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PPVRA
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Fri May 08, 2020 11:00 pm

Denmark opened hair dressers two weeks ago, apparently.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-52360452


Friend of mine in Austria got a hair cut earlier this week.
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
ltbewr
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Fri May 08, 2020 11:12 pm

SheikhDjibouti wrote:
DLFREEBIRD wrote:
my neighbor a physician just returned from NYC.  

 This is what she wrote in a mass email to probably everyone she knows.
..
..

Probably one of the best posts I have read on this subject.

Thankyou. Both of you. Very much.


I agree that is an excellent summary of this crises at this time and how to approach it.
 
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SheikhDjibouti
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Fri May 08, 2020 11:13 pm

casinterest wrote:
With the relaxed social distancing guidelines across most of the states, the US will be under close watch for the next two weeks.

As will every other country. This isn't just a US thing.

All round the world leaders are tripping over each other not to be the last to relax their lockdowns. That would be political suicide.
And note; science has got absolutely nothing to do with it.

Hell, take the United Kingdom, which is anything but "United".

Boris Johnson is on record that he will make a big announcement on Sunday; so have a guess what Wales has done to steal his thunder?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52584690
(to be fair, it is only a modest change, but it sets the tone)

It's a bit like a game of poker; the best Prime Minister Boris can do now is "see" the Welsh proposal. But if he wants to remain top dog he will have to raise the bar with even greater concessions for his English fan base.
And if he doesn't, there's always the risk of Civil War. Come on you Roundheads.... :stirthepot:

The problem is we are betting with people's lives here.
Nothing to see here; move along please.
 
Jalap
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sat May 09, 2020 12:02 am

SheikhDjibouti wrote:
The problem is we are betting with people's lives here.

Yes. But there is no other way. A 3 month total global lockdown is impossible.

As for the poker analogy, all cards will be called in the end.
Politicians need to make their bets now. The more loose measures get, the more lives they put on the table.
Most countries do seem to be very reluctant to put many lives on the table. Others seem prepared to bet on far more lives

It's impossible to tell today what the results will be. But in the end, all hands will be called.
As for the political suicide, it's the ones putting the most lives on the table that are the most at risk for a suicide. It is extremely short term thinking to release measures for political gain now. Because your hand will be called before the next election.
 
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Revelation
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sat May 09, 2020 6:22 pm

https://erinbromage.wixsite.com/covid19 ... avoid-them is a really well written article with practical information on what kinds of day to day situations can cause high virus transmission and which ones should not.

A lot of stuff I've read has lists of do's and don'ts, what makes this one different is it gives the why's and why not's, complete with numbers that can help you visualize why some things are relatively high risk and others are relatively low risk.

In short, grocery stores and walks outside are relatively low risk, while bars, restaurants, hair salons and many work environments where you spend long periods of time with less than ideal air circulation are higher risk. You want to avoid long encounters in places with low air circulation and limited air volume.
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
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Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has its seasons, its evenings and songs of its own
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sat May 09, 2020 9:57 pm

Revelation wrote:
https://erinbromage.wixsite.com/covid19/post/the-risks-know-them-avoid-them is a really well written article with practical information on what kinds of day to day situations can cause high virus transmission and which ones should not.

A lot of stuff I've read has lists of do's and don'ts, what makes this one different is it gives the why's and why not's, complete with numbers that can help you visualize why some things are relatively high risk and others are relatively low risk.

In short, grocery stores and walks outside are relatively low risk, while bars, restaurants, hair salons and many work environments where you spend long periods of time with less than ideal air circulation are higher risk. You want to avoid long encounters in places with low air circulation and limited air volume.


Thanks for the post. I read, some time in very late March, that 75% social distancing would result in an R0 of less than one, so determined to go for 80%. I did ramp it up over the next two weeks. I still have decided that I would not go for 100%, 99 for the most part, but added 2 people to those I am going to spend time with. Our county of Kitsap with 25K military workers (who never stopped working, but a lot of monitoring, testing, and when needed isolation), uniformed and civilian, and 275K people are running less than one new case a day. I think my precautions reflect what most of them are doing. This is a solvable problem. Hard, but not impossible.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
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casinterest
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sat May 09, 2020 10:29 pm

SheikhDjibouti wrote:
casinterest wrote:
With the relaxed social distancing guidelines across most of the states, the US will be under close watch for the next two weeks.

As will every other country. This isn't just a US thing.

All round the world leaders are tripping over each other not to be the last to relax their lockdowns. That would be political suicide.
And note; science has got absolutely nothing to do with it.

Hell, take the United Kingdom, which is anything but "United".

Boris Johnson is on record that he will make a big announcement on Sunday; so have a guess what Wales has done to steal his thunder?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52584690
(to be fair, it is only a modest change, but it sets the tone)

It's a bit like a game of poker; the best Prime Minister Boris can do now is "see" the Welsh proposal. But if he wants to remain top dog he will have to raise the bar with even greater concessions for his English fan base.
And if he doesn't, there's always the risk of Civil War. Come on you Roundheads.... :stirthepot:

The problem is we are betting with people's lives here.


I just worrry that we will rush Phase 2 and be in even deeper trouble.
I noticed today in the US as I went around that more people were out and about and there are more gatherings in driveways of people hanging out .

Couple that with day cares reopening and people going back to work that probably don't want to lose their job, and we have a ripe opportunity for the spread to keep going.


At some point tonight, the US will pass 80,000 deaths.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
PPVRA
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sat May 09, 2020 11:29 pm

casinterest wrote:
SheikhDjibouti wrote:
casinterest wrote:
With the relaxed social distancing guidelines across most of the states, the US will be under close watch for the next two weeks.

As will every other country. This isn't just a US thing.

