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dtw2hyd
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 2:25 pm

einsteinboricua wrote:
...
I don't think markets care too much that Pence is not qualified; rather, they're more concerned with disruptions to the supply chain. If world economies show a massive slowdown, I think recession fears may become more prominent.


Didn't some brilliant analyst on CNBC say China factories are restarting production, no need to worry? Was he expecting a spike to dump his stock?
All posts are just opinions.
 
Alfons
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 2:40 pm

Daniel Koch, Head of Communicable Diseases Division of Switzerland, said today in a press conference by answer a journalist' question, that the Coronavirus is here to stay. It won't disappear or reduce due to UV rays in the summer or through other seasonal reasons. It will stay until we all got it, except the ones who received a vaccine. That's also an interesting new information which must be based on a scientific knowledge.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 2:58 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
einsteinboricua wrote:
...
I don't think markets care too much that Pence is not qualified; rather, they're more concerned with disruptions to the supply chain. If world economies show a massive slowdown, I think recession fears may become more prominent.


Didn't some brilliant analyst on CNBC say China factories are restarting production, no need to worry? Was he expecting a spike to dump his stock?

Stock market is a lagging indicator.

Tanker charter rates down 80%:

https://gcaptain.com/tanker-rates-plung ... -shipping/

“On the finished goods side of it you’ve got empty containers for example in China and you’ve got a shortage of containers in the (United) States because the manufactured goods are not getting out of China and being transported round the world. It’s affecting all the supply chain throughout theshipping industry,” he said.


I personally do not read much wall street analysis. I read news on enabling industries and everything points to, in my opinion, a 5 to 7 month hit in global GNP. In my opinion, the black swan event has already occurred.

Labor intensive industries will be hardest hit: electronics, automobile, shipping (ports, trucking, warehouses all take a huge amount of labor), textiles (a Hubei specialty)... The supply chain is disrupted.

Lightsaber

Late edit: India really hit by lack of frieghters at Colombo (trans shipment center for India due to lack of efficient deep water ports for the 20000 teu vessels) and lack of containers:

https://theloadstar.com/coronavirus-hit ... t-scarcer/
Winter is coming.
 
L410Turbolet
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:08 pm

art wrote:
[
I share your scepticism in terms of the number of cases reported and think the real number is much higher but I see no advantage for the communist party to manipulate the analysis of those reported cases.

There really was no reason to arrest the doctor who tried to earn others about coronavirus, yet they did. They knew that lying got them nowhere with SARS, yet they did lied again for many weeks to even admit there's a problém.
That's why I think the Chinese official stats you copy and paste on this forum is just a waste of energy and space. They are far from reality and I doubt even the Chinese government really knows how much.
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:19 pm

lightsaber wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
einsteinboricua wrote:
...
I don't think markets care too much that Pence is not qualified; rather, they're more concerned with disruptions to the supply chain. If world economies show a massive slowdown, I think recession fears may become more prominent.


Didn't some brilliant analyst on CNBC say China factories are restarting production, no need to worry? Was he expecting a spike to dump his stock?

Stock market is a lagging indicator.

Tanker charter rates down 80%:

https://gcaptain.com/tanker-rates-plung ... -shipping/

“On the finished goods side of it you’ve got empty containers for example in China and you’ve got a shortage of containers in the (United) States because the manufactured goods are not getting out of China and being transported round the world. It’s affecting all the supply chain throughout theshipping industry,” he said.


I personally do not read much wall street analysis. I read news on enabling industries and everything points to, in my opinion, a 5 to 7 month hit in global GNP. In my opinion, the black swan event has already occurred.

Labor intensive industries will be hardest hit: electronics, automobile, shipping (ports, trucking, warehouses all take a huge amount of labor), textiles (a Hubei specialty)... The supply chain is disrupted.

Lightsaber

Late edit: India really hit by lack of frieghters at Colombo (trans shipment center for India due to lack of efficient deep water ports for the 20000 teu vessels) and lack of containers:

https://theloadstar.com/coronavirus-hit ... t-scarcer/


Adding on:
1. Yes, China is reopening their factories. But that doesn't mean those factories will run at 100% from Day 1. There are still restriction of movements meaning not all the migrant workers can necessarily get back to where they work right there. This means labor shortage that will last at least until end of March.
2. Some factories own by foreign companies are also not fully reopening yet - mainly hitting automobile sectors.
3. Electronics will get hit by the current outbreak in South Korea also - especially things like memories and display.
4. All these and factories in China essentially has to catch up with a month worth of stoppage - that's LOTS of goods.

And I'm making the estimates base on an assumption that the outbreak is truly over in China, and no additional outbreaks will occurred in those crowded factories. Another outbreak = more disruptions = just throw the global supply chain further into a tailspin.

The bottom line is, that's what happen when the world relied on China to be the "World Factory".

EDIT:
US Stock market in another dive today...DJIA down ~600 (2.5%) so far, as is S&P 500 (also down ~2.5%). All these with the nCoV barely hitting US. Can't imagine what the market will look like if (touch wood) a Italian/Korean style outbreak occur in US.
Last edited by zakuivcustom on Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:23 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:
...
The bottom line is, that's what happen when the world relied on China to be the "World Factory".


China is the World's SPOF. But I am sure beancounters everywhere explaining this is once in a 100-year event, no need to mitigate.
All posts are just opinions.
 
