UAUA
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Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Mon May 13, 2019 7:30 am

They had many debates regarding this. Will this become a reality?
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TSS
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Mon May 13, 2019 7:59 am

UAUA wrote:
They had many debates regarding this. Will this become a reality?

Other than showing off for the sake of showing off, what use would they have for one? Ships of any type are a very slow way to get from A to B, and maintenance on them is expensive. Better to just charter a plane as needed.
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Channex757
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Mon May 13, 2019 9:54 am

Security nightmare as well. Personally, I can't see William standing for it and he's got a lot of clout in the Firm nowadays.
 
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cpd
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Mon May 13, 2019 10:08 am

UAUA wrote:
They had many debates regarding this. Will this become a reality?



Doubt there is any use for one now. Expensive and slow.
 
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zkojq
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Mon May 13, 2019 3:52 pm

The UK is broke. They can't exactly afford it even if they wanted to.
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VSMUT
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Mon May 13, 2019 8:38 pm

TSS wrote:
UAUA wrote:
They had many debates regarding this. Will this become a reality?

Other than showing off for the sake of showing off, what use would they have for one? Ships of any type are a very slow way to get from A to B, and maintenance on them is expensive. Better to just charter a plane as needed.


Representation around the kingdom, on a much more visible and down-to-earth level. They can pull up to any tiny little town with a stretch of coastline. That's how the Royal Yacht is used in Denmark.

They aren't exactly in a hurry anyway. As they are funded through the state and can't hold any positions in government, why hurry about in business jets?
 
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Mon May 13, 2019 9:04 pm

VSMUT wrote:
TSS wrote:
UAUA wrote:
They had many debates regarding this. Will this become a reality?

Other than showing off for the sake of showing off, what use would they have for one? Ships of any type are a very slow way to get from A to B, and maintenance on them is expensive. Better to just charter a plane as needed.


Representation around the kingdom, on a much more visible and down-to-earth level. They can pull up to any tiny little town with a stretch of coastline. That's how the Royal Yacht is used in Denmark.

True, but they can pull up to any tiny town with a stretch of road now and not have the additional security concerns of being in a boat, plus not every tiny town on the coast has suitable docking facilities but every tiny town does have a place where a couple of busses can be parked.

VSMUT wrote:
They aren't exactly in a hurry anyway. As they are funded through the state and can't hold any positions in government, why hurry about in business jets?

As I understand it the ones that don't have small children still have quite full schedules though: There's always an appearance here, an official dinner there, a meeting in another place, a tour of someplace else, and a presentation to go to almost every day.

Until recently they had a royal yacht, a coal-burner from the teens or twenties if I'm not mistaken, that they rarely if ever used which was costing them a fortune in maintenance just to sit there idle.
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Bongodog49
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Mon May 13, 2019 9:10 pm

zkojq wrote:
The UK is broke. They can't exactly afford it even if they wanted to.


How do you deduce that the worlds 5th largest economy is broke ?

We have falling national debt and positive growth, so I'm sure we could afford a Royal yacht if we wished one.

The problem however is that there is no great public call for one.

One post said that it would be a security problem, in many ways its predecessor was the answer to security problems, it sailed all over the World and provided secure safe accommodation wherever it went, in addition it also helped host nations who didn't need to security sweep hotels and shut them down for days on end. The greatest issue in future however would be that the previous yacht used to be accompanied by a Royal navy frigate and a supply ship, we simply don't have enough frigates and destroyers now to dedicate one to guarding a Royal yacht.
 
VSMUT
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Mon May 13, 2019 9:27 pm

TSS wrote:
True, but they can pull up to any tiny town with a stretch of road now and not have the additional security concerns of being in a boat, plus not every tiny town on the coast has suitable docking facilities but every tiny town does have a place where a couple of busses can be parked.


Lack of docks has never been an issue here. All you need is for the tender to be able to get close enough to shore for a person to step off.

Security concerns can hardly be solved more easily and better than by putting the monarch on a warship, guarded by sailors of the military.


TSS wrote:
There's always an appearance here, an official dinner there, a meeting in another place, a tour of someplace else, and a presentation to go to almost every day.


Exactly. Appearances = representing the monarchy to the people. There are few better ways of doing that than with a ship. You sail from one place to the next, official dinners and meetings can be done aboard and suitable accommodation is available every night.
If she appears in a car, she pulls up to a parking lot, walks out and shakes some hands, meets with some official and is gone an hour later. In a ship there is a very visible presence all day.
 
BestWestern
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Mon May 13, 2019 11:06 pm

This is a government that awards an urgent short notice ferry contract to a company with no ferries.

Their ability to procure a royal yacht would probably end up with a land yacht.
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UAUA
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Tue May 14, 2019 9:34 pm

Well the UK is still a very rich empire overall.

