BN747
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The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 5:44 pm

Me wonders...are we allowed to discuss this? Or have previous ones been deleted...I mean this situation is happening right now as if a crippled jetliner is circling buying time to decide the best approach method given it's current crippling issue before deciding without addressing all options in search of the most optimal.

Personally, I think this a hoax! Sure Iran is stirring the pot in the M.E. But the Saudi side doesn't come with clean hands either.
I bet the Brokahontas is trying to light a match to a powder keg of nukes.

But he's emplying that same ol' tactic he's used (documented) multiple times to force an outcome of a self-benefiting situation, not a nation benefiting one.

Right now, he's saying 'whoa! whoa! Slow your roll fellas, not so fast! I gotta 'THINK' this through for a minute.

The Other-side (Fake other-side because both are the SAME side - but follow the script) plays mute but allow quaint interviews laced with hints of ambiguity.

We FALL for it...BAM!!! = War.

So where were we?

BN747
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einsteinboricua
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 5:52 pm

Trump poked the beehive.

He's seeing the bees swarm and is sticking his arm out so he can say "see? the bee stung me so we must exterminate the hive".

Everything was going according to plan. Withdrawing from the agreement and reimposing sanctions is an act of aggression, one that was not needed when even his own administration said the deal was working as intended.

Coupled with a war hawk that has a fetish for wars (even though he never served in uniform, except in a reserve capacity), and you have the recipe for a disaster.

Remember when conservatives were adamant that whoever fills the office of POTUS must have been a military veteran? My, my, how times have changed since then.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
c933103
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 6:02 pm

Probably still sour about Iranian revolution?
When no other countries around the world is going to militarily stop China and its subordinate fom abusing its citizens within its national boundary, it is unreasonable to expect those abuse can be countered with purely peaceful means.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 6:07 pm

Trump's tactic of escalating till the other blinks, isn't really going to work on Iran, it barely worked on North Korea (and actually it hasn't because nothing has really changed).

Perhaps Trump is looking to start a war in order to become more popular for the elections next year? Would be quite a cynical reason, but not beyond the whelm of possibilities.
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readytotaxi
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 6:20 pm

Feel sure something is gonna happen within the next 4 weeks, maybe by accident, remember the shoot-down by the USS Vincennes of Iran Air flight 655. I know tech has improved since then but hey. Can't see the Iranians doing it out front but by proxy may be, and just watch as the price of crude oil spikes if the Straits of Hormuz is threatened.
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casinterest
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 6:23 pm

Anyone ever seen the move : "Wag the Dog"?
Go watch it. That is all you need to know.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
Spar
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 7:02 pm

BN747 wrote:
Sure Iran is stirring the pot in the M.E.


readytotaxi wrote:
remember the shoot-down by the USS Vincennes of Iran Air flight 655. I know tech has improved since then but hey. Can't see the Iranians doing it out front but by proxy may be


This reminds me so much of the things that were taken as 'truths" in 2002/2003.

BN747, Iran is stirring the pot? Specifically, how?

readytotaxi, you think Iran is going to shoot down an airliner? Don't you have that backwards? Or what exactly were you trying to say?
 
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Dutchy
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 7:08 pm

casinterest wrote:
Anyone ever seen the move : "Wag the Dog"?
Go watch it. That is all you need to know.


Brilliant movie, hopefully not a scenario for real life.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
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Aesma
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 7:58 pm

With NK having shot a few missiles the other day, and China not blinking, it's clear for all to see that Trump doesn't know what he's doing. If he's allowed to start a war with Iran, there is no way he will be the only one taking the blame for it. All those who let him do it, and led him to do it, will have to explain the clusterf*** it will be.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Spar
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 8:16 pm

Aesma wrote:
All those who let him do it, and led him to do it, will have to explain the clusterf*** it will be.

Nobody from the inside has taken responsibility or bothered to explain their individual reasoning for Iraq war (except for Bolton who still claims it was a good idea and was successful).

Those who let him do it, those who provide support for him doing it, will later just hush up and claim that they weren't really for it anyway.
 
winginit
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 8:26 pm

Wait... you mean to tell me that Republicans are drumming up questionable threats to fuel their historically unyielding appetite for war? Shocking, just shocking I tell you...
 
LAXBUR
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 8:38 pm

Sad day when I trust the Iranians before the current American administration.
 
BN747
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 10:24 pm

Spar wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Sure Iran is stirring the pot in the M.E.


readytotaxi wrote:
remember the shoot-down by the USS Vincennes of Iran Air flight 655. I know tech has improved since then but hey. Can't see the Iranians doing it out front but by proxy may be


This reminds me so much of the things that were taken as 'truths" in 2002/2003.

BN747, Iran is stirring the pot? Specifically, how?

readytotaxi, you think Iran is going to shoot down an airliner? Don't you have that backwards? Or what exactly were you trying to say?


What I mean is the old age reason for meddling in each other's affairs in the Region - the Shia vs the Sunni thing.

But more importantly as an American, is this comment...

LAXBUR wrote:
Sad day when I trust the Iranians before the current American administration.


That's where we Americans find ourselves now.

BN747
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DDR
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 10:37 pm

I just don't want to see an Iraqi war 2.0
In my opinion, that war was a mistake and resulted in hundreds of thousands of deaths (I'm including all the murders by ISIS because the war allowed them to take over large areas of territory). I just deep down do not believe that Iran is a threat to the west.
 
Spar
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 10:52 pm

BN747 wrote:
Sure Iran is stirring the pot in the M.E.

Spar wrote:
BN747, Iran is stirring the pot? Specifically, how?

BN747 wrote:
What I mean is the old age reason for meddling in each other's affairs in the Region - the Shia vs the Sunni thing.

There hasn't been any significant Sunni - Shia problems for many centuries. The current problems are being wholly created by Israel which has brought Saudi Arabia to believe they can depend on the US and Israeli militaries to cow Iran or to destroy Iran's military and isolate it economically; all Saudi Arabia has to do is end support for Palestinians and turn a blind eye to Zionist expansion.

The Shia dominance of Sunni's in Iraq have nothing to do with Iranian meddling, that is the direct result of the US war on the Sunni regime that used to rule Iraq.

The situation in Syria was also created by the US war which destroyed the Sunni infrastructure in Iraq and which bled over into Syria. Iran had nothing to do with that, in fact Iran is and has been on our side in that confrontation with the Sunni extremists. It is the US who opposes the longstanding government in Syria, not Iran.

The Houthu Saudi Arabian war in Yemen is also not anything brought about by Iran's actions, that is a direct result of Saudi Arabia's invasion of Yemen with US weapons and US military support. Saudi Arabia invaded Yemen because they want to change the centuries old political landscape of that local region.

Every facet of any current Sunni - Shia conflict is 100% of our making.

This is exactly how the public came to support the invasion of Iraq; people who should have known better chatted up imaginary factoids about Saddam and the Baathists until it became common knowledge that Saddam had nuclear weapons and was soon going to take over the middle east, exterminate all the Jews and then come after America.
 
BerenErchamion
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 11:01 pm

John Bolton is still angry that the Iranian people had the sheer unmitigated gall to support Mossadegh's party, making him PM. He sees an opportunity to punish them for that once again. It's not that he's too stupid to connect the dots between the US's past attempts to punish Iran for Mossadegh and the current despotic regime; it's just that he's wearing ideological blinders that make him unwilling to do so.

Donald Trump is a sociopath who is willing to sacrifice however many hundreds of thousands if not millions of lives (Iranian and US) it takes in order to create a distraction to protect himself.

Both of them will be safe in a bunker when the bombs start falling, so what do they care?
 
BerenErchamion
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 11:05 pm

Aesma wrote:
With NK having shot a few missiles the other day, and China not blinking, it's clear for all to see that Trump doesn't know what he's doing. If he's allowed to start a war with Iran, there is no way he will be the only one taking the blame for it. All those who let him do it, and led him to do it, will have to explain the clusterf*** it will be.


Everyone who voted for Trump--hell, everyone who had the opportunity to vote for Hillary Clinton but did not--will have the blood of every person who dies in this conflict on their hands.
 
BerenErchamion
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 11:06 pm

casinterest wrote:
Anyone ever seen the move : "Wag the Dog"?
Go watch it. That is all you need to know.


Remember when people thought it was about the three-day bombing campaign in Iraq during the Clinton administration?
 
LMP737
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 11:07 pm

Here's an interesting article regarding one the architects of the last Gulf War and is cheer leading the current crisis. This time though as National Security adviser which makes him even more dangerous.

https://taskandpurpose.com/john-bolton- ... =tp-buffer
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
NIKV69
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 11:27 pm

Bibi is going to wipe Iran off the map long before Trump does believe me.
Nikon from day one, Nikon till I die,
 
Spar
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Thu May 16, 2019 11:43 pm

BerenErchamion wrote:
Donald Trump is a sociopath who is willing to sacrifice however many hundreds of thousands if not millions of lives (Iranian and US) it takes in order to create a distraction to protect himself.

Anybody who wants to get it right should be wary of calling this Donald Trump's war, even if he does wind up launching it on his watch. This is still a PNAC war and it comes with the active support of the AIPAC apparatus as well.

Keep in mind that the Project for a New American Century had larger, further ranging plans than just Iraq. Iraq was just supposed to be the launch point of the war, the ultimate target was always Iran (and beyond) but the invasion of Iran had to be put off when the situation in Iraq turned sour. Had John McCain won the election in 2008 the invasion of Iraq was a sure thing and if Romney had won in 2012 it again would have been resurrected. The right wingers, spurred on by the Zionists have been waiting for their chance for over twenty years now (remember the PNAC plan was written long before 911).

Had some of the other Republican 2016 candidates won instead of Trump, we probably would have invaded Iran already by now. Trump is an isolationist at his core, we're only on the edge of war now because he has filled the current administration with a bunch of war hawks and he's having trouble keeping the lid on them.
 
BestWestern
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 1:13 am

NIKV69 wrote:
Bibi is going to wipe Iran off the map long before Trump does believe me.



Stop dreaming.
Iran will not be wiped off the map.
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BN747
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 1:18 am

NIKV69 wrote:
Bibi is going to wipe Iran off the map long before Trump does believe me.


Comments like this sounds like an overheard conversation of two children arguing over some tv WWF match...but it's spoken by a fully grown adult.
The naked, sheer brutal inhumanity of such a statement from a supposed fully developed mind is very disturbing.

Spar wrote:
BerenErchamion wrote:
Donald Trump is a sociopath who is willing to sacrifice however many hundreds of thousands if not millions of lives (Iranian and US) it takes in order to create a distraction to protect himself.

Anybody who wants to get it right should be wary of calling this Donald Trump's war, even if he does wind up launching it on his watch. This is still a PNAC war and it comes with the active support of the AIPAC apparatus as well.

Keep in mind that the Project for a New American Century had larger, further ranging plans than just Iraq. Iraq was just supposed to be the launch point of the war, the ultimate target was always Iran (and beyond) but the invasion of Iran had to be put off when the situation in Iraq turned sour. Had John McCain won the election in 2008 the invasion of Iraq was a sure thing and if Romney had won in 2012 it again would have been resurrected. The right wingers, spurred on by the Zionists have been waiting for their chance for over twenty years now (remember the PNAC plan was written long before 911).

Had some of the other Republican 2016 candidates won instead of Trump, we probably would have invaded Iran already by now. Trump is an isolationist at his core, we're only on the edge of war now because he has filled the current administration with a bunch of war hawks and he's having trouble keeping the lid on them.


Who says the PANC was ever a good idea.

It is the brain food for old fucks who are about to die any minute now setting off global fireworks for NO justifiable reason.

Look at Bolton - looks like the Grim Reaper in daylight,
Look at Brokahontas, corpulent, ignorant, easier to manipulate than 4 year old and in possession enough nukes the blow the world up 10X over ...