All round the world leaders are tripping over each other not to be the last to relax their lockdowns. That would be political suicide.
And note; science has got absolutely nothing to do with it.

Hell, take the United Kingdom, which is anything but "United".

Boris Johnson is on record that he will make a big announcement on Sunday; so have a guess what Wales has done to steal his thunder?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52584690
(to be fair, it is only a modest change, but it sets the tone)

It's a bit like a game of poker; the best Prime Minister Boris can do now is "see" the Welsh proposal. But if he wants to remain top dog he will have to raise the bar with even greater concessions for his English fan base.
And if he doesn't, there's always the risk of Civil War. Come on you Roundheads.... :stirthepot:

The problem is we are betting with people's lives here.


I just worrry that we will rush Phase 2 and be in even deeper trouble.
I noticed today in the US as I went around that more people were out and about and there are more gatherings in driveways of people hanging out .

Couple that with day cares reopening and people going back to work that probably don't want to lose their job, and we have a ripe opportunity for the spread to keep going.


At some point tonight, the US will pass 80,000 deaths.


People are out but they’re practicing social distancing, they’re wearing masks, etc. do the same and when fall comes around, get the flu shot.
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
PPVRA
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sun May 10, 2020 2:54 am

Great interview with Sweden’s Dr. Anders Tegnell:

https://youtu.be/x8J9CvgB1AE
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
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DIRECTFLT
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sun May 10, 2020 6:16 pm

More jobs for Texas...Thanks !!! :D

Elon Musk says will move Tesla out of California amid lockdown dispute

https://www.businessinsider.com/califor ... row-2020-5

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzrTCt3rH4k
Smoothest Ride so far ~ AA A300B4-600R ~~ Favorite Aviation Author ~ Robert J. Serling
 
PPVRA
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sun May 10, 2020 7:05 pm

Apple’s version of location/quarantine data:

https://www.apple.com/covid19/mobility
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
Chemist
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sun May 10, 2020 7:19 pm

If I read the Apple data correctly, the US is approaching its normal levels unlike many European countries. Hopefully some masks will still slow things down, but between the mixed government messages and higher population, I'm expecting many, many more deaths and the US to lead that for quite some time to come.
 
flyguy89
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sun May 10, 2020 7:35 pm

Chemist wrote:
If I read the Apple data correctly, the US is approaching its normal levels unlike many European countries. Hopefully some masks will still slow things down, but between the mixed government messages and higher population, I'm expecting many, many more deaths and the US to lead that for quite some time to come.

I believe the EU is leading in cases and deaths currently if you're keeping score.
 
flyguy89
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sun May 10, 2020 7:52 pm

casinterest wrote:
SheikhDjibouti wrote:
casinterest wrote:
With the relaxed social distancing guidelines across most of the states, the US will be under close watch for the next two weeks.

As will every other country. This isn't just a US thing.

All round the world leaders are tripping over each other not to be the last to relax their lockdowns. That would be political suicide.
And note; science has got absolutely nothing to do with it.

Hell, take the United Kingdom, which is anything but "United".

Boris Johnson is on record that he will make a big announcement on Sunday; so have a guess what Wales has done to steal his thunder?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52584690
(to be fair, it is only a modest change, but it sets the tone)

It's a bit like a game of poker; the best Prime Minister Boris can do now is "see" the Welsh proposal. But if he wants to remain top dog he will have to raise the bar with even greater concessions for his English fan base.
And if he doesn't, there's always the risk of Civil War. Come on you Roundheads.... :stirthepot:

The problem is we are betting with people's lives here.


I just worrry that we will rush Phase 2 and be in even deeper trouble.
I noticed today in the US as I went around that more people were out and about and there are more gatherings in driveways of people hanging out .

Couple that with day cares reopening and people going back to work that probably don't want to lose their job, and we have a ripe opportunity for the spread to keep going.


At some point tonight, the US will pass 80,000 deaths.

This virus is likely going to be with us for a long time to come. We're going to have to learn to live with it at some point. An effective vaccine is still very much an if. We flattened the curve. Now time to figure out how to live with it.
 
olle
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sun May 10, 2020 8:22 pm

flyguy89 wrote:
casinterest wrote:
SheikhDjibouti wrote:
As will every other country. This isn't just a US thing.

All round the world leaders are tripping over each other not to be the last to relax their lockdowns. That would be political suicide.
And note; science has got absolutely nothing to do with it.

Hell, take the United Kingdom, which is anything but "United".

Boris Johnson is on record that he will make a big announcement on Sunday; so have a guess what Wales has done to steal his thunder?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52584690
(to be fair, it is only a modest change, but it sets the tone)

It's a bit like a game of poker; the best Prime Minister Boris can do now is "see" the Welsh proposal. But if he wants to remain top dog he will have to raise the bar with even greater concessions for his English fan base.
And if he doesn't, there's always the risk of Civil War. Come on you Roundheads.... :stirthepot:

The problem is we are betting with people's lives here.


I just worrry that we will rush Phase 2 and be in even deeper trouble.
I noticed today in the US as I went around that more people were out and about and there are more gatherings in driveways of people hanging out .

Couple that with day cares reopening and people going back to work that probably don't want to lose their job, and we have a ripe opportunity for the spread to keep going.


At some point tonight, the US will pass 80,000 deaths.

This virus is likely going to be with us for a long time to come. We're going to have to learn to live with it at some point. An effective vaccine is still very much an if. We flattened the curve. Now time to figure out how to live with it.


Europe start to open up.

Germany now has a R number of 1.1

With an vaccine 12 month away there will be outbreaks until the immunity is start to give effect.

The model seems to be to keep a R number on a level where hospitals can handle the situation until this happens.
 
