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PixelPilot
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:43 pm

DLFREEBIRD wrote:
I thought everybody understood that during a pandemic in the hot spots autopsies are not being performed due to lack of staff. What am I missing?


That potentially somebody that died cause of a heart attack is marked as CoviD cause he tested positive at some point.
Can’t explain it any more blunt.
 
PixelPilot
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:47 pm

casinterest wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
DLFREEBIRD wrote:

what part of probable do you not understand?


Probable is not definitive. Obviously.
What is that confuses you about it?

**I also explained why few posts above.



Are you that dense? Seriously?

Unless someone requests an autopsy, Probable is the most direct attributing factor.


So if somebody dies of a obvious heart attack but tested positive Covid 7 weeks ago and you put cause of death covid then it’s ok.
Got it. Must be cause I’m dense. Rofl.
 
ltbewr
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:49 pm

I have brought up previously as to determining the numbers who died in main part from Covid-19. As others and I have suggested, it is the number of 'excess' deaths above the mean of the same period over 1-5 past years. The mean would include 'normal flu' deaths in past years. There are of course some issues as to the 'mean' in the Covid-19 time period, there may be fewer deaths from accidents currently, but higher than normal numbers from some dying from non-Covid-19 causes as afraid to go to hospital if having a heart attack, stoke, diabetic shock, respiratory attack and the like. There may also be delays in forwarding information to state and local health departments, we see that especially during weekends.
 
DLFREEBIRD
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:57 pm

PixelPilot wrote:
DLFREEBIRD wrote:
I thought everybody understood that during a pandemic in the hot spots autopsies are not being performed due to lack of staff. What am I missing?


That potentially somebody that died cause of a heart attack is marked as CoviD cause he tested positive at some point.
Can’t explain it any more blunt.


And, potentially the heart attack was brought on by the virus damaging the heart which is what's happening.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/ ... the-heart/
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Wed Apr 29, 2020 11:12 pm

PixelPilot wrote:
casinterest wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:

Probable is not definitive. Obviously.
What is that confuses you about it?

**I also explained why few posts above.



Are you that dense? Seriously?

Unless someone requests an autopsy, Probable is the most direct attributing factor.


So if somebody dies of a obvious heart attack but tested positive Covid 7 weeks ago and you put cause of death covid then it’s ok.
Got it. Must be cause I’m dense. Rofl.


All heart attacks have causes. See above. Some triggered by CAD, some not. If a soccer player with hypertrophic cardiomyopathy dies on the pitch of a massive heart attack, are we calling reason a heart attack? If a person with long QT syndrome is scared to death by a surprise, do we charge their friend with manslaughter? This is faulty logic that shows zero understanding of what an ‘obvious heart attack’ means to a pathologist. If we extend your reasoning, we have to attribute most deaths from any condition to the heart, since cardiac arrest is what finishes most everyone. :lol:
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Wed Apr 29, 2020 11:44 pm

There is a possibility the specimen of dead person took a while to get tested because of lab backlog and can be a COVID-19 positive few weeks later.

Didn't NY started counting all hospital deaths as COVID-19 deaths? I may be wrong.

Default DNR/DNAR, not allowing families, patients in hallways, dorms and field hospitals, lack of medical equipment, medicines, PPEs for health care pros, all these were applicable to only third world, now acceptable practices.

I am glad slowly healthcare system coming back to normal, there are enough supplies now.

Of course there will be a lot of finger pointing for political reasons, just another day in politics.
All posts are just opinions.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Wed Apr 29, 2020 11:52 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
There is a possibility the specimen of dead person took a while to get tested because of lab backlog and can be a COVID-19 positive few weeks later.

Didn't NY started counting all hospital deaths as COVID-19 deaths? I may be wrong.

Default DNR/DNAR, not allowing families, patients in hallways, dorms and field hospitals, lack of medical equipment, medicines, PPEs for health care pros, all these were applicable to only third world, now acceptable practices.

I am glad slowly healthcare system coming back to normal, there are enough supplies now.

Of course there will be a lot of finger pointing for political reasons, just another day in politics.

https://www.politico.com/states/new-yor ... ed-1275931
The latest statistics include probable coronavirus deaths through Monday. And even the new statistics may understate the death toll. Probable deaths were recorded as people who did not have a positive lab test for Covid-19, but did have Covid-19 or something similar listed as the cause of death on their death certificate.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
DLFREEBIRD
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 12:05 am

dtw2hyd wrote:
There is a possibility the specimen of dead person took a while to get tested because of lab backlog and can be a COVID-19 positive few weeks later.

Didn't NY started counting all hospital deaths as COVID-19 deaths? I may be wrong.

Default DNR/DNAR, not allowing families, patients in hallways, dorms and field hospitals, lack of medical equipment, medicines, PPEs for health care pros, all these were applicable to only third world, now acceptable practices.

I am glad slowly healthcare system coming back to normal, there are enough supplies now.

Of course there will be a lot of finger pointing for political reasons, just another day in politics.


No they haven't they are undercounting if anything.

here's your data.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/202 ... -city.html

More than 27,000 New Yorkers have died since the start of the novel coronavirus outbreak in March — 20,900 more than would be expected over this period and thousands more than have been captured by official coronavirus death statistics.
 
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WarRI1
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 12:23 am

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2020/0 ... /24145180/

It seems success is slip sliding away and the death count is rising every day. Just a tad optimistic was he?
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
PixelPilot
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:43 am

Aaron747 wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
casinterest wrote:


Are you that dense? Seriously?

Unless someone requests an autopsy, Probable is the most direct attributing factor.


So if somebody dies of a obvious heart attack but tested positive Covid 7 weeks ago and you put cause of death covid then it’s ok.
Got it. Must be cause I’m dense. Rofl.


All heart attacks have causes. See above. Some triggered by CAD, some not. If a soccer player with hypertrophic cardiomyopathy dies on the pitch of a massive heart attack, are we calling reason a heart attack? If a person with long QT syndrome is scared to death by a surprise, do we charge their friend with manslaughter? This is faulty logic that shows zero understanding of what an ‘obvious heart attack’ means to a pathologist. If we extend your reasoning, we have to attribute most deaths from any condition to the heart, since cardiac arrest is what finishes most everyone. :lol:


In your reasoning a guy that died in a car accident and had covid will have COD listed as covid cause you know, probable cause.
Rofl.
Feds are counting everything as covid regardless of cause and I quote “despite other nations doing the opposite”.
So Now US is doing it right all of a sudden?
How is it? Gotta make up your mind cause you are starting to circle in your statements which is not surprising tbh.
And cool selective pathologist story that has nothing to do with this lol.
https://nypost.com/2020/04/07/feds-clas ... 19-deaths/
Last edited by PixelPilot on Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:08 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
speedking
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:44 am

https://www.cfact.org/2020/04/27/tale-o ... d-climate/

Tale of two panics — Covid & Climate

While they are occurring on vastly different time scales, the Covid-19 panic and the climate change panic are remarkably similar. Perhaps there are certain basic social panic mechanisms that always occur, which are yet to be discovered. Yet in any case the striking similarities between these two are worth exploring a bit.

To begin with, each panic began with runaway computer models. In the Covid case the U.S. death count was projected to be around 2,000,000, clearly calling for draconian government action, which soon followed. That number now stands at about 60,000, about the same as a bad flu year, but the damage is well underway.

