jetero
Posts: 4457
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 3:45 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Thu Sep 27, 2018 4:27 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
Mortyman wrote:
and Fox news cut the laughter out of the segment and ran it without the laughter….

They did ??? Outrageous, that is not reporting.


Just another day in the life of the TRULY FAKE NEWS.

But I guess they screwed up this time, as I'm sure the Trumpists would've loved to hear world leaders laughing with their beloved president. OOOOOOOPSSSS!
 
seb146
Posts: 20202
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Thu Sep 27, 2018 5:21 pm

seahawk wrote:
Lilienthal wrote:
seahawk wrote:

Why let facts destroy a good narrative?


I don't think you understood his post...


I think the liberals are just shocked, because Trump says things no other president said before. He is totally free of old fashioned diplomacy and facts.


Like alienating our allies, going on unhinged rants over nothing, creating crises, and giving us worse deals than we had before?

It does not surprise me at all that he was laughed at. He is a fool. You righties had a chance to give us a diplomat and leader but you all gave us this. Don't whine and cry and complain when no one wants to elect Republicans anymore....
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
Jalap
Posts: 482
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2007 4:25 pm

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:50 pm

aviationaware wrote:
Meanwhile, Trump is just chairing a meeting of the UNSC and stated in his opening remarks:

"The Syrian regime's butchery is enabled by Russia and Iran."

Man you guys must be right, he is totally in Russias pocket to attack them like that! Sounds like a massive fanboi.

Russia didn't support Trump & Brexit to get "fanboi's". They did this to break up unity in the West.
And clearly this is very successfull.
 
WIederling
Posts: 8467
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Fri Sep 28, 2018 7:14 am

Jalap wrote:
And clearly this is very successfull.


IMU the employ of Cambridge Analytics was the most influential and probably result turning influence
for the UK Brexit and the last US presidential determination.
And it was rather undemocratic underhanded influencing at that.
Sending over non public ways bespoke information to carefully selected recipients.
The non public transport allowed to offer each recipient his personal
nirwana or hate object without collision with the views of other voters.
Additionally rationally countering these is difficult. They were not public.
( in public vying for voters fishing on one extreme fringe loses you voters on the opposite end.
forces reasonable argument in public "middle ground". this was circumvented here.)

Bringing up foreign "influencers" ist just distraction.
Murphy is an optimist
 
anrec80
Posts: 1968
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Sep 30, 2018 3:56 pm

aviationaware wrote:
Tugger wrote:
What Trump and it appears you are not fully understanding, is that Iran is a nation, a recognized international participant on the world stage with allies, and agreement and, though some in the USA dispute it, a real governmental process in place for its people to govern the county. ISIS has none of that.

So was Nazi Germany. Thanks for playing.


So was Nazi Germany, yes. Nobody has ever doubted legitimacy of Hitler’s regime as legitimate German government. Why this addition though?
 
anrec80
Posts: 1968
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Sep 30, 2018 4:17 pm

N14AZ wrote:
And we do so why? Because we have the freedom to do so and to choose the product we consider the best. Freedom? Remember? Used to be a big thing in Trump‘s land. Now he wants to dictate which cars we buy and from where we get our natural gas.

Actually, he is treating Germany like a vassal state.

What would you think if Ms. Merkel would ask Texans, in front of the UN, to buy German beef instead of local steaks?!?!


Well - why does he do so? Isn’t it largely because he can? For him - it’s business, it’s jobs, it’s tax revenues. Together with that - he won’t approach a nation that’s truly sovereign like this. You really need to start figuring out where you are, and begin work on regaining your sovereignty.

Figure out what’s happening on your borders. Who’s inside your country (including those receiving welfare)? Finally properly fund and fix up the military. Do you (or Euro-zone for that reason) even have your own finance system? You major businesses are obtaining funding, capital and other financial services they need in the USA. Europe’s major banks (Deutsche Bank, Soc Gen, BNP Paribas) are also doing anything except what they should be - they are doing random things in the USA, but yet can’t offer all financial services your economy needs within the Euro-zone and European jurisdiction. These are the things you need to be thinking about.

These are the reasons why he can approach you the way he does.
 
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Tugger
Posts: 9262
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Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Sep 30, 2018 9:34 pm

anrec80 wrote:
N14AZ wrote:
And we do so why? Because we have the freedom to do so and to choose the product we consider the best. Freedom? Remember? Used to be a big thing in Trump‘s land. Now he wants to dictate which cars we buy and from where we get our natural gas.

Actually, he is treating Germany like a vassal state.

What would you think if Ms. Merkel would ask Texans, in front of the UN, to buy German beef instead of local steaks?!?!


Well - why does he do so? Isn’t it largely because he can? For him - it’s business, it’s jobs, it’s tax revenues. Together with that - he won’t approach a nation that’s truly sovereign like this. You really need to start figuring out where you are, and begin work on regaining your sovereignty.

Figure out what’s happening on your borders. Who’s inside your country (including those receiving welfare)? Finally properly fund and fix up the military. Do you (or Euro-zone for that reason) even have your own finance system? You major businesses are obtaining funding, capital and other financial services they need in the USA. Europe’s major banks (Deutsche Bank, Soc Gen, BNP Paribas) are also doing anything except what they should be - they are doing random things in the USA, but yet can’t offer all financial services your economy needs within the Euro-zone and European jurisdiction. These are the things you need to be thinking about.

These are the reasons why he can approach you the way he does.

I do love the Russian troll and disruption machine! Yes, Germany and other nations need to be on their own! Stand up to those you cooperate with and have treaties with! By your own country! Dammit.


See the idea is to exacerbate what ever difference or dispute there is that is on going. Push it. Make it worse. Inflame people and passions and tensions:

"Break up! Please! We (Russia) are a weaken nation even though we are huge, we can't compete against others so we need to disrupt others so we are the bigger and badder one." (I say this as a Russian troll would not/cannot say this openly).

And by the way, I freely admit that the USA is eff'ing this up as badly as anyone, with simplistic folks making passionate posts that don't actually apply much thought beyond "Ooo-rah! USA is #1!" thinking. And a president doing much the same.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
Productivity isn’t about getting more things done, rather it’s about getting the right things done, while doing less. - M. Oshin
 
jetero
Posts: 4457
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 3:45 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Sep 30, 2018 9:50 pm

Tugger wrote:
anrec80 wrote:
N14AZ wrote:
And we do so why? Because we have the freedom to do so and to choose the product we consider the best. Freedom? Remember? Used to be a big thing in Trump‘s land. Now he wants to dictate which cars we buy and from where we get our natural gas.

Actually, he is treating Germany like a vassal state.

What would you think if Ms. Merkel would ask Texans, in front of the UN, to buy German beef instead of local steaks?!?!


Well - why does he do so? Isn’t it largely because he can? For him - it’s business, it’s jobs, it’s tax revenues. Together with that - he won’t approach a nation that’s truly sovereign like this. You really need to start figuring out where you are, and begin work on regaining your sovereignty.

Figure out what’s happening on your borders. Who’s inside your country (including those receiving welfare)? Finally properly fund and fix up the military. Do you (or Euro-zone for that reason) even have your own finance system? You major businesses are obtaining funding, capital and other financial services they need in the USA. Europe’s major banks (Deutsche Bank, Soc Gen, BNP Paribas) are also doing anything except what they should be - they are doing random things in the USA, but yet can’t offer all financial services your economy needs within the Euro-zone and European jurisdiction. These are the things you need to be thinking about.

These are the reasons why he can approach you the way he does.

I do love the Russian troll and disruption machine! Yes, Germany and other nations need to be on their own! Stand up to those you cooperate with and have treaties with! By your own country! Dammit.


See the idea is to exacerbate what ever difference or dispute there is that is on going. Push it. Make it worse. Inflame people and passions and tensions:

"Break up! Please! We (Russia) are a weaken nation even though we are huge, we can't compete against others so we need to disrupt others so we are the bigger and badder one." (I say this as a Russian troll would not/cannot say this openly).

And by the way, I freely admit that the USA is eff'ing this up as badly as anyone, with simplistic folks making passionate posts that don't actually apply much thought beyond "Ooo-rah! USA is #1!" thinking. And a president doing much the same.

Tugg


That, in and of itself, is the challenge to Western democracy. Our political system is easy enough to find fault with for even the most uneducated of people because it’s easy enough to express in feelings and fables (this person is attacking the other person for something this person did!). Western democracy can survive only if individuals can put the micro aside for the macro.

Unfortunately the crazy in the U.S. have a megaphone. It’d be like if Obama won and egged on the far left wing against the rest of the country, and governed for only them, all while not doing a damned thing for them as far as policy is concerned.

It’s very easy to win when you focus on the micro.

Most of the “conservative” posters on here are focused solely on the micro.
 
anrec80
Posts: 1968
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Sep 30, 2018 10:47 pm

Tugger wrote:
I do love the Russian troll and disruption machine! Yes, Germany and other nations need to be on their own! Stand up to those you cooperate with and have treaties with! By your own country! Dammit.

"Break up! Please! We (Russia) are a weaken nation even though we are huge, we can't compete against others so we need to disrupt others so we are the bigger and badder one." (I say this as a Russian troll would not/cannot say this openly).


Wait a min - this discussion is solely about Germany and the USA threading German businesses with sanctions. What does Russia have to do here? Russia didn’t threaten with sanctions anyone.

Tugger wrote:
And by the way, I freely admit that the USA is eff'ing this up as badly as anyone, with simplistic folks making passionate posts that don't actually apply much thought beyond "Ooo-rah! USA is #1!" thinking. And a president doing much the same.

Tugg


Agree - this whole sanctions spiral will probably prove to be a mistake much bigger than even Iraqi war. Over the past few years, there isn’t a country that had not been exposed to sanctions or threat of using sanctions. Even closest allies. The USA have shown well how voluntarily and easily such decisions are being made. It doesn’t even take a high level officials - just a mention of a name by some official, or an opinion of an aide to some sertetary is enough to create a major global company problems. Of course nobody needs such dependency. Yet a year ago Europeans believed that these sanctions issues won’t affect them - and voila, they just did. And rest assured - Russian diplomacy plays off these topics well, and fully takes advantage of all opportunities provided.
 
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SomebodyInTLS
Posts: 1678
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Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:57 am

Lilienthal wrote:
seahawk wrote:

Why let facts destroy a good narrative?


I don't think you understood his post...


I think Seahawk is actually playing an incredible game of agent provocateur - with a completely straight face.
"As with most things related to aircraft design, it's all about the trade-offs and much more nuanced than A.net likes to make out."
 
Amiga500
Posts: 2237
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2015 8:22 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Thu Oct 04, 2018 2:11 pm

Unfortunately, the problem with modern democracy is that its now mud-slinging everywhere.

The substance of policies don't matter. Its all about dirt raking on the opposition.


Time was, a politician would say, "this is my position, if you like it, vote for me". Now its a case of "don't vote for them, they eat babies for breakfast, vote for me instead".

Another problem with current representative democracy is it is woefully out of date. Designed in the age of horses and telegram and also before the idiocy of social media.

Right now, we are often in a scenario where the average person on the street is of the opinion that (i) their vote doesn't matter because two party politics can leave two undesirable candidates with no credible alternative, (ii) politicians get away with figurative murder while in office and there is nothing their electorate can do and (iii) the average person isn't voting in the same proportion as those of sub-average intelligence, who are more easily led by duplicitous media.

Possible things to discuss to that end would be:
>> Political parties can only reach a max limit of 30% of any representative body they sit in - to discourage 2 party systems which are more open to abuses of power.
>> People have to pass an exam to show a rudimentary grasp of the world around them before being allowed to vote.
>> It should be much easier for any electorate to recall those they elected to face a re-election campaign.
>> Proportional representation instead of first-past-the-post.
>> ePolls among the populace could be held every quarter to better guide the representative bodies as to what the will of the people is. Indeed, if these ePolls reach a threshold, then the government should, by law, be forced to act on the wishes of the people.

There is undoubtedly a load of others, but these would get the ball rolling.
 
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N14AZ
Posts: 3759
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:19 pm

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Oct 07, 2018 8:56 pm

Lilienthal wrote:
seahawk wrote:

Why let facts destroy a good narrative?


I don't think you understood his post...

Hmmm, I think he did. Let’s have a look:

You wrote:

Lilienthal wrote:
seahawk wrote:

Only true friends, that would support America, not false friends like Germany, who gladly sell their cars but refuse to buy American. They are enemies and should be treated as such.



We buy very few American cars because they are mediocre. But we do buy iPhones, use American web-services, the freakin cheese grater i bought a couple of days ago says "Made in the USA" on it. How would you possibly arrive at the conclusion that Germany refuses to buy American? And please remind me again which jobs we took, i can't seem to remember...

