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continental004
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Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:26 pm

In the wild, in nature; the old, weak and sick are the first to die. The gene pool then gets strengthened.

We humans are no exception.

So we need to give up these draconian and communist restrictions on our movement and open up the world and our economy again.

The strong will survive.

There's no way we can stop it. Why are we messing with what we can't conquer?
 
BN747
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:30 pm

Bro, pass the dutchie 'pon the left-hand side..

..that's good smoke you got there..

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:39 pm

continental004 wrote:
In the wild, in nature; the old, weak and sick are the first to die. The gene pool then gets strengthened.

We humans are no exception.

So we need to give up these draconian and communist restrictions on our movement and open up the world and our economy again.

The strong will survive.

There's no way we can stop it. Why are we messing with what we can't conquer?




Ok, so firstly, I will point out that we do not live in the fucking wild. So there is that...

Nextly, for humans, the old and weak are not necessarily the least valuable members of the program. There are plenty of healthy bodies occupied by complete garbage minds. Ones that do not come close to being 'fittest'. And, I should point out, that they are not so easy to split off at first sight. As a substantially smarter than average human, if I recognize the embedded challenge there, it is a safe assumption that an indiscriminate virus will have an even harder time with that.

Lastly, I will point out that the people who say things like this somehow never seem to think this can apply to them too. This renders the entire "argument" intellectually dishonest.
"Nous ne sommes pas infectés. Il n'y a pas d'infection ici..."
 
continental004
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:43 pm

DarkSnowyNight wrote:
As a substantially smarter than average human


Sure Jan.
 
IFlyTWA
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:55 pm

BN747 wrote:
Bro, pass the dutchie 'pon the left-hand side..

..that's good smoke you got there..

BN747



Quarantine must have really got to him.
"To express the excitement of travel" - Eero Saarinen
 
BN747
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:10 pm

DarkSnowyNight wrote:
Nextly, for humans, the old and weak are not necessarily the least valuable members of the program. There are plenty of healthy bodies occupied by complete garbage minds. Ones that do not come close to being 'fittest'. And, I should point out, that they are not so easy to split off at first sight. As a substantially smarter than average human, if I recognize the embedded challenge there, it is a safe assumption that an indiscriminate virus will have an even harder time with that.


..and terribly weak feeble bodies with the most brilliant minds ever, like the late great theoretical physicist Steven Hawking.

No, we certainly do no obey the laws of nature. We've tinkered with it since we treated our first wound beyond licking it, like animals. We've extended our life expectancy, cured ourselves of nature-born lethal and harmful viruses..we've cheated nature and made our own rules to survive and prosper.

He misses the cro-magnon days...


BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
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stl07
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:16 pm

If you want to live like it is the wild, delete your account and never use the internet again, never go on an airplane again, move to the amazon or Alaska/Northern Canada, join a tribe, and hand-make your living space/hut and hunt for your food.

The average life expectancy for tribal life in the Amazon is 40. The average for the developed world is 70+. I think we are the ones that are doing it right
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
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jetwet1
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:40 pm

BN747 wrote:
Bro, pass the dutchie 'pon the left-hand side..

..that's good smoke you got there..

BN747


A dutchie is a food pot, not a bong.
 
BN747
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:47 pm

jetwet1 wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Bro, pass the dutchie 'pon the left-hand side..

..that's good smoke you got there..

BN747


A dutchie is a food pot, not a bong.


Do you know the song?
It's about the munchies from smoking weed...munchies means eating 'food'.. in case you are unaware.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
Dieuwer
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:51 pm

continental004 wrote:
In the wild, in nature; the old, weak and sick are the first to die. The gene pool then gets strengthened.

We humans are no exception.

So we need to give up these draconian and communist restrictions on our movement and open up the world and our economy again.

The strong will survive.

There's no way we can stop it. Why are we messing with what we can't conquer?


