sonicruiser
Topic Author
Posts: 893
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:18 am

Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Tue Feb 18, 2020 7:42 pm

Full translation:

" When Aleppo city was liberated at the end of 2016, I said that what was before the liberation of Aleppo city will not be the same as what will be after that, and I based that on my knowledge of where the members of our Armed Forces are aiming with their hearts and minds. I based that on my conviction that the patriotism of the people of Aleppo and their fealty to their homeland and the homeland’s army will overturn the calculations of the enemies.
“This is what happened, but Aleppo had to pay a great price equal to the greatness of its people and the patriotism of its position; years of violent and barbaric shelling that affected most neighborhoods, tens of thousands of martyrs, injured people, orphans, people who lost children, and widows. Years of siege without water or electricity or other life necessities, all for Aleppo to kneel and for her people to surrender.
“With every treacherous shell that had fallen, the enemies’ hopes would grow that Aleppo would become another Aleppo, one that never existed throughout history, an Aleppo that does not constitute with its twin Damascus the wings by which the homeland soars; rather an Aleppo whose people would stand with traitors in front of masters, kneeling and prostrating themselves before them, beginning for a few dollars and much disgrace.
“That was in their dreams; but in our real world, with every shell that fell, fear fell and the will to challenge grew. With every martyr, nationalist spirit grew and faith in the homeland became stronger. In our real world, it remained the real Aleppo, the Aleppo of history, nobility, and authenticity. And because it is so, its people did not settle for steadfastness just in the sense of bearing of pain and suffering and acceptance of the status quo; but rather in the sense of work and production that persisted throughout the years of the siege despite the conditions that contradict any economic sense.
“Despite that, this city kept contributing – even if at a bare minimum – to national economy, and I am confident that this type of steadfastness which reflects a concrete will and a deep-rooted sense of belonging is what will raise Aleppo from the ashes of war and restore its natural and leading position in Syria’s economy,” President al-Assad said.
President al-Assad added “It is true that liberating the city in 2016 did not achieve the desired safety for the city at the time, and it remained under the threat of treacherous and cowardly shells, and it is also true today that victory in one battle does not mean victory in the war, but that is by the abstract military logic which is based on endings and results; however, by national logic, victory begins with the beginning of steadfastness even if it was at day one, and by that logic, Aleppo is victorious, and Syria is victorious. We are all victorious over the fear they had tried to instill in our hearts, victorious over the delusions they tried to instill in our minds, victorious over fragmentation, hatred, betrayal, and all those who represent or bear or practice these qualities.
“However, we are fully aware that this liberation does not mean the end of the war, or the failure of schemes, or the disappearance of terrorism, or the surrender of enemies, but it certainly means rubbing their noses in the dirt as a prelude for complete defeat, sooner or later,” the President affirmed.
“It also means that we must not relax; rather we must prepare for the coming battles. Therefore, the battle to liberate the countryside of Aleppo and Idleb will continue regardless of some empty sound bubbles coming from the north, and the battle for liberating all Syrian soil, crushing terrorism, and achieving stability will also continue.”
His Excellency went on to say “Our Syrian Arab Army will never hesitate to carry out its national duties, and it will be as it always has been: an army from the people and for the people. Throughout history, no army has emerged victorious unless the people are united with it in its battle, and when it is united with the people in their vision and cause, and this is what we have witnessed in Aleppo and other Syrian cities, where you embraced the army it protected you, defended you, and made sacrifices for you.
“While we are experiencing times of joy, we must remember that these moments have been made possible by years of pain, heartache, and sadness, for the loss of a dear one that gave their life for the lives and happiness of others. As we bow in honor of the greatness of our martyrs and injured people, it is also our duty to stand in honor of the greatness of their mighty families. If victory is to be dedicated, then it is dedicated to them, and if anyone should receive credit for it, then they deserve the credit. I salute them for the children their raised, and salute their children for their sacrifices. I salute every one of the heroes of our great army and the allied forces begin them. I salute the strength of their bodies in the cold and frost as we bask in warmth and safety.”
President al-Assad went on to salute “our brothers, friends, and allies who stood shoulder to shoulder with the army on the ground and were guardian eagles in the sky, their blood intermingling with the blood of our army that was spilled in Aleppo, Aleppo the faithful to its homeland and history, which will never forget the blood of those who made sacrifices for it, and which will return as it was and stronger.
“Our beloved people in Aleppo, I congratulate you on the victory of your will, the will by which we will wage the greater battle: the battle to build Aleppo. By the will of all the Syrian people we will build Syria, and we will continue liberation, God willing,” His Excellency concluded.

TLDR: The battle is won but now it is time to rebuild Syria.

https://youtu.be/VgURrQhAe5Q
شما می توانید مردم را تحریم کنید ، اما نمی توانید سبک تحریم را اعمال کنید

You can sanction people, but you can't sanction style
 
User avatar
readytotaxi
Posts: 7075
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:09 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:16 pm

Get this person to the International Court of Justice, ASAP
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
Growing older, but not up.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Tue Feb 18, 2020 9:43 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
Get this person to the International Court of Justice, ASAP



:checkmark:
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Tue Feb 18, 2020 10:16 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
Get this person to the International Court of Justice, ASAP


What humanity needs the most is some sort of court for “democracy supporters” - thanks to whom this bloodshed has started in 2011. And I hope we live up to that moment.

