AirWorthy99 wrote:

I see, I debunked your claim that Germany tests more than the US, and now you need to mock other parts of my responses. You have a very thorough comprehension of math, if you keep claiming your points without really looking at data.

You really need to stop treating body counts and testing numbers as some kind of twisted dick-measuring contest to prove whose system is better once and for all. Viruses are non-ideological.

edit: note that you're not the only one guilty of this, but whatever ax you're grinding has just been sharper in the last few minutes. Sorry about that

Newark727 wrote:

AirWorthy99 wrote:

I see, I debunked your claim that Germany tests more than the US, and now you need to mock other parts of my responses. You have a very thorough comprehension of math, if you keep claiming your points without really looking at data.

You really need to stop treating body counts and testing numbers as some kind of twisted dick-measuring contest to prove whose system is better once and for all. Viruses are non-ideological.

I haven't, if you instead of fixing your eyes on me you would have seen who really is behind this ideological battle. I have tried to avoid politics into this discussion but the European friends are just happy to oblige.

Calling all wonks, nerds, or data hungry readers: Washington State has revamped its epidemiology reporting. It is fairly complex, and they are expecting this to be more accurate and assist various hospital and other health providers to better prepare for the next several weeks.
https://www.doh.wa.gov/emergencies/coronavirus

dtw2hyd wrote:

FYI

City of Detroit has a heatmap showing hotspots within the city
https://detroitmi.gov/departments/detro ... zContainer

MI-Oakland County has a dashboard. They are supposed to report by the ZIP Code starting today.
https://www.oakgov.com/covid/dashboard.html

COVID19 seems to spare poor rural counties so far. Urban poor are hit the hardest, Urban rich and suburbia is not spared either.

Yes, viruses love dense population. I fear what may happen in India.

AirWorthy99 wrote:

I see, I debunked your claim that Germany tests more than the US, and now you need to mock other parts of my responses. You have a very thorough comprehension of math, if you keep claiming your points without really looking at data.

???
You didn't even respond to the info I sent you. Let alone debunk anything ...
Germany does test more, that's a simple fact. (remember: 500000 tests/week ?)

PPVRA wrote:

Aesma wrote:

PPVRA wrote:

What’s on the far end of the flatter curve? It’s not contagion containment, it’s herd immunity. Cases should continue to climb until herd immunity is achieved. That’s my understanding of it, anyways.

I'd say the vaccine is at the far end, because with a flat curve it would take years to reach herd immunity.

Zika reached herd immunity in about two years. For Zika, herd immunity was at about 65% of the population before new case reports dropped sharply. And it was a much less efficient transmission than direct person to person.

For a highly contagious virus, MY UNDERSTANDING is that herd immunity is going to be a higher number than 65%. But the transmission is also much faster.

There must also be a number, below herd immunity, that would keep the infection curve below health system capacity on its own, without any artificial social distancing measures. But maybe not with a fast spreading virus? Not sure...

Aaron747 wrote:

AirWorthy99 wrote:

sebolino wrote:

Now you're showing your true nature. I like that !
Speaking with the hard-core US right is always funny.

Sure, the impeachment explains everything, and as we don't have this in Europe, we have time to solve all problems.
I really love your very thorough comprehension of politics.

I see, I debunked your claim that Germany tests more than the US, and now you need to mock other parts of my responses. You have a very thorough comprehension of math, if you keep claiming your points without really looking at data.

For crying out loud, at least get the information right. Germany is currently at 2.1x the rate of the US per capita.



https://twitter.com/drericding/status/1 ... 77504?s=21

What I said was the US was doing more tests than any country in the world. Which is a fact. Now you have to make up some metric to prove his point. Fine. Can't dispute the fact that the US is testing more than any other nation and now you got me here.

Love it how you folks like to play GOTCHA but on your terms and on your own devised metrics.

sebolino wrote:

AirWorthy99 wrote:

I see, I debunked your claim that Germany tests more than the US, and now you need to mock other parts of my responses. You have a very thorough comprehension of math, if you keep claiming your points without really looking at data.

