BN747
Posts: 6542
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:48 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Sun Aug 04, 2019 10:15 pm

bennett123 wrote:
Thoughts and prayers.

Rinse and repeat.


So, as in our exchange in the Miss. Gubernatorial thread - do see the fight against change here?

Do you make the connection between supporter/enabler connection.

I've fired everything from a .38 to a grenade launcher and the old M60 machine gun. I know the 2nd Amendment.

These people losing their lives because insane gun nuts and their enablers are on the same page.
....except the shooters go one step further and execute their thoughts, the enablers just hold up their rights to do it.



Change...it's bitch, but a bitch worth fighting for.

Again, how many must pay the price with their lives so people be happy with as many guns they get their grubby hands on?
Yeah, I'll be a victim of increased gun laws (although the 2nd Amendment says 'no'), I'll willing to give up some rights to save lives.

More telling would the guy who loves shooting up shit...agreeing to do the same - he's really gonna hurt.
But if some slam-the-door laws appear, watch how mad they become..but what the mass kilings decline.


BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Sun Aug 04, 2019 10:18 pm

scbriml wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
I’m still struggling to see how it’s preferable to pass sweeping legislation before the facts are in. That’s an odd way to govern.


So what's the threshold number of mass shootings when it becomes OK to do something rather than play the same old BS "Let's not rush" card? I'm just curious. Is 250 this year alone not enough?

It’s fine if they want to pass something because of the overall problem if whatever they are doing is well researched. Maybe they should have a while ago.

It’s absurd to pass something because of a single incident without even knowing the facts. That’s bad governance, plain and simple.

It’s the latter that was advocated for.
 
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Jouhou
Posts: 1965
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Sun Aug 04, 2019 10:47 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
The Senate should not rush to judgment. Just the opposite. They should get the facts first. And how interesting that you neglected to mention the House, which by your definition is also “absent at the wheel.”

Your President has tweeted numerous times, which is in keeping with modern times.

There is a lot to be offended about over these shootings. But these are not nearly the highest on the list. Not even close. If you feel some sense of personal satisfaction when a mass shooter turns out to have certain racial, political, gender, or religious characteristics, you need to reassess.

Politicizing these incidents helps nobody. This is a time for unity, not polarization.


Dayton shooter was a registered democrat, I doubt with that information out there won't be political spin on it. I kind of realized he was on the political left when I saw he was wearing an Acacia Strain hoodie.

For the unfamiliar, I think the hoodie he chose to wear was his suicide note. Just randomly look at some Acacia Strain lyrics. They have a general theme of "there's no hope for this world, I'm gonna kill myself and I'm taking you with me". I doubt the band is what inspired his spree, but I bet he felt the lyrics expressed how he felt.

Random Acacia Strain song, first thing I grabbed off youtube: https://youtu.be/VkZ8IZSnmmU lyrics fit that theme.

Edit to add link to article about the band's response https://loudwire.com/ohio-shooter-acaci ... weatshirt/

The lyrics for the song on the hoodie also have the above mentioned theme.
 
Concierge
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Sun Aug 04, 2019 10:54 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
scbriml wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
I’m still struggling to see how it’s preferable to pass sweeping legislation before the facts are in. That’s an odd way to govern.


So what's the threshold number of mass shootings when it becomes OK to do something rather than play the same old BS "Let's not rush" card? I'm just curious. Is 250 this year alone not enough?

It’s fine if they want to pass something because of the overall problem if whatever they are doing is well researched. Maybe they should have a while ago.

It’s absurd to pass something because of a single incident without even knowing the facts. That’s bad governance, plain and simple.

It’s the latter that was advocated for.


The facts are in. The house has passed universal background checks. For me the clock started ticking after Sandy Hook. Three mas s killings in eight days. It's well past time to act.
 
LH658
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Sun Aug 04, 2019 11:10 pm

Y'all over react about BA operating to place like ISB, though killing of any human cause of intolerance is inhumane whether it, a bombing, shooting, and etc. Though time for Hollywood to make movies about white kids growing up in the suburban America with radical ideology, and carrying out shootings, versus making movies/tv shows about Muslims and brown folks. I am sure if they were brown, black, muslim, or other backgrounds people would go crazy right now.

America has a serious problem, and needs tighter control on guns, but NRA won't budge with that.

So many mass shootings movie theaters, marathons, educational institutions, religious houses, government buildings, public spaces, malls, and etc.
 
Concierge
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Sun Aug 04, 2019 11:24 pm

'Dayton shooter was a registered democrat, I doubt with that information out there won't be political spin on it. I kind of realized he was on the political left when I saw he was wearing an Acacia Strain hoodie'.

Ohio is an open-primary state. No one there registers as a Democrat or a Republican. Please correct the source that delivered that incorrect information.

