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petertenthije
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Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Tue Feb 14, 2017 9:48 pm

According to various sources Peugeot is looking into taking over General Motors' European division.

http://www.autoweek.nl/nieuws/peugeot-a ... -vauxhall/
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-opel- ... SKBN15T1AL

If this goes through it would make the combined PSA/GM-EU group the second player in Europe after VW-group.The deal might be announced within days.

This would certainly shake up the European market. It would also affect other GM brands. Opel builds various models for Buick (particularly for the Chinese market) and Holden, while marketing the Chevrolet Volt as Opel Ampera.
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Aesma
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 12:59 am

Interesting. PSA had to be bailed out a few years ago, the Chinese Dongfeng entered the capital, and the French state took an equal stake to even things out.

The Opel Ampera didn't sell and was discontinued two years ago.

I await eagerly Trump's opinion.
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Flighty
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 3:51 am

Opel hasn't made money in years, but it has been a technology center for GM. GM has now expanded its technology bases elsewhere.

It is time for consolidation in Europe and this is an obvious candidate. So uh, I vote yes.
 
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Francoflier
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:06 am

Consolidation indeed...

Opel/Vauxhall/Buick and PSA mostly operate on the same segments and compete for the same market.

Their models are very similar in terms of who they aim to sell them to. We're talking middle of the range, relatively bland vehicles that seek to appeal to the greatest number while not standing out in any way.
I am not sure if that means they will be extensively chopping from either or both brands to remove competing models and just use the extended sales network to drive volumes, or keep the brand separate and take advantage of Buick's presence in China to increase their marketshare there, and maybe in the US too.
I guess we should expect models that share a common platform across all these brands soon...

I'm curious about how the GM/Buick brands would evolve from there if this happened.
Would Buick become a separate entity in the US (and China) operating independently from GM, or would GM keep the Buick brand and either keep buying their cars from PSA/Opel or slap the badge on different models from one of their other sub-brand?

As a car enthusiast, I'm not a huge fan of these massive consolidations as they tend to drive down diversity, but I can't say I'm a huge fan of either of these brands. Opel have simply never done it for me, and Pugs hasn't really done cool cars since the early 2000s when they stopped working with Pininfarina IMO.
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PanHAM
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:34 am

The Brexit and the following weakening of the Pound is the main reason for this "sale". GM does not understand the European market. They caused the downward trend of the Opel brand started in the 80s when GM ordered cost cutting. The result was that Opel produced the same shitboxes as Detroit did. Opel worked hard since the rescue a couple of years ago, brand frecognition improved and they would have produced a Profit for 2016 if it wasn't for Brexit. If there is one Surplus plant to Close, it's Luton-
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Kiwirob
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:32 am

I was surprised it's taken GM this long to cut there European operations loose, I know they came close to it 2009 with a possible sale to Magna.

I can see why Peugeot would be interested, with Renault in an alliance with Nissan, Peugeot needs volume to compete. It's a big win for them. Carlos Tavares is no fool, along with Ghosn at Renault Nissan he's one of the very best auto company CEO's, he wouldn't be looking at Opel if he couldn't make money from it.
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:33 am

PanHAM wrote:
If there is one Surplus plant to Close, it's Luton-


More likely a high labor cost German plant would go.
 
PanHAM
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 8:28 am

High labor costs can be cheaper when combined with high productivity.
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Dano1977
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 9:29 am

PanHAM wrote:
High labor costs can be cheaper when combined with high productivity.



Ellesmere Port would be the most likely candidate. It only produces the Astra.


Doesn't Luton build the Vans for Renault, Vauxhall/Opel and Nissan?
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Aesma
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 10:26 am

Peugeot doesn't make "interesting" cars because Citroën and DS are there for that.

As for bland, most Audis look the same and this across the range and generations.

PSA has a strong presence in China (hence why a Chinese manufacturer was interested in buying it), not just Buick.
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Airstud
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:18 am

petertenthije wrote:
marketing the Chevrolet Volt as Opel Ampera.


It's neat to see the ways different manufacturers try to market electric/hybrid cars.

I think they should market the "Ohm" - to people who resist.
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Aesma
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:25 am

The technology in the Volt/Ampera is interesting and got my attention, I wish it would be RWD and wouldn't have any connexion between the petrol engine and the driving wheels (or maybe a connexion with the other two wheels, if it proves more efficient to still use a small amount of its power in that way, when it has to run because the battery is empty).

