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Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Tue May 05, 2020 11:45 pm
by CitizenJustin
Mysteriously is a good word, but I think we know the real story here. All three doctors criticized the Russian government and their response to Covid19. One doctor fell just shortly after making a video recanting his accusations and saying he was stressed. Does Putin think the world is stupid, or does he just not care about appearing civilized anymore?

Also, Russia reported 10,000 new cases in the past 24 hours. It’s clear that whatever they’re doing isn’t working, so why not listen to the experts, instead of pushing them out of windows?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6AgnbMx3ME

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Tue May 05, 2020 11:55 pm
by Newark727
The difference between open and closed societies, between authoritarian and democratic regimes, isn't, and has never been, whether the trains run on time. It's whether pointing to the empty train station platform can get you arrested, or not.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 1:10 am
by GDB
He doesn't care, after all, just over two years ago one innocent British citizen was murdered, another suffered the effects of, a chemical attack on a English city in a botched attempt to kill a long inactive turned agent.
Knowing full well we had started to burn our bridges with our European allies, (though in fact they were supportive) and he had a buffoonish Kompromat in the White House.

Falling out of the windows in his Russia has become a bit of a tradition, usually reserved for investigative journalists.
Still, all his boiling, conspiracy theory based resentments, from his time as a middling KGB man, isn't helping with Covid is it?
Pity if Vlad got a dose, or poetic.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 1:32 am
by Francoflier
CitizenJustin wrote:
Does Putin think the world is stupid, or does he just not care about appearing civilized anymore?


He's gotten away with worse before.

There's no one out there anymore to call him out on it anyway. China, while being less blatant and heavy-handed, essentially uses the same methods, and the current US President seems to have a man crush on brutal dictators, not to mention that he's no fan of science either. The EU would rather not provoke him too much for fear of having to deal with him as they still rely heavily on Russian gas and are not a solid enough union to speak with one voice yet, not to mention that some of its own members are also taking stark turns towards despotism.

Welcome to the new World order...

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 2:38 am
by Aaron747
Francoflier wrote:
CitizenJustin wrote:
Does Putin think the world is stupid, or does he just not care about appearing civilized anymore?


He's gotten away with worse before.

There's no one out there anymore to call him out on it anyway. China, while being less blatant and heavy-handed, essentially uses the same methods, and the current US President seems to have a man crush on brutal dictators, not to mention that he's no fan of science either. The EU would rather not provoke him too much for fear of having to deal with him as they still rely heavily on Russian gas and are not a solid enough union to speak with one voice yet, not to mention that some of its own members are also taking stark turns towards despotism.

Welcome to the new World order...


I’m an optimist nihilist, but today the latter is winning out. Whether or not we deserve to survive remains an open question. More data and access to information than ever before, and pugilism is winning.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 6:05 am
by Dutchy
Ah yes, another 3 dead because of the Putin regime. Probably all in the days job for the regime. Anyhow the Maire of Moscow must look out not to lose his life. Covic19 is out of control in Russia even with the numbers being dodgy as they are. 155,370 cases and 1,451 dead reported, those ratios are way off, so either Russian doctors are super human (we know they can't fly at least (too soon?!)) or the numbers aren't right. So I guess the latter.

Aaron747 wrote:
Francoflier wrote:
CitizenJustin wrote:
Does Putin think the world is stupid, or does he just not care about appearing civilized anymore?


He's gotten away with worse before.

There's no one out there anymore to call him out on it anyway. China, while being less blatant and heavy-handed, essentially uses the same methods, and the current US President seems to have a man crush on brutal dictators, not to mention that he's no fan of science either. The EU would rather not provoke him too much for fear of having to deal with him as they still rely heavily on Russian gas and are not a solid enough union to speak with one voice yet, not to mention that some of its own members are also taking stark turns towards despotism.

Welcome to the new World order...


I’m an optimist nihilist, but today the latter is winning out. Whether or not we deserve to survive remains an open question. More data and access to information than ever before, and pugilism is winning.


We have a number of real-life social experiments with populist leaders and people see that they do not work.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 7:30 am
by scbriml
I can't wait for the spin from the usual suspects....

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 11:48 am
by Dutchy
scbriml wrote:
I can't wait for the spin from the usual suspects....


They are not at work, St. Petersburg is closed as well.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 11:50 am
by jamincan
The fact that these deaths are overtly not accidental is deliberate and not due to incompetence. Putin's Russia is an authoritarian regime, and actions like this is how he holds on to power. Other doctors will think twice before criticizing him.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 1:10 pm
by scbriml
Dutchy wrote:
scbriml wrote:
I can't wait for the spin from the usual suspects....


