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stl07
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Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 5:01 am

https://www.foxnews.com/us/armed-man-ar ... police-say

Except this time, there was a "good guy with a gun" to stop it.


that "good guy" was a TRAINED officer.
Last edited by SQ22 on Fri Aug 09, 2019 5:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Title updated
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stl07
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Re: Copycat in Missouri Walmart

Fri Aug 09, 2019 5:03 am

to add, this is why we have the 2nd amendment, to save innocent citizens in a "well-regulated" manner, as stated in the constitution. When guns people actually get training, be it though law enforcement/military or private training, they can work miracles
Interesting how every thread is spammed with "bring back paid membership, there are too many spammers"
 
Airstud
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Re: Copycat in Missouri Walmart

Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:26 am

stl07 wrote:
to add, this is why we have the 2nd amendment, to save innocent citizens in a "well-regulated" manner, as stated in the constitution. When guns people actually get training, be it though law enforcement/military or private training, they can work miracles


I'm not sure "miracle" is the word I'd use here, since the "miracle" is the prevention of the type of catastrophe perpetrated by 2nd-Amendment-protected maniacs.

I strongly support the 2nd Amendment, as being - as the framers themselves put it - necessary to the security of a Free state. Every time the ACLU or like-minded parties campaign viciously to get dangerous criminals sprung because of the cops having violated the thug's civil liberties - or because the cops are portrayed as having done so - the point is proven, that the people, the decent people, need the right to bear arms & protect themselves and their families when the civil-liberties-laden thug comes banging into their house.

That said, nobody needs no AK47 or AR15 or Uzi to protect themselves from a thug. I think we need a Constitutional amendment banning ownership of those ridiculous machines but specifically preserving the people's right to sensible protection.
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tommy1808
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Re: Copycat in Missouri Walmart

Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:35 am

Airstud wrote:
Uzi .


and if you want to protect yourself with an Uzi you night quite a bit of practice to actually hit something......

It is sort of fun that everything that would be required to effectively use a gun for self protection without getting yourself imprisoned (sufficient training, adequate knowledge about maintenance and working understanding of the legal situation around using a gun) are all big no no´s for that being mandatory ....

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extender
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:52 am

A good guy with a gun.
 
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Re: Copycat in Missouri Walmart

Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:03 am

stl07 wrote:
to add, this is why we have the 2nd amendment, to save innocent citizens in a "well-regulated" manner, as stated in the constitution. When guns people actually get training, be it though law enforcement/military or private training, they can work miracles


The suspect grabbed a cart, pushed it around the store and recorded cell phone video of himself walking through the Walmart, Springfield's KY3 reported, citing police.


Wasn't the guy eventually detained just exercising his 2nd amendment rights as well?

He showed up in the store open carrying, grabbed a cart and just walked down the aisles.
 
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Re: Copycat in Missouri Walmart

Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:20 am

JJJ wrote:
stl07 wrote:
to add, this is why we have the 2nd amendment, to save innocent citizens in a "well-regulated" manner, as stated in the constitution. When guns people actually get training, be it though law enforcement/military or private training, they can work miracles


The suspect grabbed a cart, pushed it around the store and recorded cell phone video of himself walking through the Walmart, Springfield's KY3 reported, citing police.


Wasn't the guy eventually detained just exercising his 2nd amendment rights as well?

He showed up in the store open carrying, grabbed a cart and just walked down the aisles.


He might not have been licensed to carry.
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:24 am

[quote="extender"]A good guy with a gun.[/

Because when seconds matter....*

Strange how he didn’t fire a single shot and just filmed himself pushing a cart round the store. Perhaps he just took his assault rifle shopping like that idiot who takes his to the airport terminal. Because, you know, rights...




*other NRA inspired catchphrases are available
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JJJ
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Re: Copycat in Missouri Walmart

Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:28 am

Airstud wrote:
JJJ wrote:
stl07 wrote:
to add, this is why we have the 2nd amendment, to save innocent citizens in a "well-regulated" manner, as stated in the constitution. When guns people actually get training, be it though law enforcement/military or private training, they can work miracles


The suspect grabbed a cart, pushed it around the store and recorded cell phone video of himself walking through the Walmart, Springfield's KY3 reported, citing police.


Wasn't the guy eventually detained just exercising his 2nd amendment rights as well?

He showed up in the store open carrying, grabbed a cart and just walked down the aisles.


He might not have been licensed to carry.