NEITHER man could physically beat a high school girl and both eager to send someoneelse's child to die - but nor their own.

...what's wrong with picture?


BN747
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Spar
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 3:03 am

BN747 wrote:
Who says the PANC was ever a good idea.
It's PNAC not PANC. And Benjamin Netanyahu and every other Zionist on the planet must think that the PNAC plan and the PNAC actions were, and still are, a good idea. So far the PNAC has caused war and upheaval in the region that has destroyed two Arab nations and in on the verge of embroiling Israel's dear friend the United States in another major war in the region that is sure to cripple the Persian nation.

The PNAC is no joke as you seem to think.
 
BN747
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 4:06 am

Spar wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Who says the PANC was ever a good idea.
It's PNAC not PANC. And Benjamin Netanyahu and every other Zionist on the planet must think that the PNAC plan and the PNAC actions were, and still are, a good idea. So far the PNAC has caused war and upheaval in the region that has destroyed two Arab nations and in on the verge of embroiling Israel's dear friend the United States in another major war in the region that is sure to cripple the Persian nation.

The PNAC is no joke as you seem to think.


No it isn't ...it's the bible of 21st century pirates.

BN747
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BN747
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 4:06 am

BN747 wrote:
Spar wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Who says the PANC was ever a good idea.
It's PNAC not PANC. And Benjamin Netanyahu and every other Zionist on the planet must think that the PNAC plan and the PNAC actions were, and still are, a good idea. So far the PNAC has caused war and upheaval in the region that has destroyed two Arab nations and in on the verge of embroiling Israel's dear friend the United States in another major war in the region that is sure to cripple the Persian nation.

The PNAC is no joke as you seem to think.


No it isn't ...it's the bible of 21st century political pirates.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 11:07 am

Spar wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Sure Iran is stirring the pot in the M.E.


readytotaxi wrote:
remember the shoot-down by the USS Vincennes of Iran Air flight 655. I know tech has improved since then but hey. Can't see the Iranians doing it out front but by proxy may be


This reminds me so much of the things that were taken as 'truths" in 2002/2003.

BN747, Iran is stirring the pot? Specifically, how?

readytotaxi, you think Iran is going to shoot down an airliner? Don't you have that backwards? Or what exactly were you trying to say?

Not suggesting Iran will shoot down a plane I was offering an example of how things can go wrong quickly. The Iranians will probably use a third party they sponsor to do anything threatening.
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
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Spar
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 11:22 am

readytotaxi wrote:
Not suggesting Iran will shoot down a plane I was offering an example of how things can go wrong quickly. The Iranians will probably use a third party they sponsor to do anything threatening.

You're using the example of irrational kneejerk application of deadly force by the Americans as the basis for predicting surreptitious activity by the victim of that irrational kneejerk action by the Americans?

That kind of logic makes sense to you?
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 11:54 am

It does.
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
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Spar
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 12:08 pm

You should win some kind of internet award for that bit of illogic.

I suppose that you think that recently beaten up wives should be investigated by the police in the belief that they are now predisposed to crime?
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 3:53 pm

Thank goodness we are all different and have different points of view on the same matter. A dull world it would be without you and me being able to express our opinions.
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
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seb146
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 4:22 pm

I don't understand how Iran is suddenly a threat. I do, but I don't see it as being started by Iran. There was an agreement between Iran and The West. Everything seemed to be going swimmingly until a certain orange golfer was installed in the White House. With zero proof whatsoever, he decided Iran was a threat.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Fri May 17, 2019 5:07 pm

You are correct, most of the heads of Europe agreed that Iran was sticking to the deal they signed up to.
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
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BN747
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sat May 18, 2019 12:44 am

seb146 wrote:
I don't understand how Iran is suddenly a threat. I do, but I don't see it as being started by Iran. There was an agreement between Iran and The West. Everything seemed to be going swimmingly until a certain orange golfer was installed in the White House. With zero proof whatsoever, he decided Iran was a threat.


It's because if ever there was a president who NEEDS a war....it is the Criminal-in-Chief calling the shots from 1600 Pennsylvania.

Barr can't save him and his trump Org, but a war might afford him a fighting chance to avoid jail, so they (the goose steeping Republicans) and Brokahontas have nothing to lose, nothing. They're kids are in danger? He knows MOST Americans don't want him////so, why not? Seriously, Adelson and pals wi;; 'donate' millions to his defense fund. Old school corruption at it's best.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
NIKV69
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sat May 18, 2019 1:31 am

BN747 wrote:
Comments like this sounds like an overheard conversation of two children arguing over some tv WWF match...but it's spoken by a fully grown adult.
The naked, sheer brutal inhumanity of such a statement from a supposed fully developed mind is very disturbing.





Yea I know Israel doesn't have the right to defend themselves. It's ok Sympathizing with terrorists isn't that becoming you know?
Nikon from day one, Nikon till I die,
 
mham001
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sat May 18, 2019 1:36 am

BerenErchamion wrote:
Aesma wrote:
With NK having shot a few missiles the other day, and China not blinking, it's clear for all to see that Trump doesn't know what he's doing. If he's allowed to start a war with Iran, there is no way he will be the only one taking the blame for it. All those who let him do it, and led him to do it, will have to explain the clusterf*** it will be.


Everyone who voted for Trump--hell, everyone who had the opportunity to vote for Hillary Clinton but did not--will have the blood of every person who dies in this conflict on their hands.


Hillary Clinton was far more of a war monger than Trump, all day long and smart people could recognize that. Remember Libya? You know, the most prosperous and liberal country in North Africa? And remember how we needed to "confront" Russia? How do you think that would have played out? Please don't try to revise history.
 
BN747
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sat May 18, 2019 1:53 am

NIKV69 wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Comments like this sounds like an overheard conversation of two children arguing over some tv WWF match...but it's spoken by a fully grown adult.
The naked, sheer brutal inhumanity of such a statement from a supposed fully developed mind is very disturbing.





Yea I know Israel doesn't have the right to defend themselves. It's ok Sympathizing with terrorists isn't that becoming you know?


Don't try to deflect the issue...you, a grown man 'g;eefully' called for the wiping out of a en entire nation. And spoke of it as it was throwing out the garbage.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
Ken777
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sat May 18, 2019 2:38 am

Bolton is, IMO, a war Freak and it looks like our SecState is dancing to the same tune.

Trump probably doesn't have the brains to understand that another was in the ME will be political suicide, even for a dirtbag like him with his 38% of idiots supporting him.

One can only hope that we will have an impeachment investigation over the next 15 or so months and that is sufficient to keep Trump out of the running. Might even end up with state level Indictments that Donny cannot Pardon and might even result in Prison time.
 
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seb146
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sat May 18, 2019 5:13 am

NIKV69 wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Comments like this sounds like an overheard conversation of two children arguing over some tv WWF match...but it's spoken by a fully grown adult.
The naked, sheer brutal inhumanity of such a statement from a supposed fully developed mind is very disturbing.





Yea I know Israel doesn't have the right to defend themselves. It's ok Sympathizing with terrorists isn't that becoming you know?


Deflect much, Nik? This is not, I repeat: NOT about Israel. YOUR orange god decided Iran is a threat. After Iran had played by the rules. After all our (former) allies told us Iran played by the rules. But, yeah, deflect to Israel. Who has nukes and plays the victim constantly and constantly uses weapons against Palestine who retaliated because Israel who retaliated because Palestine who retaliated because Israel who retaliated because Palestine who retaliated because Israel who retaliated because Palestine........................
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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johnboy
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sat May 18, 2019 7:13 am

mham001 wrote:

Hillary Clinton was far more of a war monger than Trump, all day long and smart people could recognize that. Remember Libya? You know, the most prosperous and liberal country in North Africa? And remember how we needed to "confront" Russia? How do you think that would have played out? Please don't try to revise history.


