... d=42845778

Clinton Campaign, DNC Coordinated With Organizations To Incite Violence At Trump Events - http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/ ... rters.html
 
ElliottM
Posts: 56
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Oct 17, 2016 11:27 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
Of course the catholic church uses gays as a scapegoat--what are you expecting?? Conflating sexuality with predators is a trope the christian right and republicans have been using for decades to denigrate anything that mystified them, whether it was women, or blacks, or natives, or gays, or transgendered, and on and on. I wouldn't expect the catholic church to be honest, moral, or ethical if their life depended on it. But sure let's wander down that path...then what are all the higher ups doing hiding and protecting the pedophiles? Are they gay too? And again, where is the connection between homosexuality and pedophilia? Citation or GTFO.


I'm a lifelong Republican and a devout Christian and believe it or not, I fully agree with you. I really wanted to be sympathetic to mham001. I felt for him, because I used to believe exactly the things he has written. I too used to conflate child molestors with adult homosexual men who enter into consensual relationships with fellow adult homosexual men. I know the struggle and the effort of maintaining one's beliefs when reality screams otherwise. But this thread is just too rich. I read mham001's sources but they did not back up his claims. So this is falsification of information.

But please, I do not denigrate women or black or any of the other groups you mentioned. We Republicans are not all like this!
 
ElliottM
Posts: 56
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Oct 17, 2016 11:41 pm

Dreadnought wrote:
But the left has convinced themselves that those on the right are motivated by nothing more than hatred or avarice, and therefore evil. Why argue with evil people, right?


I have many left-wing family and friends - even coworkers - who don't see me (a lifelong Republican) as "evil" or "hateful". We regularly discuss politics, we do not "argue", we have civil discussions. To my great surprise, I've even discussed politics at work in a workplace of mixed political affiliation and if anything, it's made our working relationships stronger. I was shocked because I didn't expect my coworkers to bring up politics, but it's come up many times over lunch or what not. I'm certain none of my coworkers think of me as evil.

As for "hatred", I think it's a rather meaningless term. I've been called "hateful" and "hate-filled" by both sides, so I don't see it as a partisan issue. For instance, I was told within a 5 minute conversation both that I hate black people and that I hate police officers. I hate neither! I also think it's meaningless because I can hate someone and still support their rights - just as I can disagree with what someone is saying and still support their right to say it. So hatred is legally and politically meaningless (to me).

I am greedy though. ;)
Last edited by ElliottM on Mon Oct 17, 2016 11:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
coolian2
Posts: 2483
Joined: Sun Oct 22, 2006 3:34 pm

Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Mon Oct 17, 2016 11:42 pm

ElliottM wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Of course the catholic church uses gays as a scapegoat--what are you expecting?? Conflating sexuality with predators is a trope the christian right and republicans have been using for decades to denigrate anything that mystified them, whether it was women, or blacks, or natives, or gays, or transgendered, and on and on. I wouldn't expect the catholic church to be honest, moral, or ethical if their life depended on it. But sure let's wander down that path...then what are all the higher ups doing hiding and protecting the pedophiles? Are they gay too? And again, where is the connection between homosexuality and pedophilia? Citation or GTFO.


I'm a lifelong Republican and a devout Christian and believe it or not, I fully agree with you. I really wanted to be sympathetic to mham001. I felt for him, because I used to believe exactly the things he has written. I too used to conflate child molestors with adult homosexual men who enter into consensual relationships with fellow adult homosexual men. I know the struggle and the effort of maintaining one's beliefs when reality screams otherwise. But this thread is just too rich. I read mham001's sources but they did not back up his claims. So this is falsification of information.

But please, I do not denigrate women or black or any of the other groups you mentioned. We Republicans are not all like this!

Mate, get out and vote Hillary. You cannot let your party stop representing you. The only way you can do this is tell them that you do not stand for what they're doing.

I did similar in my last election. I wasted my vote (based on our party system) but, I said that I wasn't happy, with my single number.
 