AFAIK you don't need a license to open carry in Missouri.
 
extender
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:47 am

scbriml wrote:
*other NRA inspired catchphrases are available


Yes, and you don't have to comment on every one if it doesn't affect you.

Not a fan of open carry. If he was legal to do it, doesn't mean you have to push the bounds of the law. Definitely lacking common sense. Like all these first amendment auditors you see, they are looking to provoke.
 
AirplaneFixer
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:31 pm

stl07 wrote:
https://www.foxnews.com/us/armed-man-arrested-at-missouri-walmart-police-say

Except this time, there was a "good guy with a gun" to stop it.


that "good guy" was a TRAINED officer.


Stop what? Dude was pushing a shopping cart with his weapon in the basket. Tell ya what sparky, come back when a good guy with a gun takes out an actual mass shooter. This was a yuge nothingburger.
 
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trpmb6
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Re: Copycat in Missouri Walmart

Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:44 pm

JJJ wrote:
Airstud wrote:
JJJ wrote:



Wasn't the guy eventually detained just exercising his 2nd amendment rights as well?

He showed up in the store open carrying, grabbed a cart and just walked down the aisles.


He might not have been licensed to carry.


AFAIK you don't need a license to open carry in Missouri.


Correct. In Missouri you can open carry without any restrictions. Actually most states you can. But Missouri became a constitutional carry state in 2017 so you can even conceal carry legally without any license or training. (A note from me, if you intend to carry, please get training - for your safety and others.)

Unfortunately, this is one challenge we face. This man will very likely be able to sue the folks involved (doubt he pursues it - though he may to prove a point) in this incident for violating his civil liberties and restraining him unjustly. It's a tough line that we must follow, and I get that people won't like it, but that is the reality of our current constitution and laws. It's also what makes red-flag laws unconstitutional.
 
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:46 pm

AirplaneFixer wrote:
stl07 wrote:
https://www.foxnews.com/us/armed-man-arrested-at-missouri-walmart-police-say

Except this time, there was a "good guy with a gun" to stop it.


that "good guy" was a TRAINED officer.


Stop what? Dude was pushing a shopping cart with his weapon in the basket. Tell ya what sparky, come back when a good guy with a gun takes out an actual mass shooter. This was a yuge nothingburger.



The good guy with a gun crowd has nothing and they're clutching at straws. They're kind of like the slow uncle at a family dinner trying to make an obscure point, it's just easier to nod your head and change the topic.
 
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:06 pm

Why do I have the feeling the "armed suspect" is getting the outcome he wanted...
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JJJ
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Re: Copycat in Missouri Walmart

Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:15 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
JJJ wrote:
Airstud wrote:

He might not have been licensed to carry.


AFAIK you don't need a license to open carry in Missouri.


Correct. In Missouri you can open carry without any restrictions. Actually most states you can. But Missouri became a constitutional carry state in 2017 so you can even conceal carry legally without any license or training. (A note from me, if you intend to carry, please get training - for your safety and others.)

Unfortunately, this is one challenge we face. This man will very likely be able to sue the folks involved (doubt he pursues it - though he may to prove a point) in this incident for violating his civil liberties and restraining him unjustly. It's a tough line that we must follow, and I get that people won't like it, but that is the reality of our current constitution and laws. It's also what makes red-flag laws unconstitutional.


Precisely. In order to accomodate the kind of people who feels it's his natural right to walk down a walmart in military fatigues with a few loaded magazines and a rifle you have the collateral damage of having a few mass shootings every now and then.
 
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Re: Copycat in Missouri Walmart

Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:21 pm

Airstud wrote:
He might not have been licensed to carry.

1. Now we require licenses to carry? Isn't that infringing on the right to bear arms? Geez...pick one or the other.
2. Missouri allows open carry without a permit so no license is needed.

extender wrote:
If he was legal to do it, doesn't mean you have to push the bounds of the law.

You might want to let your conservative brethren know this little quip: that just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you SHOULD.

blueflyer wrote:
Why do I have the feeling the "armed suspect" is getting the outcome he wanted...
Depends on the outcome :
1. If his goal is to portray himself as a martyr of the 2nd Amendment and show that he is not still fully free to carry his weapons anywhere, then yes.
2. If his goal is to point out the hypocrisy in a conservative, gun loving state that even when allowed by law to open carry he still is seen as a suspect, then yes.