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alberchico
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:37 pm

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... llness.htm

I hope the Pope doesn't get it. In other news, Japanese schools are ordered closed for a month. Wow.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... month.html
short summary of every jewish holiday: they tried to kill us ,we won , lets eat !
 
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casinterest
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:43 pm

One thing is becoming clear. The concentration has to be on getting those that are susceptible to the worsening effects identified. This disease is going to spread, and no quarantine is going to stop it. The quarantines can slow it, but only so much.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:51 pm

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/News/mi ... eport.html

One of the VP of Iran (VP of Women and Family Affair), Masoumeh Ebtekar, was tested positive for nCoV.

For background - Masoumeh Ebtekar is known as "Mary" by foreign press and is the English spokeperson/translator for the students during the 1979 Iran Hostage Crisis.
 
L410Turbolet
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:32 pm

alberchico wrote:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8051083/Pope-cancels-visit-Rome-priests-slight-illness.htm

I hope the Pope doesn't get it.

Indeed, this moronic Pope doesn't get many things. Taking basic hygienic precautions in times of epidemic is one of them.
His "solidarity" antics are simply dumb. Thoughts and prayers?
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 5:16 pm

Some updates from Norway:

- 1st individual who tested positive for COVID-19 was voluneerly quarantined in his home yesterday.
- Today 50 people are volunteerly quarantined in Oslo, Stavanger, Elverum, Tromsø and Sauda on suspicion of Coronavirus infection. (Test results not ready yet)
- National Institute of Public Health (Folkehelseinstituttet) are planning for 25% of the population being infected. With a 25% infection rate, 280,000 people are expected to need medical care, and 16,000 might need hospital care.
- The institute has the power to shut down public transport as well as quarantine parts of cities, entire cities or entire regions.
- I'm getting info from local governments where I live with instructions of what to do if suspicion of Coronavirus infection.

Seems like the system is working here so far, I expect it will not be as easy if it really becomes a pandemic.

Link in Norwegian:

https://www.nettavisen.no/nyheter/planl ... 29297.html
 
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Erebus
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 5:19 pm

L410Turbolet wrote:
alberchico wrote:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8051083/Pope-cancels-visit-Rome-priests-slight-illness.htm

I hope the Pope doesn't get it.

Indeed, this moronic Pope doesn't get many things. Taking basic hygienic precautions in times of epidemic is one of them.
His "solidarity" antics are simply dumb. Thoughts and prayers?


Blinded by faith, religious obligations.

Explosion in Korean cases traceable to a church cult. https://qz.com/1808390/religion-is-at-the-heart-of-koreas-coronavirus-outbreak/

Explaining the linkages between religion and the outbreak in Korea, Francis Jae-ryong Song, a professor in sociology at Kyung Hee University in Seoul, described the country as a “zealous Christian state.” She said many Korean Christians have an “evangelical mindset” and their religious activities, like attending worship sessions and outreach multiple times a week, and their unwillingness to curb those activities, may have led to the large-scale spread of the contagion.


And Iran too. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-51651454

Other health experts have expressed concern about Iran's decision not to restrict access to the shrine of Hazrat Masumeh in Qom.

Its custodian has insisted it should be kept open as a "house for cure".

"House for cure means people would come here to get cured from mental and physical diseases," Ayatollah Mohammed Saeedi told Jamaran news website on Wednesday. "Therefore, it should be open, and people should be encouraged to come here."


No surprises why they are among the hardest hit outside of China.
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 5:22 pm

South Korea reports 505 new coronavirus cases today, 1,766 in total. Largest daily increase so far.

I don't have a source for this yet, only a tweet:

https://twitter.com/NorbertElekes/statu ... 04678?s=20
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 5:44 pm

https://www.vox.com/2020/2/27/21155394/ ... ock-market

Ignore the brief evaluation of Trump declaring a victory. Most of the story is what the goals of sober epidemiologists are. The infections will come, that is the most likely event. But slowing down the infection rates are all important. That way hospitals and other medical facilities will not be overwhelmed. Think of it as a plateau of seriousness as opposed to a high peak. Also, when the infections start spreading we all will need to observe appropriate social distancing. Depending upon the seriousness, ones age, co-morbidity schools, daycare, special procedures in nursing homes and assisted living, restaurants, theaters, churches will all experience restrictions or closures. The function of the national government is to support states, cities etc. in making appropriate responses and curtailments. And avoiding false and useless steps which would waste money and public support.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 5:44 pm

Erebus wrote:
L410Turbolet wrote:
alberchico wrote:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8051083/Pope-cancels-visit-Rome-priests-slight-illness.htm

I hope the Pope doesn't get it.

Indeed, this moronic Pope doesn't get many things. Taking basic hygienic precautions in times of epidemic is one of them.
His "solidarity" antics are simply dumb. Thoughts and prayers?


Blinded by faith, religious obligations.

Explosion in Korean cases traceable to a church cult. https://qz.com/1808390/religion-is-at-the-heart-of-koreas-coronavirus-outbreak/

Explaining the linkages between religion and the outbreak in Korea, Francis Jae-ryong Song, a professor in sociology at Kyung Hee University in Seoul, described the country as a “zealous Christian state.” She said many Korean Christians have an “evangelical mindset” and their religious activities, like attending worship sessions and outreach multiple times a week, and their unwillingness to curb those activities, may have led to the large-scale spread of the contagion.


