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casinterest
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ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 5:32 pm

Interesting news item from the past few weeks.
ICE has been raiding businesses, as they should to detain those that have come to this country illegally and gotten jobs without the proper work papers

Unfortunately these raids are going to have some long term systemic ramifications as this issue has been boiling over for decades.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/201 ... sippi.html

In one of the poorest stares in the nation, the local economies are being devastated by the raids.
"The state’s largest agricultural product is chicken, and longtime residents say the arrival of Latino immigrants has filled classrooms, revived communities, and sustained local businesses. “If they removed every illegal in town, we’d be in big trouble,” Martha Rogers, the 76-year-old CEO of the Bank of Morton, told me earlier in the day, as she contemplated what might result from last week’s raids. “I’m for limiting who can come into this country. But people who are already here, who have jobs and are contributing? There should be some avenue for them to be legal.”


This small town is going to be devastated.

Some may argue that the jobs will be created elsewhere, but at what costs to the small communities?
Will the jobs even be in the US?
Are any of the managers facing criminal charges? To this point I see no indication that these companies are being penalized for the lax hiring oversight that obviously went into employing these folks.

Will these actions by ICE continue, further destroying rural american companies and the agricultural economies that depend on them?
it seems rather ironic, that the Administration that was elected to protect Rural Americans may ultimately destroy their livelihoods.
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mham001
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 5:54 pm

Trump was not elected to protect illegals in Rural America. These people had to commit fraud and identity theft to work all these years, and then they all know how to scam the W4 form to pay no income taxes. While Slate and the liberal media like to print these puff pieces to solicit tears, Mississippi has a 6% unemployment rate in a country with ~3%. Want to make a bet on who is disproportionally affected by that? The 35% Black population in Morton - 8% of whom are unemployed. Simply another example of how lax immigration policies are hurting poor rural (and urban) US citizens.
Last edited by mham001 on Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:05 pm, edited 3 times in total.
 
windy95
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 5:55 pm

Following the rule of law is destroying rural America? A little dramatic don't you think?
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casinterest
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:03 pm

windy95 wrote:
Following the rule of law is destroying rural America? A little dramatic don't you think?


But it does right?
Many jobs over the last 3 decades have been lost to the cities and overseas from rural America. Some of their last bit of stability has been found by latching onto lower cost workers and keeping businesses through very questionable local tax policies. Without people to work for cheap, how do these companies survive? How do they stay in rural areas or even in the US?
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
tommy1808
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:16 pm

casinterest wrote:
Without people to work for cheap, how do these companies survive? How do they stay in rural areas or even in the US?


Plus no one really minded, otherwise crackdowns on the employers would have been common place since forever. As long as there is demand, there is supply.

Heck, if anyone really minded the illegal low wage labour force, just offer amnesty, work permit and a way to citizenship for anyone reporting their employer, and jobs for illegals would pretty much disappear, and pretty much over night.

Can't go after employers, Trump wasn't elected to go after himself...

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jdstJD
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:33 pm

It rubs me the wrong way when people say immigrants will do the jobs that Americans won’t do. That should not be the reason to acquiesce in the illegal immigration problem. Americans who need jobs need to get off of their high horse and get to work. Fight the fight of raising wages to a livable wage to support a good quality of life but don’t just say you refuse to work a certain job because you’re too good to do it.

Another issue that bothers me is when people (like trump and his supporters and administration ) say that illegal immigrants take jobs away from blacks and Hispanics, as though white people wouldn’t also need to compete for those jobs. Black people are not only worth working low wage jobs. Just like every other group we have plenty of people who are highly educated and currently hold or need jobs at all levels. And every other group is susceptible to lower wage jobs not being available to them because of illegal immigration.
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NoTime
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:37 pm

Come on, man...

"ICE Raids destroying Rural America" - and you list one example from one town?
 
Olddog
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:38 pm

Yes, if you want to be effective, the crackdown must be on the employers. Without them, way less illegals coming in and maybe more real american jobs.
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mham001
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:46 pm

Employers and managers are routinely prosecuted - it just doesn't make the big headlines and gives liberals a false talking point. Prosecuting the company and its managers is why they haul off the records on the first day, they need to find out who knew what. Often it is employment agencies who are committing the fraud, such as we are also seeing with the H1B scams. A contractor in my city was recently sentenced to 12 years in prison for knowingly hiring illegals, for example.

But Mississippi..

Department of Justice
U.S. Attorney’s Office
Southern District of Mississippi

Friday, April 12, 2019
Business Owner and Managers Sentenced to Federal Prison for Immigration Crimes
Defendants Also Forfeited and Fined Almost One Million Dollars for Illegal Acts

Or another big raid in 2008 resulted in...

The Howard Industries, Inc. transformer manufacturing plant was the subject of an immigration sweep on August 25, 2008, that resulted in the administrative arrest of nearly 600 illegal aliens who were working at the plant.

Howard Industries, Inc. waived indictment and pled guilty to a felony information. Howard Industries, Inc. further agreed to pay a criminal fine in the amount of $2.5 million.

Thursday's guilty plea by Howard Industries, Inc. follows the earlier plea of Jose Humberto González, former Human Resources Manager for Howard Industries, Inc., who pled guilty to a similar federal criminal conspiracy charge relating to the employment of unlawful aliens at the Howard Industries electrical transformer plant in Laurel.
https://www.wlox.com/story/14138038/how ... onspiracy/
 
mham001
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:07 pm

jdstJD wrote:
It rubs me the wrong way when people say immigrants will do the jobs that Americans won’t do. That should not be the reason to acquiesce in the illegal immigration problem. Americans who need jobs need to get off of their high horse and get to work. Fight the fight of raising wages to a livable wage to support a good quality of life but don’t just say you refuse to work a certain job because you’re too good to do it.

Another issue that bothers me is when people (like trump and his supporters and administration ) say that illegal immigrants take jobs away from blacks and Hispanics, as though white people wouldn’t also need to compete for those jobs. Black people are not only worth working low wage jobs. Just like every other group we have plenty of people who are highly educated and currently hold or need jobs at all levels. And every other group is susceptible to lower wage jobs not being available to them because of illegal immigration.


