Iloveboeing
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GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:36 pm

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/ca ... 114114002/

Although I am an American, 3 of the cars I've ever owned (Chevrolet Impala) were built in Oshawa, Ontario, Canada, and I feel for the workers that are going to lose their jobs. The Impala is a great car and has served me well through the years. In fact, I have a 2016 Chevrolet Impala Limited, which was built in May 2016 and was one of the last Impala Limiteds off of the production line.

I also test drove a 2016 Chevrolet Volt at the Kansas City Auto Show a couple of years ago and I loved the vehicle; I just couldn't afford to buy one brand-new.

I think the ditching of the sedans is going to come back to bite them in the rear-end, especially when oil prices rise. We can't have everything be SUVs and pickup trucks. That just won't work.
 
Flighty
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:51 pm

I rented a 2018 Impala in Canada earlier this year. It was loaded. Very nice car. 300HP V6, quiet, nice leather interior, everything you could want. Good in snow too. It is a style of car that is old-fashioned and people do not buy them much anymore. But still nicer than any of my cars. Kind of wanted to keep it.
 
mmo
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:53 pm

Glad Trump got the auto industry back on its feet!!!!
If we weren't all crazy we'd all go insane!
 
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Tugger
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:07 pm

mmo wrote:
Glad Trump got the auto industry back on its feet!!!!

Oh he is now going to try and force them to give more jobs to his "Trump base" states (like Ohio).

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
Productivity isn’t about getting more things done, rather it’s about getting the right things done, while doing less. - M. Oshin
 
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trpmb6
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:13 pm

We made it 3 posts before politics took over. Sigh.

Impala's are a relic of the past. It just doesn't fit in the market anymore. My wife is the perfect case study for it. She once had a malibu, loved that car. The obvious next step up was to go to impala. But the mpg isn't really all that great, and she figured, if you're going bigger why not just go the next step anyways. So we now have a tahoe. Admittedly, there were several steps between the malibu and the tahoe she could have gone with that would have been a better choice MPG wise - she just likes driving bigger vehicles. The variety in vehicles that is offered in that mid range is another killer of the Impala.
 
LMP737
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:27 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
But the mpg isn't really all that great, and she figured, if you're going bigger why not just go the next step anyways. So we now have a tahoe. Admittedly, there were several steps between the malibu and the tahoe she could have gone with that would have been a better choice MPG wise -.


That's hilarious.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
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casinterest
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 12:08 am

I can't wait to see how many new plants GM opens in Mexico, notice how none of the closures were there?

I see this as a Solid Middle finger to the Blue Class working families. Ford and GM aren't retooling for the future, they are retooling for their own demise.
Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
 
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Tugger
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 12:51 am

casinterest wrote:
I can't wait to see how many new plants GM opens in Mexico, notice how none of the closures were there?

I see this as a Solid Middle finger to the Blue Class working families. Ford and GM aren't retooling for the future, they are retooling for their own demise.

When will someone start saying: "USMCA - Worst trade deal EVER!"

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
Productivity isn’t about getting more things done, rather it’s about getting the right things done, while doing less. - M. Oshin
 
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Aaron747
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 12:56 am

trpmb6 wrote:
We made it 3 posts before politics took over. Sigh.

Impala's are a relic of the past. It just doesn't fit in the market anymore. My wife is the perfect case study for it. She once had a malibu, loved that car. The obvious next step up was to go to impala. But the mpg isn't really all that great, and she figured, if you're going bigger why not just go the next step anyways. So we now have a tahoe. Admittedly, there were several steps between the malibu and the tahoe she could have gone with that would have been a better choice MPG wise - she just likes driving bigger vehicles. The variety in vehicles that is offered in that mid range is another killer of the Impala.


POTUS made it political all by himself by telling WSJ he was demanding GM stop making cars in China and keep the plant in Ohio open. Stunning
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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Berevoff
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:44 am

well at least now trumps rallies will have bigger audiences. there will be a lot more free time in their schedules
 
Okie
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:13 am

Not sure exactly where GM is really going here.
Barra has collectively lowered GM market cap by about 20Bn and not really been out in front of anything new. No visual presence by Barra what so ever promoting the brand.
Other than Pickups and SUV's I am not sure of anything new or profound that GM has announced in the last 5 years since Barra's tenure.