I don't know how you associate Metal Core music with what you call 'the left'. These bands are anarchic - the agenda of the left is no more meaningful to them than that of the right.
 
stratosphere
Posts: 1672
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Sun Aug 04, 2019 11:46 pm

Concierge wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
scbriml wrote:

So what's the threshold number of mass shootings when it becomes OK to do something rather than play the same old BS "Let's not rush" card? I'm just curious. Is 250 this year alone not enough?

It’s fine if they want to pass something because of the overall problem if whatever they are doing is well researched. Maybe they should have a while ago.

It’s absurd to pass something because of a single incident without even knowing the facts. That’s bad governance, plain and simple.

It’s the latter that was advocated for.


The facts are in. The house has passed universal background checks. For me the clock started ticking after Sandy Hook. Three mas s killings in eight days. It's well past time to act.


We already have background checks and the shooters in both California garlic fest and the Dayton OH shootings bought their guns legally and the Dayton shooter had a high capacity mag that was illegal and that didn't stop him. People that are hell bent on doing something will do it regardless of laws. We see that gun free zones are real effective *rolls eyes*. I am a gun owner and have a carry permit but I have no problem with reigning in AK and AR type weapons but like I said we have so many now on the streets I don't know any laws that will stop the truly determined. Maybe we need to look very close at social media the latest shooters are young white men need to start flagging the hate speech mongers.
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Sun Aug 04, 2019 11:57 pm

It seems our far leftist "friends" are blaming the first amendment instead of blaming guns or white supremacy. Not surprising but still very disappointing.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
Concierge
Posts: 44
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:13 am

[/quote]We already have background checks and the shooters in both California garlic fest and the Dayton OH shootings bought their guns legally and the Dayton shooter had a high capacity mag that was illegal and that didn't stop him. People that are hell bent on doing something will do it regardless of laws. We see that gun free zones are real effective *rolls eyes*. I am a gun owner and have a carry permit but I have no problem with reigning in AK and AR type weapons but like I said we have so many now on the streets I don't know any laws that will stop the truly determined. Maybe we need to look very close at social media the latest shooters are young white men need to start flagging the hate speech mongers.[/quote]

We don't have universal background checks, and they are among the only points of agreement when it comes to gun control. The conversation has to start somewhere, so why not at a place of agreement?

There's no clear definition of a gun free zone, so the statistics on mass shootings in those zones range from 85% to 10% and there are various agendas at work.

Here's where I roll my eyes.
 
Spar
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:15 am

stratosphere wrote:
like I said we have so many now on the streets I don't know any laws that will stop the truly determined.

That's no argument against making military weapons illegal. Half of them at least would be gone right away, surrendered by law abiding people. Another half would be gone in six months when the fact that criminal prosecution awaits those hiding these weapons sinks in. The remaining quarter would be nibbled away at by the apprehension of criminal types and gun owners dying off.

There would of course be a number of them hidden and secured away from the police and they would continue to be out there for a hundred years; but these weapons would pose little risk because they would be well hidden and would be unlikely to ever see the light of day (or night).

In a short time the cultural perception of these weapons would change and nobody would want to brag about owning one of them. They would become a pain in the ass to own and to have to keep hidden.

The important result would be an immediate drop in gun deaths and that reduction would be permanent. A side benefit would be that idiots who would be caught with them would be taken off the streets, hopefully for long stretches.
 
seb146
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:20 am

Super80Fan wrote:
It seems our far leftist "friends" are blaming the first amendment instead of blaming guns or white supremacy. Not surprising but still very disappointing.


And the right is using debunked propaganda of video games to support continued mass shootings. How many mass shootings have there been in video game obsessed Japan? Or Europe where they have video games? Or Australia where they have video games? Or Canada?

White supremacy and ease of access to guns caused these shootings. What is so hard to understand about that? What is truly disappointing is the Republicans who claim to love life and every life is sacred and all lives matter don't care about life when guns are involved.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
Concierge
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:21 am

Super80Fan wrote:
It seems our far leftist "friends" are blaming the first amendment instead of blaming guns or white supremacy. Not surprising but still very disappointing.


Far leftists such as Trump who refuses to denounce white supremacists?
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:24 am

seb146 wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
It seems our far leftist "friends" are blaming the first amendment instead of blaming guns or white supremacy. Not surprising but still very disappointing.


And the right is using debunked propaganda of video games to support continued mass shootings. How many mass shootings have there been in video game obsessed Japan? Or Europe where they have video games? Or Australia where they have video games? Or Canada?

White supremacy and ease of access to guns caused these shootings. What is so hard to understand about that? What is truly disappointing is the Republicans who claim to love life and every life is sacred and all lives matter don't care about life when guns are involved.


Isn't that what I said, guns and white supremacy? Meanwhile, your kind is busy trying to shutdown 4chan/8chan.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
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Jouhou
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:27 am

Concierge wrote:
'Dayton shooter was a registered democrat, I doubt with that information out there won't be political spin on it. I kind of realized he was on the political left when I saw he was wearing an Acacia Strain hoodie'.

Ohio is an open-primary state. No one there registers as a Democrat or a Republican. Please correct the source that delivered that incorrect information.