I have to respond to this because it is Democratic liberal advocates who ROUTINELY bring up the black unemployment as evidence of the white man suppressing blacks. Yet here we have direct evidence that illegals are gainfully employed while a disproportionate amount of black people - who are US citizens first and foremost, remain unemployed. And nobody said whites are not included in the loss of income, on the other hand nobody can deny that blacks are not disproportionally affected in blue collar industries in regions with high black populations. Read the study of Black unemployment in Los Angeles by UCLA and see the direct correlation between black construction jobs and the huge influx of illegals in the '90's and 00's.

Here is what happens in an industry, for those living in their ivory towers. Once illegals begin to infiltrate an industry, wages stagnate and decline. This makes the industry less attractive to young Americans graduating school looking for a career. I know this for a fact because I have recruited many times. The lack of interest simply spurs more hiring of illegals "because Americans won't do that". And why would they when they are competing in wages with people and companies who pay no taxes and have no stake. I lived through 20 years of this myself, after 6 years of specialized training in a trade, only to see it overrun by illegals in the late 90's and 00's. Today, you won't get hired on may jobsites without speaking Spanish. They depressed the low end of the market, which in turn suppresses the high end. They stole money off the table of my family for 20 years.

Now, because I am white and say that, I am called Racist! in this forum by the usual suspects. So for this reason, I don't point out the plight of blue collar whites because they are lower life forms for many liberal elites. I am sorry that conversely pointing out the plight of blacks insults you and other liberals but it cannot be denied, illegals steal jobs from blue collar workers and blacks ARE disproportionately affected. This has to hurt a liberal Democratic apologist.
Last edited by mham001 on Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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casinterest
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:22 pm

NoTime wrote:
Come on, man...

"ICE Raids destroying Rural America" - and you list one example from one town?


https://www.wbir.com/article/news/local ... 7996142380
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/h ... 230026.php
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mham001
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:32 pm

casinterest wrote:
NoTime wrote:
Come on, man...

"ICE Raids destroying Rural America" - and you list one example from one town?


https://www.wbir.com/article/news/local ... 7996142380
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/h ... 230026.php


Neither of those articles backs your point.

Rutledge mayor Speck Sykes agrees.

"Very little effect--minimal effect, if any," Sykes said. "It's just like anything that happens in town. Two or three days and everyone goes about their own business. And it goes away."

Sykes says a couple of businesses in Rutledge did close in the last year--Jarnigan Ford Dealership and the local grocery store.

But he says those closures were unrelated to the raid.

"I see no reason why it would affect us in any way," Sykes said.

For Mitchell, he hopes the meatpacking plant can recover.

"I'm just hoping that it can open back up soon," Mitchell said.

Mitchell said the owner of Southeastern Provisions says he hopes to be back open in the next couple of weeks.
 
seb146
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:41 pm

So, according to righties, illegals all live high on the hog on welfare but these illegals were arrested working. Which is it?
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casinterest
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:43 pm

mham001 wrote:
casinterest wrote:
NoTime wrote:
Come on, man...

"ICE Raids destroying Rural America" - and you list one example from one town?


https://www.wbir.com/article/news/local ... 7996142380
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/h ... 230026.php


Neither of those articles backs your point.

Rutledge mayor Speck Sykes agrees.

"Very little effect--minimal effect, if any," Sykes said. "It's just like anything that happens in town. Two or three days and everyone goes about their own business. And it goes away."

Sykes says a couple of businesses in Rutledge did close in the last year--Jarnigan Ford Dealership and the local grocery store.

But he says those closures were unrelated to the raid.

"I see no reason why it would affect us in any way," Sykes said.

For Mitchell, he hopes the meatpacking plant can recover.

"I'm just hoping that it can open back up soon," Mitchell said.

Mitchell said the owner of Southeastern Provisions says he hopes to be back open in the next couple of weeks.


I would say my point has been made by your quotes.

Glam artist mayors acting like nothing has happened, yet businesses are shut down, and they are 'hoping" they can get back up.
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stratclub
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:52 pm

Don't forget that by stopping the flow of illegal drugs into our country, we are destroying the livelihood of hard working drug dealers and driving up the street price of illegal drugs. Yup. Criminals are being victimized when they break the law and get arrested for it.

Just one example of CNN's Jake Tapper trying to push false "Humanitarian" narratives. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gdfJ4_S538
 
mham001
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:59 pm

casinterest wrote:
I would say my point has been made by your quotes.

Glam artist mayors acting like nothing has happened, yet businesses are shut down, and they are 'hoping" they can get back up.


I imagine the mayor of the nearby town (pop 1,100) would know more about it than you and have more interest since he is the one the locals will judge at the ballot box. But really, 100 jobs in a county of 22,000...

Looking further...
The owner of a Grainger County meatpacking plant agreed to plead guilty to charges for tax evasion, wire fraud and employing undocumented immigrants that stemmed from a federal immigration raid in April of this year.

A plea agreement filed Thursday details the methods Southeastern Provision owner James Brantley used to avoid paying nearly $1.3 million in taxes, hire at least 150 undocumented immigrants and withdraw a total of $25 million in cash to pay them in large weekly amounts from a local bank for several years.
https://www.wbir.com/article/news/local ... -585057981
 
MaverickM11
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:03 pm

mham001 wrote:
Employers and managers are routinely prosecuted - it just doesn't make the big headlines and gives liberals a false talking point

Nonsense. It's smoke and mirrors for the masses. Has ICE stopped by Devin Nunes' family farm? US Agriculture would grind to a halt without undocumented workers. The owners know that, the government knows that...Trump probably thinks eggs come from bunnies and continues to hire undocumented labor regardless. And owners claiming "I didn't know" or "it's the employment agency" is the oldest trick in the book. They know exactly what they're doing--hundreds of non english speaking immigrants don't just decide to go to East Upchuck Alabama on a whim. And I'm sure all the owners are GOP supporters.
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casinterest
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:07 pm

mham001 wrote:
casinterest wrote:
I would say my point has been made by your quotes.

Glam artist mayors acting like nothing has happened, yet businesses are shut down, and they are 'hoping" they can get back up.


I imagine the mayor of the nearby town (pop 1,100) would know more about it than you and have more interest since he is the one the locals will judge at the ballot box. But really, 100 jobs in a county of 22,000...

Looking further...
The owner of a Grainger County meatpacking plant agreed to plead guilty to charges for tax evasion, wire fraud and employing undocumented immigrants that stemmed from a federal immigration raid in April of this year.

A plea agreement filed Thursday details the methods Southeastern Provision owner James Brantley used to avoid paying nearly $1.3 million in taxes, hire at least 150 undocumented immigrants and withdraw a total of $25 million in cash to pay them in large weekly amounts from a local bank for several years.
https://www.wbir.com/article/news/local ... -585057981


https://www.marketwatch.com/story/job-g ... 2019-08-02

Image

ince the economy began adding jobs after the Great Recession nine years ago, about 21.5 million jobs have been created in the United States, the second-best stretch of hiring in the nation’s history, second only to the 1990s.

But job growth isn’t being spread evenly across the land. Most of the new jobs have been located in a just a few dozen large and dynamic cities, leaving slower-growing cities, small towns and rural areas — where about half of Americans live — far behind.
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WingsFan
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:14 pm

casinterest wrote:
windy95 wrote:
Following the rule of law is destroying rural America? A little dramatic don't you think?


But it does right?
Many jobs over the last 3 decades have been lost to the cities and overseas from rural America. Some of their last bit of stability has been found by latching onto lower cost workers and keeping businesses through very questionable local tax policies. Without people to work for cheap, how do these companies survive? How do they stay in rural areas or even in the US?



If a business or an industry needs underpaid workers with few rights and no job mobility to survive, perhaps it is not a business worthy of staying afloat. If the job is that hard to retain workers then wages should reflect the true worth.
 
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casinterest
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:21 pm

WingsFan wrote:
casinterest wrote:
windy95 wrote:
Following the rule of law is destroying rural America? A little dramatic don't you think?


But it does right?
Many jobs over the last 3 decades have been lost to the cities and overseas from rural America. Some of their last bit of stability has been found by latching onto lower cost workers and keeping businesses through very questionable local tax policies. Without people to work for cheap, how do these companies survive? How do they stay in rural areas or even in the US?



If a business or an industry needs underpaid workers with few rights and no job mobility to survive, perhaps it is not a business worthy of staying afloat. If the job is that hard to retain workers then wages should reflect the true worth.


Quite possibly, but we are currently in a trade war that is destroying the economy for that very reason. The Truth of the matter is that if your job doesn't require a lot of thinking, it can be replaced by a human or robot doing it for far less someplace else. Now how do we balance that with the "need" for a strong dollar?
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mham001
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:34 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
mham001 wrote:
Employers and managers are routinely prosecuted - it just doesn't make the big headlines and gives liberals a false talking point

Nonsense. It's smoke and mirrors for the masses.


I have presented several sourced prosecutions without even trying. What sourced evidence do you have for your assertion?

Here is another from a source right up your alley, People's World...

Shady contractors jailed in Bay area and on Long Island
June 20, 2019
https://www.peoplesworld.org/article/sh ... ng-island/
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:45 pm

mham001 wrote:
Trump was not elected to protect illegals in Rural America.

But the catch here is that rural American interests are affected. I mean for all the talk about "these people are taking our jobs", I don't see people signing up to help with farms or construction work. The thing is that it's like chemotherapy: affecting the whole to get rid of a small thing. Farmers are now short of labor, but frankly they dug their graves, let them lay in them.

mham001 wrote:
These people had to commit fraud and identity theft to work all these years, and then they all know how to scam the W4 form to pay no income taxes.

Sure, because a regular American is so innocent that none would ever commit fraud or identity theft? Why would you even think that a poor Latino, emigrating after leaving everything they owned behind, would immediately resort to fraud and identity theft.

Conservatives hate to be lumped with people they don't like (you can't, for example, say that if a single conservative is racist, then all conservatives are racist), but they sure have no problem generalizing.

mham001 wrote:
While Slate and the liberal media like to print these puff pieces to solicit tears,

Call out your side that also attempts to stir fear and anxiety when there is none. Remember Coffeegate and how Fox News and others fumed for days?

mham001 wrote:
Mississippi has a 6% unemployment rate in a country with ~3%.

Which shows that conservative policies haven't worked to lift the state from last place.

mham001 wrote:
Want to make a bet on who is disproportionally affected by that? The 35% Black population in Morton - 8% of whom are unemployed.

In an area known to still be hostile towards Black and which had to be dragged into the 20th century through legislation and amendments and which doesn't even have a minimum wage, you're really going to blame black unemployment on immigrants (legal or otherwise)? Why not blame the ones who hired them in the first place (it's clear that even at a federal minimum wage, a Black American has to be paid the same as a White, but exceptions can be made for immigrants who can be paid less)?

mham001 wrote:
Simply another example of how lax immigration policies are hurting poor rural (and urban) US citizens.

Again, for all the outcry about illegals taking our jobs, I'm not seeing people giving up their factory jobs and coal mining jobs to work the fields or do construction work, or be janitors or bus drivers or caretakers (in the case of women).

Maybe this year it's not a big deal: Midwestern farms have barely planted crops and for the little that they have, China is not buying. But maybe next year weather improves and trade resumes...except many farmers will find themselves without workers.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
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LAXintl
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:53 pm

I have zero sympathies for these companies that hire illegal aliens, especially in such brazen form by the hundreds.

Frankly, I wish management would be criminally charged as well and huge penalties levied against companies that turn a blind eye to basic employment law in the country.
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MaverickM11
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Wed Aug 14, 2019 9:37 pm

WingsFan wrote:
casinterest wrote:
windy95 wrote:
Following the rule of law is destroying rural America? A little dramatic don't you think?


But it does right?
Many jobs over the last 3 decades have been lost to the cities and overseas from rural America. Some of their last bit of stability has been found by latching onto lower cost workers and keeping businesses through very questionable local tax policies. Without people to work for cheap, how do these companies survive? How do they stay in rural areas or even in the US?



If a business or an industry needs underpaid workers with few rights and no job mobility to survive, perhaps it is not a business worthy of staying afloat. If the job is that hard to retain workers then wages should reflect the true worth.

*cough* coal *cough*

mham001 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
mham001 wrote:
Employers and managers are routinely prosecuted - it just doesn't make the big headlines and gives liberals a false talking point

Nonsense. It's smoke and mirrors for the masses.


I have presented several sourced prosecutions without even trying. What sourced evidence do you have for your assertion?

Here is another from a source right up your alley, People's World...

Shady contractors jailed in Bay area and on Long Island
June 20, 2019
https://www.peoplesworld.org/article/sh ... ng-island/

You can google results for days, and it still wouldn't cover the tip of the iceberg of an industry that is up to 50% or more dependent on undocumented immigrants

stratclub wrote:
Don't forget that by stopping the flow of illegal drugs into our country, we are destroying the livelihood of hard working drug dealers and driving up the street price of illegal drugs. Yup. Criminals are being victimized when they break the law and get arrested for it.

Just one example of CNN's Jake Tapper trying to push false "Humanitarian" narratives. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gdfJ4_S538

You have no idea what you're talking about. As per usual.

mham001 wrote:
While Slate and the liberal media like to print these puff pieces to solicit tears, Mississippi has a 6% unemployment rate in a country with ~3%. Want to make a bet on who is disproportionally affected by that? The 35% Black population in Morton - 8% of whom are unemployed. Simply another example of how lax immigration policies are hurting poor rural (and urban) US citizens.

This is the biggest crock of garbage. It's impossible to decide whom the bible belt GOP leaders care about less: undocumented immigrants or black people, nor overstate their--and yes, previously white supremacist democrats--contribution to their dismal plight.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
mham001
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:49 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
This is the biggest crock of garbage. It's impossible to decide whom the bible belt GOP leaders care about less: undocumented immigrants or black people, nor overstate their--and yes, previously white supremacist democrats--contribution to their dismal plight.


I'm sorry. I had no idea bible belt GOP leaders had control of federal immigration policy for the last 20-30 years.
 
MaverickM11
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:12 am

mham001 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
This is the biggest crock of garbage. It's impossible to decide whom the bible belt GOP leaders care about less: undocumented immigrants or black people, nor overstate their--and yes, previously white supremacist democrats--contribution to their dismal plight.


I'm sorry. I had no idea bible belt GOP leaders had control of federal immigration policy for the last 20-30 years.

Right because the bible belt's misery started 30 years ago :roll: ...because of immigration :roll: :roll: :roll: And those same leaders had no problem with cheap labor either...especially when they could get rid of it whenever it was convenient to whip up white resentment
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 2:54 am

Please stop the personal attacks. If you have a problem with a post please report it and the moderation team will take care of it. Thanks
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stratclub
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:05 am

stratclub wrote:
Don't forget that by stopping the flow of illegal drugs into our country, we are destroying the livelihood of hard working drug dealers and driving up the street price of illegal drugs. Yup. Criminals are being victimized when they break the law and get arrested for it.

Just one example of CNN's Jake Tapper trying to push false "Humanitarian" narratives. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gdfJ4_S538

MaverickM11 wrote:
You have no idea what you're talking about. As per usual.

Usual Liberal deflection Bro. Accuse others of what you are guilty of and then go to your safe space and have a meltdown because someone dared to destroyed your delusion with facts.

The point of my first post is using Liberal logic people breaking the law are victims when their actions cause them to get arrested/detained and separated from their children.
Last edited by stratclub on Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
seb146
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:12 am

stratclub wrote:
stratclub wrote:
Don't forget that by stopping the flow of illegal drugs into our country, we are destroying the livelihood of hard working drug dealers and driving up the street price of illegal drugs. Yup. Criminals are being victimized when they break the law and get arrested for it.

Just one example of CNN's Jake Tapper trying to push false "Humanitarian" narratives. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gdfJ4_S538

MaverickM11 wrote:
You have no idea what you're talking about. As per usual.

Usual Liberal deflection. Accuse others of what you are guilty of and then go to your safe space and have a meltdown because someone destroyed your delusion with facts.

The point of my first post is using Liberal logic people breaking the law are victims when their actions cause them to get arrested/detained and separated from their children.


An AMERICAN hired illegals because....? Republicans are constantly whining that "illegals are stealing jobs from Americans". Well.... several positions just opened up in Mississippi. Get to it!

Plenty of white, English speaking people refuse to do that kind of work. To top it off, it is white, English speaking people who collect welfare more than immigrants. White, English speaking people would rather sit around collecting welfare than do an honest days' work like those who were trying to feed and clothe and house their families with hard work.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
tommy1808
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Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 5:02 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
mham001 wrote:
Employers and managers are routinely prosecuted - it just doesn't make the big headlines and gives liberals a false talking point

Nonsense..


:checkmark:

e-verify wouldn´t be "come one, it would be really, really nice if you signed up for it if that doesn´t bother you too much", it would be "You can not hire a single employee without e-verify or you go to prison/we fine you until you are broke."

Becoming ICE IMAGE "certfied" is such a low bar that ISO 9001 seems hard to get.... https://www.ice.gov/image

Compliance is a "mutal agreement" not a requirement and the SELF-ASSESSMENT QUESTIONNAIRE makes pretty clear that any sort of check ups is close to non existent. It would´t be "have your Form I-9 ever been inspected", it would be "How often" otherwise....

People employing illegals probably only get prosecuted if they pissed someone off that can send some law enforcement over....

best regards
Thomas
This Singature is a safe space......
 
stratosphere
Posts: 1672
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2007 12:45 pm

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:25 pm

LAXintl wrote:
I have zero sympathies for these companies that hire illegal aliens, especially in such brazen form by the hundreds.

Frankly, I wish management would be criminally charged as well and huge penalties levied against companies that turn a blind eye to basic employment law in the country.


