BarfBag
Posts: 2566
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2001 7:13 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Wed May 29, 2019 1:46 am

dtw2hyd wrote:
BTW, consolidation of power is not symptomatic of a healthy democracy. Putin and Xi are also doing it. No one calls Russia or China true democracies.

Wrong . Consolidation of legislative power through free and fair elections is entirely healthy and constitutional . There’s NO constitutional requirement that there must be a certain number of opposition legislators - I challenge you to prove any such claim .

You’re confusing the words competent and constitutional . That the Congress could only win 50 odd seats in two General Elections is a demonstration of their own incompetence . It is not a proof of lack of democracy .

The right to have legislative power to oppose is EARNED competitively in elections .

China by the way makes no presumption of being democratic - they will vehemently deny it, in fact . And if you want to nitpick, India is a federal republic and not a popular democracy.
[quote=“dtw2hyd”]In a federal system, the center doesn't give handouts to states, actually center plays with states' money.
[/quote]
If you’re referring to disaster relief funds, you are wrong . Patnaik sought national disaster status for the cyclone damage. Consequently he received federal troops and federal funds . All federal states have disaster relief as a federal task . Guess what the F in FEMA stands for ?

As a general answer about federal devolution of fiscal powers to states, it’s clear you’re not at all familiar with the role of the Finance Commission , or for that matter the role of the now defunct Planning Commission.

The BJPs actions and goals have always been more federally oriented than the Congress .
 
BarfBag
Posts: 2566
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2001 7:13 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Wed May 29, 2019 5:05 am

Well, the guy seems to think the composition of the Lok Sabha determines the extent of democracy in India. Same guy who equates Indian political system with that of the Kim family in North Korea, Chinese totalitarian state and Iran's ulema council.
dtw2hyd wrote:
Read post #18 from 4 months back. I called Modi/Shah victory and listed the reasons.

The part where you claimed BJP would win because of polarization related to Ayodhya and Sabarimala ? If you weren't in the US but in Kerala like I was, you'd realize you're far off on both. Modi won the north because he uplifted the lot of the very bottom of the economic pyramid.

None of the folks in the cities, much less venting gas from Yoo Ess, are aware just how many new roads, electric power lines, and the sheer number of toilets that have come up in the last five years. Add to that all the PMAY homes built and the gas cylinders, and it's not a surprise the BJP won astonishing >50% or even >60% voteshares across the northern swathe of India - they have transformed the lives of 400 million people at the very bottom.

I traveled up the northern states a little in 2014, and a lot more the last 4 months. The change at the rural level is enormous. I've heard the extreme left media mocking the Swacch Bharat Mission, Ujjwala etc claiming the numbers are made up. Let's pretend they're made up. Here's some number that aren't made up:

303 seats out of 543 for BJP
353 seats out of 543 for alliance
3rd largest voteshare ever won by a winning entity. Larger than anything by Indira Gandhi. Larger than all but one of Nehru's wins. The only other case is a sympathy vote after IG was killed.
>50% voteshare in UP, RJ, GJ, MH, JH, CG, HR, HP, UK, DL BH, which together comprise about half a billion people.
41% voteshare in WB
4 seats in Telangana

Sabarimala didn't help the BJP - it actually helped the UDF because it split the anti LDF vote with the BJP. Take a look at the Kerala result and you'd realize that. Kerala is the only place INC even won >10 seats. In 20 states, Congress won ZERO.

In a few months, BJP will force reelections in Karnataka and MP assemblies. Probably Rajasthan too. And in 2024 the BJP targets 333 seats in Lok Sabha. I'll be doing my bit again then to make that happen.
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7070
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Wed May 29, 2019 10:24 am

BarfBag wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
BTW, consolidation of power is not symptomatic of a healthy democracy. Putin and Xi are also doing it. No one calls Russia or China true democracies.

Consolidation of legislative power through free and fair elections is entirely healthy and constitutional .
...
The right to have legislative power to oppose is EARNED competitively in elections .


Free and fair is a totally debatable topic about Indian elections. Unfairly consolidating power is nothing but dictatorship.

All the listed powers earned thru elections time and again.

I haven't given the best example of elections yet, Gaza strip in 2006. No one in the world guessed the result of that democratic election.
 
BarfBag
Posts: 2566
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2001 7:13 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Wed May 29, 2019 3:35 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Unfairly consolidating power is nothing but dictatorship.

All the listed powers earned thru elections time and again.

I haven't given the best example of elections yet, Gaza strip in 2006. No one in the world guessed the result of that democratic election.