And - congrats to Syrian leadership and Syrian people, hopefully they can rebuild their country and peaceful life.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 12:45 pm

anrec80 wrote:
readytotaxi wrote:
Get this person to the International Court of Justice, ASAP


What humanity needs the most is some sort of court for “democracy supporters” - thanks to whom this bloodshed has started in 2011. And I hope we live up to that moment.


Rewriting history again, are we? It was an uprise of the Syrians requesting a bit more freedom, the Assad regime decided to give a reply in bullets. So you agree that the Assad regime should answer for this and other crimes against humanity in the International Court of Justice. I didn't think you would feel this way, but hey, you learn something any day.

anrec80 wrote:
And - congrats to Syrian leadership and Syrian people, hopefully they can rebuild their country and peaceful life.


.........under the rule of the Assad regime, a harsh dictatorship willing to kill its citizen to keep in power. So I kind of understand you congratulating the Assad regime and especially the Putin regime with keeping its geopolitical presence there, but no, the Syrian people, they definitely not the winners here.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
tu204
Posts: 2117
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 12:36 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 3:46 pm

Dutchy wrote:
anrec80 wrote:
readytotaxi wrote:
Get this person to the International Court of Justice, ASAP


What humanity needs the most is some sort of court for “democracy supporters” - thanks to whom this bloodshed has started in 2011. And I hope we live up to that moment.


Rewriting history again, are we? It was an uprise of the Syrians requesting a bit more freedom, the Assad regime decided to give a reply in bullets. So you agree that the Assad regime should answer for this and other crimes against humanity in the International Court of Justice. I didn't think you would feel this way, but hey, you learn something any day
.


I'll support this.

Right after the leaders of the western regimes starting with Clinton stand trial for their crimes.
I do not dream about movie stars, they must dream about me for I am real and they are not. - Alexander Popov
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 4:44 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Rewriting history again, are we? It was an uprise of the Syrians requesting a bit more freedom, the Assad regime decided to give a reply in bullets. So you agree that the Assad regime should answer for this and other crimes against humanity in the International Court of Justice. I didn't think you would feel this way, but hey, you learn something any day.


There isn’t any history rewriting, there is manipulation with definitions. When someone picks up a stone or a Molotov cocktail to throw one at a police officer - this is when “freedom requests” end, and heavy crimes begin. I don’t know if there were bullets - it doesn’t matter really. Using force by a state is the only response when anyone (even a “freedom requester”) uses force as any argument. But for some reason people picking up Molotov cocktails are “freedom fighters”. Overall - very European. First, attach beautiful labels to criminals, and then let them create a mess, and at the end not know what to do with all that. This was the case everywhere - Ukraine, Syria, Libya. EU doesn’t have a clue what to do with any of those - all it’s good at is beautiful talk and labeling.

Dutchy wrote:
.........under the rule of the Assad regime, a harsh dictatorship willing to kill its citizen to keep in power. So I kind of understand you congratulating the Assad regime and especially the Putin regime with keeping its geopolitical presence there, but no, the Syrian people, they definitely not the winners here.


Regular ordinary Syrians don’t see it this way. Assad leadership is quite popular with them, obviously - especially given that Assad himself isn’t afraid to roam around a marketplace in Damascus without much security. Unlike most “democratic leaders”.
 
Redd
Posts: 1191
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 5:13 pm

Dutchy wrote:
.........under the rule of the Assad regime, a harsh dictatorship willing to kill its citizen to keep in power. So I kind of understand you congratulating the Assad regime and especially the Putin regime with keeping its geopolitical presence there, but no, the Syrian people, they definitely not the winners here.



Swallowing the propaganda hook line and sinker. Assad wasn't any worse than any western democratic leader, and Syria was quite prosperous. Then the West decided Syria needed some good ol' freedom and democracy. Just like Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan... Look at the state of those countries now. Look at Syria.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 5:33 pm

Redd wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
.........under the rule of the Assad regime, a harsh dictatorship willing to kill its citizen to keep in power. So I kind of understand you congratulating the Assad regime and especially the Putin regime with keeping its geopolitical presence there, but no, the Syrian people, they definitely not the winners here.


Swallowing the propaganda hook line and sinker. Assad wasn't any worse than any western democratic leader, and Syria was quite prosperous.


Realy? Human right watch report. So proof your statement:

According to Human Rights Watch, President Bashar al-Assad failed to improve Syria’s human rights record in the first 10 years of his rule,[4] and Syria's human rights situation remained among the worst in the world.[5] According to Amnesty International, the government may be guilty of crimes against humanity based on "witness accounts of deaths in custody[6] and extrajudicial executions,[7][8][9][10] torture,[11][12][13][14][15][16] rape,[17][18][19] and arbitrary detention and forced disappearances[20] during the crackdown against the 2011 uprising and during the Syrian Civil War.[21] The government has also conducted chemical attacks against its own civilians.[22][23][24][25]


wiki link

Which two western democratic leaders has the same record, not even taken up any because then I could name any leader and that is just too easy.


