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LMP737
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:27 am

mham001 wrote:

I doubt that is accurate too, if you were to really look at some of the cases. Easy to spot, some of them, for example, this fine fellow from Afghanistan was most likely a "refugee"...

Zazi was born in a village in Paktia Province, Afghanistan.[10] He has two sisters and two brothers.[10] At the age of 7 in 1992, he and his family moved to the city of Peshawar in Pakistan where they settled as Afghan refugees.[11][12]

In 1999, he and the family left Pakistan and immigrated to New York City. They moved into a two-bedroom apartment in the Flushing, Queens section of the city.[5][10][13] Mohammed Wali Zazi, Najibullah's father and now a naturalized U.S. citizen, found work as a New York City taxi driver.

Zazi underwent weapons and explosives training at an al-Qaeda training camp in Pakistan in 2008. On September 9, 2009, he drove from his home in Aurora, Colorado, to New York City, intending to detonate explosives on the New York City subway during rush hour as one of three coordinated suicide "martyrdom" bombings.[2][7] Spooked, however, by surveillance by U.S. intelligence, and warned by a local imam that the authorities were inquiring about him, he abruptly flew back to Colorado. He was arrested days later.


Here's a little exercise for you. Look up how many people were murdered in the US last year. Then look up how many were killed by immigrants from the countries in question.
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KruegerFlaps
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:47 am

A stay on deportation of arrivals from the seven countries listed has been ordered by Federal Judge Ann Donnelly.
Donnelly said that anyone from one of the seven countries who was in flight en route to the US when the order was signed and landed with a valid visa would be allowed to legally stay in the country.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... tive-order
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TheFlyingDisk
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:58 am

AAPilot wrote:
I am very happy with trumps first week. I would like to have seen Saudi Arabia and Pakistan on the ban list as well but its a good start so far.

I also hope we can see the US withdraw from that silly paris treaty.


You mean the 1783 Treaty of Paris which among other things states:

"Britain acknowledges the United States (namely the thirteen states, listed[14]) to be free, sovereign, and independent states, and that the British Crown and all heirs and successors relinquish claims to the Government, property, and territorial rights of the same, and every part thereof;"

Yes, I do think it's silly for Great Britain to agree to that...

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777Jet
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:30 am

dragon-wings wrote:
dragon-wings wrote:
I really don't see how this ban will help fight terror he in the US. The 9-11 attacks, Orlando, San Bernardino, Fort Hood ect. Not one terror attack in the US has been done by a immigrant.


Maybe I should of been more clear. I ment Refugee, not immigrant.


The family of the Boston Bombers sought asylum in the US and were eventually granted asylum in the US. They were refugees.

If you want to keep getting technical: ""An asylum seeker is a person who has sought protection as a refugee, but whose claim for refugee status has not yet been assessed. Every refugee has at some point been an asylum seeker.""

Aesma wrote:
777Jet : Kyrgyzstan and Russia aren't on Trump's list either.


Correct, but the Boston Bombers nonetheless undermine the original claim made by dragon-wings that: ""Not one terror attack in the US has been done by a immigrant.""

Furthermore, whilst ""Kyrgyzstan and Russia aren't on Trump's list"", the Boston Bombers were raised as Muslims which is very relevant to Trump's agenda against Islamic terrorism.

We also have a few radical Islamic extremists here in Australia, some have joined ISIS, others have been arrested here in Australia for terror plots, but Australia is also not on Trump's list.
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LMP737
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:39 am

777Jet wrote:

The family of the Boston Bombers sought asylum in the US and were eventually granted asylum in the US. They were refugees.

If you want to keep getting technical: ""An asylum seeker is a person who has sought protection as a refugee, but whose claim for refugee status has not yet been assessed. Every refugee has at some point been an asylum seeker.""



Correct, but the Boston Bombers nonetheless undermine the original claim made by dragon-wings that: ""Not one terror attack in the US has been done by a immigrant.""

Furthermore, whilst ""Kyrgyzstan and Russia aren't on Trump's list"", the Boston Bombers were raised as Muslims which is very relevant to Trump's agenda against Islamic terrorism.