???
You didn't even respond to the info I sent you. Let alone debunk anything ...
Germany does test more, that's a simple fact. (remember: 500000 tests/week ?)

You did not post a fact, but rather an estimation by a German scientist. Nonetheless I posted facts that the US has done 550,000 test in the last week. That goes against your claim.

PPVRA wrote:

Zika reached herd immunity in about two years. For Zika, herd immunity was at about 65% of the population before new case reports dropped sharply. And it was a much less efficient transmission than direct person to person.

For a highly contagious virus, MY UNDERSTANDING is that herd immunity is going to be a higher number than 65%. But the transmission is also much faster.

Do you have a source with respect to Zika?

AirWorthy99 wrote:

sebolino wrote:

AirWorthy99 wrote:

I see, I debunked your claim that Germany tests more than the US, and now you need to mock other parts of my responses. You have a very thorough comprehension of math, if you keep claiming your points without really looking at data.

???
You didn't even respond to the info I sent you. Let alone debunk anything ...
Germany does test more, that's a simple fact. (remember: 500000 tests/week ?)

You did not post a fact, but rather an estimation by a German scientist. Nonetheless I posted facts that the US has done 550,000 test in the last week. That goes against your claim.

Guys, your back and forth bickering is not helpful to anyone. It's not providing any useful info.

That goes for both of you.

We're all doing what we can. I know it's annoying getting attacked every single post you make. But a simple solution is to put each other on a "foe" list. Problem solved.

olle wrote:

Ny times writes a story that the number of cremations in wuhan has been much higher late 2019...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tqQzQSKiEg (in French)

@ 9:40 listen to this Swiss doctor cite October as the "zero" point of the outbreak.

JetBuddy wrote:

Guys, your back and forth bickering is not helpful to anyone. It's not providing any useful info.

That goes for both of you.

We're all doing what we can. I know it's annoying getting attacked every single post you make. But a simple solution is to put each other on a "foe" list. Problem solved.

You're totally right, sorry for that.
I get mad with this type of arguments ...

sebolino wrote:

dtw2hyd wrote:

FYI

City of Detroit has a heatmap showing hotspots within the city
https://detroitmi.gov/departments/detro ... zContainer

MI-Oakland County has a dashboard. They are supposed to report by the ZIP Code starting today.
https://www.oakgov.com/covid/dashboard.html

COVID19 seems to spare poor rural counties so far. Urban poor are hit the hardest, Urban rich and suburbia is not spared either.

Yes, viruses love dense population. I fear what may happen in India.

India is massively overpopulated, losing a few thousand isn’t going to make any difference at all. It would probably take the deaths of millions to make much of an impact.

Another thread appears to have been deleted so I'm posting this here as the only thread for it. And the apology but blameless "It's not MY fault" tour continues on main stream media in the USA:
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/federa ... wo-decades

Tugg

In Finland a private health care consortium is buying test capacity in South-Korea, they say that's the most efficent way at the moment. Finnair just opened a cargo route (A359) HEL-ICN, they probably carry the test samples.

Tugger wrote:

Another thread appears to have been deleted so I'm posting this here as the only thread for it. And the apology but blameless "It's not MY fault" tour continues on main stream media in the USA:
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/federa ... wo-decades

Tugg

No surprise, as with many catastrophes, failures large and small riddle the path of unpreparedness. Hundreds of think-tanks' analysis, academic research, and intra-government analysis reports sit collecting dust on shelves highlighting major problems (also containing meaningful solutions) on just about every major/minor issue potentially facing the US. Political gridlock overwhelms and continues decade by decade, culminating in the ever so often emergency that bring all these "oversights" to light.

On a note regarding the Newport acquisition referenced in the article (sources from the NYT piece). The original contract was awarded based on this company's ability to provide this new vent at 70% less than market price. Color me not-shocked that the government eventually had to cancel the contract, basically from what it sounds like an unattainable proposal.

