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trpmb6
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:26 pm

Kavanaugh is an originalist. I know this might be hard for some to understand but he is not going to legislate from the bench like Sotomayor does.
 
windy95
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:31 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
Kavanaugh is an originalist. I know this might be hard for some to understand but he is not going to legislate from the bench like Sotomayor does.


As all Justices should be. If you do not like what is in Constitution or not in the Constitution that's to bad. That is why they created the amendment process.
non nobis Domine non nobis sed nomini tuo da gloriam
 
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trpmb6
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:44 pm

I honestly think that is one of the reasons the left is so terrified. They like activist judges who will legislate from the bench *when it supports their own views.*

So naturally when they see a "conservative" judge nominated they freak out because they automatically think this judge will legislate from the bench from the opposite side.

That's just not the case. Conservative judges are originalists. A conservative judge can never really be an activist judge as far as i'm concerned. The two ideologies don't agree with each other.

This is why things always tend to move more and more liberal over time. Liberal activist judges move the posts to the left over time. Meanwhile conservative judges follow a strict interpretation of the constitution and established law.
 
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casinterest
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:50 pm

windy95 wrote:
trpmb6 wrote:
Kavanaugh is an originalist. I know this might be hard for some to understand but he is not going to legislate from the bench like Sotomayor does.


As all Justices should be. If you do not like what is in Constitution or not in the Constitution that's to bad. That is why they created the amendment process.


Originalism is just another version of the flat earth society.

You can pretend the constitution was written as intended, but then you have to understand what was intended. Was it the writers of the amendments intentions, or the interpretations of the states that ratified it? And what were those intentions?


I present to you the Ninth Amendment.

Have fun


"The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people. "

I would take that to mean that the right to bear arms in the 2nd amendment should not extend to where it comes into conflict with the life,liberty and pursuit of happiness of the rest of the socierty. And that would be an ORIGINALIST interpretation.
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trpmb6
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:01 pm

Not at all. You're misrepresenting the meaning of the ninth amendment in the context of why it was included. The ninth amendment is purely there to note that even though the founders decided to specifically include rights, like the 1st and 2nd amendments, it does not exclude other rights that have not been listed.

https://constitutioncenter.org/interactive-constitution/amendments/amendment-ix wrote:
During the ratification debates over the Constitution, some opponents of ratification (“Anti-Federalists”) vociferously complained about the absence of a bill of rights. In response, supporters of the Constitution (“Federalists”) such as James Wilson argued that a bill of rights would be dangerous. Enumerating any rights, Wilson argued, might imply that all those not listed were surrendered. And, because it was impossible to enumerate all the rights of the people, a bill of rights might actually be construed to justify the government’s power to limit any liberties of the people that were not enumerated.
 
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casinterest
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:03 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
Not at all. You're misrepresenting the meaning of the ninth amendment in the context of why it was included. The ninth amendment is purely there to note that even though the founders decided to specifically include rights, like the 1st and 2nd amendments, it does not exclude other rights that have not been listed.

https://constitutioncenter.org/interactive-constitution/amendments/amendment-ix wrote:
During the ratification debates over the Constitution, some opponents of ratification (“Anti-Federalists”) vociferously complained about the absence of a bill of rights. In response, supporters of the Constitution (“Federalists”) such as James Wilson argued that a bill of rights would be dangerous. Enumerating any rights, Wilson argued, might imply that all those not listed were surrendered. And, because it was impossible to enumerate all the rights of the people, a bill of rights might actually be construed to justify the government’s power to limit any liberties of the people that were not enumerated.


I don't think you read what I wrote very closely.
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trpmb6
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:08 pm

Then take Scalia's interpretation then, from the same link i provided:

Justice Antonin Scalia wrote:
[T]he Constitution’s refusal to ‘deny or disparage’ other rights is far removed from affirming any one of them, and even further removed from authorizing judges to identify what they might be, and to enforce the judges’ list against laws duly enacted by the people.” In this way, Justice Scalia would deny the amendment any judicially-enforced legal effect.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:09 pm

BN747 wrote:
Now that Benczkowski is ‘in’...now if Kavanaugh gets confirmed, the pins are all lined up for Traitor Trump/Pooty to usurp All American laws they’ve yet to violate...