We also have a few radical Islamic extremists here in Australia, some have joined ISIS, others have been arrested here in Australia for terror plots, but Australia is also not on Trump's list.


I'll give you the same exercise I gave someone else. Research how many people were murdered in the USA last year. Then look up how many were killed by people from the countries on Trumps list. Makes you wonder why so much attention is being given to this considering that anyone with half a brain can figure that we are the problem.
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cpd
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:11 am

The countries that are strangely absent from the list, has anyone thought to check Trump's business interests in those places?
 
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TheFlyingDisk
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:35 am

cpd wrote:
The countries that are strangely absent from the list, has anyone thought to check Trump's business interests in those places?


These are all "fake news", mind you.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... 35030bbf61

http://www.npr.org/2017/01/28/511996783 ... -interests

http://news.google.com/news/url?sr=1&sa ... 49061.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/tru ... 25e490499a
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CplKlinger
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:40 am

777Jet wrote:
How could such a bad man win the election and become POTUS???


I dunno, Stalin and Lenin were elected, and look what they did.
 
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777Jet
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:35 am

dragon-wings wrote:
I really don't see how this ban will help fight terror he in the US. The 9-11 attacks, Orlando, San Bernardino, Fort Hood ect. Not one terror attack in the US has been done by a immigrant.


.........

LMP737 wrote:
Research how many people were murdered in the USA last year. Then look up how many were killed by people from the countries on Trumps list.


I'm not interested in ALL of the local murders - types of murders that happen in all countries - and that were not underpinned by Islamic terrorism. This is about preventing Islamic terrorism such as 9/11.

I hope Australia takes such a hard line stance on immigration one day:

http://www.news.com.au/national/crime/t ... 0eecce7d80

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cpd
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:36 am

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
cpd wrote:
The countries that are strangely absent from the list, has anyone thought to check Trump's business interests in those places?


These are all "fake news", mind you.


Well it should be pretty easy for anyone to check, including the naysayers and Trump supporters, so they don't have to rely on fake news.
 
A332DTW
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:42 am

I was a refugee. Our immigration process took a year and a half. I can't help but reflect what my life would be like right now had we been turned away. Out of the many campaign promises he made, I never believed that he would actually manifest a version of his ban in any way. I expected a reduction in refugees, but not a complete ban. There comes a time where you throw in the towel, where cynicism becomes justified. I give up on this country.
 
cpd
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:15 am

Well, he's going to take refugees from Australia:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/ ... u0t6f.html
 
NIKV69
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:37 am

The biggest part of the problem with these protests is they are a front for the open border crowd. If you look close at the JFK crowd like I did I saw signs that said "No Borders" and "Sanctuary Now" these individuals want everyone let in here with no questions asked. Then there were the people that were mad that people returning with valid visas were being detained and that was an issue and should not have been happening. The MSM is running with it and it's a mess. Just more spin and anarchy.

Trumps Exec order was written poorly and the countries he chose were also bad. His intentions were correct in that we just can't let everyone in here willy nilly but he went about it in the wrong way. So now CNN and MSNBC will do the same thing they did when Sherriff Joe wanted to crack down on the illegal problem and run with the propaganda.
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EA CO AS
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:08 am

Hillis wrote:
a judge has issued a stay against Trump's immigration ban.


Which only applies to existing visa holders already arrived in the U.S. and those who are in transit and hold valid visas. The rest of the ban remains in effect.
Last edited by EA CO AS on Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Derico
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:11 am

Let's see what I have seen the last 3 days only.

1. knee-jerk carpet-banning of individuals from a country based on their religion
2. a woman at JFK viciously attacked because of her appearance giving away her religion, and other related incidents
3. a mosque burning down mysteriously overnight...

Now, where and in what time period of 20th century history have I read this kind of social atmosphere before??