"Unfairly" ? It's the very Constitution of India that mandates elections every 5 years. It also mandates the manner in which it is executed.

There's nothing unfair about any of what happens in the Indian general elections. You have a problem with the result, that is all. Even the extreme left's cherished hope of invalidating the election on the basis of VVPAT fell flat on its face - they all matched!

Keep digging a bigger hole for yourself:
"India is the same as North Korea , Iran and China politically" - dtw2hyd the political expert
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7070
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Wed May 29, 2019 4:10 pm

BarfBag wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
Unfairly consolidating power is nothing but dictatorship.

All the listed powers earned thru elections time and again.

I haven't given the best example of elections yet, Gaza strip in 2006. No one in the world guessed the result of that democratic election.

"Unfairly" ? It's the very Constitution of India that mandates elections every 5 years. It also mandates the manner in which it is executed.

There's nothing unfair about any of what happens in the Indian general elections. You have a problem with the result, that is all. Even the extreme left's cherished hope of invalidating the election on the basis of VVPAT fell flat on its face - they all matched!

Keep digging a bigger hole for yourself:
"India is the same as North Korea , Iran and China politically" - dtw2hyd the political expert


You are not answering even a single question honestly.

North Korea, Iran, Russia, China, Venezuela, and Gaza Strip conduct elections on a relatively regular basis. Regularity itself is not a symptom of great health.
Only a random sample of five VVPAT are counted, so "they all matched" is not a true statement.

Keeping technical issues aside, the way Sunil Arora and ECI conducted themselves makes election process legitimacy very questionable. Arora cannot ride on Seshan's reputation.
 
BarfBag
Posts: 2566
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2001 7:13 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Wed May 29, 2019 4:20 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
You are not answering even a single question honestly.

North Korea, Iran, Russia, China, Venezuela, and Gaza Strip conduct elections on a relatively regular basis. Regularity itself is not a symptom of great health.
Only a random sample of five VVPAT are counted, so "they all matched" is not a true statement.

Keeping technical issues aside, the way Sunil Arora and ECI conducted themselves makes election process legitimacy very questionable. Arora cannot ride on Seshan's reputation.

You have demonstrated the following already:
* You don't understand what a democracy is. You think India is 'more' or 'less' democratic depending on how many members of each party are in Lok Sabha.
* You're on record claiming that Indian democracy has 'become a numbers game'. The word literally means rule by the people - they vote, they choose.
* You have demonstrated that you do not understand what elections and peaceful transfer of power are about. Show me where North Korea or China elected an opposition, and the ruling party stepped out and let the other guys take over.

You don't like the fact that only 5 VVPATs are counted ? Too bad. Take it up with the Supreme Court of India:
SC rejects Opposition review plea on 50% VVPAT verification, says not inclined to interfere
Therefore:
Image
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7070
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Thu May 30, 2019 10:44 am

BarfBag wrote:
You have demonstrated the following already:
* You don't understand what a democracy is. You think India is 'more' or 'less' democratic depending on how many members of each party are in Lok Sabha.
* You're on record claiming that Indian democracy has 'become a numbers game'. The word literally means rule by the people - they vote, they choose.
* You have demonstrated that you do not understand what elections and peaceful transfer of power are about. Show me where North Korea or China elected an opposition, and the ruling party stepped out and let the other guys take over.

You don't like the fact that only 5 VVPATs are counted ? Too bad. Take it up with the Supreme Court of India:

Therefore:
Image


Again, DPRK, Russia, Iran, China has ceremonial opposition parties. You yourself claimed next targets are Karnataka and Rajasthan. What is India? A single party system.

People are free to vote, in this case, they might have voted out of fear, hoping that they will be safe if Modi finds out who they voted for and leave the responsibility to others. Now having a WTF moment. India is facing a Emporer has no clothes moment, someone has to say it.

You made false and misleading statements about VVPAT up thread, not me.

Therefore
Modi could use a boatload for Preparation-H. No one else needs a Burnol.
 
User avatar
WingsFan
Posts: 324
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Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Thu May 30, 2019 3:40 pm

The delusion index here is off the chart! You may oppose BJP and Modi all you like but insinuation that the elections were sham is simply incorrect.You comparing this with Cuba,China or N Korea is just plain stupid. Not even parties and candidates who lost have questioned the process. Feel free to hold on the your delusions if that's what keeps you sane.

Modi may have bungled up few opportunities during his last tenure ( notably, the currency fiasco) but there is simply no getting around the fact that Indians wanted BJP and they got BJP fair and square.


dtw2hyd wrote:

Again, DPRK, Russia, Iran, China has ceremonial opposition parties. You yourself claimed next targets are Karnataka and Rajasthan. What is India? A single party system.

