BN747
Topic Author
Posts: 6536
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:48 am

Lincoln: We Are the Last Best Hope on Earth

Wed Aug 07, 2019 9:16 pm

Something Joe Biden just said compelled to look up the back story - thread title. In a speech of his 'Message to Congress' a year before the Emancipation Proclamation.

“Fellow-citizens, we can not escape history. We of this Congress and this Administration will be remembered in spite of ourselves. No personal significance or insignificance can spare one or another of us. The fiery trial through which we pass will light us down in honor or dishonor to the latest generation. We say we are for the Union. The world will not forget that we say this. We know how to save the Union. The world knows we do know how to save it. We, even we here, hold the power and bear the responsibility. In giving freedom to the slave we assure freedom to the free — honorable alike in what we give and what we preserve. We shall nobly save or meanly lose the last best hope of earth.”
-from https://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2 ... best-hope/

When Biden said this..I had to pause for a moment.

It caused me to image Lincoln's worldview to provoke that thought. Perhaps some Lincoln experts reside here and can shed some light on the subject.

But to me, a leader of a relatively new nation with worldwide business-minded rulers betting on/against the survival of this new America. It had to weight on his mind enough to the point to seed the Congress and anyone listening that Emancipation Proclamation...was coming.

But stating the 'Earth's last Best Hope'...had history shown him this? Was he exaggerating?
And has any other known world leader, past or present made such a statement addressing humanity?

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
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casinterest
Posts: 8800
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: Lincoln: We Are the Last Best Hope on Earth

Wed Aug 07, 2019 9:47 pm

BN747 wrote:
Something Joe Biden just said compelled to look up the back story - thread title. In a speech of his 'Message to Congress' a year before the Emancipation Proclamation.

“Fellow-citizens, we can not escape history. We of this Congress and this Administration will be remembered in spite of ourselves. No personal significance or insignificance can spare one or another of us. The fiery trial through which we pass will light us down in honor or dishonor to the latest generation. We say we are for the Union. The world will not forget that we say this. We know how to save the Union. The world knows we do know how to save it. We, even we here, hold the power and bear the responsibility. In giving freedom to the slave we assure freedom to the free — honorable alike in what we give and what we preserve. We shall nobly save or meanly lose the last best hope of earth.”
-from https://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2 ... best-hope/

When Biden said this..I had to pause for a moment.

It caused me to image Lincoln's worldview to provoke that thought. Perhaps some Lincoln experts reside here and can shed some light on the subject.

But to me, a leader of a relatively new nation with worldwide business-minded rulers betting on/against the survival of this new America. It had to weight on his mind enough to the point to seed the Congress and anyone listening that Emancipation Proclamation...was coming.

But stating the 'Earth's last Best Hope'...had history shown him this? Was he exaggerating?
And has any other known world leader, past or present made such a statement addressing humanity?

BN747


America is still a young country, but you have to remember that American Exceptionalism and Manifest Destiny were still being played out , east to west. The whole civil war started because new states wanted to choose whether or not to have slavery, and it was the American position that new states should not have that choice . Lincoln was appealing to that last best hope while underscoring that he was going to reaffirm the ideas in the declaration of independence coming forward in the Emancipation Proclamation and Gettysburg Address. Lincoln was committed to keeping America together, but also making sure it lived up to it's promises.

Biden is using the same process for gun control.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
BN747
Topic Author
Posts: 6536
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:48 am

Re: Lincoln: We Are the Last Best Hope on Earth

Wed Aug 07, 2019 10:08 pm

casinterest wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Something Joe Biden just said compelled to look up the back story - thread title. In a speech of his 'Message to Congress' a year before the Emancipation Proclamation.

“Fellow-citizens, we can not escape history. We of this Congress and this Administration will be remembered in spite of ourselves. No personal significance or insignificance can spare one or another of us. The fiery trial through which we pass will light us down in honor or dishonor to the latest generation. We say we are for the Union. The world will not forget that we say this. We know how to save the Union. The world knows we do know how to save it. We, even we here, hold the power and bear the responsibility. In giving freedom to the slave we assure freedom to the free — honorable alike in what we give and what we preserve. We shall nobly save or meanly lose the last best hope of earth.”
-from https://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2 ... best-hope/

When Biden said this..I had to pause for a moment.

It caused me to image Lincoln's worldview to provoke that thought. Perhaps some Lincoln experts reside here and can shed some light on the subject.

But to me, a leader of a relatively new nation with worldwide business-minded rulers betting on/against the survival of this new America. It had to weight on his mind enough to the point to seed the Congress and anyone listening that Emancipation Proclamation...was coming.

But stating the 'Earth's last Best Hope'...had history shown him this? Was he exaggerating?
And has any other known world leader, past or present made such a statement addressing humanity?

BN747


America is still a young country, but you have to remember that American Exceptionalism and Manifest Destiny were still being played out , east to west. The whole civil war started because new states wanted to choose whether or not to have slavery, and it was the American position that new states should not have that choice . Lincoln was appealing to that last best hope while underscoring that he was going to reaffirm the ideas in the declaration of independence coming forward in the Emancipation Proclamation and Gettysburg Address. Lincoln was committed to keeping America together, but also making sure it lived up to it's promises.

Biden is using the same process for gun control.



Thanks, but your response is missing my point.

Lincoln in 1862 was not a fortune teller, and certainly, the way the North was getting it's ass kicked, he had no idea that the Union would prevail at that time.

I just watched an episode of Crash Course: Focusing on the 17th Century Crisis & The 30 Year War...All European horrific, death, starvation, cannibalism, abject misery PLUS.
I'm wondering just how much of this history did Lincoln know?