Kiwirob wrote:

sebolino wrote:

dtw2hyd wrote:

FYI

City of Detroit has a heatmap showing hotspots within the city
https://detroitmi.gov/departments/detro ... zContainer

MI-Oakland County has a dashboard. They are supposed to report by the ZIP Code starting today.
https://www.oakgov.com/covid/dashboard.html

COVID19 seems to spare poor rural counties so far. Urban poor are hit the hardest, Urban rich and suburbia is not spared either.

Yes, viruses love dense population. I fear what may happen in India.

India is massively overpopulated, losing a few thousand isn’t going to make any difference at all. It would probably take the deaths of millions to make much of an impact.

I honestly don't know what to answer to that. I'm speechless ...

Tugger wrote:

Another thread appears to have been deleted so I'm posting this here as the only thread for it. And the apology but blameless "It's not MY fault" tour continues on main stream media in the USA:
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/federa ... wo-decades

Tugg

Well, somebody here said that the US were well prepared and did a good job. It's then probably true ...

Olympics Games off, Japan Cases Spike. Or how suppressing the real number of Coronavirus cases in Japan backfired spectacularly.

With the Olympics now off, many are voicing suspicion that the numbers are rising because Japan suddenly has no reason to hide them.

https://www.boston.com/news/health/2020 ... -questions

Dieuwer wrote:

Olympics Games off, Japan Cases Spike. Or how suppressing the real number of Coronavirus cases in Japan backfired spectacularly.

With the Olympics now off, many are voicing suspicion that the numbers are rising because Japan suddenly has no reason to hide them.

https://www.boston.com/news/health/2020 ... -questions

Seems like our friend Waterbomber2 was right about Japan.

I'm not surprised.

It's interesting how former Prime Minister Yukio Hatoyama is blaming the Tokyo governor though. I say there's no chance the Japanese government didn't know about the supression of real case numbers.

JetBuddy wrote:

Dieuwer wrote:

Olympics Games off, Japan Cases Spike. Or how suppressing the real number of Coronavirus cases in Japan backfired spectacularly.

With the Olympics now off, many are voicing suspicion that the numbers are rising because Japan suddenly has no reason to hide them.

https://www.boston.com/news/health/2020 ... -questions

Seems like our friend Waterbomber2 was right about Japan.

I'm not surprised.

It's interesting how former Prime Minister Yukio Hatoyama is blaming the Tokyo governor though. I say there's no chance the Japanese government didn't know about the supression of real case numbers.

The numbers will rise in any place. Whether Japan is holding back or or not will be seen in the full data over the next few weeks.

The question is now is how is social distancing helping. There are some promising signals in the numbers in Europe. Hopefully the US starts to show the same trend.

SQ22 wrote:

PPVRA wrote:

Zika reached herd immunity in about two years. For Zika, herd immunity was at about 65% of the population before new case reports dropped sharply. And it was a much less efficient transmission than direct person to person.

For a highly contagious virus, MY UNDERSTANDING is that herd immunity is going to be a higher number than 65%. But the transmission is also much faster.

Do you have a source with respect to Zika?

Multiple sources can be found online. Here’s one:


Gone or forgotten? The rise and fall of Zika virus

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanp ... 68-2667(18)30029-X/fulltext

Edit: the page above won’t work anymore for me. See another source below.

“Pooling all individuals sampled, seroprevalance was estimated to be approximately 63%, with similar prevalence rates in all age and gender cohorts studied. This level of herd immunity basically quenched the outbreak in Salvador.”

http://www.centerforhealthsecurity.org/ ... 72017.html

casinterest wrote:

JetBuddy wrote:

Dieuwer wrote:

Olympics Games off, Japan Cases Spike. Or how suppressing the real number of Coronavirus cases in Japan backfired spectacularly.



https://www.boston.com/news/health/2020 ... -questions

Seems like our friend Waterbomber2 was right about Japan.

I'm not surprised.

It's interesting how former Prime Minister Yukio Hatoyama is blaming the Tokyo governor though. I say there's no chance the Japanese government didn't know about the supression of real case numbers.

The numbers will rise in any place. Whether Japan is holding back or or not will be seen in the full data over the next few weeks.

The question is now is how is social distancing helping. There are some promising signals in the numbers in Europe. Hopefully the US starts to show the same trend.

The coverup that I have suspected is happening in Japan is indeed outrageous, perhaps even criminal.
Japan's low testing numbers per capita are shameful.
I think that there is a basis for a case at the International Court of Justice.

In waves, there are observable reductions.
However, Japan has not taken massive measures to reduce the rate of infections, they have only stopped public gatherings and closed schools.
Perhaps their strategy is the herd immunity one. Perhaps they're willing to sacrifice a huge portion of elderlies in their aging population.

In any case, if I were Pres. Trump, I would quietly distance myself from PM Abe.
His administration is going to come under such intense fire that will make hell look like paradise.



In the meanwhile, the Japanese Doctor's Association has asked the government to declare the state of emergency, as the situation is bad enough already.

https://www.news24.jp/articles/2020/03/30/07617631.html

Tokyo governor Koike has asked people to stay home also during weekdays, extending her request to stay home during weekends.$

https://www.news24.jp/articles/2020/03/30/07617597.html


Too little, too late.
A real tragedy is looming in Japan, its population of 125 millions will be hit far worse than the U.S. or Europe, probably resulting in millions of casualties.
There is no doubt that it will also be difficult to know the true extent of the tragedy as the Japanese government is deadset on covering it up.
What the Japanese government is doing is probably worse than what the Chinese government did.
The people of Japan are good people, they don't deserve this.

Austria has been on (forced) social distancing for two weeks now and the percentage of new infections has dropped from 35% to 9% - so yes, definitely working, just not enough to take out the champaign. We will start random tests tomorrow on select people from all ages, genders, and so on, with no symptoms, to see how widespread it actually really is or to at least get an idea. Stay safe everyone.

Aaron747 wrote:

AirWorthy99 wrote:

Aaron747 wrote:

For crying out loud, at least get the information right. Germany is currently at 2.1x the rate of the US per capita.



https://twitter.com/drericding/status/1 ... 77504?s=21

What I said was the US was doing more tests than any country in the world. Which is a fact. Now you have to make up some metric to prove his point. Fine. Can't dispute the fact that the US is testing more than any other nation and now you got me here.

Love it how you folks like to play GOTCHA but on your terms and on your own devised metrics.

Nobody ‘made up’ a metric - in statistics, per capita is the only applicable metric between populations of different sizes. And there is no ‘gotcha game’ either - math and science don’t care about partisan stripes.

We were not debating on 'per capita' the poster said that it was Germany testing the most in the world, I said the US is testing more than anyone else. Which is a fact, we weren't debating per capita, Iceland what do they have to do in this present crisis?. Absolutely nothing, population of a small to medium city in the US.

But I understand you also have an axe to grind.

It appears China's is still trying to cover up their disaster here:

Just two weeks ago the head of Emergency at Wuhan Central hospital went public, saying authorities had stopped her and her colleagues from warning the world. She has now disappeared, her whereabouts unknown

https://twitter.com/60Mins/status/1244211674439016449

In all seriousness China needs to be held accountable on this.

AirWorthy99 wrote:

It appears China's is still trying to cover up their disaster here:

Just two weeks ago the head of Emergency at Wuhan Central hospital went public, saying authorities had stopped her and her colleagues from warning the world. She has now disappeared, her whereabouts unknown

https://twitter.com/60Mins/status/1244211674439016449

In all seriousness China needs to be held accountable on this.

I bet she took off herself, knowing well what would happen if she stayed put and allowed the Chinese government to get to her

Aaron747 wrote:

AirWorthy99 wrote:

It appears China's is still trying to cover up their disaster here:

Just two weeks ago the head of Emergency at Wuhan Central hospital went public, saying authorities had stopped her and her colleagues from warning the world. She has now disappeared, her whereabouts unknown

https://twitter.com/60Mins/status/1244211674439016449

In all seriousness China needs to be held accountable on this.

There have been other threads on that - both closed. Yes the PRC ‘needs to be’ held to account but the real question is ‘can they be’? And the likely answer is ‘no’ as they are ostensibly ‘too big to fail’.

Maybe they should pay for our stimulus. Just sayin.

Aaron747 wrote:

AirWorthy99 wrote:

Aaron747 wrote:

Nobody ‘made up’ a metric - in statistics, per capita is the only applicable metric between populations of different sizes. And there is no ‘gotcha game’ either - math and science don’t care about partisan stripes.

We were not debating on 'per capita' the poster said that it was Germany testing the most in the world, I said the US is testing more than anyone else. Which is a fact, we weren't debating per capita, Iceland what do they have to do in this present crisis?. Absolutely nothing, population of a small to medium city in the US.

But I understand you also have an axe to grind.

Per capita is the only way to compare how much is done when sizes of samples are different - period. No axe to grind - always going to stand up to scientific inaccuracy and misinformation. We are in the age where more data and knowledge exist than any point in human history - no excuse to play games with math or science.

Really? these past days the media has been celebrating the US being the most with infections int he world. Go here and look how many per capita or per million cases the US has

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

You will find Liechtenstein with 1,626 cases per million inhabitants, Gibraltar with 2,048 cases per million.

At this point even per capita bases is an unreliable metric. You tried to cherry pick a metric that proves the other poster's point but you fail to see that I can produce many metrics to show how bad other countries have it compared to the US. So no point in arguing based on made up metrics just to prove I am wrong.

Aaron747 wrote:

AirWorthy99 wrote:

It appears China's is still trying to cover up their disaster here:

Just two weeks ago the head of Emergency at Wuhan Central hospital went public, saying authorities had stopped her and her colleagues from warning the world. She has now disappeared, her whereabouts unknown

https://twitter.com/60Mins/status/1244211674439016449

In all seriousness China needs to be held accountable on this.

There have been other threads on that - both closed. Yes the PRC ‘needs to be’ held to account but the real question is ‘can they be’? And the likely answer is ‘no’ as they are ostensibly ‘too big to fail’.

Europe has bridged a great deal of cooperation with China, the most recent before all of this was Huawei, the US warned Europe and other countries not to trust them, and they went ahead anyways. I hope they can reconsider who could they trust with businesses. The politburo is fierce-less they are criminals and despots. I wouldn't trust them with absolutely nothing.

In any case its not only Europe, but here in the US there is just too much involvement of China in our businesses and even on our entertainment and sports. I hope we can start cancelling out China soon. That would be a start.

It is interesting...and sad...to see, how many here have just a dangerous half- knowledge. And these are not even aware of it...

AirWorthy99 wrote:

Again trying to prove your argument with data that its unreliable by consensus of most of the experts.

Yeah I really hate it when people who use data to prove their point.

AirWorthy99 wrote:

Again, you might not be from the US, but here we mostly don't live with parents or old people, we can avoid them in order not to pass them this virus.

No different from here.

AirWorthy99 wrote:

No absolute need to keep home people who otherwise won't be affected by this virus and aren't going to die from it.

Well yes because, as had been pointed out infinitum here, that will dramatically spread the virus amongst the general population and that will put older people at greater risk. They'll be much more likely to get it at the supermarket, bank, petrol station etc if the virus has widely spread among the general population. And of course that's ignoring the fact that the virus affects people who aren't old too.

Why are you so enthusiastic for everyone to get infected anyway? Care to volunteer yourself?

AirWorthy99 wrote:

It is your belief we should afford a year waiting for a vaccine, that's for you to keep believing and arguing.

Where did I say that?

par13del wrote:

Grizzly410 wrote:

olle wrote:

Number of death in USA went today over 2000 with 1000 the last 24 hours. Of this over 900 is NY state. NY very fast getting on the same level as Spain and Italy.

I don't give more than 1 week for the US death toll to become as credible as the chinese.

So the media that has been ensuring that when POTUS spits we know about it will somehow join in a conspiracy with the White House to give out false numbers, or are you saying the Chinese numbers are accurate and the US will follow suit?
Just checking.

You trust Donald with the truth? You do you, but that's not a hill I'd want to die on.

JetBuddy wrote:

21 million phone subscriptions were cancelled in China from January and until today. Why?

And how reliable is your source on that?

tommy1808 wrote:

South Kora also did more tests that the US, about 3 times more per capita. Iceland beats you by a factor of ten.

Far more than any other country.. hahaha

But.....but....Donnie said it so it must be true!

AirWorthy99 wrote:

Here in the US our politicians were worried about fighting among themselves over a failed impeachment attempt. When they could have been focused on this. In Europe they did not have impeachment, but yes you Europeans are so obsessed about the US that probably you were also glued into the stupid spectacle that was going on in the US and got caught with your pants down, now tens of thousands are dead in Europe.

So now you're blaming the high death toll in Europe on Europeans watching the president be impeached? A new highlight for a.net - just about up there with snowglobes and that dude writing to his senator to stop delta ordering Airbus.

When you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done”

February 26, 2020

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-st ... onference/

Truly a president who is one of the greatest thinkers of our time.

AirWorthy99 wrote:

Most importantly the 'unity' of the EU bloc in these times which they really need each other.

Yeah that's working out great for those not part of the block...(and yes I am aware that's UK posturing).

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/p ... 30571.html

stl07 wrote:

I bet she took off herself, knowing well what would happen if she stayed put and allowed the Chinese government to get to her

You don't just "take off" in China. It happens to be the most heavily-surveilled country in the world. Not to mention the biometric controls they have on all citizens and the government's unlimited access to cellphone and internet data.

zkojq wrote:

When you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done”

February 26, 2020

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-st ... onference/

Truly a president who is one of the greatest thinkers of our time.

In case some dim witted come across your post one might add that February 26th was week after Impeachment, when Trump was too busy purging perceived enemies (=smart/patriotic/dedicated people) from the US government.

How many people did Trump shoot on time square now? One wasn't enoug for Donald Hannibal Trump apparently..

Best regards
Thomas

I'm tired of people freaking out about produce. If you wash your produce then you will be fine. Yeah no one should be going around pulling pranks or spitting on stuff. But if you think your produce is already sanitized on the shelf then you are wrong. It comes into contact with a lot of people and a lot of dirt and germs on the path from field to store. You should already know to thoroughly wash it before consuming. There is no need for anyone to throw it out. You are just as ignorant as the idiots who go around making trouble if you throw it away.

TTailedTiger wrote:

Yeah no one should be going around pulling pranks or spitting on stuff. .

the FBI seems to disagree with your assessment: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 17296.html

If you wash your produce then you will be fine.

that however is true....

best regards
Thomas

tommy1808 wrote:

TTailedTiger wrote:

Yeah no one should be going around pulling pranks or spitting on stuff. .

the FBI seems to disagree with your assessment: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 17296.html

If you wash your produce then you will be fine.

that however is true....

best regards
Thomas

How is that disagreeing with me? I said no one should be going around doing it.

TTailedTiger wrote:

tommy1808 wrote:

TTailedTiger wrote:

Yeah no one should be going around pulling pranks or spitting on stuff. .

the FBI seems to disagree with your assessment: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 17296.html

If you wash your produce then you will be fine.

that however is true....

best regards
Thomas

How is that disagreeing with me? I said no one should be going around doing it.

sorry, my before coffee brain read "no on is going around"...

best regards
Thomas

sebolino wrote:

Kiwirob wrote:

sebolino wrote:

Yes, viruses love dense population. I fear what may happen in India.

India is massively overpopulated, losing a few thousand isn’t going to make any difference at all. It would probably take the deaths of millions to make much of an impact.

I honestly don't know what to answer to that. I'm speechless ...

It's not difficult to understand, India has a massive population.

The governor of Virginia has issued a lockdown order that lasts until Jine 10! Who does he think he is? The Republican primary is June 9 so I have no doubt that he did that on purpose. I think he will have to be forcefremkved from office. And hopefully taken to Leavenworth.


https://www.nationalreview.com/news/vir ... l-june-10/

TTailedTiger wrote:

The governor of Virginia has issued a lockdown order that lasts until Jine 10! Who does he think he is?

"not a genocidal member of a death cult" is what he thinks he is. Not the first primary to be postpones.

best regards
Thomas