Claims that the ruinous actions brought the numbers down are belied by the countries that fared just as well without them. Nor do we know what made the model so “hot” as it has not been analyzed, or even properly documented and released for analysis.

In the climate case the hot models take a benign increase in atmospheric CO2 and turn it into a coming catastrophe. We actually know how they do this using massive (and purely speculative) positive feedbacks from water vapor and clouds. That these models have clearly been falsified by observation is ignored by their masters.

In both cases the speculative terror to come was heartily embraced by the mainstream media, accompanied by relentless cries for action. Predictably the public responded with fear, giving the government ample room for action.

In both cases the result has been mandates for economically destructive abstinence. In the Covid case the mandate is to hide thy self away. Don’t go out, don’t go to work, don’t go to school. That the economy is rapidly collapsing is no surprise.
 
PixelPilot
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:50 am

speedking wrote:
https://www.cfact.org/2020/04/27/tale-of-two-panics-covid-climate/

Tale of two panics — Covid & Climate

While they are occurring on vastly different time scales, the Covid-19 panic and the climate change panic are remarkably similar. Perhaps there are certain basic social panic mechanisms that always occur, which are yet to be discovered. Yet in any case the striking similarities between these two are worth exploring a bit.

To begin with, each panic began with runaway computer models. In the Covid case the U.S. death count was projected to be around 2,000,000, clearly calling for draconian government action, which soon followed. That number now stands at about 60,000, about the same as a bad flu year, but the damage is well underway.

Claims that the ruinous actions brought the numbers down are belied by the countries that fared just as well without them. Nor do we know what made the model so “hot” as it has not been analyzed, or even properly documented and released for analysis.

In the climate case the hot models take a benign increase in atmospheric CO2 and turn it into a coming catastrophe. We actually know how they do this using massive (and purely speculative) positive feedbacks from water vapor and clouds. That these models have clearly been falsified by observation is ignored by their masters.

In both cases the speculative terror to come was heartily embraced by the mainstream media, accompanied by relentless cries for action. Predictably the public responded with fear, giving the government ample room for action.

In both cases the result has been mandates for economically destructive abstinence. In the Covid case the mandate is to hide thy self away. Don’t go out, don’t go to work, don’t go to school. That the economy is rapidly collapsing is no surprise.


Not surprising.
Pseudo intellectualism is a disease.
Theories tailored to one specific scenario without zero understanding of the subject in general.
 
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Aesma
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:06 am

speedking wrote:
https://www.cfact.org/2020/04/27/tale-of-two-panics-covid-climate/


Tale of two panics — Covid & Climate

Too much BS in that article to be worth responding to it.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
PixelPilot
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:39 am

According to Musk hospitals in Cali were half empty all this time.
Link to the data is down now. I guess server overloaded.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/125 ... 78560?s=21

But interestingly enough all beaches and state parks will be closed as of May 1st.
Who was it that enjoyed freedom of California moderate approach so much lately?

https://twitter.com/bennyjohnson/status ... 32549?s=21
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:16 am

PixelPilot wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:

So if somebody dies of a obvious heart attack but tested positive Covid 7 weeks ago and you put cause of death covid then it’s ok.
Got it. Must be cause I’m dense. Rofl.


All heart attacks have causes. See above. Some triggered by CAD, some not. If a soccer player with hypertrophic cardiomyopathy dies on the pitch of a massive heart attack, are we calling reason a heart attack? If a person with long QT syndrome is scared to death by a surprise, do we charge their friend with manslaughter? This is faulty logic that shows zero understanding of what an ‘obvious heart attack’ means to a pathologist. If we extend your reasoning, we have to attribute most deaths from any condition to the heart, since cardiac arrest is what finishes most everyone. :lol:


In your reasoning a guy that died in a car accident and had covid will have COD listed as covid cause you know, probable cause.
Rofl.
Feds are counting everything as covid regardless of cause and I quote “despite other nations doing the opposite”.
So Now US is doing it right all of a sudden?
How is it? Gotta make up your mind cause you are starting to circle in your statements which is not surprising tbh.
And cool selective pathologist story that has nothing to do with this lol.
https://nypost.com/2020/04/07/feds-clas ... 19-deaths/


No, there is no anatomical relation between the physical processes of a car accident and COVID. My examples were using your logic. Not my problem if reading comprehension wasn't up to snuff.

And on that topic, it seems you missed one of the most important quotes in the article you linked:

Dr. Michael Baden, a Fox News contributor, said it’s reasonable to include the death of someone infected with the virus, who also had other health issues, in the COVID-19 body count.

“In the normal course, autopsies would then determine whether the person died of the effects of the COVID virus, whether the person had a brain tumor or brain hemorrhage, for example, that might be unrelated to it and what the relative significance of both the infection and the pre-existing disease is”
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
PixelPilot
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:21 am

Aaron747 wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:

All heart attacks have causes. See above. Some triggered by CAD, some not. If a soccer player with hypertrophic cardiomyopathy dies on the pitch of a massive heart attack, are we calling reason a heart attack? If a person with long QT syndrome is scared to death by a surprise, do we charge their friend with manslaughter? This is faulty logic that shows zero understanding of what an ‘obvious heart attack’ means to a pathologist. If we extend your reasoning, we have to attribute most deaths from any condition to the heart, since cardiac arrest is what finishes most everyone. :lol:


In your reasoning a guy that died in a car accident and had covid will have COD listed as covid cause you know, probable cause.
Rofl.
Feds are counting everything as covid regardless of cause and I quote “despite other nations doing the opposite”.
So Now US is doing it right all of a sudden?
How is it? Gotta make up your mind cause you are starting to circle in your statements which is not surprising tbh.
And cool selective pathologist story that has nothing to do with this lol.
https://nypost.com/2020/04/07/feds-clas ... 19-deaths/


No, there is no anatomical relation between the physical processes of a car accident and COVID. My examples were using your logic. Not my problem if reading comprehension wasn't up to snuff.

And on that topic, it seems you missed one of the most important quotes in the article you linked:

Dr. Michael Baden, a Fox News contributor, said it’s reasonable to include the death of someone infected with the virus, who also had other health issues, in the COVID-19 body count.

“In the normal course, autopsies would then determine whether the person died of the effects of the COVID virus, whether the person had a brain tumor or brain hemorrhage, for example, that might be unrelated to it and what the relative significance of both the infection and the pre-existing disease is”


I never missed it. I’m just questioning validity of the numbers and believe they are inflated which is not unreasonable when you take into account how US counts this data. Now whether this number is big or small I don’t know.
That’s all.
 
ltbewr
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:54 am

I hope some out there don't mind a little humor in these tense times.
We are aware of the low Covid-19 testing rates in Sweden. Perhaps they are having trouble assembling the tests they bought from IKEA.
 
Olddog
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:01 am

PixelPilot wrote:
I never missed it. I’m just questioning validity of the numbers and believe they are inflated which is not unreasonable when you take into account how US counts this data. Now whether this number is big or small I don’t know.
That’s all.


What is your point ? You are endlessly arguing about the numbers without any substance just to push your agenda.....
Signature censored
 
DLFREEBIRD
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:13 am

PixelPilot wrote:

Pseudo intellectualism is a disease.
Theories tailored to one specific scenario without zero understanding of the subject in general.


pot meet kettle.
 
art
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:37 am

PixelPilot wrote:
Side effects already appearing?
Links to articles in the thread.

https://twitter.com/alexberenson/status ... 64577?s=21


2 recommendations for people who will not seek medical treatment for a medical problem due to being terrified by the prospect of contracting the virus:

1, don't be so fearful
2. learn to overcome your fears and behave normally in spite of being aware of a threat

If medics, bus drivers, supermarket checkout staff etc can carry on as usual, so can you!
 
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scbriml
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:45 am

speedking wrote:
TIn the Covid case the U.S. death count was projected to be around 2,000,000, clearly calling for draconian government action, which soon followed. That number now stands at about 60,000, about the same as a bad flu year, but the damage is well underway.


Where to start?

The projection of up to 2 million deaths was if no action was taken. Action was taken, the action is working.

Flu death numbers are for a whole year, Covid-19 has matched that in two months and is still going strong (nearly 5,000 added in the last two days). Let's wait until next March and see what the Covid-19 death total for a whole year is.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:28 am

PixelPilot wrote:
According to Musk hospitals in Cali were half empty all this time.
Link to the data is down now. I guess server overloaded.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/125 ... 78560?s=21

But interestingly enough all beaches and state parks will be closed as of May 1st.
Who was it that enjoyed freedom of California moderate approach so much lately?

https://twitter.com/bennyjohnson/status ... 32549?s=21


Looks like it is customary for Musk to say something interesting around 4/20 of every year.

With all elective surgeries cancelled, sure there will be some empty beds, otherwise the schedulers of these surgeries wouldn't waste even one hour of prep/operating/recovery room time or bed capacity.
All posts are just opinions.
 
PixelPilot
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:09 pm

DLFREEBIRD wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:

Pseudo intellectualism is a disease.
Theories tailored to one specific scenario without zero understanding of the subject in general.


pot meet kettle.


I appreciate your thorough response after being proven that my thesis is actually right and that is according to Dr. Birx.
Or she's dum too?
 
PixelPilot
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:16 pm

Olddog wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
I never missed it. I’m just questioning validity of the numbers and believe they are inflated which is not unreasonable when you take into account how US counts this data. Now whether this number is big or small I don’t know.
That’s all.


What is your point ? You are endlessly arguing about the numbers without any substance just to push your agenda.....


If you can not see the potential dangers of incorrect data in a recession (or worse) type of event then you are part of the problem.
Lives of millions of people are spiraling into oblivion while media screams doom and intensifies negative factors.
If they are screaming doom on a inflated data then that is wrong. Call it cautionary I call it dangerous.
Some of you are obsessed with covid while completely missing everything else that will have a massive negative impact on society.

Mind blowing.

Aaron747 wrote:
DLFREEBIRD wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:

Pseudo intellectualism is a disease.
Theories tailored to one specific scenario without zero understanding of the subject in general.


pot meet kettle.


Dunning-Kruger effect is incredible to observe in the wilds of homo sapiens.


No kidding.
Obsessing with covid while literally ignoring every other negative outcome of certain actions is exactly that.
"Your" drone shots are a perfect example of Dunning-Kruger effect. World is pretty where I live, I got it all so it is ok and so what that millions around are about to face actual doom. I can take pretty scenic drives and life is awesome so all red states are jelly of what we have.
That's the foundation of your thesis. That's your character. Your own words.

Oh and BTW did you hear that all Cali is closing all beaches. I guess you guys are not doing this great.
https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/cali ... index.html
 
2122M
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:44 pm

PixelPilot wrote:
Olddog wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
I never missed it. I’m just questioning validity of the numbers and believe they are inflated which is not unreasonable when you take into account how US counts this data. Now whether this number is big or small I don’t know.
That’s all.


What is your point ? You are endlessly arguing about the numbers without any substance just to push your agenda.....


If you can not see the potential dangers of incorrect data in a recession (or worse) type of event then you are part of the problem.
Lives of millions of people are spiraling into oblivion while media screams doom and intensifies negative factors.
If they are screaming doom on a inflated data then that is wrong. Call it cautionary I call it dangerous.
Some of you are obsessed with covid while completely missing everything else that will have a massive negative impact on society.

Mind blowing.

Aaron747 wrote:
DLFREEBIRD wrote:

pot meet kettle.


Dunning-Kruger effect is incredible to observe in the wilds of homo sapiens.


No kidding.
Obsessing with covid while literally ignoring every other negative outcome of certain actions is exactly that.
Your drone shots are a perfect example of Dunning-Kruger effect. World is pretty where I live, I got it all so it is ok and so what that millions around are about to face actual doom. I can take pretty scenic drives and life is awesome so all red states are jelly of what we have.
That's the foundation of your thesis. That's your character.

Oh and BTW did you hear that all Cali is closing all beaches. I guess you guys are not doing this great.
https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/cali ... index.html


Except it isn't a global economic catastrophe. Look at countries with a more (god-forbid) socialist systems and you will see the unemployment numbers are only up a little bit and the overall economic impact isn't nearly as bad as it has been here in the US. Their economies will recover quicker and feel less long term pain. Is it expensive to do that? Of course, but probably not as expensive as a protracted recession.

Elections have consequences. Electing predominately conservative lawmakers over the last 25 years has put us in this position where we now have to make a choice between saving lives or saving the economy whereas the left leaning major economies of Europe never had to make that choice.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/eu ... story.html

https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/04/04/ku ... urope-not/
 
PixelPilot
Posts: 563
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:49 pm

2122M wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
Olddog wrote:

What is your point ? You are endlessly arguing about the numbers without any substance just to push your agenda.....


If you can not see the potential dangers of incorrect data in a recession (or worse) type of event then you are part of the problem.
Lives of millions of people are spiraling into oblivion while media screams doom and intensifies negative factors.
If they are screaming doom on a inflated data then that is wrong. Call it cautionary I call it dangerous.
Some of you are obsessed with covid while completely missing everything else that will have a massive negative impact on society.

Mind blowing.

Aaron747 wrote:

Dunning-Kruger effect is incredible to observe in the wilds of homo sapiens.


No kidding.
Obsessing with covid while literally ignoring every other negative outcome of certain actions is exactly that.
Your drone shots are a perfect example of Dunning-Kruger effect. World is pretty where I live, I got it all so it is ok and so what that millions around are about to face actual doom. I can take pretty scenic drives and life is awesome so all red states are jelly of what we have.
That's the foundation of your thesis. That's your character.

Oh and BTW did you hear that all Cali is closing all beaches. I guess you guys are not doing this great.
https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/cali ... index.html


Except it isn't a global economic catastrophe. Look at countries with a more (god-forbid) socialist systems and you will see the unemployment numbers are only up a little bit and the overall economic impact isn't nearly as bad as it has been here in the US. Their economies will recover quicker and feel less long term pain. Is it expensive to do that? Of course, but probably not as expensive as a protracted recession.

Elections have consequences. Electing predominately conservative lawmakers over the last 25 years has put us in this position where we now have to make a choice between saving lives or saving the economy whereas the left leaning major economies of Europe never had to make that choice.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/eu ... story.html

https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/04/04/ku ... urope-not/


I would agree if you would show me one country with 340+ million people that got it right.
Maybe if each state were a country then using EU nations as examples would be fitting but some cities here are larger than entire countries.
You can't compare those unfortuantely.

But I will agree about electing wrong people for the job is exactly what is hurting us long term.
Unfortunately between left and right they all cheer for the same. This part is not hard to see which is why I believe third party is needed simply to break the mold.
Last edited by PixelPilot on Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
AirWorthy99
Posts: 1085
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:57 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:54 pm

2122M wrote:

Except it isn't a global economic catastrophe. Look at countries with a more (god-forbid) socialist systems and you will see the unemployment numbers are only up a little bit and the overall economic impact isn't nearly as bad as it has been here in the US. Their economies will recover quicker and feel less long term pain. Is it expensive to do that? Of course, but probably not as expensive as a protracted recession.


Except that it is:

Italy recession: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/italy ... 2020-04-30

France recession: https://www.france24.com/en/20200430-fr ... st-quarter

Germany braces for recession: https://www.thelocal.de/20200429/german ... s-minister

Spain recession: https://english.elpais.com/economy_and_ ... ntury.html

UK facing recession: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... SKCN21W1EQ

What happens when recession comes up? unemployment too. Yes it is a global economic catastrophe, and it seems to be worse than the health crisis from COVID.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister
 
2122M
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:58 pm

PixelPilot wrote:
2122M wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:

If you can not see the potential dangers of incorrect data in a recession (or worse) type of event then you are part of the problem.
Lives of millions of people are spiraling into oblivion while media screams doom and intensifies negative factors.
If they are screaming doom on a inflated data then that is wrong. Call it cautionary I call it dangerous.
Some of you are obsessed with covid while completely missing everything else that will have a massive negative impact on society.

Mind blowing.



No kidding.
Obsessing with covid while literally ignoring every other negative outcome of certain actions is exactly that.
Your drone shots are a perfect example of Dunning-Kruger effect. World is pretty where I live, I got it all so it is ok and so what that millions around are about to face actual doom. I can take pretty scenic drives and life is awesome so all red states are jelly of what we have.
That's the foundation of your thesis. That's your character.

Oh and BTW did you hear that all Cali is closing all beaches. I guess you guys are not doing this great.
https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/cali ... index.html


Except it isn't a global economic catastrophe. Look at countries with a more (god-forbid) socialist systems and you will see the unemployment numbers are only up a little bit and the overall economic impact isn't nearly as bad as it has been here in the US. Their economies will recover quicker and feel less long term pain. Is it expensive to do that? Of course, but probably not as expensive as a protracted recession.

Elections have consequences. Electing predominately conservative lawmakers over the last 25 years has put us in this position where we now have to make a choice between saving lives or saving the economy whereas the left leaning major economies of Europe never had to make that choice.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/eu ... story.html

https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/04/04/ku ... urope-not/


I would agree if you would show me one country with 340+ million people that got it right.
Maybe if each state were a country then using small EU nations as examples would be fitting but some cities here are larger than entire countries.
You can't compare those unfortuantely.

But I will agree about electing wrong people for the job is exactly what is hurting us long term.
Unfortunately between left and right they all cheer for the same. This part is not hard to see.



I love this cop out from the right. "You need to compare us to a diverse country of exactly 300 to 340 million people in the western hemisphere, north of the equator with a largely temperate climate, a capital on the east coast and 32 team professional american football league. Otherwise it's not a fair comparison!"

But fine, if you would prefer to compare US states to EU countries, then you must be in favor of electing 50 democratic socialist governors so they can achieve results similar to Europe individually.
 
2122M
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:00 pm

AirWorthy99 wrote:
2122M wrote:

Except it isn't a global economic catastrophe. Look at countries with a more (god-forbid) socialist systems and you will see the unemployment numbers are only up a little bit and the overall economic impact isn't nearly as bad as it has been here in the US. Their economies will recover quicker and feel less long term pain. Is it expensive to do that? Of course, but probably not as expensive as a protracted recession.


Except that it is:

Italy recession: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/italy ... 2020-04-30

France recession: https://www.france24.com/en/20200430-fr ... st-quarter

Germany braces for recession: https://www.thelocal.de/20200429/german ... s-minister

Spain recession: https://english.elpais.com/economy_and_ ... ntury.html

UK facing recession: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... SKCN21W1EQ

What happens when recession comes up? unemployment too. Yes it is a global economic catastrophe, and it seems to be worse than the health crisis from COVID.


This is kind of my point. GDP is going to drop everywhere. But the European countries that are able to prop up their citizens and companies through the recession will suffer less and recover quicker. Just like they did after 2008.
 
PixelPilot
Posts: 563
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:19 am

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:05 pm

2122M wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
2122M wrote:

Except it isn't a global economic catastrophe. Look at countries with a more (god-forbid) socialist systems and you will see the unemployment numbers are only up a little bit and the overall economic impact isn't nearly as bad as it has been here in the US. Their economies will recover quicker and feel less long term pain. Is it expensive to do that? Of course, but probably not as expensive as a protracted recession.

Elections have consequences. Electing predominately conservative lawmakers over the last 25 years has put us in this position where we now have to make a choice between saving lives or saving the economy whereas the left leaning major economies of Europe never had to make that choice.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/eu ... story.html

https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/04/04/ku ... urope-not/


I would agree if you would show me one country with 340+ million people that got it right.
Maybe if each state were a country then using small EU nations as examples would be fitting but some cities here are larger than entire countries.
You can't compare those unfortuantely.

But I will agree about electing wrong people for the job is exactly what is hurting us long term.
Unfortunately between left and right they all cheer for the same. This part is not hard to see.



I love this cop out from the right. "You need to compare us to a diverse country of exactly 300 to 340 million people in the western hemisphere, north of the equator with a largely temperate climate, a capital on the east coast and 32 team professional american football league. Otherwise it's not a fair comparison!"

But fine, if you would prefer to compare US states to EU countries, then you must be in favor of electing 50 democratic socialist governors so they can achieve results similar to Europe individually.


Communism or socialism is not going to save you even though you clearly believe it will.
I come from a communist / socialist country. I lived the "fairy tale" you are imagining.
Not going to work.
Also if you are in such belief of EU economy doing great please let me know how come the great France has riots for the past year? Why Germany's economy was showing signs of recession in 2018 already? What about Italy and its massive debt? Portugal going into recession. Greece anyone?
The only decent economy up till covid in EU was actually Poland. Look up the numbers. Funny enough they have probably the worst social benefits in the entire EU.
 
2122M
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:14 pm

PixelPilot wrote:
2122M wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:

I would agree if you would show me one country with 340+ million people that got it right.
Maybe if each state were a country then using small EU nations as examples would be fitting but some cities here are larger than entire countries.
You can't compare those unfortuantely.

But I will agree about electing wrong people for the job is exactly what is hurting us long term.
Unfortunately between left and right they all cheer for the same. This part is not hard to see.



I love this cop out from the right. "You need to compare us to a diverse country of exactly 300 to 340 million people in the western hemisphere, north of the equator with a largely temperate climate, a capital on the east coast and 32 team professional american football league. Otherwise it's not a fair comparison!"

But fine, if you would prefer to compare US states to EU countries, then you must be in favor of electing 50 democratic socialist governors so they can achieve results similar to Europe individually.


Communism or socialism is not going to save you even though you clearly believe it will.
I come from a communist / socialist country. I lived the "fairy tale" you are imagining.
Not going to work.
Also if you are in such belief or EU economy doing great please let me know how come the great France has riots for the past year? Why Germany's economy was showing signs of recession in 2018 already? What about Italy and its massive debt? Portugal going into recession. Greece anyone?
The only decent economy up till covid in EU was actually Poland. Look up the numbers. Though they have probably the worst social benefits in the entire EU.


Hate to break it to you, but we've had protests in the streets too, we're showing signs of recession too, we are in a huge amount of debt, and middle/lower class wages have been flat while prices have skyrocketed.

Seems the economy is on shaky ground everywhere. At least in Europe they are able to take care of their citizens during a global health pandemic a whole lot better than we can.
 
PixelPilot
Posts: 563
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:19 am

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:24 pm

2122M wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
2122M wrote:


I love this cop out from the right. "You need to compare us to a diverse country of exactly 300 to 340 million people in the western hemisphere, north of the equator with a largely temperate climate, a capital on the east coast and 32 team professional american football league. Otherwise it's not a fair comparison!"

But fine, if you would prefer to compare US states to EU countries, then you must be in favor of electing 50 democratic socialist governors so they can achieve results similar to Europe individually.


Communism or socialism is not going to save you even though you clearly believe it will.
I come from a communist / socialist country. I lived the "fairy tale" you are imagining.
Not going to work.
Also if you are in such belief or EU economy doing great please let me know how come the great France has riots for the past year? Why Germany's economy was showing signs of recession in 2018 already? What about Italy and its massive debt? Portugal going into recession. Greece anyone?
The only decent economy up till covid in EU was actually Poland. Look up the numbers. Though they have probably the worst social benefits in the entire EU.


Hate to break it to you, but we've had protests in the streets too, we're showing signs of recession too, we are in a huge amount of debt, and middle/lower class wages have been flat while prices have skyrocketed.

Seems the economy is on shaky ground everywhere. At least in Europe they are able to take care of their citizens during a global health pandemic a whole lot better than we can.


Antifa throwing eggs vs normal people aren't exactly protests in comparison to police actually fighting firefighters and cars set on fire for days at a time.
Apart from Charlottesville, US are boy scouts in comparison to what's happening in there.

End of last year.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kon0rmLQE7U
https://ocdn.eu/pulscms-transforms/1/fm ... QIAzQPAwsM
 
2122M
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:32 pm

PixelPilot wrote:
2122M wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:

Communism or socialism is not going to save you even though you clearly believe it will.
I come from a communist / socialist country. I lived the "fairy tale" you are imagining.
Not going to work.
Also if you are in such belief or EU economy doing great please let me know how come the great France has riots for the past year? Why Germany's economy was showing signs of recession in 2018 already? What about Italy and its massive debt? Portugal going into recession. Greece anyone?
The only decent economy up till covid in EU was actually Poland. Look up the numbers. Though they have probably the worst social benefits in the entire EU.


Hate to break it to you, but we've had protests in the streets too, we're showing signs of recession too, we are in a huge amount of debt, and middle/lower class wages have been flat while prices have skyrocketed.

Seems the economy is on shaky ground everywhere. At least in Europe they are able to take care of their citizens during a global health pandemic a whole lot better than we can.


Antifa throwing eggs vs normal people aren't exactly protests in comparison to police actually fighting firefighters and cars set on fire for days at a time.
Apart from Charlottesville, US are boy scouts in comparison to what's happening in there.

End of last year.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kon0rmLQE7U
https://ocdn.eu/pulscms-transforms/1/fm ... QIAzQPAwsM


This is just the last few years:

2016 – Occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, January–February 2016. 1 killed and several dozen arrested at Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, Oregon.
2016 – 2016 Donald Trump Chicago rally protest, March 11. Five people arrested and two police officers injured during a demonstration at the UIC Pavilion.
2016 – Democracy Spring rally in April. March to Washington D.C. and sit-ins lead to arrests.
2016 – 2016 Sacramento riot, June 26, A confrontation between white nationalists and left-wing counter protesters at the California State Capitol. Ten people were hospitalized for stabbing and laceration wounds.
2016 – Widespread protests erupt in response to two deaths at the hands of police, the Shooting of Alton Sterling and shooting of Philando Castile. At least 261 people were arrested in protests in New York City, Chicago, St. Paul, Baton Rouge, and other cities.
2016 – 2016 Milwaukee riots, Sherman Park, August 13–15. Milwaukee, Wisconsin.
2016 – 2016 Charlotte riot, September 20–21, Protests and riots break out in response to the shooting of Keith Lamont Scott by a Charlotte police officer.
2016 – Dakota Access Pipeline protests, 411 protesters arrested. Multiple skirmishes with police, with vehicles, hay bales, and tires set on fire.
2016 – Anti-Trump protests, November 9–27. As a result of Donald Trump elected as 45th President of the U.S., thousands protested across twenty-five American cities, and unrest broke out in downtown Oakland, California, and Portland, Oregon. In Oakland, over 40 fires started and police officers were injured.
2017 – Berkeley, California, February 1, civil unrest ensued at UC Berkeley as Milo Yiannopoulos was scheduled to speak on the campus.[2][3]
2017 – 2017 Anaheim, California protests, February 21, protesters demonstrate after police officer grabs boy and fires his gun. Protesters damage property and throw bottles and rocks at police.
2017 – May Day, violence breaks out at May Day protests in Olympia, and Portland, as masked anarchists damage property and clash with police.
2017 – 2017 Unite the Right rally, Charlottesville, Virginia, August 11–12. At a Unite the Right rally of white nationalists and white supremacists opposing the removal of a statue of Robert E. Lee, rally attendees and counter-protesters clashed, sometimes violently. A woman, Heather Heyer, was killed and 19 other injured when a rally attendee drove his car into a crowd of counter-protestors. Two law enforcement officers also died in a helicopter crash while monitoring the event.
2017 – 2017 St. Louis protests, beginning September 15, large protests erupted when police officer Jason Stockley was found not guilty of murder in the shooting death of Anthony Lamar Smith on December 20, 2011. Some of the protests turned destructive and the police became violent. Windows were broken at Mayor Lyda Krewson's house and in the Central West End business district on the first night, many windows were broken in the Delmar Loop on Sept 16, a few were broken downtown on Sept 17 after police drove swiftly through a crowd following a peaceful march. Police conducted a kettling mass arrest operation of nonviolent protesters and bystanders, beating and pepper spraying many, including journalists, documentary filmmakers, and an undercover officer. Protests and sporadic unrest continued daily for weeks.
2019 – Memphis riot, June 13, following the fatal shooting of Brandon Webber by U.S. Marshals, Memphis, TN.
 
PixelPilot
Posts: 563
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:19 am

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:47 pm

2122M wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
2122M wrote:

Hate to break it to you, but we've had protests in the streets too, we're showing signs of recession too, we are in a huge amount of debt, and middle/lower class wages have been flat while prices have skyrocketed.

Seems the economy is on shaky ground everywhere. At least in Europe they are able to take care of their citizens during a global health pandemic a whole lot better than we can.


Antifa throwing eggs vs normal people aren't exactly protests in comparison to police actually fighting firefighters and cars set on fire for days at a time.
Apart from Charlottesville, US are boy scouts in comparison to what's happening in there.