I don't know how you associate Metal Core music with what you call 'the left'. These bands are anarchic - the agenda of the left is no more meaningful to them than that of the right.


Open primary doesn't change what you register as. There's party registration in Ohio- Google it.

Also as somebody who's been a long time part of the Boston hardcore scene the furthest right anyone dares to identify as is libertarian. Also Acacia Strain is pretty far from anarcho-punk, jesus. They're for trendy mosh warriors.
 
Concierge
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:18 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:29 am

Super80Fan wrote:
seb146 wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
It seems our far leftist "friends" are blaming the first amendment instead of blaming guns or white supremacy. Not surprising but still very disappointing.


And the right is using debunked propaganda of video games to support continued mass shootings. How many mass shootings have there been in video game obsessed Japan? Or Europe where they have video games? Or Australia where they have video games? Or Canada?

White supremacy and ease of access to guns caused these shootings. What is so hard to understand about that? What is truly disappointing is the Republicans who claim to love life and every life is sacred and all lives matter don't care about life when guns are involved.


Isn't that what I said, guns and white supremacy? Meanwhile, your kind is busy trying to shutdown 4chan/8chan.


'Your Kind?' I guess you don't want to be taken seriously.
 
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Jouhou
Posts: 1965
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:40 am

Concierge wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
seb146 wrote:

And the right is using debunked propaganda of video games to support continued mass shootings. How many mass shootings have there been in video game obsessed Japan? Or Europe where they have video games? Or Australia where they have video games? Or Canada?

White supremacy and ease of access to guns caused these shootings. What is so hard to understand about that? What is truly disappointing is the Republicans who claim to love life and every life is sacred and all lives matter don't care about life when guns are involved.


Isn't that what I said, guns and white supremacy? Meanwhile, your kind is busy trying to shutdown 4chan/8chan.


'Your Kind?' I guess you don't want to be taken seriously.


Considering I was just in 8chan, it seems even they are resigned to the fact that if the Qanons and /pol/ keep sending out psychos into the real world the site isn't going to last. If cloudflare drops them they're screwed. Also looks like the europeans are heckling the Americans pretty hard in there right now too.

Also, remember that some of the communities on 8chan exist only because they were too extreme for 4chan.
 
Concierge
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:40 am

Jouhou wrote:
Concierge wrote:
'Dayton shooter was a registered democrat, I doubt with that information out there won't be political spin on it. I kind of realized he was on the political left when I saw he was wearing an Acacia Strain hoodie'.

Ohio is an open-primary state. No one there registers as a Democrat or a Republican. Please correct the source that delivered that incorrect information.

I don't know how you associate Metal Core music with what you call 'the left'. These bands are anarchic - the agenda of the left is no more meaningful to them than that of the right.


Open primary doesn't change what you register as. There's party registration in Ohio- Google it.

Also as somebody who's been a long time part of the Boston hardcore scene the furthest right anyone dares to identify as is libertarian. Also Acacia Strain is pretty far from anarcho-punk, jesus. They're for trendy mosh warriors.


Are you registered in an open primary state? I am. I know how it works, year in and year out. If you Googled it, you misread it.

'Ohio law provides for open primaries, meaning voters do not have to register with a party to participate in its primary. Voters select the ballot of the party whose primary they wish to vote in at the polling place.'

One primary a Democrat voter, the next, a Republican.

If you find a leftist leaning in the lyrics you posted or on the band's site, you're seeing something I don't, jesus.
 
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Jouhou
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:57 am

Concierge wrote:
Jouhou wrote:
Concierge wrote:
'Dayton shooter was a registered democrat, I doubt with that information out there won't be political spin on it. I kind of realized he was on the political left when I saw he was wearing an Acacia Strain hoodie'.

Ohio is an open-primary state. No one there registers as a Democrat or a Republican. Please correct the source that delivered that incorrect information.

I don't know how you associate Metal Core music with what you call 'the left'. These bands are anarchic - the agenda of the left is no more meaningful to them than that of the right.


Open primary doesn't change what you register as. There's party registration in Ohio- Google it.

Also as somebody who's been a long time part of the Boston hardcore scene the furthest right anyone dares to identify as is libertarian. Also Acacia Strain is pretty far from anarcho-punk, jesus. They're for trendy mosh warriors.


Are you registered in an open primary state? I am. I know how it works, year in and year out. If you Googled it, you misread it.

'Ohio law provides for open primaries, meaning voters do not have to register with a party to participate in its primary. Voters select the ballot of the party whose primary they wish to vote in at the polling place.'

One primary a Democrat voter, the next, a Republican.

If you find a leftist leaning in the lyrics you posted or on the band's site, you're seeing something I don't, jesus.


I'm saying Acacia Strain is a part of and a byproduct of the Boston Hardcore scene. The band does not have political lyrics, but is firmly embedded in a culture that embraces left wing politics. That band was playing at every damn show around here for awhile, I know exactly what their crowd is.