Redd wrote:
Then the West decided Syria needed some good ol' freedom and democracy. Just like Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan... Look at the state of those countries now. Look at Syria.
[/quote]

The Syrians upraised, not the west deciding anything, who exactly is swallowing the propaganda?
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 5:37 pm

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Rewriting history again, are we? It was an uprise of the Syrians requesting a bit more freedom, the Assad regime decided to give a reply in bullets. So you agree that the Assad regime should answer for this and other crimes against humanity in the International Court of Justice. I didn't think you would feel this way, but hey, you learn something any day.


There isn’t any history rewriting, there is manipulation with definitions. When someone picks up a stone or a Molotov cocktail to throw one at a police officer - this is when “freedom requests” end, and heavy crimes begin. I don’t know if there were bullets - it doesn’t matter really. Using force by a state is the only response when anyone (even a “freedom requester”) uses force as any argument. But for some reason people picking up Molotov cocktails are “freedom fighters”. Overall - very European. First, attach beautiful labels to criminals, and then let them create a mess, and at the end not know what to do with all that. This was the case everywhere - Ukraine, Syria, Libya. EU doesn’t have a clue what to do with any of those - all it’s good at is beautiful talk and labeling.


Like I said, rewriting history........

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
.........under the rule of the Assad regime, a harsh dictatorship willing to kill its citizen to keep in power. So I kind of understand you congratulating the Assad regime and especially the Putin regime with keeping its geopolitical presence there, but no, the Syrian people, they definitely not the winners here.


Regular ordinary Syrians don’t see it this way. Assad leadership is quite popular with them, obviously - especially given that Assad himself isn’t afraid to roam around a marketplace in Damascus without much security. Unlike most “democratic leaders”.


Really? And your source for this? Russia Today? Assad roaming a marketplace around isn't proof of anything.................. if anything it is proof of propaganda.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
Redd
Posts: 1191
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:22 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Realy? Human right watch report. So proof your statement:



Show me a Human Rights Watch report on Bill Clinton, GWB, Regan, Obama, etc, . Just because they had people in other nations killed doesn't count?
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 7:06 pm

Redd wrote:
Swallowing the propaganda hook line and sinker. Assad wasn't any worse than any western democratic leader, and Syria was quite prosperous. Then the West decided Syria needed some good ol' freedom and democracy. Just like Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan... Look at the state of those countries now. Look at Syria.


Redd, these Western “pro-democracy” people will not see anything, even if they look - just because they won’t want to see anything. First, they prefer to stuff the region with all sorts of human leftovers (a-la fighters, terrorists, criminals), call them “pro-democracy opposition”, support them with firearms or bomb the counties. And then, when their previous actions inevitably start creating problems, they are looking whom to blame - a “dictator regime”, Russia, Iran, China, Hezbollah or someone else. But they certainly will never see any problems with their own actions.
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 7:08 pm

Dutchy wrote:


Dude, good enough posting your “democratic” reports and rankings. Everyone knows by now their true worth.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 7:10 pm

Redd wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Realy? Human right watch report. So proof your statement:



Show me a Human Rights Watch report on Bill Clinton, GWB, Regan, Obama, etc, . Just because they had people in other nations killed doesn't count?


Would it matter what those reports say? Would it justify the action of the Assad regime to commit war crimes?
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 7:13 pm

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:


Dude, good enough posting your “democratic” reports and rankings. Everyone knows by now their true worth.


Indeed, everyone knows, they are unbiased and based on facts. Good of you to note that.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:01 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Would it matter what those reports say? Would it justify the action of the Assad regime to commit war crimes?


Typical European flipping. Yes, in one country law enforcement doing their job is “war crimes”, while bombings of other countries like Libya, “guarding oil resources” like in Syria - are totally fine things to be doing.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:05 pm

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Would it matter what those reports say? Would it justify the action of the Assad regime to commit war crimes?


Typical European flipping. Yes, in one country law enforcement doing their job is “war crimes”, while bombings of other countries like Libya, “guarding oil resources” like in Syria - are totally fine things to be doing.


We have Anrac 3 again, the attacking one......... including personal attacks.

And bombing hospitals and targeting civilians is a war crime everywhere. The Assad regime did it with the help of your Putin regime.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:25 pm

Dutchy wrote:
And bombing hospitals and targeting civilians is a war crime everywhere. The Assad regime did it with the help of your Putin regime.


In every country there is a domestic court system for this kind of scenarios. Western opinion isn’t required on this one.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:43 pm

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
And bombing hospitals and targeting civilians is a war crime everywhere. The Assad regime did it with the help of your Putin regime.


In every country there is a domestic court system for this kind of scenarios. Western opinion isn’t required on this one.


In Syria there is no independent court system, so that does not fly. Not western opinion, human rights is no western opinion, it is right every citizen of the world should have. The same for the international criminal court, is no western opinion, it is a court system of the world, the UN, for the most heinous crimes of all.