Americans should be very worried at the picture being formed here.

#resist

#conspiracytheories

#AlexJones
 
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casinterest
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:17 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
Then take Scalia's interpretation then, from the same link i provided:

Justice Antonin Scalia wrote:
[T]he Constitution’s refusal to ‘deny or disparage’ other rights is far removed from affirming any one of them, and even further removed from authorizing judges to identify what they might be, and to enforce the judges’ list against laws duly enacted by the people.” In this way, Justice Scalia would deny the amendment any judicially-enforced legal effect.


Then why do we have a country? If you want to be a true originalist you have have to look at those words as having specific meaning, otherwise they wouldn't be there.
We started the whole revolution against England for inalienable rights of life,liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

Scalia's interpretation is a bullshit way out, and not originalist at all. Inalienable rights are already affirmed.
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trpmb6
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:29 pm

Scalia is probably the most famous originalist in modern times so I'll take his originalist interpretation over yours.

You are trying to suggest that the Ninth amendment allows for the restriction of the 2nd amendment because in some undisclosed way it may interfere with the life liberty and pursuit of happiness of others. It is just as easy to say that the 2nd amendment helps guarantee the rights of life liberty and pursuit of happiness.

Your argument is not an originalist interpretation of the 9th amendment. You're not interpreting in the lens of the discussions that madison and others had when Madison wrote the 9th amendment. The 9th amendment was not designed to limit any other amendment or right listed. It was designed to say "Just because we didn't list a right here doesn't mean it may not exist - and the government cannot infringe upon those either"

So basically they're saying the government can't create restrictions on say your right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness. If you want to go there.

Another way of looking at it would be, replace 2nd amendment in your argument with the 1st. Would you then be willing to say that we should restrict the press when it interferes with my pursuit of happiness? I would be far happier with less huffington post articles. But I don't subscribe to that.
 
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casinterest
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:39 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
Scalia is probably the most famous originalist in modern times so I'll take his originalist interpretation over yours.

You are trying to suggest that the Ninth amendment allows for the restriction of the 2nd amendment because in some undisclosed way it may interfere with the life liberty and pursuit of happiness of others. It is just as easy to say that the 2nd amendment helps guarantee the rights of life liberty and pursuit of happiness.

Your argument is not an originalist interpretation of the 9th amendment. You're not interpreting in the lens of the discussions that madison and others had when Madison wrote the 9th amendment. The 9th amendment was not designed to limit any other amendment or right listed. It was designed to say "Just because we didn't list a right here doesn't mean it may not exist - and the government cannot infringe upon those either"

So basically they're saying the government can't create restrictions on say your right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness. If you want to go there.

Another way of looking at it would be, replace 2nd amendment in your argument with the 1st. Would you then be willing to say that we should restrict the press when it interferes with my pursuit of happiness? I would be far happier with less huffington post articles. But I don't subscribe to that.


Let's look at the first amendment. It would be legal to yell FIRE in a crowded theater under the first amendment if Scalia was being originalist about it. Would that be safe? No.
Thank goodness we have had some decent judges that don't diminish other Amendments and the enumerated rights to support their pet favorites as Scalia did.
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trpmb6
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:42 pm

I knew the fire thing would come up. You can be an originalist with common sense too. Nobody said the water wasn't muddy when it comes to protecting our rights.
 
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casinterest
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:47 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
I knew the fire thing would come up. You can be an originalist with common sense too. Nobody said the water wasn't muddy when it comes to protecting our rights.


And here in lies the slippery slope of Originalism. You can't have it. You always have to interject common sense, and Scalia's abandonment of the 9th in favor of the 2nd would not come into play with the 1st? It seems a little more corrupt than muddy.
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:52 pm

I will certainly agree that there is still a degree of personal discretion interjected into an originalists rulings. To that end, it is why I am satisfied to see Kavanaugh has a very lengthy pedigree of rulings to point to. Which happens to be the very reason I opposed Amy Barrett and preferred Kavanaugh. It is quite clear how he will rule on things. And it was a perfect play by Trump to ensure he gets Lisa Murkowski and Susan Collins in his court. (Pretty sure both voted to confirm Kavanaugh to the DC court of appeals)

anyways, time to leave work. and i'm having far more fun in the pedantic thread at this time lol
 
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:00 pm

https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/nation-world/national/article214749845.html

Trump is as popular as Obama was in the middle of his first presidential term, survey says


Poll also found the following:

Thirty-one percent of Americans lauded Obama as the best president ever, according to the Pew Research Center, while another 13 percent said he was the second-best.


President Donald Trump, who got 19 percent during his second year as president in this poll, is about as popular as Obama was during the middle of his first presidential term. Twenty percent of people said Obama was either the first or second-best president during his third year.


But now this is where I get really annoyed by this poll and the people interpreting it:

There is also a generational divide in how much support a president receives.

No generation supports a president as strongly as millennials do Obama, according to the poll. Sixty-two percent of people in that generation — described as those aged from 22 to 37 — named our nation's first black president as one of the best they've seen.

That makes him the only president to receive a majority of votes from a generation in this new poll.

Trump, however, had just 19 percent of the youngest generation name him as the first- or second-best president. Millennials are the only generation to give President George W. Bush a higher approval rating than Trump, although Bush narrowly eked him out with 20 percent of people naming him as one of the best presidents in their lifetime.


Well of course millennials would overwhelmingly support Obama. He was president for a very significant portion of their lives. And in the wording of the polls they could really only list 2 (for the younger ones) or 3 (for the older ones) maybe 4 pushing back to clinton. But even I don't really remember much from Clinton's presidency to make a personal opinion that isn't swayed by current news articles. For me, it'd really be a choice between Trump, Obama and Bush.

Kind of a silly poll really for younger people.
 
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:02 pm

casinterest wrote:


The Scots have also roasted him on Twitter after he posted one of the dumbest Tweets in his long and distinguished career of dumb Tweeting.

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/sta ... wsrc%5Etfw

"Just arrived in Scotland. Place is going wild over the vote. They took their country back, just like we will take America back. No games!"

After Scotland voted overwhelmingly to remain in the EU. :rotfl:
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:36 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
I initially came here to pose the question as to why other NATO countries don't meet their defense spending obligations as spelled out in the agreement. I find it funny when other countries chastise Trump for pulling out of the paris accord or the Iranian agreement when they themselves aren't even living up to a simple requirement of spend X% of gdp on defense spending.


European countries have committed to fiscal responsibility and are sticking to it.

How is the US deficit going ?
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VTKillarney
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:38 pm

Aesma wrote:
trpmb6 wrote:
I initially came here to pose the question as to why other NATO countries don't meet their defense spending obligations as spelled out in the agreement. I find it funny when other countries chastise Trump for pulling out of the paris accord or the Iranian agreement when they themselves aren't even living up to a simple requirement of spend X% of gdp on defense spending.


European countries have committed to fiscal responsibility and are sticking to it.

How is the US deficit going ?

All the more reason for the United States to demand its allies pay their fair share.
 
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casinterest
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:49 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
Aesma wrote:
trpmb6 wrote:
I initially came here to pose the question as to why other NATO countries don't meet their defense spending obligations as spelled out in the agreement. I find it funny when other countries chastise Trump for pulling out of the paris accord or the Iranian agreement when they themselves aren't even living up to a simple requirement of spend X% of gdp on defense spending.


European countries have committed to fiscal responsibility and are sticking to it.

How is the US deficit going ?

All the more reason for the United States to demand its allies pay their fair share.



The Europeans made commitments to pay 2% of GDP by 2024.

They have 6 years to get there.

Trump can't even commit to a faithful relationship for that long.
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Dutchy
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 10:56 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
Aesma wrote:
trpmb6 wrote:
I initially came here to pose the question as to why other NATO countries don't meet their defense spending obligations as spelled out in the agreement. I find it funny when other countries chastise Trump for pulling out of the paris accord or the Iranian agreement when they themselves aren't even living up to a simple requirement of spend X% of gdp on defense spending.


European countries have committed to fiscal responsibility and are sticking to it.

How is the US deficit going ?

All the more reason for the United States to demand its allies pay their fair share.


To do what exactly? The European countries already have recognized they need to invest in defense. Bring it to 1,5% -1,7% of the GDP should be more than sufficient to have a ready army which is well trained and equipped. Noone is really challenging NATO.

Don't forget that America wants to have its presence in the Pacific, so America's 3,4% is in the same range for NATO.
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Mortyman
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:24 pm

casinterest wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Aesma wrote:

European countries have committed to fiscal responsibility and are sticking to it.

How is the US deficit going ?

All the more reason for the United States to demand its allies pay their fair share.



The Europeans made commitments to pay 2% of GDP by 2024.

They have 6 years to get there.

Trump can't even commit to a faithful relationship for that long.



Actually the European nations comitted to work towards 2% by 2024. Please note the wording: WORK TOWARDS. Doesn't actually mean that it is written in stone.
 
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:04 am

casinterest wrote:
And here in lies the slippery slope of Originalism. You can't have it. ..... more corrupt than muddy.

LOL “slippery slope of originalism” - that’s a new one. You folks just keep on trying to come up with ways to frame the constitution as old, corrupt, and bad - just like the Nazis and communists did to their governments in the 20th century.

It would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.

Mike Drop
 
LMP737
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:23 am

VTKillarney wrote:
All the more reason for the United States to demand its allies pay their fair share.


Can you please define "fair share". Do you know what it even means? Or are you just repeating some tripe you read on the net?
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:23 am

Trump.

Gross.
Pancakes are delicious.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:36 am

LMP737 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
All the more reason for the United States to demand its allies pay their fair share.


Can you please define "fair share". Do you know what it even means? Or are you just repeating some tripe you read on the net?

As much as Greece.
 
LMP737
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:50 am

VTKillarney wrote:

As much as Greece.


That's not what I asked. Seems to me all you did is just repeat something you read.
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casinterest
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:54 am

MikeDrop wrote:
casinterest wrote:
And here in lies the slippery slope of Originalism. You can't have it. ..... more corrupt than muddy.

LOL “slippery slope of originalism” - that’s a new one. You folks just keep on trying to come up with ways to frame the constitution as old, corrupt, and bad - just like the Nazis and communists did to their governments in the 20th century.

It would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.

Mike Drop


What is Pathetic is that you did nothing to make a refutation of my point . Just a pathetic nonsensical Godwin attack.
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LMP737
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:43 am

trpmb6 wrote:

___________________________________________________________________________________________

I initially came here to pose the question as to why other NATO countries don't meet their defense spending obligations as spelled out in the agreement. I find it funny when other countries chastise Trump for pulling out of the paris accord or the Iranian agreement when they themselves aren't even living up to a simple requirement of spend X% of gdp on defense spending.


It ever cross you mind that maybe the US should spend less?
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LMP737
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:50 am

trpmb6 wrote:
I'm not sure where people keep saying it was Stormy Daniels who was being touched. The arrest report clearly says it was Stormy Daniels who fondled the mammary glands of a female officer named Mary.

Image


Darn the luck.


https://www.yahoo.com/gma/adult-film-st ... ories.html
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:10 am

At the least the NATO summit was sterling success for Trump. How be slammed the liberal Europeans that are just leeches sucking the wealth from America was the best act ever. Now America knows that they are no friends and it is time to end the bad deal that NATO is. Would be awesome to have a press conference with Putin and declare the intention of the US leaving NATO. Trump´s analysis of the Brexit chaos was also perfect and May should have listened to him, because he knows how the best deals are made.
 
tommy1808
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 10:15 am

seb146 wrote:
He had strong ties to the Russian Alfa Bank which had/has ties to tRump. Nothing suspicious here.


It is also the bank that facilitated money laundering with Deutsche Bank, the bank that provided Trump with liquidity via its private equity branch when DB real estate didn't want anything to do with him any more. .... likely via a guarantee from Russia.

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oslmgm
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:46 pm

seahawk wrote:
At the least the NATO summit was sterling success for Trump. How be slammed the liberal Europeans that are just leeches sucking the wealth from America was the best act ever. Now America knows that they are no friends and it is time to end the bad deal that NATO is. Would be awesome to have a press conference with Putin and declare the intention of the US leaving NATO. Trump´s analysis of the Brexit chaos was also perfect and May should have listened to him, because he knows how the best deals are made.


It's funny how Trump and his supporters probably see it as a success, while the rest of the world thinks he proved once again that he's a nonsensical idiot.

Nothing really changed at the summit, the European countries still have 2024 as the target year for spending 2% of GDP on the military. The "slamming" you enjoyed is seen as another proof that he's a moron.

What a success - those who have been cheering for him through pussy-grabbing and thousands of lies are still cheering for him! Yeay... :banghead:
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:36 pm

Democrats introduce a bill to de-fund ICE and run away in shame.

http://dailycaller.com/2018/07/12/democ ... yan-stunt/
 
2122M
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:45 pm

This script is getting a little predictable now isn't it? It's been the same with North Korea, NATO and now the UK.:

Step 1: Talk tough and insult the people you are about to meet.
Step 2: Meet with them amongst a great deal of pomp and circumstance.
Step 3: Leave as best friends and claim victory while actually accomplishing absolutely nothing at all.
Step 4: Repeat as quickly as possible to distract from the fact that nothing is getting done.

Only he's not talking tough about Putin prior to their meeting. He is happily insulting his way through Western Europe, but has only said very nice things about Putin prior to their Helsinki meeting.
 
oslmgm
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 2:55 pm

:lol: This made me laugh so hard...
Wisconsin...?? :rotfl:

(Trump about Brexit)

https://mobile.twitter.com/BarryHealySo ... 2083026950
 
seb146
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:42 pm

A podcast on this article was recommended for me

https://libjournal.uncg.edu/ijcp/articl ... le/249/116

One suggestion in this article is that the right is more interested in holding on to power and not so much the economy. The podcast calls it "racial resentment and cultural anxiety brought about by social and demographic changes."

https://www.kqed.org/forum/201010186623 ... supporters
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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scbriml
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:29 pm

oslmgm wrote:
:lol: This made me laugh so hard...
Wisconsin...?? :rotfl:

(Trump about Brexit)

https://mobile.twitter.com/BarryHealySo ... 2083026950


Can he string a coherent statement together or any statement that doesn't include self-praise?
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Dutchy
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:33 pm

oslmgm wrote:
:lol: This made me laugh so hard...
Wisconsin...?? :rotfl:

(Trump about Brexit)

https://mobile.twitter.com/BarryHealySo ... 2083026950


Well, more importantly, he seems to think Ireland is part of the UK, but hey, he has property there...
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Berevoff
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:37 pm

Dutchy wrote:
oslmgm wrote:
:lol: This made me laugh so hard...
Wisconsin...?? :rotfl:

(Trump about Brexit)

https://mobile.twitter.com/BarryHealySo ... 2083026950


Well, more importantly, he seems to think Ireland is part of the UK, but hey, he has property there...


I think we've well established Trump has no idea about geography other than where the brown people come from.
 
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seahawk
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:55 pm

seb146 wrote:
A podcast on this article was recommended for me

https://libjournal.uncg.edu/ijcp/articl ... le/249/116

One suggestion in this article is that the right is more interested in holding on to power and not so much the economy. The podcast calls it "racial resentment and cultural anxiety brought about by social and demographic changes."

https://www.kqed.org/forum/201010186623 ... supporters


"Dictator for Dummies" 101. Create hardship to consolidate your power base.
 
vfw614
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Fri Jul 13, 2018 9:39 pm

So this self-declared genius gives an interview to The Sun (of all newpapers) which not only contains a truckload of his usual verbal diarrhea, including insults to the UK Prime Minister whom he is about to meet, but which is also recorded - and yet he calls the interview fake news when it is published verbatim and he becomes aware of the massive diplomatic backlash it causes. Only to make a fool of himself as inevitably these recording are leaked almost immediately (interestingly, I hasten to add, as The Sun is a Murdoch produced newspaper...)

You cannot make this stuff up, the guy is just plain crazy. I think the best mankind can hope for is that it survives his presidency and is not nuked off planet earth by him.
 
LMP737
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Sat Jul 14, 2018 2:42 am

trpmb6 wrote:
I honestly think that is one of the reasons the left is so terrified. They like activist judges who will legislate from the bench *when it supports their own views.*

So naturally when they see a "conservative" judge nominated they freak out because they automatically think this judge will legislate from the bench from the opposite side.

That's just not the case. Conservative judges are originalists. A conservative judge can never really be an activist judge as far as i'm concerned. The two ideologies don't agree with each other.

This is why things always tend to move more and more liberal over time. Liberal activist judges move the posts to the left over time. Meanwhile conservative judges follow a strict interpretation of the constitution and established law.


The judges who ruled in the majority in cases like Plessy V Ferguson, Scott V Sanford and Brown V The Board of Education were they originalists or activist?
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MikeDrop
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:54 pm

casinterest wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:
casinterest wrote:
And here in lies the slippery slope of Originalism. You can't have it. ..... more corrupt than muddy.

LOL “slippery slope of originalism” - that’s a new one. You folks just keep on trying to come up with ways to frame the constitution as old, corrupt, and bad - just like the Nazis and communists did to their governments in the 20th century.

It would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.

Mike Drop


What is Pathetic is that you did nothing to make a refutation of my point . Just a pathetic nonsensical Godwin attack.


The refute is obvious and doesn't require explanation. But, since you are acting as if you don't understand. I'll explain.

You cant slip down a slope when you are climbing back to your starting point - hence the word "original" being included in the term "originalist". That is just nonsense. But of course you know this and the introduction of the term "slippery slope" to the discussion is just more cynical leftist talking points to try to discredit the US Constitution, and our way of life. If you get your way we will be living like those poor people in Venezuela.

It wont work


Mike Drop
 
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casinterest
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:59 pm

MikeDrop wrote:
casinterest wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:
LOL “slippery slope of originalism” - that’s a new one. You folks just keep on trying to come up with ways to frame the constitution as old, corrupt, and bad - just like the Nazis and communists did to their governments in the 20th century.

It would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.

Mike Drop


What is Pathetic is that you did nothing to make a refutation of my point . Just a pathetic nonsensical Godwin attack.


The refute is obvious and doesn't require explanation. But, since you are acting as if you don't understand. I'll explain.

You cant slip down a slope when you are climbing back to your starting point - hence the word "original" being included in the term "originalist". That is just nonsense. But of course you know this and the introduction of the term "slippery slope" to the discussion is just more cynical leftist talking points to try to discredit the US Constitution, and our way of life. If you get your way we will be living like those poor people in Venezuela.

It wont work


Mike Drop



Orginialism is for the dumb morons that think the US Baptist English version of the Bible is the literal word of God, and then go to a pig picking afterwords. Originalism is nothing but a political ploy that tries to get people to see it how the "Framers" saw it, while ignoring how the states that voted for it saw it, and ignoring how precedents have shaped it.

Hell it too over 200 years for all the states to Ratify the 27th amendment. so what is Originalist about it. the way the framers saw it, or the way the final states that ratified it saw it?

Saying we are on the way to Venezuela is for people that have no real arguments for the strength of the constitution.
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VTKillarney
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Sat Jul 14, 2018 5:05 pm

No. Originalism respects the role of each branch of government. Judges should not legislate. We have Congress for that.
 
MikeDrop
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Sat Jul 14, 2018 5:53 pm

casinterest wrote:
Orginialism is for the dumb morons that think the US Baptist English version of the Bible is the literal word of God, and then go to a pig picking afterwords. Originalism is nothing but a political ploy that tries to get people to see it how the "Framers" saw it, while ignoring how the states that voted for it saw it, and ignoring how precedents have shaped it.

NO - You are absolutely incorrect. An originalist would defend the Bill of Rights and believes that extra-constitutional activism would dilute the power and effect of the Bill of Rights. If you can set the precedent of limiting one right that is guaranteed without following constitutional procedure then no rights are guaranteed.

Of course, extreme socialists like you do not believe in the Bill of Rights so calling originalists "Dumb Morons" and setting up straw man arguments comparing the US Constitution to the Bible are just part of your plan to discredit the US Constitution - and to create a workers paradise like Venezuela.

casinterest wrote:
Hell it too over 200 years for all the states to Ratify the 27th amendment. so what is Originalist about it. the way the framers saw it, or the way the final states that ratified it saw it?

It is originalist because it became law following to exact processes that were defined in the US Constitution, and is is now PART of the Constitution. The fact that it took a long time is irrelevant.

Lets talk about the 2nd amendment. An originalist will say that the right to bear arms is guaranteed by the constitution. However an originalist would also say that those who want limit gun rights should follow the processes defined in the constitution to ban guns. As an originalist, I would personally support this.

Mike Drop
 
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casinterest
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:50 pm

MikeDrop wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Orginialism is for the dumb morons that think the US Baptist English version of the Bible is the literal word of God, and then go to a pig picking afterwords. Originalism is nothing but a political ploy that tries to get people to see it how the "Framers" saw it, while ignoring how the states that voted for it saw it, and ignoring how precedents have shaped it.

NO - You are absolutely incorrect. An originalist would defend the Bill of Rights and believes that extra-constitutional activism would dilute the power and effect of the Bill of Rights. If you can set the precedent of limiting one right that is guaranteed without following constitutional procedure then no rights are guaranteed.

Of course, extreme socialists like you do not believe in the Bill of Rights so calling originalists "Dumb Morons" and setting up straw man arguments comparing the US Constitution to the Bible are just part of your plan to discredit the US Constitution - and to create a workers paradise like Venezuela.


I am not incorrect. If you think that then you are ABSOLUTELY WRONG.

there is no such thing as Extra -constitutional activism. That is only a made up term End of story. go home.

Originalist are dumb morns. End of story. Every law has to be interpreted. End of Story.

Even the bible has to be interpreted, it was written in Hebrew 2000 years ago, and the morons that call themselves Fundamentalists in the US should move to Israel and take up hebrew.
MikeDrop wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Hell it too over 200 years for all the states to Ratify the 27th amendment. so what is Originalist about it. the way the framers saw it, or the way the final states that ratified it saw it?

It is originalist because it became law following to exact processes that were defined in the US Constitution, and is is now PART of the Constitution. The fact that it took a long time is irrelevant.

Lets talk about the 2nd amendment. An originalist will say that the right to bear arms is guaranteed by the constitution. However an originalist would also say that those who want limit gun rights should follow the processes defined in the constitution to ban guns. As an originalist, I would personally support this.

An originalist would look at the 2nd Amendment and the WHOLE of the constitutional amendments. Not cherry pick like Scalia did. Your intepretation assumes there only was a 2nd Amendment.

Mike Drop

[/quote]
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VTKillarney
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:02 pm

Of course every law has to be interpreted. Originalism is merely a theory on HOW to interpret laws.

Do you not understand what originalism is?
 
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casinterest
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:02 pm

And look here at the Lying Racist Coward Trump being a Lying Racist Coward


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/sta ... 2559725569


Just like a crybaby.

Never mind that Obama tried to get the incompetent McConnell and Republicans to sign a bill on Russia. But the GOP was already selling out to Putin

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politi ... 16-n853016
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LMP737
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Re: The Success of President Donald Trump

Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:55 pm

MikeDrop wrote:
It is originalist because it became law following to exact processes that were defined in the US Constitution, and is is now PART of the Constitution. The fact that it took a long time is irrelevant.


So I'll ask you the same question I asked someone else. Were the judges who ruled in the majority in cases like Plessy V Ferguson, Scott V Sanford and Brown V The Board of Education were they originalists or activist?
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