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Aaron747
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 2:48 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
That is definitely the consensus.


So you won’t be replying to the previous conversation regarding obstruction...?

I don't recall the question. What I can say is that Mueller was very clear that the OLC memo was NOT why he declined to recommend obstruction charges. This was a huge win for the Republicans and a complete embarrassment for the Democrats.

The Democrats didn't get anything new yesterday. This makes impeachment look less and less likely. Which means that Trump had a great day.

But, hey. If the Democrats think that the evidence is there, then by all means they should commence impeachment proceedings. The fact that they haven't speaks volumes.


Reply 519, thanks.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
afcjets
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 2:59 pm

jdstJD wrote:
I absolutely would never ever ever ever ever vote for Donald trump. But I am not pleased with the democratic platform this election cycle. So I don’t want to give my vote to the democrats because I don’t support much of the platform. So what is someone like me to do? If I don’t vote at all then that’s a vote for trump. If I vote for a democrat (with the exception of Biden. Love him) and he/she wins and they implement their policies I’ll be very upset. It’s not fair to put more independent and moderate voters like me in this position.

Don't be surprised if a late comer like Stacey Abrahams enters the race. If Biden is too weak and these other candidates self destruct by trying to all out left each other (which is exactly what they're doing), someone like Stacey (who has emphatically said she's not a socialist and likes capitalism, she said she's been both rich and poor and she prefers being rich) or even Michelle (assuming her husband isn't exposed in the investigations) and don't count out Hillary. No matter what happens, I think she thinks she is above it all and still entitled, and if she sees an opportunity, she will jump on it and she can continue with her tactics.
 
seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 4:19 pm

afcjets wrote:
jdstJD wrote:
I absolutely would never ever ever ever ever vote for Donald trump. But I am not pleased with the democratic platform this election cycle. So I don’t want to give my vote to the democrats because I don’t support much of the platform. So what is someone like me to do? If I don’t vote at all then that’s a vote for trump. If I vote for a democrat (with the exception of Biden. Love him) and he/she wins and they implement their policies I’ll be very upset. It’s not fair to put more independent and moderate voters like me in this position.

Don't be surprised if a late comer like Stacey Abrahams enters the race. If Biden is too weak and these other candidates self destruct by trying to all out left each other (which is exactly what they're doing), someone like Stacey (who has emphatically said she's not a socialist and likes capitalism, she said she's been both rich and poor and she prefers being rich) or even Michelle (assuming her husband isn't exposed in the investigations) and don't count out Hillary. No matter what happens, I think she thinks she is above it all and still entitled, and if she sees an opportunity, she will jump on it and she can continue with her tactics.


One other thing to consider: Democrats MUST take back the Senate and retain the House for any of those policies to be implemented. We have a wannabe king now. That is VERY dangerous to the Republic. He told the right wing meeting of Turning Point USA that he can do whatever he wants.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 19971.html

oops... wrong link. Still hilarious and happened at the meeting

https://www.newsweek.com/article-2-tren ... do-1450798

The "stable genius" decided that Article 2 of the Constitution gives him unlimited powers. It does not. If he read and understood the Constitution, he would know that.

JDST: I am curious what policies are you against?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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jdstJD
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 4:46 pm

seb146 wrote:
afcjets wrote:
jdstJD wrote:
I absolutely would never ever ever ever ever vote for Donald trump. But I am not pleased with the democratic platform this election cycle. So I don’t want to give my vote to the democrats because I don’t support much of the platform. So what is someone like me to do? If I don’t vote at all then that’s a vote for trump. If I vote for a democrat (with the exception of Biden. Love him) and he/she wins and they implement their policies I’ll be very upset. It’s not fair to put more independent and moderate voters like me in this position.

Don't be surprised if a late comer like Stacey Abrahams enters the race. If Biden is too weak and these other candidates self destruct by trying to all out left each other (which is exactly what they're doing), someone like Stacey (who has emphatically said she's not a socialist and likes capitalism, she said she's been both rich and poor and she prefers being rich) or even Michelle (assuming her husband isn't exposed in the investigations) and don't count out Hillary. No matter what happens, I think she thinks she is above it all and still entitled, and if she sees an opportunity, she will jump on it and she can continue with her tactics.


One other thing to consider: Democrats MUST take back the Senate and retain the House for any of those policies to be implemented. We have a wannabe king now. That is VERY dangerous to the Republic. He told the right wing meeting of Turning Point USA that he can do whatever he wants.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 19971.html

oops... wrong link. Still hilarious and happened at the meeting

https://www.newsweek.com/article-2-tren ... do-1450798

The "stable genius" decided that Article 2 of the Constitution gives him unlimited powers. It does not. If he read and understood the Constitution, he would know that.

JDST: I am curious what policies are you against?


From my response to another poster:

“There are quite a few positions the current field of democratic presidential candidates have taken that scare me and quite frankly piss me off. I.e free healthcare covering illegal immigrants, decriminalizing illegally crossing the boarder, reparations (not the concept but the timing of making it an election issue given the importance of getting trump out of office), 75% tax rate increase on wealthy (I think fixing tax code loopholes is more palatable than a blanket extreme tax rate hike because it sounds too much like punishing wealth which Americans do not like regardless of class)”
Lawyer, frequent air traveler and aviation enthusiast.
 
bhill
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 7:39 pm

Mueller did NOT investigate COLLUSION...because that is not a legal term...You must not have watched the proceedings. The word you are looking for is CONSPIRACY.
Carpe Pices
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 7:53 pm

bhill wrote:
Mueller did NOT investigate COLLUSION...because that is not a legal term...You must not have watched the proceedings. The word you are looking for is CONSPIRACY.

For better of for worse, most people have adopted the colloquial term, "collusion." This is not a court of law and everyone seems to understand what it refers to. But, yes, you are correct. Mueller found no evidence of conspiracy. Trump will not be charged.
 
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N14AZ
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 7:59 pm

jdstJD wrote:
From my response to another poster:

“There are quite a few positions the current field of democratic presidential candidates have taken that scare me and quite frankly piss me off. I.e free healthcare covering illegal immigrants, decriminalizing illegally crossing the boarder, reparations (not the concept but the timing of making it an election issue given the importance of getting trump out of office), 75% tax rate increase on wealthy (I think fixing tax code loopholes is more palatable than a blanket extreme tax rate hike because it sounds too much like punishing wealth which Americans do not like regardless of class)”

Good lord, that’s what they stand for? Then I suggest to skip the elections and save all that money. They have no chance...
 
seb146
Posts: 20262
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:34 pm

jdstJD wrote:
seb146 wrote:
afcjets wrote:
Don't be surprised if a late comer like Stacey Abrahams enters the race. If Biden is too weak and these other candidates self destruct by trying to all out left each other (which is exactly what they're doing), someone like Stacey (who has emphatically said she's not a socialist and likes capitalism, she said she's been both rich and poor and she prefers being rich) or even Michelle (assuming her husband isn't exposed in the investigations) and don't count out Hillary. No matter what happens, I think she thinks she is above it all and still entitled, and if she sees an opportunity, she will jump on it and she can continue with her tactics.


One other thing to consider: Democrats MUST take back the Senate and retain the House for any of those policies to be implemented. We have a wannabe king now. That is VERY dangerous to the Republic. He told the right wing meeting of Turning Point USA that he can do whatever he wants.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 19971.html

oops... wrong link. Still hilarious and happened at the meeting

https://www.newsweek.com/article-2-tren ... do-1450798

The "stable genius" decided that Article 2 of the Constitution gives him unlimited powers. It does not. If he read and understood the Constitution, he would know that.

JDST: I am curious what policies are you against?


From my response to another poster:

“There are quite a few positions the current field of democratic presidential candidates have taken that scare me and quite frankly piss me off. I.e free healthcare covering illegal immigrants, decriminalizing illegally crossing the boarder, reparations (not the concept but the timing of making it an election issue given the importance of getting trump out of office), 75% tax rate increase on wealthy (I think fixing tax code loopholes is more palatable than a blanket extreme tax rate hike because it sounds too much like punishing wealth which Americans do not like regardless of class)”


I think this should be a thread on it's own. Thank you for responding. What I will say is, with so many candidates on the Democratic side, they can be extreme and no one will notice. Those positions will fall back toward center once the nominee is chosen. I remember some of the crazy stands the Republican nominees took in 2016. They mostly got rid of those stands when the field was narrowed.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:35 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
bhill wrote:
Mueller did NOT investigate COLLUSION...because that is not a legal term...You must not have watched the proceedings. The word you are looking for is CONSPIRACY.

For better of for worse, most people have adopted the colloquial term, "collusion." This is not a court of law and everyone seems to understand what it refers to. But, yes, you are correct. Mueller found no evidence of conspiracy. Trump will not be charged.


People have adopted that because the golfer in chief started scream tweeting it over and over and over so it became a thing. Facts have no place in the MAGA world.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
MikeDrop
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 9:33 pm

seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
bhill wrote:
Mueller did NOT investigate COLLUSION...because that is not a legal term...You must not have watched the proceedings. The word you are looking for is CONSPIRACY.

For better of for worse, most people have adopted the colloquial term, "collusion." This is not a court of law and everyone seems to understand what it refers to. But, yes, you are correct. Mueller found no evidence of conspiracy. Trump will not be charged.


People have adopted that because the golfer in chief started scream tweeting it over and over and over so it became a thing. Facts have no place in the MAGA world.

The fact is that Adam Schiff has acknowledged that he specifically uses the term collusion to describe what he considers non-criminal behavior by Trump. Google the words Adam Schiff Collusion and you can find plenty of examples where repeatedly uses this term in order to bash President Trump. He has done this because the Mueller Report did not deliver the goods that he needed in order to “get Trump” so he started using the word collusion as a political talking point.

Facts do matter, but not to the Anti-Trump crowd.

Mike Drop
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 10:04 pm

MikeDrop wrote:
seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
For better of for worse, most people have adopted the colloquial term, "collusion." This is not a court of law and everyone seems to understand what it refers to. But, yes, you are correct. Mueller found no evidence of conspiracy. Trump will not be charged.


People have adopted that because the golfer in chief started scream tweeting it over and over and over so it became a thing. Facts have no place in the MAGA world.

The fact is that Adam Schiff has acknowledged that he specifically uses the term collusion to describe what he considers non-criminal behavior by Trump. Google the words Adam Schiff Collusion and you can find plenty of examples where repeatedly uses this term in order to bash President Trump. He has done this because the Mueller Report did not deliver the goods that he needed in order to “get Trump” so he started using the word collusion as a political talking point.

Facts do matter, but not to the Anti-Trump crowd.

Mike Drop

The bigger question I have in regard to Adam Schiff is when will he produce the “smoking gun” that he was on all of the liberal news networks touting? He sure must be a very patient man.

And let’s not forget this quote taken directly from the Mueller Report: “as defined in legal dictionaries, collusion is largely synonymous with conspiracy."
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Thu Jul 25, 2019 11:29 pm

I wonder if Mueller is sick and tired of everything and feels sorry he ever accepted the job.
 
ltbewr
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 12:24 am

The key reason for the investigation under Robert Mueller was that Russian government and connected persons were involved in trying to affect the 2016 Presidential election. That was on of the strongest points of Mueller's testimony on Wednesday.

Today (Thursday) the Senate Intelligence Committee put out a report on Russia's acts and attempts to interfere with the 2016 elections. The most important point was that there were attempts in 2016 and beyond of hacking into voting records on computers in all 50 states. So far nothing has been proven that any records were altered. Too bad this report didn't come out sooner. It still doesn't tie Trump directly to it, but it show Trump didn't care to investigate how he might have been helped him win. It also raises questions of our elections being affected by foreign agents in the future. https://www.npr.org/2019/07/25/74520513 ... ueller-day
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 1:04 am

So you are complaining that there was no investigation by citing the findings of an investigation?

The system seems to be working quite well. I’d much rather have Congress investigate than Trump investigate himself. Wouldn’t you?
 
MikeDrop
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 1:17 am

VTKillarney wrote:
So you are complaining that there was no investigation by citing the findings of an investigation?

The system seems to be working quite well. I’d much rather have Congress investigate than Trump investigate himself. Wouldn’t you?

Let’s not forget that all this was done during a previous administration that decided it was not enough of a threat to do anything about.

Mike Drop
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 2:01 am

CNN headline: “Impeachment Fizzles”
https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEK ... id=US%3Aen

Nice going Congressional Democrats. Calling Mueller was the biggest political blunder in years. He tried to warn them that he was going to stick to his report and not go beyond it. They thought they knew better. All they had to do was listen To Mueller. That’s what makes this so embarrassing for them.

From the CNN article: “Mueller's testimony was not a bombshell. It was much closer to a bust -- at least when it came to generating momentum for impeachment.”