So why do you want those heinous crimes go unpunished?
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
mad99
Posts: 1217
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:33 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:44 pm

Nice to see Syria and Russia winning this. I hope turkey does the right thing and pulls out but I doubt it.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:59 am

mad99 wrote:
Nice to see Syria and Russia winning this. I hope turkey does the right thing and pulls out but I doubt it.


why?
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
mad99
Posts: 1217
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:33 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:15 am

Why Syria winning or why Turkey won’t do the right thing and pull out?

Syria winning. The USA and allies tried to install a new government by arming jihadist making life hell for Syrians and killing thousands. It looks like this is now over and millions will return.

Turkey has allowed thousands of jihadist to cross into Syria and continues to arm them but it looks like the writing is on the wall so why continue?
 
Redd
Posts: 1191
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:48 am

Dutchy wrote:
Redd wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Realy? Human right watch report. So proof your statement:



Show me a Human Rights Watch report on Bill Clinton, GWB, Regan, Obama, etc, . Just because they had people in other nations killed doesn't count?


Would it matter what those reports say? Would it justify the action of the Assad regime to commit war crimes?


It would matter, because you're showing outrage towards one politician while giving a pass to much worse ones. That is called hypocrisy.
Last edited by Redd on Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
Redd
Posts: 1191
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:54 am

anrec80 wrote:
Redd wrote:
Swallowing the propaganda hook line and sinker. Assad wasn't any worse than any western democratic leader, and Syria was quite prosperous. Then the West decided Syria needed some good ol' freedom and democracy. Just like Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan... Look at the state of those countries now. Look at Syria.


Redd, these Western “pro-democracy” people will not see anything, even if they look - just because they won’t want to see anything. First, they prefer to stuff the region with all sorts of human leftovers (a-la fighters, terrorists, criminals), call them “pro-democracy opposition”, support them with firearms or bomb the counties. And then, when their previous actions inevitably start creating problems, they are looking whom to blame - a “dictator regime”, Russia, Iran, China, Hezbollah or someone else. But they certainly will never see any problems with their own actions.


You're absolutely right. They're also unwilling to look at the bigger picture ( greater good, considering their socially leaning and cannot see that aspect, I'd also like to point out the irony of that) that all of these countries were better off before western intervention by ALL metrics, and that the culture of these countries is completely incompatible with a western style democracy.

If we're to use a metric of body count to measure a leader's ''tyrant factor'', Assad would come in somewhere near the bottom if compared to just about any western politician, not to mention other middle eastern leaders.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:06 am

mad99 wrote:
Syria winning. The USA and allies tried to install a new government by arming jihadist making life hell for Syrians and killing thousands. It looks like this is now over and millions will return.


Right, and what do you think of the human rights records of the Assad regime in the past 50 years?

I guess the narrative of anyone against the Assad regime is a jihadist in Syria, is sticking with some.....
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:13 am

Redd wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Redd wrote:

Show me a Human Rights Watch report on Bill Clinton, GWB, Regan, Obama, etc, . Just because they had people in other nations killed doesn't count?


Would it matter what those reports say? Would it justify the action of the Assad regime to commit war crimes?


It would matter, because you're showing outrage towards one politician while giving a pass to much worse ones. That is called hypocrisy.


Then show what is much worse. I do not see it. And if you prove it, please file a suit in American courts, the problem with Syria and Russia is that they do not have an independent court system and are no democracies, so that they will not hold accountable.

Your tactic resembles the old USSR tactic, we did this and they did that, so everybody does it, so nobody can call out anything, because it would be hypocrisy. Of course, that is complete bull.
I believe everyone who commits crimes against humanity should be held accountable, doesn't matter if it is an American, Dutchmen, Russian or Syrian, or any of the other 200-odd nationalities. Do you subscribe to that point of view, or do you feel, like Anrac80, that Putins regime and Assad regime can do in Syria whatever they like?
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:15 am

Redd wrote:
anrec80 wrote:
Redd wrote:
Swallowing the propaganda hook line and sinker. Assad wasn't any worse than any western democratic leader, and Syria was quite prosperous. Then the West decided Syria needed some good ol' freedom and democracy. Just like Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan... Look at the state of those countries now. Look at Syria.


Redd, these Western “pro-democracy” people will not see anything, even if they look - just because they won’t want to see anything. First, they prefer to stuff the region with all sorts of human leftovers (a-la fighters, terrorists, criminals), call them “pro-democracy opposition”, support them with firearms or bomb the counties. And then, when their previous actions inevitably start creating problems, they are looking whom to blame - a “dictator regime”, Russia, Iran, China, Hezbollah or someone else. But they certainly will never see any problems with their own actions.


You're absolutely right. They're also unwilling to look at the bigger picture ( greater good, considering their socially leaning and cannot see that aspect, I'd also like to point out the irony of that) that all of these countries were better off before western intervention by ALL metrics, and that the culture of these countries is completely incompatible with a western style democracy.

If we're to use a metric of body count to measure a leader's ''tyrant factor'', Assad would come in somewhere near the bottom if compared to just about any western politician, not to mention other middle eastern leaders.