MareBorealis
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sun May 10, 2020 9:26 pm

New data available how COVID-19 has effected people in EU, by Eurofound.
https://www.eurofound.europa.eu/sites/d ... 0058en.pdf

A couple of examples:

Trust in the healthcare system, the top/bottom five countries:

-Malta
-Denmark
-Finland
-Spain
-Austria
----------------
-Slovakia
-Romania
-Poland
-Bulgaria
-Hungary

Proportion of workers who started teleworking as a result of COVID-19, the countries above 50 percent and below 30 percent:

-Finland
-Luxembourg
-Netherlands
-Belgium
----------------
-Bulgaria
-Hungary
-Croatia
-Greece
-Romania
 
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seb146
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sun May 10, 2020 10:33 pm

DIRECTFLT wrote:
More jobs for Texas...Thanks !!! :D

Elon Musk says will move Tesla out of California amid lockdown dispute

https://www.businessinsider.com/califor ... row-2020-5

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzrTCt3rH4k


And when people are too sick to work? Or, better yet, when the Board sets up a fully automated factory employing 20 or so people, let's see the celebrations then....
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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seb146
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Sun May 10, 2020 10:38 pm

Can someone explain how "no shirt, no shoes, no service" didn't have anyone marching with their guns into capital buildings and calling for mass boycotts but, all of a sudden, being asked to wear a mask is a threat to our rights and way of life? Can someone explain how we can not get testing any time we want as we were promised by the occupant of the White House but he and those around him at the very top are tested every single day? Can someone explain how we have trillions of dollars to shell out to huge corporations but have to constantly cut programs like CDC funding and Medicare?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
Concierge
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 2:40 am

As someone teleworking and at no risk of job loss, I know I am fortunate.

For teleworkers out there, do you think your employer is likely to make this permanent - after COVID?

Where I work, space has been reduced and teleworking is encouraged, but not required. I don't enjoy it. Is this the new normal?

I am an old BTW ;)
 
Newark727
Posts: 2003
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 3:29 am

DIRECTFLT wrote:
More jobs for Texas...Thanks !!! :D

Elon Musk says will move Tesla out of California amid lockdown dispute

https://www.businessinsider.com/califor ... row-2020-5

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzrTCt3rH4k


Difficult to imagine the cost of pulling up sticks exceeding the cost of staying put even with the lockdown. I guess as long as more venture capital money is coming in that doesn't matter?
 
Chemist
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 4:21 am

seb146 wrote:
Can someone explain how "no shirt, no shoes, no service" didn't have anyone marching with their guns into capital buildings and calling for mass boycotts but, all of a sudden, being asked to wear a mask is a threat to our rights and way of life? Can someone explain how we can not get testing any time we want as we were promised by the occupant of the White House but he and those around him at the very top are tested every single day? Can someone explain how we have trillions of dollars to shell out to huge corporations but have to constantly cut programs like CDC funding and Medicare?


Not to mention involuntary military draft in the 1960's. Somehow that was ok, but rules far less onerous to help protect the country today are taking away rights.
 
flyguy89
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 4:38 am

Concierge wrote:
As someone teleworking and at no risk of job loss, I know I am fortunate.

For teleworkers out there, do you think your employer is likely to make this permanent - after COVID?

Where I work, space has been reduced and teleworking is encouraged, but not required. I don't enjoy it. Is this the new normal?

I am an old BTW ;)

Nah. Most everyone I've talked to hates teleworking as well and can't wait to get back to the office. Collaboration was so much easier. The only thing we do all seem to say is that it would be nice to have the option to work from home 1 day a week maybe.
 
olle
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 5:56 am

Concierge wrote:
As someone teleworking and at no risk of job loss, I know I am fortunate.

For teleworkers out there, do you think your employer is likely to make this permanent - after COVID?

Where I work, space has been reduced and teleworking is encouraged, but not required. I don't enjoy it. Is this the new normal?

I am an old BTW ;)


When employers recognize that the same amount of work can be executed with less (expensive) office floor space, the answer will be yes.

I think that this crisis will make many people able to move to smaller well connected cities, your house will need to have space for having your office area, construction of offices in the major cities will slow down when companies more go over to use office floor space for meeting rooms, temporal office space for days that you visit office.

Organisations will require a new kind of management, and sitting on your chair 8 hours per day will suddenly not mean that you have worked efficient 8 hours. Meetings will become more efficient. UK and US is from my experience a business culture where endless meetings rules.
 
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Francoflier
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 6:18 am

flyguy89 wrote:
This virus is likely going to be with us for a long time to come. We're going to have to learn to live with it at some point. An effective vaccine is still very much an if. We flattened the curve. Now time to figure out how to live with it.


Exactly.

Lockdowns have worked where they were implemented early enough, and in other places they have managed to flatten the curve and not completely overwhelm hospitals.
They are not a long term solution. Past a few weeks, maybe a couple of months, you lose the population's will to cooperate and create yourself an economic disaster that are going to have lifetime consequences for a vast majority of families.

Science may want them to go on, but the issue is that science has no other answers. There is no cure, no vaccine, and it may a long while before one comes around. Until then, the virus will continue to make its way through the population, lockdown or not. And medical science completely ignores the side and after effects of such dramatic lockdowns, as it is not its area of expertise.

We have to learn to live with it by finding measures that limit the transmission rate while allowing people to live their lives as much as possible and, as nasty as it may be, not treat this thing as if it was the Zombie apocalypse the media would love us to believe it is.

olle wrote:
Europe start to open up.

Germany now has a R number of 1.1

With an vaccine 12 month away there will be outbreaks until the immunity is start to give effect.

The model seems to be to keep a R number on a level where hospitals can handle the situation until this happens.


