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bennett123
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Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:36 pm

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-c ... e-46703806

It would be nice to see the Honourable Member do the honourable thing.

What are the odds of that.
 
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TheFlyingDisk
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Fri Dec 28, 2018 11:25 pm

So she lied about driving her car and going 11 mph over the speed limit?

Since politicians lie through their teeth all the time, I don't see why this is any different.
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scbriml
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 12:11 am

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
So she lied about driving her car and going 11 mph over the speed limit?


Yes, she should face the consequences of her actions, just like us mere mortals would.

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
Since politicians lie through their teeth all the time, I don't see why this is any different.


So that makes it OK? Not sure what you're saying.

If she had any honour, she'd resign her seat. If she doesn't, then hopefully the people of Peterborough will do the right thing at the ballot box at the earliest opportunity.
Last edited by scbriml on Sat Dec 29, 2018 12:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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cpd
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 12:11 am

bennett123 wrote:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-46703806

It would be nice to see the Honourable Member do the honourable thing.

What are the odds of that.


Politicians are allowed error after error, and with an oops I’m sorry excuse can continue on as if nothing happened. We just have to live with it...

Life must be good for them!
 
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TheFlyingDisk
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 12:34 am

scbriml wrote:
TheFlyingDisk wrote:
So she lied about driving her car and going 11 mph over the speed limit?


Yes, she should face the consequences of her actions, just like us mere mortals would.


Since her jail sentence is less than a year, what other consequence that she need to face? Maybe change the law so that MPs will be disqualified if they go to jail for any length of time.

scbriml wrote:
TheFlyingDisk wrote:
Since politicians lie through their teeth all the time, I don't see why this is any different.


So that makes it OK? Not sure what you're saying.

If she had any honour, she'd resign her seat. If she doesn't, then hopefully the people of Peterborough will do the right thing at the ballot box at the earliest opportunity.


I'm saying that the punishment doesn't fit the crime.

There are far bigger things to be outraged about. This is hardly it.
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scbriml
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 1:04 am

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
Since her jail sentence is less than a year, what other consequence that she need to face?

...

I'm saying that the punishment doesn't fit the crime.


You're sounding confused. She hasn't been sentenced yet, so her punishment is currently unknown. However, if I'd been convicted of that crime and did time for it, I would have been sacked from my job. Why should she be any different just because she's an MP? If anything, she should be held to a higher standard than joe public.

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
There are far bigger things to be outraged about. This is hardly it.


So we shouldn't bother to uphold the rule of law because there "are far bigger things to be outraged about"? How "big" does something need to be in your book before it's worth bothering with? :confused:
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TheFlyingDisk
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 2:56 am

scbriml wrote:
TheFlyingDisk wrote:
Since her jail sentence is less than a year, what other consequence that she need to face?

...

I'm saying that the punishment doesn't fit the crime.


You're sounding confused. She hasn't been sentenced yet, so her punishment is currently unknown. However, if I'd been convicted of that crime and did time for it, I would have been sacked from my job. Why should she be any different just because she's an MP? If anything, she should be held to a higher standard than joe public.


Thing is, a private citizen working at a private firm have different rules than MPs. MPs will be kicked out only if they're jailed for more than a year. I doubt the jail time for perjury would be that long.


scbriml wrote:
TheFlyingDisk wrote:
There are far bigger things to be outraged about. This is hardly it.


So we shouldn't bother to uphold the rule of law because there "are far bigger things to be outraged about"? How "big" does something need to be in your book before it's worth bothering with? :confused:


The rule of law is being upheld. Problem is you want more punishment than what the law will serve. And that's the problem that I'm having with all this.
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moo
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 4:01 am

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
I doubt the jail time for perjury would be that long


The maximum sentence for "perverting the course of justice" in the UK, which is what she was convicted of, is life imprisonment.

This is a particularly egregious case, involving a person of significant public interest and stature, and significant falsehoods told designed not only to exonerate the accused but also implicate another innocent party, so the Judge could very easily impose a sentence of more than a year.
 
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scbriml
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 9:25 am

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
Thing is, a private citizen working at a private firm have different rules than MPs. MPs will be kicked out only if they're jailed for more than a year. I doubt the jail time for perjury would be that long.


It doesn't matter how long a custodial sentence is, I would have been sacked. Why should MPs, who are supposed to be public servants, be less accountable? If she had a shred of honour, she'd resign before being sentenced.

If a sitting MP is prepared to lie in court to save their own skin while trying to have an innocent person convicted of their own crime, they don't come across as particularly trustworthy of holding public office.