What is the greater good I am missing with the Assad regime?
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Francoflier
Posts: 5111
Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2001 12:27 pm

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:33 am

Democracy would not have worked in Syria, just as it seems to not work in countries around the region.
Sadly, dictatorships are the only thing keeping the region stable. Maybe one day they'll get there.
There is no wonder that Russia, a big proponent and supporter of autocratic regimes, was very interested in expanding its influence in the region through this conflict. Let's not forget to give a honorable mention to Trump who was more than happy to hand them the keys to the country.

A great day for dictatorship and for all those who like to abandon their freedoms to all-powerful autocrats... yay. :sarcastic:
Last edited by Francoflier on Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
Redd
Posts: 1191
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:14 am

Dutchy wrote:
Redd wrote:
anrec80 wrote:

Redd, these Western “pro-democracy” people will not see anything, even if they look - just because they won’t want to see anything. First, they prefer to stuff the region with all sorts of human leftovers (a-la fighters, terrorists, criminals), call them “pro-democracy opposition”, support them with firearms or bomb the counties. And then, when their previous actions inevitably start creating problems, they are looking whom to blame - a “dictator regime”, Russia, Iran, China, Hezbollah or someone else. But they certainly will never see any problems with their own actions.


You're absolutely right. They're also unwilling to look at the bigger picture ( greater good, considering their socially leaning and cannot see that aspect, I'd also like to point out the irony of that) that all of these countries were better off before western intervention by ALL metrics, and that the culture of these countries is completely incompatible with a western style democracy.

If we're to use a metric of body count to measure a leader's ''tyrant factor'', Assad would come in somewhere near the bottom if compared to just about any western politician, not to mention other middle eastern leaders.


What is the greater good I am missing with the Assad regime?


No, you're missing the great over all picture. Were countries like Iraq and Libya, or more precisely their populations, better off with their previous dictators? By all metrics the answer seems to be yes. So in the interests of the greater good, it was not a good idea to try to bring western democracy, or try to, for the people of those nations. Nor was it better for the hundreds of thousands of dead innocent people.

Likewise, Syria was better off before the west armed terrorists and called them freedom fighters and let them loose on Assad.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:47 am

Redd wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
What is the greater good I am missing with the Assad regime?


No, you're missing the great over all picture. Were countries like Iraq and Libya, or more precisely their populations, better off with their previous dictators? By all metrics the answer seems to be yes. So in the interests of the greater good, it was not a good idea to try to bring western democracy, or try to, for the people of those nations. Nor was it better for the hundreds of thousands of dead innocent people.

Likewise, Syria was better off before the west armed terrorists and called them freedom fighters and let them loose on Assad.


In your framework, there are only two options: dictatorship or total chaos with jihadists. In my mind, this is a false dilemma. Dictatorship is not a stable form of government, in the end, only a small portion of the population benefits from this and the vast majority of people have their rights capped. Same with jihadists. The question is how to get to another form, without treating the population as little children - as you are doing by promoting a dictatorship.

BTW, don't rewrite history, setting Iraq aside, all those other instances it was the population which began the uprise, Arabic spring movement, not western intervention. What NATO did in Libya was bombing the forces of the dictator precisely because he was bombing civilian targets.

So, what is the overall picture: promoting dictatorship or even a bigger picture from a human perspective?
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
RJMAZ
Posts: 1840
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2016 2:54 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:27 pm

Redd wrote:
Swallowing the propaganda hook line and sinker. Assad wasn't any worse than any western democratic leader, and Syria was quite prosperous. Then the West decided Syria needed some good ol' freedom and democracy. Just like Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan... Look at the state of those countries now. Look at Syria.

This is extremely accurate.

Assad would easily win a legitimate election :duck:
 
Redd
Posts: 1191
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:07 pm

Dutchy wrote:

In your framework, there are only two options: dictatorship or total chaos with jihadists. In my mind, this is a false dilemma. Dictatorship is not a stable form of government, in the end, only a small portion of the population benefits from this and the vast majority of people have their rights capped. Same with jihadists. The question is how to get to another form, without treating the population as little children - as you are doing by promoting a dictatorship.

BTW, don't rewrite history, setting Iraq aside, all those other instances it was the population which began the uprise, Arabic spring movement, not western intervention. What NATO did in Libya was bombing the forces of the dictator precisely because he was bombing civilian targets.

So, what is the overall picture: promoting dictatorship or even a bigger picture from a human perspective?


#1 In my framework I care about the welfare of people. Playing with their form of government has yielded devastating results for them now, hasn't it?

#2 I can't even call you naive, there is a documentary you can find on YT with interviews with the CIA officers who planned Libya talking about how they had planned and executed the whole action, and the plot to put Khalifa Haftar, who is an American citizen and had spent 20 years in the USA, in power after toppling Gaddafi. Saying that it was a citizen led uprising isn't only amusing, but ignorant and complete denialism, considering the facts are all out there available to the public, straight from the horses mouth.

#3 Please explain how you came to the conclusion that I support dictatorships. I'd be very interested in learning how you came to that conclusion.
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:50 pm

Redd wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
So, what is the overall picture: promoting dictatorship or even a bigger picture from a human perspective?


#1 In my framework I care about the welfare of people. Playing with their form of government has yielded devastating results for them now, hasn't it?


Again, you see only two options: dictator or chaos, no 3rd way. I think that it quite dogmatic.

Redd wrote:
#2 I can't even call you naive, there is a documentary you can find on YT with interviews with the CIA officers who planned Libya talking about how they had planned and executed the whole action, and the plot to put Khalifa Haftar, who is an American citizen and had spent 20 years in the USA, in power after toppling Gaddafi. Saying that it was a citizen led uprising isn't only amusing, but ignorant and complete denialism, considering the facts are all out there available to the public, straight from the horses mouth.


Fine, you believe that kind of things. YT? What is that? In general, CIA officers aren't the type to blamp around their accomplishments.

Redd wrote:
#3 Please explain how you came to the conclusion that I support dictatorships. I'd be very interested in learning how you came to that conclusion.


Well, you seem to prefer it to any other solution. But please enlighten me on how I should see it differently.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:01 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Right, and what do you think of the human rights records of the Assad regime in the past 50 years?

I guess the narrative of anyone against the Assad regime is a jihadist in Syria, is sticking with some.....



Yes, the alternative to Assad would be ISIS with all its horrors and problems for the whole continent, and Europe primarily. Do we really need to discuss human rights record of Jihadi John?
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:12 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Again, you see only two options: dictator or chaos, no 3rd way. I think that it quite dogmatic.


Not only in Syria - in any of these cases (Ukraine, Libya, Iraq) there has never been any third way - either existing statehood (whether it’s likable on the West or not) or chaos with a civil war.

Dutchy wrote:
Well, you seem to prefer it to any other solution. But please enlighten me on how I should see it differently.



Because - see above - there simply have never been any other solutions at those particular timeframes. The nation itself must come up with those solutions at a time and in ways that work for them. Without any foreign meddling, “democracy support” and the likes. Anything else - it can be an illusion of a solution, but it’s not.

If there are solutions to anything - the only problems they solve is financial problems of some corrupt politicians, both inside the country and in “democratic” countries. And nearly always in “democracy support” you find some ugly corruption schemes that were behind all the mess. It’s true about all cases - Venezuela, Libya, Syria, Ukraine. There is no “democracy support” anywhere in the picture. Just plain low key corruption.
 
Redd
Posts: 1191
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:53 pm

Dutchy wrote:

Again, you see only two options: dictator or chaos, no 3rd way. I think that it quite dogmatic.


LOL... No that's not it....

Dutchy wrote:

Fine, you believe that kind of things. YT? What is that? In general, CIA officers aren't the type to blamp around their accomplishments.


Once again, LOL.... Believing or not, does not make it true or false Dutchy. The fact that the documentary is there, and those CIA officers (retired) said what they said is a fact. My belief really has no bearing on that.

Dutchy wrote:
Well, you seem to prefer it to any other solution. But please enlighten me on how I should see it differently.


You can see things how you like my friend. You either have a problem with English comprehension or are really trying to categorize me because our opinions differ. Either way you are wrong, and you can take that as gospel. There is no higher authority on what I think than me, myself and I, so take my word on that ;)
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:30 pm

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Right, and what do you think of the human rights records of the Assad regime in the past 50 years?

I guess the narrative of anyone against the Assad regime is a jihadist in Syria, is sticking with some.....



Yes, the alternative to Assad would be ISIS with all its horrors and problems for the whole continent, and Europe primarily. Do we really need to discuss human rights record of Jihadi John?


Complete and utter bull. There are many alternatives to the Assad regime with their Russian cronies. So false narative from you again.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:31 pm

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Again, you see only two options: dictator or chaos, no 3rd way. I think that it quite dogmatic.


Not only in Syria - in any of these cases (Ukraine, Libya, Iraq) there has never been any third way - either existing statehood (whether it’s likable on the West or not) or chaos with a civil war.

Dutchy wrote:
Well, you seem to prefer it to any other solution. But please enlighten me on how I should see it differently.



Because - see above - there simply have never been any other solutions at those particular timeframes. The nation itself must come up with those solutions at a time and in ways that work for them. Without any foreign meddling, “democracy support” and the likes. Anything else - it can be an illusion of a solution, but it’s not.

If there are solutions to anything - the only problems they solve is financial problems of some corrupt politicians, both inside the country and in “democratic” countries. And nearly always in “democracy support” you find some ugly corruption schemes that were behind all the mess. It’s true about all cases - Venezuela, Libya, Syria, Ukraine. There is no “democracy support” anywhere in the picture. Just plain low key corruption.


I do understand that you prefer a harsh dictatorship above personal freedoms.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:36 pm

Redd wrote:
Dutchy wrote:

Again, you see only two options: dictator or chaos, no 3rd way. I think that it quite dogmatic.


LOL... No that's not it....


Till now, you haven't given us another option and of the two you prefer dictatorship. So what is your alternative to the Assad regime?

Redd wrote:
Dutchy wrote:

Fine, you believe that kind of things. YT? What is that? In general, CIA officers aren't the type to blamp around their accomplishments.


Once again, LOL.... Believing or not, does not make it true or false Dutchy. The fact that the documentary is there, and those CIA officers (retired) said what they said is a fact. My belief really has no bearing on that.


I always get suspicious if someone claims to be an ex-CIA officer and you have presented us with only one source, and you haven't given us the url to this documentary yet, to judge for ourselves and you haven't given us a second source........

Redd wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Well, you seem to prefer it to any other solution. But please enlighten me on how I should see it differently.


You can see things how you like my friend. You either have a problem with English comprehension or are really trying to categorize me because our opinions differ. Either way you are wrong, and you can take that as gospel. There is no higher authority on what I think than me, myself and I, so take my word on that ;)


Sure, but I can only see what you write here, not what you think, so that's why I said, enlighten us what you see as a third way, besides the Assad-regime. Or a dictatorship in general in the Middle East.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:27 am

Dutchy wrote:

Complete and utter bull. There are many alternatives to the Assad regime with their Russian cronies. So false narative from you again.


Then what are/were the alternatives? Jabhat al Nusra and the likes? In Syria, nobody has seen any other than that. In Alma-Ata, Russians tried to organize a political process between Assad and opposition. But characters claiming to be the “opposition” that came to the talks were nothing but a gathering of random con artists, having appeared from nowhere and obviously not representing anyone. Such “political process” has no chance obviously.

And quality of “democratic opposition” that low wan’t only in Syria - it’s like that everywhere pretty much.
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:42 am

Dutchy wrote:
I do understand that you prefer a harsh dictatorship above personal freedoms.


When it comes to some other nation, I do not have any preference. It’s up to that nation - whether they want a dictatorship or personal freedoms. And if they want dictatorship - then how harsh, and freedoms - who should have what freedoms. And when/how to transition between the two forms. It’s up to them to decide, and nobody from outside should tell them that they are living improperly, their leader is wrong, etc.
 
anrec80
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:50 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:46 am

Dutchy wrote:
I always get suspicious if someone claims to be an ex-CIA officer and you have presented us with only one source, and you haven't given us the url to this documentary yet, to judge for ourselves and you haven't given us a second source........


And nonetheless you do not expect us to get suspicious when you bring up here “open source investigations” claimed to be based on “social networks” for some reason.
 
Redd
Posts: 1191
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 7:27 am

Dutchy wrote:
Till now, you haven't given us another option and of the two you prefer dictatorship. So what is your alternative to the Assad regime? .


Forgive me, I assumed you possess some powers of assumption and deduction. I don't have a position on an alternative, I simply stated and believe that the people of Syria were much better off before the west armed & trained Jihadi Islamist wacko's, called them freedom fighters and helped destroy the country.

Dutchy wrote:
I always get suspicious if someone claims to be an ex-CIA officer and you have presented us with only one source, and you haven't given us the url to this documentary yet, to judge for ourselves and you haven't given us a second source........


You haven't asked for the URL. I'm not in the habit of giving things before I'm asked to do so.

Dutchy wrote:
Sure, but I can only see what you write here, not what you think, so that's why I said, enlighten us what you see as a third way, besides the Assad-regime. Or a dictatorship in general in the Middle East.


I don't need to enlighten you of a third way, once again it's not something I've put thought into. Assad and no war, was a much better alternative than what actually happened. Like it or not, Assad is the legitimate leader of that country and the country would have been better off if it hadn't been destroyed, directly or indirectly by the West as it was, don't you think?
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 7:43 am

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:

Complete and utter bull. There are many alternatives to the Assad regime with their Russian cronies. So false narative from you again.


Then what are/were the alternatives? Jabhat al Nusra and the likes? In Syria, nobody has seen any other than that. In Alma-Ata, Russians tried to organize a political process between Assad and opposition. But characters claiming to be the “opposition” that came to the talks were nothing but a gathering of random con artists, having appeared from nowhere and obviously not representing anyone. Such “political process” has no chance obviously.

And quality of “democratic opposition” that low wan’t only in Syria - it’s like that everywhere pretty much.



:rotfl: :rotfl: or actually quite sad. First Russia bombs the shit out of them, with numerous hospitals and civilians, targeted (=war crimes), so Russia is firmly in the camp of Assad, do you think they are the right party to organize this So I agree, this political process has obviously no chance at all. Besides, what is Assad going to do? Give up serious powers? He will. end up in jail or worse. That trap of any dictator, you cannot really retire, or you need to put some crony at the helm, which you know is going to protect you, Yeltsin - Putin is the perfect example.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 7:48 am

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
I do understand that you prefer a harsh dictatorship above personal freedoms.


When it comes to some other nation, I do not have any preference. It’s up to that nation - whether they want a dictatorship or personal freedoms. And if they want dictatorship - then how harsh, and freedoms - who should have what freedoms. And when/how to transition between the two forms. It’s up to them to decide, and nobody from outside should tell them that they are living improperly, their leader is wrong, etc.