I am the first to say, and have said it before, that the Muslim world has a huge problem, because most of the religious conflict zones involve Muslims vs someone else. So clearly there is a deep intolerance existing in the extremes of Muslim societies. I also feared that eventually, the relative lack of action from Muslim governments and societies to tackle it would lead to an indiscriminate backlash against ALL Muslims. Here we go,

That does not make it right however, the knee-jerk reaction, much less when it is plainly clear that it is the government itself through their rhetoric who have fanned the flames. There are ways you can tighten significantly your visas of certain nations without stoking the inner fears of the masses with hyperbolic talk.

Really, forget the USA as a flawed democracy, or flawed republic. It is a deeply troubled society period. Same with Europe quite frankly. You see it here and I see it when I browse English language news all over the internet. The level of hatred, of vitriol in the comments, on both sides.

It's become tribal, and that is the worst kind of societal disagreement level there is. When it gets tribal, there is a great risk of a total breakdown in social cohesion. I think you are seeing that now.
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mariner
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:18 am

777Jet wrote:
So, when I said ""As somebody who has gone through the entire process, I can assure you that any concerns he has about the vetting process are very warranted."" I was referring to my 'dodgy' experience. Way too easy...


That may depend on where you were born.

I'm British, both parents, but because oil my father's overseas posting I was born in a country called Palestine.

That fact - my birthplace - caused my Green Card process to be much longer and more arduous than yours, with two interviews, even though I had a fairly high powered lawyer. It wasn't unpleasant it just took time, and it helped, I guess, that I'd been working in the US for ten years. Even after it was approved there was a problem because "Palestine" doesn't now exist in the INS computers and Israel didn't exist when I was born.

So there was another meeting to decide what birth country should be on my card.

mariner
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LJ
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:35 am

cpd wrote:
The countries that are strangely absent from the list, has anyone thought to check Trump's business interests in those places?


You don't have to. If they would put Saudia Arabia, UAE or one of the other countries on the list, it would mean a trade war and thus he takes on only thse coutries of which everybody already has a bad perception and where the trade links are non-vital. Moreover, I'm sure the oil business, miltary equipement and Ministry of Defence wouldn't like to displease their customers (or in case of Ministry of Defence countries which they need for other purposes). For that reason, he's very pragmatic, but it will mean that terrorists can easily enter the country. Moreover, he forgets that the most problematic terrosoists will be the IS-converted all American guy who can go in and out of the US without any problem.
 
tommy1808
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:41 am

Derico wrote:
Now, where and in what time period of 20th century history have I read this kind of social atmosphere before??


Unfortunately that is what many of them want. I don't have to scroll down far my time line in FB to find plenty of calls, me memes with thousands of likes and shares, calling for the extermination of all muslims.
Unfortunately evolution can't wipe out all jackasses, just most.

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NIKV69
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:57 am

EA CO AS wrote:
Hillis wrote:
a judge has issued a stay against Trump's immigration ban.


Which only applies to existing visa holders already arrived in the U.S. and those who are in transit and hold valid visas. The rest of the ban remains in effect.


So people that have never been here before get looked at more carefully before we let them in. So?
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bgm
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:28 am

NIKV69 wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
Hillis wrote:
a judge has issued a stay against Trump's immigration ban.


Which only applies to existing visa holders already arrived in the U.S. and those who are in transit and hold valid visas. The rest of the ban remains in effect.


So people that have never been here before get looked at more carefully before we let them in. So?


What part of the current vetting process exactly do you find insufficient? I'm curious to know.
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Pellegrine
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:35 am

I've decided that I'm going on a trip to Iran and with the people I know, if I have one second of detention we will be suing the US Gov and Donal Dump himself. I've always wanted to go to Iran. I dig their food and UNESCO World Heritage sites.
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DLFREEBIRD
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:54 am

Trump executive order is an attempt at government-mandated religious persecution. There is no other words to describe what he's done to the Muslim community.