Will someone please inform this person who is president and who isn’t? There seems to be some latent confusion
 
kaitak
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sun May 19, 2019 1:18 am

[


Yea I know Israel doesn't have the right to defend themselves. It's ok Sympathizing with terrorists isn't that becoming you know?[/quote]

Deflect much, Nik? This is not, I repeat: NOT about Israel. YOUR orange god decided Iran is a threat. After Iran had played by the rules. After all our (former) allies told us Iran played by the rules. But, yeah, deflect to Israel. Who has nukes and plays the victim constantly and constantly uses weapons against Palestine who retaliated because Israel who retaliated because Palestine who retaliated because Israel who retaliated because Palestine who retaliated because Israel who retaliated because Palestine........................[/quote]

I think, at this stage, it's more about Bolton than Trump; from what I hear, Trump is trying to restrain Bolton and may recognise (a) that withdrawing from the Iran nuke deal was a mistake and (b) that he is being manipulated down a path to war by JB and other hawks. I don't think Trump wants a war; I think even he recognises that a war with Iran would escalate very quickly and even if it were ultimately winnable, it would be an extremely costly affair (far more than Iraq) and the aftermath (winning the peace) would be just as costly. Feedback from prospective allies would also have told him "you're on your own on this one, mate" (except, of course, for Israel, which is probably doing its damndest to push the US towards conflict with Iran).

That raises the question for me: is Bolton on borrowed time? Wishful thinking on my part, perhaps, but I sense a growing impatience on DT's part, with Bolton and his ilk.
 
alfa164
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sun May 19, 2019 1:42 am

kaitak wrote:
I think, at this stage, it's more about Bolton than Trump; from what I hear, Trump is trying to restrain Bolton and may recognise (a) that withdrawing from the Iran nuke deal was a mistake and (b) that he is being manipulated down a path to war by JB and other hawks. I don't think Trump wants a war; I think even he recognises that a war with Iran would escalate very quickly and even if it were ultimately winnable, it would be an extremely costly affair (far more than Iraq) and the aftermath (winning the peace) would be just as costly. Feedback from prospective allies would also have told him "you're on your own on this one, mate" (except, of course, for Israel, which is probably doing its damndest to push the US towards conflict with Iran). That raises the question for me: is Bolton on borrowed time? Wishful thinking on my part, perhaps, but I sense a growing impatience on DT's part, with Bolton and his ilk.


Everyone in the Trump White House is on borrowed time; they enter it that way, and are forced out as soon as the narcissist-in-chief gets tired of them - or until they can't put up with his tantrums anymore. And he always gets tired of anyone with any brains.

The real question is... will Bolton be gone before he gets a chance to get us into another ill-advised war-of-choice? Between him and Stephen Miller, I am not sure who is the bigger menace to society...
I'm going to have a smokin' hot body again!
I have decided to be cremated....
 
BN747
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sun May 19, 2019 3:03 am

alfa164 wrote:
kaitak wrote:
I think, at this stage, it's more about Bolton than Trump; from what I hear, Trump is trying to restrain Bolton and may recognise (a) that withdrawing from the Iran nuke deal was a mistake and (b) that he is being manipulated down a path to war by JB and other hawks. I don't think Trump wants a war; I think even he recognises that a war with Iran would escalate very quickly and even if it were ultimately winnable, it would be an extremely costly affair (far more than Iraq) and the aftermath (winning the peace) would be just as costly. Feedback from prospective allies would also have told him "you're on your own on this one, mate" (except, of course, for Israel, which is probably doing its damndest to push the US towards conflict with Iran). That raises the question for me: is Bolton on borrowed time? Wishful thinking on my part, perhaps, but I sense a growing impatience on DT's part, with Bolton and his ilk.


Everyone in the Trump White House is on borrowed time; they enter it that way, and are forced out as soon as the narcissist-in-chief gets tired of them - or until they can't put up with his tantrums anymore. And he always gets tired of anyone with any brains.

The real question is... will Bolton be gone before he gets a chance to get us into another ill-advised war-of-choice? Between him and Stephen Miller, I am not sure who is the bigger menace to society...