ElliottM
Posts: 56
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2016 3:58 am

Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:27 am

coolian2 wrote:
Mate, get out and vote Hillary. You cannot let your party stop representing you. The only way you can do this is tell them that you do not stand for what they're doing.

I did similar in my last election. I wasted my vote (based on our party system) but, I said that I wasn't happy, with my single number.


My party still represents me, mostly. Trump does not. I can't in good conscience vote for Clinton either. But in my area, she'll probably win big. I am in a very liberal area. So it won't really matter who I vote for; it'll only determine how badly Trump and Johnson (and Stein, for that matter) lose!


NoTime wrote:
Considering the ridiculousness coming out of the American left (safe spaces, trigger words, micro aggressions, feigned indignation about EVERYTHING), I think the derogatory connotation is going to be around for a long time to come.


Eh, I know a lot of left-leaners (due to my location, I'm stuck with 'em ;)) and they don't really do that stuff. The only time someone (a veteran) mentioned a trigger is with respect to PTSD, which it's a legitimate psychiatric phenomenon and not being "triggered" by dissent. The Tumblr-ite SJW loonie-left doesn't represent the average American liberal (Thank God). That's like saying the average conspiracy-theorist or echo-chamber conservative represents the mainstream; they don't.
 
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PacificBeach88
Posts: 756
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Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:47 am

ElliottM wrote:
coolian2 wrote:
Mate, get out and vote Hillary. You cannot let your party stop representing you. The only way you can do this is tell them that you do not stand for what they're doing.

I did similar in my last election. I wasted my vote (based on our party system) but, I said that I wasn't happy, with my single number.


My party still represents me, mostly. Trump does not. I can't in good conscience vote for Clinton either. But in my area, she'll probably win big. I am in a very liberal area. So it won't really matter who I vote for; it'll only determine how badly Trump and Johnson (and Stein, for that matter) lose!


NoTime wrote:
Considering the ridiculousness coming out of the American left (safe spaces, trigger words, micro aggressions, feigned indignation about EVERYTHING), I think the derogatory connotation is going to be around for a long time to come.


Eh, I know a lot of left-leaners (due to my location, I'm stuck with 'em ;)) and they don't really do that stuff. The only time someone (a veteran) mentioned a trigger is with respect to PTSD, which it's a legitimate psychiatric phenomenon and not being "triggered" by dissent. The Tumblr-ite SJW loonie-left doesn't represent the average American liberal (Thank God). That's like saying the average conspiracy-theorist or echo-chamber conservative represents the mainstream; they don't.


Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.....so you basically rely on the power of the left to support your gay/bi/homo desires and refuse to stand up for yourself. Don't worry. Since Stonewall, most of us have done the heavy lifting and let you and your kind cruise by with little to no heavy lifting. *SMH* And you wonder why you get anyone left of center that feels antipathy towards you? Seriously? Really? Stop it!
 
ElliottM
Posts: 56
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2016 3:58 am

Re: Liberal Brownshirts at it again...

Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:54 am

PacificBeach88 wrote:
Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.....so you basically rely on the power of the left to support your gay/bi/homo desires and refuse to stand up for yourself. Don't worry. Since Stonewall, most of us have done the heavy lifting and let you and your kind cruise by with little to no heavy lifting. *SMH* And you wonder why you get anyone left of center that feels antipathy towards you? Seriously? Really? Stop it!


Wow. I can hardly dignify this with a response. And you wonder why people right of center feel antipathy towards you? ;)

Anyway, no, I don't have gay desires, though I don't have any kind of problem with gay people. I grew up in a very anti-gay fire-and-brimstone community. Ever since I outgrew that, I've had serious grievances with the way my party treats gay Americans. I cheered the marriage ruling. Any transgender man is welcome to use the same bathrooms as me. I think the birth certificate thing is stupid. It's a non-problem, doesn't need a "solution". Please don't be so fast to judge. I do however also have grievances with the politics of the left, so I can't pledge my support there either. Honestly, I pray for a fiscal-conservative and social-liberal candidate. I have seen some at the state level. Federally, Gary Johnson is the closest I've seen in a long, long time.

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