Is this a serious question or rhetorical?
Humans are emotional and sometimes rational beings. They typically don't like dying and don't like watching their loved ones die. Because often, death is accompanied by unpleasant (negative) emotions that humans want to avoid.
 
PPVRA
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 9:44 pm

The point is to escape from nature. That’s what the human race has been doing for ages—apply knowledge to escape from nature’s horrid diseases, famine, weather, etc.
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
NIKV69
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 9:55 pm

BN747 wrote:
jetwet1 wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Bro, pass the dutchie 'pon the left-hand side..

..that's good smoke you got there..

BN747


A dutchie is a food pot, not a bong.


Do you know the song?
It's about the munchies from smoking weed...munchies means eating 'food'.. in case you are unaware.

BN747


You sir win the thread again. I had to read that twice. :footinmouth:
I am the Googlizer!!!
 
TTailedTiger
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:08 pm

As I said before, the isolation measures won't be able to be maintained past the end of April. People won't stand for the mayors and governors continually extending it. At that point factions start forming and you will see the swift collapse of society. Better to adopt what Seeden is doing with tiered isolation and get everyone else back to work and life.
 
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SheikhDjibouti
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:27 pm

A lot of people have said a lot of things.

Some of those comments are destined not to age well.
Nothing to see here; move along please.
 
DLFREEBIRD
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:28 pm

continental004 wrote:

There's no way we can stop it. Why are we messing with what we can't conquer?


so you're ready to give up? when we haven't even reached the APEX?

l have faith in scientists, I don't have faith in stupid people or people who aren't willing to put up a fight.

If you listen to the scientists, you will be in more of a position to survive this.

regardless, things are not going back to the way they were before. you will have to adapt to survive.
that what's mankind has done throughout history.
 
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Revelation
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:29 pm

TTailedTiger wrote:
As I said before, the isolation measures won't be able to be maintained past the end of April. People won't stand for the mayors and governors continually extending it. At that point factions start forming and you will see the swift collapse of society. Better to adopt what Seeden is doing with tiered isolation and get everyone else back to work and life.

"People" need to take a chill pill. Being asked to isolate is not a big ask.
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has its beaches, its homeland and thoughts of its own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has its seasons, its evenings and songs of its own
 
TTailedTiger
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:33 pm

Revelation wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
As I said before, the isolation measures won't be able to be maintained past the end of April. People won't stand for the mayors and governors continually extending it. At that point factions start forming and you will see the swift collapse of society. Better to adopt what Seeden is doing with tiered isolation and get everyone else back to work and life.

"People" need to take a chill pill. Being asked to isolate is not a big ask.


It certainly is when you lose your job or business. Countries aren't even giving property tax rebates for businesses that they consider "non-essential" and force them to close. That isn't fair at all to be paying taxes on a building you are forbidden to use.
 
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scbriml
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:33 pm

TTailedTiger wrote:
As I said before, the isolation measures won't be able to be maintained past the end of April. People won't stand for the mayors and governors continually extending it. At that point factions start forming and you will see the swift collapse of society. Better to adopt what Seeden is doing with tiered isolation and get everyone else back to work and life.


Per capita, Sweden currently has 33% less Covid-19 cases but 50% more deaths than America, so that's not sounding like such a great policy, is it?
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
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TTailedTiger
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:34 pm

DLFREEBIRD wrote:
continental004 wrote:

There's no way we can stop it. Why are we messing with what we can't conquer?


so you're ready to give up? when we haven't even reached the APEX?

l have faith in scientists, I don't have faith in stupid people or people who aren't willing to put up a fight.

If you listen to the scientists, you will be in more of a position to survive this.

regardless, things are not going back to the way they were before. you will have to adapt to survive.
that what's mankind has done throughout history.


What is that supposed to mean? You think we will have to social distance for the rest of time?
 
TTailedTiger
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:37 pm

scbriml wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
As I said before, the isolation measures won't be able to be maintained past the end of April. People won't stand for the mayors and governors continually extending it. At that point factions start forming and you will see the swift collapse of society. Better to adopt what Seeden is doing with tiered isolation and get everyone else back to work and life.


Per capita, Sweden currently has 33% less Covid-19 cases but 50% more deaths than America, so that's not sounding like such a great policy, is it?


They will also be able to care for people having heart attacks, strokes, seizures, etc. The rest of the world is saying these people aren't worth saving because of the current pandemic. No hospital space for anyone else. They don't want to see their society collapse over one event.
 
LCDFlight
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:56 pm

It is kind of funny that people care so much about this, but not about obesity, inactivity, screen time, mental health... diabetes... hypertension, the things that are actually likely to kill them. The media has convinced people to care about this virus, but ordinarily, the irony is that most people do not take action to improve their health. It is not a top priority for most people.
 
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scbriml
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 10:59 pm

TTailedTiger wrote:
scbriml wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
As I said before, the isolation measures won't be able to be maintained past the end of April. People won't stand for the mayors and governors continually extending it. At that point factions start forming and you will see the swift collapse of society. Better to adopt what Seeden is doing with tiered isolation and get everyone else back to work and life.


Per capita, Sweden currently has 33% less Covid-19 cases but 50% more deaths than America, so that's not sounding like such a great policy, is it?


They will also be able to care for people having heart attacks, strokes, seizures, etc. The rest of the world is saying these people aren't worth saving because of the current pandemic. No hospital space for anyone else. They don't want to see their society collapse over one event.


You make lots of claims without any supporting links or evidence - who's said "these people aren't worth saving"? Which countries have no hospital space except for Covid-19 patients?

Sweden's healthcare system will be just as swamped as everyone else's, probably more so given their current numbers.
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TTailedTiger
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 11:05 pm

LCDFlight wrote:
It is kind of funny that people care so much about this, but not about obesity, inactivity, screen time, mental health... diabetes... hypertension, the things that are actually likely to kill them. The media has convinced people to care about this virus, but ordinarily, the irony is that most people do not take action to improve their health. It is not a top priority for most people.


Agreed on all points. Of course I'd rather eat a croissant with lots of butter every morning for breakfast but know that it's not good for your health. So I have my green smoothie with flax and chia seeds while the rest pack the drive thru every morning at McDonald's, Starbucks, etc. And then to the gym every night while the rest sit with with a bag of chips and whatever reality show is on. There's much more to be worried about than dying of coronavirus.
 
Jalap
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 11:16 pm

TTailedTiger wrote:
They will also be able to care for people having heart attacks, strokes, seizures, etc. The rest of the world is saying these people aren't worth saving because of the current pandemic. No hospital space for anyone else. They don't want to see their society collapse over one event.

The point of the measures taken is that our health system can take care of everybody who's in need.
Your preferred scenario is that corona patients die silently at home. I get that.
The "Bring out your dead" approach to save the Holy Economy.
 
Derico
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 11:27 pm

While the OP is fundamentally wrong (we still live in the jungle, but that doesn't mean we can have a little compassion and selflessness), I do understand the point of those against what has happened.

The reason the world has reacted to Coronavirus the way it has is really simple: To protect lives (noble), and just good old fear (natural).

People want to protect their loved ones, and that is understandable. This disease is not a threat to the species, but people don't want to die if it's preventable. Right now in many places you could die because you can't get simple treatment for ANY disease, since hospitals are full. Stay home helps alleviate this crisis. I agree that we can only lock down society for at most 90 days.

Second, the natural fear of the unknown. We know sugar, and AIDS, and all the other ones. People in Israel live in constant threat, they got used to it. People in many Muslim countries also live under threat of extremists, they got used to it. South Koreans live under constant threat, and got used to it. People in the US live under constant threat of random shooting, they got used to it. Rampant crime in some Latin American countries, yet people got used to it. Mass stabbings or using cars to plow thru crowds in Europe? People got used to living under that threat. The human mind can fight off incredible burdens, but is not very well suited to a brand new threat he doesn't understand, and the system reverts to a more typical "fight or flight".

As for eating habits and drugs, come on. Those are personal choices. You didn't randomly just overdose it was a personal choice and society should not really have to pay for it (even if I believe serious abusers forfeit their liberty and should be instituted).
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
BN747
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:16 am

One observation I've noted is that kids affected by this is planting a seed in their young minds to 'stay away from people'. I saw a woman walk into the middle of Wilshire blvd to get like 50' feet from an approaching Asian couple.

Humans, we are made with stupidity laced into our DNA, well since we're born ignorant I guess that's okay.

I'd like to hear a child psychiatrist /behavior specialist share the thoughts on this type of impact on kids, worldwide.

You guys do know that a infant will die if left without 'touch' after a lengthy period, right? Young children of course will not but they will adjust in a way I do noy see as a 'positive' adjustment. This speaks directly to the next generation, it'll be interesting what comes of it.
American kids like to play. I can't imagine my mom saying to 10yo BN747, you can't go play with Victor, Vernon and Ricky anymore and you certainly can't go over to their house.

I really cannot gauge how that would affect a young mind over a lifetime.

My cottonball pooch is totally confused, he's perplexed was why now only 1 out of 100 (or more) will pet him, even come near him (aside from his neighbor doggy pall peeps)
he's confused but when he gets attention, he hangs on for dear life.

There are sure to be noticeable effects on social behavior in the post-Corona world....and it's anyone guess.


BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
DLFREEBIRD
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:22 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
DLFREEBIRD wrote:
continental004 wrote:

There's no way we can stop it. Why are we messing with what we can't conquer?


so you're ready to give up? when we haven't even reached the APEX?

l have faith in scientists, I don't have faith in stupid people or people who aren't willing to put up a fight.

If you listen to the scientists, you will be in more of a position to survive this.

regardless, things are not going back to the way they were before. you will have to adapt to survive.
that what's mankind has done throughout history.


What is that supposed to mean? You think we will have to social distance for the rest of time?


I think you're injecting your worries, into something I didn't say. It will take as long as it needs to take. Right now 8 governors aren't even issuing stay at home directives. So we aren't on the same page, which will just drag this out and t hurt the economy even longer.
 
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Aesma
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:23 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
Revelation wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
As I said before, the isolation measures won't be able to be maintained past the end of April. People won't stand for the mayors and governors continually extending it. At that point factions start forming and you will see the swift collapse of society. Better to adopt what Seeden is doing with tiered isolation and get everyone else back to work and life.

"People" need to take a chill pill. Being asked to isolate is not a big ask.


It certainly is when you lose your job or business. Countries aren't even giving property tax rebates for businesses that they consider "non-essential" and force them to close. That isn't fair at all to be paying taxes on a building you are forbidden to use.


If you reopen too soon, with no consensus on the safety of doing that, while hospitals are overwhelmed, not only are you making things worse, but your business will not thrive, because a lot of people won't be stupid enough to go back to normal.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
rfields5421
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:34 am

continental004 wrote:
In the wild, in nature; the old, weak and sick are the first to die. The gene pool then gets strengthened.

There's no way we can stop it. Why are we messing with what we can't conquer?


1) You are talking about me personally. I don't like your hint for me to lay down and die !!!!!

2) If humans didn't fight against and try to change the world, you would not have electricity or connectivity to the internet. You might actually have to write a letter by hand and mail it.

3) Another thing, you tone suggests you believe that I'm taking up something that could save younger 'more productive' people.

4) I'm just hopeful to keep my sorry old carcass around to meet my first great granddaughter when she is born in late July.
Not all who wander are lost.
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:40 am

You are absolutely wrong. No vaccine, no medicine and no protection. What are we fighting?