There's no limit on how many menaces are in that administration, but Brokahontas has a knack for finding them, much much better at that than his business skillzzzz.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
Spar
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sun May 19, 2019 12:42 pm

The Saudi's say they don't want a war, or so says the Minister of State for Foreign Affairs.

Saudi Arabia says it seeks to avert war, ball in Iran's court
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-saud ... SKCN1SP01C

I thought is was Ukraine that had government led by a comedian.
 
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Aesma
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sun May 19, 2019 3:20 pm

Well Saudi territory is far more likely to be attacked than US territory in a war with Iran, so it might be the truth.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
mham001
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sun May 19, 2019 4:10 pm

johnboy wrote:
mham001 wrote:

Hillary Clinton was far more of a war monger than Trump, all day long and smart people could recognize that. Remember Libya? You know, the most prosperous and liberal country in North Africa? And remember how we needed to "confront" Russia? How do you think that would have played out? Please don't try to revise history.


Will someone please inform this person who is president and who isn’t? There seems to be some latent confusion


That was a response to an apparently deleted post.
 
Spar
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Sun May 19, 2019 6:22 pm

Aesma wrote:
Well Saudi territory is far more likely to be attacked than US territory in a war with Iran, so it might be the truth.

True, however a war with Iran would be brought about by a coalition (Israel SA UAE and the US) attack on Iran, not an attack by Iran against Saudi Arabia.
 
LMP737
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Mon May 20, 2019 12:19 am

kaitak wrote:
I think, at this stage, it's more about Bolton than Trump; from what I hear, Trump is trying to restrain Bolton and may recognise (a) that withdrawing from the Iran nuke deal was a mistake and (b) that he is being manipulated down a path to war by JB and other hawks. I don't think Trump wants a war; I think even he recognises that a war with Iran would escalate very quickly and even if it were ultimately winnable, it would be an extremely costly affair (far more than Iraq) and the aftermath (winning the peace) would be just as costly. Feedback from prospective allies would also have told him "you're on your own on this one, mate" (except, of course, for Israel, which is probably doing its damndest to push the US towards conflict with Iran).

That raises the question for me: is Bolton on borrowed time? Wishful thinking on my part, perhaps, but I sense a growing impatience on DT's part, with Bolton and his ilk.


This is not an issue of Trump having to restrain Bolton. He's the president of the United States. He could fire him at any moment if he didn't like the direction this was all heading. It's Trump who decided to surround himself with war mongers like Bolton and Pompeo.

You can only come to two conclusions in this mess. Either Trump is fully on board with what's going on. Or he's asleep at the switch and is letting other people make life and death decisions and is nothing more than a rubber stamp. Which means he either doesn't have the intelligence or the courage to do what he thinks is right. I'm not sure which scenario is worse.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
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Jouhou
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Mon May 20, 2019 12:31 am

Has everyone forgotten that Congress authorizes war?

What they're trying to do is provoke Iran into starting a war, but a full-scale invasion is not possible without congress.

On that note, I'm worried. The next time we invade another country it needs to be by a government I can trust. That is not this one.
 
Spar
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Re: The Iran Threat Thread

Mon May 20, 2019 8:24 am

Jouhou wrote:
What they're trying to do is provoke Iran into starting a war, but a full-scale invasion is not possible without congress.

Under the war powers act, a president has 60 days to get US troops so deeply involved in a military action that Congress has no chance to put an immediate end to it. In practice, the mantra that would immediately come into play is "support the troops", as in if you don't support the troops you're some kind of monster and you should rot in hell.

Anyone who was paying attention saw this dynamic come into play even from the buildup for the 2003 invasion of Iraq. Any politician who wanted to remain in office had no choice other than to "support the troops" if they were up for re-election in 2004. It wasn't until after things had gone completely sour that politicians could speak out against the war policies; that didn't occur until after the 2006 election cycle.

The United States has been fighting wars of choice for the last 65 years and has gained absolutely nothing positive out of any of those wars; none of these wars have done anything to enhance the nation's security. We have severely crippled our economy and thrown away much national wealth. We have also alienated much of the positive opinion the peoples of the world held for the US after WWII. Yet the American populace remains eager for the next war.

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