Now it's up to the courts, to rein Trump in and his so called advisor's. Clearly neither understand the words that make up our constitution.
Nor do those who voted him into office.
 
flipdewaf
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:26 am

TheF15Ace wrote:
. They are perfectly fine in flyover country waiting for America to be ''great again''.
the key part here for me is the "waiting" part, as if somehow if they want the country to be great that someone else will sort it while they wait. As far as I can tell the trump voters are ignorant to the hard work that has to be put in (mentally and not physically) beyond putting an x in a box to make things great. Ill use trump as an example of how people should be, although we may not agree with the way he does things or maybe the way he thinks he has got to where he is by actually getting on and doing things, making th leap beyond "wouldn't it be good if" he's added "so I'm going to ..." and that's what makes people/things great (its just a shame someone appears to have put a Christian magnet next to his moral compass).

Rant over.

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777Jet
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:33 am

cpd wrote:
Well, he's going to take refugees from Australia:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/ ... u0t6f.html


I'm really, really surprised by this.

I thought, and was hoping, that Trump would tell Turnbull that the US would not be taking those refugees and that Australia now had to deal with them.

mariner wrote:
That may depend on where you were born.

I'm British, both parents, but because oil my father's overseas posting I was born in a country called Palestine.

That fact - my birthplace - caused my Green Card process to be much longer and more arduous than yours, with two interviews, even though I had a fairly high powered lawyer. It wasn't unpleasant it just took time, and it helped, I guess, that I'd been working in the US for ten years. Even after it was approved there was a problem because "Palestine" doesn't now exist in the INS computers and Israel didn't exist when I was born.

So there was another meeting to decide what birth country should be on my card.


I was born in Australia.

My parents, who were also born in Australia, had to wait 2 years when they applied for green cards in the 90's. They told me about that process. Basically they had several interviews and were kept in limbo for over a year after the last interview. One day they were told that their green cards were just approved and they had to be on US soil in 90 days or they would lose the green cards. They lost a lot of money have to rush a property sale through as a result of the short notice which was different to the time frames they were given. So, yeah, I am aware of how tough the process can be, as well as how dodgy / quick / questionable. I do worry that some of those with bad intentions have connections somewhere on the inside that can make getting to the US a piece of cake for them.
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jetwet1
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:34 am

Pellegrine wrote:
I've decided that I'm going on a trip to Iran and with the people I know, if I have one second of detention we will be suing the US Gov and Donal Dump himself. I've always wanted to go to Iran. I dig their food and UNESCO World Heritage sites.


Please, go ahead and try to sue the Federal Government, have fun with that.

While I am 100% against Trump on this (and well everything), don't act like the people who put Trump in office.
 
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Pellegrine
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:38 am

jetwet1 wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:
I've decided that I'm going on a trip to Iran and with the people I know, if I have one second of detention we will be suing the US Gov and Donal Dump himself. I've always wanted to go to Iran. I dig their food and UNESCO World Heritage sites.


Please, go ahead and try to sue the Federal Government, have fun with that.

While I am 100% against Trump on this (and well everything), don't act like the people who put Trump in office.


Well we can all at least try something. Might have an effect, might not. I want to visit Palmyra too, but not with ISIS there...
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EA CO AS
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:53 am

Pellegrine wrote:
jetwet1 wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:
I've decided that I'm going on a trip to Iran and with the people I know, if I have one second of detention we will be suing the US Gov and Donal Dump himself. I've always wanted to go to Iran. I dig their food and UNESCO World Heritage sites.


Please, go ahead and try to sue the Federal Government, have fun with that.

While I am 100% against Trump on this (and well everything), don't act like the people who put Trump in office.


Well we can all at least try something. Might have an effect, might not. I want to visit Palmyra too, but not with ISIS there...


Just take whatever cash you'd planned on using to fund your lawsuit and set it on fire in your front yard.

The end result will be the same, yet quicker, and you'll at least get a pretty show and some warmth out of it.
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LJ
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 10:54 am

Pellegrine wrote:
I've decided that I'm going on a trip to Iran and with the people I know, if I have one second of detention we will be suing the US Gov and Donal Dump himself. I've always wanted to go to Iran. I dig their food and UNESCO World Heritage sites.