How well documented were the times pre- & post Roman Empire and such events.

Something had to compel him to make this statement. Basically expressing the the daunting chances of human prosperity.
I'm just trying gauge what he knew and how he saw things shaping his view.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
Caryjack
Posts: 401
Joined: Tue May 08, 2007 9:45 am

Re: Lincoln: We Are the Last Best Hope on Earth

Thu Aug 08, 2019 8:26 am

BN747[/quote]
Thanks, but your response is missing my point.

Lincoln in 1862 was not a fortune teller,....
I just watched an episode of Crash Course: Focusing on the 17th Century Crisis & The 30 Year War...All European horrific, death, starvation, cannibalism, abject misery PLUS.
I'm wondering just how much of this history did Lincoln know?

How well documented were the times pre- & post Roman Empire and such events.

Something had to compel him to make this statement. Basically expressing the the daunting chances of human prosperity.
I'm just trying gauge what he knew and how he saw things shaping his view.

BN747[/quote]

The Founding Fathers were very much aware of the strife associated with the European system of governments ruled by Kings, Queens, Kaisers, Tsars, etc. Every twenty-five years or so some Prince would knock-up somebody else’s Princes causing the offended party to start another war. The Royalty wasn't much concerned about the deaths involved as long as their honor was satisfied. At least that's the way I see it.

Thomas Jefferson in particular was fascinated by the Great Books of the Christians, Jews, Greeks and Romans. He often gave copies of such as gifts and also created his own personal cut-and-past bible. The people who produced the US Deceleration of Independence and the Constitution lived and studied the European way of running a country and wanted nothing to do with it. US history was made by some of the brightest and most progressive people in the world, Benjamin Franklin being a good example. This knowledge was past on.

As the country grew, politicians controlling slave states forced compromises which conflicted with the founding documents, thereby foretelling the American Civil War.

One hundred years later Pres. Lincoln knew that the US democracy was far superior the European examples and found him self in a precarious situation. He had to preserve the Union by eliminating slavery. He did, thereby making America the second country in the world, after England, to outlaw slavery.
 
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casinterest
Posts: 8800
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: Lincoln: We Are the Last Best Hope on Earth

Thu Aug 08, 2019 1:11 pm

BN747 wrote:
casinterest wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Something Joe Biden just said compelled to look up the back story - thread title. In a speech of his 'Message to Congress' a year before the Emancipation Proclamation.

“Fellow-citizens, we can not escape history. We of this Congress and this Administration will be remembered in spite of ourselves. No personal significance or insignificance can spare one or another of us. The fiery trial through which we pass will light us down in honor or dishonor to the latest generation. We say we are for the Union. The world will not forget that we say this. We know how to save the Union. The world knows we do know how to save it. We, even we here, hold the power and bear the responsibility. In giving freedom to the slave we assure freedom to the free — honorable alike in what we give and what we preserve. We shall nobly save or meanly lose the last best hope of earth.”
-from https://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2 ... best-hope/

When Biden said this..I had to pause for a moment.

It caused me to image Lincoln's worldview to provoke that thought. Perhaps some Lincoln experts reside here and can shed some light on the subject.

But to me, a leader of a relatively new nation with worldwide business-minded rulers betting on/against the survival of this new America. It had to weight on his mind enough to the point to seed the Congress and anyone listening that Emancipation Proclamation...was coming.

But stating the 'Earth's last Best Hope'...had history shown him this? Was he exaggerating?
And has any other known world leader, past or present made such a statement addressing humanity?

BN747


America is still a young country, but you have to remember that American Exceptionalism and Manifest Destiny were still being played out , east to west. The whole civil war started because new states wanted to choose whether or not to have slavery, and it was the American position that new states should not have that choice . Lincoln was appealing to that last best hope while underscoring that he was going to reaffirm the ideas in the declaration of independence coming forward in the Emancipation Proclamation and Gettysburg Address. Lincoln was committed to keeping America together, but also making sure it lived up to it's promises.

Biden is using the same process for gun control.



Thanks, but your response is missing my point.

Lincoln in 1862 was not a fortune teller, and certainly, the way the North was getting it's ass kicked, he had no idea that the Union would prevail at that time.

I just watched an episode of Crash Course: Focusing on the 17th Century Crisis & The 30 Year War...All European horrific, death, starvation, cannibalism, abject misery PLUS.
I'm wondering just how much of this history did Lincoln know?

How well documented were the times pre- & post Roman Empire and such events.

Something had to compel him to make this statement. Basically expressing the the daunting chances of human prosperity.
I'm just trying gauge what he knew and how he saw things shaping his view.

BN747


Alll of our knowledge of the wars and those times was present in libraries. By all accounts Lincoln was a bit of a book worm. He was also a lawyer, and had been a member of the Illinois State legislature for many years when he was younger. He was already a part of many discussions about abolitionism and expansion discussions during that time. This was all 20+ years before he was president. His years leading to the Presidency included discussion and debates with Douglas. In preparation for those debates, I would imagine much information was consumed to be prepared for old world vs American ideals.

American Exceptionalism was as Caryjack pointed out heavily promoted by the founders of this country. Lincoln was born in 1809. His father and mother were children of the revolution. This exceptionalism and manifest destiny are probably why his parents wound up moving westward from their births in Virginia. The history of Europe and I am sure stories of the horrors from such a place were probably told to all kids to remind them why they were in America. The war of 1812 probably served well to keep these stories alive.
Where ever you go, there you are.

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