ozglobal
Topic Author
Posts: 2594
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:33 am

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:59 pm

ElPistolero wrote:
Aesma wrote:
We can have cooperation and an agreement with the US on defense (although with Trump, that's debatable). But European defense should be first and foremost an European endeavour. No US general involved. Can you imagine an European general dictating things on US soil ?


Going to be blunt: did you just flip "America First" into "Europe First"?

....



How on earth to you arrive at that parallel?? By "America First", Trump means he will seek to advantage the US to the detriment of other nations. On the other hand, "European defence should be first and foremost a European endeavour." is simply an exhortation to taking more responsibility for one's self. NO parallel what so ever.
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
 
KLDC10
Posts: 1409
Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:15 pm

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 4:01 pm

ozglobal wrote:
KLDC10 wrote:
AirPacific747 wrote:
Sympathy for the UK is disappearing very quickly these days. I hope they will feel the negative consequences for many decades to come with the way they are stabbing their fellow Europeans in the back.


I'd love to know how refusing to surrender sovereignty to a supra-national organisation constitutes "stabbing their fellow Europeans in the back". ......


And I'll be happy to explain it for you a second time. From the OP: In order to suck up to the American's for a deal, lead by a horror of a human being who wants to see the break up of the EU and NATO, she seeks leverage by poring scorn on the her fellow EU members, " ...she just spent 35mins giving an impassioned plea where she threw her "European friends and allies" totally under the bus with endless allusions to how only the US and UK have ever got it, only they have ever stood up to tyranny, only they have ever pulled their weight on defence, and that they have been alone in every other aspect of global leadership. She speaks of the UK, in contrast to other European countries, as being 'truly internationalists,' 'always having looked beyond Europe.'

Get it?


No. I don't "get it". The US and UK have indeed spent decades standing up to tyranny; preventing the Soviet Union from expanding its influence in Western Europe, and eventually bringing about its collapse is just one example. She makes a good point on defense - other NATO members don't spend nearly enough on their own defense, and other countries have to pick up the tab. The US and UK have demonstrated global leadership - we don't very often see France, Germany or Italy falling over themselves to lead alongside the United States. Looking beyond the European Union echo chamber is no bad thing.
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Aesma
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Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 4:13 pm

France is policing all of North Africa. And has sent its carrier to Syria.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
UltimoTiger777
Posts: 458
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2016 5:19 pm

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 4:21 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
And with Brexit, they basically defrauded the money.


Apart from that being the most retarded statement about Brexit I've yet read, if you look at the figures, you'll find that in the 44 years we've been a member, there's only been on year where we received more than we paid in (1975). That's including the rebate from 1985.

Whose defrauding who again?
 
PanHAM
Posts: 9731
Joined: Fri May 06, 2005 6:44 pm

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 4:42 pm

Aesma wrote:
We can have cooperation and an agreement with the US on defense (although with Trump, that's debatable). But European defense should be first and foremost an European endeavour. No US general involved. Can you imagine an European general dictating things on US soil ?


very much so. The second in Command of the US HQ in Wiesbaden is a German General commanding US Forces..There are many similar examples, AWACS are multi national staffed, just one example. NATO works and Mr. T. will be educated on the Facts. The real Facts of course.
Was Erlauben Erdogan!!!
 
ElPistolero
Posts: 1763
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 12:44 am

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 4:57 pm

ozglobal wrote:


How on earth to you arrive at that parallel?? By "America First", Trump means he will seek to advantage the US to the detriment of other nations. On the other hand, "European defence should be first and foremost a European endeavour." is simply an exhortation to taking more responsibility for one's self. NO parallel what so ever.


Chill buddy, I was being facetious. I was hoping there was an outside chance that the poster I quoted was flipping the Brexit/America First argument on its head (with the subsequent entertaining sound of heads popping). I mean, taken to its extreme, an EU military force could preclude the need for any foreign military presence in the EU.

While some of our more simple-minded 'sovereignty'-chanting friends might cheer such a development, others might be able to comprehend the negative implications of being told to shut bases and staging areas in Europe. These issues aren't as one-way as they're made out to be.

Either which way, Reagan and Thatcher were champions of the geopolitical entity once known as 'the west'. Now we have people in the UK and US actually cheering for the disintegration of the EU for ideological reasons, driving a wedge within 'the west'. Chief among them a prospective US Ambassador to the EU.

Odd world, no?
 
ozglobal
Topic Author
Posts: 2594
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:33 am

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 5:10 pm

KLDC10 wrote:
ozglobal wrote:
KLDC10 wrote:

I'd love to know how refusing to surrender sovereignty to a supra-national organisation constitutes "stabbing their fellow Europeans in the back". ......


And I'll be happy to explain it for you a second time. From the OP: In order to suck up to the American's for a deal, lead by a horror of a human being who wants to see the break up of the EU and NATO, she seeks leverage by poring scorn on the her fellow EU members, " ...she just spent 35mins giving an impassioned plea where she threw her "European friends and allies" totally under the bus with endless allusions to how only the US and UK have ever got it, only they have ever stood up to tyranny, only they have ever pulled their weight on defence, and that they have been alone in every other aspect of global leadership. She speaks of the UK, in contrast to other European countries, as being 'truly internationalists,' 'always having looked beyond Europe.'

Get it?


No. I don't "get it". The US and UK have indeed spent decades standing up to tyranny; preventing the Soviet Union from expanding its influence in Western Europe, and eventually bringing about its collapse is just one example. She makes a good point on defense - other NATO members don't spend nearly enough on their own defense, and other countries have to pick up the tab. The US and UK have demonstrated global leadership - we don't very often see France, Germany or Italy falling over themselves to lead alongside the United States. Looking beyond the European Union echo chamber is no bad thing.


She is pouring scorn on her 'European allies and friends' specifically in order to flatter and curry favour with the US. That's stabbing in the back.
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
 
Olddog
Posts: 1236
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2016 4:41 pm

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 6:52 pm

PanHAM wrote:
Olddog wrote:
Teresa May could get a better deal :mrgreen:



The Name of the Lady is THeresa May- Teresa May is a porn star. But don't worry, the blunder was made by whoever was or wasn't in Charge at the Trump Administration. Safe to say that The Donald knows Teresa better than Theresa.
/quote]


Lol, I was thinking that my post was an obvious joke :hissyfit:
When UK was in it wanted a lot of opt-outs, now it is out it wants opt-ins
 
L410Turbolet
Posts: 6075
Joined: Wed May 05, 2004 9:12 am

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 7:53 pm

KLDC10 wrote:
The US and UK have indeed spent decades standing up to tyranny; preventing the Soviet Union from expanding its influence in Western Europe, and eventually bringing about its collapse is just one example.


Amazing how things have changed in just one week, isn't it? Let's restore the USSR to its former "glory" is apparently the slogan of the day.
Reagan's inauguration speech in 1981 and Trump's series of simplistic sentences in elementary school level of English could not be possibly more different.
 
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Aesma
Posts: 11839
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:14 am

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 9:46 pm

PanHAM wrote:
Aesma wrote:
We can have cooperation and an agreement with the US on defense (although with Trump, that's debatable). But European defense should be first and foremost an European endeavour. No US general involved. Can you imagine an European general dictating things on US soil ?


very much so. The second in Command of the US HQ in Wiesbaden is a German General commanding US Forces..There are many similar examples, AWACS are multi national staffed, just one example. NATO works and Mr. T. will be educated on the Facts. The real Facts of course.


You're talking about an US base on German soil. I'm talking about US soil (where there is no foreign base).
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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Dano1977
Posts: 708
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2008 2:49 pm

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sat Jan 28, 2017 11:03 pm

Aesma wrote:
PanHAM wrote:
Aesma wrote:
We can have cooperation and an agreement with the US on defense (although with Trump, that's debatable). But European defense should be first and foremost an European endeavour. No US general involved. Can you imagine an European general dictating things on US soil ?


very much so. The second in Command of the US HQ in Wiesbaden is a German General commanding US Forces..There are many similar examples, AWACS are multi national staffed, just one example. NATO works and Mr. T. will be educated on the Facts. The real Facts of course.


You're talking about an US base on German soil. I'm talking about US soil (where there is no foreign base).



My information may be outdated - But the RAF has a small corner on an airbase in Nevada for drone ops
The average EU official - he has the organising ability of the Italians, the flexibility of the Germans and the modesty of the French. And that's topped up by the imagination of the Belgians, the generosity of the Dutch.
 
NIKV69
Posts: 12726
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:27 am

Re: Theresa May to GOP - Trump

Sun Jan 29, 2017 12:39 am

L410Turbolet wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
Very glad to see President Trump meeting with her. It brings back memories of Thatcher-Reagan!


How? Just because the UK's PM is a woman?


https://www.yahoo.com/news/evoking-reag ... 07367.html
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