If you're a US passport holder you cannot go to Iran as they closed (or will close again) the border for US passport holders and thus you won't be in an aircraft going to Iran (I doubt that the overland options are viable at the moment), if you even get on an aircraft from the US.

BTw what people seem to forget is that one has to board an aircraft before one enters the USA (unless one takes a very long detour or only travells from Canada/Mexico). Given the penalties airlines (may) receive, it's very unlikely they'll let you board or only if you're 100% liable for the consequences (which may result in many USD in fines and return fares). Thus even a case-by-case approach will result in a complete ban as airlines reduce the risk.
 
NIKV69
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 11:28 am

DLFREEBIRD wrote:
Trump executive order is an attempt at government-mandated religious persecution. There is no other words to describe what he's done to the Muslim community.



No it isn't, a Muslim from Malaysia or Bangladesh doesn't fall under the exec order so I fail to see how this is Religious persecution.

Was the order written in haste and poorly worded? Sure but you are watching way too much Rachel Maddow.
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DLFREEBIRD
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 11:41 am

Iran is already a sanctioned country, U.S. citizens already have to purchase a ticket on a non-Iranian carrier to travel into Iran,


If Pellegrine has a diplomatic visa, NATO VISAS, C-2 VISA G-1,G-2,G-3, and G-4 visas which are typically issued for international organizations traveling to work he can go to and from Libya, Iran, Iraq, Somalia, Sudan, Syria and Yemen. If not he will have to wait out the 90 day ban, which will end April 27, 2017
 
ltbewr
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 11:54 am

I bet there will be other fallout from President Trump's* EO as to banning persons of certain countries. The deal as to Iran's nuclear program is dead. The plan to purchase Boeing aircraft by Iran is dead. I wouldn't be surprised that Israel will attempt to bomb Iran's nuclear sites soon that will blow up the whole Islamic world. More hate and likely terror attacks on the USA, USA and especially Trump branded properties. The price of oil could kick up due to a reaction to the bans. American based airlines will face boycotts. No doubt any tourism to the USA will drop off out of fear and protest.
The ban doesn't include Saudi Arabia as we sell them military weapons and due to the need for access for persons making pilgrimages to the Muslim holy sites there. Libya is on the list due to the attack on the USA consulate in Benghazi. I would suggest the selection of countries is deliberate in part to appease Israel.
President Trump* is making a real mess of our world. This is not going to end well for all of us.
 
salttee
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 11:57 am

Being an American in Iraq has just gotten dangerous.

Iraq's Popular Mobilization on Sunday called on the Iraqi government to ban U.S. nationals from entering Iraq and to expel those who are already in the country, in a reaction to the new U.S. travel curbs on Iraqis. Popular Mobilization is mainly a coalition of Shi'ite paramilitary groups armed and trained by Iran to fight Islamic State. It became an Iraqi government-approved body last year. The call to ban U.S. nationals came in a statement published by its spokesman, Ahmed al-Assadi.
 
DLFREEBIRD
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 11:57 am

NIKV69 wrote:
DLFREEBIRD wrote:
Trump executive order is an attempt at government-mandated religious persecution. There is no other words to describe what he's done to the Muslim community.



No it isn't, a Muslim from Malaysia or Bangladesh doesn't fall under the exec order so I fail to see how this is Religious persecution.

Was the order written in haste and poorly worded? Sure but you are watching way too much Rachel Maddow.



I don't have cable T.V. so i have no idea what Rachel Maddow is saying.

I do remember Trump saying .during the election that he would call for a complete and total shutdown of Muslims entering the United States. Then after being elected he signed a executive order disallowing anyone from a number of predominately Muslim nations from entering the United States.
 
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lugie
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:00 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
No it isn't, a Muslim from Malaysia or Bangladesh doesn't fall under the exec order so I fail to see how this is Religious persecution.

Was the order written in haste and poorly worded? Sure but you are watching way too much Rachel Maddow.


If this wasn't about muslims then green card/visa holders would have been exempt, which they were not until the New York court struck the order down.
If this was about increasing vetting for refugees from civil war zones, the ban wouldn't lock MIT students out of the country after paying a visit to their families in Iran.

Sure there are a few predominantly muslim nations not included in the ban but those are nations where Trump has business interests. Like Saudi-Arabia or Russia where the only foreign-born citizens to ever commit terrorist attacks on US soil were from.

This guy needs to be gone sooner rather than later or the entire world will pay the bill that a minority of idiots from the US are responsible for...
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KLDC10
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 3:03 pm

CplKlinger wrote:
777Jet wrote:
How could such a bad man win the election and become POTUS???


I dunno, Stalin and Lenin were elected, and look what they did.


Is that your seriously held understanding of how things worked in the USSR, or are you just trolling?
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Aesma
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:43 pm

This is not a jab at Tunisia as it's a country I like and they did succeed in their revolution, but there are literally thousands of ISIS fighters that are Tunisian. Meanwhile there are probably more ISIS fighters with US citizenship than with Iranian citizenship.

Yet Iran is the most affected by the ban, and Tunisia not at all.

Iran has its own goal in the conflict that we might not like, but as part of that goal they are fighting hard against ISIS, recruiting people all over the region to support that fight.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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Aesma
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 4:52 pm

lugie wrote:
This guy needs to be gone sooner rather than later or the entire world will pay the bill that a minority of idiots from the US are responsible for...


Don't forget Pence is a religious fanatic who wants the end of the world, I'm not sure we would be better off with him.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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Francoflier
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:04 pm

cpd wrote:
TheFlyingDisk wrote:
cpd wrote:
The countries that are strangely absent from the list, has anyone thought to check Trump's business interests in those places?


These are all "fake news", mind you.


Well it should be pretty easy for anyone to check, including the naysayers and Trump supporters, so they don't have to rely on fake news.


Trump can do no wrong...
So what if all of the countries he omitted from his ban happen to be countries where he has businesses?
Pakistan does not harbor Islamist terrorists and no Saudi Arabian has ever flown an airliner into a tower in NY, right?
:banghead:


Honestly, what kind of a moron would look at what he's doing and think that this makes perfect sense. He is violating the constitution and using the whole country as a business instrument for himself while he hypnotizes the gullible masses with populist, ineffective and possibly disastrous measures.

You could sell the London bridge to every one of the idiots who cheer for him.
Is it cool to be ignorant and dumb now? What is happening?
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
salttee
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:11 pm

In case anybody here doesn't know or somehow hasn't noticed, the Trump/Republican/AIPAC effort to bundle Iran with ISIS is absurd.

Iran is as opposed to ISIS as the west is.
 
Pyrex
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:15 pm

DLFREEBIRD wrote:
Trump executive order is an attempt at government-mandated religious persecution..


When you apply to a U.S. visa or Green Card, there is (and has been, for a long time, since I can remember) a question about whether someone has ever belonged to the German National Socialist Party, or language to that effect. Is that an attempt at government-mandated political persecution as well, or are you just being selective about your ideologies started by murderous military expansionists who forcibly conquered vast amounts of territory, based on how successful they (and their successors) were at doing it?

The 1st Amendment of the U.S. Constitution bans the government from discriminating against someone based on their religion or their political views. It does not give anyone the right to show up at a U.S. airport in full Klansperson or S.S. uniform and be expected in, unless they are a U.S. citizen, in which case there is nothing the government can do about it.
Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
 
salttee
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 5:25 pm

Pyrex wrote:

You think asking if someone is a Nazi is political persecution? ummmmmmmm
 
Flaps
Posts: 1645
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:18 pm

I don't necessarily agree on the green card issue but 100% agree with the rest. This about more than just immigration. It is part and parcel of a process that the US has finally had enough and things will be different going forward. If this same action had been taken by obummer the liberals would be dancing in the streets. This is all just sour grapes carryover from losing the election. You're pissed off because of who is calling the shots more so than the shots that are being called.