It is way too early to establish a post-lockdown R value, and this figure was extrapolated over a few days only.
These are the actual figures for Germany:
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavir ... y/germany/

There is no clear increase in daily cases, just the usual up and down cycle that occurs every week where less cases are reported over the weekend. Not to mention that with long incubation periods, such a trend would take a lot longer to materialize.
More dramatization by the media, which thrives on keeping people scared and which is disheartening to see.

Germany has done an excellent job in managing the outbreak so far, aside from being late to detect it, like all other western nations.
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
flyguy89
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 7:36 am

Francoflier wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
This virus is likely going to be with us for a long time to come. We're going to have to learn to live with it at some point. An effective vaccine is still very much an if. We flattened the curve. Now time to figure out how to live with it.


Exactly.

Lockdowns have worked where they were implemented early enough, and in other places they have managed to flatten the curve and not completely overwhelm hospitals.
They are not a long term solution. Past a few weeks, maybe a couple of months, you lose the population's will to cooperate and create yourself an economic disaster that are going to have lifetime consequences for a vast majority of families.

Science may want them to go on, but the issue is that science has no other answers. There is no cure, no vaccine, and it may a long while before one comes around. Until then, the virus will continue to make its way through the population, lockdown or not. And medical science completely ignores the side and after effects of such dramatic lockdowns, as it is not its area of expertise.

We have to learn to live with it by finding measures that limit the transmission rate while allowing people to live their lives as much as possible and, as nasty as it may be, not treat this thing as if it was the Zombie apocalypse the media would love us to believe

:checkmark:

And all of this isn't to say not to take it seriously. The vast majority of the population will now take precautions (better hygiene, increased sanitizing standards, distancing and mask-wearing where appropriate), testing is being expanded rapidly (not where it should be, but getting there), contact tracing protocols implemented.

There is still plenty we're learning about the virus, but we do know who is most vulnerable and can take more targeted protective measures. We'll very likely also get better at treating COVID. Otherwise, we have to go on. This isn't about "sacrificing the old to save the economy." We can take reasonable and effective measures to protect grandma (and should!) without blanket, draconian, and economically devastating lockdowns. Continuing to shelter in place indefinitely to try to eradicate it or until a vaccine arrives are just not viable options however.
 
tommy1808
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 7:50 am

flyguy89 wrote:
Francoflier wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
This virus is likely going to be with us for a long time to come. We're going to have to learn to live with it at some point. An effective vaccine is still very much an if. We flattened the curve. Now time to figure out how to live with it.


Exactly.

Lockdowns have worked where they were implemented early enough, and in other places they have managed to flatten the curve and not completely overwhelm hospitals.
They are not a long term solution. Past a few weeks, maybe a couple of months, you lose the population's will to cooperate and create yourself an economic disaster that are going to have lifetime consequences for a vast majority of families.

Science may want them to go on, but the issue is that science has no other answers. There is no cure, no vaccine, and it may a long while before one comes around. Until then, the virus will continue to make its way through the population, lockdown or not. And medical science completely ignores the side and after effects of such dramatic lockdowns, as it is not its area of expertise.

We have to learn to live with it by finding measures that limit the transmission rate while allowing people to live their lives as much as possible and, as nasty as it may be, not treat this thing as if it was the Zombie apocalypse the media would love us to believe

:checkmark:

And all of this isn't to say not to take it seriously. The vast majority of the population will now take precautions (better hygiene, increased sanitizing standards, distancing and mask-wearing where appropriate),.


The Problem is that "Vast Majority" is not good enough for a virus that is this contagious, a small group of people can screw it up for everyone with ease.

This is how far people got within a few weeks from one meat packing plant:

Image

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
jodieellis
Posts: 35
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 9:49 am

Well, I feel bad for myself since there is no where I can go out of my own house. 2020 seems like the worst year to me. There is more of hates for 2020 than 2019.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 12:43 pm

PPVRA wrote:
casinterest wrote:
SheikhDjibouti wrote:
As will every other country. This isn't just a US thing.

All round the world leaders are tripping over each other not to be the last to relax their lockdowns. That would be political suicide.
And note; science has got absolutely nothing to do with it.

Hell, take the United Kingdom, which is anything but "United".

Boris Johnson is on record that he will make a big announcement on Sunday; so have a guess what Wales has done to steal his thunder?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-52584690
(to be fair, it is only a modest change, but it sets the tone)

It's a bit like a game of poker; the best Prime Minister Boris can do now is "see" the Welsh proposal. But if he wants to remain top dog he will have to raise the bar with even greater concessions for his English fan base.
And if he doesn't, there's always the risk of Civil War. Come on you Roundheads.... :stirthepot:

The problem is we are betting with people's lives here.


I just worrry that we will rush Phase 2 and be in even deeper trouble.
I noticed today in the US as I went around that more people were out and about and there are more gatherings in driveways of people hanging out .

Couple that with day cares reopening and people going back to work that probably don't want to lose their job, and we have a ripe opportunity for the spread to keep going.


At some point tonight, the US will pass 80,000 deaths.


People are out but they’re practicing social distancing, they’re wearing masks, etc. do the same and when fall comes around, get the flu shot.


But they aren't . And the fall and flu doesn't matter for Covid.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 12:45 pm

olle wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
casinterest wrote:

I just worrry that we will rush Phase 2 and be in even deeper trouble.
I noticed today in the US as I went around that more people were out and about and there are more gatherings in driveways of people hanging out .

Couple that with day cares reopening and people going back to work that probably don't want to lose their job, and we have a ripe opportunity for the spread to keep going.


At some point tonight, the US will pass 80,000 deaths.

This virus is likely going to be with us for a long time to come. We're going to have to learn to live with it at some point. An effective vaccine is still very much an if. We flattened the curve. Now time to figure out how to live with it.


Europe start to open up.

Germany now has a R number of 1.1

With an vaccine 12 month away there will be outbreaks until the immunity is start to give effect.

