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CitizenJustin
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Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sun Nov 03, 2019 6:13 pm

The city council of the eastern German city of Dresden passed an alarming resolution this week declaring the city to be in the grips of a Nazinotstand or “Nazi emergency.” The resolution was put to the city council Wednesday, decrying that “anti-democratic, anti-pluralist, misanthropic and right-wing-extremist attitudes and actions, including violence in Dresden, are occurring with increasing frequency.”

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/201 ... gency.html

This is just one link, but the news is everywhere. This is quite concerning in my opinion, though some people think the city council is being too reactionary. There’s no doubt the far-right is gaining momentum in many countries. The question is - are they going to be successful this time around? Fascism is a form of right wing extremism, no matter what historically/politically illiterate people say. It’s particularly terrifying to me because I’m gay and biracial, which are two minorities the right loves to hate and deny basic human rights. The most vulnerable depend on healthy democracies with sane leaders and intelligent voters with critical thinking skills.

Hindsight is 20/20 and it seems to me that we continue making the same mistakes over and over. Why would anyone support this Nazi stupidity, when we all know the consequences of WWII? I’d be interested to hear what our European friends have to say about this.
 
johns624
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sun Nov 03, 2019 9:20 pm

CitizenJustin wrote:
Why would anyone support this Nazi stupidity, when we all know the consequences of WWII? I’d be interested to hear what our European friends have to say about this.
Not a European, but the answer is simple. People who mess up their own lives by making a series of bad decisions have to have a scapegoat to blame their woes on. That way, they don't have to admit that it's their own fault.
 
olle
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Mon Nov 04, 2019 8:14 am

During the communist years nazism or extreme right only existed in the west. Then it showed up after the fall of the wall.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Mon Nov 04, 2019 8:26 am

johns624 wrote:
CitizenJustin wrote:
Why would anyone support this Nazi stupidity, when we all know the consequences of WWII? I’d be interested to hear what our European friends have to say about this.
Not a European, but the answer is simple. People who mess up their own lives by making a series of bad decisions have to have a scapegoat to blame their woes on. That way, they don't have to admit that it's their own fault.


Either that or insecure men incensed that ‘their’ local women are dating ‘the other’. I have seen the crap these people whine about. Entitlement mentality mixed with SPS - terrible combination.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
aloges
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Mon Nov 04, 2019 8:32 am

olle wrote:
During the communist years nazism or extreme right only existed in the west. Then it showed up after the fall of the wall.

What he said. The GDR had a totalitarian regime and never went through denazification. The communists simply imprisoned the prominent Nazis, recruited the turncoats and got busy trying to turn the country into their kind of “utopia”. As long as you didn’t stand in the way of that, you could be as racist as you liked.
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Braybuddy
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Fri Nov 08, 2019 2:47 pm

This did not come out of nowhere. The far right were of no consequence in Europe before 2015. Major Isis-inspired terrorist attacks and uncontrolled migration from east and south of the Med are the two events which will define the second half of this decade in Europe and have become the rallying cry for far right extremists. These same events will shape the future of the continent over the next few decades. Simple as.
 
Zeppi
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Fri Nov 08, 2019 3:09 pm

German here, and yeah, this is not only happening in Dresden. It's happening all across Europe even, Germany, Italy, Poland, France, Hungary, Austria, the UK...
You just need to look at the last few state elections in Germany, where the far right has won hugely and the former centrist parties are spiraling downwards ever faster. In Thuringia the two parties with the highest percentages of the total vote were the far left (Die Linke) and the far right (AfD)

Braybuddy wrote:
This did not come out of nowhere.

Indeed it didn't. It's not purely due to immigration itself, but due to how politics have totally mishandled the situation in the last four years. In many instances people felt that the state has totally lost control. Clan crime of large arab families is rampant in most larger urban areas, actively recruiting young men from the pool of new arrivals, and only now are police beginning to crack down on it.
When older people who have worked 45 years get so little pension that they need to go to welfare organisations for basic foods, while seeing that asylum seekers with lots of kids get plenty of cash handed to them without working at all, of course that stirs negative sentiments. And that is exactly what you see in the results of recent elections. People largely are fed up, feel left alone by politics. Hence they say "I don't care any more if there are NAZIs/fascist in the AfD, I'll vote for them anyway just not to vote for the others who are doing nothing for me".
The huge problem in my view is that everything is shifting to the extremes of the political spectrum, while the liberal centre is slowly being eroded away. Or rather fast in recent years.
 
