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stl07
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House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Fri May 17, 2019 9:32 pm

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/pol ... 707673002/
Wow, at least on the surface, this looks like a huge win for equal American rights
Interesting how every thread is spammed with "bring back paid membership, there are too many spammers"
 
LittleFokker
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Fri May 17, 2019 10:12 pm

I'm sure McConnell will wipe his ass with it, as he has done with everything the House has passed so far this session.

Democrats should troll the GOP by passing some sort of quality sensible legislation, but giving it some rotten ass title like "Kill All the Mexicans Act" or "Babies Should Be Armed Act," just to see what matters more to the GOP - going for the worst legislative priorities possible or not letting the Democrats do anything positive for this country.
"All human activities are doomed to failure." - Jean Paul Sartre
 
Pi7472000
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Sat May 18, 2019 7:23 pm

LittleFokker wrote:
I'm sure McConnell will wipe his ass with it, as he has done with everything the House has passed so far this session.

Democrats should troll the GOP by passing some sort of quality sensible legislation, but giving it some rotten ass title like "Kill All the Mexicans Act" or "Babies Should Be Armed Act," just to see what matters more to the GOP - going for the worst legislative priorities possible or not letting the Democrats do anything positive for this country.


That is because Republicans live like it is 1519 instead of 2019. As much as they would love to live in a 1519 style theocracy this is the 21st century and religion/myths have zero place in our policies.
 
aviationaware
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Sun May 19, 2019 10:50 am

As long as that bill includes crazy ideas like this unscientific and self-defeating gender identity crap that allows men to go into ladies locker rooms, this will never pass the Senate. Of course the Democrats put everything into one bill intentionally so it bounces in the Senate and they can then proceed to claim that Republicans are homophobic and transphobic. The state of political discourse in this country is really shameful. Instead of just pushing the 95% that all can agree on, let's put some silly crap in to badmouth the other side!
 
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johnboy
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Sun May 19, 2019 9:54 pm

aviationaware wrote:
As long as that bill includes crazy ideas like this unscientific and self-defeating gender identity crap that allows men to go into ladies locker rooms, this will never pass the Senate. Of course the Democrats put everything into one bill intentionally so it bounces in the Senate and they can then proceed to claim that Republicans are homophobic and transphobic. The state of political discourse in this country is really shameful. Instead of just pushing the 95% that all can agree on, let's put some silly crap in to badmouth the other side!


So the gay is against gay rights.
Got it.
 
aviationaware
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Mon May 20, 2019 3:56 am

johnboy wrote:
aviationaware wrote:
As long as that bill includes crazy ideas like this unscientific and self-defeating gender identity crap that allows men to go into ladies locker rooms, this will never pass the Senate. Of course the Democrats put everything into one bill intentionally so it bounces in the Senate and they can then proceed to claim that Republicans are homophobic and transphobic. The state of political discourse in this country is really shameful. Instead of just pushing the 95% that all can agree on, let's put some silly crap in to badmouth the other side!


So the gay is against gay rights.
Got it.


So according to you a man going into a ladies bathroom is a gay rights issue. Got it.
 
MaverickM11
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Mon May 20, 2019 8:22 am

aviationaware wrote:
johnboy wrote:
aviationaware wrote:
As long as that bill includes crazy ideas like this unscientific and self-defeating gender identity crap that allows men to go into ladies locker rooms, this will never pass the Senate. Of course the Democrats put everything into one bill intentionally so it bounces in the Senate and they can then proceed to claim that Republicans are homophobic and transphobic. The state of political discourse in this country is really shameful. Instead of just pushing the 95% that all can agree on, let's put some silly crap in to badmouth the other side!


So the gay is against gay rights.
Got it.


So according to you a man going into a ladies bathroom is a gay rights issue. Got it.

LOL Republicans *are* transphobic and homophobic--more than ever now! They won't even let in their Log Cabin Chickens for Colonel Sanders into their own convention. You still trying to make that men-going-into-ladies-bathrooms trope happen? Did you soil yourself when Trump walked in on underage women changing at his pageant? Or is that just normal GOP behavior at this point?
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
aviationaware
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Mon May 20, 2019 8:58 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
They won't even let in their Log Cabin Chickens for Colonel Sanders into their own convention.