Would have been even more interesting if he had been a POC, properly licensed, and still open carrying. Then goal number 2 evolves into racial profiling as well.
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casinterest
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:24 pm

What the What?
This was one of those right wing nutcase bloggers with camera going through the store blogging about open carry laws, and then he got stopped by another 2nd amendment guy that saw that he looked threatening . How was this a good guy thing. Just a case of too lenient of a law allowing for a potentially dangerous situation.
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:07 pm

The number one rule for any gun owner: Assume any gun is loaded and approach/handle as such.
(However in an odd twist a corollary rule is: An unloaded gun is useless.)

This is the dumbest problem of "open carry", technically for these type of repeating rifles (don't know for licensed persons open-carrying handguns), I believe they must be unloaded in public. But for everyone else who has learned proper firearm management, you have to assume....
It MUST drive law enforcement in those states nuts.

Tugg
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Kiwirob
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:14 pm

casinterest wrote:
What the What?
This was one of those right wing nutcase bloggers with camera going through the store blogging about open carry laws, and then he got stopped by another 2nd amendment guy that saw that he looked threatening . How was this a good guy thing. Just a case of too lenient of a law allowing for a potentially dangerous situation.


What would have been really funny is if the trained responder good guy with a gun shot the guy open carrying.The ramifications from such an incident would be interesting.
 
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:30 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
casinterest wrote:
What the What?
This was one of those right wing nutcase bloggers with camera going through the store blogging about open carry laws, and then he got stopped by another 2nd amendment guy that saw that he looked threatening . How was this a good guy thing. Just a case of too lenient of a law allowing for a potentially dangerous situation.


What would have been really funny is if the trained responder good guy with a gun shot the guy open carrying.The ramifications from such an incident would be interesting.


It has happened before, and it resulted in lengthy legal battles . The trained responder being a cop, you can understand how this went.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/nation-w ... story.html
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Re: Copycat in Missouri Walmart

Fri Aug 09, 2019 4:13 pm

einsteinboricua wrote:
Would have been even more interesting if he had been a POC, properly licensed, and still open carrying.


He'd most likely be dead.
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seb146
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 4:19 pm

One time. This is not a trend. This is NRA and gun nuts wet dream. They will continue to beat this for as long as they can. One time their fantasy "worked". So, I will continue to ask:

Where was the "good guy with a gun" in Gilroy, Dayton, Orlando, El Paso, Las Vegas, Charleston, Columbine, Aurora.......
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 5:39 pm

I really will laugh my ass off when some state like TX or MS fully devolves into the widespread open carry fantasy land the NRA touts as the safest form of living in America. This is just one perfectly legal nut bag strolling into Walmart with long guns, 100 rounds and body armor. Imagine 1000 shoppers just like this guy arguing over 20% off iPads on Black Friday. I'm practically wetting myself just imagining the scene. All it'll take is one round going off on purpose or by accident and hundreds of militia will be dying on a daily basis in an effort to protect a right enshrined in the context of 18th Century pastoral Americana right here in the 21st. If only they could see how miserably we've interpreted their words, the founders would be scratching their heads.
 
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 5:40 pm

stl07 wrote:
https://www.foxnews.com/us/armed-man-arrested-at-missouri-walmart-police-say

Except this time, there was a "good guy with a gun" to stop it.


that "good guy" was a TRAINED officer.


Sorry, he was a firefighter, right? Not a trained officer. So it basically it doesn't matter what his profession is, he is a civilian whom intervened in an armed robbery and luckily nobody got hurt by an amateur. Sorry, a perfect example of what should not happen. In this case, it ended good, but what would you have said if it didn't turn out great? Or are you saying that all those police-training is rubbish and everyone could do this?
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 5:44 pm

Tugger wrote:
This is the dumbest problem of "open carry", technically for these type of repeating rifles (don't know for licensed persons open-carrying handguns), I believe they must be unloaded in public. But for everyone else who has learned proper firearm management, you have to assume....
It MUST drive law enforcement in those states nuts.

Tugg


????

No. They are not required to be unloaded in public.
 
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 5:45 pm

Dutchy wrote:
stl07 wrote:
https://www.foxnews.com/us/armed-man-arrested-at-missouri-walmart-police-say

Except this time, there was a "good guy with a gun" to stop it.


that "good guy" was a TRAINED officer.


Sorry, he was a firefighter, right? Not a trained officer. So it basically it doesn't matter what his profession is, he is a civilian whom intervened in an armed robbery and luckily nobody got hurt by an amateur. Sorry, a perfect example of what should not happen. In this case, it ended good, but what would you have said if it didn't turn out great? Or are you saying that all those police-training is rubbish and everyone could do this?


Armed robbery?!?

Guy was legally carrying his weapon. Per Missouri law he was doing nothing wrong. The firefighter might actually face felony assault charges now.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 5:51 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
stl07 wrote:
https://www.foxnews.com/us/armed-man-arrested-at-missouri-walmart-police-say

Except this time, there was a "good guy with a gun" to stop it.


that "good guy" was a TRAINED officer.


Sorry, he was a firefighter, right? Not a trained officer. So it basically it doesn't matter what his profession is, he is a civilian whom intervened in an armed robbery and luckily nobody got hurt by an amateur. Sorry, a perfect example of what should not happen. In this case, it ended good, but what would you have said if it didn't turn out great? Or are you saying that all those police-training is rubbish and everyone could do this?


Armed robbery?!?

Guy was legally carrying his weapon. Per Missouri law he was doing nothing wrong. The firefighter might actually face felony assault charges now.


Doubt it.

"Formal charges of making a terrorist threat in the first degree are now pending against Dmitriy Andreychenko, police say.:"


https://www.npr.org/2019/08/09/74976378 ... n-missouri
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Dutchy
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 5:54 pm

casinterest wrote:

Doubt it.

"Formal charges of making a terrorist threat in the first degree are now pending against Dmitriy Andreychenko, police say.:"


https://www.npr.org/2019/08/09/74976378 ... n-missouri


Ok, but the main thing for me is that a civilian intervened and it could have worked out quite differently especially if he was making terrorist threats.
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casinterest
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 5:59 pm

Dutchy wrote:
casinterest wrote:

Doubt it.

"Formal charges of making a terrorist threat in the first degree are now pending against Dmitriy Andreychenko, police say.:"


https://www.npr.org/2019/08/09/74976378 ... n-missouri


Ok, but the main thing for me is that a civilian intervened and it could have worked out quite differently especially if he was making terrorist threats.


The main thing for me, is that this guy appeared threatening, when by all accounts he was checking his phone, strolling though the store in tactical gear, with loaded guns. Honestly, I thought for a minute this was just a guy preparing for "Judgement Day"

Seriously, by current law , he is allowed to carry like that. Threatening is going to be interesting to see in court, and if they find him guilty, wouldn't that be ammo for all the folks that say that their should be a limit on what is legal ?
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Dutchy
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:06 pm

casinterest wrote:
The main thing for me, is that this guy appeared threatening, when by all accounts he was checking his phone, strolling though the store in tactical gear, with loaded guns. Honestly, I thought for a minute this was just a guy preparing for "Judgement Day"

Seriously, by current law , he is allowed to carry like that. Threatening is going to be interesting to see in court, and if they find him guilty, wouldn't that be ammo for all the folks that say that their should be a limit on what is legal ?


Sure, I think this is two sides of the same coin. The person whom can legitimately - take your word for it - walk around with this kind of gun and people feel threatened by it and another civilian carrying a gun pointing a gun at another civilian just because he thought he was doing the right thing. In both cases, I guess that this is evidence that there are way too many people carrying guns in their daily life in the US and it bound to go wrong at one time, even if everyone has got the best intentions. The policemen are professionals in dealing with this kind of situation, or at least they should be.
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:06 pm

casinterest wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
casinterest wrote:


Ok, but the main thing for me is that a civilian intervened and it could have worked out quite differently especially if he was making terrorist threats.


The main thing for me, is that this guy appeared threatening, when by all accounts he was checking his phone, strolling though the store in tactical gear, with loaded guns. Honestly, I thought for a minute this was just a guy preparing for "Judgement Day"

Seriously, by current law , he is allowed to carry like that. Threatening is going to be interesting to see in court, and if they find him guilty, wouldn't that be ammo for all the folks that say that their should be a limit on what is legal ?


Same thing goes for red flag laws. Who interprets what constitutes threatening? What if he's a big bald white guy with tattoos. Is that threatening? Body builder threatening? With red flag laws, what level of mental illness or thought crimes gets you banned from owning a weapon?

I don't think the DA has a case here. This guy knows the laws. He knew what he was doing. (Disclaimer: I think the guy is an idiot for pulling this stunt - but that doesn't mean he broke the law). I don't think terrorism charges hold here.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:11 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Dutchy wrote:

Ok, but the main thing for me is that a civilian intervened and it could have worked out quite differently especially if he was making terrorist threats.


The main thing for me, is that this guy appeared threatening, when by all accounts he was checking his phone, strolling though the store in tactical gear, with loaded guns. Honestly, I thought for a minute this was just a guy preparing for "Judgement Day"

Seriously, by current law , he is allowed to carry like that. Threatening is going to be interesting to see in court, and if they find him guilty, wouldn't that be ammo for all the folks that say that their should be a limit on what is legal ?


Same thing goes for red flag laws. Who interprets what constitutes threatening? What if he's a big bald white guy with tattoos. Is that threatening? Body builder threatening? With red flag laws, what level of mental illness or thought crimes gets you banned from owning a weapon?

I don't think the DA has a case here. This guy knows the laws. He knew what he was doing. (Disclaimer: I think the guy is an idiot for pulling this stunt - but that doesn't mean he broke the law). I don't think terrorism charges hold here.


This is why we need to restrict the laws so that folks don't go in Terminator style thinking they are exercising their rights/
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Kiwirob
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:14 pm

Dutchy wrote:
stl07 wrote:
https://www.foxnews.com/us/armed-man-arrested-at-missouri-walmart-police-say

Except this time, there was a "good guy with a gun" to stop it.


that "good guy" was a TRAINED officer.


Sorry, he was a firefighter, right? Not a trained officer. So it basically it doesn't matter what his profession is, he is a civilian whom intervened in an armed robbery and luckily nobody got hurt by an amateur. Sorry, a perfect example of what should not happen. In this case, it ended good, but what would you have said if it didn't turn out great? Or are you saying that all those police-training is rubbish and everyone could do this?


There was no armed robbery, just a citizen using is second amendment right to open carry a firearm in a public place.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:26 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
stl07 wrote:
https://www.foxnews.com/us/armed-man-arrested-at-missouri-walmart-police-say

Except this time, there was a "good guy with a gun" to stop it.


that "good guy" was a TRAINED officer.


Sorry, he was a firefighter, right? Not a trained officer. So it basically it doesn't matter what his profession is, he is a civilian whom intervened in an armed robbery and luckily nobody got hurt by an amateur. Sorry, a perfect example of what should not happen. In this case, it ended good, but what would you have said if it didn't turn out great? Or are you saying that all those police-training is rubbish and everyone could do this?


There was no armed robbery, just a citizen using is second amendment right to open carry a firearm in a public place.


Fine, my bad, I misinterpreted things, but see how fast you can misinterpret situations like this in this day and age? And see how dangerous that can be if everybody is armed and their first response is to take a gun and point it at someone?
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MikeDrop
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:32 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Dutchy wrote:

Sorry, he was a firefighter, right? Not a trained officer. So it basically it doesn't matter what his profession is, he is a civilian whom intervened in an armed robbery and luckily nobody got hurt by an amateur. Sorry, a perfect example of what should not happen. In this case, it ended good, but what would you have said if it didn't turn out great? Or are you saying that all those police-training is rubbish and everyone could do this?


There was no armed robbery, just a citizen using is second amendment right to open carry a firearm in a public place.


Fine, my bad, I misinterpreted things, but see how fast you can misinterpret situations like this in this day and age? And see how dangerous that can be if everybody is armed and their first response is to take a gun and point it at someone?

If I recall correctly you don’t live in the US and are not a US citizen. Is this correct?

Mike Drop
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:37 pm

MikeDrop wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:

There was no armed robbery, just a citizen using is second amendment right to open carry a firearm in a public place.


Fine, my bad, I misinterpreted things, but see how fast you can misinterpret situations like this in this day and age? And see how dangerous that can be if everybody is armed and their first response is to take a gun and point it at someone?

If I recall correctly you don’t live in the US and are not a US citizen. Is this correct?

Mike Drop


Yes, Mike, what is your point?
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
MikeDrop
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:56 pm

Dutchy wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:
Dutchy wrote:

Fine, my bad, I misinterpreted things, but see how fast you can misinterpret situations like this in this day and age? And see how dangerous that can be if everybody is armed and their first response is to take a gun and point it at someone?

If I recall correctly you don’t live in the US and are not a US citizen. Is this correct?

Mike Drop


Yes, Mike, what is your point?

No point in the question. I just wanted to gain some understanding about you and avoid making an assumption. Now that I understand more about you I have this question:

Why do you spend so much time commenting on things in the US that have nothing to do you or your country? Your opinion on the status of US constitutional rights is irrelevant, yet you act as if you think it is. Why is that? Aren’t there issues in your own country that could use your attention?

Mike Drop
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:08 pm

MikeDrop wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:
If I recall correctly you don’t live in the US and are not a US citizen. Is this correct?

Mike Drop


Yes, Mike, what is your point?

No point in the question. I just wanted to gain some understanding about you and avoid making an assumption. Now that I understand more about you I have this question:

Why do you spend so much time commenting on things in the US that have nothing to do you or your country? Your opinion on the status of US constitutional rights is irrelevant, yet you act as if you think it is. Why is that? Aren’t there issues in your own country that could use your attention?

Mike Drop


So there was a point in your question and that is that you cannot have an opinion about something which doesn't directly impact your life. Interesting conversations we would have around here. I, myself, would welcome a perspective from another country, so feel free to post your opinion about the Netherlands.

So how is the weather.......
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
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Tugger
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:17 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
Tugger wrote:
This is the dumbest problem of "open carry", technically for these type of repeating rifles (don't know for licensed persons open-carrying handguns), I believe they must be unloaded in public. But for everyone else who has learned proper firearm management, you have to assume....
It MUST drive law enforcement in those states nuts.

Tugg


????

No. They are not required to be unloaded in public.

My expereince is with family in Tennessee where it must be unloaded. I thought that was the normal situation elsewhere. I have now checked and only a few states that allow open-carry restrict it to unloaded only.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
Productivity isn’t about getting more things done, rather it’s about getting the right things done, while doing less. - M. Oshin
 
JJJ
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:17 pm

casinterest wrote:

Seriously, by current law , he is allowed to carry like that. Threatening is going to be interesting to see in court, and if they find him guilty, wouldn't that be ammo for all the folks that say that their should be a limit on what is legal ?


He was recording himself so it should be pretty evident if he was just walking around or did anything that could have been interpreted as threatening by anyone.

He could have easily been shot, though.
 
bhill
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:18 pm

Wait....this person went into a store carrying a RIFLE and put it in a shopping cart and then proceeded to shop?? Was it loaded? Either way, I question this person's judgement. A sidearm in a holster...sure..but this is just weird....
Carpe Pices
 
MikeDrop
Posts: 500
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:24 pm

Dutchy wrote:
MikeDrop wrote:
Dutchy wrote:

Yes, Mike, what is your point?

No point in the question. I just wanted to gain some understanding about you and avoid making an assumption. Now that I understand more about you I have this question:

Why do you spend so much time commenting on things in the US that have nothing to do you or your country? Your opinion on the status of US constitutional rights is irrelevant, yet you act as if you think it is. Why is that? Aren’t there issues in your own country that could use your attention?

Mike Drop


So there was a point in your question and that is that you cannot have an opinion about something which doesn't directly impact your life. Interesting conversations we would have around here. I, myself, would welcome a perspective from another country, so feel free to post your opinion about the Netherlands.

So how is the weather.......

You are welcome to have whatever opinions that you want to have. Nowhere did I say that you cannot. My question was about your motivations. Why do you spend so much time commenting about things that you don’t like in the US? Seems weird to me but hey, whatever, knock yourself out.

Mike Drop
 
wingman
Posts: 3717
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:51 pm

bhill wrote:
Wait....this person went into a store carrying a RIFLE and put it in a shopping cart and then proceeded to shop?? Was it loaded? Either way, I question this person's judgement. A sidearm in a holster...sure..but this is just weird....


Not only totally legal in MS, but the actual end state dream of the NRA. Every single adult man and woman carrying whatever guns they want to with body armor and a 100 or 1000 rounds of ammunition anywhere the public has the right to be. It'd be the Wild West on the kind of knife's edge paranoia you get from 3 days smoking meth. Like I said below, a thousand people crowded into a Walmart on Back Friday and someone misreads a sneeze...BAM!, 400 dead in a heartbeat. That's the dream right there.

I think it moved.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:01 pm

wingman wrote:
bhill wrote:
Wait....this person went into a store carrying a RIFLE and put it in a shopping cart and then proceeded to shop?? Was it loaded? Either way, I question this person's judgement. A sidearm in a holster...sure..but this is just weird....


Not only totally legal in MS, but the actual end state dream of the NRA. Every single adult man and woman carrying whatever guns they want to with body armor and a 100 or 1000 rounds of ammunition anywhere the public has the right to be. It'd be the Wild West on the kind of knife's edge paranoia you get from 3 days smoking meth. Like I said below, a thousand people crowded into a Walmart on Back Friday and someone misreads a sneeze...BAM!, 400 dead in a heartbeat. That's the dream right there.

I think it moved.


just a point of clarification
Missouri is MO
Mississippi MS
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:03 pm

Umm...after reading up the story, it almost seems like the dude is trying to make some point, or is just a gun nuts and openly bring a rifle everywhere on purpose. Holding up a phone = make people think that he's going to pull off another NZ Mosque shooting and putting that on FB Live.

Ultimately, I really don't know if the dude did anything illegal given the MO gun laws, as long as he didn't do any actual verbal threat. People like him needs to have their guns taken away IMHO, though.
 
dmg626
Posts: 292
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:30 pm

Open carry is just plain stupid and used by people who want to intimidate the general public. Unless your on your own property, like a ranch or open land, it should not be allowed. “exercising” your right makes you look like a dildo and in this case if the firefighter shot him than that’s one less dildo walking around in this world
 
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Tugger
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:34 pm

In what states can stores and other such private parties and entities ban open-carry?

Also, in open carry states can a state entity (like a state fair) ban open carry? (I'm thinking it's a public space so maybe not.)

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
Productivity isn’t about getting more things done, rather it’s about getting the right things done, while doing less. - M. Oshin
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:34 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
Same thing goes for red flag laws. Who interprets what constitutes threatening?


And therein lies the problem; you’re talking about taking action against someone without the benefit of due process. Let me simplify “Red Flag Law” for you. The very same folks who report your tweets as ‘offensive’ will be able to call a police hotline and have them come seize your weapons...

There you go. Simple. It’s like “pre-crime” from the Minority Report.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
seb146
Posts: 20202
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:46 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
trpmb6 wrote:
Same thing goes for red flag laws. Who interprets what constitutes threatening?


And therein lies the problem; you’re talking about taking action against someone without the benefit of due process. Let me simplify “Red Flag Law” for you. The very same folks who report your tweets as ‘offensive’ will be able to call a police hotline and have them come seize your weapons...

There you go. Simple. It’s like “pre-crime” from the Minority Report.


Not quite so simple

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/what-are-r ... nted-them/

For someone to TEMPORARILY have their weapons taken, parties must present to a court exactly why they should have their weapons taken. There must be a good reason other than "s/he said something I don't like". There must be proof there is a legitimate threat. Like the mother of the El Paso right wing domestic terrorist. She tried to warn authorities but, nothing happened. So, there is due process. Not just simply busting down the door and taking everything within five minutes of a report.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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Tugger
Posts: 9262
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Re: Armed off-duty firefighter halts armed suspect at Walmart store in Missouri

Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:51 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
trpmb6 wrote:
Same thing goes for red flag laws. Who interprets what constitutes threatening?


And therein lies the problem; you’re talking about taking action against someone without the benefit of due process. Let me simplify “Red Flag Law” for you. The very same folks who report your tweets as ‘offensive’ will be able to call a police hotline and have them come seize your weapons...

There you go. Simple. It’s like “pre-crime” from the Minority Report.

Except for the fact one creates a situation where "killing" and all that exists while the other really does not. It can foment outcry and others to do stuff but not directly, you know, being able to "kill" another person at a distance.

So, yeah, crazy people shouting on a corner or someone online getting in your face versus someone shooting you at a distance.... Hmmm. nope, no difference that I can see at all! We gotta treat them exactly the same!

To be clear on my position:
Support the right of citizens to own/have/use firearms
Oppose open carry
Support concealed weapons allowance with proper license and meeting the requirements for such
Oppose unrestricted purchase/access to "burst fire" and other similar weapons that can be converted easily to single trigger-pull, multiple rounds fired firearms. Maybe with training and certification.
Support background checks required on ALL weapons transactions, private party, inheritance, or otherwise.
Support hunting, home defense, self defense etc. Learn your weapon, care for your weapon, use your weapon. Go gun ownership!

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
Productivity isn’t about getting more things done, rather it’s about getting the right things done, while doing less. - M. Oshin

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