The problem it faced in Europe is a high price and a sedan form.
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planeophilic
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:39 am

So finally the French are taking something German, and not the other way around.
As a 13 year long Opel owner, I am waiting, with anticipation, and hoping something good comes outta it.
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diverted
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 12:48 pm

PanHAM wrote:
The Brexit and the following weakening of the Pound is the main reason for this "sale". GM does not understand the European market. They caused the downward trend of the Opel brand started in the 80s when GM ordered cost cutting. The result was that Opel produced the same shitboxes as Detroit did. Opel worked hard since the rescue a couple of years ago, brand frecognition improved and they would have produced a Profit for 2016 if it wasn't for Brexit. If there is one Surplus plant to Close, it's Luton-



Classic case of GM knowing better than everyone, which in fact was more of an example of their hubris.

They had a good thing with the Opel Kadett B. It was the second best selling car in the US.(And outsold the Beetle in Germany) So what did they do? Well, instead of investing money in Opel in North America, they continued selling them through Buick dealers.

Meanwhile, MB and BMW started making serious headway in North America. And what did GM do? Theycalled them the Buick Opels. Then Buick Opels by Isuzu. Meanwhile they figured the Vega would be the next big thing, and well, as usual, the General cocked it up big time.

A few short decades later, they tried the Opel in North America again. Remember the Cadillac Catera? Saturn Astra and Aura?


A nice summary here
You can see that GM never really had a clear plan for Opel. Maybe it could have worked if Opel hadn’t been forced to support Buick and Isuzu and Vauxhall and Holden and Cadillac and Saturn. Maybe it could have worked if Opel was given all of those programs’ funding instead. Maybe it could have worked if its planning had been clear: a world car from the start, built in America and marketed with the best of them.

Instead Opel’s German engineers kept plugging away at their own designs and GM employed their work to patch whatever momentary problem it had elsewhere in the world.

To say that Opel was GM’s duct tape would be too kind. Opel has had to do the job of a plaintive bumper sticker, desperately holding the crashed ass of GM together, never able to do the job repeatedly asked of it.


Source: http://jalopnik.com/gm-has-never-known- ... 1792346132
 
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Francoflier
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 4:18 pm

Airstud wrote:
I think they should market the "Ohm" - to people who resist.


:highfive:

PanHAM wrote:
High labor costs can be cheaper when combined with high productivity.


I'm guessing the productivity of a German auto worker and his British counterparts will be similar. The Brit, however, would cost less to a company that makes most of its revenue in currencies other than the Pound...
I think it's too early for international manufacturers to pull the plug on UK production. If they can somehow get around paying higher tariffs for their imports into the UK (which they probably could if they threaten to close the lines) and a decent deal on export tariffs out of that factory -or better yet, if they sell most of the production from that factory in the UK- then it might make sense to keep their presence there. A weak currency does have benefits.
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WIederling
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 5:01 pm

Flighty wrote:
Opel hasn't made money in years, but it has been a technology center for GM. GM has now expanded its technology bases elsewhere.


GM moved all IP rights from Opel to some offshore "GM Antiqua" entity or other.
Opel pays significant license fees for every car made.
More than the industry manages on average as profits.
Completely unsurprising that they don't make any money in Germany.
Add in dysfunctional US style management that only knows about rape ....

The transfer to PSA will afaics run aground or will come into heavy seas.
GM completely bypassed the worker council which is illegal here.
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luckyone
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 5:59 pm

diverted wrote:
A few short decades later, they tried the Opel in North America again. Remember the Cadillac Catera? Saturn Astra and Aura?

GM continues to sell some of its overseas products in the United States, and they're doing quite well with it. A few examples off the top of my head are the Buick Regal, which was designed and engineered as the Insignia, the Buick Encore/Chevy Trax which is the Opel/Vauxhall Mokka, and the new Chevy Cruze is basically an Astra in slightly tweaked sheet metal, especially the hatchback.
 
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Aesma
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:30 pm

BTW is GM South Korea part of the deal ? It seems they're involved in the design of most Opel cars. Extricating the European part might not be simple. What would PSA want exactly ? Surely not the plants, as they're closing several of their own already. Not saying they would close Opel plants, just that it can't be the reason for the buy. Or do they just want to eliminate a competitor ? The market doesn't think so apparently, my Renault shares went down amid a bullish market.
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mham001
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:56 pm

Francoflier wrote:
Consolidation indeed...