Oh by the way. How do you like the big Volkswagen plant in Chattanooga? Or the Airbus assembly line in Mobile? Or numerous other German cooperations like Siemens, BASF or Bayer that produce goods on American soil with American workers for decades?

So does that still make us an enemy... or an ally... sorry man, your logic is quite difficult to apply to the complications of the real world...


I wanted to support your point by adding some more examples, meaning more FACTS:

N14AZ wrote:
plus Starbucks, Mc Donald, all kind of Coca Cola products, even when it’s just sparkling water ...

And we do so why? Because we have the freedom to do so and to choose the product we consider the best. Freedom? Remember? Used to be a big thing in Trump‘s land. Now he wants to dictate which cars we buy and from where we get our natural gas.

Actually, he is treating Germany like a vassal state.

What would you think if Ms. Merkel would ask Texans, in front of the UN, to buy German beef instead of local steaks?!?!


So his reply
seahawk wrote:
Why let facts destroy a good narrative?

was not for me but like speaking to President Trump. Why let facts destroy his propaganda talking.

That’s how I see it. I may be wrong, of course.
 
seb146
Posts: 20202
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:18 pm

Amiga500 wrote:
Unfortunately, the problem with modern democracy is that its now mud-slinging everywhere.

The substance of policies don't matter. Its all about dirt raking on the opposition.


I don't know where you live but, in the Untied States, politicians play to the lowest common denominator and know that mud slinging gets them votes.

Another problem with current representative democracy is it is woefully out of date. Designed in the age of horses and telegram and also before the idiocy of social media.


Many parts of the United States Constitution are. It would literally take an act of God Himself to change even one letter.

Right now, we are often in a scenario where the average person on the street is of the opinion that (i) their vote doesn't matter because two party politics can leave two undesirable candidates with no credible alternative, (ii) politicians get away with figurative murder while in office and there is nothing their electorate can do and (iii) the average person isn't voting in the same proportion as those of sub-average intelligence, who are more easily led by duplicitous media.

Possible things to discuss to that end would be:
>> Political parties can only reach a max limit of 30% of any representative body they sit in - to discourage 2 party systems which are more open to abuses of power.
>> People have to pass an exam to show a rudimentary grasp of the world around them before being allowed to vote.
>> It should be much easier for any electorate to recall those they elected to face a re-election campaign.
>> Proportional representation instead of first-past-the-post.
>> ePolls among the populace could be held every quarter to better guide the representative bodies as to what the will of the people is. Indeed, if these ePolls reach a threshold, then the government should, by law, be forced to act on the wishes of the people.

There is undoubtedly a load of others, but these would get the ball rolling.


Again, in the United States, getting money out of the political process would improve things very much. 535 people in Congress insist that their current pay is not enough. It starts at $174,000 per year for part time work. And they get full benefits.

I do not agree with revamping the recall process. That would lead to massive abuse of power by the electorate. Passing an exam would probably be illegal, although I think it is a great idea.

This is a great conversation to have but what it is doing in this thread leaves me scratching my head.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
petertenthije
Posts: 3702
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2001 10:00 pm

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:55 pm

Amiga500 wrote:
>> Political parties can only reach a max limit of 30% of any representative body they sit in - to discourage 2 party systems which are more open to abuses of power.
That will not work unless there are already credible third (ideally fourth/fifth/sixth...) parties. Otherwise you will end up with a few million people deciding on 40% of the representatives. Also, it will probably lead to the democrats and republicans setting up their own “diet” parties.

Amiga500 wrote:
>> People have to pass an exam to show a rudimentary grasp of the world around them before being allowed to vote.
Who gets to decide the minimum requirements? Who gets to decide if someone passed the test? This proposal would be so easy to abuse by the political establishment.

Amiga500 wrote:
>> It should be much easier for any electorate to recall those they elected to face a re-election campaign.
Makes sense to me.

Amiga500 wrote:
>> Proportional representation instead of first-past-the-post.
This should have been done ages ago.

Amiga500 wrote:
>> ePolls among the populace could be held every quarter to better guide the representative bodies as to what the will of the people is. Indeed, if these ePolls reach a threshold, then the government should, by law, be forced to act on the wishes of the people.
Any decent populist will be able to play low-information voters like a fiddle. You only need a catchy slogan and a (real or imaginary) threat. American politicians have become Jedi-masters at catchphrases and making up threats. I don’t think you really thought this one through.
Attamottamotta!
 
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Lilienthal
Topic Author
Posts: 134
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Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:04 am

N14AZ wrote:

So his reply
seahawk wrote:
Why let facts destroy a good narrative?

was not for me but like speaking to President Trump. Why let facts destroy his propaganda talking.

That’s how I see it. I may be wrong, of course.


As in "My dear leader please don't look at the facts, just feed us more of your BS because we enjoy the story that much"?

He seems to be a die hard Trump supporter. I thought he just misunderstood your post to be supportive of his points instead of mine.
But yeah... given the torrential downpour of obvious inaccuracies, lies and delusions coming from the Trump administration and his still relatively high support numbers, i guess some of his supporters simply don't want their bubble popped, even though they know they're being fed nonsense.
 
ltbewr
Posts: 14167
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Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:42 am

One has to wonder if the USA's UN Ambassador, Nikki Haley has resigned as deep down believes the polices of the Trump administration, especially under Sec. of State Pompeo, are bad, have driven her away from any real say in diplomatic policy and the embarrassing behaviors of Trump himself.
Better to escape the eventual train wreck of the Trump administration now to save her political future (President or VP Republican nomination in 2020 or 2024?), go on the speaking/book tour and make some big money so can run, pay down debts or just out of personal greed or possibly not be removed for taking unethical private biz jet trips (7 of question).
 
Pyrex
Posts: 4616
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 7:24 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:19 pm

She was highly complementary of Trump in her exit press conference, and he of her... I guess she realizes how utterly useless the UN is, and, while fun, spending your day just trolling the world's dictatorships probably gets boring after a while.

My guess is that she is leaving to run for Senate in 2020 so she can then run for President in 2024. Either that or replace Pence as VP in 2020 - after accomplishing almost everything he set out to do in the first two years of his mandate (immigration reform excluded), Trump is probably only in it for the lolz at this point. Being the guy that led directly to the first female President of the U.S. (after retiring in 2022) would just be trolling on an epic level.
Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
 
WIederling
Posts: 8467
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Oct 14, 2018 4:26 pm

seb146 wrote:
I don't know where you live but, in the Untied States, politicians play to the lowest common denominator and know that mud slinging gets them votes.


Not long ago burning witches and members of minorities was politically opportune
and got the cheers of the masses too.

Nonetheless that was rather dysfunctional overall.

Same for religious drivel and theological thinking.
1000++ years of no tap water and working sanitation should give people something to think about.
Murphy is an optimist
 
jetero
Posts: 4457
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 3:45 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:04 pm

WIederling wrote:
Same for religious drivel and theological thinking. 1000++ years of no tap water and working sanitation should give people something to think about.


Ah, who needs big government?
 
seb146
Posts: 20202
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Oct 14, 2018 11:44 pm

WIederling wrote:
seb146 wrote:
I don't know where you live but, in the Untied States, politicians play to the lowest common denominator and know that mud slinging gets them votes.


Not long ago burning witches and members of minorities was politically opportune
and got the cheers of the masses too.

Nonetheless that was rather dysfunctional overall.

Same for religious drivel and theological thinking.
1000++ years of no tap water and working sanitation should give people something to think about.


It could be said that it is politically opportune to shun and hate minorities and those of different religions these days. Works just well for "patriots" on the right. The same ones who claim to be Christian.

https://www.courierpress.com/story/news ... 546737002/
https://www.coloradoan.com/story/news/2 ... 301496002/
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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Pellegrine
Posts: 2268
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 10:19 am

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Sun Oct 14, 2018 11:53 pm

I'd laugh at that sorry president every day of my life. He has no standing to be in the place he is in, except for voters as and more ignorant than he is.
oh boy, here we go!!!
 
WIederling
Posts: 8467
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Re: Trump laughed at by UN General Assembly

Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:06 am

Pellegrine wrote:
I'd laugh at that sorry president every day of my life. He has no standing to be in the place he is in, except for voters as and more ignorant than he is.


Only he is more like Nero exponentiated: Doing trash talk, playing the fiddle while burning the globe.
Murphy is an optimist

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