For an all powerful god He sure needs a lot of help from stupid people:

"The Ohio House on Wednesday passed the "Student Religious Liberties Act." Under the law, students can't be penalized if their work is scientifically wrong as long as the reasoning is because of their religious beliefs."

https://local12.com/news/local/ohio-hou ... o-religion

Ohio House passed the bill; their state senate hasn't voted on it yet - is what the fifth sentence of the article said.

It's the fourth sentence that is the most disheartening...

Apparently even catholic private schools teach evolution. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution ... ic_schools

Just because of some fringe, non-mainstream brand of evangelicalism gets triggered by evolution doesn't mean that facts should care about their feelings-in the words of a far-rightest himself

stl07 wrote:

Apparently even catholic private schools teach evolution. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution ... ic_schools

Just because of some fringe, non-mainstream brand of evangelicalism gets triggered by evolution doesn't mean that facts should care about their feelings-in the words of a far-rightest himself

As Spock so wisely said: “you must learn to govern your passions, they will be your undoing”

Airstud wrote:

Ohio House passed the bill; their state senate hasn't voted on it yet - is what the fifth sentence of the article said.

That this bill even made it to the floor of a state legislature is sad. Republicans do not care about people or science or education or We The People. They only care about power. If they can use religion to do it, all the better.

MaverickM11 wrote:

students can't be penalized if their work is scientifically wrong as long as the reasoning is because of their religious beliefs."

bad grades are no penalty..... so what kind of penalty are they talking about anyways?

And gosh geez..... Teenagers will just include any false answer into their religious believe system and be reel fun.

Plus side: if your teacher penalizes you for correct answers, and those religious nutjob teachers exist in the US, students can actually bring facts to their classroom. ....

Reminds me a bit of Oklahoma (?) and their Ten Commandments Monument, trying to circumvent the constitution by saying "if its not paid for by the tax payer it is fine", which directly brought the Satanist on "Oh, cool, really, we are going to set up a statue of Baphomet ......

best regards
Thomas

seb146 wrote:

Airstud wrote:

Ohio House passed the bill; their state senate hasn't voted on it yet - is what the fifth sentence of the article said.

That this bill even made it to the floor of a state legislature is sad. Republicans do not care about people or science or education or We The People. They only care about power. If they can use religion to do it, all the better.

You can’t just blame the legislators you also have to blame the morons who vote for those kinds of people.

Kiwirob wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Airstud wrote:

Ohio House passed the bill; their state senate hasn't voted on it yet - is what the fifth sentence of the article said.

That this bill even made it to the floor of a state legislature is sad. Republicans do not care about people or science or education or We The People. They only care about power. If they can use religion to do it, all the better.

You can’t just blame the legislators you also have to blame the morons who vote for those kinds of people.

Usually elected officials have no idea not caring about the electorates wishes. The problem is that many of them are just as cuckoo ans their voter....

best regards
Thomas

Pastafarianism, my new religion. I like the hats.

Stupid is as stupid does.

And this does pretty stupid.

Tugg

So let me see if I get this straight: if this passes (and let's face it: it will), that means an atheist kid who didn't study for the test (or wants to make a point) can simply write that the universe was created by a badly hung over Flying Spaghetti Monster, using his 'noodly appendage', and it ... has to be counted as correct?

Can't wait to see this...

Scorpio wrote:

So let me see if I get this straight: if this passes (and let's face it: it will), that means an atheist kid who didn't study for the test (or wants to make a point) can simply write that the universe was created by a badly hung over Flying Spaghetti Monster, using his 'noodly appendage', and it ... has to be counted as correct?

Can't wait to see this...

Well you are correct but not really understanding the thorough detail and substantiation and reasoning that will be required to support your theory/answer. Think of the rigorous work required. First you have to explain in full and back it with explanation. That's not easy. I mean "Let there be light, and there was light" is not easy and requi..... Oh wait... That was easy....

Dumb. Seriously dumb.

Tugg

Republicans hate public education. They would rather see "Christian" madrasas. Maybe this is a way of getting public support for shutting down public education in Ohio as a test for shutting down public education nationwide? Republicans can point to students failing SATs and federal standardized tests for funding and this will be their proof that public education does not work.

Lots of people in OH graduating to become hamburger flippers. People for high paying tech jobs will have to come from abroad.

A lot of Republican's support good solid public schooling. I sure do. And I do not support vouchers for private schooling in general (we could maybe start a discussion if the private schools are required to accept all who apply, cannot pick and choose who attends, and must accommodate all skill/ability levels, etc.)

Tugg

Tugger wrote:

A lot of Republican's support good solid public schooling. I sure do. And I do not support vouchers for private schooling in general (we could maybe start a discussion if the private schools are required to accept all who apply, cannot pick and choose who attends, and must accommodate all skill/ability levels, etc.)

Tugg

I think you're in a teensy weensy minority that could fit under Paul Ryan's workout bench

MaverickM11 wrote:

Tugger wrote:

A lot of Republican's support good solid public schooling. I sure do. And I do not support vouchers for private schooling in general (we could maybe start a discussion if the private schools are required to accept all who apply, cannot pick and choose who attends, and must accommodate all skill/ability levels, etc.)

Tugg

I think you're in a teensy weensy minority that could fit under Paul Ryan's workout bench

I don't know, I have a feeling there is a "silent majority" in the Republican party that are afraid to speak out for fear of being labeled "RINO" or some such. I say bring it on. I'll speak my mind and tell you exactly why I am supporting one position over another.

The current inability of so many Republican's to be able to speak out against the stupidity and destruction that is being caused within is pathetic.

And something similar is beginning to happen to the Dems too.

We don't need extremes. We need "middle of the road" and some people thing that is bad or weak. That is not correct.

And back on topic, we needs people that support science and rigorous schooling etc. Reason over passion (you still need passion but it can't be the only thing. If you can't clearly explain and support your position then it is not a very good position).

Tugg

seb146 wrote:

Republicans hate public education. They would rather see "Christian" madrasas. Maybe this is a way of getting public support for shutting down public education in Ohio as a test for shutting down public education nationwide? Republicans can point to students failing SATs and federal standardized tests for funding and this will be their proof that public education does not work.

For very good reason. Dreadful results in teaching children. High cost for poor results, a terrible return on investment. Godless, immoral culture that leads to misbehaving adults (and kids while they're there), helping create a perverse society. "Science" teaching that is simply wrong and completely not science (because it's based on the demand that there can't be a God--the conclusion creates the evidence) but is taught as fact (no wonder we have bills like this). It's the government brainwashing center.

Thanks for partially acknowledging why many don't believe in public "education". Sadly it appears you're not one of them.

MSPNWA wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Republicans hate public education. They would rather see "Christian" madrasas. Maybe this is a way of getting public support for shutting down public education in Ohio as a test for shutting down public education nationwide? Republicans can point to students failing SATs and federal standardized tests for funding and this will be their proof that public education does not work.

For very good reason. Dreadful results in teaching children. High cost for poor results, a terrible return on investment. Godless, immoral culture that leads to misbehaving adults (and kids while they're there), helping create a perverse society. "Science" teaching that is simply wrong and completely not science (because it's based on the demand that there can't be a God--the conclusion creates the evidence) but is taught as fact (no wonder we have bills like this). It's the government brainwashing center.

Thanks for partially acknowledging why many don't believe in public "education". Sadly it appears you're not one of them.

OK boomer

MSPNWA wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Republicans hate public education. They would rather see "Christian" madrasas. Maybe this is a way of getting public support for shutting down public education in Ohio as a test for shutting down public education nationwide? Republicans can point to students failing SATs and federal standardized tests for funding and this will be their proof that public education does not work.

For very good reason. Dreadful results in teaching children. High cost for poor results, a terrible return on investment. Godless, immoral culture that leads to misbehaving adults (and kids while they're there), helping create a perverse society. "Science" teaching that is simply wrong and completely not science (because it's based on the demand that there can't be a God--the conclusion creates the evidence) but is taught as fact (no wonder we have bills like this). It's the government brainwashing center.

Yeah... no.

Tugg

MSPNWA wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Republicans hate public education. They would rather see "Christian" madrasas. Maybe this is a way of getting public support for shutting down public education in Ohio as a test for shutting down public education nationwide? Republicans can point to students failing SATs and federal standardized tests for funding and this will be their proof that public education does not work.

For very good reason. Dreadful results in teaching children. High cost for poor results, a terrible return on investment. Godless, immoral culture that leads to misbehaving adults (and kids while they're there), helping create a perverse society. "Science" teaching that is simply wrong and completely not science (because it's based on the demand that there can't be a God--the conclusion creates the evidence) but is taught as fact (no wonder we have bills like this). It's the government brainwashing center.

Thanks for partially acknowledging why many don't believe in public "education". Sadly it appears you're not one of them.

Many of us were beaten by "Christians" in school. Many "Christians" are caught in possession of drugs and prostitutes and terrible things done to children. But we have to feel sorry for them and even take their side because they say they are "Christian".

nope.

Money does not get you closer to God. Money does not make you better than anyone. Claiming you are religious does not let you off the hook. Claiming you are religious does not give you the right to beat and kill others.

Man, I wished I had thought of this when I was in school.

What's going to happen is that all the kids who screw up on their AP Biology tests are gonna run to the teacher and say "my religion says x, can I get my points back"

LMP737 wrote:

Man, I wished I had thought of this when I was in school.

Tooks the words out of my mouth

stl07 wrote:

Tooks the words out of my mouth

Better grades, not as many lectures from an irate dad. lol

I used to think of Ohio as a normal state, not lately for sure.

MSPNWA wrote:

Godless, immoral culture that leads to misbehaving adults (and kids while they're there)

You mean like adults who lie pathologically, cheat on their wives and pay their mistresses hush money?

MSPNWA wrote:

helping create a perverse society

The way you worded that it sounds like you are of the belief that at one time we had a more moral society. If so what time period do have in mind?

MSPNWA wrote:

"Science" teaching that is simply wrong and completely not science (because it's based on the demand that there can't be a God--the conclusion creates the evidence)

What are you talking about? Let me guess, it's "wrong" in your eyes because it goes against years of religious indoctrination? Or do you have conclusive evidence that it's wrong? If so you should share that information with the world and stop wasting your time here.

Here's the thing, religion has no place in a science classroom. I do not recall ever having a science class where it was stated there was no god. It's just there is no scientific evidence any god exists so why even bother talking about it. If the only evidence you have for gods existence is the bible then that my friend, is a fairy tale.

MSPNWA wrote:

but is taught as fact

You mean facts like the earth revolves around the sun?

MSPNWA wrote:

It's the government brainwashing center.

All because they don't teach fairy tales? That's what churches are for.

Scorpio wrote:

So let me see if I get this straight: if this passes (and let's face it: it will), that means an atheist kid who didn't study for the test (or wants to make a point) can simply write that the universe was created by a badly hung over Flying Spaghetti Monster, using his 'noodly appendage', and it ... has to be counted as correct?

Can't wait to see this...

I'll be waiting with my popcorn.

'm sure the people who voted for this did not have the Flying Spaghetti Monster in mind. My guess is they were only thinking of the bible when they wrote it. Funny thing is the student who uses the FSM as an answer has about as much proof of it's existence as a student using the bible, koran, torah etc.

Part of me wants to think that this is just some spoof from the Onion. Nowadays though......

so what happens when these kids hit college?

And these are the people talking about improving education opportunities? This is some sort of Middle Ages crusade, not educational policy.

DLFREEBIRD wrote:

so what happens when these kids hit college?

Who cares? Those lawmakers want to get re-elected within a year, not when the kids of their voters go to college. They have no incentive to care even if that doesn’t happen at all.

my point is that they can't shelter these kids forever.

LMP737 wrote:

Man, I wished I had thought of this when I was in school.

I don't know, to me the science is much easier to learn, because it makes sense.

MSPNWA wrote:

Godless, immoral culture that leads to misbehaving adults (and kids while they're there), helping create a perverse society.

Nice rant. Thanks for the laugh.

Aesma wrote:

LMP737 wrote:

Man, I wished I had thought of this when I was in school.

I don't know, to me the science is much easier to learn, because it makes sense.

Heretic!

anrec80 wrote:

This is some sort of Middle Ages crusade, not educational policy.

Not sort of, it is exactly the same mechanism, or even personality cults have the same things behind it.

I don’t think people understand what this bill actually says. It adds to established academic standards and on page 17, it specifically says the work need to meet:

“...ordinary standards of substance and relevance...”

It doesn’t change the content of what is taught and it requires ordinary standards. What it does allow is a student to provide a religious viewpoint and prohibits a teacher from penalizing them for doing so, but they still need to meet the standard of substance. Further, it doesn’t remove any existing content from what is already required in the classroom.

DL717 wrote:

I don’t think people understand what this bill actually says. It adds to established academic standards and on page 17, it specifically says the work need to meet:

“...ordinary standards of substance and relevance...”

It doesn’t change the content of what is taught and it requires ordinary standards. What it does allow is a student to provide a religious viewpoint and prohibits a teacher from penalizing them for doing so, but they still need to meet the standard of substance. Further, it doesn’t remove any existing content from what is already required in the classroom.

Point being, religion has no place inside the classroom.

What are they thinking? Question: describe the world: the world is flat with on the edges ice sheets, and "south pole" is guarded by the military to prevent anyone from snooping around there. Scientists and conventional "media", wrongfully, wants us to believe the world is a globe.

anrec80 wrote:

DLFREEBIRD wrote:

so what happens when these kids hit college?

Who cares? Those lawmakers want to get re-elected within a year, not when the kids of their voters go to college. They have no incentive to care even if that doesn’t happen at all.

College lol...bless yer heart

DL717 wrote:

I don’t think people understand what this bill actually says. It adds to established academic standards and on page 17, it specifically says the work need to meet:

“...ordinary standards of substance and relevance...”

It doesn’t change the content of what is taught and it requires ordinary standards. What it does allow is a student to provide a religious viewpoint and prohibits a teacher from penalizing them for doing so, but they still need to meet the standard of substance. Further, it doesn’t remove any existing content from what is already required in the classroom.

All species are created by God as is and evolution isn't in the Bible. Enough substance there ? What more could there be ?

DL717 wrote:

I don’t think people understand what this bill actually says. It adds to established academic standards and on page 17, it specifically says the work need to meet:

“...ordinary standards of substance and relevance...”

It doesn’t change the content of what is taught and it requires ordinary standards. What it does allow is a student to provide a religious viewpoint and prohibits a teacher from penalizing them for doing so, but they still need to meet the standard of substance. Further, it doesn’t remove any existing content from what is already required in the classroom.

Which means a student can take a Bible into the class room as proof the Earth is 6000 years old and as proof that we are all descendants of clay dolls. There is no written word for natives creation stories but they would have to be given a gold star and A+ for insisting that Raven created the Earth and created humans. Even though science says otherwise. Boomers seem to be okay with all this misinformation being taught in public schools but go on to wonder why kids do things like eat detergent and hold Roman candles between their buttocks....

DL717 wrote:

I don’t think people understand what this bill actually says. It adds to established academic standards and on page 17, it specifically says the work need to meet:

“...ordinary standards of substance and relevance...”

It doesn’t change the content of what is taught and it requires ordinary standards. What it does allow is a student to provide a religious viewpoint and prohibits a teacher from penalizing them for doing so, but they still need to meet the standard of substance. Further, it doesn’t remove any existing content from what is already required in the classroom.

Isn't that a tad bit contradictory? How can a student be expected to meet ordinary standards of substance and relevance yet at the same time not worry about being penalized if on a test they say for example a bat is a bird. Which by the way the old testament says exactly that.

What is the whole point of this if it's not such a big deal? The first thing that comes to mind is incrementalism. The GOP is seeing if they can get their foot in the door. Second, they're a bunch of snowflakes who think the bible is under threat and this is how they deal with it.

MSPNWA wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Republicans hate public education. They would rather see "Christian" madrasas. Maybe this is a way of getting public support for shutting down public education in Ohio as a test for shutting down public education nationwide? Republicans can point to students failing SATs and federal standardized tests for funding and this will be their proof that public education does not work.

For very good reason. Dreadful results in teaching children. High cost for poor results, a terrible return on investment. Godless, immoral culture that leads to misbehaving adults (and kids while they're there), helping create a perverse society. "Science" teaching that is simply wrong and completely not science (because it's based on the demand that there can't be a God--the conclusion creates the evidence) but is taught as fact (no wonder we have bills like this). It's the government brainwashing center.

Thanks for partially acknowledging why many don't believe in public "education". Sadly it appears you're not one of them.

Science teaches established data as fact and everything else as unknowns requiring investigation. Ya know, the process that made...Apollo successful...and gave you a job at NWA, and makes it possible for you to access the Internet without a wire. FFS

Wasn't John Glenn from Ohio? Astronaut and science and math and all that? Now that state that gave us a great American hero is just giving up on science and facts.

Your mind on Republicanism.

Ignorance .. now has a legal standing....

..and so it should, I mean, only 'ignorant humans' can make it so. Natural laws (Darwin) suggest ignorance has very very limited usefulness.

BN747

Aesma wrote:

DL717 wrote:

I don’t think people understand what this bill actually says. It adds to established academic standards and on page 17, it specifically says the work need to meet:

“...ordinary standards of substance and relevance...”

It doesn’t change the content of what is taught and it requires ordinary standards. What it does allow is a student to provide a religious viewpoint and prohibits a teacher from penalizing them for doing so, but they still need to meet the standard of substance. Further, it doesn’t remove any existing content from what is already required in the classroom.

All species are created by God as is and evolution isn't in the Bible. Enough substance there ? What more could there be ?

Religious nut-jobs train their children to interrupt class when anything comes up that they happen to not believe in..... with this law teachers can do nothing about students interrupting class anymore, because they just bring up a religious viewpoint (which means a wrong viewpoint in pretty much all cases).

Aesma wrote:

LMP737 wrote:

Man, I wished I had thought of this when I was in school.

I don't know, to me the science is much easier to learn, because it makes sense.

You have to understand science, even with it making sense that is harder than just repeating what you are told, what religion is....

LMP737 wrote:

MSPNWA wrote:

"Science" teaching that is simply wrong and completely not science (because it's based on the demand that there can't be a God--the conclusion creates the evidence)

What are you talking about? Let me guess, it's "wrong" in your eyes because it goes against years of religious indoctrination? Or do you have conclusive evidence that it's wrong? If so you should share that information with the world and stop wasting your time here.

boomer baby doesn´t understand that god being irrelevant to science is not the same thing as denying Gods existence. There are after all some few scientists that do believe in God, they just confine his/her existence to areas where we don´t know better..... and how many gnostic atheists are there anyways, i only ever meet agnostic atheists....

best regards
Thomas

MSPNWA wrote:

Godless, immoral culture that leads to misbehaving adults (and kids while they're there), helping create a perverse society.

Well the thing is that the christian god (if the bible is believed to be real) Promotes the keeping of virgins as slaves to rape. If you deem rape and slavery as moral then I can quite see why an immoral godless society would be a better place than one imbibed with the morals of ... well ... nothing actually compares so a metaphor falls down.

MSPNWA, Either the Bible is not a good source to derive morals or its ok to own another human being. The choice is yours but I guess you've run away from this conversation.

Regards,

Fred

flipdewaf wrote:

MSPNWA wrote:

Godless, immoral culture that leads to misbehaving adults (and kids while they're there), helping create a perverse society.

Well the thing is that the christian god (if the bible is believed to be real) Promotes the keeping of virgins as slaves to rape. If you deem rape and slavery as moral then I can quite see why an immoral godless society would be a better place than one imbibed with the morals of ... well ... nothing actually compares so a metaphor falls down.

MSPNWA, Either the Bible is not a good source to derive morals or its ok to own another human being. The choice is yours but I guess you've run away from this conversation.

Regards,

Fred

LOL...exactly!!!

How can these guys vociferously defend the most godless, immoral 'person' to ever hold the job of POTUS?

But some how in their shredded brain wiring it makes perfect sense to 'condemn godless acts, immorality BUT accept it from your leader'...yep that's them! Without fail..and you can't count the millions of Evangelicals who walk this 'crooked' line every minute.

Fred is correct, slavery past and sexual slavery today (or the story of the dude 'enslaving a disabled black dude for 10 years working 20 hour days in his restaurant - A White Man Who Enslaved A Black Man With A Disability Will Spend 10 Years In Prison -https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/claudiakoerner/white-man-enslaved-black-man-restaurant.

That guy should do no jail time at all because the Bible approves of this just as it does to sell your daughter or worse.

Religious people only love discussing the warm fuzzy Bible tales, never there unpleasant sections, never. By doing so they are brain-loading their kids with such vacuous beliefs is certain prolonging of ignorance.

Either correct your religion or mean it and live up to every word but being the ultimate hypocrite guarantees a life of internal conflict between what you were taught versus what your eyes report back to your to be processed in your brain.

BN747

BN747
BN747

MSPNWA wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Republicans hate public education. They would rather see "Christian" madrasas. Maybe this is a way of getting public support for shutting down public education in Ohio as a test for shutting down public education nationwide? Republicans can point to students failing SATs and federal standardized tests for funding and this will be their proof that public education does not work.

For very good reason. Dreadful results in teaching children. High cost for poor results, a terrible return on investment. Godless, immoral culture that leads to misbehaving adults (and kids while they're there), helping create a perverse society. "Science" teaching that is simply wrong and completely not science (because it's based on the demand that there can't be a God--the conclusion creates the evidence) but is taught as fact (no wonder we have bills like this). It's the government brainwashing center.

Thanks for partially acknowledging why many don't believe in public "education". Sadly it appears you're not one of them.

Whoa, Gramps! Did we forget to take our meds again today? Isn’t this level of craziness a bit too much for a Monday?