Why did they retire the Britannia? Too expensive to operate+too old?
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johns624
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Tue May 14, 2019 10:29 pm

UAUA wrote:
Well the UK is still a very rich empire overall.

Why did they retire the Britannia? Too expensive to operate+too old?
Google (in multiple ways) is your friend. The UK has no empire and hasn't for 50+ years. The HMS Britannia was built in 1954, so yes, she is too old. As another member posted, she would have to be accompanied by a frigate/destroyer on all but the shortest cruises. The Royal Navy has only 19 total and 2-3 are normally tied up due to a shortage of crews. Seeing as how only 25-40% of naval ships are ready to go to sea at one time, they don't have enough to spare.
 
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Channex757
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Wed May 15, 2019 1:42 am

Again, security. In this modern world of portable missile systems a Royal Yacht is a floating target that can't do more than around thirty knots.

In the Firm itself, Betty is in her nineties now so won't use it. Charles is mad and will probably step aside in favour of William. So it's William who will be consulted on this and as a 21st Century monarch he won't want a yacht. The last semi-serious proposal had the new ship sponsored and looking like a product placement nightmare! Britannia 2 would need to be relatively plain looking and therefore boring. He is an RAF King so the Voyager will suit him fine.
 
TSS
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Wed May 15, 2019 5:20 am

Channex757 wrote:
Again, security. In this modern world of portable missile systems a Royal Yacht is a floating target that can't do more than around thirty knots.

In the Firm itself, Betty is in her nineties now so won't use it. Charles is mad and will probably step aside in favour of William. So it's William who will be consulted on this and as a 21st Century monarch he won't want a yacht. The last semi-serious proposal had the new ship sponsored and looking like a product placement nightmare! Britannia 2 would need to be relatively plain looking and therefore boring. He is an RAF King so the Voyager will suit him fine.

Well put. Aside from all that, I believe it is Buckingham Palace, one of the main Royal Palaces in London anyway, that is currently in need of a long-deferred new roof. It doesn't matter whether you're the reigning monarch of the UK or the poorest redneck living in Bug Tussle, Alabama, putting a new roof on the house when the old one is leaking takes precedence over putting a new boat in the water every time.
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Kiwirob
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Wed May 15, 2019 5:44 am

TSS wrote:
VSMUT wrote:
TSS wrote:
Other than showing off for the sake of showing off, what use would they have for one? Ships of any type are a very slow way to get from A to B, and maintenance on them is expensive. Better to just charter a plane as needed.


Representation around the kingdom, on a much more visible and down-to-earth level. They can pull up to any tiny little town with a stretch of coastline. That's how the Royal Yacht is used in Denmark.

True, but they can pull up to any tiny town with a stretch of road now and not have the additional security concerns of being in a boat, plus not every tiny town on the coast has suitable docking facilities but every tiny town does have a place where a couple of busses can be parked.

VSMUT wrote:
They aren't exactly in a hurry anyway. As they are funded through the state and can't hold any positions in government, why hurry about in business jets?

As I understand it the ones that don't have small children still have quite full schedules though: There's always an appearance here, an official dinner there, a meeting in another place, a tour of someplace else, and a presentation to go to almost every day.

Until recently they had a royal yacht, a coal-burner from the teens or twenties if I'm not mistaken, that they rarely if ever used which was costing them a fortune in maintenance just to sit there idle.


The Royal yacht Britannia sailed over 1 million nautical miles, she was in service from 1954 to 1997, she was used a lot. She wasn’t coal fired either, she burned diesel.
 
Kiwirob
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Wed May 15, 2019 5:47 am

johns624 wrote:
UAUA wrote:
Well the UK is still a very rich empire overall.

Why did they retire the Britannia? Too expensive to operate+too old?
Google (in multiple ways) is your friend. The UK has no empire and hasn't for 50+ years. The HMS Britannia was built in 1954, so yes, she is too old. As another member posted, she would have to be accompanied by a frigate/destroyer on all but the shortest cruises. The Royal Navy has only 19 total and 2-3 are normally tied up due to a shortage of crews. Seeing as how only 25-40% of naval ships are ready to go to sea at one time, they don't have enough to spare.


The Danes and Norwegians both have royal yachts which are far older than Britannia, they are both used frequently.
 
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Wed May 15, 2019 6:02 am

Kiwirob wrote:
TSS wrote:
Until recently they had a royal yacht, a coal-burner from the teens or twenties if I'm not mistaken, that they rarely if ever used which was costing them a fortune in maintenance just to sit there idle.


The Royal yacht Britannia sailed over 1 million nautical miles, she was in service from 1954 to 1997, she was used a lot. She wasn’t coal fired either, she burned diesel.

Fair enough, I was wrong. I must have been confusing the Britannia with another (possibly royal) yacht that was retired at about the same time because I looked up the Britannia and it was much larger and more modern than the one I was thinking of.
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UAUA
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Wed May 15, 2019 6:32 am

johns624 wrote:
UAUA wrote:
Well the UK is still a very rich empire overall.