Yea Peter Thiel getting the most prominent speaking spot at the last RNC was definitely a sign of that. How do you stand your constant headache?
 
MaverickM11
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Mon May 20, 2019 10:34 am

aviationaware wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
They won't even let in their Log Cabin Chickens for Colonel Sanders into their own convention.


Yea Peter Thiel getting the most prominent speaking spot at the last RNC was definitely a sign of that. How do you stand your constant headache?

The Association of German National Jews supported Hitler too. Just because you found a useful idiot (libertarian) in Peter Thiel doesn't mean anything. You truly have to be broken in the head to think this GOP is anything but viciously anti LGBT. But hey an uber wealthy white guy has no problem throwing his compatriots under the bus so he can get a tax break, while also planning for an apocalypse by buying property for a bunker in New Zealand--New Zealand must be more libertarian/conservative than the USA. Or Peter Thiel is just a self serving lunatic. Or you could point to Aaron Schock, who has voted consistently against LGBT rights, while scamming government funds to decorate it like Downton Abbey, and then giving guys handjobs at Coachella--are we supposed to be proud of him too?
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
aviationaware
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Mon May 20, 2019 8:36 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
You truly have to be broken in the head to think this GOP is anything but viciously anti LGBT.


Yea I think you are right. Hey, Donald Trump is the first President openly supporting same sex marriage (since he was a candidate I might add, unlike others) and all, but what the heck - he hates gays! You know there is this fine line between having the same rights as everybody else (which you will find few who will disagree with that on either side) and giving some people extras like being able to go into bathrooms they don't belong to because they have some kind of mental disorder.

I have said it before and I will say it again, there are exactly two genders. Anything else is anti-scientific bullshit and any legislation budging to this belief is just as bad as hardcore religious legislation in medieval muslim countries.
 
stratclub
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Mon May 20, 2019 8:55 pm

Well, close. There are two sexes. By blurring common sense, it is come down to sexual behavioral disorders are now delegated to various "genders." People with gender identity disorder need to come to grips with the truth and accept that medical science cannot magically change someone from one sex to another.
 
Jetty
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 10:42 am

stratclub wrote:
Well, close. There are two sexes. By blurring common sense, it is come down to sexual behavioral disorders are now delegated to various "genders." People with gender identity disorder need to come to grips with the truth and accept that medical science cannot magically change someone from one sex to another.

While I agree people with ‘gender disorders’ just have atypical personalities without any medical condition, not everyone fits into either of the two sexes; being intersex is real and it would be good if the government recognized that. It comes in many former, but take Swyer Syndrome an an example, those persons have XY chromosomes yet Geneva genitalia. https://ghr.nlm.nih.gov/condition/swyer-syndrome
 
stratclub
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 1:46 pm

Jetty wrote:
stratclub wrote:
Well, close. There are two sexes. By blurring common sense, it is come down to sexual behavioral disorders are now delegated to various "genders." People with gender identity disorder need to come to grips with the truth and accept that medical science cannot magically change someone from one sex to another.

While I agree people with ‘gender disorders’ just have atypical personalities without any medical condition, not everyone fits into either of the two sexes; being intersex is real and it would be good if the government recognized that. It comes in many former, but take Swyer Syndrome an an example, those persons have XY chromosomes yet Geneva genitalia. https://ghr.nlm.nih.gov/condition/swyer-syndrome

1 in 80,000 people is pretty close to statistically insegnificant. Still, with X and Y chromazones the person would be male with a mutation on the chromazonal level.

Beyond that, the concept of Intersex is not totally agreed on by medical science. The term of "other" for sexual identity of intersex people because of chromazonal anomilies could be considered reasonable and should be protected by the equility act.

Gender identity is a construct of the mind and does not negate someones biological sex and is not something that can be "fixed." It's just that some people are different and IMHO, aceptance of a persons biological sex and acceptance of a persons gender identity by themselves and by society could lead to better outcomes than what medical science is doing now.
 
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seb146
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 2:01 pm

aviationaware wrote:
johnboy wrote:
aviationaware wrote:
As long as that bill includes crazy ideas like this unscientific and self-defeating gender identity crap that allows men to go into ladies locker rooms, this will never pass the Senate. Of course the Democrats put everything into one bill intentionally so it bounces in the Senate and they can then proceed to claim that Republicans are homophobic and transphobic. The state of political discourse in this country is really shameful. Instead of just pushing the 95% that all can agree on, let's put some silly crap in to badmouth the other side!


So the gay is against gay rights.
Got it.


So according to you a man going into a ladies bathroom is a gay rights issue. Got it.


Do you know any trans people? It does not sound like it. You also do not sound concerned at all with women going into the men's room.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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mbmbos
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 2:07 pm

aviationaware wrote:
As long as that bill includes crazy ideas like this unscientific and self-defeating gender identity crap that allows men to go into ladies locker rooms, this will never pass the Senate. Of course the Democrats put everything into one bill intentionally so it bounces in the Senate and they can then proceed to claim that Republicans are homophobic and transphobic. The state of political discourse in this country is really shameful. Instead of just pushing the 95% that all can agree on, let's put some silly crap in to badmouth the other side!


Such a sad and misinformed meme that has been making the rounds: supporting transgender identity is unscientific.

This is ignorant to say the least. Acceptance of transgender identity is acceptance of gender identification not genital identification. There's nothing unscientific about that and, in fact, psychological studies indicate vastly improved mental health and life success when transgender people are free to identify as they choose.

It's not about the crotch!
"If I don't manage to fly, someone else will. The spirit wants only for there to be flying. As for who happens to do it, in that he has only a passing interest."
- R.M. Rilke
 
Jetty
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 2:36 pm

mbmbos wrote:
This is ignorant to say the least. Acceptance of transgender identity is acceptance of gender identification not genital identification. There's nothing unscientific about that and, in fact, psychological studies indicate vastly improved mental health and life success when transgender people are free to identify as they choose.

I definitely believe the bold part, but that doesn't make it a medical condition. Peoples mental health and life succes can be improved by many factors that aren't rooted in a medical condition, including appearance unassociated to ones gender. If norms in society regarding behavior and appearance of men and women were different transgender people wouldn't find the need to change gender. Their 'condition' is rooted in personality and preferences outside the norms that society associates with their sex, that isn't a medical.
 
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mbmbos
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 3:51 pm

Jetty wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
This is ignorant to say the least. Acceptance of transgender identity is acceptance of gender identification not genital identification. There's nothing unscientific about that and, in fact, psychological studies indicate vastly improved mental health and life success when transgender people are free to identify as they choose.

I definitely believe the bold part, but that doesn't make it a medical condition. Peoples mental health and life succes can be improved by many factors that aren't rooted in a medical condition, including appearance unassociated to ones gender. If norms in society regarding behavior and appearance of men and women were different transgender people wouldn't find the need to change gender. Their 'condition' is rooted in personality and preferences outside the norms that society associates with their sex, that isn't a medical.



Who is making a "medical" argument? Not I. It appears the person I quoted is creating a straw man argument by claiming it isn't scientific. He is playing with semantics - i.e., sex versus gender. And again, recognizing someone's declared gender is not a science issue nor has anyone claimed it to be. I've seen this ridiculous argument being floated around while nobody promoting transgender rights is making it. It was most likely thought up by a right wing think tank as usual. I am addressing the logical fallacy here, not whether psychology research is "medical."
"If I don't manage to fly, someone else will. The spirit wants only for there to be flying. As for who happens to do it, in that he has only a passing interest."
- R.M. Rilke
 
luckyone
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 5:36 pm

aviationaware wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
You truly have to be broken in the head to think this GOP is anything but viciously anti LGBT.


Yea I think you are right. Hey, Donald Trump is the first President openly supporting same sex marriage (since he was a candidate I might add, unlike others) and all, but what the heck - he hates gays! You know there is this fine line between having the same rights as everybody else (which you will find few who will disagree with that on either side) and giving some people extras like being able to go into bathrooms they don't belong to because they have some kind of mental disorder.

I have said it before and I will say it again, there are exactly two genders. Anything else is anti-scientific bullshit and any legislation budging to this belief is just as bad as hardcore religious legislation in medieval muslim countries.

As a psychiatrist—read, someone who specializes in diagnosing and treating mental health conditions—your entire statement is factually incorrect. I cannot be more succinct than that. When you’ve completed medical school, a psychiatry residency, and have worked with these individuals, then you’re entitled to make a statement about them. Until then, such statements are obstructive and ignorant. I shouldn’t need to point out that similar statements were made about homosexuality within your lifetime.
Last edited by luckyone on Tue May 21, 2019 5:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
MSPNWA
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 5:39 pm

So stripping away rights from all to bestow new "rights" for the few is "equal". Thank goodness we only have check and balances.
 
luckyone
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 5:48 pm

Jetty wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
This is ignorant to say the least. Acceptance of transgender identity is acceptance of gender identification not genital identification. There's nothing unscientific about that and, in fact, psychological studies indicate vastly improved mental health and life success when transgender people are free to identify as they choose.

I definitely believe the bold part, but that doesn't make it a medical condition. Peoples mental health and life succes can be improved by many factors that aren't rooted in a medical condition, including appearance unassociated to ones gender. If norms in society regarding behavior and appearance of men and women were different transgender people wouldn't find the need to change gender. Their 'condition' is rooted in personality and preferences outside the norms that society associates with their sex, that isn't a medical.

Mental health is medicine. Psychiatrists are MDs or DOs. We go to medical school and complete Graduate Medical Education.
 
luckyone
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 5:56 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
So stripping away rights from all to bestow new "rights" for the few is "equal". Thank goodness we only have check and balances.

Whose rights are being restricted?
 
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mbmbos
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 6:00 pm

luckyone wrote:
Jetty wrote:
mbmbos wrote:
This is ignorant to say the least. Acceptance of transgender identity is acceptance of gender identification not genital identification. There's nothing unscientific about that and, in fact, psychological studies indicate vastly improved mental health and life success when transgender people are free to identify as they choose.

I definitely believe the bold part, but that doesn't make it a medical condition. Peoples mental health and life succes can be improved by many factors that aren't rooted in a medical condition, including appearance unassociated to ones gender. If norms in society regarding behavior and appearance of men and women were different transgender people wouldn't find the need to change gender. Their 'condition' is rooted in personality and preferences outside the norms that society associates with their sex, that isn't a medical.

Mental health is medicine. Psychiatrists are MDs or DOs. We go to medical school and complete Graduate Medical Education.


I wasn't even going to go there given how expansive - and silly - the original argument is. Thank you for stating this!
"If I don't manage to fly, someone else will. The spirit wants only for there to be flying. As for who happens to do it, in that he has only a passing interest."
- R.M. Rilke
 
luckyone
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 6:08 pm

mbmbos wrote:
luckyone wrote:
Jetty wrote:
I definitely believe the bold part, but that doesn't make it a medical condition. Peoples mental health and life succes can be improved by many factors that aren't rooted in a medical condition, including appearance unassociated to ones gender. If norms in society regarding behavior and appearance of men and women were different transgender people wouldn't find the need to change gender. Their 'condition' is rooted in personality and preferences outside the norms that society associates with their sex, that isn't a medical.

Mental health is medicine. Psychiatrists are MDs or DOs. We go to medical school and complete Graduate Medical Education.


I wasn't even going to go there given how expansive - and silly - the original argument is. Thank you for stating this!

I’ll add that we are required to pass the exact same medical licensure tests (and there are four of them) as any other medical doctor.
 
Pyrex
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 6:42 pm

Auto-mutilation takes multiple forms. In my time, if a teenager cut themselves they would be given the psychiatric treatment they needed until they stopped doing it. I wonder if in this day and age a psychiatrist would just lose their license for even suggesting a person shouldn't be entitled to permanently disfigure themselves like that.
Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
 
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mbmbos
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 6:47 pm

Pyrex wrote:
Auto-mutilation takes multiple forms. In my time, if a teenager cut themselves they would be given the psychiatric treatment they needed until they stopped doing it. I wonder if in this day and age a psychiatrist would just lose their license for even suggesting a person shouldn't be entitled to permanently disfigure themselves like that.