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Aesma
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Fri Nov 08, 2019 3:57 pm

Far right and nazi are two things, sometimes related, but not the same.

The far right in Europe has been growing for decades, it's nothing new. Le Pen was in the runoff presidential election in 2002, Austria elected the far right to the chancellery around that time, etc.

That people identifying as nazis are coming out of the woodwork, especially in Germany, is much more recent.

Although it's not a good sign, these nazis seem to be mostly stupid people that will never get any kind of power. The original nazis had smart people at the top, today smart people with these tendencies (or who just want power/money) will go the "humane far right" way, not try to resurrect the nazi party. These people are the ones to be concerned about.
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Jetty
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Fri Nov 08, 2019 4:09 pm

CitizenJustin wrote:
The city council of the eastern German city of Dresden passed an alarming resolution this week declaring the city to be in the grips of a Nazinotstand or “Nazi emergency.” The resolution was put to the city council Wednesday, decrying that “anti-democratic, anti-pluralist, misanthropic and right-wing-extremist attitudes and actions, including violence in Dresden, are occurring with increasing frequency.”

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/201 ... gency.html

This is just one link, but the news is everywhere. This is quite concerning in my opinion, though some people think the city council is being too reactionary. There’s no doubt the far-right is gaining momentum in many countries. The question is - are they going to be successful this time around? Fascism is a form of right wing extremism, no matter what historically/politically illiterate people say. It’s particularly terrifying to me because I’m gay and biracial, which are two minorities the right loves to hate and deny basic human rights. The most vulnerable depend on healthy democracies with sane leaders and intelligent voters with critical thinking skills.

Hindsight is 20/20 and it seems to me that we continue making the same mistakes over and over. Why would anyone support this Nazi stupidity, when we all know the consequences of WWII? I’d be interested to hear what our European friends have to say about this.

You seem to assume far right equals nazi (national socialist), that’s uninformed and not true. ‘Far right’ comes in many different shapes and forms. Doesn’t have to be fascist, doesn’t have to have a problem with gay people, and have huge differences from country to country. In Germany i.e. the only political party against mass immigration is considered far right. In my country, The Netherlands, 20% of votes go to political parties that could be considered far right, but I haven’t seen a nazi in years because there are only a few dozen.

By far the most people who vote far right in Europe do so because of mass immigration from outside Europe. Stop mass immigration and you stop the far right. And this is happening, albeit slowly. Mainstream parties in many countries are way less positive towards immigration than they used to be but it isn’t easy to translate this into effective policy with the Mediterranean as border.
 
anrec80
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:18 pm

And what the City and the State is going to do about it? Are they going to address the very issues that cause people to support these movements? Obviously, not. They will just keep passing resolutions.
 
seat64k
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sat Nov 09, 2019 6:32 pm

Zeppi wrote:
older people who have worked 45 years get so little pension that they need to go to welfare organisations for basic foods, while seeing that asylum seekers with lots of kids get plenty of cash handed to them without working at all


Can you elabore on this? Why does this disparity exist?
 
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Aesma
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sat Nov 09, 2019 6:40 pm

Germany needs young people and children, it has too many old people.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Jetty
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sat Nov 09, 2019 6:48 pm

seat64k wrote:
Zeppi wrote:
older people who have worked 45 years get so little pension that they need to go to welfare organisations for basic foods, while seeing that asylum seekers with lots of kids get plenty of cash handed to them without working at all


Can you elabore on this? Why does this disparity exist?

In many European welfare states having (many) children comes with a huge amount of extra benefits grounded on the idea that it's more important for children than adults to live without poverty and adults have more responsibility for their own well being. This is a sensible idea in theory but when many immigrants hardly contribute to the system while on average having many more children it isn't surprising it's perceived unfair by people who did contribute -i.e. pensioners who worked whole their life for a low salary- and are worse off. Another issue is that asylum seekers are guaranteed social housing -this again makes sense otherwise they'd be living on the streets- but no such guarantee exists for most other residents.

Aesma wrote:
Germany needs young people and children, it has too many old people.

While this is debatable on itself Germany certainly doesn't need unemployed young people.

Bringing most of these current asylum seekers into gainful employment is a herculean task, given the lack of German language abilities, occupational experience, and skills among many refugees. While between 8,500 and 10,000 refugees entered the German labor force each month in 2018, researchers project that some 50 percent of the recent refugees will still be unemployed five years after their arrival. That percentage is estimated to drop to 25 percent only after 14 years. In addition, about one-third of employed refugees are temporary workers without long-term contracts, and the majority of them are working in low-skilled, low-paying occupations.
https://wenr.wes.org/2019/08/the-state- ... ny-in-2019
 
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WildcatYXU
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:54 pm

Aesma wrote:
Germany needs young people and children, it has too many old people.


Let me fix that for you: Germany - and the EU as a whole - needs a sensible immigration system which currently does not exist.
310, 319, 320, 321, 321N, 332, 333, 343, 345, 346, 732, 735, 73G, 738, 744, 752, 762, 763, 77L, 77W, 788, AT4, AT7, BEH, C402, CR2, CRA, CR9, DH1, DH3, DH4, E45, E75, E90, E95, F28, F50, F100, MD82, Saab 340, YAK40
 
anrec80
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sun Nov 10, 2019 1:08 am

seat64k wrote:
Can you elabore on this? Why does this disparity exist?


Yes, it does in Europe.
 
anrec80
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sun Nov 10, 2019 1:14 am

Aesma wrote:
Germany needs young people and children, it has too many old people.


Germany needs young people who would work and contribute to the society. It does not need any more welfare recipients (using kids and language as an excuse among others).
 
anrec80
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sun Nov 10, 2019 1:19 am

Jetty wrote:
Bringing most of these current asylum seekers into gainful employment is a herculean task, given the lack of German language abilities, occupational experience, and skills among many refugees. While between 8,500 and 10,000 refugees entered the German labor force each month in 2018, researchers project that some 50 percent of the recent refugees will still be unemployed five years after their arrival. That percentage is estimated to drop to 25 percent only after 14 years. In addition, about one-third of employed refugees are temporary workers without long-term contracts, and the majority of them are working in low-skilled, low-paying occupations.
https://wenr.wes.org/2019/08/the-state- ... ny-in-2019


Of course with all this social state it’s a Herculean task. But in my view - the key driver to the gainful employment is the desire of our candidate. I have already before mentioned Ukrainians as an example - those who truly need work and want to work, they do work, pick up language, and get integrated into workforce. Germany should remove welfare benefits for them (food, state paid housing, etc.) - and see the subsequent integration rate, and, most importantly - influx rate. You’ve got your refuge papers - here is your work permit, and please go and support yourself.
 
Jetty
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:04 am

anrec80 wrote:
You’ve got your refuge papers - here is your work permit, and please go and support yourself.

While in the current economic upturn not many skills are needed to gain employment working in western Europe requires speaking the native language (or good English), accepting women as your equals, not praying 5 times a day and to have a basic understanding of the local customs and culture. Many Muslim or uneducated immigrants wouldn't be able to do this whether they want or not, the barrier is just too big.

Then the remaining choice concerning the immigrants that can't cope is if they are a burden to society by receiving welfare or by ruining the living environment when living on the streets and supporting themselves with petty crime. Often the former is the more sensible choice. There's a reason no European country has a solution for this problem: it isn't easy to find one. Europe is moving in the direction of just barring entry to illegal immigrants whatever it takes and that might be the only long term solution. There's just two EU countries still supporting Mediterranean immigration (Germany and France), even the European Parliament is now against stepping up efforts to save migrants taking that route: www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe ... 71401.html This would be unthinkable a few yours ago. The comparison with the USA is remarkable: while Trump is considered a lunatic -not that he isn't- because of his desire to build a wall, if it were possible Europa would have build wall on it's borders with Africa a long time ago. There is a fence on all borders with Turkey already.

To get back on topic, while I wouldn't vote on a far-right party -if I could vote in Germany or France- apparently Merkel and Macron need to be shown their migrant-favorable policies aren't acceptable to the electorate and "Wir schaffen das" doesn't fly. If that takes a temporarily growing far-right, so be it.
 
ItnStln
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:07 pm

Aesma wrote:
Germany needs young people and children, it has too many old people.

They need people who will work, regardless of age.
 
anrec80
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:26 pm

Jetty wrote:
While in the current economic upturn not many skills are needed to gain employment working in western Europe requires speaking the native language (or good English), accepting women as your equals, not praying 5 times a day and to have a basic understanding of the local customs and culture. Many Muslim or uneducated immigrants wouldn't be able to do this whether they want or not, the barrier is just too big.


When you come to someone else’s society, you live by its rules, and not establish your own. The European problem is that European societies let the newcomers establish their own rules, and not insist that the newcomers live by their own. Yes, people in Europe celebrate Christmas and New Years, eat pork, work, pay taxes. Someone doesn’t like it - they should look for some other place for their refuge.

Jetty wrote:
Then the remaining choice concerning the immigrants that can't cope is if they are a burden to society by receiving welfare or by ruining the living environment when living on the streets and supporting themselves with petty crime. Often the former is the more sensible choice. There's a reason no European country has a solution for this problem: it isn't easy to find one.


There are things that can be done. First, Europeans should stop to just giving out rights, privileges and other goodies like free housing to the right and to the left. Overall, I believe that good stuff in the society must be given out in exchange for something good for the society, and not just like that. Refuge must be treated not as the right, but rather as the contract - you have been provided a peaceful place and work permit - now go seek work, visit language and culture classes, work for check and pay taxes, just as anyone else. If that doesn’t work (or doesn’t work out for some reason) - sorry, here is your 30 day notice to look for some other place for yourself. Migration is not for everybody.

Same comes to pity crime - part of the agreement is that you are being a law abiding citizen. Break the law - and go back home immediately, regardless.
 
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Aesma
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:40 pm

I'm not German nor living in Germany, but aren't many refugees Syrians with plenty of education, including doctors, engineers etc. ?

Those coming from Afghanistan, probably less so.

It doesn't mean it's impossible to assimilate them, and there are plenty of places needing workers. I work in construction, on construction sites hardly anyone speaks French.

We don't need immigrants to become archetypal French or Germans, just to adapt.

In France at least we definitely don't let immigrants establish their own communities, it might happen but not on purpose.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
BN747
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:28 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
johns624 wrote:
CitizenJustin wrote:
Why would anyone support this Nazi stupidity, when we all know the consequences of WWII? I’d be interested to hear what our European friends have to say about this.
Not a European, but the answer is simple. People who mess up their own lives by making a series of bad decisions have to have a scapegoat to blame their woes on. That way, they don't have to admit that it's their own fault.


Either that or insecure men incensed that ‘their’ local women are dating ‘the other’. I have seen the crap these people whine about. Entitlement mentality mixed with SPS - terrible combination.


Ahh..Euro Incels, but of course!

That explains alot..but below even fuels that argument more.

Zeppi wrote:
German here, and yeah, this is not only happening in Dresden. It's happening all across Europe even, Germany, Italy, Poland, France, Hungary, Austria, the UK...
You just need to look at the last few state elections in Germany, where the far right has won hugely and the former centrist parties are spiraling downwards ever faster. In Thuringia the two parties with the highest percentages of the total vote were the far left (Die Linke) and the far right (AfD)

Braybuddy wrote:
This did not come out of nowhere.

Indeed it didn't. It's not purely due to immigration itself, but due to how politics have totally mishandled the situation in the last four years. In many instances people felt that the state has totally lost control. Clan crime of large arab families is rampant in most larger urban areas, actively recruiting young men from the pool of new arrivals, and only now are police beginning to crack down on it.
When older people who have worked 45 years get so little pension that they need to go to welfare organisations for basic foods, while seeing that asylum seekers with lots of kids get plenty of cash handed to them without working at all, of course that stirs negative sentiments. And that is exactly what you see in the results of recent elections. People largely are fed up, feel left alone by politics. Hence they say "I don't care any more if there are NAZIs/fascist in the AfD, I'll vote for them anyway just not to vote for the others who are doing nothing for me".
The huge problem in my view is that everything is shifting to the extremes of the political spectrum, while the liberal centre is slowly being eroded away. Or rather fast in recent years.