********

Not really much going on style wise other than Corvette and Camaro everything else is pretty sleepy.

Predicting a new CEO post haste.

Okie
 
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WarRI1
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:15 am

I have to wonder how many of my Union brothers and sisters who were at the rallies for this Idiot we have in office now, while wearing their Union Hats are now being laid off ? Be careful of what you wish for, it can come back and bite you in the Ass.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
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Berevoff
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:23 am

WarRI1 wrote:
I have to wonder how many of my Union brothers and sisters who were at the rallies for this Idiot we have in office now, while wearing their Union Hats are now being laid off ? Be careful of what you wish for, it can come back and bite you in the Ass.


yeah demanding wages out of line with the product causes lots of these factories to go overseas where its cheaper. demanding big pay doesn't matter in a global economy when someone in china or mexico will do it for half the price

these factories would still be open if unions didnt money grab
 
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WarRI1
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:40 am

Berevoff wrote:
WarRI1 wrote:
I have to wonder how many of my Union brothers and sisters who were at the rallies for this Idiot we have in office now, while wearing their Union Hats are now being laid off ? Be careful of what you wish for, it can come back and bite you in the Ass.


yeah demanding wages out of line with the product causes lots of these factories to go overseas where its cheaper. demanding big pay doesn't matter in a global economy when someone in china or mexico will do it for half the price

these factories would still be open if unions didnt money grab


If one does not have a credible reply, one should keep ones mouth shut. That is a lesson in life that seems to be forgotten. Of course one might if one thought about it for a moment, wonder just who made and still makes the money grabs that have decimated the American way of life. :banghead: :banghead:
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
ltbewr
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:50 am

Those that want small to medium sized cars long went to SUV's or the Non-USA based companies. The 'big 3' US companies never wanted to make low or no profit small cars, they want you to buy bigger more expensive and more profitable larger vehicles. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Subaru, Hyundai and Kia all got a foothold in the North American market with decent small cars, eventually making them hear due to tariffs and trade limits. I bet in 2-3 years, the big China based companies like Chery or BYD will consider making cars in China and sending them to the USA, setting up dealerships to fill the gap the big USA 3 are giving up.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:56 am

The US 2.5 (FCA is hardly even a 0.5 in the US) are ceding the market to the Asians and even the Asians are struggling as the market shifts to trucks, SUVs and crossovers. Ford dealers will hardly give you the time of day if you’re not buying an F-series. A Mustang Bullitt buyer might get their attention. Last version had a $10.000 markup at my dealer.

First Ford, now GM are under as much pressure as they were in 2008-09. They should just gone bankrupt and reorganized without the Feds. It just put off the day of reckoning.

GF
 
seb146
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:40 am

trpmb6 wrote:
We made it 3 posts before politics took over. Sigh.


To be fair, one reason not cited in the OP but cited in many other reports is the tariff war started by the orange one

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidkiley ... dafd260574
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
stratclub
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:45 am

ltbewr wrote:
I bet in 2-3 years, the big China based companies like Chery or BYD will consider making cars in China and sending them to the USA, setting up dealerships to fill the gap the big USA 3 are giving up.

That ship has already sailed. Buick Envision assembled in China and available at your local dealers in the U.S. Why would Chery build a dealer network here? GM's dealers network already supports the Chinese assembled Envision. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buick_Envision
Last edited by stratclub on Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:00 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
alfa164
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:56 am

mmo wrote:
Glad Trump got the auto industry back on its feet!!!!


He was right in one respect; I am getting tired of all this "winning"...

:roll:
 
phatfarmlines
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:10 am

seb146 wrote:
trpmb6 wrote:
We made it 3 posts before politics took over. Sigh.


To be fair, one reason not cited in the OP but cited in many other reports is the tariff war started by the orange one

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidkiley ... dafd260574


:checkmark: A damning article if I ever read one, and a direct quote:

–Higher costs, due in part to the Trump administration steel tariffs, have already cost GM $1 billion, and those costs will persist and rise as long as they are in place.

I believe these model cuts also align with what Ford is doing, getting rid of the Fiesta and Taurus to focus on SUVs and crossovers.
 
BestWestern
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:22 am

The law of unintended consequences is in full force in the USA at present. Trump hasn’t thought through his tariff plans. He has agriculture and automotive on their knees.
Greetings from Hong Kong.... a subsidiary of China Inc.
 
JJJ
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:26 am

phatfarmlines wrote:

I believe these model cuts also align with what Ford is doing, getting rid of the Fiesta and Taurus to focus on SUVs and crossovers.


The US only got the Fiesta in the first place because of high gas prices. With the economy doing well and gas prices contained the people go back to big gas guzzlers.

And so the cycle goes.
 
L410Turbolet
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:31 am

BestWestern wrote:
The law of unintended consequences is in full force in the USA at present.

I don't think Trump is to blame for the Small Penis Syndrome pandemia that drives the SUV sales worldwide.
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:44 am

But I thought companies were coming home and expanding at record pace! You mean this was a lie?

L410Turbolet wrote:
the Small Penis Syndrome pandemia that drives the SUV sales worldwide.

I'm relieved to know that I'm not the only one who thinks the SPS is the reason there are so many gas guzzlers on American roads these days. Never made sense why you need a pickup or a full-sized SUV when your day job is 8 hours inside an office and you either have small children or are an empty nester.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
L410Turbolet
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 12:52 pm

ltbewr wrote:
The 'big 3' US companies never wanted to make low or no profit small cars, they want you to buy bigger more expensive and more profitable larger vehicles.

Makes one wonder how companies like Toyota or VW make profit since they have been making, as you say, "low or no profit small cars" more than anything else.
einsteinboricua wrote:
I'm not the only one who thinks the SPS is the reason there are so many gas guzzlers on American roads these days.

Not just American.

quote="einsteinboricua"]Never made sense why you need a pickup or a full-sized SUV [/quote]
...and then all you can afford is 2WD.
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 12:59 pm

GM is trying to be proactive this time, not sure why everyone is upset. Do people want them to produce millions of vehicles no one wants to buy and ask for another $85Billionn bailout? Even without Trump tariffs, people are not buying many gasoline-powered small cars. GM based on their current sales and forecast realized battery powered small cars is the only option

GM no longer a global automotive company. Sold Opel/Vauxhall(long overdue). Lost China market share. Shutdown production in India. Kicked out of Venezuela. If I recall correctly closed/sold Russian units.
 
Kiwirob
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:07 pm

L410Turbolet wrote:
einsteinboricua wrote:
I'm not the only one who thinks the SPS is the reason there are so many gas guzzlers on American roads these days.

Not just American.



Most European, Australian, Kiwi SUV owners buy diesels, the sensible choice for the insensible choice of vehicle they buy. Most SUV owners would be better off with a stationwagon.
 
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trpmb6
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:30 pm

Citing steel tariffs as the reason GM is closing plants is disingenuous really. All the other automakers are facing those same tariffs and are weathering the storm so to speak. This has much more to do with GM and their leadership team and their poor understanding of how the market is changing than anything else. They pretty much told us as much in their press release. Their doing this to better realign their compact and midsize vehicle line up. Look at the plants they are shutting down. Impala, volt, cruz. Hell if it wasn't for rental companies they'd probably shut down the malibu plants too.
 
2122M
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:51 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
Citing steel tariffs as the reason GM is closing plants is disingenuous really. All the other automakers are facing those same tariffs and are weathering the storm so to speak. This has much more to do with GM and their leadership team and their poor understanding of how the market is changing than anything else. They pretty much told us as much in their press release. Their doing this to better realign their compact and midsize vehicle line up. Look at the plants they are shutting down. Impala, volt, cruz. Hell if it wasn't for rental companies they'd probably shut down the malibu plants too.