The model seems to be to keep a R number on a level where hospitals can handle the situation until this happens.



And that is going to be the trick. The balancing point between economy, education, and health, are something that requires a full hands on approach by multiple government agencies. The US has a problem with that right now .
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
PPVRA
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 12:54 pm

casinterest wrote:
PPVRA wrote:
casinterest wrote:

I just worrry that we will rush Phase 2 and be in even deeper trouble.
I noticed today in the US as I went around that more people were out and about and there are more gatherings in driveways of people hanging out .

Couple that with day cares reopening and people going back to work that probably don't want to lose their job, and we have a ripe opportunity for the spread to keep going.


At some point tonight, the US will pass 80,000 deaths.


People are out but they’re practicing social distancing, they’re wearing masks, etc. do the same and when fall comes around, get the flu shot.


But they aren't . And the fall and flu doesn't matter for Covid.


Flu shots keep people out of the hospital.
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
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casinterest
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 1:17 pm

PPVRA wrote:
casinterest wrote:
PPVRA wrote:

People are out but they’re practicing social distancing, they’re wearing masks, etc. do the same and when fall comes around, get the flu shot.


But they aren't . And the fall and flu doesn't matter for Covid.


Flu shots keep people out of the hospital.



But that doesn't help with the Covid issue. The Flu is the Flu, and is minimal compared to Covid,
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
flyguy89
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 3:49 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
Francoflier wrote:

Exactly.

Lockdowns have worked where they were implemented early enough, and in other places they have managed to flatten the curve and not completely overwhelm hospitals.
They are not a long term solution. Past a few weeks, maybe a couple of months, you lose the population's will to cooperate and create yourself an economic disaster that are going to have lifetime consequences for a vast majority of families.

Science may want them to go on, but the issue is that science has no other answers. There is no cure, no vaccine, and it may a long while before one comes around. Until then, the virus will continue to make its way through the population, lockdown or not. And medical science completely ignores the side and after effects of such dramatic lockdowns, as it is not its area of expertise.

We have to learn to live with it by finding measures that limit the transmission rate while allowing people to live their lives as much as possible and, as nasty as it may be, not treat this thing as if it was the Zombie apocalypse the media would love us to believe

:checkmark:

And all of this isn't to say not to take it seriously. The vast majority of the population will now take precautions (better hygiene, increased sanitizing standards, distancing and mask-wearing where appropriate),.


The Problem is that "Vast Majority" is not good enough for a virus that is this contagious, a small group of people can screw it up for everyone with ease.

This is how far people got within a few weeks from one meat packing plant:

Image

best regards
Thomas

It's going to have to be enough in conjunction with other measures. There is no other alternative unfortunately.
 
GDB
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 4:52 pm

Be afraid, be very afraid, (if you've seen the Black Mirror episode 'Metalhead');

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/technolog ... apore-park

(That companies products reportedly inspired Charlie Brooker to write that one).
 
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ER757
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 7:15 pm

Concierge wrote:
As someone teleworking and at no risk of job loss, I know I am fortunate.

For teleworkers out there, do you think your employer is likely to make this permanent - after COVID?

Where I work, space has been reduced and teleworking is encouraged, but not required. I don't enjoy it. Is this the new normal?

I am an old BTW ;)

I believe it may become a permanent thing for a good number of folks. Before the lockdown, I worked at home 2 days a week, and now it's all the time (since early March). The lease at our office is up at the end of the year and they are looking at a smaller space to move to figuring some people can indeed work from home full time. I have about a yer and a half until retirement (although that's tentative now depending on where the economy goes) so pretty sure they'll want me to be one of the off-site people which is fine by me. If I never see the inside of our office again, I'd be fine with it
 
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casinterest
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 7:43 pm

ER757 wrote:
Concierge wrote:
As someone teleworking and at no risk of job loss, I know I am fortunate.

For teleworkers out there, do you think your employer is likely to make this permanent - after COVID?

Where I work, space has been reduced and teleworking is encouraged, but not required. I don't enjoy it. Is this the new normal?

I am an old BTW ;)

I believe it may become a permanent thing for a good number of folks. Before the lockdown, I worked at home 2 days a week, and now it's all the time (since early March). The lease at our office is up at the end of the year and they are looking at a smaller space to move to figuring some people can indeed work from home full time. I have about a yer and a half until retirement (although that's tentative now depending on where the economy goes) so pretty sure they'll want me to be one of the off-site people which is fine by me. If I never see the inside of our office again, I'd be fine with it



I had this discussion with a colleague, and both of us are enjoying not having to commute to work. It frees up some time. However it does also keep us a from concentrating on some needed work in the labs.

I may go back to a one or two day a week office trip from here on out .
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 7:55 pm

casinterest wrote:
ER757 wrote:
Concierge wrote:
As someone teleworking and at no risk of job loss, I know I am fortunate.

For teleworkers out there, do you think your employer is likely to make this permanent - after COVID?

Where I work, space has been reduced and teleworking is encouraged, but not required. I don't enjoy it. Is this the new normal?

I am an old BTW ;)

I believe it may become a permanent thing for a good number of folks. Before the lockdown, I worked at home 2 days a week, and now it's all the time (since early March). The lease at our office is up at the end of the year and they are looking at a smaller space to move to figuring some people can indeed work from home full time. I have about a yer and a half until retirement (although that's tentative now depending on where the economy goes) so pretty sure they'll want me to be one of the off-site people which is fine by me. If I never see the inside of our office again, I'd be fine with it



I had this discussion with a colleague, and both of us are enjoying not having to commute to work. It frees up some time. However it does also keep us a from concentrating on some needed work in the labs.

I may go back to a one or two day a week office trip from here on out .


You're old and supposed to be set in your ways. LOL. More seriously, as we get older we also have learned that things change, we have to adapt. The world (culture, society etc) does not care whether we like it or not.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
ltbewr
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 8:54 pm

frmrCapCadet wrote:
casinterest wrote:
ER757 wrote:
I believe it may become a permanent thing for a good number of folks. Before the lockdown, I worked at home 2 days a week, and now it's all the time (since early March). The lease at our office is up at the end of the year and they are looking at a smaller space to move to figuring some people can indeed work from home full time. I have about a yer and a half until retirement (although that's tentative now depending on where the economy goes) so pretty sure they'll want me to be one of the off-site people which is fine by me. If I never see the inside of our office again, I'd be fine with it

I had this discussion with a colleague, and both of us are enjoying not having to commute to work. It frees up some time. However it does also keep us a from concentrating on some needed work in the labs.
I may go back to a one or two day a week office trip from here on out .

You're old and supposed to be set in your ways. LOL. More seriously, as we get older we also have learned that things change, we have to adapt. The world (culture, society etc) does not care whether we like it or not.


I too am 65 years old, hope to be on the payroll until next spring (66 years old) and working since 3/16 at home with an provided computer. I like working from home mainly as only have a 5 second commute, only a short walk to the loo, no bosses or annoying co-workers hanging around, have a window unlike my work station, At some point I will have to be physically in my office to work with documents, perhaps 2-3 times a week and have some verbal contact with co-workers that I miss, but I am very concerned about ever returning to the physical office, mainly due to the commute on public transit until a vaccine or numbers of infections or deaths drop to normal flu levels. Then there is the danger of a 2nd round of infections. I live in NJ and work in NYC, have to use a bus to NYC PABT then a NYC Subway to my workplace. It will be almost impossible to keep safe distance in transit as businesses open up, many more will be going to work as have to for financial survival.
I do expect that many employers, including governments, will cut their staff numbers as the pandemic continues and even after 'normal' returns due to massive revenue drops, productivity improvements.
 
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DIRECTFLT
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 9:46 pm

Newark727 wrote:
DIRECTFLT wrote:
More jobs for Texas...Thanks !!! :D

Elon Musk says will move Tesla out of California amid lockdown dispute

https://www.businessinsider.com/califor ... row-2020-5

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzrTCt3rH4k


Difficult to imagine the cost of pulling up sticks exceeding the cost of staying put even with the lockdown. I guess as long as more venture capital money is coming in that doesn't matter?


I'm just guessing, but Elon could be thinking forward to possible closures in the Fall, if there's resurgence, or even more forward to the next pandemic that comes along. Ans so Elon may feel that Texas is willing to stay open when California, isn't.
Smoothest Ride so far ~ AA A300B4-600R ~~ Favorite Aviation Author ~ Robert J. Serling
 
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ER757
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 11:16 pm

frmrCapCadet wrote:
casinterest wrote:
ER757 wrote:
I believe it may become a permanent thing for a good number of folks. Before the lockdown, I worked at home 2 days a week, and now it's all the time (since early March). The lease at our office is up at the end of the year and they are looking at a smaller space to move to figuring some people can indeed work from home full time. I have about a yer and a half until retirement (although that's tentative now depending on where the economy goes) so pretty sure they'll want me to be one of the off-site people which is fine by me. If I never see the inside of our office again, I'd be fine with it



I had this discussion with a colleague, and both of us are enjoying not having to commute to work. It frees up some time. However it does also keep us a from concentrating on some needed work in the labs.

I may go back to a one or two day a week office trip from here on out .


You're old and supposed to be set in your ways. LOL. More seriously, as we get older we also have learned that things change, we have to adapt. The world (culture, society etc) does not care whether we like it or not.

Yes, I am most definitely old :old: and yeah, set in my ways is a pretty apt description. But over the years working at the company I am employed by (36 years and counting) it's that you have to be open to change. My job now is almost nothing like it was 6 or 7 year ago, let alone 20. Be flexible or be gone, and I am not quite ready for the latter just yet.
 
PPVRA
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Mon May 11, 2020 11:37 pm

“Over the weekend, police in London said they were “losing the battle” in parks as hundreds of people ignored social distancing rules to enjoy the Bank Holiday weekend sunshine.

Pictures on social media showed large groups of people sat on the grass eating pizza and drinking beer as the police looked on.“

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/0 ... -lockdown/
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
tommy1808
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Tue May 12, 2020 5:37 am

flyguy89 wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
:checkmark:

And all of this isn't to say not to take it seriously. The vast majority of the population will now take precautions (better hygiene, increased sanitizing standards, distancing and mask-wearing where appropriate),.


The Problem is that "Vast Majority" is not good enough for a virus that is this contagious, a small group of people can screw it up for everyone with ease.

This is how far people got within a few weeks from one meat packing plant:

Image

best regards
Thomas

It's going to have to be enough in conjunction with other measures. There is no other alternative unfortunately.


yeah.. it has to. I agree you can not lock down indefinitely. But other measures means "test and trace", while the current admins approach seems to ramp up claiming the number of death is in fact much, much lower.....

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
olle
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Re: COVID-19 Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Tue May 12, 2020 10:59 am

UK has got 46500 excess death compared to earlier years during the Corona outbreak;

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/heal ... 09871.html
 
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Tugger
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Tue May 12, 2020 3:04 pm

casinterest wrote:
PPVRA wrote:
casinterest wrote:

But they aren't . And the fall and flu doesn't matter for Covid.


Flu shots keep people out of the hospital.



But that doesn't help with the Covid issue. The Flu is the Flu, and is minimal compared to Covid,

While I think I know what you mean, I will note that you are wrong that the flu shot doesn't help with the COVID issue. And PPVRA is right that the shot reduces the number of people with the flu and therefore that potentially have to go to the hospital. That directly impacts capacity within the medical system, and freeing up capacity improves the ability of the system to handle a COVID outbreak. You are also removing another vector for the virus to get into the public (people in the hospitals) and the number with "underlying health issues that can be exposed as well. Less people reduces the path for the virus to get out.

So while the regular flu vaccine doesn't help directly prevent COVID-19, it can help the overall system better manage. And that is a good thing.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
There are many kinds of sentences that we think state facts about the world but that are really just expressions of our attitudes. - F. Ramsey
 
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casinterest
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Tue May 12, 2020 3:07 pm

Tugger wrote:
casinterest wrote:
PPVRA wrote:

Flu shots keep people out of the hospital.



But that doesn't help with the Covid issue. The Flu is the Flu, and is minimal compared to Covid,

While I think I know what you mean, I will note that you are wrong that the flu shot doesn't help with the COVID issue. And PPVRA is right that the shot reduces the number of people with the flu and therefore that potentially have to go to the hospital. That directly impacts capacity within the medical system, and freeing up capacity improves the ability of the system to handle a COVID outbreak. You are also removing another vector for the virus to get into the public (people in the hospitals) and the number with "underlying health issues that can be exposed as well. Less people reduces the path for the virus to get out.

So while the regular flu vaccine doesn't help directly prevent COVID-19, it can help the overall system better manage. And that is a good thing.

Tugg


The Flu is the Flu, but at the same time. While we are practicing Social distancing we are also hammering down on the spread of the Flu. I will assert, that for the next year or so, the Flu numbers are going to be way down. Getting the vaccine may be a good idea, but it will not be tantamount this year. Social distancing will result in a reduction of many virus related illnesses. However , I do wonder if accidents are going to be up a bit, as I notice a lot more bikers and risk taking fitness programs .
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
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Francoflier
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Tue May 12, 2020 3:31 pm

casinterest wrote:

The Flu is the Flu, but at the same time. While we are practicing Social distancing we are also hammering down on the spread of the Flu. I will assert, that for the next year or so, the Flu numbers are going to be way down. Getting the vaccine may be a good idea, but it will not be tantamount this year. Social distancing will result in a reduction of many virus related illnesses.


That may not be a good thing on the long term...

Lockdowns and all the measures destined to contain the spread of SARS CoV-2 do also contain the spread of a host of other pathogens which we all normally happily share and which, crucially, continually update our individual 'virus database'.
I remember hearing a few specialists mentioning that this is a factor that should not be forgotten among all this. It might be a much lesser worry at the moment, but hiding from the World and all the billions of nasty little bugs we are constantly crossing path with in our day to day lives does nothing to enhance our overall immunity to them, at least if this keeps up for a while.

Additionally, by hiding from them, we are selectively training other viruses like the flu to become a lot more contagious.
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
StarAC17
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Tue May 12, 2020 3:37 pm

olle wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
casinterest wrote:

I just worrry that we will rush Phase 2 and be in even deeper trouble.
I noticed today in the US as I went around that more people were out and about and there are more gatherings in driveways of people hanging out .

Couple that with day cares reopening and people going back to work that probably don't want to lose their job, and we have a ripe opportunity for the spread to keep going.


At some point tonight, the US will pass 80,000 deaths.

This virus is likely going to be with us for a long time to come. We're going to have to learn to live with it at some point. An effective vaccine is still very much an if. We flattened the curve. Now time to figure out how to live with it.


Europe start to open up.

Germany now has a R number of 1.1

With an vaccine 12 month away there will be outbreaks until the immunity is start to give effect.

The model seems to be to keep a R number on a level where hospitals can handle the situation until this happens.


So that would say that it is time for a cautious reopening, an R0 of 1.1 is consistent with the flu not the R0 of 2 and 4 that initially was the estimated reproductive number. The reality is that Covid-19 is likely going to be an endemic Coronavirus unless a vaccine can eradicate any possible mutation faster than the virus can mutate. H1N1 is endemic and that is the flu strain that caused the Spanish Flu.

According the the special episode of Explained on this the other four coronaviruses that cause colds give an immunity of 1-2 years so I would say Covid would have the same more than likely. I am tired of the media treating this as some super-bug with no evidence to suggest it is.

I do fear however that any new cases are just going to freak out the politicians and the health officials. Yes if you see a constant exponential uptick then put some restrictions back in but a stable number should be manageable for the health care systems. It also adds in some degree of herd immunity to those who get mild cases that don't require hospitalization. Not facing the virus is kicking the can down the road and it could turn out that Sweden is right.

Speaking of Germany they had reported that they had 236 new cases yesterday, that is with a population of 83,000,000. Ontario, Canada is getting 100 to 200 more than that in a day with a population of 14,500,000 and is testing way less than Germany. I would say Germany has got this and we should be following what they are doing.

We are also now seeing in New York that those who are staying home are getting a good chunk of cases.

https://www.timesunion.com/news/article ... 250457.php

PPVRA wrote:
“Over the weekend, police in London said they were “losing the battle” in parks as hundreds of people ignored social distancing rules to enjoy the Bank Holiday weekend sunshine.

Pictures on social media showed large groups of people sat on the grass eating pizza and drinking beer as the police looked on.“

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/0 ... -lockdown/


Similar photo from Vancouver.

https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/soc ... 4495e46d62

These photos can be misleading unless you are up close to people. They looked close together from the photographers perspective but that beach is probably several thousand square feet or larger, 6 feet is minuscule in that perspective. When I go the beach, I am usually 6 feet apart from friends to begin with just because there is so much space.
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Tugger
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Tue May 12, 2020 3:40 pm

casinterest wrote:
Tugger wrote:
casinterest wrote:


But that doesn't help with the Covid issue. The Flu is the Flu, and is minimal compared to Covid,

While I think I know what you mean, I will note that you are wrong that the flu shot doesn't help with the COVID issue. And PPVRA is right that the shot reduces the number of people with the flu and therefore that potentially have to go to the hospital. That directly impacts capacity within the medical system, and freeing up capacity improves the ability of the system to handle a COVID outbreak. You are also removing another vector for the virus to get into the public (people in the hospitals) and the number with "underlying health issues that can be exposed as well. Less people reduces the path for the virus to get out.

So while the regular flu vaccine doesn't help directly prevent COVID-19, it can help the overall system better manage. And that is a good thing.

Tugg


The Flu is the Flu, but at the same time. While we are practicing Social distancing we are also hammering down on the spread of the Flu. I will assert, that for the next year or so, the Flu numbers are going to be way down. Getting the vaccine may be a good idea, but it will not be tantamount this year. Social distancing will result in a reduction of many virus related illnesses. However , I do wonder if accidents are going to be up a bit, as I notice a lot more bikers and risk taking fitness programs .

Yes, the overall massive reduction in general activity by the public has equally reduced the number of people being injured. Sports injuries are the most common and though as you point out some are now beginning to be reengaged, and with that comes resulting injuries, the overall volume is still way down. No children's sports or hobby leagues, no weekend get-togethers by groups to go hiking, no training regimines for any of this including semi pro and professional elements. All this "normal" injury activity is currently missing at hospitals. Then throw in the cancellation of most/all elective surgeries and procedures and combine the reduction in interaction which leads to "normal" infection loads and used capacity is just blasted and reduced incredibly.

I am not sure how much this was considered as they considered hospital capacity impacts and being overwhelmed by COVID patients. Better to be more prepared, so it was right to plan for a bad COVID impact.

Supplies have been a more critical choke point. Of course much of that is due to the lack of leadership and coordination from the feds on this (mostly due our dear "head in the sand" leader). Had they been smart, they would have coordinated providing and using avaiable supplies where they were needed. Instead we ended up with an all out fight between all communities and states for whatever supplies were available. That was beyond stupid and only made the situation much worse.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
There are many kinds of sentences that we think state facts about the world but that are really just expressions of our attitudes. - F. Ramsey
 
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casinterest
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Tue May 12, 2020 6:00 pm

Tugger wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Tugger wrote:
While I think I know what you mean, I will note that you are wrong that the flu shot doesn't help with the COVID issue. And PPVRA is right that the shot reduces the number of people with the flu and therefore that potentially have to go to the hospital. That directly impacts capacity within the medical system, and freeing up capacity improves the ability of the system to handle a COVID outbreak. You are also removing another vector for the virus to get into the public (people in the hospitals) and the number with "underlying health issues that can be exposed as well. Less people reduces the path for the virus to get out.

So while the regular flu vaccine doesn't help directly prevent COVID-19, it can help the overall system better manage. And that is a good thing.

Tugg


The Flu is the Flu, but at the same time. While we are practicing Social distancing we are also hammering down on the spread of the Flu. I will assert, that for the next year or so, the Flu numbers are going to be way down. Getting the vaccine may be a good idea, but it will not be tantamount this year. Social distancing will result in a reduction of many virus related illnesses. However , I do wonder if accidents are going to be up a bit, as I notice a lot more bikers and risk taking fitness programs .

Yes, the overall massive reduction in general activity by the public has equally reduced the number of people being injured. Sports injuries are the most common and though as you point out some are now beginning to be reengaged, and with that comes resulting injuries, the overall volume is still way down. No children's sports or hobby leagues, no weekend get-togethers by groups to go hiking, no training regimines for any of this including semi pro and professional elements. All this "normal" injury activity is currently missing at hospitals. Then throw in the cancellation of most/all elective surgeries and procedures and combine the reduction in interaction which leads to "normal" infection loads and used capacity is just blasted and reduced incredibly.

I am not sure how much this was considered as they considered hospital capacity impacts and being overwhelmed by COVID patients. Better to be more prepared, so it was right to plan for a bad COVID impact.

Supplies have been a more critical choke point. Of course much of that is due to the lack of leadership and coordination from the feds on this (mostly due our dear "head in the sand" leader). Had they been smart, they would have coordinated providing and using avaiable supplies where they were needed. Instead we ended up with an all out fight between all communities and states for whatever supplies were available. That was beyond stupid and only made the situation much worse.

Tugg


Supplies are a problem, but Trump is working on his smoke bombs to divert attention.

Meanwhile Pence is socially distancing from Trump due to the Covid Cases in the White House.
Fauci is testifying that opening the economy will result in needless deaths, and right now there are many rural hotspots occurring where the local authorities are flouting federal and state guidelines.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
flyguy89
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Tue May 12, 2020 6:15 pm

casinterest wrote:
Fauci is testifying that opening the economy will result in needless deaths, and right now there are many rural hotspots occurring where the local authorities are flouting federal and state guidelines.

With all due respect, that is not at all what Fauci is saying. He cautioned against reopening too quickly, and that strong contact tracing protocols and social distancing measures should be in place to prevent hospitals from becoming overwhelmed.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Coronavirus Non Aviation Thread - May 2020

Tue May 12, 2020 6:30 pm

flyguy89 wrote:
casinterest wrote:
Fauci is testifying that opening the economy will result in needless deaths, and right now there are many rural hotspots occurring where the local authorities are flouting federal and state guidelines.

With all due respect, that is not at all what Fauci is saying. He cautioned against reopening too quickly, and that strong contact tracing protocols and social distancing measures should be in place to prevent hospitals from becoming overwhelmed.


Really?

https://news.yahoo.com/fauci-warns-quic ... 13231.html

Why else would the GOP sit there any attack his statements on opening the economy?
Where ever you go, there you are.
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Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos