2122M
Posts: 1201
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:30 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Respectfully, just because they’ve worked in one place doesn’t mean that they aren’t needed elsewhere.

So many logical fallacies from you...


Logical Fallacies? Lets talk facts. Where is the crisis? Where is the emergency? Where is the illegal immigration spike we need to address? What problem is this 5.6 billion dollars solving?

As recently as two years ago Democrats even admitted that our border was not acceptably secure. And it still isn’t.

Look, I get it. You are comfortable with a porous border. Some want to reduce this. Government wouldn’t be shut down if everyone agreed.


There is always disagreement, the President shouldn't use disagreement to withhold paychecks from 800,000 employees. There is a shutdown not because there is disagreement, but because our President doesn't know how to handle disagreement.
 
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VTKillarney
Posts: 1661
Joined: Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:13 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:31 pm

2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:

Logical Fallacies? Lets talk facts. Where is the crisis? Where is the emergency? Where is the illegal immigration spike we need to address? What problem is this 5.6 billion dollars solving?

As recently as two years ago Democrats even admitted that our border was not acceptably secure. And it still isn’t.

Look, I get it. You are comfortable with a porous border. Some want to reduce this. Government wouldn’t be shut down if everyone agreed.


There is always disagreement, the President shouldn't use disagreement to withhold paychecks from 800,000 employees. There is a shutdown not because there is disagreement, but because our President doesn't know how to handle disagreement.

I think we all agree that it would be nice to see the shutdown end. Both sides could end it with one phone call. Neither wants to.
 
2122M
Posts: 1201
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:33 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
As recently as two years ago Democrats even admitted that our border was not acceptably secure. And it still isn’t.

Look, I get it. You are comfortable with a porous border. Some want to reduce this. Government wouldn’t be shut down if everyone agreed.


There is always disagreement, the President shouldn't use disagreement to withhold paychecks from 800,000 employees. There is a shutdown not because there is disagreement, but because our President doesn't know how to handle disagreement.

I think we all agree that it would be nice to see the shutdown end. Both sides could end it with one phone call. Neither wants to.


So who, in your mind, should give in? Should dems just give Trump the money or should Trump re-open the government and continue negations without the shutdown in the background?

What is your opinion?
 
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VTKillarney
Posts: 1661
Joined: Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:13 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:39 pm

2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:

There is always disagreement, the President shouldn't use disagreement to withhold paychecks from 800,000 employees. There is a shutdown not because there is disagreement, but because our President doesn't know how to handle disagreement.

I think we all agree that it would be nice to see the shutdown end. Both sides could end it with one phone call. Neither wants to.


So who, in your mind, should give in? Should dems just give Trump the money or should Trump re-open the government and continue negations without the shutdown in the background?

What is your opinion?

Since Trump’s plan only covers 300+ miles of border sections that have been identified as having the highest strategic need for a barrier, and since Democrats are on record supporting barriers in strategic locations, the Democrats should end this standoff.
 
2122M
Posts: 1201
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:46 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
I think we all agree that it would be nice to see the shutdown end. Both sides could end it with one phone call. Neither wants to.


So who, in your mind, should give in? Should dems just give Trump the money or should Trump re-open the government and continue negations without the shutdown in the background?

What is your opinion?

Since Trump’s plan only covers 300+ miles of border sections that have been identified as having the highest strategic need for a barrier, and since Democrats are on record supporting barriers in strategic locations, the Democrats should end this standoff.


Then you approve of shutting down the government as a viable negotiating tactic anytime a president doesn't get exactly what he wants. And that is where the disagreement here is. Let there be negotiations on a wall and on border security, but lets not hold federal employees hostage just because the president doesn't get 100% of what he wants.
 
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VTKillarney
Posts: 1661
Joined: Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:13 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:49 pm

2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:

So who, in your mind, should give in? Should dems just give Trump the money or should Trump re-open the government and continue negations without the shutdown in the background?

What is your opinion?

Since Trump’s plan only covers 300+ miles of border sections that have been identified as having the highest strategic need for a barrier, and since Democrats are on record supporting barriers in strategic locations, the Democrats should end this standoff.


Then you approve of shutting down the government as a viable negotiating tactic anytime a president doesn't get exactly what he wants. And that is where the disagreement here is. Let there be negotiations on a wall and on border security, but lets not hold federal employees hostage just because the president doesn't get 100% of what he wants.

Read what I have actually written, not what you WANT me to say. I never said what you accuse me of saying.

Seriously. Please don’t make up things that I’ve said. Read what I actually write. This is a disturbing pattern of yours.
 
A3801000
Posts: 558
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2016 5:12 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:52 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
Since Trump’s plan only covers 300+ miles of border sections that have been identified as having the highest strategic need for a barrier, and since Democrats are on record supporting barriers in strategic locations, the Democrats should end this standoff.


Where is this plan? Could you please provide a link to this plan? Thank you.
 
2122M
Posts: 1201
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:54 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Since Trump’s plan only covers 300+ miles of border sections that have been identified as having the highest strategic need for a barrier, and since Democrats are on record supporting barriers in strategic locations, the Democrats should end this standoff.


Then you approve of shutting down the government as a viable negotiating tactic anytime a president doesn't get exactly what he wants. And that is where the disagreement here is. Let there be negotiations on a wall and on border security, but lets not hold federal employees hostage just because the president doesn't get 100% of what he wants.