All we are doing is panic buying, which is our second nature. Anything in short supply or on sale we have to buy and hoard. If 737MAX is on 99% discount, I might consider the possibility getting one and parking in the backyard. It may never fly or even kill me, but never pass on a good deal.

In the process we are interacting with more people than we generally do and spreading the virus.

So don't worry, we are not doing anything against nature.

And don't get disappointed if the survivors do not meet your criteria. Nature has a way to control who will survive. Case in point T-Rex is missing in action.
All posts are just opinions.
 
ChrisKen
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:25 am

BN747 wrote:
jetwet1 wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Bro, pass the dutchie kouchie 'pon the left-hand side..

..that's good smoke you got there..

BN747


A dutchie is a food pot, not a bong.


Do you know the song?
It's about the munchies from smoking weed...munchies means eating 'food'.. in case you are unaware.

BN747

Corrected that for you BN747

"Pass the dutchie" (Musical Youth) was about being poor and starving, with all references to drugs removed. 'Dutchie' is patois for a type of cooking pot (Dutch Oven).
'Pass the dutchie' was a cover of the original, "Pass the kouchie" by the Mighty Diamonds.
"Kouchie" is slang for "pot in which marijuana is kept" or pot pipe.

The original version is about drugs, it's more famous cover isn't (although oft mistaken for being so).
 
BN747
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:41 am

ChrisKen wrote:
BN747 wrote:
jetwet1 wrote:

A dutchie is a food pot, not a bong.


Do you know the song?
It's about the munchies from smoking weed...munchies means eating 'food'.. in case you are unaware.

BN747

Corrected that for you BN747

"Pass the dutchie" (Musical Youth) was about being poor and starving, with all references to drugs removed. 'Dutchie' is patois for a type of cooking pot (Dutch Oven).
'Pass the dutchie' was a cover of the original, "Pass the kouchie" by the Mighty Diamonds.
"Kouchie" is slang for "pot in which marijuana is kept" or pot pipe.

The original version is about drugs, it's more famous cover isn't (although oft mistaken for being so).[/quote


Thanks, but if you're a stoner and I take it you're not, that song is like the stoner National Anthem, is it not?

Umm, if you say 'Kouchie' in America, an unknown woman just my smack you across the face....
..you know that, right?

But if you say it twice and snap your fingers...then it's a song, by Charo.

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
jetwet1
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:08 am

BN747 wrote:
jetwet1 wrote:
BN747 wrote:
Bro, pass the dutchie 'pon the left-hand side..

..that's good smoke you got there..

BN747


A dutchie is a food pot, not a bong.


Do you know the song?
It's about the munchies from smoking weed...munchies means eating 'food'.. in case you are unaware.

BN747


Musical Youth, 1982, a rewrite of Pass the Kutchie by Mighty Diamonds 1981

Yes I know the song, I'm English, it got a lot of radio play and of course, TOTP.

A dutchie is a Jamacian cooking pot, a kutchie a Jamacian slang for a pot that holds pot.
 
BN747
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:37 am

jetwet1 wrote:
BN747 wrote:
jetwet1 wrote:

A dutchie is a food pot, not a bong.


Do you know the song?
It's about the munchies from smoking weed...munchies means eating 'food'.. in case you are unaware.

BN747


Musical Youth, 1982, a rewrite of Pass the Kutchie by Mighty Diamonds 1981

Yes I know the song, I'm English, it got a lot of radio play and of course, TOTP.

A dutchie is a Jamacian cooking pot, a kutchie a Jamacian slang for a pot that holds pot.


Oh so it is a bong in english terminology then?



Ok Chris wrote 'Kouchie' the first time, which is a homonym American counter part that spelled differently but pronounced the same.

But thanks for the clarity Jetwet1!

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
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Aesma
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:57 am

dtw2hyd wrote:
You are absolutely wrong. No vaccine, no medicine and no protection. What are we fighting?