Opel/Vauxhall/Buick and PSA mostly operate on the same segments and compete for the same market.

Their models are very similar in terms of who they aim to sell them to. We're talking middle of the range, relatively bland vehicles that seek to appeal to the greatest number while not standing out in any way.
I am not sure if that means they will be extensively chopping from either or both brands to remove competing models and just use the extended sales network to drive volumes, or keep the brand separate and take advantage of Buick's presence in China to increase their marketshare there, and maybe in the US too.
I guess we should expect models that share a common platform across all these brands soon...

I'm curious about how the GM/Buick brands would evolve from there if this happened.
Would Buick become a separate entity in the US (and China) operating independently from GM, or would GM keep the Buick brand and either keep buying their cars from PSA/Opel or slap the badge on different models from one of their other sub-brand?

As a car enthusiast, I'm not a huge fan of these massive consolidations as they tend to drive down diversity, but I can't say I'm a huge fan of either of these brands. Opel have simply never done it for me, and Pugs hasn't really done cool cars since the early 2000s when they stopped working with Pininfarina IMO.


They are not selling Buick.
 
Pyrex
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:41 am

My family was / is an Opel household. My dad had a 1988 Opel Kadett 3-door that lasted over 20 years (although pretty low miles), and ended up being the first car I could routinely drive on the road after getting my driver's license (he wouldn't lend me his "new" 2000 Opel Astra). I still remember my parents driving it almost new from Portugal to London, with me and my sister (little kids at the time) and lots of luggage in the back, and then cruising most of the UK and Northern France in it for two years, despite having the steering wheel on the left side.

I always considered Opel as the cheapest way to access German engineering - never quite as good as VW, but more affordable. They have a pretty good reputation and market presence in Portugal, and they do a lot of engineering work for other GM brands (Chevrolet's sold in Brazil are mostly older Opel models, for one). I am surprised GM never managed to make money with it, and is actively considering selling it (they will be left with very little in Europe and several other countries after that).
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mham001
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:51 am

Pyrex wrote:
My family was / is an Opel household. My dad had a 1988 Opel Kadett 3-door that lasted over 20 years (although pretty low miles), and ended up being the first car I could routinely drive on the road after getting my driver's license (he wouldn't lend me his "new" 2000 Opel Astra). I still remember my parents driving it almost new from Portugal to London, with me and my sister (little kids at the time) and lots of luggage in the back, and then cruising most of the UK and Northern France in it for two years, despite having the steering wheel on the left side.

I always considered Opel as the cheapest way to access German engineering - never quite as good as VW, but more affordable. They have a pretty good reputation and market presence in Portugal, and they do a lot of engineering work for other GM brands (Chevrolet's sold in Brazil are mostly older Opel models, for one). I am surprised GM never managed to make money with it, and is actively considering selling it (they will be left with very little in Europe and several other countries after that).


I had two 70's Kadetts in the early 80's, one made in W Germany, one in S Korea. They were well made cars with mediocre reliabilty but far better overall cars than the VWs we saw at the time.
 
PanHAM
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:12 am

The logic step for PSA would be to Close some plants in France, since the productivity of Opel is better then their onw.

That's the Advantage of having high labour costs. Likely however that this won't happen, the French unions would burn the places down.
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SQ325
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:37 pm

I am very interested in the new Ampera put for sure will skip it if Opel becomes PSA!
PSA quality simply sucks! No way i would buy a "Peugeot" Ampera
 
WIederling
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:26 pm

SQ325 wrote:
I am very interested in the new Ampera put for sure will skip it if Opel becomes PSA!
PSA quality simply sucks! No way i would buy a "Peugeot" Ampera


There are enough PSA native e-drive offers around.
( Though the Citroën C-ZERO and Peugeot iOn are in all essence a Mitsubishi i-MIeV :-)

does the Ampera/Volt platform sell at all ?
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Aesma
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Fri Feb 17, 2017 10:18 pm

The Volt is a GM USA product so it would have nothing to do with PSA.

The Peugeot 308 has won European Car of the Year in 2014 so quality can't be that bad.
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cpd
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 2:34 am

Aesma wrote:
The Volt is a GM USA product so it would have nothing to do with PSA.

The Peugeot 308 has won European Car of the Year in 2014 so quality can't be that bad.


Well, there have been some "interesting" European Car of the Year choices before, so I'd be cautious. One year the Ford Scorpio beat out the Lancia/Autobianchi Y10.. Another year the Fiat Tipo won. And the Citroen XM was surely an interesting choice, of an equally interesting and controversial car. At least they did choose the Focus over the Peugeot 206, although I guess many people were blinded by Peugeot's fantastic TV and viral marketing campaign with the Hindustan Ambassador being reshaped into a 206. :D Still one of the great car commercials. :)


WIederling wrote:
SQ325 wrote:
I am very interested in the new Ampera put for sure will skip it if Opel becomes PSA!
PSA quality simply sucks! No way i would buy a "Peugeot" Ampera


There are enough PSA native e-drive offers around.
( Though the Citroën C-ZERO and Peugeot iOn are in all essence a Mitsubishi i-MIeV :-)

does the Ampera/Volt platform sell at all ?


Does anyone buy the iMiev at all? Here in my country it is frightfully expensive, extremely tiny and very compromised. Yes, admirable for being electric, but not really a proper car.

From what I've seen, the Volt/Ampera is a more mature machine. It's actually a fairly decent car first and foremost. But it is also really costly too.
 
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Aesma
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 3:55 am

At my job a colleague was given a iOn as he lives close-by so didn't need too much range (at least to come and go home), he gave it back after a week as it really wasn't suited to our use, we regularly drive far and need to transport stuff.

Now the electric car of choice is the Renault Zoe, pretty similar to the Clios we drive, except for the powertrain of course.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
cpd
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 4:18 am

Aesma wrote:
At my job a colleague was given a iOn as he lives close-by so didn't need too much range (at least to come and go home), he gave it back after a week as it really wasn't suited to our use, we regularly drive far and need to transport stuff.

Now the electric car of choice is the Renault Zoe, pretty similar to the Clios we drive, except for the powertrain of course.


One crucial difference with Zoe, it looks like a normal car. Electric cars shouldn't be crazy, unusual circus machines on wheels, they need to be electric of course, but also function as ordinary proper cars.

An electric VW Golf or Tiguan would be the perfect example. A normal car first and foremost.
 
ltbewr
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 4:35 am

Why would PSA want GM Europe ? GM-E plants are mainly in high labor costs countries including the UK and Germany. Would the Euro Chevy brand models be included ? Are GM-E diesels any good (likely PSA's are better). They pretty much only gain a small market share in Europe, one that is mature and dying. Then there would be the complications of some current GM models based on or partially made in Europe. Ford isn't into buying other car makers, FCA (Fiat-Chrysler) has its own issues both in Europe and North America and could be weakened by a PSA-GM-E deal. Then there is the Brexit and other EC relationship issues along with the EC saying no on anti-trust grounds.
 
Flighty
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 4:59 am

ltbewr, I can't think of a reason except to get rid of a competitor, and maybe along the sides of this deal, they acquire some engineers, or some part of GM technology or footprint that they want (real estate in Germany?).
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 7:00 am

Flighty wrote:
ltbewr, I can't think of a reason except to get rid of a competitor, and maybe along the sides of this deal, they acquire some engineers, or some part of GM technology or footprint that they want (real estate in Germany?).


Volume is the reason.
 
Asiaflyer
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 8:23 am

This would be a great move for Opel. GM has mismanaged Opel for decades and not reinvested enough in ner programs.
American auto makers has been doing terrible bad with everything they touched abroad for a long time. Just look hos Ford mismanaged Volvo for years and now Volvo is making record profits after been sold to Geely.
 
ltbewr
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 9:31 am

I guess for PSA it is either buy or be bought, they are caught in the middle. The costs to meet escalating environmental and safety standards in cars means you need to be big to have the capital and afford the engineering costs to do so. Many markets for PSA and other brands have matured. China is about the only growing market although that may be reaching practical limits. Japanese, Korean and now China based brands, due to evolving open trade agreements, have shrunk markets for some Euro and US based brands. Some models of cars and light commercial vehicles are already being cross-made by one company and sold under different brands.
 
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 10:48 am

cpd wrote:
WIederling wrote:
does the Ampera/Volt platform sell at all ?

Does anyone buy the iMiev at all? Here in my country it is frightfully expensive, extremely tiny and very compromised. Yes, admirable for being electric, but not really a proper car.
From what I've seen, the Volt/Ampera is a more mature machine. It's actually a fairly decent car first and foremost. But it is also really costly too.


IMHo they are real "häßlich" and lack room in the inside.
We have one small no frills cheap car for daily errants that is bought new and run into the ground.
When our last Hyundai Atos needed replacement (245Mm) I did some test driving ( Space Star) at our nearest Mitsubishi dealership.
Same place had a used iMIeV for sale ( 14k€, 2years ) took this for a ride and liked it very much. Small outside
but comparatively roomy on the inside. No Buy due to price and lack of range. Other wise ...
We went back and settled on a brand new 2016 Hyundai I10 : <8000k€ ( due to the base model having some desired features that the Space Start did not have.)
Murphy is an optimist
 
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Channex757
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:22 am

I never thought GM would essentially abandon the Holden brand either by taking production out of Australia and just badging Korean-built imports instead, so nothing is off the table with Vauxhall/Opel.

Astra at Ellesmere Port is an efficient plant that could be sold by PSA to someone like JLR. Much of the fat was trimmed to get the contract for the latest Astra. Vans at Luton would be an interesting spin-off as it's essentially a separate business and no longer seems to have any Renault link. If anything it's high-wage plants in Germany that are at stake as much of Opel's production is in the slower selling lines. Corsa is built in Spain and other models come from Korea.

Open also has factories in places like Russia to consider.
 
diverted
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 5:53 pm

luckyone wrote:
diverted wrote:
A few short decades later, they tried the Opel in North America again. Remember the Cadillac Catera? Saturn Astra and Aura?

GM continues to sell some of its overseas products in the United States, and they're doing quite well with it. A few examples off the top of my head are the Buick Regal, which was designed and engineered as the Insignia, the Buick Encore/Chevy Trax which is the Opel/Vauxhall Mokka, and the new Chevy Cruze is basically an Astra in slightly tweaked sheet metal, especially the hatchback.


Oh absolutely. Chevy SS is a Holden. What I meant was that GM had a prime opportunity to have Opel as a brand in North America. They had a prime opportunity and wasted it. And then dropped Opel's on us as a Cadillac. They should have built on that brand awareness from the Kadet, rather than letting Opel languish as Buick Opels, Buick Opels by Isuzu, and then resorting to slapping Saturn and Cadillac badges on them.
 
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Channex757
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Sat Feb 18, 2017 6:16 pm

Sad truth of this is that the British workers will get it up the trumper as they are the easiest to sack, if PSA wants to rationalise the business. That's why Ford have gradually closed down all their production in the UK of complete vehicles, including the iconic Transit line at Southampton which got moved to Turkey.

The only hope I hold out is that those two Vauxhall businesses get sold rather than shuttered. Maybe Ellesmere Port would be ideal for the new smaller Jaguar line that fits below the XE.
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 7:41 am

Might take over became will take over this morning. Interesting point to according to the report I watched this morning the UK plants will not be closed, they are GMs most productive, efficient and cheap to run production facilities in Europe, so it looks like it will be the German plants taking the hit.
 
Olddog
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 7:58 am

Depends off the Brexit tariff deal I guess
 
tommy1808
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 8:21 am

Kiwirob wrote:
Interesting point to according to the report I watched this morning the UK plants will not be closed, they are GMs most productive, efficient and cheap to run production facilities in Europe, so it looks like it will be the German plants taking the hit.


Plant. There is just one in Ellesmere Port, and they only make the Astra. And that car isn´t build in Germany at all, but in Poland. And that production line has just been updated a year ago. And it is located in a special economic zone. So i am very much in doubt the UK Plant has much economic advantage, on top of being well undersized to cover demand.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
cpd
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 8:53 am

It will be announced on Monday.
 
vc10
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 9:02 am

Sadly the British car industry has not got a good record as far as ownership by the French, as you only have to recall PSA's last take over in the UK . Rootes group , which became part of Chrysler was sold to PSA who rapidly closed their Linwood plant and eventually closed the Renton plant so ceasing production in the UK
 
LAH1
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 9:06 am

Plants - The UK factories at Ellesmere Port and Luton employ about 4,500 people. bbc
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 9:19 am

tommy1808 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Interesting point to according to the report I watched this morning the UK plants will not be closed, they are GMs most productive, efficient and cheap to run production facilities in Europe, so it looks like it will be the German plants taking the hit.


Plant. There is just one in Ellesmere Port, and they only make the Astra. And that car isn´t build in Germany at all, but in Poland. And that production line has just been updated a year ago. And it is located in a special economic zone. So i am very much in doubt the UK Plant has much economic advantage, on top of being well undersized to cover demand.

best regards
Thomas


Plants, that means more than one, in this case two, Luton and Ellesmere Port, both have manufacturing contracts until 2021 and 2025 which are apparently unbreakable.
 
tommy1808
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 10:11 am

Kiwirob wrote:
Plants, that means more than one, in this case two, Luton and Ellesmere Port, both have manufacturing contracts until 2021 and 2025 which are apparently unbreakable.


Plant. IBC Vehicles Limited isn´t Opel, and has a single model they build, which incidentally isn´t build anywhere else. The only redundancy that can be eliminated is the Astra production, and that is happening in Poland and the UK (+ St. Petersburg). The UK plant is soon 10% import tariff away from the EU market, as the UK is going WTO. Which happens to be Opels biggest market....

So, there simply isn´t a German plant in jeopardy.With sales in Russia being slow, St. Petersburg may be threatened, but even that is unlikely.

best regards
Thomas

.
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
MileHFL400
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 10:22 am

Oh great, a maker of very mediocre and fragile cars taking over a maker of more mediocre and very uninteresting cars
Thanks and best Regards
AA
 
melpax
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 10:33 am

Channex757 wrote:
I never thought GM would essentially abandon the Holden brand either by taking production out of Australia and just badging Korean-built imports instead, so nothing is off the table with Vauxhall/Opel.


With Commodore production ending later this year, Holden has been slowly replacing some of the Korean-built cars with some of the Opel lineup.

Cruze production finished up in Adelaide last year, Holden have re-introduced the Astra as a replacement. Holden are planning on replacing the Commodore & the Korean-built Malibu with a Holden-badged Insignia, not sure what will happen with Opel being sold off, will be interesting to see what happens.

GM will still be retaining the Holden design studio in Melbourne post-closedown, as well as the proving ground just outside Melbourne. They were initially looking into selling the proving ground off, but had a change of mind. Suspect that GM did not want it falling into the hands of a competitor.
 
LAH1
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 10:59 am

tommy1808 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Plants, that means more than one, in this case two, Luton and Ellesmere Port, both have manufacturing contracts until 2021 and 2025 which are apparently unbreakable.


Plant. IBC Vehicles Limited isn´t Opel, and has a single model they build, which incidentally isn´t build anywhere else. The only redundancy that can be eliminated is the Astra production, and that is happening in Poland and the UK (+ St. Petersburg). The UK plant is soon 10% import tariff away from the EU market, as the UK is going WTO. Which happens to be Opels biggest market....

So, there simply isn´t a German plant in jeopardy.With sales in Russia being slow, St. Petersburg may be threatened, but even that is unlikely.

best regards
Thomas

.


Ok. have it your way but this news item seems to suggest that there are two plants and they are both at risk. And this bit backs up what Kiwirob wrote :-
The new owners met government and unions last week and provided assurance that existing production commitments would be honoured at Ellesmere Port till 2020 and Luton for some years beyond that.
 
LAH1
Posts: 153
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 3:24 pm

Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:01 am

This is the link that I missed, apologies.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-39175740
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: Peugeot might take over Opel/Vauxhall!

Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:22 am

tommy1808 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Plants, that means more than one, in this case two, Luton and Ellesmere Port, both have manufacturing contracts until 2021 and 2025 which are apparently unbreakable.


Plant. IBC Vehicles Limited isn´t Opel, and has a single model they build, which incidentally isn´t build anywhere else. The only redundancy that can be eliminated is the Astra production, and that is happening in Poland and the UK (+ St. Petersburg). The UK plant is soon 10% import tariff away from the EU market, as the UK is going WTO. Which happens to be Opels biggest market....

So, there simply isn´t a German plant in jeopardy.With sales in Russia being slow, St. Petersburg may be threatened, but even that is unlikely.

best regards
Thomas

.


IBC Vehicles is owned by Vauxhall, which in turn is owned by Opel, which in turn is owned by GM who are about to sell to PSA. It's two plants in the UK, whiccever way you try to spin it both are going to be bought by PSA, both are the most efficient plants owned by GM in Europe and both have long term contracts.

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