Ouch! It stings!!!!!
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 3:01 am

One Democrat talking point is especially maddening. They say Russia tried to help Trump and Trump "welcomed that help." But there was no actual Russian "help" offered at the Trump Tower meeting. It was bogus. Sure, Trump "welcomed" WikiLeaks emails... but so did the US media.
 
seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:17 am

VTKillarney wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:
seb146 wrote:

People have adopted that because the golfer in chief started scream tweeting it over and over and over so it became a thing. Facts have no place in the MAGA world.

The fact is that Adam Schiff has acknowledged that he specifically uses the term collusion to describe what he considers non-criminal behavior by Trump. Google the words Adam Schiff Collusion and you can find plenty of examples where repeatedly uses this term in order to bash President Trump. He has done this because the Mueller Report did not deliver the goods that he needed in order to “get Trump” so he started using the word collusion as a political talking point.

Facts do matter, but not to the Anti-Trump crowd.

Mike Drop

The bigger question I have in regard to Adam Schiff is when will he produce the “smoking gun” that he was on all of the liberal news networks touting? He sure must be a very patient man.

And let’s not forget this quote taken directly from the Mueller Report: “as defined in legal dictionaries, collusion is largely synonymous with conspiracy."


But not what Mueller was looking for so when the MAGA leader screamed "NO COLLUSION!!!" we were right in saying "that is not even a thing" so thank you for finally understanding what we have been trying to tell you for the last six months.

And, he was still not exonerated. That was never said.

Being that many in Congress are lawyers, could it be that they are looking for an air-tight case to take the wannabe king out? That Mitch McConnell will never take up? This just shows how much Republicans hate America and the Constitution.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:22 am

VTKillarney wrote:
One Democrat talking point is especially maddening. They say Russia tried to help Trump and Trump "welcomed that help." But there was no actual Russian "help" offered at the Trump Tower meeting. It was bogus. Sure, Trump "welcomed" WikiLeaks emails... but so did the US media.


1) Why would they lie about the meeting being about adoption?
2) Why would they block and obstruct about the meeting if nothing happened?
3) https://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na- ... story.html
4) http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/04/ ... eting.html

FACTS are FACTS. And the FACTS are that team MAGA met with Russians to get dirt on Hillary WHICH IS ILLEGAL. Also, what did Mueller say about welcoming help from WikiLeaks? I want to hear it from you. Put it in perspective.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 7:56 am

VTKillarney wrote:
One Democrat talking point is especially maddening. They say Russia tried to help Trump and Trump "welcomed that help." But there was no actual Russian "help" offered at the Trump Tower meeting. It was bogus. Sure, Trump "welcomed" WikiLeaks emails... but so did the US media.


Not sure how you come to that conclusion reading the report’s account of the June 9 meeting. The meeting went bust because Kushner saw Don Jr had been had and left early. Bannon’s account was similar - in fact, Don Jr was the only one with a different account and efforts to tuck tail later. Some of the obstruction actions could be construed as attempts to protect the son as well - if he were a man he could have taken responsibility instead of making the family and father look bad by association.

But oh well, now we have 45 telling Hannity tonight the whole investigation was ‘treason’ - guess he needs to read Article III again :roll:
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:06 am

seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:
The fact is that Adam Schiff has acknowledged that he specifically uses the term collusion to describe what he considers non-criminal behavior by Trump. Google the words Adam Schiff Collusion and you can find plenty of examples where repeatedly uses this term in order to bash President Trump. He has done this because the Mueller Report did not deliver the goods that he needed in order to “get Trump” so he started using the word collusion as a political talking point.

Facts do matter, but not to the Anti-Trump crowd.

Mike Drop

The bigger question I have in regard to Adam Schiff is when will he produce the “smoking gun” that he was on all of the liberal news networks touting? He sure must be a very patient man.

And let’s not forget this quote taken directly from the Mueller Report: “as defined in legal dictionaries, collusion is largely synonymous with conspiracy."


But not what Mueller was looking for so when the MAGA leader screamed "NO COLLUSION!!!" we were right in saying "that is not even a thing" so thank you for finally understanding what we have been trying to tell you for the last six months.

And, he was still not exonerated. That was never said.

Being that many in Congress are lawyers, could it be that they are looking for an air-tight case to take the wannabe king out? That Mitch McConnell will never take up? This just shows how much Republicans hate America and the Constitution.

Mueller looked for conspiracy, which his own report says is synonymous with collusion. It doesn’t get much clearer than that, even if Adam Schiff wants to confuse everyone.

Of course Trump was not exonerated. A prosecutor in the United States cannot exonerate. Congressional Democrats are getting bent out of shape because Mueller didn’t do something that he couldn’t do. Mueller himself admitted that the DOJ has never exonerated anyone. Ever. Republicans understand the presumption of innocence. Democrats hate that concept with a passion.

At the end of the day, this proved to be a hoax and Congressional Democrats have lost big time. This has been the greatest political blunder in at least a generation.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:45 am

VTKillarney wrote:
seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
The bigger question I have in regard to Adam Schiff is when will he produce the “smoking gun” that he was on all of the liberal news networks touting? He sure must be a very patient man.

And let’s not forget this quote taken directly from the Mueller Report: “as defined in legal dictionaries, collusion is largely synonymous with conspiracy."


But not what Mueller was looking for so when the MAGA leader screamed "NO COLLUSION!!!" we were right in saying "that is not even a thing" so thank you for finally understanding what we have been trying to tell you for the last six months.

And, he was still not exonerated. That was never said.

Being that many in Congress are lawyers, could it be that they are looking for an air-tight case to take the wannabe king out? That Mitch McConnell will never take up? This just shows how much Republicans hate America and the Constitution.

Mueller looked for conspiracy, which his own report says is synonymous with collusion. It doesn’t get much clearer than that, even if Adam Schiff wants to confuse everyone.

Of course Trump was not exonerated. A prosecutor in the United States cannot exonerate. Congressional Democrats are getting bent out of shape because Mueller didn’t do something that he couldn’t do. Mueller himself admitted that the DOJ has never exonerated anyone. Ever. Republicans understand the presumption of innocence. Democrats hate that concept with a passion.

At the end of the day, this proved to be a hoax and Congressional Democrats have lost big time. This has been the greatest political blunder in at least a generation.


That reality exists only in your mind. Dems tried to get Mueller to overstep his bounds and GOP tried to undercut his team, but the fact remains: nobody has disproven or discredited the contents of the report itself. The facts within stand on their own and are damning to several individuals in Trump orbit - that alone is a shitty legacy.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 11:00 am

The worse legacy is how for the past two+ years Democrats have tried to undermine an election with a hoax. Democrats took a page right out of the Putin playbook.

But it’s worth repeating now that this attack on our democracy is over, no collusion. No conspiracy.

Every American should be rejoicing.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 12:26 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
The worse legacy is how for the past two+ years Democrats have tried to undermine an election with a hoax. Democrats took a page right out of the Putin playbook.

But it’s worth repeating now that this attack on our democracy is over, no collusion. No conspiracy.

Every American should be rejoicing.


As I stated 50 or so replies ago - nothing could be further from your statement - both campaigns reached out to Russians for dirt, and got played like fiddles. Nobody should be rejoicing - neither candidate deserved a single vote. It was sad enough that both were hated enough for 100 million eligible voters to sit out, but it’s sadder still that all 230 million should have knowing what we know now.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:32 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
The worse legacy is how for the past two+ years Democrats have tried to undermine an election with a hoax. Democrats took a page right out of the Putin playbook.

But it’s worth repeating now that this attack on our democracy is over, no collusion. No conspiracy.

Every American should be rejoicing.


Rejoicing over sworn testimony AND in print that team MAGA worked with foreign governments to get elected? Not only by soliciting campaign donations WHICH IS ILLEGAL but the Tower meeting and working with Wikileaks?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... oliticians
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/2 ... e-warnings

BTW, when you righties were screaming about the Clinton's pay-to-play (it wasn't but let's pretend for just a second) I am thinking you will (not) make as much noise about dear leader doing the exact same thing?

https://www.politico.com/story/2016/12/ ... rds-232974
https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2017/0 ... uguration/
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 5:54 pm

seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
The worse legacy is how for the past two+ years Democrats have tried to undermine an election with a hoax. Democrats took a page right out of the Putin playbook.

But it’s worth repeating now that this attack on our democracy is over, no collusion. No conspiracy.

Every American should be rejoicing.


Rejoicing over sworn testimony AND in print that team MAGA worked with foreign governments to get elected? Not only by soliciting campaign donations WHICH IS ILLEGAL but the Tower meeting and working with Wikileaks?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... oliticians
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/2 ... e-warnings

BTW, when you righties were screaming about the Clinton's pay-to-play (it wasn't but let's pretend for just a second) I am thinking you will (not) make as much noise about dear leader doing the exact same thing?

https://www.politico.com/story/2016/12/ ... rds-232974
https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2017/0 ... uguration/

Here is what I know:
1) Every single one of the indictments brought against a member of Trump's campaign team involves a procedural crime and not a substantive crime.
2) Trump himself has not been implicated in any of those indictments.

This is what we have after 2 years, 2,800 subpoenas and tens of millions of dollars.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 6:11 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
The worse legacy is how for the past two+ years Democrats have tried to undermine an election with a hoax. Democrats took a page right out of the Putin playbook.

But it’s worth repeating now that this attack on our democracy is over, no collusion. No conspiracy.

Every American should be rejoicing.


Rejoicing over sworn testimony AND in print that team MAGA worked with foreign governments to get elected? Not only by soliciting campaign donations WHICH IS ILLEGAL but the Tower meeting and working with Wikileaks?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... oliticians
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/2 ... e-warnings

BTW, when you righties were screaming about the Clinton's pay-to-play (it wasn't but let's pretend for just a second) I am thinking you will (not) make as much noise about dear leader doing the exact same thing?

https://www.politico.com/story/2016/12/ ... rds-232974
https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2017/0 ... uguration/

Here is what I know:
1) Every single one of the indictments brought against a member of Trump's campaign team involves a procedural crime and not a substantive crime.
2) Trump himself has not been implicated in any of those indictments.

This is what we have after 2 years, 2,800 subpoenas and tens of millions of dollars.


No, We have evidence that Russia sought and succeeded in violating our election laws. These are extremely substantial to people that care about integrity of elections. We also have proof that the President asked people to lie to cover up meetings and other items. Trump would likely be implicated if he was not the sitting president.

So quit with the lies about how substantially the Trump administration has worked to destroy the US elections process, and how they and the GOP currently still allow the elections to be exploited.
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 6:17 pm

Only one sitting President allowed Russia to interfere with our election - Obama.

Of course he thought that Hillary would win, so he really didn't care.

Democrats in the beltway have been making one bad decision after another in regard to Russia.

Mind you, we are talking about a few tweets and Facebook posts.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 6:22 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
Only one sitting President allowed Russia to interfere with our election - Obama.

Of course he thought that Hillary would win, so he really didn't care.

Democrats in the beltway have been making one bad decision after another in regard to Russia.

Mind you, we are talking about a few tweets and Facebook posts.


No,
Trump went to Russia and offered a Free penhouse to putin.
That was a private deal and corruption, Trump invited attacks on American Infrastructure.
Obama, asked the cowards in the GOP to authorize spending to counter russian interference, and guess what. They did jack squat.

Here is some reading while you ponder your lack of comprehension of history.

https://www.npr.org/2018/02/21/58761404 ... ce-in-2016

Former Vice President Joe Biden also has complained that the White House wanted Republicans to join in a bipartisan statement announcing and condemning the interference campaign. In Biden's telling, however, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., wouldn't go along.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 6:42 pm

This article does a great job of illustrating just how impotent Obama was in regard to Russia election interference.
https://www.politico.com/story/2017/08/ ... nce-241547

In any event. We can thank Mueller for informing us that Trump did not conspire with Russia.
 
seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 7:22 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
Only one sitting President allowed Russia to interfere with our election - Obama.


Actually, he told us Russia was trying to interfere with our elections. Republicans said "that is just a lie to get Hillary elected!" Just keep digging that hole, VTK.....
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 7:42 pm

seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Only one sitting President allowed Russia to interfere with our election - Obama.


Actually, he told us Russia was trying to interfere with our elections. Republicans said "that is just a lie to get Hillary elected!" Just keep digging that hole, VTK.....

Read the article that I linked to. That's not how it worked.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 7:48 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Only one sitting President allowed Russia to interfere with our election - Obama.


Actually, he told us Russia was trying to interfere with our elections. Republicans said "that is just a lie to get Hillary elected!" Just keep digging that hole, VTK.....

Read the article that I linked to. That's not how it worked.


That is exactly what Mitch McConnell did. He lied and wouldn't do anything.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 9:13 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Only one sitting President allowed Russia to interfere with our election - Obama.


Actually, he told us Russia was trying to interfere with our elections. Republicans said "that is just a lie to get Hillary elected!" Just keep digging that hole, VTK.....

Read the article that I linked to. That's not how it worked.


Yeah, I read the article several times. "Unnamed officials...." and "Speaking on anonymity...." back up your opinion.

Beyond that, the Obama administration was trying not to degrade relations with Russia any farther. I guess he should have simply embraced Putin like the current occupant of the White House.....
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:45 pm

Politico is a credible source. I’m sure that they vetted their sources.
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sat Jul 27, 2019 2:32 am

seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Only one sitting President allowed Russia to interfere with our election - Obama.


Actually, he told us Russia was trying to interfere with our elections.


And his administration was told to stand down on their efforts against it.
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seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sat Jul 27, 2019 3:50 am

EA CO AS wrote:
seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Only one sitting President allowed Russia to interfere with our election - Obama.


Actually, he told us Russia was trying to interfere with our elections.


And his administration was told to stand down on their efforts against it.


By Mitch McConnell. Unless you have another source? I am guessing you will come back with Hillary.......
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sat Jul 27, 2019 3:59 am

seb146 wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
seb146 wrote:

Actually, he told us Russia was trying to interfere with our elections.


And his administration was told to stand down on their efforts against it.


By Mitch McConnell. Unless you have another source? I am guessing you will come back with Hillary.......


Is the Mueller report and CNN good enough for you?

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/04/19/opinio ... index.html

How about the White House cyber security coordinator under the Obama administration?

https://news.yahoo.com/obama-cyber-chie ... 35758.html
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sat Jul 27, 2019 6:15 am

EA CO AS wrote:
seb146 wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:

And his administration was told to stand down on their efforts against it.


By Mitch McConnell. Unless you have another source? I am guessing you will come back with Hillary.......


Is the Mueller report and CNN good enough for you?

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/04/19/opinio ... index.html

How about the White House cyber security coordinator under the Obama administration?

https://news.yahoo.com/obama-cyber-chie ... 35758.html


So, the president who is LITERALLY a Constitutional scholar WHO KNOWS THE CONSTITUTION is wrong and has no idea how the Constitution works? You mean that? That is what you are arguing? Really? The administration who surrounded themselves with anyone and everyone who knows about diplomacy and the Constitution and the law? You think they are wrong and lying? Are you even serious?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sat Jul 27, 2019 9:06 am

seb146 wrote:
So, the president who is LITERALLY a Constitutional scholar WHO KNOWS THE CONSTITUTION is wrong and has no idea how the Constitution works?


You mean Mr. "I have a phone and a pen"? The guy who decided that circumventing Congress, the Constitutionally-defined body that's meant to create law, was how he'd operate?

Yes, him, and he was wrong. He was focused on getting Russia onboard with the Iran deal and that's why he told his team to back down.

If you want to focus on Russia playing dirty tricks, talk to the guy at the top who knew about it and decided to not only do nothing, but told his people to stop the things they were trying to do to counter them.

Anyway, you asked me to cite a source. I did - multiple, actually. And you can't admit that President Obama owns this failure?
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

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SQ22
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sat Jul 27, 2019 9:22 am

May I remind you to keep this thread on topic. Thanks.
 
seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sat Jul 27, 2019 4:45 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
seb146 wrote:
So, the president who is LITERALLY a Constitutional scholar WHO KNOWS THE CONSTITUTION is wrong and has no idea how the Constitution works?


You mean Mr. "I have a phone and a pen"? The guy who decided that circumventing Congress, the Constitutionally-defined body that's meant to create law, was how he'd operate?

Yes, him, and he was wrong. He was focused on getting Russia onboard with the Iran deal and that's why he told his team to back down.

If you want to focus on Russia playing dirty tricks, talk to the guy at the top who knew about it and decided to not only do nothing, but told his people to stop the things they were trying to do to counter them.

Anyway, you asked me to cite a source. I did - multiple, actually. And you can't admit that President Obama owns this failure?


Admit the man who knows the law and tried to do something didn't do anything? As soon as you admit Republicans are fully supportive of Russian interference. Last time and this time.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-t ... tZJVELgk6o
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/mitch-mcco ... rity-bill/
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sat Jul 27, 2019 5:12 pm

It’s going to be interesting to see what Congressional Democrats do now that the Mueller testimony backfired. Their Plan B was the Sourhern District of New York. Since that went absolutely nowhere what will the do with the Mueller Report now?
 
