Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 1609
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 4:15 am

Last month, farmers took their tractors on the highway in The Netherlands protesting over what they say are attempts to blame them for nitrogen pollution. The tractors caused traffic jams on 375 kilometers or 233 miles of highway and they went to Utrecht and The Hauge. The campaign was launched in May after a court found that The Netherlands was in violation of European nitrogen emissions standards and farmers say that they have taken steps to reduce nitrogen emissions. It is important that nitrogen emissions must be reduced to curb global warming and that is why government regulations are necessary for farm tractors.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/10/ ... 02990.html
 
User avatar
stl07
Posts: 2548
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 8:57 pm

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 4:56 am

The irony is that traffic causes pollution
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
DTVG
Posts: 61
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2019 10:06 pm

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 6:53 am

Controlling nitrogen emissions is mainly about reducing local air pollution (where I live smog) and not about saving the climate.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11984
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 7:42 am

DTVG wrote:
Controlling nitrogen emissions is mainly about reducing local air pollution (where I live smog) and not about saving the climate.


Not so much in the Netherlands, the problem lies with local nature, nitrogen is great for some plant life and species, they thrive on. In the Netherlands, we need less rich soil for native species to thrive.

the main problem was that the Dutch government doesn't want to act, this was known in 2011 that the proposed legislation doesn't work and now the government has been slapped on the risk by the high court for not taking the right action. 46% of all nitrogen is "produced" by farmers, so the real debate is: do we need - as the Netherlands - really be the second-largest exporter in the world of agricultural products? That is not per capita, but overall(!).

The Netherlands is small and we can't do everything, and develop nature, and be the second-largest exporter of agricultural products, and build 1million homes till 2030, and expand our car infrastructure network, and keep our large fossil fuel industry thriving, and have a large international airport, and ....................... So some choices need to be made here to move forward.

So you could have picked contractors, they were protesting a week later.

As for now, we are going to have our maximum speed lowered to 100km/h on highways, during the day. It will help to get the construction business going again, but a more permanent solution is being sought. Integrated sustainability is the game here.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
anrec80
Posts: 2759
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:47 am

Dutchy wrote:
Not so much in the Netherlands, the problem lies with local nature, nitrogen is great for some plant life and species, they thrive on. In the Netherlands, we need less rich soil for native species to thrive.

the main problem was that the Dutch government doesn't want to act, this was known in 2011 that the proposed legislation doesn't work and now the government has been slapped on the risk by the high court for not taking the right action. 46% of all nitrogen is "produced" by farmers, so the real debate is: do we need - as the Netherlands - really be the second-largest exporter in the world of agricultural products? That is not per capita, but overall(!).

The Netherlands is small and we can't do everything, and develop nature, and be the second-largest exporter of agricultural products, and build 1million homes till 2030, and expand our car infrastructure network, and keep our large fossil fuel industry thriving, and have a large international airport, and ....................... So some choices need to be made here to move forward.

So you could have picked contractors, they were protesting a week later.

As for now, we are going to have our maximum speed lowered to 100km/h on highways, during the day. It will help to get the construction business going again, but a more permanent solution is being sought. Integrated sustainability is the game here.


Long story short - people want to live normally and work normally. Without any of this "climate" craze.
 
tommy1808
Posts: 13727
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:58 am

DTVG wrote:
Controlling nitrogen emissions is mainly about reducing local air pollution (where I live smog) .


nope, its about not spending a ton of money on keeping it out of drinking water....

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
tommy1808
Posts: 13727
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:03 am

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Not so much in the Netherlands, the problem lies with local nature, nitrogen is great for some plant life and species, they thrive on. In the Netherlands, we need less rich soil for native species to thrive.

the main problem was that the Dutch government doesn't want to act, this was known in 2011 that the proposed legislation doesn't work and now the government has been slapped on the risk by the high court for not taking the right action. 46% of all nitrogen is "produced" by farmers, so the real debate is: do we need - as the Netherlands - really be the second-largest exporter in the world of agricultural products? That is not per capita, but overall(!).

The Netherlands is small and we can't do everything, and develop nature, and be the second-largest exporter of agricultural products, and build 1million homes till 2030, and expand our car infrastructure network, and keep our large fossil fuel industry thriving, and have a large international airport, and ....................... So some choices need to be made here to move forward.

So you could have picked contractors, they were protesting a week later.

As for now, we are going to have our maximum speed lowered to 100km/h on highways, during the day. It will help to get the construction business going again, but a more permanent solution is being sought. Integrated sustainability is the game here.


Long story short - people want to live normally and work normally. Without any of this "climate" craze.


Long Story short: bullshit
Image

There is a tiny, loud minority probably needs better mental health care more to live and work normally to cure their climate craze.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
petertenthije
Posts: 3978
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2001 10:00 pm

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:44 am

One of the problems is that there is a quotient on how much nitrogen can be produced near official nature preserves.

A few years ago the government in its wisdom decided to massively expand the nature preserves. Not by making more nature, but by assigined preserved status to existing forests, lakes and rivers. This has caused a massive patch work of (at best) loosely connected areas. (1)

These small areas have all given a zone within which nitrogen use is limited. But because there are so many small patches, the nitrogen zone covers vast areas of the country.

One of the things the farmers are protesting against, is that the regions they work in tend to be light on nitrogen. The north, the east and to a lesser extend the south of the Netherlands.(2)
Meanwhile, the areas that produce by far the most nitrogen, are hit relatively lightly because there is not much nature in those areas. Think here of the west of the netherlands, in particular the Amsterdam and Rotterdam regions. You'll also note that nitrogen is on the decline all over the country.

If the government had balls, they would consolidate the patch work of preserves. Get rid of small ones, buy out farmers near large ones to consolidate. But that's hard and expensive. Putting tariffs on farmers is easier. And symbolic gestures like lowering the speed limit to 100 kph is easier still, even though it is well known this won't work.


(1) https://www.clo.nl/indicatoren/nl142502 ... 0-gebieden
(2) https://www.atlasleefomgeving.nl/meer-w ... tofdioxide
The first thing to remember is always treat your kite like you treat your woman.
Get inside her five times a day and take her to heaven and back!
Lord Flashheart, 1989
 
FatCat
Posts: 1038
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:02 pm

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:37 am

we make everything green
but the lithium extraction, treatment and recycling processes to build our green electric cars are some of the most polluting processes
as it is copper extraction and processing
as hydro-, solar-, and windpower are polluting and nature-devastating processes
as cracking process to extract hydrogen for our green eco friendly cars is a nature devastating process
Aeroplane flies high
Turns left, looks right
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11984
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:59 am

anrec80 wrote:
Long story short - people want to live normally and work normally. Without any of this "climate" craze.


Long story short: you want to cause a divide in western society and ALL your comments should be seen in that light. It is just wearily and tiresome your "contribution".
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
Bongodog49
Posts: 182
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:35 am

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:58 pm

Farmers in the UK have been struggling with nitrate vulnerable zones for a few years now. If you are in such a zone you are prevented from spreading any manure in the winter months, plus you have limits on the total amount you can apply. Meanwhile the Netherlands appears to have been able to intensify its livestock enterprises spreading ever larger amounts of manure on its fields.
As a generalisation, if a UK farm with X cows and y hectares struggles to dispose of its manure within EU regs, how does a netherlands farm with 2x cows and y/2 hectares manage ?

The Netherlands has a dairy herd 60% the size of the UK's on a land area only 15% of the size. The Netherlands pig population is 2.5 x the UK's.
Quite simply too much muck, not enough land.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11984
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 3:39 pm

The Dutch farming industry is extremely efficient and that is a problem nowadays. Too many cows, too many pigs, too many chickens etc. We need to make choices here to move forward.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Aesma
Posts: 13394
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:14 am

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Thu Nov 21, 2019 6:41 pm

In France, especially Brittany, this is a huge problem, and there is no doubt at all that farmers, in particular pig producers, are to blame. The consequences are rivers are full of algae killing everything else, tap water is crazy expensive due to the treatments needed to make it drinkable, and beaches are covered in toxic, deadly green algae every spring and summer.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
tommy1808
Posts: 13727
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: Recent Tractor Protests in The Netherlands

Fri Nov 22, 2019 5:43 am

FatCat wrote:
as hydro-, solar-, and windpower are polluting and nature-devastating processes


Hydro can be a huge mess, but the rest isn´t "nature devastating" at all. If may be offensive to your eyes, but you are not "nature", and it beats other kinds of Energy hands down.

And it has nothing to do with Nitrogen.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: DarkSnowyNight, Dt91c and 58 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos