Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
Hagic wrote:http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/trump-steel-aluminum-1.4557060
Isn't this expected to affect Boeing and make Airbus more competitive in the long run?
PW100 wrote:FWIW, I believe that BBD buys its Al and Al-Li from Alcoa. I don't believe China sells any aviation grade Aluminium around here or Europe.Hagic wrote:http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/trump-steel-aluminum-1.4557060
Isn't this expected to affect Boeing and make Airbus more competitive in the long run?
Don't think it will affect Boeing nor Airbus. I dont think the type of high grade and exotic aerospace aluminum alloys being used today and tomorrow is sourced in any material (pun intended . . . ) quantities from China (Russia perhaps).
ExMilitaryEng wrote:So, after Softwood Lumber duties, the CSeries BS (now resolved), and now aluminium, Quebec trade with US is not getting smoother.
longhauler wrote:It would be fun to watch the scramble if Hydro-Quebec decides ... OK, Vermont and New York, we're not sending electricity south any more ... see ya.
dz09 wrote:I don't think our president has a clue on how the aluminum business work. He relies on advisors and experts whose allegiance is to wall street or some foreign powers. There are hardly any smelters left in the US. Most of the raw material (billets) is imported. the processing of aluminum into coils, plates or extrusions is done by a handful of mills and extruders that are mostly foreign owned (Chinese and European and Australian). High tariffs have already been in place for few years and that is thanks to Obama. that resulted in doubling of the conversion costs putting a lot of small companies relying on extrusions for their products out of business.
The new tariffs will result in even higher aluminum prices due to a lack of competition and will either kill whatever aluminum business is left in this country, or force them to move their operations overseas.
Boeing will get hurt and I think they will certainly start considering moving some of their operations overseas. this will not affect Airbus at all as they do not have any manufacturing operations here in the US. their aluminum needs are met by European or Asian suppliers. the tariffs will hurt US exports greatly.
dmg626 wrote:dz09 wrote:I don't think our president has a clue on how the aluminum business work. He relies on advisors and experts whose allegiance is to wall street or some foreign powers. There are hardly any smelters left in the US. Most of the raw material (billets) is imported. the processing of aluminum into coils, plates or extrusions is done by a handful of mills and extruders that are mostly foreign owned (Chinese and European and Australian). High tariffs have already been in place for few years and that is thanks to Obama. that resulted in doubling of the conversion costs putting a lot of small companies relying on extrusions for their products out of business.
The new tariffs will result in even higher aluminum prices due to a lack of competition and will either kill whatever aluminum business is left in this country, or force them to move their operations overseas.
Boeing will get hurt and I think they will certainly start considering moving some of their operations overseas. this will not affect Airbus at all as they do not have any manufacturing operations here in the US. their aluminum needs are met by European or Asian suppliers. the tariffs will hurt US exports greatly.
So true, the administration should ask a net posters seeing there are so many experts on this board.
dz09 wrote:I don't think our president has a clue on how the aluminum business work. He relies on advisors and experts whose allegiance is to wall street or some foreign powers. There are hardly any smelters left in the US. Most of the raw material (billets) is imported. the processing of aluminum into coils, plates or extrusions is done by a handful of mills and extruders that are mostly foreign owned (Chinese and European and Australian). High tariffs have already been in place for few years and that is thanks to Obama. that resulted in doubling of the conversion costs putting a lot of small companies relying on extrusions for their products out of business.
The new tariffs will result in even higher aluminum prices due to a lack of competition and will either kill whatever aluminum business is left in this country, or force them to move their operations overseas.
Boeing will get hurt and I think they will certainly start considering moving some of their operations overseas. this will not affect Airbus at all as they do not have any manufacturing operations here in the US. their aluminum needs are met by European or Asian suppliers. the tariffs will hurt US exports greatly.
dz09 wrote:I googled "aluminum tariffs under Obama" and nearly every hit that came back was this current tariff spike under tRump. There were articles about Obama raising tariffs on solar panels from China and tires from China and steel from China. I think one reason there are fewer aluminum plants in the United States is environmental laws. I know of two plants that closed because of tough regulations. Both were located next to the Columbia River. One of those plants now houses a Google server farm.
Dutchy wrote:The title is wrong, it should be: Trump starts a trade war and thus will weaken the world's economy.
AirFiero wrote:Dutchy wrote:The title is wrong, it should be: Trump starts a trade war and thus will weaken the world's economy.
Spare us your anti Trump nonsense.
How about my country trying to help bring back JOBS for PEOPLE?
AirFiero wrote:Dutchy wrote:The title is wrong, it should be: Trump starts a trade war and thus will weaken the world's economy.
Spare us your anti Trump nonsense.
How about my country trying to help bring back JOBS for PEOPLE?
Jouhou wrote:AirFiero wrote:Dutchy wrote:The title is wrong, it should be: Trump starts a trade war and thus will weaken the world's economy.
Spare us your anti Trump nonsense.
How about my country trying to help bring back JOBS for PEOPLE?
And yet, back here in the USA we are now fretting about increased construction costs due to expensive steel, and future projects likely now getting shelved. Nothing like laid off construction workers and metal tradesmen. P.S. construction jobs can't be sent overseas
Dutchy wrote:AirFiero wrote:Dutchy wrote:The title is wrong, it should be: Trump starts a trade war and thus will weaken the world's economy.
Spare us your anti Trump nonsense.
How about my country trying to help bring back JOBS for PEOPLE?
What anti-Trump? What nonsense? Do you think the rest of the world will say: oh ok, no problem, of course, you can benefit your own industry against world trade rules, a bit naive don't you think? This will have consequences.
If you want jobs? Invest in infrastructure and make your country a bit more equal.
Dutchy wrote:The title is wrong, it should be: Trump starts a trade war and thus will weaken the world's economy.
WIederling wrote:Research shows that the tariffs adversely affected US GDP and employment.[1]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_Unit ... eel_tariff
Jouhou wrote:P.S. construction jobs can't be sent overseas
tommy1808 wrote:High taxes kill the economy
Renewable, expensive energy kill the economy
Social systems kill the economy
Universal health care kills the economy
Unions kill the economy
Strict environment standards kill the economy
And yet countries having all of the above can somehow make steel and aluminium cheaper than US companies not burdened by all that.
Best regards
Thomas
Route66 wrote:I think some people here need to be more careful about throwing stones from glass houses.
Route66 wrote:I think some people here need to be more careful about throwing stones from glass houses.
Route66 wrote:Jouhou wrote:P.S. construction jobs can't be sent overseas
The construction trade has already been given away to illegals.
seb146 wrote:Route66 wrote:Jouhou wrote:P.S. construction jobs can't be sent overseas
The construction trade has already been given away to illegals.
Source, please.
Aesma wrote:I heard on the radio that the EU could slap taxes on steel and aluminum, ironically, since some grades are imported from the US to the EU. Other taxes could be on oranges and whisky, among others.
Aside from that, how much of the trade imbalance is due to the fact that products we buy that are of US origin are not built in the US ? Say iPhones ? Considering their ridiculous prices it's a travesty they're not made in the US (or EU for those markets).
tommy1808 wrote:Route66 wrote:I think some people here need to be more careful about throwing stones from glass houses.
I see you still don't get the difference between tariffs targeting an abuser (China) and a blanket tariff against any other producers (for example Germany), regardless of cost structure etc. Or to use the words of your source, anti-dumping tariff vs. flat out protectionism....
Removing incentives for domestic producers to increase productivity will just make those industries even less competitive in the global market and drive up consumer prices in the US.
That is called inflation and the Fed will increase interest rates even faster.
The kremlin provided Trump with a good playbook to wreck the economy and do sustained damage in the little time he has.
Best regards
Thomas
par13del wrote:We are told that the USA runs a trade imbalance with most if not all industrial nations because their product quality is low,
par13del wrote:The republicans wanted to lower the trade imbalance by increasing oil exports, how is that working out?
par13del wrote:It will also be interesting to see the tariffs imposed on USA parts that are used in Airbus products that are then turned into complete aircraft and sold back to the USA.
Aesma wrote:I heard on the radio that the EU could slap taxes on steel and aluminum, ironically, since some grades are imported from the US to the EU. Other taxes could be on oranges and whisky, among others.
Aside from that, how much of the trade imbalance is due to the fact that products we buy that are of US origin are not built in the US ? Say iPhones ? Considering their ridiculous prices it's a travesty they're not made in the US (or EU for those markets).
seb146 wrote:Route66 wrote:
The construction trade has already been given away to illegals.
Source, please.
Route66 wrote:seb146 wrote:Route66 wrote:
The construction trade has already been given away to illegals.
Source, please.
https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/02/25/ ... 3777840295
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-b ... story.html
http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-c ... ion-trump/
CCGPV wrote:Have you ever done major commercial or residential work? Roofing, masonry, landscaping and framing in particular. Undocumented or non-legitimate document having workers do a lot of the work. At least in my experience in various locations.
I put a roof on a location a few years ago and the only citizens were the owner of the business. He said Americans simply don't stick around long enough.
AirFiero wrote:Dutchy wrote:The title is wrong, it should be: Trump starts a trade war and thus will weaken the world's economy.
Spare us your anti Trump nonsense.
How about my country trying to help bring back JOBS for PEOPLE?
ElPistolero wrote:Jingoistic nonsense at best.
This is basically a subsidy to inefficient industries with taxpayers handing money directly to inefficient/more expensive US companies instead of using the government as a middleman.
Jobs? More like income redistribution, as your socialist friends would call it.
Tugger wrote:Route66 wrote:
You do understand that you stated the construction trade has been "given away" to illegals. Iplying they have taken it over, right? Is 12% taking over?CCGPV wrote:Have you ever done major commercial or residential work? Roofing, masonry, landscaping and framing in particular. Undocumented or non-legitimate document having workers do a lot of the work. At least in my experience in various locations.
I put a roof on a location a few years ago and the only citizens were the owner of the business. He said Americans simply don't stick around long enough.
Well that's proof if I've ever heard proof before!
Or you could look at the research that has been done on it:
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/pew-7 ... le/2617560
And this is from the Washington Examiner which is the "conservative" DC paper....
Tugg
MSPNWA wrote:Inefficient is an inaccurate word to use. The reality is that the domestic industry could be more efficient. That's actually a likely scenario with available US technology and its skilled labor force. But they have no chance of competing evenly when up against cheap labor and a regime that doesn't care about even playing fields.
CCGPV wrote:How would you know if they are illegals? Don't try to tell me that they just volunteered that information because they like to talk to gringos.I was just stating my experience that illegal immigrants make up a large part of the people I've worked with in the construction industry. They are all good people.
longhauler wrote:ExMilitaryEng wrote:So, after Softwood Lumber duties, the CSeries BS (now resolved), and now aluminium, Quebec trade with US is not getting smoother.
It would be fun to watch the scramble if Hydro-Quebec decides ... OK, Vermont and New York, we're not sending electricity south any more ... see ya.