End of last year.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kon0rmLQE7U
https://ocdn.eu/pulscms-transforms/1/fm ... QIAzQPAwsM


This is just the last few years:

2016 – Occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, January–February 2016. 1 killed and several dozen arrested at Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, Oregon.
2016 – 2016 Donald Trump Chicago rally protest, March 11. Five people arrested and two police officers injured during a demonstration at the UIC Pavilion.
2016 – Democracy Spring rally in April. March to Washington D.C. and sit-ins lead to arrests.
2016 – 2016 Sacramento riot, June 26, A confrontation between white nationalists and left-wing counter protesters at the California State Capitol. Ten people were hospitalized for stabbing and laceration wounds.
2016 – Widespread protests erupt in response to two deaths at the hands of police, the Shooting of Alton Sterling and shooting of Philando Castile. At least 261 people were arrested in protests in New York City, Chicago, St. Paul, Baton Rouge, and other cities.
2016 – 2016 Milwaukee riots, Sherman Park, August 13–15. Milwaukee, Wisconsin.
2016 – 2016 Charlotte riot, September 20–21, Protests and riots break out in response to the shooting of Keith Lamont Scott by a Charlotte police officer.
2016 – Dakota Access Pipeline protests, 411 protesters arrested. Multiple skirmishes with police, with vehicles, hay bales, and tires set on fire.
2016 – Anti-Trump protests, November 9–27. As a result of Donald Trump elected as 45th President of the U.S., thousands protested across twenty-five American cities, and unrest broke out in downtown Oakland, California, and Portland, Oregon. In Oakland, over 40 fires started and police officers were injured.
2017 – Berkeley, California, February 1, civil unrest ensued at UC Berkeley as Milo Yiannopoulos was scheduled to speak on the campus.[2][3]
2017 – 2017 Anaheim, California protests, February 21, protesters demonstrate after police officer grabs boy and fires his gun. Protesters damage property and throw bottles and rocks at police.
2017 – May Day, violence breaks out at May Day protests in Olympia, and Portland, as masked anarchists damage property and clash with police.
2017 – 2017 Unite the Right rally, Charlottesville, Virginia, August 11–12. At a Unite the Right rally of white nationalists and white supremacists opposing the removal of a statue of Robert E. Lee, rally attendees and counter-protesters clashed, sometimes violently. A woman, Heather Heyer, was killed and 19 other injured when a rally attendee drove his car into a crowd of counter-protestors. Two law enforcement officers also died in a helicopter crash while monitoring the event.
2017 – 2017 St. Louis protests, beginning September 15, large protests erupted when police officer Jason Stockley was found not guilty of murder in the shooting death of Anthony Lamar Smith on December 20, 2011. Some of the protests turned destructive and the police became violent. Windows were broken at Mayor Lyda Krewson's house and in the Central West End business district on the first night, many windows were broken in the Delmar Loop on Sept 16, a few were broken downtown on Sept 17 after police drove swiftly through a crowd following a peaceful march. Police conducted a kettling mass arrest operation of nonviolent protesters and bystanders, beating and pepper spraying many, including journalists, documentary filmmakers, and an undercover officer. Protests and sporadic unrest continued daily for weeks.
2019 – Memphis riot, June 13, following the fatal shooting of Brandon Webber by U.S. Marshals, Memphis, TN.


Mostly incident related and isolated events and not anti government unrest minus one when Trump was democratically (!!) elected. That one is TDS on full force with rainbows screaming to high havens.
So, random stuff over span of 4 years.

Yellow vests started in 2018 and are still going. Quite different reason too and certainly more unified.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_vests_movement
 
2122M
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:35 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:51 pm

PixelPilot wrote:
2122M wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:

Antifa throwing eggs vs normal people aren't exactly protests in comparison to police actually fighting firefighters and cars set on fire for days at a time.
Apart from Charlottesville, US are boy scouts in comparison to what's happening in there.

End of last year.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kon0rmLQE7U
https://ocdn.eu/pulscms-transforms/1/fm ... QIAzQPAwsM


This is just the last few years:

2016 – Occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, January–February 2016. 1 killed and several dozen arrested at Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, Oregon.
2016 – 2016 Donald Trump Chicago rally protest, March 11. Five people arrested and two police officers injured during a demonstration at the UIC Pavilion.
2016 – Democracy Spring rally in April. March to Washington D.C. and sit-ins lead to arrests.
2016 – 2016 Sacramento riot, June 26, A confrontation between white nationalists and left-wing counter protesters at the California State Capitol. Ten people were hospitalized for stabbing and laceration wounds.
2016 – Widespread protests erupt in response to two deaths at the hands of police, the Shooting of Alton Sterling and shooting of Philando Castile. At least 261 people were arrested in protests in New York City, Chicago, St. Paul, Baton Rouge, and other cities.
2016 – 2016 Milwaukee riots, Sherman Park, August 13–15. Milwaukee, Wisconsin.
2016 – 2016 Charlotte riot, September 20–21, Protests and riots break out in response to the shooting of Keith Lamont Scott by a Charlotte police officer.
2016 – Dakota Access Pipeline protests, 411 protesters arrested. Multiple skirmishes with police, with vehicles, hay bales, and tires set on fire.
2016 – Anti-Trump protests, November 9–27. As a result of Donald Trump elected as 45th President of the U.S., thousands protested across twenty-five American cities, and unrest broke out in downtown Oakland, California, and Portland, Oregon. In Oakland, over 40 fires started and police officers were injured.
2017 – Berkeley, California, February 1, civil unrest ensued at UC Berkeley as Milo Yiannopoulos was scheduled to speak on the campus.[2][3]
2017 – 2017 Anaheim, California protests, February 21, protesters demonstrate after police officer grabs boy and fires his gun. Protesters damage property and throw bottles and rocks at police.
2017 – May Day, violence breaks out at May Day protests in Olympia, and Portland, as masked anarchists damage property and clash with police.
2017 – 2017 Unite the Right rally, Charlottesville, Virginia, August 11–12. At a Unite the Right rally of white nationalists and white supremacists opposing the removal of a statue of Robert E. Lee, rally attendees and counter-protesters clashed, sometimes violently. A woman, Heather Heyer, was killed and 19 other injured when a rally attendee drove his car into a crowd of counter-protestors. Two law enforcement officers also died in a helicopter crash while monitoring the event.
2017 – 2017 St. Louis protests, beginning September 15, large protests erupted when police officer Jason Stockley was found not guilty of murder in the shooting death of Anthony Lamar Smith on December 20, 2011. Some of the protests turned destructive and the police became violent. Windows were broken at Mayor Lyda Krewson's house and in the Central West End business district on the first night, many windows were broken in the Delmar Loop on Sept 16, a few were broken downtown on Sept 17 after police drove swiftly through a crowd following a peaceful march. Police conducted a kettling mass arrest operation of nonviolent protesters and bystanders, beating and pepper spraying many, including journalists, documentary filmmakers, and an undercover officer. Protests and sporadic unrest continued daily for weeks.
2019 – Memphis riot, June 13, following the fatal shooting of Brandon Webber by U.S. Marshals, Memphis, TN.


Mostly incident related and isolated events and not anti government unrest minus one when Trump was democratically (!!) elected. That one is TDS on full force with rainbows screaming to high havens.
So, random stuff over span of 4 years.

Yellow vests started in 2018 and are still going. Quite different reason too and certainly more unified.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_vests_movement


Oh I'm sorry. Do the yellow vest protesters have MDS?

Are all the protests listed not also the people rising up against authority?

If you want to nick-pick the difference, go to town. But to suggest that Europe is crumbling while the US is doing great is just not accurate.
 