Read what I have actually written, not what you WANT me to say. I never said what you accuse me of saying.

Seriously. Please don’t make up things that I’ve said. Read what I actually write.


You can't have it both ways. If you want the Dems to cave to Trump, then you are putting your stamp of approval on this negotiation tactic of withholding pay from 800,000 people just to get what you want. There is no other possible way to look at this.

If you want Trump to end the shutdown without a 5.6 Billion dollar guarantee in exchange for further negotiations, you can still get border wall sections in the future that will be clearly defined through deliberate negations and a proper democratic process.

You just made that choice. I'm not putting words in anyone's mouth, I'm just pointing gout the reality of this situation.
 
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VTKillarney
Posts: 1661
Joined: Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:13 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:56 pm

No. Just no. Read what I’ve written not what you WANT me to say. Seriously.

I’m not putting my stamp of approval on anything. I’m just recognizing the reality of the present situation.
 
2122M
Posts: 1201
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:00 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
No. Just no. Read what I’ve written not what you WANT me to say. Seriously.

I’m not putting my stamp of approval on anything. I’m just recognizing the reality of the present situation.


If you want to Dems to cave to Trump, you are 100% putting your stamp of approval on this tactic of his.

You can believe he is right about the wall, but think it's wrong of him to hold the government hostage over it. But that's not what you think. You think the Dems should cave (your words that no one put in your mouth).
 
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VTKillarney
Posts: 1661
Joined: Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:13 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:02 pm

2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
No. Just no. Read what I’ve written not what you WANT me to say. Seriously.

I’m not putting my stamp of approval on anything. I’m just recognizing the reality of the present situation.


If you want to Dems to cave to Trump, you are 100% putting your stamp of approval on this tactic of his.

You can believe he is right about the wall, but think it's wrong of him to hold the government hostage over it. But that's not what you think. You think the Dems should cave (your words that no one put in your mouth).

I think it’s wrong for the Dems to hold them hostage over something they’ve already indicated agreement to. (Barriers in strategic locations)

And stop making up beliefs that I don’t hold. Seriously.
 
2122M
Posts: 1201
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:06 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
No. Just no. Read what I’ve written not what you WANT me to say. Seriously.

I’m not putting my stamp of approval on anything. I’m just recognizing the reality of the present situation.


If you want to Dems to cave to Trump, you are 100% putting your stamp of approval on this tactic of his.

You can believe he is right about the wall, but think it's wrong of him to hold the government hostage over it. But that's not what you think. You think the Dems should cave (your words that no one put in your mouth).

I think it’s wrong for the Dems to hold them hostage over something they’ve already indicated agreement to. (Barriers in strategic locations)

And stop making up beliefs that I don’t hold. Seriously.


In case you haven't been paying attention, the House has been passing bill after bill to re-open the government (hence this thread). They aren't holding anyone hostage. So sorry, but this is Trump's shutdown (and he's quite proud of that).

I'm starting to see why you are so hesitant to give your own opinion about things though as you seem uncomfortable defending your own opinions.
 
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seb146
Posts: 20458
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 7:08 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Respectfully, just because they’ve worked in one place doesn’t mean that they aren’t needed elsewhere.

So many logical fallacies from you...


Logical Fallacies? Lets talk facts. Where is the crisis? Where is the emergency? Where is the illegal immigration spike we need to address? What problem is this 5.6 billion dollars solving?

As recently as two years ago Democrats even admitted that our border was not acceptably secure. And it still isn’t.

Look, I get it. You are comfortable with a porous border. Some want to reduce this. Government wouldn’t be shut down if everyone agreed.


The government would not be shut down if YOUR leader would grow up and accept that we need and want more than just HIS stupid vanity wall.

https://psmag.com/news/how-many-of-trum ... s-are-true
https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-mete ... mps-borde/

A stupid vanity wall by itself will not stop these things you MAGA fan boys hate and are so scared of. The brown, non-English speaking people who have been here for generations will not suddenly disappear. Drugs will not suddenly disappear. Jobs will not suddenly appear for white English speaking only people.

As with YOUR leader, you MAGA fan boys focus on one single point THAT IS NOT TRUE: You MAGA fan boys honestly believe Democrats do not want border security. You believe that because your fake information sites tell you that. The fact is that Democrats want more than just a stupid vanity wall because they understand that only a stupid vanity wall by itself WILL DO NOTHING to stop immigration and drugs and give people things like low cost health care and low cost education.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 20458
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Senate will not waste its time on Democratic Bill

Fri Jan 11, 2019 7:12 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
2122M wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
No. Just no. Read what I’ve written not what you WANT me to say. Seriously.

I’m not putting my stamp of approval on anything. I’m just recognizing the reality of the present situation.


If you want to Dems to cave to Trump, you are 100% putting your stamp of approval on this tactic of his.

You can believe he is right about the wall, but think it's wrong of him to hold the government hostage over it. But that's not what you think. You think the Dems should cave (your words that no one put in your mouth).

I think it’s wrong for the Dems to hold them hostage over something they’ve already indicated agreement to. (Barriers in strategic locations)

And stop making up beliefs that I don’t hold. Seriously.


VTK, take your pick:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/pol ... 463374002/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... story.html
https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/10/politics ... index.html

That CNN link REPUBLICAN McConnell blocks votes to open the government.

Just because you repeat something over and over again does not make it true.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!

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