All we are doing is panic buying, which is our second nature. Anything in short supply or on sale we have to buy and hoard. If 737MAX is on 99% discount, I might consider the possibility getting one and parking in the backyard. It may never fly or even kill me, but never pass on a good deal.

In the process we are interacting with more people than we generally do and spreading the virus.

So don't worry, we are not doing anything against nature.

And don't get disappointed if the survivors do not meet your criteria. Nature has a way to control who will survive. Case in point T-Rex is missing in action.


Personally I take it very seriously, I haven't panic bought anything, I have had only a couple of large deliveries, I shop as little as possible...

I live with someone at high risk of death from this thing.

As long as my government takes this seriously, then I can telework, so there is also that.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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T18
Posts: 534
Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2009 12:28 am

Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:13 am

Correct me if I misunderstand but isn't the point of all these closures and stay home orders just to spread out the time period over which it spreads to allow for a lesser load on the medical facilities for those who need intervention so we can hopefully assist as many as possible in recovery from infection, where as with out any precaution it would be likely a shorter period of infections but, the numbers could easily overwhelm the facilities and that could lead to people who could have recovered dying due to a lack of resources available to assist them. As far as I understood we are seeking to flatten the curve but that does not mean fewer people will get sick, just they will not all be sick at once.
“Racing's important to men who do it well. When you're racing, it's life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting.” ― Steve McQueen (Le Mans) 1971
 
petertenthije
Posts: 3922
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2001 10:00 pm

Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:11 am

continental004 wrote:
There's no way we can stop it. Why are we messing with what we can't conquer?

By that logic, we might as well:
  • Stop building dykes and dams, eventually there will be a bigger flood;
  • Stop making house earthquake proof, eventually there will be a bigger earthquake;
  • Stop making storm shelters, eventually there will be a bigger storm;
  • Stop having a military, eventually someone will have a better gun/warship/fighter;
  • Stop banning drugs, people will use it anyway;
  • Stop having a police force, criminals will be criminals.

I think you’ll get my point by now.

But hey, above suggestions would save billions. Sure, in the long term it would cost trillions... but you only care for the next quarterly results right?
Attamottamotta!
 
T4thH
Posts: 1049
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:17 pm

Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:42 pm

T18 wrote:
Correct me if I misunderstand but isn't the point of all these closures and stay home orders just to spread out the time period over which it spreads to allow for a lesser load on the medical facilities for those who need intervention so we can hopefully assist as many as possible in recovery from infection, where as with out any precaution it would be likely a shorter period of infections but, the numbers could easily overwhelm the facilities and that could lead to people who could have recovered dying due to a lack of resources available to assist them. As far as I understood we are seeking to flatten the curve but that does not mean fewer people will get sick, just they will not all be sick at once.


Yes...3/4 correct. If it is slowed down, also few less will get sick, till the herd immunity level will be reached.
If it is not slowed down, so a high level of the population is contagious at the same time, there is only a marginal chance, that someone will not get in contact with someone, who is contagious, even when everyone, who feels ill (so has symptoms), stays home. I have read somewhere (more than one source, but will now not search for it), that one COVID-19 infects in average 3 others, but 2 of them, prior any symptoms are developed. And there are super-spreader, who infect dozens or hundreds....
Always remind, everyone, who is living together with others, regular called family, if one of them get it, all of them will get in contact, so in most cases 100% will get it.
So, as long someone is not living in a sparely populated area, most will get in direct contact with COVID-19., let us say, 80% of the population, till the herd immunity will finally and late stop the spreading. It is also just because One is in average infecting more than three, perhaps 5?

If it is tried to flatter the curve, everyone takes care and social distancing is done, there is a higher chance, that some will escape and not got it, till the herd immunity level is reached and the spreading slows down and stops. So herd immunity level will be reached at 60%, so one will infect only two?
 
Scorpio
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:38 pm

TTailedTiger wrote:

They will also be able to care for people having heart attacks, strokes, seizures, etc. The rest of the world is saying these people aren't worth saving because of the current pandemic. No hospital space for anyone else. They don't want to see their society collapse over one event.

Um, you know you've got that the other way around, right? It's when you don't take measures and let the pandemic simply run its course, as you are suggesting we do, that hospitals will no longer be able to care for people having heart attacks, strokes, seizures etc due to a ridiculous influx of Covid-patients. Hell, they won't even be able to care for all the Covid cases coming in.
 
continental004
Topic Author
Posts: 435
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2014 11:53 pm

Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:20 am

Seriously though, let the olds die. It'll save us taxpayers countless $$$ if we don't have to pay for so many pensions.
 
continental004
Topic Author
Posts: 435
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2014 11:53 pm

Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:27 am

petertenthije wrote:
Stop banning drugs, people will use it anyway


Actually we should decriminialize drugs.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:28 am

Scorpio wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:

They will also be able to care for people having heart attacks, strokes, seizures, etc. The rest of the world is saying these people aren't worth saving because of the current pandemic. No hospital space for anyone else. They don't want to see their society collapse over one event.

Um, you know you've got that the other way around, right? It's when you don't take measures and let the pandemic simply run its course, as you are suggesting we do, that hospitals will no longer be able to care for people having heart attacks, strokes, seizures etc due to a ridiculous influx of Covid-patients. Hell, they won't even be able to care for all the Covid cases coming in.


Huh, but I thought the benefit of a private healthcare system is that we never have to ration? It was all lies! :dopey:
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stl07
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:47 am

continental004 wrote:
Seriously though, let the olds die. It'll save us taxpayers countless $$$ if we don't have to pay for so many pensions.

Are you willing to die over some stupid virus that will be over in 3-6 months
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
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TTailedTiger
Posts: 2519
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:13 am

stl07 wrote:
continental004 wrote:
Seriously though, let the olds die. It'll save us taxpayers countless $$$ if we don't have to pay for so many pensions.

Are you willing to die over some stupid virus that will be over in 3-6 months


Well we keep building deathrap skyscrapers even though we know above a certain floor will die in an emergency.

Six months of no one working will mean we are in a depression we will never recovers from. Just like a Democrat to keep kicking the can. First it was two weeks of isolation and now it's six months. There is nothing more precious than our civil rights. Thousands died protecting them and now they are ripped away.
 
MoonC
Posts: 338
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 1:26 am

Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:56 am

Let the old die this, let the old die that. Those pushing this idea don't see to grasp that this virus does NOT only kill the old or those with underlying conditions. They are the major part of the deceased, yes, but far from being the only ones. So really, if you are of any age range and pushing the idea of a particular segment of the population dying...show the way and start with yourself!
 
tommy1808
Posts: 13237
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 11:16 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
stl07 wrote:
continental004 wrote:
Seriously though, let the olds die. It'll save us taxpayers countless $$$ if we don't have to pay for so many pensions.

Are you willing to die over some stupid virus that will be over in 3-6 months


Well we keep building deathrap skyscrapers even though we know above a certain floor will die in an


No, we don't. Skyscrapers are so freaking expensive to build, not because they are high, but because you have to make sure that everyone can get to safety, responders can safely move in the building and what not in all normal emergencies. Being on the ground floor will do didely squat for you when a plane crashes onto your house, so Skyscrapers don't have to survive that either.

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 8350
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Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 1:11 pm

Aesma wrote:
Personally I take it very seriously, I haven't panic bought anything, I have had only a couple of large deliveries, I shop as little as possible...

I live with someone at high risk of death from this thing.

As long as my government takes this seriously, then I can telework, so there is also that.


Apologies, every one should take this seriously.

I am still not sure TS intentions, hence my sarcasm. Is the thread started after sudden enlightenment or after finding some historical references which will be offensive to discuss. Or just a clickbait thread, I was not sure.