And Iran too. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-51651454

Other health experts have expressed concern about Iran's decision not to restrict access to the shrine of Hazrat Masumeh in Qom.

Its custodian has insisted it should be kept open as a "house for cure".

"House for cure means people would come here to get cured from mental and physical diseases," Ayatollah Mohammed Saeedi told Jamaran news website on Wednesday. "Therefore, it should be open, and people should be encouraged to come here."


No surprises why they are among the hardest hit outside of China.


This is exactly why Medeaval Europe was so hard hit with the plague back in the 1300s. The priests, monks and other intellectuals gathered the people to heal them, to pray for them, and so on. They went from patient to patient and spread the disease.

Then they all died, and since the priests and monks were the only ones who knew how to read and write, Europe was set back 500 years intellectually. At least.
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 6:00 pm

Erebus wrote:
Blinded by faith, religious obligations.


It's partially "blinded", but there's also the fact that place of worship is VERY prone for spreading virus as you're talking about an enclosed space with tons of people.

The two largest clusters in Singapore both involved community spread among church members (Grace Assembly Church and Life Church):
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/ ... ists-via-a

Meanwhile, in Hong Kong, multiple worshippers of the same Buddhist temple/center (Fook Wai Ching She) in North Point caught the virus. It's right now the largest cluster in HK.
http://www.ejinsight.com/20200226-covid ... e-to-nine/

Tests at the temple revealed that there are viruses sticking to sink handle in toilet, the worshipping mat, etc.

That's not to say that there are no zealous people, for example, there's that "anti-Moon Jae-In" Christians Group in South Korea that keep trying to defy bans on group gatherings:
https://en.yna.co.kr/view/AEN20200226004300315

They "rally" in Gwanghuamun Plaza on 23rd, with the mayor of Seoul literally have to come to the plaza to try to put a stop to that rally, only for the mayor to almost get chased out by that religious "mob".
 
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Jouhou
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 6:09 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:

The only thing that seems to be consistently out here in US is surgical mask. Can't help that most of US stock of those are made in China...

I concurred with hand sanitizer - I could have bought a box load of them from supermarket yesterday. Same with disinfecting wipes.



The Italian outbreak IMHO is what really spook the market - it came from almost nowhere and is threatening to spread further to the rest of Europe. There's an Iranian outbreak that came from nowhere also, but that affect Middle East more than US economy. The South Korean outbreak is tracable (to Sincheonji Church), but will affect the South Korean economy (and thus, tech sector). Japan is another unknown waiting to explode.

At least there's a giant ocean that separate US from the major regions of outbreak. I can imagine somebody that had been to Northern Italy eventually cause an outbreak somewhere in US, though.


It's sad though that the US has drastically cut back SNS stockpiles of face masks from over 100 million to 30 million over the past decade. That leaves us in a real bind. We need to issue domestic long term contracts to expand domestic production immediately. And not to just multinational corporations with long and thin supply chains. Small and domestic.

As for Italy, another thing that and Iran means is that this virus is likely seeded in many places undetected.

I'm also worried that with the CDC refusing to test our first community spread case for several days we may have many more blatantly Ill cases not being tested. We need to test more, immediately. Not just people with contacts from China or confirmed cases, this is ridiculous.
情報
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 6:34 pm

Is having a COVID-19 test kit a must or a lab can devise its own kit using supplies in stock, like a compound pharmacy.
All posts are just opinions.
 
kalvado
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 6:37 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Is having a COVID-19 test kit a must or a lab can devise its own kit using supplies in stock, like a compound pharmacy.

It is fairly complicated to make such kit from scratch. Basic information is published, so it is doable... for something like a major university research center or a large biotech company. Not for a city hospital.
 
art
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 7:08 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
...
The bottom line is, that's what happen when the world relied on China to be the "World Factory".


China is the World's SPOF. But I am sure beancounters everywhere explaining this is once in a 100-year event, no need to mitigate.


I had a friemd involved in marine design including offshore drilling rigs used in the North Sea. He told me that rigs had to be designed to survive astonishingly large waves, so large that it was estimated that they would only occur once every 100 years -'the '100 year wave'.

I also recall him telling me that in the decade since one rig he had helped design was commissioned, it had survived several 100 year waves.

Alfons wrote:
Daniel Koch, Head of Communicable Diseases Division of Switzerland, said today in a press conference by answer a journalist' question, that the Coronavirus is here to stay. It won't disappear or reduce due to UV rays in the summer or through other seasonal reasons. It will stay until we all got it, except the ones who received a vaccine. That's also an interesting new information which must be based on a scientific knowledge.


Any reason why it should not join the world's repertoire of diseases? I imagine that it is a disease that will exist in various parts of the world until enough people are vaccinated to allow remaining small outbreaks to be contained. Then it will be "Bye bye COVID-19 - not nice to have known you!"
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 7:28 pm

Italy reports 231 new cases of coronavirus today, 655 cases in total.

This is out of control.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:20 pm

zakuivcustom wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:

Didn't some brilliant analyst on CNBC say China factories are restarting production, no need to worry? Was he expecting a spike to dump his stock?

Stock market is a lagging indicator.

Tanker charter rates down 80%:

https://gcaptain.com/tanker-rates-plung ... -shipping/

“On the finished goods side of it you’ve got empty containers for example in China and you’ve got a shortage of containers in the (United) States because the manufactured goods are not getting out of China and being transported round the world. It’s affecting all the supply chain throughout theshipping industry,” he said.


I personally do not read much wall street analysis. I read news on enabling industries and everything points to, in my opinion, a 5 to 7 month hit in global GNP. In my opinion, the black swan event has already occurred.

Labor intensive industries will be hardest hit: electronics, automobile, shipping (ports, trucking, warehouses all take a huge amount of labor), textiles (a Hubei specialty)... The supply chain is disrupted.

Lightsaber

Late edit: India really hit by lack of frieghters at Colombo (trans shipment center for India due to lack of efficient deep water ports for the 20000 teu vessels) and lack of containers:

https://theloadstar.com/coronavirus-hit ... t-scarcer/


Adding on:
1. Yes, China is reopening their factories. But that doesn't mean those factories will run at 100% from Day 1. There are still restriction of movements meaning not all the migrant workers can necessarily get back to where they work right there. This means labor shortage that will last at least until end of March.
2. Some factories own by foreign companies are also not fully reopening yet - mainly hitting automobile sectors.
3. Electronics will get hit by the current outbreak in South Korea also - especially things like memories and display.
4. All these and factories in China essentially has to catch up with a month worth of stoppage - that's LOTS of goods.

And I'm making the estimates base on an assumption that the outbreak is truly over in China, and no additional outbreaks will occurred in those crowded factories. Another outbreak = more disruptions = just throw the global supply chain further into a tailspin.

The bottom line is, that's what happen when the world relied on China to be the "World Factory".

EDIT:
US Stock market in another dive today...DJIA down ~600 (2.5%) so far, as is S&P 500 (also down ~2.5%). All these with the nCoV barely hitting US. Can't imagine what the market will look like if (touch wood) a Italian/Korean style outbreak occur in US.

I do not subscribe to the outbreak being over.

Wuhan was the source of global powdered eggs, we know that is shut down. I posted links prior of food waiting in multiple countries to ship as the reefers are stuck in China.

I can agree with your analysis. Due to just in time, that month muck up has containers in the wrong places. The USA has a container shortage per my prior links. :faint: Normally they are selling those things off as cheap self storage. There are multiple acres near San Pedro harbor that had containers stacked 8 high looking for someone to rent it. If those were cleared, we are in a tight market.

There is a reason I believe we haven't baked in a 5 to 7 month hit.

The shortages start in the USA soon of little things.
Diet Coke sweatener in short supply: https://amp.usatoday.com/amp/4890071002

It looks like Coke used their muscle to ensure supply. Everyone else?

Lightsaber
Winter is coming.
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:34 pm

lightsaber wrote:
I do not subscribe to the outbreak being over.


I certainly don't believe that the outbreak is over, either. My point is, supply chain shortage is a real thing even in the most ideal scenario.

JetBuddy wrote:
Italy reports 231 new cases of coronavirus today, 655 cases in total.

This is out of control.


I almost want to use the word "insane" to describe this...

The worst part? I don't think Italy even trace back the mass outbreak to a "Patient Zero" yet.
 
kalvado
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:35 pm

JetBuddy wrote:
Italy reports 231 new cases of coronavirus today, 655 cases in total.

This is out of control.

I am more upset with the person who wasn't tested for a week in California. since (s)he is sick for a while, transmission happened sometime in early February, and there is a yet to be discoveres bunch of cases..
CDC were going to use their flu surveylance system, but apparently didn't. Cat is out of the bag, and virus is now free-roaming in US.
 
wingman
Posts: 4021
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:39 pm

Thank God and Trump that we now have Pence leading the US response. The CDC is little more than a fake news cesspool. Pence is already laying out the groundwork for a rapid response strategy based on abstinence. I don’t have any sources but I do have Faith.
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 9:02 pm

Norway now has 4 confirmed cases, 50 suspected COVID-19 patients in quarantine.

It keeps spreading wildly through Europe now. And EU is still insisting on no border controls.

(Norway is not EU, but Schengen area).
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 9:23 pm

Market is clearly not confident that this will blow over.

DJIA posted its biggest drop ever (down 1190 points), surpassing the drop from back in 2018 by 15 points.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
Waterbomber2
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:36 pm

It's happening people.
Restricting movement of people is the only way to slow this down.
I watched the White House's press conference yesterday and Trump is quite frankly doing a great job. Europe and Japan left their borders wide open for China and are now lined up for disaster.
The US will close borders very soon, they have said they are considering it.

Clusters appearing in France and Germany.
Keeping borders open is insanity, a suicide mission.
 
L410Turbolet
Posts: 6268
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:38 pm

JetBuddy wrote:
Erebus wrote:
L410Turbolet wrote:
Indeed, this moronic Pope doesn't get many things. Taking basic hygienic precautions in times of epidemic is one of them.
His "solidarity" antics are simply dumb. Thoughts and prayers?


Blinded by faith, religious obligations.

Explosion in Korean cases traceable to a church cult. https://qz.com/1808390/religion-is-at-the-heart-of-koreas-coronavirus-outbreak/

Explaining the linkages between religion and the outbreak in Korea, Francis Jae-ryong Song, a professor in sociology at Kyung Hee University in Seoul, described the country as a “zealous Christian state.” She said many Korean Christians have an “evangelical mindset” and their religious activities, like attending worship sessions and outreach multiple times a week, and their unwillingness to curb those activities, may have led to the large-scale spread of the contagion.


And Iran too. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-51651454

Other health experts have expressed concern about Iran's decision not to restrict access to the shrine of Hazrat Masumeh in Qom.

Its custodian has insisted it should be kept open as a "house for cure".

"House for cure means people would come here to get cured from mental and physical diseases," Ayatollah Mohammed Saeedi told Jamaran news website on Wednesday. "Therefore, it should be open, and people should be encouraged to come here."


No surprises why they are among the hardest hit outside of China.


This is exactly why Medeaval Europe was so hard hit with the plague back in the 1300s. The priests, monks and other intellectuals gathered the people to heal them, to pray for them, and so on. They went from patient to patient and spread the disease.


Ironically, backward muslim clerics in Saudi Arabia, who decided to cancel Mecca pilgrimages, seem to have more common sense at the moment, than allegedly "progressive" pope, who snogs with people. If he wants to go for the Darwin Award for 2020, so be it, but he should think up a way without exposing other people to unnecessary hazards.
 
joeblow10
Posts: 467
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Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:45 pm

Waterbomber2 wrote:
It's happening people.
Restricting movement of people is the only way to slow this down.
I watched the White House's press conference yesterday and Trump is quite frankly doing a great job. Europe and Japan left their borders wide open for China and are now lined up for disaster.
The US will close borders very soon, they have said they are considering it.

Clusters appearing in France and Germany.
Keeping borders open is insanity, a suicide mission.


I have no idea how you can claim Trump is doing a great job - and this is coming from a guy who voted for him. He offered almost zero specifics last night, not to mention some of his comments praising how we will soon have “almost zero” patients in the US, as it clearly spreads behind the scenes. The fact this latest patient in CA, the first instance of community spread, wasn’t tested for days on end despite being on a ventilator machine at the hospital, shows the pure incompetence and I would even argue cover-up going on behind the scenes to prevent mass market panic.

We closed off flights from China. Fantastic! Then why on earth are we still allowing flights from Korea and Italy, and Japan as well.

That’s all he cares about - the market - because it’s the key to his re-election. Nothing he is doing is helping that... sealing off the borders would probably only tank them more.
 
Dieuwer
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2017 6:27 pm

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:53 pm

Increase in new cases slowing down. Looks like we are going to plateau at about 100,000 infected.


https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019%E2%8 ... s_outbreak
 
yonahleung
Posts: 75
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 3:55 am

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 12:38 am

Dieuwer wrote:
Increase in new cases slowing down. Looks like we are going to plateau at about 100,000 infected.


https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019%E2%8 ... s_outbreak

That is if you believe the Chinese figures. Seeing the US stock market's reaction we now know what incentives are behind the Chinese misreporting of figures, especially when ensuring production does not take too big a hit is their main aim right now. (And they are also making ridiculous accusations that someone back-import the Wuhan-virus into China from Iran and South Korea... I am pretty sure that 5 years later they will try to say that the Wuhan virus originated from South Korea or Iran and China is just a victim of inadequate infection control measures of other countries.
 
BigBazza
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2016 2:02 am

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 12:40 am

Potential dog infection in Hong Kong
https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/hea ... ient-tests
"The spokesman added that tests would be repeated to determine if the dog had really been infected or if the result was caused by environmental contamination of the dog’s mouth and nose."
 
Dieuwer
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2017 6:27 pm

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 12:41 am

Dutch info show on the Coronavirus: "Facts and Fables". Auto-generated translation subtitles available.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xeubt5oGwoo
 
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seb146
Posts: 22799
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 12:46 am

I wonder how the United States can deal with this given that many working people can not afford health care and can not afford to take time off work anyway? Not to mention all the cuts to what little public health care we had. This should be a wake up call for all Americans: that we need affordable health care.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
Dieuwer
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2017 6:27 pm

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 12:53 am

Dieuwer wrote:
Dutch info show on the Coronavirus: "Facts and Fables". Auto-generated translation subtitles available.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xeubt5oGwoo


Good points being made about wearing or not wearing masks:
"Health care workers wear masks because they interact closely with the infected patient and need to minimize exposure as much as possible". "Wearing masks on the streets won't help as much as the exposure to the virus on the street is minimal, as long as you do not touch an infected person or getting aerosols from an infected person." "It is much more important to adhere to strict personal hygiene. Wash hands thoroughly, sneeze into your elbow, etc."

In short, people need to use common sense.
 
Waterbomber2
Posts: 1363
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 1:31 am

joeblow10 wrote:
Waterbomber2 wrote:
It's happening people.
Restricting movement of people is the only way to slow this down.
I watched the White House's press conference yesterday and Trump is quite frankly doing a great job. Europe and Japan left their borders wide open for China and are now lined up for disaster.
The US will close borders very soon, they have said they are considering it.

Clusters appearing in France and Germany.
Keeping borders open is insanity, a suicide mission.


I have no idea how you can claim Trump is doing a great job - and this is coming from a guy who voted for him. He offered almost zero specifics last night, not to mention some of his comments praising how we will soon have “almost zero” patients in the US, as it clearly spreads behind the scenes. The fact this latest patient in CA, the first instance of community spread, wasn’t tested for days on end despite being on a ventilator machine at the hospital, shows the pure incompetence and I would even argue cover-up going on behind the scenes to prevent mass market panic.

We closed off flights from China. Fantastic! Then why on earth are we still allowing flights from Korea and Italy, and Japan as well.