This is exactly why we will never solve this problem..These ICE raids are just a dog and pony show. We could put the brakes on the flood of illegals coming here very easy by turning the screws on employers. E verify and high fines and imprisonment for management for knowingly hiring illegals would be a great start.. But lets face it big biz loves cheap labor that illegals provide and you can include Trump properties in that mix and the Democrats are pandering and trying to find a way to include them in the voting process. The Chamber of Commerce is opposed to anything that would impede the flow of illegals as well so you have too many special interests that want to see this continue. As long as we allow lobbying and dark money to control our legislators you will never see any improvement.
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 9373
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:39 pm

stratosphere wrote:
LAXintl wrote:
I have zero sympathies for these companies that hire illegal aliens, especially in such brazen form by the hundreds.

Frankly, I wish management would be criminally charged as well and huge penalties levied against companies that turn a blind eye to basic employment law in the country.


This is exactly why we will never solve this problem..These ICE raids are just a dog and pony show. We could put the brakes on the flood of illegals coming here very easy by turning the screws on employers. E verify and high fines and imprisonment for management for knowingly hiring illegals would be a great start.. But lets face it big biz loves cheap labor that illegals provide and you can include Trump properties in that mix and the Democrats are pandering and trying to find a way to include them in the voting process. The Chamber of Commerce is opposed to anything that would impede the flow of illegals as well so you have too many special interests that want to see this continue. As long as we allow lobbying and dark money to control our legislators you will never see any improvement.


Precisely. As I have pointed out many times before, members of this very WH are trying to help the Chamber of Commerce with their cheap labor project, but certain posters here never seem to take issue with that. It boggles the mind.

https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politi ... 48714.html

https://dailycaller.com/2019/04/25/kush ... -backlash/

https://patch.com/district-columbia/was ... an-workers
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 17417
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 9:16 pm

stratclub wrote:
stratclub wrote:
Don't forget that by stopping the flow of illegal drugs into our country, we are destroying the livelihood of hard working drug dealers and driving up the street price of illegal drugs. Yup. Criminals are being victimized when they break the law and get arrested for it.

Just one example of CNN's Jake Tapper trying to push false "Humanitarian" narratives. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gdfJ4_S538

MaverickM11 wrote:
You have no idea what you're talking about. As per usual.

Usual Liberal deflection Bro. Accuse others of what you are guilty of and then go to your safe space and have a meltdown because someone dared to destroyed your delusion with facts.

The point of my first post is using Liberal logic people breaking the law are victims when their actions cause them to get arrested/detained and separated from their children.

No deflection. Just a complete and total lack of understanding of how drugs get into this country and immigration law. As I'd expect.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
stratclub
Posts: 1326
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:38 pm

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 11:26 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
stratclub wrote:
stratclub wrote:
Don't forget that by stopping the flow of illegal drugs into our country, we are destroying the livelihood of hard working drug dealers and driving up the street price of illegal drugs. Yup. Criminals are being victimized when they break the law and get arrested for it.

Just one example of CNN's Jake Tapper trying to push false "Humanitarian" narratives. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gdfJ4_S538


Usual Liberal deflection Bro. Accuse others of what you are guilty of and then go to your safe space and have a meltdown because someone dared to destroyed your delusion with facts.

The point of my first post is using Liberal logic people breaking the law are victims when their actions cause them to get arrested/detained and separated from their children.

No deflection. Just a complete and total lack of understanding of how drugs get into this country and immigration law. As I'd expect.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree then. So tell me why we should have in effect an uncontrolled border and have to spend billions of our tax dollars (estimated at $135 billion annually) on people that are not citizens. That money could much better be spent paying down the national debt.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 17417
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Thu Aug 15, 2019 11:39 pm

stratclub wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
stratclub wrote:
Usual Liberal deflection Bro. Accuse others of what you are guilty of and then go to your safe space and have a meltdown because someone dared to destroyed your delusion with facts.

The point of my first post is using Liberal logic people breaking the law are victims when their actions cause them to get arrested/detained and separated from their children.

No deflection. Just a complete and total lack of understanding of how drugs get into this country and immigration law. As I'd expect.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree then. So tell me why we should have in effect an uncontrolled border and have to spend billions of our tax dollars (estimated at $135 billion annually) on people that are not citizens. That money could much better be spent paying down the national debt.

No one is suggesting we should have an uncontrolled border.

The drugs mostly come through ports of entry--like the $1B of cocaine found on a ship in Philadelphia.

Paying down the national debt would mean more when the republicans aren't blowing it to stratospheric levels never seen before.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 9373
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 12:22 am

stratclub wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
stratclub wrote:
Usual Liberal deflection Bro. Accuse others of what you are guilty of and then go to your safe space and have a meltdown because someone dared to destroyed your delusion with facts.

The point of my first post is using Liberal logic people breaking the law are victims when their actions cause them to get arrested/detained and separated from their children.

No deflection. Just a complete and total lack of understanding of how drugs get into this country and immigration law. As I'd expect.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree then. So tell me why we should have in effect an uncontrolled border and have to spend billions of our tax dollars (estimated at $135 billion annually) on people that are not citizens. That money could much better be spent paying down the national debt.


Take it up with Kushner, Purdue, and the CofC then...
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
seb146
Posts: 20258
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 4:27 am

stratclub wrote:
So tell me why we should have in effect an uncontrolled border


This right wing talking point has just become a thing recently. I want to see the exact words where anyone but the right talks about "uncontrolled" or "open" borders. It seems to be a right wing phenomenon they want so desperately Democrats to have. But, I want to see where the right is getting this misinformation.

stratclub wrote:
and have to spend billions of our tax dollars (estimated at $135 billion annually) on people that are not citizens. That money could much better be spent paying down the national debt.


Source for your numbers? Is that including police and fire that we all pay for or does that include immigration attorneys immigrants use to turn their green card into full citizenship? Republicans have been in control of all three branches of government for over two years. They had every opportunity to balance the budget and lower the debt. What happened? When you answer, keep in mind that Republicans had control of the White House, the House Of Representatives, the Senate, and the Supreme Court.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
tommy1808
Posts: 10644
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 6:52 am

stratclub wrote:
I guess we will have to agree to disagree then. So tell me why we should have in effect an uncontrolled border and have to spend billions of our tax dollars (estimated at $135 billion annually) on people that are not citizens. That money could much better be spent paying down the national debt.


Since non-citizens pay in excess of 300 billion in taxes that won´t really work the way you imagine it. Like it or not, non-citizens almost invariably pay more than they cost across the planet.

best regards
Thomas
This Singature is a safe space......
 
stratclub
Posts: 1326
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:38 pm

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:59 am

tommy1808 wrote:
stratclub wrote:
I guess we will have to agree to disagree then. So tell me why we should have in effect an uncontrolled border and have to spend billions of our tax dollars (estimated at $135 billion annually) on people that are not citizens. That money could much better be spent paying down the national debt.


Since non-citizens pay in excess of 300 billion in taxes that won´t really work the way you imagine it. Like it or not, non-citizens almost invariably pay more than they cost across the planet.

best regards
Thomas

Interesting thought. I think you are referring to legal aliens that are classified as tax residents. People that are illegal would not be classified as a tax resident and even pay taxes as they could not legally get a SSN. Do you have a link that explains the $300 billion dollar claim?

https://immigration.findlaw.com/visas/i ... taxes.html
"There are many situations in which you may be required to pay United States taxes even if you are not a U.S. citizen. Whether or not you have to file and pay taxes depends on whether the government has classified you as a tax resident or not. For example, all permanent residents, or holders of green cards, are considered to be tax residents. Not all non-immigrant visa holders are tax residents, however. Even if you are not a tax resident, it may still be a good idea to file an income tax return if you have been working for an employer that withholds taxes from your wages - you might get a tax refund."

https://www.google.com/search?client=op ... 61qdSJshDI
"To Obtain a New Social Security Number and Card you will need to provide at least two documents to prove age, identity, and U.S. citizenship or current immigration status. To Obtain a Replacement Card, if lost or stolen, you must prove your identity and U.S. citizenship."

I'm not against people that are here legally, but our immigration system does need to be fixed so that "We the People" as citizens can maintain control of our border and can have a say on to who is allowed into our country just like most every other country does. What I am against is the Socialist/Liberal/Democratic plan is that we have uncontrolled borders so everyone on the planet can come here and get "free stuff" on our dime and vote here by just showing up at our border.
 
tommy1808
Posts: 10644
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:19 am

stratclub wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:
stratclub wrote:
I guess we will have to agree to disagree then. So tell me why we should have in effect an uncontrolled border and have to spend billions of our tax dollars (estimated at $135 billion annually) on people that are not citizens. That money could much better be spent paying down the national debt.


Since non-citizens pay in excess of 300 billion in taxes that won´t really work the way you imagine it. Like it or not, non-citizens almost invariably pay more than they cost across the planet.

best regards
Thomas

Interesting thought. I think you are referring to legal aliens that are classified as tax residents.


You said "People that are not citizens", that is any non resident in the country, not just illegals.

best regards
Thomas
This Singature is a safe space......
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 17417
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 2:01 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
stratclub wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:

Since non-citizens pay in excess of 300 billion in taxes that won´t really work the way you imagine it. Like it or not, non-citizens almost invariably pay more than they cost across the planet.

best regards
Thomas

Interesting thought. I think you are referring to legal aliens that are classified as tax residents.


You said "People that are not citizens", that is any non resident in the country, not just illegals.

best regards
Thomas

I don't think stratclub knows the difference. The Trump admin, however, does.

Here's a fun reminder of one of the many times we went through this rigmarole:

When The U.S. Government Tried To Replace Migrant Farmworkers With High Schoolers

https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/20 ... YKyAN7b5Ag

"But farmers complained — in words that echo today's headlines — that Mexican laborers did the jobs that Americans didn't want to do, and that the end of the Bracero Program meant that crops would rot in the fields.

Wirtz cited this labor shortage and a lack of summer jobs for high schoolers as reason enough for the program. But he didn't want just any band geek or nerd — he wanted jocks."

"Problems arose immediately for the A-TEAM nationwide. In California's Salinas Valley, 200 teenagers from New Mexico, Kansas and Wyoming quit after just two weeks on the job. "We worked three days and all of us are broke," the Associated Press quoted one teen as saying. Students elsewhere staged strikes. At the end, the A-TEAM was considered a giant failure and was never tried again."

White people didn't last two weeks, in jobs migrants do for a lifetime. And it had little to do with pay.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
seb146
Posts: 20258
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 4:03 pm

stratclub wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:
stratclub wrote:
I guess we will have to agree to disagree then. So tell me why we should have in effect an uncontrolled border and have to spend billions of our tax dollars (estimated at $135 billion annually) on people that are not citizens. That money could much better be spent paying down the national debt.


Since non-citizens pay in excess of 300 billion in taxes that won´t really work the way you imagine it. Like it or not, non-citizens almost invariably pay more than they cost across the planet.

best regards
Thomas

Interesting thought. I think you are referring to legal aliens that are classified as tax residents. People that are illegal would not be classified as a tax resident and even pay taxes as they could not legally get a SSN. Do you have a link that explains the $300 billion dollar claim?

https://immigration.findlaw.com/visas/i ... taxes.html
"There are many situations in which you may be required to pay United States taxes even if you are not a U.S. citizen. Whether or not you have to file and pay taxes depends on whether the government has classified you as a tax resident or not. For example, all permanent residents, or holders of green cards, are considered to be tax residents. Not all non-immigrant visa holders are tax residents, however. Even if you are not a tax resident, it may still be a good idea to file an income tax return if you have been working for an employer that withholds taxes from your wages - you might get a tax refund."

https://www.google.com/search?client=op ... 61qdSJshDI
"To Obtain a New Social Security Number and Card you will need to provide at least two documents to prove age, identity, and U.S. citizenship or current immigration status. To Obtain a Replacement Card, if lost or stolen, you must prove your identity and U.S. citizenship."

I'm not against people that are here legally, but our immigration system does need to be fixed so that "We the People" as citizens can maintain control of our border and can have a say on to who is allowed into our country just like most every other country does. What I am against is the Socialist/Liberal/Democratic plan is that we have uncontrolled borders so everyone on the planet can come here and get "free stuff" on our dime and vote here by just showing up at our border.


You keep talking about "liberals want open borders" but I have yet to see that from anyone but the right. Please provide links.