If the goal of this thread is to claim it will be the survival of the fittest, my point is it will be survival of the smartest, even weaker/vulnerable sections of the society will survive by just being smart.

If you see Michigan's stats, even though fatality rates are tracks age, infection rates of older age groups are way low.

This virus spares no one, if an young person gets infected and suffers lung damage, that is a life time illness. It is not pretty living with 40% lung capacity.
All posts are just opinions.
 
winginit
Posts: 2868
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:23 pm

Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:17 pm

TTailedTiger wrote:
Six months of no one working will mean we are in a depression we will never recovers from.


What? You're aware that entire European nations who have been literally destroyed numerous times over have recovered and yet you're saying that six months of quarantine (which is not 'no one working', obviously) will lead to a depression that we will never recover from? That's... an uninformed take.

continental004 wrote:
The strong will survive.


dtw2hyd wrote:
If the goal of this thread is to claim it will be the survival of the fittest, my point is it will be survival of the smartest, even weaker/vulnerable sections of the society will survive by just being smart.


It's all hypothetical as society is not going to collapse, but as it very often has been at least throughout modern history it would be neither survival of the fittest nor survival of the smartest - it would be survival of the richest.
 
cpd
Posts: 6413
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:46 am

Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 8:02 pm

TTailedTiger wrote:
stl07 wrote:
continental004 wrote:
Seriously though, let the olds die. It'll save us taxpayers countless $$$ if we don't have to pay for so many pensions.

Are you willing to die over some stupid virus that will be over in 3-6 months


Well we keep building deathrap skyscrapers even though we know above a certain floor will die in an emergency.

Six months of no one working will mean we are in a depression we will never recovers from. Just like a Democrat to keep kicking the can. First it was two weeks of isolation and now it's six months. There is nothing more precious than our civil rights. Thousands died protecting them and now they are ripped away.


The removal of our freedoms wouldn’t have happened if people would have listened to the guidelines. But no, they didn’t. The crowded the beaches, they crowded the cafes and restaurants, etc. Is your decaf extra weak soy latte that important to risk the health and wellbeing of the rest of us?

You are going to have to live with these restrictions for a while for the better of everyone. You have to remain stoic.

You sound like one of those whining lefties. You can’t let the conservative side down like that.

This also doesn’t just affect the old, the young are also dieing from this.
 
TTailedTiger
Posts: 2519
Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2018 5:19 am

Re: Why are we going so hard against nature fighting Covid-19 like we are doing?

Mon Apr 06, 2020 9:56 pm

cpd wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
stl07 wrote:
Are you willing to die over some stupid virus that will be over in 3-6 months


Well we keep building deathrap skyscrapers even though we know above a certain floor will die in an emergency.

Six months of no one working will mean we are in a depression we will never recovers from. Just like a Democrat to keep kicking the can. First it was two weeks of isolation and now it's six months. There is nothing more precious than our civil rights. Thousands died protecting them and now they are ripped away.


The removal of our freedoms wouldn’t have happened if people would have listened to the guidelines. But no, they didn’t. The crowded the beaches, they crowded the cafes and restaurants, etc. Is your decaf extra weak soy latte that important to risk the health and wellbeing of the rest of us?

You are going to have to live with these restrictions for a while for the better of everyone. You have to remain stoic.

You sound like one of those whining lefties. You can’t let the conservative side down like that.

This also doesn’t just affect the old, the young are also dieing from this.


I'm not the only one who agrees these restrictions can't go on for long. Depression, cabin fever, looting, domestic violence, civil unrest, etc are all brewing. Most are just not going to accept being on house arrest indefinitely.

There's a reason Trump hoped to be past the worst by Easter. And it was nothing to do with his ego. When these mayors and governors tell people they can't worship their God together and can't even gather as families, that's going to be the final straw for many. Some cops will undoubtedly try and enter private homes I'd they think there are more than ten people inside. It's going to get very ugly, very quickly.

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