That’s all he cares about - the market - because it’s the key to his re-election. Nothing he is doing is helping that... sealing off the borders would probably only tank them more.


Leaders in Europe and Asia haven't made the tough decision of closing borders and now there are unstoppable amounts of clusters.

Italy did force the flights to/from China shut but other EU countries did not, so anyone from China could still reach Italy with a connection in another EU country and this is what happened supposedly.

Trump made the tough call of rejecting anyone coming from China, which was a bold move. Without this move, the US may have had thousands of infections by now, considering the huge interface it had with China before the travel restrictions.
You can't avoid that infections will pop up right and left, as I said previously in this thread, thousands of people travelled to the US from China to visit friends and relatives during the Chinese new year, before the travel restrictions took effect and it was unbelievable, even suspicious, that no infections had been reported so far.
A few clusters here and there are very manageable and buy the US crucial time.
Trump has to be an actor sometimes, and that's what he did when he said from India that he's not worried. The reason he can do that is because he's working hard behind the scenes, he just wanted to reassure people.
I don't have a problem with a government working hard behind the scenes while putting up a brave face in front of the camera's. The US is mobilising people, preparing protocols and money.
I do have a problem with governments in the EU and Japan asking not to panic while doing no kind of preparation or taking no measures to slow down the spread (albeit Japan is now snapping out of it and starting to take bold measures, thank god).

Also, the US government will obviously take care of medical bills associated with the virus as it's a health emergency, this has nothing to do with the broader health care debate in the US.

Trump's only mistake is worrying too much about a stock market crash affecting his re-election. This crisis is an external factor that would crash the stock market under any president.
If he wants to be re-elected, he will have to show that he will take care of the safety and health of American people, things that are much more important in such a crisis, as people claw back down to the lower levels of the pyramid of Maslow.
 
User avatar
WarRI1
Posts: 14195
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 10:51 am

Partisanship complicates US coronavirus reactions

Fri Feb 28, 2020 1:56 am

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2020/0 ... /23935689/


Look at who trump blames for stock market crash. A sick man and then look at Pence putting a political face on it all.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
User avatar
precure787
Posts: 219
Joined: Sat Jun 20, 2015 9:44 pm

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 1:56 am

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
some live updates related to the coronavirus. Reference only (may be subject to change)
Edward Zen/Precure 787
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 12730
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Partisanship complicates US coronavirus reactions

Fri Feb 28, 2020 2:25 am

Ridiculous. In a public health scenario, experts should be the only ones opining on matters. There should be zero partisanship on things that come down to science.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
User avatar
stl07
Posts: 2549
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 8:57 pm

Re: Partisanship complicates US coronavirus reactions

Fri Feb 28, 2020 2:29 am

Apparently today he declared you must go through him if you are a government official to release info cuz he is worried the info will mess up the markets
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
User avatar
WarRI1
Posts: 14195
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 10:51 am

Re: Partisanship complicates US coronavirus reactions

Fri Feb 28, 2020 2:34 am

Aaron747 wrote:
Ridiculous. In a public health scenario, experts should be the only ones opining on matters. There should be zero partisanship on things that come down to science.



This man cannot keep his mouth shut, a danger to us all.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
User avatar
WarRI1
Posts: 14195
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 10:51 am

Re: Partisanship complicates US coronavirus reactions

Fri Feb 28, 2020 2:36 am

stl07 wrote:
Apparently today he declared you must go through him if you are a government official to release info cuz he is worried the info will mess up the markets



It does not surprise me, another enemies list for sure, now with health officials in the middle of a global health crisis. Let us hope it is the middle.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
zakuivcustom
Posts: 3568
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2017 3:32 am

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 2:41 am

Waterbomber2 wrote:
joeblow10 wrote:
Waterbomber2 wrote:
It's happening people.
Restricting movement of people is the only way to slow this down.
I watched the White House's press conference yesterday and Trump is quite frankly doing a great job. Europe and Japan left their borders wide open for China and are now lined up for disaster.
The US will close borders very soon, they have said they are considering it.

Clusters appearing in France and Germany.
Keeping borders open is insanity, a suicide mission.


I have no idea how you can claim Trump is doing a great job - and this is coming from a guy who voted for him. He offered almost zero specifics last night, not to mention some of his comments praising how we will soon have “almost zero” patients in the US, as it clearly spreads behind the scenes. The fact this latest patient in CA, the first instance of community spread, wasn’t tested for days on end despite being on a ventilator machine at the hospital, shows the pure incompetence and I would even argue cover-up going on behind the scenes to prevent mass market panic.

We closed off flights from China. Fantastic! Then why on earth are we still allowing flights from Korea and Italy, and Japan as well.

That’s all he cares about - the market - because it’s the key to his re-election. Nothing he is doing is helping that... sealing off the borders would probably only tank them more.


Leaders in Europe and Asia haven't made the tough decision of closing borders and now there are unstoppable amounts of clusters.

Italy did force the flights to/from China shut but other EU countries did not, so anyone from China could still reach Italy with a connection in another EU country and this is what happened supposedly.