You also keep saying that "liberals want illegals so they can vote here" so I also want you to provide links as to how many illegals vote.

Also, please provide proof about this "free stuff" the right is obsesses with. If it is out there, where is it and why are more Americans not getting it?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 17417
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 4:23 pm

seb146 wrote:
stratclub wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:

Since non-citizens pay in excess of 300 billion in taxes that won´t really work the way you imagine it. Like it or not, non-citizens almost invariably pay more than they cost across the planet.

best regards
Thomas

Interesting thought. I think you are referring to legal aliens that are classified as tax residents. People that are illegal would not be classified as a tax resident and even pay taxes as they could not legally get a SSN. Do you have a link that explains the $300 billion dollar claim?

https://immigration.findlaw.com/visas/i ... taxes.html
"There are many situations in which you may be required to pay United States taxes even if you are not a U.S. citizen. Whether or not you have to file and pay taxes depends on whether the government has classified you as a tax resident or not. For example, all permanent residents, or holders of green cards, are considered to be tax residents. Not all non-immigrant visa holders are tax residents, however. Even if you are not a tax resident, it may still be a good idea to file an income tax return if you have been working for an employer that withholds taxes from your wages - you might get a tax refund."

https://www.google.com/search?client=op ... 61qdSJshDI
"To Obtain a New Social Security Number and Card you will need to provide at least two documents to prove age, identity, and U.S. citizenship or current immigration status. To Obtain a Replacement Card, if lost or stolen, you must prove your identity and U.S. citizenship."

I'm not against people that are here legally, but our immigration system does need to be fixed so that "We the People" as citizens can maintain control of our border and can have a say on to who is allowed into our country just like most every other country does. What I am against is the Socialist/Liberal/Democratic plan is that we have uncontrolled borders so everyone on the planet can come here and get "free stuff" on our dime and vote here by just showing up at our border.


You keep talking about "liberals want open borders" but I have yet to see that from anyone but the right. Please provide links.

You also keep saying that "liberals want illegals so they can vote here" so I also want you to provide links as to how many illegals vote.

Also, please provide proof about this "free stuff" the right is obsesses with. If it is out there, where is it and why are more Americans not getting it?

The proof is with all the shariarrr law moose lambs are instituting all over the country.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
stratclub
Posts: 1326
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:38 pm

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:02 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:
stratclub wrote:
Interesting thought. I think you are referring to legal aliens that are classified as tax residents.


You said "People that are not citizens", that is any non resident in the country, not just illegals.

best regards
Thomas

I don't think stratclub knows the difference. The Trump admin, however, does.

Here's a fun reminder of one of the many times we went through this rigmarole:

When The U.S. Government Tried To Replace Migrant Farmworkers With High Schoolers

https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/20 ... YKyAN7b5Ag

"But farmers complained — in words that echo today's headlines — that Mexican laborers did the jobs that Americans didn't want to do, and that the end of the Bracero Program meant that crops would rot in the fields.

Wirtz cited this labor shortage and a lack of summer jobs for high schoolers as reason enough for the program. But he didn't want just any band geek or nerd — he wanted jocks."

"Problems arose immediately for the A-TEAM nationwide. In California's Salinas Valley, 200 teenagers from New Mexico, Kansas and Wyoming quit after just two weeks on the job. "We worked three days and all of us are broke," the Associated Press quoted one teen as saying. Students elsewhere staged strikes. At the end, the A-TEAM was considered a giant failure and was never tried again."

White people didn't last two weeks, in jobs migrants do for a lifetime. And it had little to do with pay.


I don't know the difference about what? You might be referring to tommy1808's comment.Go back and read what I posted and follow the links. I understand what the President is trying to do. Turning a blind eye to illegal aliens is really disingenuous to those people. What it does is leaves them open to being exploited by unscuplious employers because they know that these employers have the upper hand and will have them deported If they complain about working conditions or wages.

Also, illegals can not legally get a SSN and many do resort to stealing someone else's identity which causes hardships for the people whose identities they stole. The bottom line is Congress needs to stop harassing the President and do the job they were elected to do and work together with the President to fix the broken immigration system so that people can come here legally and be able to pay taxes because they could legally get a SSN and be classified as tax residents.

That's a great point about many of our younger Americans have no ambition and are so entitled that realistically, they would't last in any job. If people want to come here to work, sure why not? Give them a green card and a path to citizenship if they desire it and can meet the requirements of being vetted to our immigration standards. Sounds like a win/win to me.
 
seb146
Posts: 20258
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:51 pm

stratclub wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:

You said "People that are not citizens", that is any non resident in the country, not just illegals.

best regards
Thomas

I don't think stratclub knows the difference. The Trump admin, however, does.

Here's a fun reminder of one of the many times we went through this rigmarole:

When The U.S. Government Tried To Replace Migrant Farmworkers With High Schoolers

https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/20 ... YKyAN7b5Ag

"But farmers complained — in words that echo today's headlines — that Mexican laborers did the jobs that Americans didn't want to do, and that the end of the Bracero Program meant that crops would rot in the fields.

Wirtz cited this labor shortage and a lack of summer jobs for high schoolers as reason enough for the program. But he didn't want just any band geek or nerd — he wanted jocks."

"Problems arose immediately for the A-TEAM nationwide. In California's Salinas Valley, 200 teenagers from New Mexico, Kansas and Wyoming quit after just two weeks on the job. "We worked three days and all of us are broke," the Associated Press quoted one teen as saying. Students elsewhere staged strikes. At the end, the A-TEAM was considered a giant failure and was never tried again."

White people didn't last two weeks, in jobs migrants do for a lifetime. And it had little to do with pay.


I don't know the difference about what? You might be referring to tommy1808's comment.Go back and read what I posted and follow the links. I understand what the President is trying to do. Turning a blind eye to illegal aliens is really disingenuous to those people. What it does is leaves them open to being exploited by unscuplious employers because they know that these employers have the upper hand and will have them deported If they complain about working conditions or wages.

Also, illegals can not legally get a SSN and many do resort to stealing someone else's identity which causes hardships for the people whose identities they stole. The bottom line is Congress needs to stop harassing the President and do the job they were elected to do and work together with the President to fix the broken immigration system so that people can come here legally and be able to pay taxes because they could legally get a SSN and be classified as tax residents.

That's a great point about many of our younger Americans have no ambition and are so entitled that realistically, they would't last in any job. If people want to come here to work, sure why not? Give them a green card and a path to citizenship if they desire it and can meet the requirements of being vetted to our immigration standards. Sounds like a win/win to me.


And what have Republicans done about illegals? They are in control of the government. What have they done?

Now you hate Americans who do not want a dead end job and know that working for low wages is bad. Younger Americans have ambition. They just do not want to be stuck like Republicans have done to the middle class since Reagan. They want more. Republicans love to blame others.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
User avatar
casinterest
Topic Author
Posts: 8871
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:39 pm

Here is an eye opening read of how we got to where we are with these workers.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archi ... ve/596230/

"One of the poultry plants that Stuesse explored, in the small town of Morton, Mississippi, was raided last week. B. C. Rogers, the company that owned the plant in 1994, launched a hiring drive that year called “The Hispanic Project.” Its goal was to replace African American workers, who were seeking a union, with immigrant workers who’d be more pliant. It placed ads in Miami newspapers, arranged transportation for immigrants, and charged them for housing in dilapidated trailers. Within four years, it had brought roughly 5,000 mainly Latino workers to Morton and another meatpacking town in Mississippi, enlarging their population by more than 50 percent. The poultry industry expanded throughout the rural South during the 1990s, drawn by the warm climate and the absence of labor unions. "


And here you can see how ICE raids continue to destroy Rural America. Albeit lax enforcement of employment standards at the plants and the management by federal, state and local authorities has allowed for it.

The workers in the Midwest lost their jobs to immigrants, and now the immigrants are losing their jobs, and then the plants will close.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
mham001
Posts: 5519
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:52 am

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:41 pm

tommy1808 wrote:

Since non-citizens pay in excess of 300 billion in taxes that won´t really work the way you imagine it. Like it or not, non-citizens almost invariably pay more than they cost across the planet.


I recommend you qualify that statement. While it may represent "all" immigrants in the US, if you are representing that number as illegal contributions, it would equate to each and every one of them contributing $27,000/year. That isn't happening, those working know to game the system through the W4 form - claim 10 dependents and little to no income tax is deducted. It is that simple.

WaPO has an article pointing out the flaw discovered in E-verify and exploited in Mississippi. The article makes a lot of noise about how it can never work while giving little play how the flaw is being corrected with database photos...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business ... edirect=on
 
User avatar
casinterest
Topic Author
Posts: 8871
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:45 pm

mham001 wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:

Since non-citizens pay in excess of 300 billion in taxes that won´t really work the way you imagine it. Like it or not, non-citizens almost invariably pay more than they cost across the planet.


I recommend you qualify that statement. While it may represent "all" immigrants in the US, if you are representing that number as illegal contributions, it would equate to each and every one of them contributing $27,000/year. That isn't happening, those working know to game the system through the W4 form - claim 10 dependents and little to no income tax is deducted. It is that simple.

WaPO has an article pointing out the flaw discovered in E-verify and exploited in Mississippi. The article makes a lot of noise about how it can never work while giving little play how the flaw is being corrected with database photos...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business ... edirect=on


If everyone is claiming 10 dependents, then that would indicate an issue in management,finance, and HR, yet they have not been arrested yet for this.yet?

Seems to me to be a claim without verification, or does the rule of law not apply to management?
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
mham001
Posts: 5519
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:52 am

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:50 pm

casinterest wrote:
Here is an eye opening read of how we got to where we are with these workers.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archi ... ve/596230/

"One of the poultry plants that Stuesse explored, in the small town of Morton, Mississippi, was raided last week. B. C. Rogers, the company that owned the plant in 1994, launched a hiring drive that year called “The Hispanic Project.” Its goal was to replace African American workers, who were seeking a union, with immigrant workers who’d be more pliant. It placed ads in Miami newspapers, arranged transportation for immigrants, and charged them for housing in dilapidated trailers. Within four years, it had brought roughly 5,000 mainly Latino workers to Morton and another meatpacking town in Mississippi, enlarging their population by more than 50 percent. The poultry industry expanded throughout the rural South during the 1990s, drawn by the warm climate and the absence of labor unions. "


And here you can see how ICE raids continue to destroy Rural America. Albeit lax enforcement of employment standards at the plants and the management by federal, state and local authorities has allowed for it.

The workers in the Midwest lost their jobs to immigrants, and now the immigrants are losing their jobs, and then the plants will close.


Yep, lax Democrat immigration policies killed their own. And nobody cares. Blacks need to wake up, their handlers do not care about their "pitiful plight", as Maverick called it.

What is numbingly obvious is how you believe these plants will just close shop and Americans will not get an adequate supply of chicken. Nonsense, they will just have to hire Americans and pay a decent, livable wage Period. My wife buys chicken for $.50/lb, cheaper than ever. I've often wondered how that is possible. Now we know.
 
seb146
Posts: 20258
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: ICE Raids destroying Rural America

Fri Aug 16, 2019 8:54 pm

mham001 wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:

Since non-citizens pay in excess of 300 billion in taxes that won´t really work the way you imagine it. Like it or not, non-citizens almost invariably pay more than they cost across the planet.


I recommend you qualify that statement. While it may represent "all" immigrants in the US, if you are representing that number as illegal contributions, it would equate to each and every one of them contributing $27,000/year. That isn't happening, those working know to game the system through the W4 form - claim 10 dependents and little to no income tax is deducted. It is that simple.


Others do this too, so I don't know why this is being limited to "all immigrants". On the flip side, others who fill out W4 forms claim 0 or 1 in hopes of getting some money back in a refund the next year so I am not sure why this point was brought up.

mham001 wrote:
WaPO has an article pointing out the flaw discovered in E-verify and exploited in Mississippi. The article makes a lot of noise about how it can never work while giving little play how the flaw is being corrected with database photos...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business ... edirect=on


Just like Republicans whine and complain that EVerify does not work but offer no solutions to replace it. It is not perfect but what is the solution? According to Republicans, the solution is blame Democrats.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!

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