I'm struggling to understand why you're defending her.

TheFlyingDisk wrote:
Problem is you want more punishment than what the law will serve. And that's the problem that I'm having with all this.


Where have I said I want more punishment? I just want MPs to be treated at least the same way that I would be in the same circumstances. Ignoring that, in reality, they should be held to higher standards than Joe Public.
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chimborazo
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 7:50 pm

She’s a Labour MP. The party of do what we say and not do what we do.

She will never resign... it’s not in their nature.

I live in Peterborough... it’s a nice city. Generally. There are some rough areas though. The population in these areas appear to have a disregard for looking after the place they live in.

I’d never heard of the woman until this because I’m one of those saddos that will now blindly vote blue because of what red have done to our economy and our country in general.

Sadly, I think a good portion of those that did vote for her have similar values: “there are rules, but they don’t apply to meeeeeeee!”
 
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 8:01 pm

chimborazo wrote:
I’d never heard of the woman until this because I’m one of those saddos that will now blindly vote blue because of what red have done to our economy and our country in general.


Yeah, if you say so. If you're one of those saddos you probably always have been.
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bennett123
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 9:34 pm

Does she get her MP salary in jail?.
 
GDB
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sun Dec 30, 2018 7:52 am

chimborazo wrote:
She’s a Labour MP. The party of do what we say and not do what we do.

She will never resign... it’s not in their nature.

I live in Peterborough... it’s a nice city. Generally. There are some rough areas though. The population in these areas appear to have a disregard for looking after the place they live in.

I’d never heard of the woman until this because I’m one of those saddos that will now blindly vote blue because of what red have done to our economy and our country in general.

Sadly, I think a good portion of those that did vote for her have similar values: “there are rules, but they don’t apply to meeeeeeee!”



You said it, don't know anything, since if you did you might also know that her party have told her to step down. Which she seems to be refusing to do. Despite it being an ultra marginal seat in a marginal Parliament.
So in your sarcasm you are still completely wrong.
Unexpectedly perhaps the Tory she narrow beat to become MP last year has stated that he feels sorry for her, had no personal animosity against her.
 
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TheFlyingDisk
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Sun Dec 30, 2018 11:49 am

scbriml wrote:
TheFlyingDisk wrote:
Problem is you want more punishment than what the law will serve. And that's the problem that I'm having with all this.


Where have I said I want more punishment? I just want MPs to be treated at least the same way that I would be in the same circumstances. Ignoring that, in reality, they should be held to higher standards than Joe Public.


That's the thing. She is! Problem is MPs are subjected to different rules than Joe Public.
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Dano1977
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:24 pm

chimborazo wrote:
She’s a Labour MP. The party of do what we say and not do what we do.

She will never resign... it’s not in their nature.

I live in Peterborough... it’s a nice city. Generally. There are some rough areas though. The population in these areas appear to have a disregard for looking after the place they live in.

I’d never heard of the woman until this because I’m one of those saddos that will now blindly vote blue because of what red have done to our economy and our country in general.

Sadly, I think a good portion of those that did vote for her have similar values: “there are rules, but they don’t apply to meeeeeeee!”



Likewise I'm also from Peterborough!
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mwhcvt
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:26 am

She’s not actually been sentenced yet has she? I was under the impression sentencing will happen later this month, according to the rules of parliament she will only be compelled to step down as an MP if she is sentenced to a custodial sentence with a juration in excess of one year
Must think up a new one soon, slow moving brain trying to get into gear ;)
 
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Aesma
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:09 am

If she really tried to have someone else convicted in her place then clearly she has no honor, so why do you expect her to now do the honorable thing ?
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Jouhou
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:28 am

That's the worst scandal British politicians can commit? I wish our politicians were that lacking in corruption over here in the USA.
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scbriml
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:02 am

mwhcvt wrote:
She’s not actually been sentenced yet has she? I was under the impression sentencing will happen later this month, according to the rules of parliament she will only be compelled to step down as an MP if she is sentenced to a custodial sentence with a juration in excess of one year


There's a big difference between what the parliamentary rules say and the concept of honour. MPs address each other in Parliament as "The right honourable...." as laughable as some find that.

If she or the Labour Party had a shred of integrity, she'd already have resigned/been sacked.

Aesma wrote:
If she really tried to have someone else convicted in her place then clearly she has no honor, so why do you expect her to now do the honorable thing ?


Even if she is completely lacking in honour or any sense of doing the right thing, her party should have sacked her the moment she was convicted.