Trump made the tough call of rejecting anyone coming from China, which was a bold move. Without this move, the US may have had thousands of infections by now, considering the huge interface it had with China before the travel restrictions.
You can't avoid that infections will pop up right and left, as I said previously in this thread, thousands of people travelled to the US from China to visit friends and relatives during the Chinese new year, before the travel restrictions took effect and it was unbelievable, even suspicious, that no infections had been reported so far.
A few clusters here and there are very manageable and buy the US crucial time.
Trump has to be an actor sometimes, and that's what he did when he said from India that he's not worried. The reason he can do that is because he's working hard behind the scenes, he just wanted to reassure people.
I don't have a problem with a government working hard behind the scenes while putting up a brave face in front of the camera's. The US is mobilising people, preparing protocols and money.
I do have a problem with governments in the EU and Japan asking not to panic while doing no kind of preparation or taking no measures to slow down the spread (albeit Japan is now snapping out of it and starting to take bold measures, thank god).

Also, the US government will obviously take care of medical bills associated with the virus as it's a health emergency, this has nothing to do with the broader health care debate in the US.

Trump's only mistake is worrying too much about a stock market crash affecting his re-election. This crisis is an external factor that would crash the stock market under any president.
If he wants to be re-elected, he will have to show that he will take care of the safety and health of American people, things that are much more important in such a crisis, as people claw back down to the lower levels of the pyramid of Maslow.


Except from all I have seen, Trump care more about market not crashing more than anything.

All his reassurance are empty talks - anyone can come out and say everything is fine, but actions speak louder than words.

See Singapore - the govt there not only try to calm its populace, they took direct actions, and never backed away from them. Singapore now has the outbreak more or less in control. And yes, Singapore closed off border to anyone from mainland before basically everyone else (only behind North Korea).

For a govt that is all talk, look at Japan. Look at Hong Kong. Tell me how great things are in both places?
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 12730
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 2:49 am

zakuivcustom wrote:
Waterbomber2 wrote:
joeblow10 wrote:

I have no idea how you can claim Trump is doing a great job - and this is coming from a guy who voted for him. He offered almost zero specifics last night, not to mention some of his comments praising how we will soon have “almost zero” patients in the US, as it clearly spreads behind the scenes. The fact this latest patient in CA, the first instance of community spread, wasn’t tested for days on end despite being on a ventilator machine at the hospital, shows the pure incompetence and I would even argue cover-up going on behind the scenes to prevent mass market panic.

We closed off flights from China. Fantastic! Then why on earth are we still allowing flights from Korea and Italy, and Japan as well.

That’s all he cares about - the market - because it’s the key to his re-election. Nothing he is doing is helping that... sealing off the borders would probably only tank them more.


Leaders in Europe and Asia haven't made the tough decision of closing borders and now there are unstoppable amounts of clusters.

Italy did force the flights to/from China shut but other EU countries did not, so anyone from China could still reach Italy with a connection in another EU country and this is what happened supposedly.

Trump made the tough call of rejecting anyone coming from China, which was a bold move. Without this move, the US may have had thousands of infections by now, considering the huge interface it had with China before the travel restrictions.
You can't avoid that infections will pop up right and left, as I said previously in this thread, thousands of people travelled to the US from China to visit friends and relatives during the Chinese new year, before the travel restrictions took effect and it was unbelievable, even suspicious, that no infections had been reported so far.
A few clusters here and there are very manageable and buy the US crucial time.
Trump has to be an actor sometimes, and that's what he did when he said from India that he's not worried. The reason he can do that is because he's working hard behind the scenes, he just wanted to reassure people.
I don't have a problem with a government working hard behind the scenes while putting up a brave face in front of the camera's. The US is mobilising people, preparing protocols and money.
I do have a problem with governments in the EU and Japan asking not to panic while doing no kind of preparation or taking no measures to slow down the spread (albeit Japan is now snapping out of it and starting to take bold measures, thank god).

Also, the US government will obviously take care of medical bills associated with the virus as it's a health emergency, this has nothing to do with the broader health care debate in the US.

Trump's only mistake is worrying too much about a stock market crash affecting his re-election. This crisis is an external factor that would crash the stock market under any president.
If he wants to be re-elected, he will have to show that he will take care of the safety and health of American people, things that are much more important in such a crisis, as people claw back down to the lower levels of the pyramid of Maslow.


Except from all I have seen, Trump care more about market not crashing more than anything.

All his reassurance are empty talks - anyone can come out and say everything is fine, but actions speak louder than words.

See Singapore - the govt there not only try to calm its populace, they took direct actions, and never backed away from them. Singapore now has the outbreak more or less in control. And yes, Singapore closed off border to anyone from mainland before basically everyone else (only behind North Korea).

For a govt that is all talk, look at Japan. Look at Hong Kong. Tell me how great things are in both places?


Japan is getting even more messy. Last night PM Abe issued a request to all public schools and daycares to close from Saturday through April 1st. This sent ministers and school administrators into turmoil as they had not been consulted. This morning Japan time the opposition party pounced, saying the childless PM had given no consideration to double-income and single-parent households.

The welfare ministry was forced to issue a partial retraction begging daycares to stay open.

https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/news/20200228_03/
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Dieuwer
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2017 6:27 pm

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 2:57 am

Aaron747 wrote:
zakuivcustom wrote:
Waterbomber2 wrote:

Leaders in Europe and Asia haven't made the tough decision of closing borders and now there are unstoppable amounts of clusters.

Italy did force the flights to/from China shut but other EU countries did not, so anyone from China could still reach Italy with a connection in another EU country and this is what happened supposedly.

Trump made the tough call of rejecting anyone coming from China, which was a bold move. Without this move, the US may have had thousands of infections by now, considering the huge interface it had with China before the travel restrictions.
You can't avoid that infections will pop up right and left, as I said previously in this thread, thousands of people travelled to the US from China to visit friends and relatives during the Chinese new year, before the travel restrictions took effect and it was unbelievable, even suspicious, that no infections had been reported so far.
A few clusters here and there are very manageable and buy the US crucial time.
Trump has to be an actor sometimes, and that's what he did when he said from India that he's not worried. The reason he can do that is because he's working hard behind the scenes, he just wanted to reassure people.
I don't have a problem with a government working hard behind the scenes while putting up a brave face in front of the camera's. The US is mobilising people, preparing protocols and money.
I do have a problem with governments in the EU and Japan asking not to panic while doing no kind of preparation or taking no measures to slow down the spread (albeit Japan is now snapping out of it and starting to take bold measures, thank god).

Also, the US government will obviously take care of medical bills associated with the virus as it's a health emergency, this has nothing to do with the broader health care debate in the US.

Trump's only mistake is worrying too much about a stock market crash affecting his re-election. This crisis is an external factor that would crash the stock market under any president.
If he wants to be re-elected, he will have to show that he will take care of the safety and health of American people, things that are much more important in such a crisis, as people claw back down to the lower levels of the pyramid of Maslow.


Except from all I have seen, Trump care more about market not crashing more than anything.

All his reassurance are empty talks - anyone can come out and say everything is fine, but actions speak louder than words.

See Singapore - the govt there not only try to calm its populace, they took direct actions, and never backed away from them. Singapore now has the outbreak more or less in control. And yes, Singapore closed off border to anyone from mainland before basically everyone else (only behind North Korea).

For a govt that is all talk, look at Japan. Look at Hong Kong. Tell me how great things are in both places?


Japan is getting even more messy. Last night PM Abe issued a request to all public schools and daycares to close from Saturday through April 1st. This sent ministers and school administrators into turmoil as they had not been consulted. This morning Japan time the opposition party pounced, saying the childless PM had given no consideration to double-income and single-parent households.

The welfare ministry was forced to issue a partial retraction begging daycares to stay open.

https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/news/20200228_03/


Just think back to the Fukushima Nuclear Disaster. Same Dear-in-the-Headlights response, same incompetence.
 
Waterbomber2
Posts: 1363
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 3:07 am

Tokyo Disneyland parks will be closed until March 15th.

https://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/html/202002 ... 61000.html

Japan is finally starting to take necessary measures, ie safety over short-term financials.

The Nikkei225 dropped a whopping 4.6%.
 
Waterbomber2
Posts: 1363
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 3:19 am

France had 20 new cases yesterday, more than doubling the cases overnight, fears for an outbreak similar to Italy.
3 cases in the military base of Creil, several clusters linked to Northern Italy, hundreds under observation in home-quarantine.

https://www.lemonde.fr/societe/article/ ... _3224.html
 
zakuivcustom
Posts: 3568
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2017 3:32 am

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 3:57 am

Waterbomber2 wrote:
Tokyo Disneyland parks will be closed until March 15th.

https://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/html/202002 ... 61000.html

Japan is finally starting to take necessary measures, ie safety over short-term financials.

The Nikkei225 dropped a whopping 4.6%.


Seems like USJ remain open for now. I can see them following the lead of Tokyo Disney Resort, though.

On a side note in Japan...
https://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=2020 ... 7-mai-soci

Guess HKers are not the only one that made a run on toilet papers :white:
 
NYCVIE
Posts: 327
Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2016 11:01 pm

Re: Novel Coronavirus outbreak

Fri Feb 28, 2020 4:02 am

Waterbomber2 wrote:
I don't have a problem with a government working hard behind the scenes while putting up a brave face in front of the camera's. The US is mobilising people, preparing protocols and money.


Lmao. This isn't a covert military operation, there's no reason for the government to not be transparent about how "hard" they are working if they really. Particularly because Trump's show yesterday talking about "just wash your hands" and his appointment of Pence to head the crisis probably creates more fear. All we hear from Trump is his usual roundabout banter of "We'll spend whatever's appropriate. But hopefully we won't have to spend it because we've already done a great job."

Waterbomber2 wrote:
The US will close borders very soon, they have said they are considering it.

Trump's only mistake is worrying too much about a stock market crash affecting his re-election. This crisis is an external factor that would crash the stock market under any president.
If he wants to be re-elected, he will have to show that he will take care of the safety and health of American people, things that are much more important in such a crisis, as people claw back down to the lower levels of the pyramid of Maslow.


Trump knows that if this really hits the fan and the economy tanks that he'll be finished so of course he will worry about it heavily. I would bet that his administration (as we all should) are praying that warmer weather significantly slows down the spread of the virus.

Waterbomber2 wrote:
Also, the US government will obviously take care of medical bills associated with the virus as it's a health emergency, this has nothing to do with the broader health care debate in the US.


Where did you hear this from?

Waterbomber2 wrote:
Japan is finally starting to take necessary measures, ie safety over short-term financials.

IMO Japan is in crisis mode now that the IOC has stated that if this isn't contained by May they will outright cancel (not postpone or reschedule) the Olympics. That would be more than $20 billion down the drain and a massive international embarrassment and I can't even think of the repercussions of that for Abe's government, so don't be surprised to see more things like this over the next couple of weeks.

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