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Hillis
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For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:28 am

A friend of mine put this on her Facebook Page, and I'll put it here to show, for the record, where a few things stood in the United States on the day Barack Obama left office and Donald Trump took office.

Average price of gas: $2.32.6
http://gasprices.aaa.com/news/

Dow Jones: 19732.40
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/stock-mar ... 03025.html

NASDAQ: 5555.33
http://www.marketwatch.com/investing/index/comp

Unemployment Rate: 4.7%


Just for the record.
 
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WarRI1
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:33 am

Anybody can see the difference between 2008 and today, of course anybody who has a sense of honor and honesty ????? :banghead:
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
727LOVER
Posts: 8622
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:22 am

Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 5:22 am

Well...I hope the stock market goes up...because I'm about to chuck $7,000 or so in it.

Heard a good quote today:

The difference between Obama & Trump is that Trump wasn't handed a turd sandwich.
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
stlgph
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 5:32 am

Don't forget to tag that 4.7% with the 94,500,000 folks who are no longer participating in the labor force because they can't get a job.

Let's not forget roughly 93% of the move in the stock market was thanks to the Federal Reserve's Quantitative Easing. what was that total on the taxpayers again? 2 trillion...ish?


you know, just for the record.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
salttee
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 5:48 am

stlgph wrote:
Don't forget to tag that 4.7% with the 94,500,000 folks who are no longer participating in the labor force because they can't get a job

That's more bogus con financial faniggling. The employment rate is calculated the same way year after year, decade after decade in every country, that's why it's a meaningful number.

As for your 94.5 million you must be counting schoolchildren and the retired along with the actual unemployed, or more likely you just plucked off of Freeperville or Fox (entertainment) News.
The current problem isn't the actual number of unemployed, it's the types of jobs many have had to take.
 
A332DTW
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 5:52 am

salttee wrote:
stlgph wrote:
Don't forget to tag that 4.7% with the 94,500,000 folks who are no longer participating in the labor force because they can't get a job

That's more bogus con financial faniggling. The employment rate is calculated the same way year after year, decade after decade in every country, that's why it's a meaningful number.

As for your 94.5 million you must be counting schoolchildren and the retired along with the actual unemployed, or more likely you just plucked off of Freeperville or Fox (entertainment) News.
The current problem isn't the actual number of unemployed, it's the types of jobs many have had to take.


He got his source from the fake news lord himself: http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/11/donald-t ... esser.html
 
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zckls04
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 6:32 am

stlgph wrote:
Don't forget to tag that 4.7% with the 94,500,000 folks who are no longer participating in the labor force because they can't get a job.

Let's not forget roughly 93% of the move in the stock market was thanks to the Federal Reserve's Quantitative Easing. what was that total on the taxpayers again? 2 trillion...ish?


you know, just for the record.


94.5 million? Are you high? Please tell me this is a typo.
Four Granavox Turbines!
 
stlgph
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 6:41 am

salttee wrote:
stlgph wrote:
Don't forget to tag that 4.7% with the 94,500,000 folks who are no longer participating in the labor force because they can't get a job

That's more bogus con financial faniggling. The employment rate is calculated the same way year after year, decade after decade in every country, that's why it's a meaningful number.

As for your 94.5 million you must be counting schoolchildren and the retired along with the actual unemployed, or more likely you just plucked off of Freeperville or Fox (entertainment) News.
The current problem isn't the actual number of unemployed, it's the types of jobs many have had to take.


Yep. Fox is purely entertainment news. I guess that's why they're the #1 respected brand for news in the world, but hey, don't let the rest of this get in the way either ... because the truth just sucks, eh?!

http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2016/10/ ... n-to-rise/

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/12/02/95-milli ... force.html

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/12/02/nonfarm- ... 9-est.html


especially when it comes from the BLS itself

https://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm


but hey, go on and continue with your spin you liberals need to defend your fake unemployment rate.

also don't conveniently remember how the 4.7% championed unemployment rate was never once talked about by President Obama, who was so quick to point out all his other "victories."

and why?

he couldn't defend it, that's why.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
jpetekyxmd80
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 6:45 am

Wow, it's almost like the biggest generation approached retirement age. This stuff really is rocket science...
The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
 
stlgph
Posts: 11221
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 6:49 am

Sweetie, retirees aren't considered the labor force.
Kind of amazing if you're going to talk about economics you perhaps learn something like, economics.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
jpetekyxmd80
Posts: 4317
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 6:55 am

Do you even read the things you post?

""It's a combination. There's no question a lot of them are retirees," Boockvar said. "No one wants to say, 'I want to get fired and sit on my butt.' But when people do lose their jobs, they're not being incentivized enough to go back to work compared to the benefits they get by not being at work."
The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
 
vikkyvik
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 7:05 am

Hillis wrote:
Just for the record.


Don't forget:

Approximate number of Trump/election-related threads started by Hillis: 30
search.php?keywords=&terms=all&author=Hillis&t=0&fid%5B%5D=11&sc=1&sf=firstpost&sr=topics&sk=t&sd=d&st=0&ch=25&t=0&submit=Search

stlgph wrote:
Sweetie, retirees aren't considered the labor force.


So, you mean....they're not in the labor force?

CNBC wrote:
95 million. That's the number of Americans now counted as not in the labor force
I'm watching Jeopardy. The category is worst Madonna songs. "This one from 1987 is terrible".
 
salttee
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 7:09 am

stlgph wrote:
I guess that's why they're (Fox) the #1 respected brand for news in the world

Wow you really don't know!

I thought that the cons knew deep down that they were watching fantasy TV but just blew it off because it sounded so good.
But this guy actually thinks Fox is a respected news outlet.
I wonder if he subscribes to National Enquirer.
 
stlgph
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 7:28 am

Yeah, I guess when you're the #1 brand on social media, the #1 news website out of all the peers, the top cable network (let alone where the others fall), the most watched U.S. news channel overseas and 7 out of 10 people get their news from a Fox family product on a daily basis ... I dunno, Fox ... I really hope you get your shit together sometime soon!
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
WIederling
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Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 8:36 am

stlgph wrote:
Sweetie, retirees aren't considered the labor force.
Kind of amazing if you're going to talk about economics you perhaps learn something like, economics.


If your retiree is unable to make ends meet he _is_ still part of the labor force. ( actually forced to )
( how many corporations rejuvenated themselves via Chapt 11 denuding pensions funds in the process?)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unemploym ... ted_States

U6 includes those that need but do not have a parttime job. 10% altogether.

Addendum:
Amusing: jobs created during their tenure:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jobs_crea ... tial_terms

Best: Clinton
Worst: Bush the lesser "43"

Overall: DEM quite a bit better than GOP presidents.
Interesting dissonance on the GOP side.
Murphy is an optimist
 
salttee
Posts: 3149
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:43 pm

stlgph wrote:
Yeah, I guess when you're the #1 brand on social media, the #1 news website out of all the peers, the top cable network (let alone where the others fall), the most watched U.S. news channel overseas and 7 out of 10 people get their news from a Fox family product on a daily basis ... I dunno, Fox ... I really hope you get your shit together sometime soon!

Are you really that misinformed? Why can't you see the obvious?
http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=27363

Here's a look at the SUN, Rrupert Murdoch's first media creation and obviously the business model for FOX.News; it's nothing but populist fantasy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sun_(United_Kingdom)

Rrupert Murdoch is a huckster and Roger Ailes has been outed for being the slimeball that he is.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... ailes.html
 
WIederling
Posts: 9308
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:56 pm

salttee wrote:
stlgph wrote:
Yeah, I guess when you're the #1 brand on social media, the #1 news website out of all the peers, the top cable network (let alone where the others fall), the most watched U.S. news channel overseas and 7 out of 10 people get their news from a Fox family product on a daily basis ... I dunno, Fox ... I really hope you get your shit together sometime soon!

Are you really that misinformed?


This show was made in the DDR:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Der_schwarze_Kanal

rather popular in West Germany ( "too" or "only" ? :-) . though not as the intended educational format
but as one of the better satirical shows. Quite the hoot actually.

I don't think that news outlets beyond FOX are much better.
But FOX is a real sinister factbender in scope of what can be garnered as fact from other sources.
Murphy is an optimist
 
afcjets
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 2:02 pm

WarRI1 wrote:
Anybody can see the difference between 2008 and today, of course anybody who has a sense of honor and honesty ????? :banghead:


For the record, the GDP did not begin contracting until the 3rd quarter of 2008, so 7.75 years (more than 95%) of Bush's 8 year term, barring several months after 9/11 which was much shorter than forecast or anyone could have imagined, GDP was up under Bush.
 
salttee
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 2:11 pm

afcjets wrote:
For the record, the GDP did not begin contracting until the 3rd quarter of 2008, so 7.75 years (more than 95%) of Bush's 8 year term, barring several months after 9/11 which was much shorter than forecast or anyone could have imagined, GDP was up under Bush.

Yes, that's because he used rampant deficit spending to support his wartime economy.
The bubble burst in 2008, and in the end the US was left deeply in debit to China.
 
afcjets
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 3:17 pm

salttee wrote:
afcjets wrote:
For the record, the GDP did not begin contracting until the 3rd quarter of 2008, so 7.75 years (more than 95%) of Bush's 8 year term, barring several months after 9/11 which was much shorter than forecast or anyone could have imagined, GDP was up under Bush.

Yes, that's because he used rampant deficit spending to support his wartime economy.


LOL national debt more than DOUBLED during Obama's term, and he is also the first two term president in US history to be at war every day he was in office.

salttee wrote:
The bubble burst in 2008, and in the end the US was left deeply in debit to China.


The bubble burst in 2008 because of the subprime mortgage crisis. This was largely attributed to feel good Democratic policies like the Community Reinvestment Act under Carter and even moreso during the Clinton administration to promote minority home ownership. Clinton appointee to Fannnie Mae began requiring lending institutions to fulfill a quota of minority mortgage lending, forcing lending agencies to lower their standards in terms of such things as down payments and income requirements to assume more risky subprime loans.
 
WIederling
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 3:30 pm

afcjets wrote:
WarRI1 wrote:
Anybody can see the difference between 2008 and today, of course anybody who has a sense of honor and honesty ????? :banghead:


For the record, the GDP did not begin contracting until the 3rd quarter of 2008, so 7.75 years (more than 95%) of Bush's 8 year term, barring several months after 9/11 which was much shorter than forecast or anyone could have imagined, GDP was up under Bush.


'Bush43 tenure was about as lackluster as his father.. Only longer and with a flashy downturn at the end.
IMu both are characterized by having no vision at all. At least Bush41 did not wallow in his mediocrity like his son did.
Carte Blanche for any imbecile to take a cut from the public cookie.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... t_-_v1.png
Obama needed ~1 year to turn the tables.

I'm really "gespannt wie ein Flitzebogen" how Trump will fare in national and international politics.
"America First" will just change reaching the same objectives from "underhanded" to "in your face".

Much easier to counter that.

Following what bubbles up out of the trade treaty negotiations all around
it is all about US ( and commercial entity ) overreach.
Murphy is an optimist
 
Hillis
Topic Author
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Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 6:19 pm

Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 3:57 pm

A332DTW wrote:
salttee wrote:
stlgph wrote:
Don't forget to tag that 4.7% with the 94,500,000 folks who are no longer participating in the labor force because they can't get a job

That's more bogus con financial faniggling. The employment rate is calculated the same way year after year, decade after decade in every country, that's why it's a meaningful number.

As for your 94.5 million you must be counting schoolchildren and the retired along with the actual unemployed, or more likely you just plucked off of Freeperville or Fox (entertainment) News.
The current problem isn't the actual number of unemployed, it's the types of jobs many have had to take.


He got his source from the fake news lord himself: http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/11/donald-t ... esser.html


Actually, Trump used that number. So it must be true. :roll:

That number represents anyone 16 or older who is not looking for work. That can be kids going to high school who don't have jobs; college kids who don't have jobs wile in school, and those who are retired and, well, are done working jobs. It's a grossly misleading statement to make it sound like "Oh, my God! No one is working!". But the fact is most of those people in the group are of the above groups.

But then again, the Pee-resident never did care for facts.
 
salttee
Posts: 3149
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2016 3:26 am

Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 6:26 pm

afcjets wrote:
LOL national debt more than DOUBLED during Obama's term, and he is also the first two term president in US history to be at war every day he was in office.


Not true, here are the actual numbers:

National Debit
09/30/2015 Obama 18,150,617,666,484.33
09/30/2014 Obama 17,824,071,380,733.82
09/30/2013 Obama 16,738,183,526,697.32
09/30/2012 Obama 16,066,241,407,385.89
09/30/2011 Obama 14,790,340,328,557.15
09/30/2010 Obama 13,561,623,030,891.79
09/30/2009 Obama 11,909,829,003,511.75
09/30/2008 Bush . . 10,024,724,896,912.49
09/30/2007 Bush . . . 9,007,653,372,262.48
09/30/2006 Bush . . . 8,506,973,899,215.23
09/30/2005 Bush . . . 7,932,709,661,723.50
09/30/2004 Bush . . . 7,379,052,696,330.32
09/30/2003 Bush . . . 6,783,231,062,743.62
09/30/2002 Bush . . . 6,228,235,965,597.16
09/30/2001 Bush . . . 5,807,463,412,200.06
09/30/2000 Clinton. . 5,674,178,209,886.86
https://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/rep ... histo5.htm

The difference being that when Bush inherited office the economy was healthy and the national debit had been under control for a number of years. When Obama took office, the US was in a deep recession and was in grave danger of slipping into depression, if you will remember. There was no choice after 2008 but to deficit spend to keep the economy from collapsing as it did in 1932. And so it has been during the recovery. Posting above there is the pubbie whose major interest is the unemployment rate, which is a valid concern; if we were to have had a balanced the budget anytime in the last eight years, the economy would have stalled and the jobless rate would have skyrocketed. We are still suffering the effects of the Iraq war and Bush's legacy.
 
afcjets
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Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 6:49 pm

salttee wrote:
afcjets wrote:
LOL national debt more than DOUBLED during Obama's term, and he is also the first two term president in US history to be at war every day he was in office.


Not true, here are the actual numbers:

National Debit
09/30/2015 Obama 18,150,617,666,484.33
09/30/2014 Obama 17,824,071,380,733.82
09/30/2013 Obama 16,738,183,526,697.32
09/30/2012 Obama 16,066,241,407,385.89
09/30/2011 Obama 14,790,340,328,557.15
09/30/2010 Obama 13,561,623,030,891.79
09/30/2009 Obama 11,909,829,003,511.75
09/30/2008 Bush . . 10,024,724,896,912.49
09/30/2007 Bush . . . 9,007,653,372,262.48
09/30/2006 Bush . . . 8,506,973,899,215.23
09/30/2005 Bush . . . 7,932,709,661,723.50
09/30/2004 Bush . . . 7,379,052,696,330.32
09/30/2003 Bush . . . 6,783,231,062,743.62
09/30/2002 Bush . . . 6,228,235,965,597.16
09/30/2001 Bush . . . 5,807,463,412,200.06
09/30/2000 Clinton. . 5,674,178,209,886.86
https://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/rep ... histo5.htm


LOL, you stop almost a year and half before he even left office and you are almost there with your own data. Factcheck.org which uses more recent data says it is up 116% since he took office and is more than double (100%).

http://www.factcheck.org/2016/01/obamas ... 16-update/
Last edited by afcjets on Sat Jan 21, 2017 6:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
tommy1808
Posts: 13254
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 6:53 pm

afcjets wrote:
LOL, you stop almost a year and half before he even left office and you are almost there with your own data. Factcheck.org which uses more recent data says 116%.


how much of that was actual government spending and how much was interests paid for preexisting debt?

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
salttee
Posts: 3149
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2016 3:26 am

Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 7:14 pm

afcjets wrote:
LOL, you stop almost a year and half before he even left office and you are almost there with your own data. Factcheck.org which uses more recent data says it is up 116% since he took office and is more than double (100%).

Yes I changed sites I copied from, (same numbers) because I liked the format better and I didn't notice that the second site omitted 2016.

Comparing apples to apples it still hasn't doubled.

National Debit
09/30/2016 Obama 19,391,704,027,667.12
09/30/2015 Obama 18,150,617,666,484.33
09/30/2014 Obama 17,824,071,380,733.82
09/30/2013 Obama 16,738,183,526,697.32
09/30/2012 Obama 16,066,241,407,385.89
09/30/2011 Obama 14,790,340,328,557.15
09/30/2010 Obama 13,561,623,030,891.79
09/30/2009 Obama 11,909,829,003,511.75
09/30/2008 Bush . . 10,024,724,896,912.49
09/30/2007 Bush . . . 9,007,653,372,262.48
09/30/2006 Bush . . . 8,506,973,899,215.23
09/30/2005 Bush . . . 7,932,709,661,723.50
09/30/2004 Bush . . . 7,379,052,696,330.32
09/30/2003 Bush . . . 6,783,231,062,743.62
09/30/2002 Bush . . . 6,228,235,965,597.16
09/30/2001 Bush . . . 5,807,463,412,200.06
09/30/2000 Clinton. . 5,674,178,209,886.86
http://www.polidiotic.com/by-the-number ... t-by-year/
 
bmacleod
Posts: 2990
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2001 3:10 am

Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 7:48 pm

Also for the record:

Donald J Trump oldest ever POTUS at inauguration - 70 years. He is 8 months older than Ronald Reagan was on Jan 20 1981.

First POTUS since FDR born in NY state.

Also 1st president to have married 3 times.
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
solarflyer22
Posts: 1517
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 7:07 pm

Re: For The Record

Sat Jan 21, 2017 8:37 pm

stlgph wrote:
Don't forget to tag that 4.7% with the 94,500,000 folks who are no longer participating in the labor force because they can't get a job.

Let's not forget roughly 93% of the move in the stock market was thanks to the Federal Reserve's Quantitative Easing. what was that total on the taxpayers again? 2 trillion...ish?

you know, just for the record.


Yeah and gas is a global commodity. POTUS doesn't have nearly as much an impact as the Saudis too. DJIA index is just 30 random large companies "thought" to be representative of the entire economy. S&P500 is a much better measure.

You could also just as easily track global terrorists attacks, refugees and ISIS infiltrated states. I don't think BHOs record was so great on that and you could see Trump dramatically improve on those numbers while more or less maintaining the status quo economically.

The quantitative easing while have a big impact too. I have already seen home prices starting to fall due to that and interest rate rises.
 
WIederling
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Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Re: For The Record

Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:23 am

bmacleod wrote:
Also 1st president to have married 3 times.


While some of the others married once and then changed mistresses in round robin style :-)
Murphy is an optimist
 
Mortyman
Posts: 5856
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Re: For The Record

Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:10 am

stlgph wrote:
salttee wrote:
stlgph wrote:
Don't forget to tag that 4.7% with the 94,500,000 folks who are no longer participating in the labor force because they can't get a job

That's more bogus con financial faniggling. The employment rate is calculated the same way year after year, decade after decade in every country, that's why it's a meaningful number.

As for your 94.5 million you must be counting schoolchildren and the retired along with the actual unemployed, or more likely you just plucked off of Freeperville or Fox (entertainment) News.
The current problem isn't the actual number of unemployed, it's the types of jobs many have had to take.


Yep. Fox is purely entertainment news. I guess that's why they're the #1 respected brand for news in the world, but hey, don't let the rest of this get in the way either ... because the truth just sucks, eh?!
.



Here in Norway, Fox is looked upon as trash and laughable

Fox is only populare in the world of conservative Americans and conservative Americans live in an awfully small world. 5 minutes of Fox and you are brain dead for life.
 
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einsteinboricua
Posts: 8480
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:11 pm

Re: For The Record

Sun Jan 22, 2017 1:45 pm

stlgph wrote:
also don't conveniently remember how the 4.7% championed unemployment rate was never once talked about by President Obama, who was so quick to point out all his other "victories."

Well..I sincerely hope that, because the 4.7% number is bogus, Trump directs the BLS to publish the "REAL" unemployment. The one he's heard that could be over 40%.

And then, when numbers are reported every month, he and his ilk will pay no attention whatsoever to the monthly rate, even if it reaches 3%...because it's bogus. It's the REAL unemployment he should be concerned about.

And then when you and other conservatives post about how great Trump is doing because the unemployment rate dropped from 4%, we'll emphasize how that rate does not include the

stlgph wrote:
94,500,000 folks who are no longer participating in the labor force because they can't get a job.
and is therefore false.

And if job losses start to pile up, we'll bring this figure back and say how the REAL unemployment is getting higher, even though the monthly figures still don't reflect it.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
bmacleod
Posts: 2990
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2001 3:10 am

Re: For The Record

Mon Mar 13, 2017 2:23 pm

Also for the record Trump joins club of POTUS to win election but lose home state - NY.

Last POTUS to do so was Nixon in 1968...well that figures!!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_major-party_United_States_presidential_candidates_who_lost_their_home_or_resident_state
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus

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