People are free to vote, in this case, they might have voted out of fear, hoping that they will be safe if Modi finds out who they voted for and leave the responsibility to others. Now having a WTF moment. India is facing a Emporer has no clothes moment, someone has to say it.

You made false and misleading statements about VVPAT up thread, not me.

Therefore
Modi could use a boatload for Preparation-H. No one else needs a Burnol.
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7070
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Thu May 30, 2019 4:18 pm

WingsFan wrote:
The delusion index here is off the chart! You may oppose BJP and Modi all you like but insinuation that the elections were sham is simply incorrect.You comparing this with Cuba,China or N Korea is just plain stupid. Not even parties and candidates who lost have questioned the process. Feel free to hold on the your delusions if that's what keeps you sane.

Modi may have bungled up few opportunities during his last tenure ( notably, the currency fiasco) but there is simply no getting around the fact that Indians wanted BJP and they got BJP fair and square.



All those listed countries have elections where people vote, legislative bodies with members and court systems with show trails.

If a hiker crosses into Iran and they talks about legal process no one believes, but if an illegal immigrant crosses in USA and DHS processes them to the legal system every one trusts the system. Difference between a banana republic (vs) republic. India is at crossroads.

Just to be clear, AFAIK, I never said anything against BJP or NDA.

India probably likes and deserves Modi's Bollywood style drama and numbers game.

Demonetization actually worked well for Modi, he is the only one access to INR 2,000 bills.
 
aarbee
Posts: 406
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:20 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Thu May 30, 2019 5:23 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
aarbee wrote:
...

Just stunned.

-R


Read post #18 from 4 months back. I called Modi/Shah victory and listed the reasons. I am not a Congress fan and surprised about Modi's win.

I will at at leisure. In the same line you are claiming you called Modi victory and then feeling surprised about it? Decide will you?

dtw2hyd wrote:
BTW, consolidation of power is not symptomatic of a healthy democracy. Putin and Xi are also doing it. No one calls Russia or China true democracies.

What consolidation of power? Having majority in Lok Sabha? Isn't that democracy all about? Are you of the opinion that Prime Minister should form a cabinet of opposition members ? :roll:

You keep on talking of consolidation of power, I still don't understand your point.

dtw2hyd wrote:
Why was the IAF Heli friendly fire news came out after the election, when there was so much fanfare about Balakot and surgical strikes.

In a federal system, the center doesn't give handouts to states, actually center plays with states' money.


In your opinion, has this "money handout/state money" suddenly changed from 2014? Did Nehru, Indira, Rajiv, VP Singh, PVNR, Vajpyee, MMS do it differently?
Or you want Modi to do it differently to satisfy you?

dtw2hyd wrote:
One way I am glad he won, no one can fix India's economy, made up numbers can go only so long.

If he does not perform, this great democracy of India (to whom you have tightly slapped on their face) will throw him out. You are just sitting here and on your computer and looking at some spreadsheet and shaking your head. It's not all just some numbers for voters. Voters have serious issues : Food, Electricity, Sanitation, Cooking Gas, Health care, safety, etc. Voters have given a thumping answer based what they thought the government has delivered and wants the continuity.

Don't keep on insulting the voters.

dtw2hyd wrote:

I am sure Modi, Jaitley and Jayant Sinha are very proud of themselves having shut down a major airline without losing a vote. AI will be next, HAL after that.

Jet Airways is ONE airline in Aviation sector, which is part of Transportation, which is ONE of the domains being managed by government.

You think Modi, Jaitey had NO other business but shut down one puny airline since 2014 :?

Per your thought Modi, Jaitlely, Sinha (MJS) decided to buy Air Sahara, decided on the fleet, decided on the destinations, decided on financing options, defaulted on the payments , did not pay the salaries .... and hence shut it down.

Boo hoo ... There are lot more macro issues to focus on . Grow up.

Again just stunned.

-R
Love the AIXes
 
aarbee
Posts: 406
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:20 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Thu May 30, 2019 5:31 pm

BarfBag wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
BTW, consolidation of power is not symptomatic of a healthy democracy. Putin and Xi are also doing it. No one calls Russia or China true democracies.

Wrong . Consolidation of legislative power through free and fair elections is entirely healthy and constitutional . There’s NO constitutional requirement that there must be a certain number of opposition legislators - I challenge you to prove any such claim .

Oh this winning more seats and votes is consolidation of power? Is that what he means? Then according to that asinine logic - DTW2HYD you must think Nehru, Indira, Rajiv were bigger dictators (Indira G as a matter of fact was ONE in mid 70s)

I won't be surprised if s/he was one of them who cribbed that 2014 Modi did not have mandate because only 33% voted for him. Now the vote share and seats have gone up, it's consolidation of power and dictatorship.

Healthy democracy people vote on issues, elected representatives form the government (as per the constitution) . But that hardly matters here, damn the constitution, this is unhealthy democracy.

- R
Last edited by aarbee on Thu May 30, 2019 5:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Love the AIXes
 
aarbee
Posts: 406
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:20 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Thu May 30, 2019 5:37 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
BarfBag wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
BTW, consolidation of power is not symptomatic of a healthy democracy. Putin and Xi are also doing it. No one calls Russia or China true democracies.

Consolidation of legislative power through free and fair elections is entirely healthy and constitutional .
...
The right to have legislative power to oppose is EARNED competitively in elections .


Free and fair is a totally debatable topic about Indian elections. Unfairly consolidating power is nothing but dictatorship.

All the listed powers earned thru elections time and again.

I haven't given the best example of elections yet, Gaza strip in 2006. No one in the world guessed the result of that democratic election.

Uh! So Indian elections are NOT free and fair? Where do you come up with this? What you get with continuously insulting Indian voters and conducting body?

Again with unfairly "consolidating power" ? How is the power ILLEGALLY consolidated? What is unfair to have a majority in Parliament?
Love the AIXes
 
aarbee
Posts: 406
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:20 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Thu May 30, 2019 5:49 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
BarfBag wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
Unfairly consolidating power is nothing but dictatorship.

All the listed powers earned thru elections time and again.

I haven't given the best example of elections yet, Gaza strip in 2006. No one in the world guessed the result of that democratic election.

"Unfairly" ? It's the very Constitution of India that mandates elections every 5 years. It also mandates the manner in which it is executed.

There's nothing unfair about any of what happens in the Indian general elections. You have a problem with the result, that is all. Even the extreme left's cherished hope of invalidating the election on the basis of VVPAT fell flat on its face - they all matched!

Keep digging a bigger hole for yourself:
"India is the same as North Korea , Iran and China politically" - dtw2hyd the political expert


You are not answering even a single question honestly.

North Korea, Iran, Russia, China, Venezuela, and Gaza Strip conduct elections on a relatively regular basis. Regularity itself is not a symptom of great health.
Only a random sample of five VVPAT are counted, so "they all matched" is not a true statement.

Keeping technical issues aside, the way Sunil Arora and ECI conducted themselves makes election process legitimacy very questionable. Arora cannot ride on Seshan's reputation.



Stop sulking and accept the verdict of Indian voters . Stop comparing India to NK, Venezuela, etc. Maybe you should stay in NK to get an idea about democracy.

Now we move over personally to Chief Election Commissioner. As if berating Indian voters was not enough, now you accuse CEC and ECI. The job of conducting general elections and some state elections peacefully & legally, though very long, is truly commendable.

You don't like what Indian voters voted for ---> malign the CEC & ECI now.

Just stunned

-R
Love the AIXes
 
aarbee
Posts: 406
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:20 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Thu May 30, 2019 6:08 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
BarfBag wrote:
You have demonstrated the following already:
* You don't understand what a democracy is. You think India is 'more' or 'less' democratic depending on how many members of each party are in Lok Sabha.
* You're on record claiming that Indian democracy has 'become a numbers game'. The word literally means rule by the people - they vote, they choose.
* You have demonstrated that you do not understand what elections and peaceful transfer of power are about. Show me where North Korea or China elected an opposition, and the ruling party stepped out and let the other guys take over.

You don't like the fact that only 5 VVPATs are counted ? Too bad. Take it up with the Supreme Court of India:

Therefore:
Image


Again, DPRK, Russia, Iran, China has ceremonial opposition parties. You yourself claimed next targets are Karnataka and Rajasthan. What is India? A single party system.

People are free to vote, in this case, they might have voted out of fear, hoping that they will be safe if Modi finds out who they voted for and leave the responsibility to others. Now having a WTF moment. India is facing a Emporer has no clothes moment, someone has to say it.

You made false and misleading statements about VVPAT up thread, not me.

Therefore
Modi could use a boatload for Preparation-H. No one else needs a Burnol.


So Indian GOP Congress (I), TMC, BSP, SP, NCP, DMK, TRS, PDP, NC,RJD, TD, JD-S are all ceremonial opposition parties? WOW. Just wow. So how come they were allowed to campaign?

Maybe I lost the art of counting ... I did not know all the above mentioned parties plus BJP accounts for single party. Duh!
Speaking of Karnataka, you find it healthy that party with 37 seats out of 224 is governing and party which won 105 is in opposition. (Mind you the current ruling collation was post election and fought the elections against each other and thus cheated the people of Karnataka)..

Voted out of FEAR. Brilliant logic. Election results are not to my liking means people voted out of fear. That's a pretty below the belt accusation.

Could you care to elaborate on Emperor has no clothes moment? Who's the emperor here? I do not even see a King. Please enlighten.

As per what I saw in the swearing ceremony, Modi did not have any difficulties, so why use preparation-H? Seems Burnol moment is for people who are sulking around not accepting the verdict of great Indian democracy.

-R
Love the AIXes
 
aarbee
Posts: 406
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:20 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Thu May 30, 2019 6:11 pm

WingsFan wrote:
The delusion index here is off the chart! You may oppose BJP and Modi all you like but insinuation that the elections were sham is simply incorrect.You comparing this with Cuba,China or N Korea is just plain stupid. Not even parties and candidates who lost have questioned the process. Feel free to hold on the your delusions if that's what keeps you sane.

Modi may have bungled up few opportunities during his last tenure ( notably, the currency fiasco) but there is simply no getting around the fact that Indians wanted BJP and they got BJP fair and square.




Boom. "Indians wanted BJP and they got BJP fair and square." and hard work of the BJP workers.
Love the AIXes
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7070
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Thu May 30, 2019 9:42 pm

aarbee wrote:
...
Boom. "Indians wanted BJP and they got BJP fair and square." and hard work of the BJP workers.


Chinese voted for Xi, Russia voted for Putin, Palastines voted for Hamas, DPRK voted for Kim Jung Un, Cuba voted for Castro, Iran voted for Rouhani with the hard of their party cadre. What is your point?
 
User avatar
unrave
Posts: 2575
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Fri May 31, 2019 6:53 am

dtw2hyd wrote:
aarbee wrote:
...
Boom. "Indians wanted BJP and they got BJP fair and square." and hard work of the BJP workers.


Chinese voted for Xi, Russia voted for Putin, Palastines voted for Hamas, DPRK voted for Kim Jung Un, Cuba voted for Castro, Iran voted for Rouhani with the hard of their party cadre. What is your point?

Since their corrupt party lost the only recourse for the pidis is to tarnish the electoral process. Anything to earn the biscuit I guess.
Denial of racism is as egregious as racism itself
 
P1aneMad
Posts: 326
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2017 2:05 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Fri May 31, 2019 1:38 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:

Chinese voted for Xi, Russia voted for Putin, Palastines voted for Hamas, DPRK voted for Kim Jung Un, Cuba voted for Castro, Iran voted for Rouhani with the hard of their party cadre. What is your point?


So much failure in just one post...

.Image
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7070
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Fri May 31, 2019 1:56 pm

P1aneMad wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:

Chinese voted for Xi, Russia voted for Putin, Palastines voted for Hamas, DPRK voted for Kim Jung Un, Cuba voted for Castro, Iran voted for Rouhani with the hard of their party cadre. What is your point?


So much failure in just one post...


Memes aside, what did India achieve over those countries. Is it an economic superpower? No. Is it a military superpower? Not even close. All India had was a democracy, that is gone courtesy, Modi.

We elected a drama queen with the ultimate majority is not an achievement. He is going grab rest of the seats is also not an achievement for democracy.

What are you proud of?

Unemployment Rate Highest In 45 Years, Centre Confirms Leaked 6.1% Figure
https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/india-u ... ome-livetv

India's Economic Growth Drops To 5.8% In March Quarter, Behind China
https://www.ndtv.com/business/gdp-growt ... -topscroll
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7070
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:14 pm

India was faking GDP growth by a few points.

Rather than growing at about 7% a year in that period, growth was about 4.5%, according to the research paper, published by the Center for International Development at Harvard University


https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/controv ... -topscroll

About India's Auto Industry

more than half a million passenger vehicles worth $5 billion (nearly Rs 35,000 crore) are lying with the dealerships that have not been sold yet in the first week of June. The scene is equally terrible for the two-wheeler segment where the number is said to be $2.5 billion.


http://overdrive.in/news-cars-auto/indi ... inventory/
 
texdravid
Posts: 1801
Joined: Fri May 14, 2004 3:21 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:26 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
India was faking GDP growth by a few points.