They are not at work, St. Petersburg is closed as well.


I'm sure they can work from home. :lol:

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 1:55 pm
by Braybuddy
Dutchy wrote:
Covic19 is out of control in Russia even with the numbers being dodgy as they are. 155,370 cases and 1,451 dead reported, those ratios are way off, so either Russian doctors are super human (we know they can't fly at least (too soon?!)) or the numbers aren't right. So I guess the latter.

While Covid-19 was taking hold on Europe, Russia recorded an unusually large increase in pneumonia cases:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-coro ... SKBN216305

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 2:33 pm
by Sokes
Is the low oil price making the ruling classes nervous?
I wonder if the doctors only criticized the lack of protective suits. It sounds like someting is missing. Were they union leaders or had any other position beyond being doctors?

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 3:18 pm
by DocLightning
jamincan wrote:
The fact that these deaths are overtly not accidental is deliberate and not due to incompetence.


Exactly. The choice of defenestration is very intentional. There is no mistaking this for run-of-the-mill violence. This is a loud and clear message.

The only way out of this is an all-out revolution, and I doubt that's going to happen any time soon. And even if it does, it will simply replace one tyrant with another. We saw that with the Arab Spring. Tyrants were successfully ousted from power...and replaced with different tyrants.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 9:04 pm
by Braybuddy
Sokes wrote:
I wonder if the doctors only criticized the lack of protective suits. It sounds like someting is missing. Were they union leaders or had any other position beyond being doctors?

They were just doctors. They seem to treat union leaders slightly better:
https://meduza.io/en/feature/2020/04/03 ... g-covid-19

The rest of the world respects and honours their medics. Meanwhile in Russia . . . . :roll:

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 9:15 pm
by Newark727
Braybuddy wrote:
Sokes wrote:
I wonder if the doctors only criticized the lack of protective suits. It sounds like someting is missing. Were they union leaders or had any other position beyond being doctors?

They were just doctors. They seem to treat union leaders slightly better:
https://meduza.io/en/feature/2020/04/03 ... g-covid-19

The rest of the world respects and honours their medics. Meanwhile in Russia . . . . :roll:


Apparently all the hospital bombing in Syria became a habit...

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 9:41 pm
by GDB
Bit of a history of offing doctors, Stalin was in his last weeks jailing and worse doctors, Jewish ones in particular.
Then he keeled over and guess what?

As wonderfully satirized in the film Death Of Stalin, (banned in Russia but over a million downloads), here the committee confront the issue of the doctors, some strong language and brilliant bad taste;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCqsIbsPC9M

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Thu May 07, 2020 3:53 am
by ltbewr
USSR, Russia, same difference. Recall how the Chernobyl disaster was kept hidden, doctors put at great risk out of fear of the truth getting out. For sure many 1000's died from the radiation initially and 10's of 1000's more with cancers many years later.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Thu May 07, 2020 5:21 am
by TWA772LR
COVID ain't got nothing on Putin. Here's how the world will end.

https://youtu.be/WhPvJOnHotE

Mods please don't delete, this is just a small effort to bring some levity in light of current global affairs.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Thu May 07, 2020 6:25 am
by Dutchy
ltbewr wrote:
USSR, Russia, same difference. Recall how the Chernobyl disaster was kept hidden, doctors put at great risk out of fear of the truth getting out. For sure many 1000's died from the radiation initially and 10's of 1000's more with cancers many years later.



and showed to the citizens of the USSR that their government wasn't to be trusted.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Thu May 07, 2020 2:24 pm
by SAS A340
What's the odds of all these people who in some form criticize the Putin regime ends up leaning towards poorly maintenance or unlocked window on the 9.th floor? Must just be bad luck, right?

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Thu May 07, 2020 4:21 pm
by Dutchy
SAS A340 wrote:
What's the odds of all these people who in some form criticize the Putin regime ends up leaning towards poorly maintenance or unlocked window on the 9.th floor? Must just be bad luck, right?


Or good luck depends on the chosen perspective :lol:

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Thu May 07, 2020 5:21 pm
by SAS A340
Dutchy wrote:
SAS A340 wrote:
What's the odds of all these people who in some form criticize the Putin regime ends up leaning towards poorly maintenance or unlocked window on the 9.th floor? Must just be bad luck, right?


Or good luck depends on the chosen perspective :lol:

I miss a thumbs up button up on replies, but here you go :bigthumbsup: :bigthumbsup:

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Thu May 07, 2020 6:49 pm
by alfa164
Dutchy wrote:
SAS A340 wrote:
What's the odds of all these people who in some form criticize the Putin regime ends up leaning towards poorly maintenance or unlocked window on the 9.th floor? Must just be bad luck, right?