PixelPilot
Posts: 563
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:19 am

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:57 pm

2122M wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
2122M wrote:

This is just the last few years:

2016 – Occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, January–February 2016. 1 killed and several dozen arrested at Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, Oregon.
2016 – 2016 Donald Trump Chicago rally protest, March 11. Five people arrested and two police officers injured during a demonstration at the UIC Pavilion.
2016 – Democracy Spring rally in April. March to Washington D.C. and sit-ins lead to arrests.
2016 – 2016 Sacramento riot, June 26, A confrontation between white nationalists and left-wing counter protesters at the California State Capitol. Ten people were hospitalized for stabbing and laceration wounds.
2016 – Widespread protests erupt in response to two deaths at the hands of police, the Shooting of Alton Sterling and shooting of Philando Castile. At least 261 people were arrested in protests in New York City, Chicago, St. Paul, Baton Rouge, and other cities.
2016 – 2016 Milwaukee riots, Sherman Park, August 13–15. Milwaukee, Wisconsin.
2016 – 2016 Charlotte riot, September 20–21, Protests and riots break out in response to the shooting of Keith Lamont Scott by a Charlotte police officer.
2016 – Dakota Access Pipeline protests, 411 protesters arrested. Multiple skirmishes with police, with vehicles, hay bales, and tires set on fire.
2016 – Anti-Trump protests, November 9–27. As a result of Donald Trump elected as 45th President of the U.S., thousands protested across twenty-five American cities, and unrest broke out in downtown Oakland, California, and Portland, Oregon. In Oakland, over 40 fires started and police officers were injured.
2017 – Berkeley, California, February 1, civil unrest ensued at UC Berkeley as Milo Yiannopoulos was scheduled to speak on the campus.[2][3]
2017 – 2017 Anaheim, California protests, February 21, protesters demonstrate after police officer grabs boy and fires his gun. Protesters damage property and throw bottles and rocks at police.
2017 – May Day, violence breaks out at May Day protests in Olympia, and Portland, as masked anarchists damage property and clash with police.
2017 – 2017 Unite the Right rally, Charlottesville, Virginia, August 11–12. At a Unite the Right rally of white nationalists and white supremacists opposing the removal of a statue of Robert E. Lee, rally attendees and counter-protesters clashed, sometimes violently. A woman, Heather Heyer, was killed and 19 other injured when a rally attendee drove his car into a crowd of counter-protestors. Two law enforcement officers also died in a helicopter crash while monitoring the event.
2017 – 2017 St. Louis protests, beginning September 15, large protests erupted when police officer Jason Stockley was found not guilty of murder in the shooting death of Anthony Lamar Smith on December 20, 2011. Some of the protests turned destructive and the police became violent. Windows were broken at Mayor Lyda Krewson's house and in the Central West End business district on the first night, many windows were broken in the Delmar Loop on Sept 16, a few were broken downtown on Sept 17 after police drove swiftly through a crowd following a peaceful march. Police conducted a kettling mass arrest operation of nonviolent protesters and bystanders, beating and pepper spraying many, including journalists, documentary filmmakers, and an undercover officer. Protests and sporadic unrest continued daily for weeks.
2019 – Memphis riot, June 13, following the fatal shooting of Brandon Webber by U.S. Marshals, Memphis, TN.


Mostly incident related and isolated events and not anti government unrest minus one when Trump was democratically (!!) elected. That one is TDS on full force with rainbows screaming to high havens.
So, random stuff over span of 4 years.

Yellow vests started in 2018 and are still going. Quite different reason too and certainly more unified.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_vests_movement


Oh I'm sorry. Do the yellow vest protesters have MDS?

Are all the protests listed not also the people rising up against authority?

If you want to nick-pick the difference, go to town. But to suggest that Europe is crumbling while the US is doing great is just not accurate.


US was doing fine till CCP decided to cover up facts about the deadliest virus (according to media) of our generation. At that time EU was weakening by the day.
Those are facts.
I'm also sure as long as there's no lets go back to the old president that sold this country out sitting up top US will be back much stronger. Actually from Mexico to Canada things will get much better. At this point I would prefer Bernie vs Biden. And I genuinely do not like communists. Long term he would be lesser evil than Biden.
At least Bernie was always consistent in his believes.
 
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Aesma
Posts: 13022
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:26 pm

art wrote:
PixelPilot wrote:
Side effects already appearing?
Links to articles in the thread.

https://twitter.com/alexberenson/status ... 64577?s=21


2 recommendations for people who will not seek medical treatment for a medical problem due to being terrified by the prospect of contracting the virus:

1, don't be so fearful
2. learn to overcome your fears and behave normally in spite of being aware of a threat

If medics, bus drivers, supermarket checkout staff etc can carry on as usual, so can you!


For something like a heart attack, sure there is no hesitation to have. If you need cancer treatment neither (some of those have been postponed though, I feel they should be restarted ASAP).

Now if you had an appointment about your long term illness, that also happens to be a risk factor for COVID (diabetes, hypertension, obesity), maybe continuing with your usual treatment but skipping the appointments (or making them by phone) is not so inadvisable.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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Aesma
Posts: 13022
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:14 am

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:29 pm

PixelPilot : US was doing fine by printing tons of money and letting the rest of the world pay for it. And by polluting more than it should. And by strong arming countless countries (remember when Trump wanted to pump more oil to keep the price down ? That wasn't even long ago).
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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Tugger
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:29 pm

PixelPilot wrote:
At least Bernie was always consistent in his believes.

Then he is an outlier as essentially "consistency" is not a natural human state (on the individual level). We just aren't. Our big brain is very good at making exceptions, allowances and excuses. Consistency really is not a virtue. Being able to learn, understand and change is.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
There are many kinds of sentences that we think state facts about the world but that are really just expressions of our attitudes. - F. Ramsey
 
Chemist
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Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 4:46 am

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:11 pm

The US murder rate is 5-10x that of Europe. If you want to compare Europe to the US there are other measures as well. March was the first month in 18 years that there wasn't a school shooting in the US.
Scores dying all the time in the US from murders. And then let's talk medical bankruptcies. For the poor devils on ventilators, a huge number of those who survive will be financially wiped out.
Sure Europe has varied outcomes, just as the US states do. But overall Europe is more peaceful, lower crime, and they have longer life expectancies, even though they smoke a lot more.
 
PixelPilot
Posts: 563
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:19 am

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:24 pm

Chemist wrote:
The US murder rate is 5-10x that of Europe. If you want to compare Europe to the US there are other measures as well. March was the first month in 18 years that there wasn't a school shooting in the US.
Scores dying all the time in the US from murders. And then let's talk medical bankruptcies. For the poor devils on ventilators, a huge number of those who survive will be financially wiped out.
Sure Europe has varied outcomes, just as the US states do. But overall Europe is more peaceful, lower crime, and they have longer life expectancies, even though they smoke a lot more.


Maybe somebody should finally realize that gun free zones are a joke.
Data is out there.

Medical bankruptcies. Probably the biggest flaw of this country. It's a fact. Disgrace.
Peaceful as in getting mugged on the street or starting wars cause personally I feel safer here and I lived in three different EU countries apart from COB.
US has the worst food culture ever. Fact. But that is on individuals. There are two at this point healthy people in my family alone that are pushing mid 90s already.

Also quality of life here is much better than EU while holding same type of job position. My experience
 
GDB
Posts: 13661
Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 6:25 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:43 pm

WTF?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52476128

Vitally needed healthcare workers at home as their employers cannot pay them?
For profit healthcare in a 'wartime' situation.

Words fail....
 
AirWorthy99
Posts: 1085
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:57 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:50 pm

GDB wrote:
WTF?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52476128

Vitally needed healthcare workers at home as their employers cannot pay them?
For profit healthcare in a 'wartime' situation.