Since the days occupied Europe after their own destruction, they want everybody out!

But mostly, the non-Europeans (aka non-whites).

Tsk! Too late now. They aren't leaving.

America's current 'the Wall' mentally is same version of that Racist anger.

Just as America has meddled in Central America the entire 20th century, now it's our time to pay the price of that meddling...diversity.

Europe's past of treating the ME, India and Africa as playgrounds then running back to borrow 'bodies' to fight and protect France - then cart them off as 'we don't need your help anymore now go home' - WWI.

WWII, same deal..'help Morocco, Tunisia, Algeria, Libya...we need your help against Hitler...
... Afterwards, 'okay, fighting's over you can all go back to where you came from now'

The kids from all that are now living across all Europe and their kids are now citizens, unwanted citizens nonetheless.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
Jetty
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:45 pm

BN747 wrote:
Since the days occupied Europe after their own destruction, they want everybody out!

But mostly, the non-Europeans (aka non-whites).

This is false. There are many non-white (South)-Eastern Asians and South-Americans in Europe and there are few people who have a problem with that. If you really want to categorize it's Muslims that cause problems and are seen as problematic.

Tsk! Too late now. They aren't leaving.

Hardly anyone wants the current legal immigrants out. But we don't want any more mass immigration from Muslims. Progress is being made in making this become a reality.

2019: 96.699
2018: 141,472
2017: 185,139
2016: 373,652
2015: 1,032,408

https://data2.unhcr.org/en/situations/mediterranean
 
BN747
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:59 pm

Jetty wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Since the days occupied Europe after their own destruction, they want everybody out!

But mostly, the non-Europeans (aka non-whites).

This is false. There are many non-white (South)-Eastern Asians and South-Americans in Europe and there are few people who have a problem with that. If you really want to categorize it's Muslims that cause problems and are seen as problematic.

Tsk! Too late now. They aren't leaving.

Hardly anyone wants the current legal immigrants out. But we don't want any more mass immigration from Muslims. Progress is being made in making this become a reality.

2019: 96.699
2018: 141,472
2017: 185,139
2016: 373,652
2015: 1,032,408

https://data2.unhcr.org/en/situations/mediterranean


Of course more are coming! They've been coming since WWII and still trying like hell to get there and settle.

But not-so-hard google search will provide you a trove of articles of locals across the Continent on edge because of 'too many undesirables'...it's going on for the last 20+ years.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
Jetty
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:24 pm

BN747 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Since the days occupied Europe after their own destruction, they want everybody out!

But mostly, the non-Europeans (aka non-whites).

This is false. There are many non-white (South)-Eastern Asians and South-Americans in Europe and there are few people who have a problem with that. If you really want to categorize it's Muslims that cause problems and are seen as problematic.

Tsk! Too late now. They aren't leaving.

Hardly anyone wants the current legal immigrants out. But we don't want any more mass immigration from Muslims. Progress is being made in making this become a reality.

2019: 96.699
2018: 141,472
2017: 185,139
2016: 373,652
2015: 1,032,408

https://data2.unhcr.org/en/situations/mediterranean


Of course more are coming! They've been coming since WWII and still trying like hell to get there and settle.

But not-so-hard google search will provide you a trove of articles of locals across the Continent on edge because of 'too many undesirables'...it's going on for the last 20+ years.

BN747

More can come, as long as they don’t come en masse. And many tried like hell in 2019 as well, but most just weren’t very succesfull and got stuck somewhere along the route. This shows immigration can be managed.

The debate has indeed been going on for many years, but never was the public sentiment as unfavorable towards Illegal immigration as it is now. Even the European Parliament is now against stepping up rescue efforts in the Mediterranean, this would have been unthinkable a few years ago. www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe ... 71401.html
 
BN747
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:15 am

Jetty wrote:
More can come


A lot of your fellow Europeans will take you to mat for saying that...

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
Jetty
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Tue Nov 12, 2019 1:06 am

BN747 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
More can come


A lot of your fellow Europeans will take you to mat for saying that...

