Hillis wrote:You'll get the usual split: righties who say he's the worst president of all time, even though compared to his predecessor, this nation is better off in just about every metric since Obama became president.
They'll say he's the cause of the racial divide. And he is if you think the problem is his skin is black, and ignore the rise of white hate group, and the rise of an out-and-out racist like Donald Trump as a presidential nominee.
You'll get some lefties who says he's the greatest president of all time, simply for the mess he inherited from George W. And that despite GOP obstruction, he's moved the nation forward.
Me? I think he's been better than average, given the mess he inherited, and the un-American attitude of the GOP for the last 8 years. The economy could be better, certainly, but from where it was this time 8 years ago, it's a no-brainer that we're better off.
I think history will be much kinder to him that Republicans and conservatives want. I think history will look back on the GOP in this time frame and wonder why the hell they drifted into fascism.
bmacleod wrote:Putting in context all of Obama's 2008 promises versus what actually happened I guess it parallels the predicament of many past POTUS's.
PacificBeach88 wrote:bmacleod wrote:Putting in context all of Obama's 2008 promises versus what actually happened I guess it parallels the predicament of many past POTUS's.
Poltico tracked over 500 campaign promises from 2008 and 2012:
Promises kept or compromised to pass: 70%
Promises broken: 22%
On hold or pending 7%:
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... /obameter/
bmacleod wrote:3 1/2 months to go to end-of-term thought I'd start a discussion on comparing Obama to past presidents but not necessarily ranking him.
On foreign policy Obama seemed to follow Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton - seemingly a lightweight - only intervening when cornered by Congress/UN - Libya in 2011 and Iraq/Syria in 2014.
Bill Clinton was saddled with Somalia when he took over in 1993. He went into Bosnia only after GOP won Congress in 1994.
Domestic/Jobs - Reagan keeps sticking out here. It took Reagan into his second term before the economy fully recovered from the 1981 recession. Likewise for Obama.
Vision - Again this JFK charisma and "New Frontier" "Yes We Can"
desertjets wrote:My biggest disappointments with him are that he continued to be overly optimistic in the spirit of bi-partisanshipness long after it was clear the GOP didn't want to play at all. I suppose on one level he needed to be diplomatic and at least look like he was playing nice -- but I would have honestly liked him to have been more forceful with the GOP and calling them on their bullshit. Next would be him not closing Gitmo and not reigning in the whole surveillance infrastructure, use of drone strikes, etc... I suppose in the greater context of the GWOT this was never going to happen. I also think in the post Great Recession recovery his administration did not go after the banks/financial institutions at all. The whole concept of too big to fail is deeply troubling -- if a handful of financial institutions control too much wealth there should have some moves on anti-trust investigations.
Ultimately my opinion of him is quite high -- I feel like he has left this country in a much better place despite having a Congress for 6 out of 8 years that simply refused to govern at all. I really do wonder where this country would be at had the Congressional leadership been interested in doing their jobs at all.
LMP737 wrote:The problem with these sort of questions is that you won't get a truly objective answer until anyone with any memory of that president is long since passed. So maybe in a hundred year we call all come back to this forum and see what people are saying about Obama's presidency.
Channex757 wrote:Far too early.
Many scholars now are of the opinion that someone like Reagan, who was the darling of the Right (and still is) was actually a pretty poor President. Likewise, history has been kinder to Gerald Ford who wasn't considered to be that good at the time but is now seen as having been a safe pair of hands. Time is needed for an objective discussion of a Presidency as snap judgments just don't take the full picture into account.
What Obama does have on his side is that he managed to keep the US economy out of the worst of the Great Recession, and saved hundreds of thousands of jobs by saving companies like General Motors. If GM had gone under the damage to the USA would have been incalculable as that company is so ingrained into the national psyche and I'm sure that the White House realised that. Similarly, what you call Obamacare has not yet had time to mature and settle in so again time is needed.
bmacleod wrote:It will be interesting to see what Obama does on Jan 20 - does he take an extended vacation in Hawaii?
Plan for a charity foundation like Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton?
When Reagan left in 1989 it was "exit stage right" and retired to Bel-Air.
Similarly GW Bush left in same manner in 2009 heading for Dallas. But he kept busy on the speech circuit and now keeps busy with global humanitarian duties.
DocLightning wrote:The other thing was Iraq, although to some degree this was only partially his problem.
DocLightning wrote:He played it safe though. He knew that if he appointed someone he would hand the government over to the GOP in the next election. His nominee (a recess appointment) would have only been on the court until January, when the new Congress convenes. So he would have made matters worse. Had this been early on in his 2nd term, it would have been different since all the rage would have been taken off in the mid-term elections AND his replacement would be no more.For example, with the recent SCOTUS issue, what he *should* have done was to declare that by refusing to hear the nominee, the Senate had already given its advice and consent (in writing, no less) which was that they were not going to hear any nominees, meaning that he could appoint whoever he wanted. The Constitution does *NOT* specify that the Senate must hold hearings, only that they must "advise and consent." Of course, that would lead to the GOP suing the President and a Constitutional crisis in which the decision of the correct course of action would lie...on the Supreme Court.
Flighty wrote:Unremarkable president, took the easy way out of almost every issue. Few accomplishments.
Stayed out of war - Hallelujah for that. So, he is vastly better than GW Bush was.
Worthy of note, Obama spent $10 trillion in debt, unlikely to be paid back, that will momentarily start accruing rather large interest payments. And he did so in good times. This suggests that along the present track, Obama's USA is unsustainable and could become a marginalized country in the future.
I give him a B- / C+.
Hillis wrote:"Unremarkable President": First African-American President. That alone is remarkable.
"Took The Easy Way Out": Really, he tried for almost 4 YEARS to reach over the aisle to the GOP, who rebuffed him at every turn. He didn't take the "easy way out" in negotiating with Cuba, or Iran, or in easing tensions with nations like Vietnam, Myanmar, Cambodia and Laos. Taking the "easy way out" would have to left the status quo in place. He didn't take the easy way out in crafting the Health Care package. Most of the time, he chose the more complex, more difficult path, because it offered the higher chance for reward.
"Few Accomplishments": Where to begin.
-The drive for LGBTQ rights
-Easing tensions with Iran, Cuba, Vietnam and other nations.
-Bin Laden died on his watch.
-The deficit has been lowered dramatically.
-More than 60 months of positive job growth.
-Crafted the bailouts, popular or not, that saved the banking, housing and auto industries.
-Not one member of his cabinet or his staff have left because of illegal activity. Not one.
-Turned back the page on the use of torture against prisoners.
-Set up the Consumer Finance Protection Bureau, which is the agency that helped bring to light the Wells Fargo scam. Interestingly, the GOP wants to get rid of that agency. Wonder why?
And if you hate things so much, you can always leave.
einsteinboricua wrote:However, no one would have foreseen a weak Iraqi government with lots of tensions or a fragile neighbor next door whose central government is unable to reach beyond cities, allowing someone else to fill the void.
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