Words fail....


Hospitals are empty, no scenes of war or chaos. And not even the COVID situation is causing huge demand for hospital services. The healthcare industry is taking a beating too, since most people are not going to the hospital because they fear COVID.

the 1st quarter GDP results show
Most notably, health-care spending declined a sharp 2.3% despite an ongoing pandemic. Hospitals have canceled or delayed many elective procedures and patients have stayed away for fear of contracting the virus, causing many hospitals with relatively few coronavirus patients to lay off or furlough workers.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/gdp-s ... 2020-04-29

This crazy over reaction is not only causing long term health issues to those who aren't COVID positive, but for the future those who will use healthcare not related to COVID will be affected.

Those who thought that is worth tanking the economy over lives, did not think long term. As a result of this, more lives are affected and more people are to die from this over reaction in the long term.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister
 
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trpmb6
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:55 pm

So I thought I'd poke my head back in here to provide some anecdotal evidence. Recall, I'm from Kansas.

Two of my friends were very very ill in December. One just received an antibody test and tested positive for covid19 antibodies. The other one is being tested Wednesday, but considering her symptoms and that she was admitted to the hospital twice for viral pneumonia, we're confident she had it.

I went to the urgent care a week after she was admitted to the hospital. Had some rattle in my lungs but nothing too serious. I received a steroid shot and went about my life.

A week later my youngest son was admitted to the hospital with viral pneumonia. Both lungs hit hard and it peaked a couple days in. He was on oxygen for 6 days. Spent 7 days in the hospital.

I'm convinced I've had it, and all of my close friends. When this next friend comes back with positive antibodies, as we expect, I'll be getting tested.
 
PixelPilot
Posts: 563
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:19 am

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:56 pm

AirWorthy99 wrote:
GDB wrote:
WTF?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52476128

Vitally needed healthcare workers at home as their employers cannot pay them?
For profit healthcare in a 'wartime' situation.

Words fail....


Hospitals are empty, no scenes of war or chaos. And not even the COVID situation is causing huge demand for hospital services. The healthcare industry is taking a beating too, since most people are not going to the hospital because they fear COVID.

the 1st quarter GDP results show
Most notably, health-care spending declined a sharp 2.3% despite an ongoing pandemic. Hospitals have canceled or delayed many elective procedures and patients have stayed away for fear of contracting the virus, causing many hospitals with relatively few coronavirus patients to lay off or furlough workers.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/gdp-s ... 2020-04-29

This crazy over reaction is not only causing long term health issues to those who aren't COVID positive, but for the future those who will use healthcare not related to COVID will be affected.

Those who thought that is worth tanking the economy over lives, did not think long term. As a result of this, more lives are affected and more people are to die from this over reaction in the long term.


That's the plan. Ruin the economy so they can say it is Trumps fault you have no roof or food.
 
PixelPilot
Posts: 563
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:19 am

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:57 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
So I thought I'd poke my head back in here to provide some anecdotal evidence. Recall, I'm from Kansas.

Two of my friends were very very ill in December. One just received an antibody test and tested positive for covid19 antibodies. The other one is being tested Wednesday, but considering her symptoms and that she was admitted to the hospital twice for viral pneumonia, we're confident she had it.

I went to the urgent care a week after she was admitted to the hospital. Had some rattle in my lungs but nothing too serious. I received a steroid shot and went about my life.

A week later my youngest son was admitted to the hospital with viral pneumonia. Both lungs hit hard and it peaked a couple days in. He was on oxygen for 6 days. Spent 7 days in the hospital.

I'm convinced I've had it, and all of my close friends. When this next friend comes back with positive antibodies, as we expect, I'll be getting tested.


That's crazy. Good thing you all made it safe in the end.
 
User avatar
trpmb6
Posts: 3018
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:45 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:59 pm

Chemist wrote:
The US murder rate is 5-10x that of Europe. If you want to compare Europe to the US there are other measures as well. March was the first month in 18 years that there wasn't a school shooting in the US.
Scores dying all the time in the US from murders. And then let's talk medical bankruptcies. For the poor devils on ventilators, a huge number of those who survive will be financially wiped out.
Sure Europe has varied outcomes, just as the US states do. But overall Europe is more peaceful, lower crime, and they have longer life expectancies, even though they smoke a lot more.



The "March was the first month in 18 years that there wasn't a school shooting in the US" has been debunked.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/march ... -shooting/

Please research before sharing bad meme's from twitter and facebook.
 
AirWorthy99
Posts: 1085
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:57 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:04 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
So I thought I'd poke my head back in here to provide some anecdotal evidence. Recall, I'm from Kansas.

Two of my friends were very very ill in December. One just received an antibody test and tested positive for covid19 antibodies. The other one is being tested Wednesday, but considering her symptoms and that she was admitted to the hospital twice for viral pneumonia, we're confident she had it.

I went to the urgent care a week after she was admitted to the hospital. Had some rattle in my lungs but nothing too serious. I received a steroid shot and went about my life.

A week later my youngest son was admitted to the hospital with viral pneumonia. Both lungs hit hard and it peaked a couple days in. He was on oxygen for 6 days. Spent 7 days in the hospital.

I'm convinced I've had it, and all of my close friends. When this next friend comes back with positive antibodies, as we expect, I'll be getting tested.


Glad to hear you and your son are ok. If you come out positive, the good news for you is you need not worry for the second wave.

This seems to support the idea that COVID is already so widespread that the statistics are completely wrong.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister
 
GDB
Posts: 13661
Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 6:25 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:07 pm

Chemist wrote:
The US murder rate is 5-10x that of Europe. If you want to compare Europe to the US there are other measures as well. March was the first month in 18 years that there wasn't a school shooting in the US.
Scores dying all the time in the US from murders. And then let's talk medical bankruptcies. For the poor devils on ventilators, a huge number of those who survive will be financially wiped out.
Sure Europe has varied outcomes, just as the US states do. But overall Europe is more peaceful, lower crime, and they have longer life expectancies, even though they smoke a lot more.


And not only that, the taxes on tobacco taxes are much higher in Europe, (it was even a not that untrue joke in the 1980's political comedy 'Yes Minister' that the taxes from tobacco offset the negative health outcomes they cause, in a publicly funded healthcare system, not to mention fewer pensions to pay out).
Packaging in Europe is covered in lurid warnings and pictures, in the UK at least rates have been in sharp decline.
You won't see that in the US when Big Tobacco control so much of the political process, Jesse Helms, cracker tobacco pusher is long dead, he's had plenty of replacements.

Isn't weirdo Pence one of them?
 
AirWorthy99
Posts: 1085
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:57 pm

Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - April 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:16 pm

Chemist wrote:
The US murder rate is 5-10x that of Europe. If you want to compare Europe to the US there are other measures as well. March was the first month in 18 years that there wasn't a school shooting in the US.
Scores dying all the time in the US from murders. And then let's talk medical bankruptcies. For the poor devils on ventilators, a huge number of those who survive will be financially wiped out.
Sure Europe has varied outcomes, just as the US states do. But overall Europe is more peaceful, lower crime, and they have longer life expectancies, even though they smoke a lot more.


I think that's one of the only things to feel good about Europe now. Considering Europe has done rather worse than the US with this COVID situation, the lacks of beds and ventilators in Italy, France and Spain, and also deaths per capita are way much higher than the US when compared to Europe as a whole.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister

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