Oh boy, really, do you even know what you have written? And how ridiculous this sounds? If someone is tortured, you say: ok, no problem, the victim chose to be tortured. Or if a husband beats his wife: it is the wife's fault, she chose this. It is complete and utter bull. But thanks for laughing out loud at your statements.

That said: if you take your own ridiculous statement. seriously, why is Russia intervening? I mean, if, what you claim, Syria was slipping into a Kalifat, it is up to the people to decide, not for Russia. Right? So good to see that you at least condemn the Putin regime for intervening in Syria. :roll:
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 7:55 am

anrec80 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
I always get suspicious if someone claims to be an ex-CIA officer and you have presented us with only one source, and you haven't given us the url to this documentary yet, to judge for ourselves and you haven't given us a second source........


And nonetheless you do not expect us to get suspicious when you bring up here “open source investigations” claimed to be based on “social networks” for some reason.


That research can be verified. And we will see if that kind of investigation will hold up in an independent court of law. As you know, but mostly you want to ignore, this kind of things is usually backed up by all kind of different evidence, it is not just social networks. And these “open source investigations” are no government investigations. But as I said, it is the inconvenient truth for you, so you decide to attack only a portion, which sounds reasonable on the surface, but think about what you say for just a second and. everything falls apart.

But tell me has the CIA verified that these persons are who they say they are? So I guess you also believe in Aliens and that they walk among us, I mean, lots of stories out there on youtube, saying that they are ex-CIA officers claiming to have handled Aliens. So if you believe one aspect of this, you got to believe everything, you cannot be picky about that..............
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
Dutchy
Posts: 11115
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 8:08 am

Redd wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Till now, you haven't given us another option and of the two you prefer dictatorship. So what is your alternative to the Assad regime?


Forgive me, I assumed you possess some powers of assumption and deduction. I don't have a position on an alternative, I simply stated and believe that the people of Syria were much better off before the west armed & trained Jihadi Islamist wacko's, called them freedom fighters and helped destroy the country.


The Assad regime was slaughtering them, that's what started it.........

Dutchy wrote:
I always get suspicious if someone claims to be an ex-CIA officer and you have presented us with only one source, and you haven't given us the url to this documentary yet, to judge for ourselves and you haven't given us a second source........


You haven't asked for the URL. I'm not in the habit of giving things before I'm asked to do so..[/quote]

Consider this a question, so please give us the URL so we can see for ourselves. Obviously the quality of the discussion is helped if you provide links to your statements (and you are required to do so per forum rules).

Dutchy wrote:
Sure, but I can only see what you write here, not what you think, so that's why I said, enlighten us what you see as a third way, besides the Assad-regime. Or a dictatorship in general in the Middle East.


I don't need to enlighten you of a third way, once again it's not something I've put thought into. Assad and no war, was a much better alternative than what actually happened. Like it or not, Assad is the legitimate leader of that country and the country would have been better off if it hadn't been destroyed, directly or indirectly by the West as it was, don't you think?[/quote]

Assad is a harsh dictator, so I would never call him a legitimate leader. Sure, it would have been better if it hadn't be destroyed, that is a truism. But wouldn't have it been better if Assad stepped down, or even gave the people more freedom when they asked for it? Instead of giving them the pointy end of bullets? It all boils down to Assad and how he decided to react to its people, that were it started and. that is something you continue to ignore.

But in conclusion, you do not have a 3rd way, so my assessment. of you is right after all: dogmatic about two choices: Assad regime or jihadists.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
User avatar
CitizenJustin
Posts: 584
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:12 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:34 am

anrec80 wrote:
readytotaxi wrote:
Get this person to the International Court of Justice, ASAP


What humanity needs the most is some sort of court for “democracy supporters” - thanks to whom this bloodshed has started in 2011. And I hope we live up to that moment.

And - congrats to Syrian leadership and Syrian people, hopefully they can rebuild their country and peaceful life.


Congratulating a tyrant who gassed his own people, including innocent children. The proof is there, but It doesn’t fit your narrative. It’s truly terrifying to see people who’ve been so throughly warped by propaganda that they defend evil people.
 
Redd
Posts: 1191
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 10:10 am

Dutchy wrote:

Assad is a harsh dictator, so I would never call him a legitimate leader. Sure, it would have been better if it hadn't be destroyed, that is a truism. But wouldn't have it been better if Assad stepped down, or even gave the people more freedom when they asked for it? Instead of giving them the pointy end of bullets? It all boils down to Assad and how he decided to react to its people, that were it started and. that is something you continue to ignore.

But in conclusion, you do not have a 3rd way, so my assessment. of you is right after all: dogmatic about two choices: Assad regime or jihadists.


So, when someone is humble enough to say they don't have an opinion, or they don't have all the answers, it makes them dogmatic? You're a real piece of work.... Good thing there are Dutchy's out there with all of the solutions to all our problems. :trophy:
 
User avatar
mad99
Posts: 1217
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:33 am

Re: Assad addresses people of Syria, declares the end of the Syrian civil war

Fri Feb 21, 2020 10:29 am

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: 747fan, Aaron747, DanielK, flyingwaeldar, speedygonzales, tommy1808 and 54 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos