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TerminalD
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Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 2:54 pm

It appears this is the version without Iraq.

The Supreme Court has decided to hear arguments on President Trump's travel ban affecting citizens of six mostly Muslim countries and will be argued in October.

The high court also lifted most of the injunction blocking the president's travel ban, allowing it to take effect in most instances


http://www.cbsnews.com/news/supreme-cou ... e-updates/
 
ikramerica
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:14 pm

Not sure this is the right forum.

The decision was constitutionally correct. It both protects the individual us citizen and the power of the executive branch to set immigration rules as granted by congress.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
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usxguy
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:16 pm

I'm still surprised Hawai'i pushed for it -- considering they don't get many visitors at all from those portions of the globe.

I support our country's efforts to figure out how to manage immigration/entry of citizens from these nations.
xx
 
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Jayafe
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:17 pm

Whatever is needed to protect the status quo of the US majors. "Market" was that called?
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:19 pm

what Effect on the ME3?
 
ikramerica
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:20 pm

usxguy wrote:
I'm still surprised Hawai'i pushed for it -- considering they don't get many visitors at all from those portions of the globe.

I support our country's efforts to figure out how to manage immigration/entry of citizens from these nations.

It was one person in Hawaii, a puppet of course, but one person. They are there legally from one of the countries and said it was unfair that their relatives can't visit when people who aren't from those countries can have their relatives visit. Despite the absurdity of that, the court agreed to lift the ban for those people only until they can meet in the fall and consider it.

I call it absurd because people from Cuba, North Korea, China, USSR and Eastern Block, Iran, Syria, Vietnam etc have all had similar restrictions in place over the years.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
Bricktop
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:22 pm

Jayafe wrote:
Whatever is needed to protect the status quo of the US majors. "Market" was that called?

Yeah, because the absolute first thing on the US Supreme Court's mind is the ME3/US3 battle. :roll:
 
CriticalPoint
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:27 pm

Bricktop wrote:
Jayafe wrote:
Whatever is needed to protect the status quo of the US majors. "Market" was that called?

Yeah, because the absolute first thing on the US Supreme Court's mind is the ME3/US3 battle. :roll:


Well in all fairness this IS an aviation forum not a political forum. So if politics, such as the travel ban, are going to be discussed on airliners.net it should focus around it's impact on aviation and NOT political opinion.

But your point is valid. How airlines around the world will profit or not profit isn't even on the radar of the Suprem Court of the United States.
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:31 pm

The ironic thing is that this should now be irrelevant. The travel ban is temporary for 90 days while alternative vetting procedures are considered, or so goes the administration's reasoning. It was proposed 5 months ago, so why have these vetting procedures not been considered and implemented given that they have had two more months than they believed they needed? I don't believe for a second that INS would be overwhelmed and unable to address this question while continuing to process immigrants from these nations, if the administration was serious this could have been already resolved. Implementing the ban now is nothing more than bravado "I told you so" and a bone to the base.
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dmstorm22
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:33 pm

A bit much to say 'travel ban in effect' when only a portion of the ban is in effect now.

Anyone with an active visa/green-card, or applying that can show a bona-fide connection to the US (family, work, etc.), could be granted a visa/access. Just my $0.02, but if that limitation was in the initial EO itself, it probably doesn't get struck down.
 
Brickell305
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:34 pm

ikramerica wrote:
Not sure this is the right forum.

The decision was constitutionally correct. It both protects the individual us citizen and the power of the executive branch to set immigration rules as granted by congress.


No decision has been made. The court agreed to hear the case and until such time as they rule on it, the injunction has been lifted.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:39 pm

Good call.

There should never have been an injunction to start with.

The executive branch has always been afforded wide discretion in setting immigration policy and is also vested with task of evaluating and balancing national security.
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DfwRevolution
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:40 pm

usxguy wrote:
I'm still surprised Hawai'i pushed for it -- considering they don't get many visitors at all from those portions of the globe.


It's called venue shopping. The plaintiffs were looking for a sympathetic judge and found one in Hawaii.

RyanairGuru wrote:
if the administration was serious this could have been already resolved. Implementing the ban now is nothing more than bravado "I told you so" and a bone to the base.


It's also about defending the President's right to exercise powers that were a.) defined in the Constitution and b.) augmented by laws passed by Congress.
I have a three post per topic limit. You're welcome to have the last word.
 
ikramerica
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:49 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
ikramerica wrote:
Not sure this is the right forum.

The decision was constitutionally correct. It both protects the individual us citizen and the power of the executive branch to set immigration rules as granted by congress.


No decision has been made. The court agreed to hear the case and until such time as they rule on it, the injunction has been lifted.

Partially lifting an injunction is a defecto decision. It says that part A is likely to prevail, part B needs further consideration but could lose as presented.

It's telegraphing. It's very unlikely they will rule 100% in favor of the injunction later after lifting some of it now.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
Brickell305
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:49 pm

I kindly suggest that the thread title be changed as it is highly misleading. The Supreme Court agreed to hear the case and lifted the injunction PENDING THE OUTCOME OF THE HEARING. It has not ruled either way on whether or not the travel ban is constitutional.
 
Brickell305
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 4:02 pm

ikramerica wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
ikramerica wrote:
Not sure this is the right forum.

The decision was constitutionally correct. It both protects the individual us citizen and the power of the executive branch to set immigration rules as granted by congress.


No decision has been made. The court agreed to hear the case and until such time as they rule on it, the injunction has been lifted.

Partially lifting an injunction is a defecto decision. It says that part A is likely to prevail, part B needs further consideration but could lose as presented.

It's telegraphing. It's very unlikely they will rule 100% in favor of the injunction later after lifting some of it now.


In order for the ban to be fully reinstated, it will require a 5 vote majority. That has not happened as there hasn't been a case/hearing/any arguments brought before the court. Again, the lifting of the injunction is pending the outcome of the case. It's not telegraphing anything.
 
P1aneMad
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 4:16 pm

Jayafe wrote:
Whatever is needed to protect the status quo of the US majors. "Market" was that called?

Do you even know how many weekly flights the US majors combined have in these countries? No? I thought so...
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 4:17 pm

White House statement:

Image
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KLDC10
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 4:57 pm

In terms of the immediate effect on Civil Aviation, are we to expect that there will once again be mass protests at major international airports like JFK and LAX? Such protests would be entirely pointless given that there is now quite literally nothing to be achieved therefrom, but I wouldn't be surprised if there was to be some disruption over the coming days.
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Metjetceo
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 6:19 pm

To clarify, it wont go into effect (per earlier memo prior to ruling) per the White House.
 
LMP737
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 6:24 pm

LAXintl wrote:
White House statement:

Image


It has very little to do with keeping people safe. It has everything to do with pandering to peoples ignorance and hate. He want's to keep Americans safe? Figure out a way to keep them from killing each other. Because statistically speaking that's whose doing the killing in the good old US of A.
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casinterest
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 6:34 pm

Let's summarize.

1. Trump issues Bigoted 1st Travel Ban. Gets hands down rejected by most appeals courts
2.Trump issues watered down 2nd travel ban.
3. Green card plantiffs appeal again. Get injunction,
4. Trump appeals to Supreme Court.
5. Supreme Courts says we will hear case, people with bona fides( Green Card holders and others) can enter country .
6. Rest of ban can take effect

Trump has tweeted that he never wanted the 2nd ban, he wanted the first, so for those claiming this all is a win for him, are either missing the conversation, or their bar is so low a toddler can clear it .
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
910A
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 7:11 pm

LAXintl wrote:
White House statement:

Image


Just another lie from the Trump administration. There was no 9-0 decision. All that was done was to lift the injunction, and even the USSC justices think the case will be moot, since the Trump administration should have completed their vetting by October.
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 8:56 pm

Immigration is within executive branch powers and can impose any kind of restriction.

A foreign can always appeal visa rejection or a US person can always file a lawsuit on behalf of a foreigner.

Sure Bannon went overboard with first few days of Travel Ban v1 against the advice of DHS officials, that has been straightened out.

Just because Trump is president, laws won't change, ie., courts cannot impose a temporary ban on Presidential powers.
All posts are just opinions.
 
jetero
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:23 pm

KLDC10 wrote:
Such protests would be entirely pointless given that there is now quite literally nothing to be achieved therefrom


Kind of like the travel ban itself, eh?

Let's see . . . been 5 months/150 days since the need for immediate action for a 90-day review period to "find out what the hell is going on" in order to "protect Americans." Trump seems to be incompetent even by his own standard.
 
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BobPatterson
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:30 pm

CriticalPoint wrote:
Well in all fairness this IS an aviation forum not a political forum. So if politics, such as the travel ban, are going to be discussed on airliners.net it should focus around it's impact on aviation and NOT political opinion.


There is a reason why THIS forum in called NON-Aviation. Politics is supposedly restricted to THIS forum on airliners.net.
Facts are fragile things. Treat them with care. Sources are important. Alternative facts do not exist.
 
KLDC10
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:36 pm

BobPatterson wrote:
CriticalPoint wrote:
Well in all fairness this IS an aviation forum not a political forum. So if politics, such as the travel ban, are going to be discussed on airliners.net it should focus around it's impact on aviation and NOT political opinion.


There is a reason why THIS forum in called NON-Aviation. Politics is supposedly restricted to THIS forum on airliners.net.


This was originally posted in the Civil Aviation Forum before being moved.
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KLDC10
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:40 pm

jetero wrote:
KLDC10 wrote:
Such protests would be entirely pointless given that there is now quite literally nothing to be achieved therefrom


Kind of like the travel ban itself, eh?

Let's see . . . been 5 months/150 days since the need for immediate action for a 90-day review period to "find out what the hell is going on" in order to "protect Americans." Trump seems to be incompetent even by his own standard.


Actually, the Hawaii injunction included restrictions on what the administration could do in terms of studies and developing new vetting procedures. See: http://www.politico.com/blogs/under-the ... ban-239738 for more information. Here are just a couple of extracts:

"U.S. District Court Judge Derrick Watson scaled back the injunction Monday, nullifying its impact on studies and policy reviews ordered under the directive Trump issued in March and billed as an anti-terrorism initiative."

"In a ruling last week, a three-judge panel of the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals upheld the bulk of Watson's injunction, but said portions of it that blocked the Trump administration from studying vetting procedures were too broad and should be lifted."

So actually, the injunction severely hindered the ability of the administration to do very much about anything.
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BobPatterson
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:42 pm

LAXintl wrote:
Good call.

There should never have been an injunction to start with.

The executive branch has always been afforded wide discretion in setting immigration policy and is also vested with task of evaluating and balancing national security.

I disagree. All actions of the Executive Branch are, similarly to all enactments by the Congress, open to review by the Courts.

There are rare exceptions to this such as when a law (that has passed the Court's review) states that an action shall not be subject to review.

Please correct me if you think that what I have stated is wrong.
Facts are fragile things. Treat them with care. Sources are important. Alternative facts do not exist.
 
jetero
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 10:18 pm

KLDC10 wrote:
Actually, the Hawaii injunction included restrictions on what the administration could do in terms of studies and developing new vetting procedures. See: http://www.politico.com/blogs/under-the ... ban-239738 for more information. Here are just a couple of extracts:

"U.S. District Court Judge Derrick Watson scaled back the injunction Monday, nullifying its impact on studies and policy reviews ordered under the directive Trump issued in March and billed as an anti-terrorism initiative."

"In a ruling last week, a three-judge panel of the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals upheld the bulk of Watson's injunction, but said portions of it that blocked the Trump administration from studying vetting procedures were too broad and should be lifted."

So actually, the injunction severely hindered the ability of the administration to do very much about anything.


Limited ban on studying vetting procedures. So I'll give them 30 days. Or are you saying the administration still can't possibly have an inkling of "what the hell is going on"?

Regardless, what's most relevant is the fact that there was no actual threat, and there have been no actual attacks (neither historical nor since the injunction) by individuals who would have been covered by the travel ban. It was entirely political.
 
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DIRECTFLT
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 10:54 pm

I'll sleep better...
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330west
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Mon Jun 26, 2017 11:10 pm

Maybe I'll stop wetting the bed at night. Fingers crossed!
Always fly first class, otherwise your heirs will.
 
jetero
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:52 am

DIRECTFLT wrote:
I'll sleep better...


330west wrote:
Maybe I'll stop wetting the bed at night. Fingers crossed!


Well people have nightmares about being eaten alive by a swamp monster, so I can only suppose that it's possible for people to sleep better after a silly travel ban. Maybe taxpayers' money would be better spent if we just distributed blankets, a pacifier, and a good therapist.
 
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BobPatterson
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:00 am

jetero wrote:
DIRECTFLT wrote:
I'll sleep better...


330west wrote:
Maybe I'll stop wetting the bed at night. Fingers crossed!


Well people have nightmares about being eaten alive by a swamp monster, ........


Will there be any such monsters after Mr. Trump drains the swamp?

Sleep well.
Facts are fragile things. Treat them with care. Sources are important. Alternative facts do not exist.
 
tommy1808
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:59 am

jetero wrote:
and a good therapist.


mostly that.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
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seahawk
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 5:32 am

Finally the president can shape the country and protect the people. Good for America!!
 
tommy1808
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 6:03 am

seahawk wrote:
Finally the president can shape the country and protect the people. Good for America!!


well, more than 200 years to get from religion freedom to persecution of people because of their religion. The USA had a good run in deed.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
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seahawk
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 6:12 am

Well at least the American people now get what they voted for.
 
tommy1808
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:29 am

seahawk wrote:
Well at least the American people now get what they voted for.


considering just 38% approval rating and 57% disapproval, i don´t think they got what they thought they voted for.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
CO953
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:30 am

Not allowing someone to enter a country is not persecution by a country. Persecution happens within a country.
 
tommy1808
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:31 am

CO953 wrote:
Not allowing someone to enter a country is not persecution by a country. Persecution happens within a country.


per·se·cu·tion
ˌpərsəˈkyo͞oSH(ə)n/Senden
noun
hostility and ill-treatment, especially because of race or political or religious beliefs.
"her family fled religious persecution"
synonyms: oppression, victimization, maltreatment, ill-treatment, mistreatment, abuse, ill-usage, discrimination, tyranny; More
persistent annoyance or harassment.
"his persecution at the hands of other students"


being banned from a country is about as hostile as you can get without actually murdering people, convenient definitions daily won´t help you much.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
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seahawk
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:35 am

tommy1808 wrote:
seahawk wrote:
Well at least the American people now get what they voted for.


considering just 38% approval rating and 57% disapproval, i don´t think they got what they thought they voted for.

best regards
Thomas


Elections are - as a wise fictional character once said - "like a box of chocolates. You never know what you’re gonna get."
 
LMP737
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:39 am

DIRECTFLT wrote:
I'll sleep better...


Well then you should lie awake at night worried about run over by car, being killed by a fellow Merican, mauled to death by a dog, falling down the stairs, killed by a cow, lawnmower or even by your own bed than by people in from those countries named in the ban. Sleep tight!!!!!
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
MaverickM11
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:53 am

Trump needed a 90 day ban seven months ago to "fix" whatever they needed to fix in the vetting process. What were they doing for those seven months that still requires a ban?
I don't take responsibility at all
 
tommy1808
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 8:37 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
Trump needed a 90 day ban seven months ago to "fix" whatever they needed to fix in the vetting process. What were they doing for those seven months that still requires a ban?


.. too busy executing that super secret plan to defeat ISIS in 30 days.

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 11:30 am

tommy1808 wrote:
jetero wrote:
and a good therapist.


mostly that.

No. They're trying to get rid of healthcare altogether. Grab your therapist now or risk no therapy.

LMP737 wrote:
DIRECTFLT wrote:
I'll sleep better...


Well then you should lie awake at night worried about run over by car, being killed by a fellow Merican, mauled to death by a dog, falling down the stairs, killed by a cow, lawnmower or even by your own bed than by people in from those countries named in the ban. Sleep tight!!!!!

Or worse...having to be nice to LGBT people...the horror!!
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
330west
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 11:33 am

seahawk wrote:
Finally the president can shape the country and protect the people. Good for America!!


Protect us from what precisely? Honestly, based on my experiences with them I'm more afraid of white self-proclaimed Christians than I am of Muslims.
Always fly first class, otherwise your heirs will.
 
KLDC10
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 11:48 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
Trump needed a 90 day ban seven months ago to "fix" whatever they needed to fix in the vetting process. What were they doing for those seven months that still requires a ban?


See: Reply #28
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tommy1808
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:23 pm

einsteinboricua wrote:
No. They're trying to get rid of healthcare altogether. Grab your therapist now or risk no therapy.


can´t put them in labor camps, but you can withhold healthcare......

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
jetero
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Re: Supreme Court Lifts Injunction, Travel Ban Now in Effect

Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:24 pm

KLDC10 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Trump needed a 90 day ban seven months ago to "fix" whatever they needed to fix in the vetting process. What were they doing for those seven months that still requires a ban?


See: Reply #28


Duplicate
Last edited by jetero on Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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