A few but not a lot. As with every other subject there are people with extremist views; maybe 10% of Europeans want open borders and another 10% no immigration at all. Mainstream view is that immigration of culturally unadaptable migrants should be very limited and immigration from migrants that are suited for western culture moderate.
 
BN747
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Tue Nov 12, 2019 1:50 am

Jetty wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
More can come


A lot of your fellow Europeans will take you to mat for saying that...

A few but not a lot. As with every other subject there are people with extremist views; maybe 10% of Europeans want open borders and another 10% no immigration at all. Mainstream view is that immigration of culturally unadaptable migrants should be very limited and immigration from migrants that are suited for western culture moderate.


Good to hear...I hope your perception is pretty accurate to the reality on the ground.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
Reinhardt
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Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Tue Nov 12, 2019 10:44 am

Plenty of nonsense posted here so, including a lovely wish that someone dropped a nuke on Germany in WWII.

I live 1hr away from Dresden. I go there often, it's a lovely city.

1/ Eastern Germany is not the same as the rest of Germany. Yes there is a Turkish and Vietnamese community in the big cities and more and more international students but outside of the cities it's very much like it's always been. Lots of farmland, lots of small towns, wishes for things not to change. They see multicultrulism in Western parts and the terrorist attacks and say I don't want that. Their default response therefore is vote AFD. A lot of people deliberately paint these people as Nazis. They really aren't - perhaps lacking education, perhaps are retired and have terrible pensions, aren't happy with the fact the East is still so far behind the West when it comes to opportunity and money. Lots have genuine concerns but they think they have no moderate voice in govenment, only far right.

This is despite all the money the Govenment has spent on infrastucture here.

Also bear in mind a lot of land, buildings etc were bought up by Bavarians and West German's after the wall fell. Many people see this has repression. That everything here is run / owned by the more wealthy.

2/ Then you have Nazis. As in real, full on white supremists, Germany for white Germans. The numbers are growing in part thanks to increase in growing far right globally. These guys are incredibly dangerous. They've virtually been left alone by the authorities. Nowhere near enough has been done to curb them. They generally don't live in cities.

3/ The far left. You have in the big cities in the East with massive far left communities. They hate the Police, the Govenment and yup right wingers. They are the source of most of the violence you see in cities. It's actually pathetic. Where I live, the Mayor has asked the Police to start tackling this.

4/ Immigration - There has been a lot that's true. Those from Syria have integrated very well. Most were educated, or able to be educated and have made the effort. I work with a few and they are very decent hard working people. The problematic ones are sub-saharan Africans. Their base education is so poor they effectively have to go back and do a full school system. This costs a ton of money, and many don't want to do this. They want to get straight into employment - that's not how it works. There have been occasions the far right have attacked immigration centres, residences. That's pretty sick.

So as always it's a complicated mix of problems.

I don't think Dresden is a "Nazi Emergency" but it, like a lot of the East needs to wake up to the threat.
 
ItnStln
Posts: 100
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:47 pm

Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Tue Nov 12, 2019 5:21 pm

Reinhardt wrote:
Also bear in mind a lot of land, buildings etc were bought up by Bavarians and West German's after the wall fell. Many people see this has repression. That everything here is run / owned by the more wealthy.

Bavaria was in West Germany so why the difference?
 
santi319
Posts: 1021
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 3:24 pm

Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Wed Nov 13, 2019 7:21 am

ItnStln wrote:
Reinhardt wrote:
Also bear in mind a lot of land, buildings etc were bought up by Bavarians and West German's after the wall fell. Many people see this has repression. That everything here is run / owned by the more wealthy.

Bavaria was in West Germany so why the difference?

Google East Germany and West Germany history
 
ItnStln
Posts: 100
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:47 pm

Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:40 pm

santi319 wrote:
ItnStln wrote:
Reinhardt wrote:
Also bear in mind a lot of land, buildings etc were bought up by Bavarians and West German's after the wall fell. Many people see this has repression. That everything here is run / owned by the more wealthy.

Bavaria was in West Germany so why the difference?

Google East Germany and West Germany history

Everything I found said Bavaria was in West Germany. What did I miss?
 
tommy1808
Posts: 13252
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:44 pm

Braybuddy wrote:
This did not come out of nowhere. The far right were of no consequence in Europe before 2015. .


mmm.. no. I present to you the NSU: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_ ... nderground , check how long they have been active, among others

Right Wing and Neonazi Terrorism has been a thing in earnest since the 70`s ... Germany alone had (at least, since the line is blurry): 229 murders, 123 bomb attacks, 2173 cases of Arson, 12 kidnappings und 174 armed robberies.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
santi319
Posts: 1021
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 3:24 pm

Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Wed Nov 13, 2019 8:12 pm

santi319 wrote:
ItnStln wrote:
Reinhardt wrote:
Also bear in mind a lot of land, buildings etc were bought up by Bavarians and West German's after the wall fell. Many people see this has repression. That everything here is run / owned by the more wealthy.

Bavaria was in West Germany so why the difference?

Google East Germany and West Germany history

After the wall fell East Germany was marginalized, so basically the person in question is implying the reason for the discontent in East Germany is because the West Germans (like Bavarians), were potentially better off and bought property, opened business etc. Meanwhile their poorer East Germans were left with less opportunities and somehow they resent it now and hence why they do not love the policies of the center/left.

At least thats what I got from it.

In reality everybody knows East Germany is more like Poland when it comes to politics (expect Berlin).
 
Reinhardt
Posts: 328
Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2018 5:05 pm

Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Thu Nov 14, 2019 10:37 am

santi319 wrote:
santi319 wrote:
ItnStln wrote:
Bavaria was in West Germany so why the difference?

Google East Germany and West Germany history

After the wall fell East Germany was marginalized, so basically the person in question is implying the reason for the discontent in East Germany is because the West Germans (like Bavarians), were potentially better off and bought property, opened business etc. Meanwhile their poorer East Germans were left with less opportunities and somehow they resent it now and hence why they do not love the policies of the center/left.

At least thats what I got from it.

In reality everybody knows East Germany is more like Poland when it comes to politics (expect Berlin).


Yes exactly.

But a lot of East German's see Bavaria as almost a seperate entity to the rest of the West. They say Bavarians see themselves as the "proper German's" , dislike the rest of Germany and see themselves as superior. Whether this is right or wrong is up for debate but I hear people say that a lot. I think this goes back to what I was saying about Bavrian's buying up land, housing stock etc. A lot of landlords here are from Munich.

Also a lot of older voters say they prefer things back when the wall was up. They say there was more of a community. People had to work together and everyone got the same. Never mind the secret courts, Stazi, waiting 20 years for a car etc etc.
 
User avatar
Braybuddy
Posts: 6741
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:14 pm

Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Thu Nov 14, 2019 12:26 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
Braybuddy wrote:
This did not come out of nowhere. The far right were of no consequence in Europe before 2015. .


mmm.. no. I present to you the NSU: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_ ... nderground , check how long they have been active, among others

Right Wing and Neonazi Terrorism has been a thing in earnest since the 70`s ... Germany alone had (at least, since the line is blurry): 229 murders, 123 bomb attacks, 2173 cases of Arson, 12 kidnappings und 174 armed robberies.

best regards
Thomas

"Of no consequence" in the sense of no significance. For decaces the far right has existed in Europe, but it was never a real threat in the political sense. Some time ago in a previous thread about the rise of the far right in Germany you even said as much yourself about the AfD, and that their popularity was decreasing, IIRC.
 
ItnStln
Posts: 100
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:47 pm

Re: Dresden Germany declares “Nazi emergency”

Sat Nov 16, 2019 5:11 pm

santi319 wrote:
santi319 wrote:
ItnStln wrote:
Bavaria was in West Germany so why the difference?

Google East Germany and West Germany history

After the wall fell East Germany was marginalized, so basically the person in question is implying the reason for the discontent in East Germany is because the West Germans (like Bavarians), were potentially better off and bought property, opened business etc. Meanwhile their poorer East Germans were left with less opportunities and somehow they resent it now and hence why they do not love the policies of the center/left.

At least thats what I got from it.

In reality everybody knows East Germany is more like Poland when it comes to politics (expect Berlin).

Thanks

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