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DIRECTFLT
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sun Jul 28, 2019 3:23 am

VTKillarney wrote:
The worse legacy is how for the past two+ years Democrats have tried to undermine an election with a hoax. Democrats took a page right out of the Putin playbook.

But it’s worth repeating now that this attack on our democracy is over, no collusion. No conspiracy.

Every American should be rejoicing.


"Americans" are rejoicing. 2020 is going to be a great year for "Americans."
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seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sun Jul 28, 2019 3:55 am

VTKillarney wrote:
It’s going to be interesting to see what Congressional Democrats do now that the Mueller testimony backfired. Their Plan B was the Sourhern District of New York. Since that went absolutely nowhere what will the do with the Mueller Report now?


So "backfired" means Republicans did not read the report and believe 'TOTAL EXONERATION!! NO COLLUSION!!!" and all that BS from the occupant of the White House. This just means we PATRIOTS need to educate low information voters and highlight crimes in and hand out copies of the Mueller Report.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
MSPNWA
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sun Jul 28, 2019 5:14 am

Remember when the Democrats were asking Republicans if they would accept the Mueller Report?

We now know who wouldn't accept it.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sun Jul 28, 2019 5:29 am

DIRECTFLT wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
The worse legacy is how for the past two+ years Democrats have tried to undermine an election with a hoax. Democrats took a page right out of the Putin playbook.

But it’s worth repeating now that this attack on our democracy is over, no collusion. No conspiracy.

Every American should be rejoicing.


"Americans" are rejoicing. 2020 is going to be a great year for "Americans."


Not at the rate suburban women and independents are fleeing.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sun Jul 28, 2019 11:33 am

seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
It’s going to be interesting to see what Congressional Democrats do now that the Mueller testimony backfired. Their Plan B was the Sourhern District of New York. Since that went absolutely nowhere what will the do with the Mueller Report now?


So "backfired" means Republicans did not read the report and believe 'TOTAL EXONERATION!! NO COLLUSION!!!" and all that BS from the occupant of the White House. This just means we PATRIOTS need to educate low information voters and highlight crimes in and hand out copies of the Mueller Report.

“Backfired” means that even CNN and MSNBC pundits were saying that it was a disaster for the Democrats.
 
MikeDrop
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sun Jul 28, 2019 2:15 pm

seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
This just means we PATRIOTS need to educate low information voters and highlight crimes in and hand out copies of the Mueller Report.

Ok, do it. Please highlight the crimes committed by President Trump or his campaign that are documented in the report.

Please categorize the crimes into two groups - group 1: conspiracy crimes and group 2: process crimes. Also, please provide the section, page, and paragraph for each of these crimes that you list so we can verify your claims. We are happy to read the report - again. Just help us understand where we missed the crimes.
I’ll be very interested to compare your list to the congressional committee questions that were asked of Mueller. I’d be shocked if the Democrats didn’t ask Mueller about each and every crime that you list.
We await your reply.

Mike Drop
 
seb146
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Re: Mueller Speaks: Barr Mislead the American People

Sun Jul 28, 2019 4:38 pm

MikeDrop wrote:
seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
This just means we PATRIOTS need to educate low information voters and highlight crimes in and hand out copies of the Mueller Report.

Ok, do it. Please highlight the crimes committed by President Trump or his campaign that are documented in the report.

Please categorize the crimes into two groups - group 1: conspiracy crimes and group 2: process crimes. Also, please provide the section, page, and paragraph for each of these crimes that you list so we can verify your claims. We are happy to read the report - again. Just help us understand where we missed the crimes.
I’ll be very interested to compare your list to the congressional committee questions that were asked of Mueller. I’d be shocked if the Democrats didn’t ask Mueller about each and every crime that you list.
We await your reply.

Mike Drop


Let's start here with a watered down version

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... SKCN1UG0IK

There is also

https://www.americanbar.org/news/abanew ... stigation/

where the American Bar Association tells us that Barr said Mueller said. Which is what Republicans and MAGA fan boys have been going with. Not the actual FACTS that Mueller said.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archi ... ce/594634/

Talks about obstruction of justice and how the occupant of the White House did just that when he tried to remove Mueller and stop the investigation.

Mueller was tasked with investigating Russian interference. That he found MAGA associates guilty of other crimes is just icing on the cake. And that the orange one obstructed justice is very telling. Further, that a sector of the American voting public would rather defend him than discover actual facts is insane.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!

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