And I'm not trying to link the damn guy to politics, I was pointing out to one of our resident right wingers that they like to label every incident like this as apolitical but they tend to go ape shit if there's so much as a rumor about a Democrat being a shooter.

Also my state is semi-open, you can change parties at the polling station. In fully open primary states registration is independent from primary voting. There's only a handful of states with no party registration, Ohio isn't one of them.

https://boe.cuyahogacounty.us/en-US/dec ... party.aspx

Apparently Ohio is not fully open, it's semi-closed (aka semi-open ) like mine.
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:11 am

Concierge wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
seb146 wrote:

And the right is using debunked propaganda of video games to support continued mass shootings. How many mass shootings have there been in video game obsessed Japan? Or Europe where they have video games? Or Australia where they have video games? Or Canada?

White supremacy and ease of access to guns caused these shootings. What is so hard to understand about that? What is truly disappointing is the Republicans who claim to love life and every life is sacred and all lives matter don't care about life when guns are involved.


Isn't that what I said, guns and white supremacy? Meanwhile, your kind is busy trying to shutdown 4chan/8chan.


'Your Kind?' I guess you don't want to be taken seriously.


I don't like associating with those who hold disdain for or who like picking & choosing the first amendment.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
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Jouhou
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:13 am

Super80Fan wrote:
Concierge wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:

Isn't that what I said, guns and white supremacy? Meanwhile, your kind is busy trying to shutdown 4chan/8chan.


'Your Kind?' I guess you don't want to be taken seriously.


I don't like associating with those who hold disdain for or who like picking & choosing the first amendment.


Frankly if cloudflare drops the site and it gets DDoSed to oblivion, that has nothing to do with the first amendment.
 
Concierge
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:14 am

Jouhou wrote:
Concierge wrote:
Jouhou wrote:

Open primary doesn't change what you register as. There's party registration in Ohio- Google it.

Also as somebody who's been a long time part of the Boston hardcore scene the furthest right anyone dares to identify as is libertarian. Also Acacia Strain is pretty far from anarcho-punk, jesus. They're for trendy mosh warriors.


Are you registered in an open primary state? I am. I know how it works, year in and year out. If you Googled it, you misread it.

'Ohio law provides for open primaries, meaning voters do not have to register with a party to participate in its primary. Voters select the ballot of the party whose primary they wish to vote in at the polling place.'

One primary a Democrat voter, the next, a Republican.

If you find a leftist leaning in the lyrics you posted or on the band's site, you're seeing something I don't, jesus.


I'm saying Acacia Strain is a part of and a byproduct of the Boston Hardcore scene. The band does not have political lyrics, but is firmly embedded in a culture that embraces left wing politics. That band was playing at every damn show around here for awhile, I know exactly what their crowd is.

And I'm not trying to link the damn guy to politics, I was pointing out to one of our resident right wingers that they like to label every incident like this as apolitical but they tend to go ape shit if there's so much as a rumor about a Democrat being a shooter.I

Also my state is semi-open, you can change parties at the polling station. In fully open primary states registration is independent from primary voting. There's only a handful of states with no party registration, Ohio isn't one of them.



Thanks for the explanation on the band and music - well said.

Party affiliation, of course, only applies to primaries. In my home state, as in Ohio, you don't declare Democrat, Republican or Independent when you register to vote.
You do choose a Republican or Democrat ballot at the polls on primary day. The law allows party judges to object, but, in practice, there is no restriction on your choice.
I've been voting here for over 40 years.

In states like Massachusetts, you declare Democrat, Republican or Independent when you register to vote. On primary day, registered Democrats must take the Democrat ballot, Registered Republicans must take the Republican ballot. Registered Independents who choose to vote in the primary can choose either.

I don't know everything, but this stuff has long fascinated me, and I've studied it forever.

Goodnight and thanks again!
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:21 am

Jouhou wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
Concierge wrote:

'Your Kind?' I guess you don't want to be taken seriously.


I don't like associating with those who hold disdain for or who like picking & choosing the first amendment.


Frankly if cloudflare drops the site and it gets DDoSed to oblivion, that has nothing to do with the first amendment.


Except Cloudflare doesn't plan on dropping them.

Good try though, as I said, the far left is now working on getting rid of the first amendment instead of trying to go after guns or white supremacy.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
Concierge
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:35 am

Super80Fan wrote:
Jouhou wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:

I don't like associating with those who hold disdain for or who like picking & choosing the first amendment.


Frankly if cloudflare drops the site and it gets DDoSed to oblivion, that has nothing to do with the first amendment.


Except Cloudflare doesn't plan on dropping them.

Good try though, as I said, the far left is now working on getting rid of the first amendment instead of trying to go after guns or white supremacy.


Who is the far left that you're talking about?

I hear Trump and Republicans saying that white supremacy isn't a threat, they're not the left. My own Republican Senators oppose any legislation that would impose any restrictions on gun sales or ownership. They're not the left, but they refuse to go after guns. Yet you say it is the left that is ignoring these things.