Jouhou wrote:
That's the worst scandal British politicians can commit? I wish our politicians were that lacking in corruption over here in the USA.


Any faith that most Brits had in their politicians was sorely tested by the 'expenses scandal' a few years ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Ki ... es_scandal
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Jouhou
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:03 am

scbriml wrote:
mwhcvt wrote:
She’s not actually been sentenced yet has she? I was under the impression sentencing will happen later this month, according to the rules of parliament she will only be compelled to step down as an MP if she is sentenced to a custodial sentence with a juration in excess of one year


There's a big difference between what the parliamentary rules say and the concept of honour. MPs address each other in Parliament as "The right honourable...." as laughable as some find that.

If she or the Labour Party had a shred of integrity, she'd already have resigned/been sacked.

Aesma wrote:
If she really tried to have someone else convicted in her place then clearly she has no honor, so why do you expect her to now do the honorable thing ?


Even if she is completely lacking in honour or any sense of doing the right thing, her party should have sacked her the moment she was convicted.

Jouhou wrote:
That's the worst scandal British politicians can commit? I wish our politicians were that lacking in corruption over here in the USA.


Any faith that most Brits had in their politicians was sorely tested by the 'expenses scandal' a few years ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Ki ... es_scandal



That's at least American style in scandal. We just had an Alabama sheriff (an elected official) found to have taken $750,000 for himself, money which was meant to feed prisoners. Thanks to that states dated laws, that was deemed to be legal. What wasn't so legal, is he may also have taken up to $1,500,000 in federal funds for himself in a similar manner. I'm sure it's not much consolation, but your people are wayyy cleaner than ours. I'm still envious.

Then again, maybe you guys are just better at keeping them accountable by having higher standards than us!
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Dano1977
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:36 am

Now the local paper "The Peterborough Evening Telegraph" are now calling for her to resign.

In other news, it was also announced allegedly she claimed over £7000 for "Hotel Expenses" in 7 months. In the same time frame her predecessor only claimed £513.

From 1st August 2017 to 31st July 2018 she claimed £40602.86 in expenses, not including travel and staff costs. (if included it would be: £112,372.31)
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GDB
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:47 pm

scbriml wrote:
mwhcvt wrote:
She’s not actually been sentenced yet has she? I was under the impression sentencing will happen later this month, according to the rules of parliament she will only be compelled to step down as an MP if she is sentenced to a custodial sentence with a juration in excess of one year


There's a big difference between what the parliamentary rules say and the concept of honour. MPs address each other in Parliament as "The right honourable...." as laughable as some find that.

If she or the Labour Party had a shred of integrity, she'd already have resigned/been sacked.

Aesma wrote:
If she really tried to have someone else convicted in her place then clearly she has no honor, so why do you expect her to now do the honorable thing ?


Even if she is completely lacking in honour or any sense of doing the right thing, her party should have sacked her the moment she was convicted.

Jouhou wrote:
That's the worst scandal British politicians can commit? I wish our politicians were that lacking in corruption over here in the USA.


Any faith that most Brits had in their politicians was sorely tested by the 'expenses scandal' a few years ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Ki ... es_scandal


I understood her party have asked her to step down, however as you know, she can sit as an Independent even if her party disowns her. Which they seem to have done. Meaning she cannot use any of her parties resources, staff etc.
Of course a custodial sentence will make her position in Parliament untenable anyway, regardless of what party or not she is representing.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:47 pm

For all of the talk about the incarceration rates in the United States, even I am having a hard time believing that she will be incarcerated over this. Is that really a likely outcome?
 
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scbriml
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:22 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
For all of the talk about the incarceration rates in the United States, even I am having a hard time believing that she will be incarcerated over this. Is that really a likely outcome?


I'm sure her lawyer will plead her case for leniency, but 'perverting the course of justice' is a pretty serious offence. As pointed out above, the maximum sentence is life imprisonment (not suggesting for one second her sentence would be anywhere near that, but just to illustrate how serious the charge is). Given the lengths to which she went to avoid a simple speeding fine (including trying to implicate an innocent man), I would not be at all surprised if she sees the inside of a cell - 18 months would not be unreasonable, IMHO.
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GDB
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:53 pm

Prior to becoming a MP. she was a lawyer!
(It seems her change in career was something of a recent development, not long before the 2017 election becoming a candidate, rather than the more usual path of being in local authorities and/or standing in often unwinnable seats in prior elections, after being a long term member of the chosen party).
 
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Dano1977
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:01 pm

According to the Peterborough Evening Telegraph Tw-tter feed. She has been expelled from the Labour party.

The party's chair says Peterborough voters were "failed" by her
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Jouhou
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:11 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
For all of the talk about the incarceration rates in the United States, even I am having a hard time believing that she will be incarcerated over this. Is that really a likely outcome?


As my curiosity in this thread may have shown, we really should be taking a harder line with our own politicians. Of course, we'd have to do something about our parties making allegations of crime be "about politics". Perhaps we could pass a law making anyone using media as a means to interfere with an investigation into a crime as being obstruction of justice. It's be hard to find where the line between that and sharing an opinion as "free speech" would be, but there's definitely a line that could be drawn.

We could look to European systems to see how they are doing it. The politicians definitely seem to get away with less. It would be nice if we could actually trust ours more.

Also only the poor are subject to a high incarceration rate here.
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Bongodog1964
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:00 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
For all of the talk about the incarceration rates in the United States, even I am having a hard time believing that she will be incarcerated over this. Is that really a likely outcome?


A few years back another MP Chris Huhne persuaded his wife to take a similar speeding fine and points. A few years later he cheated on his wife and subsequently a friend of his wife reported the matter. They were both found guilty and imprisoned.

The general opinion in the UK is that MP's have few morals and would lie about anything given half a chance, if however this does turn out to be true, we expect the courts to treat them harshly
 
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SheikhDjibouti
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:56 pm

Dano1977 wrote:
Now the local paper "The Peterborough Evening Telegraph" are now calling for her to resign.


I'm somewhat surprised that neither of our Peterborough residents (Chimborazo or Dano1977) have fleshed out the story for those just catching up with things.
Ms Onasayana MP firstly claimed that a Russian man was driving her car. Whether this was someone she actually knew, or simply a patsy who would take the rap in return for unspecified favors at a later data, I cannot say for certain.

Subsequently her brother Festus Onasayana was put in the frame when their mother handed him the speeding ticket, presumably figuring that it was better if her unemployed actor son took the rap, instead of her MP daughter. Or maybe she just didn't have her proper reading glasses on? Mothers, eh? :roll:

Festus presumably ran with this idea for a bit, right up until the point the investigating team asked just how unlucky one guy could be, because on two previous speeding incidents Festus had saved himself by nominating the same mystery Russian driver. The Peterborough Police were very keen to speak to this Russian who drives everywhere in such a hurry, but apparently he's been at home in Russia all this time....

Fast forward to more recent times, and Festus has now 'fessed up (come on, I just had to....) and pleaded guilty to THREE counts of perverting the course of justice, thereby also dropping his sister right in the brown stuff.

The cherry on the cake is that the cell phone belonging to Ms Osanayana MP was in operation at the time of the speeding offence. If she was the only person within that vehicle at the time, i.e. the driver, at least it explains why she missed the speed camera. :rotfl:

Throw the book at her? Do we even have a book that is big enough?


E&OE - the case is so tangled that I may have slipped up on a particular detail somewhere or other. Plus there is no guarantee that even that ugly story is the whole truth.
Nothing to see here; move along please.
 
GDB
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Fri Jan 04, 2019 5:27 pm

Bongodog1964 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
For all of the talk about the incarceration rates in the United States, even I am having a hard time believing that she will be incarcerated over this. Is that really a likely outcome?


A few years back another MP Chris Huhne persuaded his wife to take a similar speeding fine and points. A few years later he cheated on his wife and subsequently a friend of his wife reported the matter. They were both found guilty and imprisoned.

The general opinion in the UK is that MP's have few morals and would lie about anything given half a chance, if however this does turn out to be true, we expect the courts to treat them harshly


Which goes to show they are not immune, IIRC he resigned as a MP as soon as the story broke, not waiting to be ousted by his party.
That case created one of the few witty headlines in The Sun that I found funny, seeing it on a news stand, since Huhne had also had an affair with his secretary, who did not conform to The Sun's idea of female beauty, also the expenses scandal revealed that Huhne had plumbing and central heating work done on the taxpayer's £, at an address not covered under the agreement on MP's living costs.
So in the top right of the front page, 'Huhne Services Boiler On Expenses'.
 
noviorbis77
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Re: Peterborough MP convicted, what next?

Fri Jan 04, 2019 5:31 pm

bennett123 wrote:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-46703806

It would be nice to see the Honourable Member do the honourable thing.

What are the odds of that.


She should step down.

Hopefully she will do so when she starts her prison sentence.

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