To those who think you are so superior:

"Flyover Country" is America. America is not the snotty liberal cadre from the coastal big cities. That snotty liberal cadre while highly vocal is simply not representative of the country as a whole. Your opinions are minority opinions no matter how much volume you try to throw into the equation. The rest of us do not view you as you view yourselves. America has spoken and for once we are actually getting some of the things we voted for.
 
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Aesma
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:28 pm

Supposedly Trump was successful in the election because he's a successful businessman. How much of his business was built in liberal places and how much elsewhere ? There is no reason to be dismissive of "flyover country" but politicians should have as a goal to make that part of the country enter the 21st century, not move the coasts back to the 20th. Which will never happen anyway.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
L410Turbolet
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:43 pm

salttee wrote:
Pyrex wrote:

You think asking if someone is a Nazi is political persecution? ummmmmmmm


Since there is no question about being communist it is (sort of).
 
salttee
Posts: 3149
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:48 pm

Flaps wrote:
the US has finally had enough and things will be different going forward.

The US has finally had enough of a rational forward looking foreign policy, which has been transparent and debated publicly?

You think it's better to adjust our foreign policy to the desires of a bunch of people who for the most part speak no foreign languages and don't hold passports? The very same people who supported George Bush in his nonsensical war in Iraq - for the very same reasons they now support Trump?

Are you mad?
 
salttee
Posts: 3149
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2016 3:26 am

Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:49 pm

L410Turbolet wrote:
salttee wrote:
Pyrex wrote:

You think asking if someone is a Nazi is political persecution? ummmmmmmm


Since there is no question about being communist it is (sort of).


You must have missed the day they taught WW2 in your HS history class.
 
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pvjin
Posts: 3586
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:51 pm

salttee wrote:
The US has finally had enough of a rational forward looking foreign policy, which has been transparent and debated publicly?

You think it's better to adjust our foreign policy to the desires of a bunch of people who for the most part speak no foreign languages and don't hold passports? The very same people who supported George Bush in his nonsensical war in Iraq - for the very same reasons they now support Trump?

Are you mad?


Your foreign policy under Obama has been an utter failure as far as world peace is concerned. Opposing Assad & Gaddafi and supporting Islamist rebels in Syria and Libya has prolonged the conflicts and increased the terror threat towards west. Russian sanctions haven't helped either, it's not western world's business what Russia does in areas where ethnic Russians are the majority.
"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - Martin Luther King Jr
 
salttee
Posts: 3149
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2016 3:26 am

Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:03 pm

pvjin wrote:
Your foreign policy under Obama has been an utter failure as far as world peace is concerned.

Yes I know it pissed you Russian lackeys off.
 
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pvjin
Posts: 3586
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:07 pm

salttee wrote:
pvjin wrote:
Your foreign policy under Obama has been an utter failure as far as world peace is concerned.

Yes I know it pissed you Russian lackeys off.


No, it pissed off a lot of EU citizen whose countries faced a wave of terror, crime and increasing costs with the flow of refugees Obama caused. But of course you don't give a damn about rest of the world.
"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - Martin Luther King Jr
 
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lugie
Posts: 859
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Re: VISA Issues and immigration Presidential Directive

Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:17 pm

Flaps wrote:
"Flyover Country" is America. America is not the snotty liberal cadre from the coastal big cities. That snotty liberal cadre while highly vocal is simply not representative of the country as a whole. Your opinions are minority opinions no matter how much volume you try to throw into the equation. The rest of us do not view you as you view yourselves. America has spoken and for once we are actually getting some of the things we voted for.


Flyover country is a part of America just like the coastal liberal cities.
If anything the latter are by far the more important part of America because the last time I checked Oklahoma was not the nation's economic powerhouse. Neither was Kansas nor was West Virginia, nor Alabama and I could go on but I'll stop here.

Furthermore, Anti-Trump opinions are not the majority at all because as you might remember, 3 million more people voted Clinton than Trump and half the nation voted for neither.
It's the Trumpies who, while being really vocal, will forever be the minority.
Being loud doesn't make a minority the majority and most importantly doesn't make a lie a truth.
Last edited by lugie on Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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