The Democratic House passed universal background checks in February, I think they're the left, but the Republican Senate - I think they're the right refuses to hear the
bill.

Again - who are you talking about?
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:57 am

Watching the MSNBC pundits switch in real-time on the issue of whether or not we should be talking about a shooter’s politics as new info comes out about the Dayton shooter is incredible to watch.
 
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VTKillarney
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:14 am

Heavy(.)com found the Twitter account of the alleged Dayton attacker.

His account promoted:

-Bernie Sanders
-Elizabeth Warren
-Antifa
-leftism
-socialism
-Satan
-Strong anti-ICE rhetoric
-He called the terrorist who attacked the ICE facility in Tacoma a "martyr"

This just shows that we need to focus on what makes someone pull the trigger and not their politics, because political affiliation is obviously not dispositive.
 
Concierge
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:18 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:33 am

VTKillarney wrote:
Heavy(.)com found the Twitter account of the alleged Dayton attacker.

His account promoted:

-Bernie Sanders
-Elizabeth Warren
-Antifa
-leftism
-socialism
-Satan
-Strong anti-ICE rhetoric
-He called the terrorist who attacked the ICE facility in Tacoma a "martyr"

This just shows that we need to focus on what makes someone pull the trigger and not their politics, because political affiliation is obviously not dispositive.


Heartbreaking stuff on heavy.com. A devoted Mom who has lost both children through the actions of one.
 
Concierge
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:50 am

VTKillarney wrote:
Heavy(.)com found the Twitter account of the alleged Dayton attacker.

His account promoted:

-Bernie Sanders
-Elizabeth Warren
-Antifa
-leftism
-socialism
-Satan
-Strong anti-ICE rhetoric
-He called the terrorist who attacked the ICE facility in Tacoma a "martyr"

This just shows that we need to focus on what makes someone pull the trigger and not their politics, because political affiliation is obviously not dispositive.


I had to look up dispositive - thanks for that. Gotta say that I feel like I know less now than when this started.
 
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Jouhou
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:02 am

VTKillarney wrote:
Heavy(.)com found the Twitter account of the alleged Dayton attacker.

His account promoted:

-Bernie Sanders
-Elizabeth Warren
-Antifa
-leftism
-socialism
-Satan
-Strong anti-ICE rhetoric
-He called the terrorist who attacked the ICE facility in Tacoma a "martyr"

This just shows that we need to focus on what makes someone pull the trigger and not their politics, because political affiliation is obviously not dispositive.


I was gonna say, after the discussion on party affiliation in Ohio, he's probably a registered D because he voted for Bernie in the 2016 primary, considering his age.

However, we only link them to politics if they link their selves to politics in their manifestos, which the El Paso shooter did, he also specifically said don't blame Trump! So of course we are. He also was quoting Yang in that manifesto though. What he did was politically motivated but his political views were a unique hybrid you only really see in /pol/. So back to this:

Super80Fan wrote:
Jouhou wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:

I don't like associating with those who hold disdain for or who like picking & choosing the first amendment.


Frankly if cloudflare drops the site and it gets DDoSed to oblivion, that has nothing to do with the first amendment.


Except Cloudflare doesn't plan on dropping them.

Good try though, as I said, the far left is now working on getting rid of the first amendment instead of trying to go after guns or white supremacy.


They dropped the Daily Stormer. There is a breaking point for them. If private industry doesn't take care of the issue the FBI needs to investigate every threat made in there and continuously monitor it. That costs money. Pick one or watch radicalized youth burn this country to the ground.


UPDATE: Cloudflare has announced they are dropping 8chan! And yes dude, this was being discussed, that's why I mentioned it.

https://new.blog.cloudflare.com/termina ... for-8chan/
 
seb146
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:58 am

Super80Fan wrote:
seb146 wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
It seems our far leftist "friends" are blaming the first amendment instead of blaming guns or white supremacy. Not surprising but still very disappointing.


And the right is using debunked propaganda of video games to support continued mass shootings. How many mass shootings have there been in video game obsessed Japan? Or Europe where they have video games? Or Australia where they have video games? Or Canada?

White supremacy and ease of access to guns caused these shootings. What is so hard to understand about that? What is truly disappointing is the Republicans who claim to love life and every life is sacred and all lives matter don't care about life when guns are involved.


Isn't that what I said, guns and white supremacy? Meanwhile, your kind is busy trying to shutdown 4chan/8chan.


They don't need to hide anymore. Their leader has given them cover straight from the White House. They don't need help being shut down. All this hate murder is working just fine to do that.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
MikeDrop
Posts: 511
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2018 6:21 pm

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:03 am

Concierge wrote:
I hear Trump and Republicans saying that white supremacy isn't a threat


Not quite correct: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wY7P0ETDfls

This was about two weeks ago.

Mike Drop
 
MikeDrop
Posts: 511
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2018 6:21 pm

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:04 am

seb146 wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
seb146 wrote:

And the right is using debunked propaganda of video games to support continued mass shootings. How many mass shootings have there been in video game obsessed Japan? Or Europe where they have video games? Or Australia where they have video games? Or Canada?

White supremacy and ease of access to guns caused these shootings. What is so hard to understand about that? What is truly disappointing is the Republicans who claim to love life and every life is sacred and all lives matter don't care about life when guns are involved.


Isn't that what I said, guns and white supremacy? Meanwhile, your kind is busy trying to shutdown 4chan/8chan.


They don't need to hide anymore. Their leader has given them cover straight from the White House. They don't need help being shut down. All this hate murder is working just fine to do that.

Over the top and out of line

Mike Drop
 
Concierge
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:18 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:24 am

MikeDrop wrote:
Concierge wrote:
I hear Trump and Republicans saying that white supremacy isn't a threat


Not quite correct: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wY7P0ETDfls

This was about two weeks ago.

Mike Drop



When asked if he saw White Nationalism as a growing threat in March 2019, Trump said 'I don't really. I think it's a small group of people that have a very serious problem.'
https://time.com/5552850/donald-trump-w ... w-zealand/
 
MikeDrop
Posts: 511
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2018 6:21 pm

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:33 am

Concierge wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:
Concierge wrote:
I hear Trump and Republicans saying that white supremacy isn't a threat


Not quite correct: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wY7P0ETDfls

This was about two weeks ago.

Mike Drop



When asked if he saw White Nationalism as a growing threat in March 2019, Trump said 'I don't really. I think it's a small group of people that have a very serious problem.'
https://time.com/5552850/donald-trump-w ... w-zealand/


This is not an incorrect statement. It’s a small group with a very serious problem.

Mike Drop
 
Concierge
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:18 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:38 am

MikeDrop wrote:
Concierge wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:

Not quite correct: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wY7P0ETDfls

This was about two weeks ago.

Mike Drop



When asked if he saw White Nationalism as a growing threat in March 2019, Trump said 'I don't really. I think it's a small group of people that have a very serious problem.'
https://time.com/5552850/donald-trump-w ... w-zealand/


This is not an incorrect statement. It’s a small group with a very serious problem.



Mike Drop


And a rising threat, as we saw in El Paso. You're parsing it very closely.
 
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Aaron747
Posts: 9376
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:30 am

MikeDrop wrote:
Concierge wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:

Not quite correct: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wY7P0ETDfls

This was about two weeks ago.

Mike Drop



When asked if he saw White Nationalism as a growing threat in March 2019, Trump said 'I don't really. I think it's a small group of people that have a very serious problem.'
https://time.com/5552850/donald-trump-w ... w-zealand/


This is not an incorrect statement. It’s a small group with a very serious problem.

Mike Drop


It is an incorrect statement. The FBI names it one of the top national threats and the ADL names it as one of the most politically destabilizing elements in the current society. These people and groups need to be named, shamed, and brought into the light as their activities are patently unAmerican.

Violence and crime represent the most serious problems emanating from the white supremacist movement. White supremacists have killed more people in recent years than any other type of domestic extremist (54% of all domestic extremist-related murders in the past 10 years). They are also a troubling source of domestic terror incidents (including 13 plots or attacks within the past five years).

https://www.adl.org/new-hate-and-old
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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lugie
Posts: 708
Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2013 4:11 pm

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 8:19 am

Super80Fan wrote:
seb146 wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
It seems our far leftist "friends" are blaming the first amendment instead of blaming guns or white supremacy. Not surprising but still very disappointing.


And the right is using debunked propaganda of video games to support continued mass shootings. How many mass shootings have there been in video game obsessed Japan? Or Europe where they have video games? Or Australia where they have video games? Or Canada?

White supremacy and ease of access to guns caused these shootings. What is so hard to understand about that? What is truly disappointing is the Republicans who claim to love life and every life is sacred and all lives matter don't care about life when guns are involved.


Isn't that what I said, guns and white supremacy? Meanwhile, your kind is busy trying to shutdown 4chan/8chan.


Yes, and rightfully so, because 4chan/8chan are cesspools full of white supremacists, white nationalists, racists, incels and the rest. The sort of people who go to shoot up bars, festivals, Walmarts, mosques, synagogues.

What do you propose as a quick measure to curb the spread of white supremacist ideology and the communication among white supremacist terrorists and their sympathizers? Any reasonable plans?

I think draining the hate-filled swamp that is 4chan/8chan is a very good way to start.
DH4 E75 E90 CR9 CRK M88 319 320 321 332 333 359 733 73G 738 739 748 764 772 788
X3 LH 4U TP US SN EI FR IB LX LA CM UA DL AA AS WN
FRA STR HAM TXL MUC ZRH ACE BRU BLL DUB MAN ARN MAD OPO LIS FNC AMS PHL RDU LGA CLT EWR ORD ATL SFO MDW SJO PTY
 
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Jouhou
Posts: 1965
Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 4:16 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 8:54 am

lugie wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
seb146 wrote:

And the right is using debunked propaganda of video games to support continued mass shootings. How many mass shootings have there been in video game obsessed Japan? Or Europe where they have video games? Or Australia where they have video games? Or Canada?

White supremacy and ease of access to guns caused these shootings. What is so hard to understand about that? What is truly disappointing is the Republicans who claim to love life and every life is sacred and all lives matter don't care about life when guns are involved.


Isn't that what I said, guns and white supremacy? Meanwhile, your kind is busy trying to shutdown 4chan/8chan.


Yes, and rightfully so, because 4chan/8chan are cesspools full of white supremacists, white nationalists, racists, incels and the rest. The sort of people who go to shoot up bars, festivals, Walmarts, mosques, synagogues.

What do you propose as a quick measure to curb the spread of white supremacist ideology and the communication among white supremacist terrorists and their sympathizers? Any reasonable plans?

I think draining the hate-filled swamp that is 4chan/8chan is a very good way to start.


Currently, 8chan doesn't even exist :rotfl:

The discussion right before takedown was a bit horrifying. A lot of people saying they need to shoot more people and move on to bombing. F*ck that culture of "joking" about this. If any of them were serious we have a big problem.
 
Jetty
Posts: 932
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 12:27 pm

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:48 pm

sierrakilo44 wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
Lilienthal wrote:
Another young white guy who lost his mind after years of alt-right indoctrination by sites like Breitbart, 4chan and 8chan. Combined with easy access to firearms and a gun culture that caters to these insecure individuals. But of course the mere mentioning of this makes me an enemy to a sizable portion of the US society.

Insanity. Pure insanity.


And how do you know this?


https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/aug/04/mass-shootings-el-paso-texas-dayton-ohio-8chan-far-right-website

Stop spreading lies. That article doesn't claim any association of this shooter with 4/8chan. The shooter was a fanatic supporter of Elizabeth Warren; hardly alt-right I would say.
Last edited by Jetty on Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
User avatar
VTKillarney
Posts: 1661
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Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:52 pm

The Dayton shooter was most definitely not alt-right. His Twitter account shows that he liked numerous Antifa related posts, which is odd because I’ve been told that Antifa is all about peace.
 
User avatar
Super80Fan
Posts: 1533
Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2017 4:14 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:47 pm

Jouhou wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
Heavy(.)com found the Twitter account of the alleged Dayton attacker.

His account promoted:

-Bernie Sanders
-Elizabeth Warren
-Antifa
-leftism
-socialism
-Satan
-Strong anti-ICE rhetoric
-He called the terrorist who attacked the ICE facility in Tacoma a "martyr"

This just shows that we need to focus on what makes someone pull the trigger and not their politics, because political affiliation is obviously not dispositive.


I was gonna say, after the discussion on party affiliation in Ohio, he's probably a registered D because he voted for Bernie in the 2016 primary, considering his age.

However, we only link them to politics if they link their selves to politics in their manifestos, which the El Paso shooter did, he also specifically said don't blame Trump! So of course we are. He also was quoting Yang in that manifesto though. What he did was politically motivated but his political views were a unique hybrid you only really see in /pol/. So back to this:

Super80Fan wrote:
Jouhou wrote:

Frankly if cloudflare drops the site and it gets DDoSed to oblivion, that has nothing to do with the first amendment.


Except Cloudflare doesn't plan on dropping them.

Good try though, as I said, the far left is now working on getting rid of the first amendment instead of trying to go after guns or white supremacy.


They dropped the Daily Stormer. There is a breaking point for them. If private industry doesn't take care of the issue the FBI needs to investigate every threat made in there and continuously monitor it. That costs money. Pick one or watch radicalized youth burn this country to the ground.


UPDATE: Cloudflare has announced they are dropping 8chan! And yes dude, this was being discussed, that's why I mentioned it.

https://new.blog.cloudflare.com/termina ... for-8chan/


Wow, getting a online imageboard shutdown, congrats! America is saved! There will no longer be any shootings and no more hatred & violence! Job well done!
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
User avatar
casinterest
Posts: 8871
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:54 pm

Here is the correlation between both shootings. More guns sold, more deaths.
We need to get smarter in the US, it takes far less than 1% of gun owners to cause pain to a larger percentage of the population..

More guns means more deaths, whether that are mentally disturbed, white nationalists, angry, predisposed or other.


https://www.vox.com/2015/10/3/9444417/g ... us-america

Image

https://www.vox.com/2015/10/3/9444417/g ... us-america


Image
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 17417
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:17 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
Heavy(.)com found the Twitter account of the alleged Dayton attacker.

His account promoted:

-Bernie Sanders
-Elizabeth Warren
-Antifa
-leftism
-socialism
-Satan
-Strong anti-ICE rhetoric
-He called the terrorist who attacked the ICE facility in Tacoma a "martyr"

This just shows that we need to focus on what makes someone pull the trigger and not their politics, because political affiliation is obviously not dispositive.