Rather than growing at about 7% a year in that period, growth was about 4.5%, according to the research paper, published by the Center for International Development at Harvard University


https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/controv ... -topscroll

About India's Auto Industry

more than half a million passenger vehicles worth $5 billion (nearly Rs 35,000 crore) are lying with the dealerships that have not been sold yet in the first week of June. The scene is equally terrible for the two-wheeler segment where the number is said to be $2.5 billion.


http://overdrive.in/news-cars-auto/indi ... inventory/


Rahul get off this website! Ha ha. Dude you the most shameless Congress Gandhi bootlicker in the history of Indian politics.

Geezus dude your side lost an election. Get over it and quit comparing India to some dictatorship or military junta or such.
Tort reform now. Throw lawyers in jail later.
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7070
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:07 pm

Fun facts

India's population - 1.37 Billion
Eligible voters - ~900 Million
Voters voted in 2019 election - ~603 Million (67% of 900 Million)
Voters voted for BJP in 2019 - ~235 Million (39% of 603 Million)

So, 1.135 Billion Indians have nothing to with BJP's yuge victory.
 
P1aneMad
Posts: 326
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2017 2:05 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:40 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Fun facts

India's population - 1.37 Billion
Eligible voters - ~900 Million
Voters voted in 2019 election - ~603 Million (67% of 900 Million)
Voters voted for BJP in 2019 - ~235 Million (39% of 603 Million)

So, 1.135 Billion Indians have nothing to with BJP's yuge victory.

I don't think you understand how democracy and elections work exactly...

Image
 
TryToFlySomeday
Posts: 304
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 9:51 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Mon Jul 01, 2019 12:11 am

Wasn’t the point of this thread to discuss politics’s role in Indian airlines?

Anyways, I digress. I’m joining the fun, as my cousin recently got engaged to an Indian guy.

I feel like if BJP wanted to deliver their promise to fix up the economy, they should really consider moving AI’s American flights from DEL to BOM until the Pakistani airspace opens again. Indian airplanes can fly over Iran still, so a plane can fly over Iran to get from BOM to say, ORD or JFK.

Plus, Modi’s from Gujarat, where BOM airport is located, anyways
Pakistan's aviation sector is coming back. It won't be as strong as our eastern neighbor, nowhere close, but it's going to grow over time. Stand by and watch.

Born to Pakistani parents near ORD; raised and based near ORD.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 17388
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Mon Jul 01, 2019 8:05 am

Can we get an update on the politics as 9W has collapsed since page 2 of this thread?
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
BarfBag
Posts: 2566
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2001 7:13 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Mon Jul 01, 2019 4:02 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
Can we get an update on the politics as 9W has collapsed since page 2 of this thread?

Jet's collapse is not an issue driven by Indian politics. Neither was Kingfisher for that matter.

Jet is currently going through standard procedures under the Insolvency and Bankruptcy Code of India. The State Bank of India submitted a petition initiating proceedings with the National Company Law Tribunal on June 20, and it was accepted for consideration on June 23, starting the standard 90-day process clock.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 17388
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Tue Jul 02, 2019 3:20 am

BarfBag wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Can we get an update on the politics as 9W has collapsed since page 2 of this thread?

Jet's collapse is not an issue driven by Indian politics. Neither was Kingfisher for that matter.

Of course not, but from the quote below it sounded like there was some political calculus before the election with respect to a Jet loan. Did all that die with the election and shutdown?

BawliBooch wrote:
Apropos the Jet Airways search for investor/lender saga.

My take is that pressure is being built up by the Finance Ministry on State Bank's to lend more money to Jet. While "evergreening" of loans in the old sense of the term is no longer possible, RESTRUCTURING of loans is. With state banks, this cannot be done without some amount of political pressure. NBFC's can also be roped in to lend a helping hand - so to speak.

All Jet Airway's needs right now is for one Govt bank to provide an opening. Other NBFC's, including private ones will fall in line. Historically, that has been the case.

According to my "informed sources" (loving this term ;)), Naresh Goyal's team has already bought the babu's onboard with a 2-track plan to secure financing. But they will need a) the finance minister to come on board. or b) The PMO steps in to do the needful.

The latter looks unlikely, but is not impossible. The PMO getting involved would open Modi to the charges of direct corruption, something he is unlikely to take up. But it has happened before, so you cannot say!

The current FM, Arun Jaitley has to sign off on this 2-track recovery plan. But he is conveniently out of town on "illness" (see above posts).

Keep a close watch on the moves by Finance Ministry babu's across the next month. Also keep a close watch on statements made by LIC/IRFCL/PFCL in addition to Muthoot and others. If Piyush Goyal is made the interim Finance Minister, then we can be sure that Jet Airways lobbying efforts have paid off and the working capital has been secured. If Suresh Prabhu or Sinha is made the interim FM, then its game up for Jet Airways!

The boys at the big bad blue airline played a great game to pull down Jet by targeting its sources of WC. It did work to cripple the airline in the short term. But in the end, they underestimated Naresh Goyal's ability to play the game. He has been playing the game for longer than the Gurgaon team!

PS: If someone like Swamy is made the FM, then its game up for Indigo! Swamy has for long wanted an opportunity to go after Ajit Doval! :P
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
BarfBag
Posts: 2566
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2001 7:13 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Tue Jul 02, 2019 4:13 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
BarfBag wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Can we get an update on the politics as 9W has collapsed since page 2 of this thread?

Jet's collapse is not an issue driven by Indian politics. Neither was Kingfisher for that matter.

Of course not, but from the quote below it sounded like there was some political calculus before the election with respect to a Jet loan. Did all that die with the election and shutdown?

You're quoting someone who's been a one man bandgroup drumming about "corruption" by the incumbent PM, in the lead up to the most recent elections. Worked out spectacularly well for the dude, didn't it ?
:-) Worth a look at the results of that election - the party that 'booch supports now has a phenomenal ~50 seats in a 543 seat parliament, up dramatically from 45. Meanwhile, Modi's party has ~305 seats, plus another 50 from political allies for >350 of 543 seats. So yeah, perspectives matter...

You're making the mistake of wading into an Indian politics thread with no knowledge of the subject matter and then quoting random 'I heard about' commentary. Booch, dtw2hyd and rest of the Indian extreme left/ultra-Marxist political types have been waving their hands about regarding 'scams' for eons now. They'd like nothing better than to tar Modi with something and what you quoted is just crap being flung against the wall to see what sticks. Pretty normal opposition behavior considering their preferred party itself has essentially nonexistent political mandate.

Like I posted earlier, the IBC proceedings are in progress right now. This is a completely new law passed in 2016 by the current administration, combined with the separate Fugitive Economic Offenders Act, which enables the government to confiscate properties of those who escape India after financial fraud. Mallya is already facing the FEOA and is how he's being extradited back, and it is also why there was a heightened alert regarding Goyal's exit. This is all basic rule of law in operation.
 
TryToFlySomeday
Posts: 304
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 9:51 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Tue Jul 02, 2019 9:31 pm

BarfBag wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
BarfBag wrote:
Jet's collapse is not an issue driven by Indian politics. Neither was Kingfisher for that matter.

Of course not, but from the quote below it sounded like there was some political calculus before the election with respect to a Jet loan. Did all that die with the election and shutdown?

You're quoting someone who's been a one man bandgroup drumming about "corruption" by the incumbent PM, in the lead up to the most recent elections. Worked out spectacularly well for the dude, didn't it ?
:-) Worth a look at the results of that election - the party that 'booch supports now has a phenomenal ~50 seats in a 543 seat parliament, up dramatically from 45. Meanwhile, Modi's party has ~305 seats, plus another 50 from political allies for >350 of 543 seats. So yeah, perspectives matter...

You're making the mistake of wading into an Indian politics thread with no knowledge of the subject matter and then quoting random 'I heard about' commentary. Booch, dtw2hyd and rest of the Indian extreme left/ultra-Marxist political types have been waving their hands about regarding 'scams' for eons now. They'd like nothing better than to tar Modi with something and what you quoted is just crap being flung against the wall to see what sticks. Pretty normal opposition behavior considering their preferred party itself has essentially nonexistent political mandate.

If the Indian left are such bad dudes, then how come it’s the Indian right that’s threatening to do away with diversity in the country? Modi may not respect Muslims, but doesn’t change the fact that there are 200 million of them who stayed in India because they trust a so-called secular society more than Pakistan.
And this would not only hurt Muslims. What about Christians, Buddhists, Jains, Zoroastrians and Sikhs? Do they suddenly not matter in India, which has increasingly become more Hinduized, similar to Pakistan’s Islamization in the 70s and 80s?
Just making a point.
Pakistan's aviation sector is coming back. It won't be as strong as our eastern neighbor, nowhere close, but it's going to grow over time. Stand by and watch.

Born to Pakistani parents near ORD; raised and based near ORD.
 
BarfBag
Posts: 2566
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2001 7:13 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Wed Jul 03, 2019 3:56 am

TryToFlySomeday wrote:
If the Indian left are such bad dudes, then how come it’s the Indian right that’s threatening to do away with diversity in the country? Modi may not respect Muslims, but doesn’t change the fact that there are 200 million of them who stayed in India because they trust a so-called secular society more than Pakistan.
And this would not only hurt Muslims. What about Christians, Buddhists, Jains, Zoroastrians and Sikhs? Do they suddenly not matter in India, which has increasingly become more Hinduized, similar to Pakistan’s Islamization in the 70s and 80s?
Just making a point.

You’re not making any sort of point beyond parroting the Indian extreme left . Here’s a simple challenge:

Explain why the Indian public - with the greatest turnout ever seen in Indian political history - voted in Modi by an absolute majority in 2014, while giving his coalition a near 2/3rds majority .

Then once that’s explained, explain why an even larger electorate - breaking the previous turnout record by over 1% for new historic record - voted in Modi once more with an EVEN BIGGER absolute majority, giving his coalition an even bigger mandate .

Modi won almost 20 states and UTs with a 50 percent voteshare . In other words, it is mathematically impossible to lose. No leader of India has ever won so many states by insurmountable voteshares . Not Nehru . Not Indira Gandhi. Not Rajiv Gandhi. Explain why he wins by such unprecedented margins. After all, Modi is there because the people of India elected him there.
 
TryToFlySomeday
Posts: 304
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 9:51 pm

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:30 pm

BarfBag wrote:
TryToFlySomeday wrote:
If the Indian left are such bad dudes, then how come it’s the Indian right that’s threatening to do away with diversity in the country? Modi may not respect Muslims, but doesn’t change the fact that there are 200 million of them who stayed in India because they trust a so-called secular society more than Pakistan.
And this would not only hurt Muslims. What about Christians, Buddhists, Jains, Zoroastrians and Sikhs? Do they suddenly not matter in India, which has increasingly become more Hinduized, similar to Pakistan’s Islamization in the 70s and 80s?
Just making a point.

You’re not making any sort of point beyond parroting the Indian extreme left . Here’s a simple challenge:

Explain why the Indian public - with the greatest turnout ever seen in Indian political history - voted in Modi by an absolute majority in 2014, while giving his coalition a near 2/3rds majority .

Then once that’s explained, explain why an even larger electorate - breaking the previous turnout record by over 1% for new historic record - voted in Modi once more with an EVEN BIGGER absolute majority, giving his coalition an even bigger mandate .

Modi won almost 20 states and UTs with a 50 percent voteshare . In other words, it is mathematically impossible to lose. No leader of India has ever won so many states by insurmountable voteshares . Not Nehru . Not Indira Gandhi. Not Rajiv Gandhi. Explain why he wins by such unprecedented margins. After all, Modi is there because the people of India elected him there.

Modi won 2014 because he proposed good economic policies, and people were willing to take a chance on him regardless of the anti-secularist risk.
People saw him through briefly in 2018, before Pulwama happened in 2019. After Pulwama, Modi’s numbers boosted up because he used force in Pakistan, though he lost his pilot briefly.
Modi then used his “success” in Pakistan to win 2019, because Indians and Pakistanis don’t get along at all. (Though they should cause climate change will destroy them both before war will)
Modi’s victories had nothing to do with Hindu nationalism, they all had to do with the economy and with Pakistani aggression
Pakistan's aviation sector is coming back. It won't be as strong as our eastern neighbor, nowhere close, but it's going to grow over time. Stand by and watch.

Born to Pakistani parents near ORD; raised and based near ORD.
 
BarfBag
Posts: 2566
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2001 7:13 am

Re: Indian Politics Megathread

Wed Jul 03, 2019 5:30 pm

It's worth pointing out that Vajpayee won only 182 seats in a 543 seat Parliament after the Kargil War in 1999 - a much bigger skirmish. The halfway mark in Lok Sabha is 272 seats, a long way away. In Indian politics, such border tussles don't lead to landslide wins. Some argue that Indira Gandhi won by a landslide in 1971 due to her war leadership. It misses the inconvenient fact that the war was 6 months after that election.

It's no surprise that a Pakistani makes such a claim, but Indian politics is not heavily impacted by such military actions. The Indian population is focused on its own well-being. Pakistan, like Bangladesh or Sri Lanka, is just another smaller neighbour. It has a nuisance value that the Indian public expects our government to deal with on an as-needed basis, but such actions are just standard expectations, not something that gets a ruling coalition ~355 seats out of 543 in parliament.

India does not owe anyone an explanation of its 'treatment of Muslims' - neither the US nor Pakistan has anywhere near an exemplary record to go around pointing fingers.

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