Huh? What does "auto-mutilation" have to do with this conversation? Are you talking about gender affirmation surgery? You realize, don't you, that many transgender people do not seek said surgery? You realize, don't you, gender identity has much more to do with personal identity than it has to do with their crotches? Are you stuck on genetalia?
"If I don't manage to fly, someone else will. The spirit wants only for there to be flying. As for who happens to do it, in that he has only a passing interest."
- R.M. Rilke
 
Jetty
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 10:12 pm

mbmbos wrote:
Who is making a "medical" argument? Not I. It appears the person I quoted is creating a straw man argument by claiming it isn't scientific. He is playing with semantics - i.e., sex versus gender.

Tons of people, it is even added to the DSM, and recognized as such to justify gender transition of children i.e., even when they aren't deemed old enough to get something simple as a tattoo.

And again, recognizing someone's declared gender is not a science issue nor has anyone claimed it to be.

Government databases should be based on facts, not desired identities. I know people who like to be 5 years younger and would pretend to be if they were allowed to legally change their age, people that are married but like to be registered as single. None of them get their way despite it would make them happy because it isn't rooted in facts. The exception made for sex is based on supposed scientific proof of a condition where people are born in the wrong body. Personally I take no issue with any gender identification by the way, I'm not bothered and will respect someone's choice as to how he/she wishes to identify.

And again, recognizing someone's declared gender is not a science issue nor has anyone claimed it to be. I've seen this ridiculous argument being floated around while nobody promoting transgender rights is making it. It was most likely thought up by a right wing think tank as usual. I am addressing the logical fallacy here, not whether psychology research is "medical."

The government should recognize facts, not self-chosen identities. Not because there's something wrong with a person choosing their own identity, but because it isn't relevant for the government.

luckyone wrote:
Mental health is medicine. Psychiatrists are MDs or DOs. We go to medical school and complete Graduate Medical Education.

Of course it is, but that doesn't mean the government should recognize/register everything that can affect mental health.
 
luckyone
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 11:08 pm

Pyrex wrote:
Auto-mutilation takes multiple forms. In my time, if a teenager cut themselves they would be given the psychiatric treatment they needed until they stopped doing it. I wonder if in this day and age a psychiatrist would just lose their license for even suggesting a person shouldn't be entitled to permanently disfigure themselves like that.

False equivalency. Are you aware of what is required for people to pursue reassignment surgery? As we still treat cutting...
 
aviationaware
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Tue May 21, 2019 11:12 pm

mbmbos wrote:
It's not about the crotch!


Yes it is. You can get an operation and get a change down there if you are really one of the very few unlucky people, and then get a legal change as well. You're welcome to use the ladies room then. Until that time, get the fuck out of there.
 
TTailedTiger
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 2:01 am

aviationaware wrote:
As long as that bill includes crazy ideas like this unscientific and self-defeating gender identity crap that allows men to go into ladies locker rooms, this will never pass the Senate. Of course the Democrats put everything into one bill intentionally so it bounces in the Senate and they can then proceed to claim that Republicans are homophobic and transphobic. The state of political discourse in this country is really shameful. Instead of just pushing the 95% that all can agree on, let's put some silly crap in to badmouth the other side!


Agreed. A buddy of mine is gay and can't stand transgender people trying to piggyback onto the LGB community. Being transgender has nothing to do with sexual preference in a partner.
 
MaverickM11
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 2:02 am

luckyone wrote:
aviationaware wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
You truly have to be broken in the head to think this GOP is anything but viciously anti LGBT.


Yea I think you are right. Hey, Donald Trump is the first President openly supporting same sex marriage (since he was a candidate I might add, unlike others) and all, but what the heck - he hates gays! You know there is this fine line between having the same rights as everybody else (which you will find few who will disagree with that on either side) and giving some people extras like being able to go into bathrooms they don't belong to because they have some kind of mental disorder.

I have said it before and I will say it again, there are exactly two genders. Anything else is anti-scientific bullshit and any legislation budging to this belief is just as bad as hardcore religious legislation in medieval muslim countries.

As a psychiatrist—read, someone who specializes in diagnosing and treating mental health conditions—your entire statement is factually incorrect. I cannot be more succinct than that. When you’ve completed medical school, a psychiatry residency, and have worked with these individuals, then you’re entitled to make a statement about them. Until then, such statements are obstructive and ignorant. I shouldn’t need to point out that similar statements were made about homosexuality within your lifetime.

You’re trying to reason with someone who would be outsmarted by a pigeon with lead poisoning
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
MaverickM11
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 2:18 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
aviationaware wrote:
As long as that bill includes crazy ideas like this unscientific and self-defeating gender identity crap that allows men to go into ladies locker rooms, this will never pass the Senate. Of course the Democrats put everything into one bill intentionally so it bounces in the Senate and they can then proceed to claim that Republicans are homophobic and transphobic. The state of political discourse in this country is really shameful. Instead of just pushing the 95% that all can agree on, let's put some silly crap in to badmouth the other side!


Agreed. A buddy of mine is gay and can't stand transgender people trying to piggyback onto the LGB community. Being transgender has nothing to do with sexual preference in a partner.

Sounds like a swell guy—as long as he gets his, everyone else can eat dirt.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
TTailedTiger
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 2:22 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
aviationaware wrote:
As long as that bill includes crazy ideas like this unscientific and self-defeating gender identity crap that allows men to go into ladies locker rooms, this will never pass the Senate. Of course the Democrats put everything into one bill intentionally so it bounces in the Senate and they can then proceed to claim that Republicans are homophobic and transphobic. The state of political discourse in this country is really shameful. Instead of just pushing the 95% that all can agree on, let's put some silly crap in to badmouth the other side!


Agreed. A buddy of mine is gay and can't stand transgender people trying to piggyback onto the LGB community. Being transgender has nothing to do with sexual preference in a partner.

Sounds like a swell guy—as long as he gets his, everyone else can eat dirt.


So what sort of commonality is there between a gay person and a trans person?
 
luckyone
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 2:25 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:

Agreed. A buddy of mine is gay and can't stand transgender people trying to piggyback onto the LGB community. Being transgender has nothing to do with sexual preference in a partner.

Sounds like a swell guy—as long as he gets his, everyone else can eat dirt.


So what sort of commonality is there between a gay person and a trans person?

Both groups are subject to poor treatment by misinformed and ignorant individuals...many if whom act as if they are obliged to do so, and quite a few of those become upset when asked to provide the same rights to other people they demand for themselves.
 
TTailedTiger
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 2:37 am

luckyone wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Sounds like a swell guy—as long as he gets his, everyone else can eat dirt.


So what sort of commonality is there between a gay person and a trans person?

Both groups are subject to poor treatment by misinformed and ignorant individuals...many if whom act as if they are obliged to do so, and quite a few of those become upset when asked to provide the same rights to other people they demand for themselves.


But could say those same things about racial minorities, religious minorities, women, etc. Why hijack the LGB community after they had made such great strides toward equality? Trans people have set them back.
 
LittleFokker
Posts: 1123
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 10:25 pm

Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 4:17 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
But could say those same things about racial minorities, religious minorities, women, etc. Why hijack the LGB community after they had made such great strides toward equality? Trans people have set them back.


Why do gay people deserve equality but not trans people? Equality for all means equality for all.
"All human activities are doomed to failure." - Jean Paul Sartre
 
TTailedTiger
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Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2018 5:19 am

Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 4:34 am

LittleFokker wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
But could say those same things about racial minorities, religious minorities, women, etc. Why hijack the LGB community after they had made such great strides toward equality? Trans people have set them back.


Why do gay people deserve equality but not trans people? Equality for all means equality for all.


Who said they didn't deserve equality? I'm saying they are a very unique group and shouldn't be included in the LGB community. They should have gone it on their own like everyone else who fought for equal rights.
 
bgm
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 6:24 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
LittleFokker wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
But could say those same things about racial minorities, religious minorities, women, etc. Why hijack the LGB community after they had made such great strides toward equality? Trans people have set them back.


Why do gay people deserve equality but not trans people? Equality for all means equality for all.


Who said they didn't deserve equality? I'm saying they are a very unique group and shouldn't be included in the LGB community. They should have gone it on their own like everyone else who fought for equal rights.


Who the hell are you to decide who should and should not be a part of any community. How about you mind your own damn business and let others be? There's a novel idea! :sarcastic:

LGB and T are intertwined. You assume that a transgendered person will be heterosexual? Maybe, maybe not. The issue is persecution due to ignorance by people like yourself and aviationaware
Last edited by bgm on Wed May 22, 2019 6:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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bgm
Posts: 2135
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:37 am

Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 6:31 am

aviationaware wrote:
Yes it is. You can get an operation and get a change down there if you are really one of the very few unlucky people, and then get a legal change as well. You're welcome to use the ladies room then. Until that time, get the fuck out of there.


So do you go around inspecting peoples' genitals in the restrooms then? Here's a newsflash for ya: you've more than likely shared the men's room with transgendered people and you haven't even realized it. Why? Because they're not the stereotypical big burly men in flowery dresses as you seem to ignorantly believe.
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TTailedTiger
Posts: 1339
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 6:51 am

bgm wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
LittleFokker wrote:

Why do gay people deserve equality but not trans people? Equality for all means equality for all.


Who said they didn't deserve equality? I'm saying they are a very unique group and shouldn't be included in the LGB community. They should have gone it on their own like everyone else who fought for equal rights.


Who the hell are you to decide who should and should not be a part of any community. How about you mind your own damn business and let others be? There's a novel idea! :sarcastic:

LGB and T are intertwined. You assume that a transgendered person will be heterosexual? Maybe, maybe not. The issue is persecution due to ignorance by people like yourself and aviationaware


Wouldn't a gay male who transitions to female be straight?
 
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scbriml
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 7:03 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
Wouldn't a gay male who transitions to female be straight?


What about a non-gay male who transitions to a gay female, or vv? :spin:

When you're in a hole, stop digging.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
TTailedTiger
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Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 7:05 am

scbriml wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
Wouldn't a gay male who transitions to female be straight?


What about a non-gay male who transitions to a gay female, or vv? :spin:

When you're in a hole, stop digging.


My point is no less valid than yours.
 
bgm
Posts: 2135
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:37 am

Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 7:42 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
Wouldn't a gay male who transitions to female be straight?


But what if she was attracted to women? Or men? Or both?

See where this is going?

TTailedTiger wrote:
scbriml wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
Wouldn't a gay male who transitions to female be straight?


What about a non-gay male who transitions to a gay female, or vv? :spin:

When you're in a hole, stop digging.


My point is no less valid than yours.


Oh but it is. You’re the one questioning who is ‘allowed’ to be part of the LGB community. So, how do you define a person’s sexuality? It all depends on whether or not you recognise the individual’s birth gender or their current gender and that can determine (in your eyes at least) if that’s a heterosexual or homosexual relationship.

Is the penny starting to drop now? God I hope so or am I going to have to draw you diagrams? :rotfl:
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aviationaware
Posts: 2812
Joined: Mon May 19, 2014 12:02 pm

Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 10:22 am

bgm wrote:
aviationaware wrote:
Yes it is. You can get an operation and get a change down there if you are really one of the very few unlucky people, and then get a legal change as well. You're welcome to use the ladies room then. Until that time, get the fuck out of there.


So do you go around inspecting peoples' genitals in the restrooms then? Here's a newsflash for ya: you've more than likely shared the men's room with transgendered people and you haven't even realized it. Why? Because they're not the stereotypical big burly men in flowery dresses as you seem to ignorantly believe.


See? And nobody noticed. Thanks for reinforcing my argument. Nobody, literally nobody cares what bathroom real transgender people use. The issue is, if you pass a law allowing men who identify as women to go into the ladies room, any man can do that. Legally. You're a 6ft4 300lb hairy dude who wants to stalk some women? Just identify as a women today, you're welcome! Thanks Democrats!

The thing is, all these laws supposedly promoting equality really do the opposite. True equality of opportunity can't be forced by law.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 17494
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 11:15 am

aviationaware wrote:
bgm wrote:
aviationaware wrote:
Yes it is. You can get an operation and get a change down there if you are really one of the very few unlucky people, and then get a legal change as well. You're welcome to use the ladies room then. Until that time, get the fuck out of there.


So do you go around inspecting peoples' genitals in the restrooms then? Here's a newsflash for ya: you've more than likely shared the men's room with transgendered people and you haven't even realized it. Why? Because they're not the stereotypical big burly men in flowery dresses as you seem to ignorantly believe.


See? And nobody noticed. Thanks for reinforcing my argument. Nobody, literally nobody cares what bathroom real transgender people use. The issue is, if you pass a law allowing men who identify as women to go into the ladies room, any man can do that. Legally. You're a 6ft4 300lb hairy dude who wants to stalk some women? Just identify as a women today, you're welcome! Thanks Democrats!

Even the dumbest republicans have given up on that trope since they know a) that's not what happens and b) that's not what anyone is asking for, so unless you want to ensure everyone on this site knows you have the brainpower of a bivalve, you might want to pick a different argument. Spoilers! You won't. :roll:

TTailedTiger wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:

Agreed. A buddy of mine is gay and can't stand transgender people trying to piggyback onto the LGB community. Being transgender has nothing to do with sexual preference in a partner.

Sounds like a swell guy—as long as he gets his, everyone else can eat dirt.


So what sort of commonality is there between a gay person and a trans person?

Human? Minority? Oppressed? Take your pick. I don't think the transgendered folk at Stonewall thought about whether or not they were part of the "LGB" group. Many of them have blazed trails so that straight acting masc gays can take baby steps decades later.
Last edited by MaverickM11 on Wed May 22, 2019 11:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
aviationaware
Posts: 2812
Joined: Mon May 19, 2014 12:02 pm

Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 11:21 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
Even the dumbest republicans have given up on that trope since they know a) that's not what happens and b) that's not what anyone is asking for, so unless you want to ensure everyone on this site knows you have the brainpower of a bivalve, you might want to pick a different argument. Spoilers! You won't. :roll:


Look, I'm just telling you what your silly "Let's regulate every corner of society" mind games would lead to. If you aren't prepared to deal with that kind of argument and only interested in being reassured that your idea is brilliant, I guess reddit would be a good place to start.
 
bgm
Posts: 2135
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:37 am

Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 2:30 pm

aviationaware wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Even the dumbest republicans have given up on that trope since they know a) that's not what happens and b) that's not what anyone is asking for, so unless you want to ensure everyone on this site knows you have the brainpower of a bivalve, you might want to pick a different argument. Spoilers! You won't. :roll:


Look, I'm just telling you what your silly "Let's regulate every corner of society" mind games would lead to. If you aren't prepared to deal with that kind of argument and only interested in being reassured that your idea is brilliant, I guess reddit would be a good place to start.


The "need for regulation" is simply because these people have been targeted and abused by society.

Do you think Jewish people need protection from antisemitic behavior?
Do you think black people need protection from racist behavior?
Do you think gay people need protection from homophobic behavior?

If you answer no to any of those then you are clearly beyond help. Self-loathing but be strong in your head.
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aviationaware
Posts: 2812
Joined: Mon May 19, 2014 12:02 pm

Re: House approves Equality Act, sweeping bill to expand gay rights

Wed May 22, 2019 8:34 pm

bgm wrote:

The "need for regulation" is simply because these people have been targeted and abused by society.

Do you think Jewish people need protection from antisemitic behavior?
Do you think black people need protection from racist behavior?
Do you think gay people need protection from homophobic behavior?

If you answer no to any of those then you are clearly beyond help. Self-loathing but be strong in your head.


Certainly, but not by law. The law's purpose is to level the playing field, so as long as everyone is treated equally by the law that must surely be good enough. This kind of change has to be made in people's heads, and pushing societal change upon them by force of law is not a good way to achieve that, at all. Less so if the changes are so sweeping and radical. Why not try one at a time?

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