Just highly predictive:
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1427699
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
User avatar
MrHMSH
Posts: 2450
Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2013 7:32 pm

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:42 pm

scbriml wrote:
Mass shootings are like busses - you wait ages for one, then two come along together.


This is an absolute lie... you don’t need to wait for ages for one.
 
NIKV69
Posts: 12648
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:27 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:18 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
WIederling wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Two in 24 hours, must be a record.


The 250th.. 251st shooting on day 216 of this year.

There must have been multiple shootings on a single day before these last two. ( about 30..35 ? )


Doesn’t it say something about police culture in the US when two white guys can kill 30 people in separate incidents and still remain alive, when an unarmed black can be gunned down for often times nothing?


Didn't the second gunman get killed my police?
Nikon from day one, Nikon till I die,
 
seb146
Posts: 20262
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:30 pm

VTKillarney wrote:
The Dayton shooter was most definitely not alt-right. His Twitter account shows that he liked numerous Antifa related posts, which is odd because I’ve been told that Antifa is all about peace.


And there are others who say they went to school with him and he was a racist, misogynist bully. You don't post any proof, so why should I?

Funny how we are all automatically jumping to the conclusion that these shooters are anti fascist and far left but we can not even suggest they are what they actually are: right wing racists. Even when shown the proof, we still have to beat the drum of "anti fascists are killers".
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
Kiwirob
Posts: 12157
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:16 pm

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:35 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
WIederling wrote:

The 250th.. 251st shooting on day 216 of this year.

There must have been multiple shootings on a single day before these last two. ( about 30..35 ? )


Doesn’t it say something about police culture in the US when two white guys can kill 30 people in separate incidents and still remain alive, when an unarmed black can be gunned down for often times nothing?


Didn't the second gunman get killed my police?


Whoops yes he did, still he only killed 9, including his sister so it looks like a family argument gotten out of hand. The other guy killed 20, he’s still breathing.
 
Kiwirob
Posts: 12157
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:16 pm

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:37 pm

seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
The Dayton shooter was most definitely not alt-right. His Twitter account shows that he liked numerous Antifa related posts, which is odd because I’ve been told that Antifa is all about peace.


And there are others who say they went to school with him and he was a racist, misogynist bully. You don't post any proof, so why should I?

Funny how we are all automatically jumping to the conclusion that these shooters are anti fascist and far left but we can not even suggest they are what they actually are: right wing racists. Even when shown the proof, we still have to beat the drum of "anti fascists are killers".


The guy in Dayton killed his sister, to me it sounds like it was a family argument that was taken to its ultimate conclusion.
 
seb146
Posts: 20262
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:39 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
seb146 wrote:
VTKillarney wrote:
The Dayton shooter was most definitely not alt-right. His Twitter account shows that he liked numerous Antifa related posts, which is odd because I’ve been told that Antifa is all about peace.


And there are others who say they went to school with him and he was a racist, misogynist bully. You don't post any proof, so why should I?

Funny how we are all automatically jumping to the conclusion that these shooters are anti fascist and far left but we can not even suggest they are what they actually are: right wing racists. Even when shown the proof, we still have to beat the drum of "anti fascists are killers".


The guy in Dayton killed his sister, to me it sounds like it was a family argument that was taken to its ultimate conclusion.


He is either incel (right winger) or was angry his sister was dating a minority (right winger). Either way, he easily had access to guns because he belonged to some well regulated militia and this was the well regulated militia protecting the interests of the United States, right?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
Kiwirob
Posts: 12157
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:16 pm

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:50 pm

seb146 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
seb146 wrote:

And there are others who say they went to school with him and he was a racist, misogynist bully. You don't post any proof, so why should I?

Funny how we are all automatically jumping to the conclusion that these shooters are anti fascist and far left but we can not even suggest they are what they actually are: right wing racists. Even when shown the proof, we still have to beat the drum of "anti fascists are killers".


The guy in Dayton killed his sister, to me it sounds like it was a family argument that was taken to its ultimate conclusion.


He is either incel (right winger) or was angry his sister was dating a minority (right winger). Either way, he easily had access to guns because he belonged to some well regulated militia and this was the well regulated militia protecting the interests of the United States, right?


I haven’t read any articles where it says she was dating a minority.
 
seb146
Posts: 20262
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Mass Shooting in Dayton, 10 Dead

Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:53 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
seb146 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:

The guy in Dayton killed his sister, to me it sounds like it was a family argument that was taken to its ultimate conclusion.


He is either incel (right winger) or was angry his sister was dating a minority (right winger). Either way, he easily had access to guns because he belonged to some well regulated militia and this was the well regulated militia protecting the interests of the United States, right?


I haven’t read any articles where it says she was dating a minority.


So, the only logical conclusion is he was part of a well regulated militia engaging in his sworn duty to protect the United States. Why else would he have so much firepower?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!

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