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Braybuddy
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Forum debate: toning it down

Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:46 am

Not a bad idea at all, fair play to the guy. Could it work on here or is it too late?
https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-48579597
 
tommy1808
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Re: Forum debate: toning it down

Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:28 am

In a world in which many people believe that there is such thing as an "alternative fact" or "alternative theory" the idea absolutely breaks down...

best regards
Thomas
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casinterest
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Re: Forum debate: toning it down

Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:32 pm

Braybuddy wrote:
Not a bad idea at all, fair play to the guy. Could it work on here or is it too late?
https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-48579597


Theirs is a separate platform. It would not work on here, because the owners of this site would have to make big changes to the way threads are presented. Perhaps some day it will come. So many of these threads have subthreads that it would be hard to even evoke a "quality answer" button to the threads. At the end of the day, I think when many threads die out, the discussion has run it's course, and those with particular points of view walk away with an idea changed or not.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
vikkyvik
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Re: Forum debate: toning it down

Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:52 pm

I don't know why anyone is surprised that online debate sounds the way it does.

Hundreds/thousands/millions of people who will likely never meet, never interact in any meaningful way, have their own ideas/influences/views that they think are correct, and can always cover for more extreme statements by saying "I was just joking/trolling/being provocative", and we expect them to interact calmly, respectfully, and with an open mind?

I look at people who "debate" (read: argue and insult) on Facebook (or on A.net) and just laugh.

Sure, we can try and fix it, or we can just wait till people realize how stupid it is and either 1.) adopt a better style of online debate, or 2.) debate in-person.
I'm watching Jeopardy. The category is worst Madonna songs. "This one from 1987 is terrible".
 
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Tugger
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Re: Forum debate: toning it down

Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:56 pm

And sadly, just wait until the bots get good enough to just do it on their own.

Trolls in troll factories (like IRA) are bad enough, but when persistent 24/7 never tiring of spewing bullsh!t AI constructs begin going back and forth between themselves and heaping upon hapless humans who don't know better, it will be a ridiculous pathetic mess.

Tugg
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Braybuddy
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Re: Forum debate: toning it down

Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:29 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
In a world in which many people believe that there is such thing as an "alternative fact" or "alternative theory" the idea absolutely breaks down...

best regards
Thomas

I suppose that's where reasoned debate and explaining can win the day, but, as we've seen again time and time again on here, threads tend to descend into rancour and insults. I looked at the site, and if you have a strong opinion on something you go into great detail why you hold such an opinion, without resorting to cheap shots or bickering. OCCASIONALLY you'll get a discussion thread on this site which is much more level-headed that the political threads, and it's a treat to find.

vikkyvik wrote:
Hundreds/thousands/millions of people who will likely never meet, never interact in any meaningful way, have their own ideas/influences/views that they think are correct, and can always cover for more extreme statements by saying "I was just joking/trolling/being provocative", and we expect them to interact calmly, respectfully, and with an open mind?

I look at people who "debate" (read: argue and insult) on Facebook (or on A.net) and just laugh.

I think that's the problem with arguing/debating online. You don't know the other person, apart from their opinion on something, so you like or dislike them immediately on one or two lines. Put those two in a room together discussing the same subject and their interaction would be completely different. I read recently (maybe last year) about a situation where some US conservatives and liberals found themselves thrown together for some reason -- accidentally of course. After their time together they found they actually got on quite well, and most even liked each other as individuals.
 
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trpmb6
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Re: Forum debate: toning it down

Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:52 pm

The problem has less to do with the presentation and execution of intellectual debate and more to do with the introduction and mismanagement of ideologues with little to no desire to engage in the debate in good faith and resort to the use of childish insults and tirades.

We often have great conversations and discussions on this forum, and others, where I've walked away with a modified or changed view. Other times I've held to my convictions. At the heart of the issue is engaging in a respectful manner. Sounds silly to have to even type such a thing to be honest. Can't tell you how many threads I choose to just simply ignore or don't even bother clicking on when I see the name of certain users under it. There are a few I simply avoid because I know they have no interest in having a decent conversation about the article or viewpoint they're bringing up. Instead it's a tirade laden with insults. You'll never win someone over if your first step is to insult them in some form.

Another key thing to do is check emotion at the door. Emotionally charged discussions are often the first ones to devolve into a mud slinging contest.

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