I'm not an economist so I won't try and connect all the dots, but Trump made promises that his policies were going to add manufacturing jobs and increase American auto manufacturing. For whatever reason, the opposite seems to be happening. I don't know whether its tariffs, taxes or just bad timing, but it's a promise made by Trump that is falling flat on its face.
 
DiamondFlyer
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:23 pm

BestWestern wrote:
The law of unintended consequences is in full force in the USA at present. Trump hasn’t thought through his tariff plans. He has agriculture and automotive on their knees.


Agriculture on it's knees? Hardly, the only agriculture that's on it's knee's are farmers who are drastically over leveraged. which seems to happen about every 20 years. Farmers that know how to budget and keep working on what they have are doing just fine.

einsteinboricua wrote:
I'm relieved to know that I'm not the only one who thinks the SPS is the reason there are so many gas guzzlers on American roads these days. Never made sense why you need a pickup or a full-sized SUV when your day job is 8 hours inside an office and you either have small children or are an empty nester.


Because we can? I have 2 trucks, single male. Don't really care about having some high MPG Asian piece of crap, I'll take my 2 Ford trucks that do less than 20MPG.
From my cold, dead hands
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:26 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
L410Turbolet wrote:
einsteinboricua wrote:
I'm not the only one who thinks the SPS is the reason there are so many gas guzzlers on American roads these days.

Not just American.



Most European, Australian, Kiwi SUV owners buy diesels, the sensible choice for the insensible choice of vehicle they buy. Most SUV owners would be better off with a stationwagon.


Good for the environment as we see from the EU’s love affair with diesels. Another government solution.

GF
 
A3801000
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:34 pm

DiamondFlyer wrote:

Agriculture on it's knees? Hardly, the only agriculture that's on it's knee's are farmers who are drastically over leveraged. which seems to happen about every 20 years. Farmers that know how to budget and keep working on what they have are doing just fine.


'The number of farms filing for bankruptcy is increasing across the Upper Midwest, following low prices for corn, soybeans, milk and beef...'
'The situation has gotten worse for farmers since June because of the retaliatory tariffs...'

https://apnews.com/70498f1fe7af463284c3706b65032cf6

DiamondFlyer wrote:

Because we can? I have 2 trucks, single male. Don't really care about having some high MPG Asian piece of crap, I'll take my 2 Ford trucks that do less than 20MPG.


Of course you can. Well, if you don't care about anyone other then yourself. Climate change? Don't care. Depleting valuable resources? Don't care.
Seems to be a trend in the USA: Children killed by guns? Don't care. Leaving behind a massive debt? Don't care.

Good luck.
 
luckyone
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:40 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
L410Turbolet wrote:
einsteinboricua wrote:
I'm not the only one who thinks the SPS is the reason there are so many gas guzzlers on American roads these days.

Not just American.



Most European, Australian, Kiwi SUV owners buy diesels, the sensible choice for the insensible choice of vehicle they buy. Most SUV owners would be better off with a stationwagon.

The fallout from dieselgate has resulted in diesel sales being down about 16% across Europe, 30-35% specifically in the UK and Germany, while SUV sales are still up at least 25%. I agree with you regarding a station wagon, as I drive one. Much better overall vehicle than an "SUV."
 
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trpmb6
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 3:13 pm

A3801000 wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:

Agriculture on it's knees? Hardly, the only agriculture that's on it's knee's are farmers who are drastically over leveraged. which seems to happen about every 20 years. Farmers that know how to budget and keep working on what they have are doing just fine.


'The number of farms filing for bankruptcy is increasing across the Upper Midwest, following low prices for corn, soybeans, milk and beef...'
'The situation has gotten worse for farmers since June because of the retaliatory tariffs...'

https://apnews.com/70498f1fe7af463284c3706b65032cf6


Should provide more context from that link.

84 farms filed for bankruptcy in Wisconsin, Minnesota, North Dakota, South Dakota and Montana in the 12 months that ended in June. That’s more than double the number over the same period in 2013 and 2014.