Why did they retire the Britannia? Too expensive to operate+too old?
Google (in multiple ways) is your friend. The UK has no empire and hasn't for 50+ years. The HMS Britannia was built in 1954, so yes, she is too old. As another member posted, she would have to be accompanied by a frigate/destroyer on all but the shortest cruises. The Royal Navy has only 19 total and 2-3 are normally tied up due to a shortage of crews. Seeing as how only 25-40% of naval ships are ready to go to sea at one time, they don't have enough to spare.


Thanks for the info.

They still have like 13-15 British territories like Falkland Islands and many in the Commonwealth with the Queen as the figurehead and governors. But not exactly colonies. The last colony they had was Hong Kong. You are right.

How old are the Danish/Norwegian Royal yachts?
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B777LRF
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Wed May 15, 2019 7:01 am

UAUA wrote:
How old are the Danish/Norwegian Royal yachts?


Dannebrog was launched in 1932, and has been through a number of refurbishments/upgrades since; new engines, new electrics, new hydraulics, new nav equipment - you name it.

She is used every year when the monarch goes on a her annual trip around Denmark, usually lasting around 6 weeks visiting small and smaller towns around the country. She has been as far north as Greenland, and was used as the royal residence in London and Athens for their respective olympics. She is used for both official duties and private trips by the royal family, and has several hundred thousand nautical miles under her keel.

Security is not a problem. Being onboard a yacht, with 80-odd sailors looking after her, is just about as safe as it gets. Dannebrog does not sail with a navy escort; as a navy ship she's perfectly able to maintain security for the royal family herself. She does not sail with a security contingent from special branch, they only meet her when she steps off the boat and meet the locals. You'd be surprised how few officers is needed for her security; she usually strolls the main shopping street in Copenhagen with just two plain-clothes in tow.

The heir to the Danish throne is an avid sailor himself, and there's absolutely no sign of any motion to retire Dannebrog. She will live well beyond her 100th birthday and, when time comes, will likely be replaced by something more modern, which hopefully will also last 100+ years. We're a seafaring nation, all the way back to the vikings. It's only right and proper the royal family should have a suitable yacht at their disposal.
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Kiwirob
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Wed May 15, 2019 8:26 am

UAUA wrote:

How old are the Danish/Norwegian Royal yachts?


HNoMY Norge was originally launched in 1937 as a private yacht for Thomas Sopwith, the Norwegian govt brought the yacht in 1947. When Prince Karl of Denmark was asked to become the King of Norway, the Govt promised him a Royal Yacht, it took a few decades before they delivered on this promise.

Norge has been overhauled several times, with the last major refit occuring in 1985, she's popular with the Norwegian public. I'm pretty sure when the time comes to replace her the Govt will.
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Thu May 16, 2019 3:14 pm

BestWestern wrote:
This is a government that awards an urgent short notice ferry contract to a company with no ferries.

Their ability to procure a royal yacht would probably end up with a land yacht.

That is so very true. :checkmark:
The UK government history on I.T. projects also sucks big time, spend billions and then scrap it because it will not work.
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Bongodog49
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Re: Will there ever be a new British Royal yacht?

Thu May 16, 2019 7:41 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
TSS wrote:
VSMUT wrote:

Representation around the kingdom, on a much more visible and down-to-earth level. They can pull up to any tiny little town with a stretch of coastline. That's how the Royal Yacht is used in Denmark.

True, but they can pull up to any tiny town with a stretch of road now and not have the additional security concerns of being in a boat, plus not every tiny town on the coast has suitable docking facilities but every tiny town does have a place where a couple of busses can be parked.

VSMUT wrote:
They aren't exactly in a hurry anyway. As they are funded through the state and can't hold any positions in government, why hurry about in business jets?

As I understand it the ones that don't have small children still have quite full schedules though: There's always an appearance here, an official dinner there, a meeting in another place, a tour of someplace else, and a presentation to go to almost every day.

Until recently they had a royal yacht, a coal-burner from the teens or twenties if I'm not mistaken, that they rarely if ever used which was costing them a fortune in maintenance just to sit there idle.


The Royal yacht Britannia sailed over 1 million nautical miles, she was in service from 1954 to 1997, she was used a lot. She wasn’t coal fired either, she burned diesel.


Brittania burnt oil fuel to raise steam as it was turbine powered, that was one of its problems, by the 1990's it was the last steam turbine ship in the Royal Navy, they were running out of engineers with turbine experience and Royal fleet auxilary ships weren't carrying the correct fuel. Other issues included no helicopter facilities, and requiring nearly 300 crew. A replacement was being planned but we had a change of government and the new one was determined to change a lot of things, including not replacing the Royal Yacht

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