84 farms is hardly Agriculture on it's knees. And curious that they cherry picked 2013-2014. How does this compare to 2015-2016? 2016-2017? What's the historical average over 20 years?

Miedtke said the underlying problem began before the trade issues, with farmers being too efficient for their financial good and demand not keeping pace with the production.
 
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casinterest
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 3:15 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
Citing steel tariffs as the reason GM is closing plants is disingenuous really. All the other automakers are facing those same tariffs and are weathering the storm so to speak. This has much more to do with GM and their leadership team and their poor understanding of how the market is changing than anything else. They pretty much told us as much in their press release. Their doing this to better realign their compact and midsize vehicle line up. Look at the plants they are shutting down. Impala, volt, cruz. Hell if it wasn't for rental companies they'd probably shut down the malibu plants too.



All this really says is that GM Doesn't do a good job making and marketing cars anymore. They keep loosing their market share to Foreign Automakers, while chasing the glory of the SUV and Truck Markets. Unfortunately for GM they are going to discover that their market their is under siege as well from Foreign Automakers as well as being under siege from Ford.
Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 3:19 pm

DiamondFlyer wrote:
BestWestern wrote:
The law of unintended consequences is in full force in the USA at present. Trump hasn’t thought through his tariff plans. He has agriculture and automotive on their knees.


Agriculture on it's knees? Hardly, the only agriculture that's on it's knee's are farmers who are drastically over leveraged. which seems to happen about every 20 years. Farmers that know how to budget and keep working on what they have are doing just fine.

einsteinboricua wrote:
I'm relieved to know that I'm not the only one who thinks the SPS is the reason there are so many gas guzzlers on American roads these days. Never made sense why you need a pickup or a full-sized SUV when your day job is 8 hours inside an office and you either have small children or are an empty nester.


Because we can? I have 2 trucks, single male. Don't really care about having some high MPG Asian piece of crap, I'll take my 2 Ford trucks that do less than 20MPG.


Source, quote, evidence that the only farmers affected are overleveraged?

Second part classically bears out post 24 lol
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
slider
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 3:42 pm

Jalopnik has a good take on this, so for all of you yammering about Trump or tariffs, please read and check the facts.

https://jalopnik.com/heres-everything-g ... 1830654490

Candidly, the only political issue I'd have to be ornery about is that GM took tax cuts and a special package from Congress and then did this. That's shitty.

But they needed to have been more nimble (where have we heard this before) in adapting to the changing consumer tastes, buying practices, and operating efficiencies long before this. When they're riding high, they lose all interest in being cost or manufacturing efficient.
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 3:45 pm

It is dismaying that Japan, Korea, and Germany can make and sell sedans, this will leave Tesla the only major (?) US auto company selling sedans (and Musk is coming after the pickup business as well).
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
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trpmb6
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 3:54 pm

casinterest wrote:
trpmb6 wrote:
Citing steel tariffs as the reason GM is closing plants is disingenuous really. All the other automakers are facing those same tariffs and are weathering the storm so to speak. This has much more to do with GM and their leadership team and their poor understanding of how the market is changing than anything else. They pretty much told us as much in their press release. Their doing this to better realign their compact and midsize vehicle line up. Look at the plants they are shutting down. Impala, volt, cruz. Hell if it wasn't for rental companies they'd probably shut down the malibu plants too.



All this really says is that GM Doesn't do a good job making and marketing cars anymore. They keep loosing their market share to Foreign Automakers, while chasing the glory of the SUV and Truck Markets. Unfortunately for GM they are going to discover that their market their is under siege as well from Foreign Automakers as well as being under siege from Ford.


I agree. They (and the other US automakers) unfortunately face an uphill battle in trying to modernize their production capabilities as well as stay competitive on the marketing side. For far too long they benefited from a consumer mentality of "buy what mom and dad bought". Today's consumer is much more analytical in what they are purchasing. The internet has opened up far more information for the consumer in regards to performance, safety and other standards.
 
JJJ
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:09 pm

luckyone wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
L410Turbolet wrote:

Not just American.



Most European, Australian, Kiwi SUV owners buy diesels, the sensible choice for the insensible choice of vehicle they buy. Most SUV owners would be better off with a stationwagon.

The fallout from dieselgate has resulted in diesel sales being down about 16% across Europe, 30-35% specifically in the UK and Germany, while SUV sales are still up at least 25%. I agree with you regarding a station wagon, as I drive one. Much better overall vehicle than an "SUV."


Small vehicles have done away with diesels (too expensive to get them up to Euro 6 standard). They're still the norm the bigger the vehicle.
 
seb146
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Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:09 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
GM is trying to be proactive this time, not sure why everyone is upset. Do people want them to produce millions of vehicles no one wants to buy and ask for another $85Billionn bailout? Even without Trump tariffs, people are not buying many gasoline-powered small cars. GM based on their current sales and forecast realized battery powered small cars is the only option

GM no longer a global automotive company. Sold Opel/Vauxhall(long overdue). Lost China market share. Shutdown production in India. Kicked out of Venezuela. If I recall correctly closed/sold Russian units.


And WHEN the economy comes crashing down again, they will simply ask for a massive government bail out because they are too big to fail. It makes no sense to me. They cite the tariffs and also the coming economic downturn as reasons why they are closing plants and halting production of some models. The models they are halting are ones that could get them through any economic downturn.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
alfa164
Posts: 2328
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 2:47 am

Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:17 pm

L410Turbolet wrote:
BestWestern wrote:
The law of unintended consequences is in full force in the USA at present.

I don't think Trump is to blame for the Small Penis Syndrome pandemia that drives the SUV sales worldwide.


No... Trump is just the number one example of the small penis syndrome...

;)

trpmb6 wrote:
Citing steel tariffs as the reason GM is closing plants is disingenuous really. All the other automakers are facing those same tariffs and are weathering the storm so to speak.


And just who are all those "other automakers"? Eliminate GM... Ford... and Fiat Chrysler (who really has shrunk to be almost irrelevant)... who is left? The Japanese or the Germans who have plants in the USA - and whose profits go back to their home countries?

I get it: "MAKE JAPAN AND GERMANY GREAT AGAIN!"

frmrCapCadet wrote:
It is dismaying that Japan, Korea, and Germany can make and sell sedans, this will leave Tesla the only major (?) US auto company selling sedans (and Musk is coming after the pickup business as well).


And it remains to be seen how successful Tesla will be once the various subsidies and incentives it receives dries up. For years, many auto analysts have believed that Musk's real plan was to build his company so it became just large enough for another, major auto company to acquire it. It is getting harder to see which automakers might be interested, as the major US companies withdraw from markets they once dominated.
Last edited by alfa164 on Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
AA747123
Posts: 170
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2016 5:15 pm

Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:23 pm

These closures have nothing to do with Trump. Americans dont want small fuel efficient cars like the Volt/Cruz.. The demand is for larger SUV/Trucks. GM is adapting to the market changes. Thats all.
 
alfa164
Posts: 2328
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 2:47 am

Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:33 pm

AA747123 wrote:
These closures have nothing to do with Trump. Americans dont want small fuel efficient cars like the Volt/Cruz.. The demand is for larger SUV/Trucks. GM is adapting to the market changes. Thats all.


I guess you want to ignore the $1 billion that Trump's tariffs have already cost GM... but the manufacturers can't. Those ego-driven tariffs affect the price of every vehicle, but the trucks and SUV's are better-positioned to absorb them because they maintain a higher profit margin (and, frankly, their purchasers are willing to spend more to satisfy their feelings of inadequacy).

Then end result is not only the abdication of the car market to foreign manufacturers, but also a diminution of choices for American buyers.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidkiley ... 1eec8e6057
 
AA747123
Posts: 170
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2016 5:15 pm

Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:41 pm

alfa164 wrote:
AA747123 wrote:
These closures have nothing to do with Trump. Americans dont want small fuel efficient cars like the Volt/Cruz.. The demand is for larger SUV/Trucks. GM is adapting to the market changes. Thats all.


I guess you want to ignore the $1 billion that Trump's tariffs have already cost GM... but the manufacturers can't. Those ego-driven tariffs affect the price of every vehicle, but the trucks and SUV's are better-positioned to absorb them because they maintain a higher profit margin (and, frankly, their purchasers are willing to spend more to satisfy their feelings of inadequacy).

Then end result is not only the abdication of the car market to foreign manufacturers, but also a diminution of choices for American buyers.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidkiley ... 1eec8e6057


You would still see the cuts, Ford cut all their cars for the same reason.
 
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einsteinboricua
Posts: 6766
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:11 pm

Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:05 pm

slider wrote:
Candidly, the only political issue I'd have to be ornery about is that GM took tax cuts and a special package from Congress and then did this. That's shitty.

You mean you really thought a company would use the tax cuts to invest in its workforce instead of padding its profits? Bless your innocent heart.

DiamondFlyer wrote:
Because we can? I have 2 trucks, single male. Don't really care about having some high MPG Asian piece of crap, I'll take my 2 Ford trucks that do less than 20MPG and complain when gas is too high and can't make ends meet...because I can

There. Fixed it for you.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
Dogman
Posts: 37
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2018 4:47 pm

Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:12 pm

Writing from Canada here.
In the last three years I've seen following changes in car ownership around me:
We bought a Nissan Micra for my wife. AFAIK it's not available in the US, but it's a size of Chevy Sonic.
My neighbour got a new Honda Accord - his third one, I believe. In the same time period his daughter got her license and they purchased a Kia Rio for her. When his son got a licence he got a Hyundai Genesis coupe.
My other neighbours son got his license and they got a Chevy Cavalier for him.
A friend of mine sold his GMC track and got a new Civic.
What I am trying to say that compact cars are far from dead. My friend who got the Civic is saving $250 per month on gas. Yes, big sedans are on their way out. Personally I never liked sedans, they are just not too practical. But I think that small hatchbacks are still have future. In my opinion Ford and GM are making a mistake getting rid of them. The Cruze is a nice car, at least it looks nice, especially the hatchback. I see a lot of them around.May be they do not have the same profit margin but they are still finding their buyers.
Last edited by Dogman on Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
alfa164
Posts: 2328
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 2:47 am

Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:15 pm

DiamondFlyer wrote:
Because we can? I have 2 trucks, single male, with a small penis and self-esteem issues.. Don't really care about having some high MPG Asian piece of crap, I'll take my 2 Ford trucks that do less than 20MPG.


There you go, fixed it! Don't be afraid to face your fears. And feel free to ruin the future for the rest of us, and our children and grandchildren...

:roll:
 
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trpmb6
Posts: 1593
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:45 pm

Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:42 pm

Dogman wrote:
What I am trying to say that compact cars are far from dead. My friend who got the Civic is saving $250 per month on gas.


Anyone who is driving enough to have SAVINGS of 250 dollars per month on gas has no business driving anything but an extremely high efficiency, High MPG vehicle. I don't even pay 250 dollars a month for my Ram 1500 that gets about 20 MPG.
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 6306
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: GM Cutting Jobs, Models and Plants

Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:44 pm

seb146 wrote:

And WHEN the economy comes crashing down again, they will simply ask for a massive government bail out because they are too big to fail. It makes no sense to me. They cite the tariffs and also the coming economic downturn as reasons why they are closing plants and halting production of some models. The models they are halting are ones that could get them through any economic downturn.


All are slow moving models. There are only two fuel-efficient models in the list namely Chevy Cruze(100k down 26%) and Volt(40k). Cadillac CT6(7k) and XTS(12k), Chevy Impala(43k), Buick LaCrosse(13k). Quarterly sales in parenthesis.

Old SUVs were truck-based, they are more efficient. A sedan and compact SUV may share a common platform and gives same fuel economy, SUV may sell better than the sedan.

Also, last time around gas was $4+/Gallon

Toyota dropped Scion brand and Toyota Yaris. It is a very competitive segment with so many electric/hybrid options.

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