Or good luck depends on the chosen perspective :lol:


Well done! :lol:

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Thu May 07, 2020 6:50 pm
by Sokes
I usually do like sarcasm. Not this time.
I don't understand what is going on, but I don't like it.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Thu May 07, 2020 7:16 pm
by GDB
Sokes wrote:
I usually do like sarcasm. Not this time.
I don't understand what is going on, but I don't like it.


Typical Putin playbook is what is happening.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 6:35 am
by Sokes
GDB wrote:
Sokes wrote:
I usually do like sarcasm. Not this time.
I don't understand what is going on, but I don't like it.


Typical Putin playbook is what is happening.

A spy gets killed. Difficult to judge.

Chronic critical reporters get killed. That's really bad.
But then Russia has elections. If people had to vote for a party whose agenda is to employ more judges and ensure their independence things would improve.
And even in the West critics who have no history of accusations get accused of rape.

But here we have doctors who complained about a specific situation.
I read in Bombai 15.000 doctors closed their medical practice. The state government threatens to withdraw their licence.
Maybe the Russian government has difficulties to maintain the medical system. Throwing some doctor critics from the window may freighten other doctors to fall in line.
An alternative explanation is extreme dicontent caused by economic hardship related to oilprice and oligarchy. It's this explanation why I don't like this situation. Will those who profit from the cleptocracy simply step aside? Or will they start a dictatorship?
Throwing doctors from the window may be intended to give a message to politicians from the opposition.

These are all wild speculations and they are likely wrong.
But something isn't right with this story. Something more is going on which I don't understand and which gives me a bad feel.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 7:05 am
by GDB
Sokes wrote:
GDB wrote:
Sokes wrote:
I usually do like sarcasm. Not this time.
I don't understand what is going on, but I don't like it.


Typical Putin playbook is what is happening.

A spy gets killed. Difficult to judge.

Chronic critical reporters get killed. That's really bad.
But then Russia has elections. If people had to vote for a party whose agenda is to employ more judges and ensure their independence things would improve.
And even in the West critics who have no history of accusations get accused of rape.

But here we have doctors who complained about a specific situation.
I read in Bombai 15.000 doctors closed their medical practice. The state government threatens to withdraw their licence.
Maybe the Russian government has difficulties to maintain the medical system. Throwing some doctor critics from the window may freighten other doctors to fall in line.
An alternative explanation is extreme dicontent caused by economic hardship related to oilprice and oligarchy. It's this explanation why I don't like this situation. Will those who profit from the cleptocracy simply step aside? Or will they start a dictatorship?
Throwing doctors from the window may be intended to give a message to politicians from the opposition.

These are all wild speculations and they are likely wrong.
But something isn't right with this story. Something more is going on which I don't understand and which gives me a bad feel.


No it isn't, it is easy to judge.
As I said EX spy, defected years before, no intel value at all, did NOT get killed, he was poisoned as was his daughter (did you even read what I wrote?).
Two innocent citizens were poisoned by a nerve agent, one died, in 2018. This was the left over from the botched attack.
It could have been far worse, military chemical warfare defence teams spent a considerable time cleaning up the mess Putin's goons left.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poisoning ... ia_Skripal

To understand Putin you have to know that he never accepted that the wall fell and then, later the USSR collapsed due to it's internal contradictions. No a middle ranking KGB functionary, it was all a western plot.
That's why he hates the ex USSR states who could not wait to be free of the USSR, as it contradicts his worldview.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 9:53 am
by Sokes
GDB wrote:
To understand Putin you have to know that he never accepted that the wall fell and then, later the USSR collapsed due to it's internal contradictions. No a middle ranking KGB functionary, it was all a western plot.
That's why he hates the ex USSR states who could not wait to be free of the USSR, as it contradicts his worldview.

He isn't a critic of the system, he is the system.
Neither history, nor ex USSR states can explain why doctors are thrown from windows.

Re: Three Russian doctors mysteriously fall from hospital windows

Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 11:20 am
by GDB
Sokes wrote:
GDB wrote:
To understand Putin you have to know that he never accepted that the wall fell and then, later the USSR collapsed due to it's internal contradictions. No a middle ranking KGB functionary, it was all a western plot.
That's why he hates the ex USSR states who could not wait to be free of the USSR, as it contradicts his worldview.

He isn't a critic of the system, he is the system.
Neither history, nor ex USSR states can explain why doctors are thrown from windows.


It really can, he does not like anyone who questions him, such as those doctors who were pushed since they publicly questioned his states botched response to Covid, just as journalists have gone the same way in the past and he has a burning resentment against anyone who undermined the USSR, even in retirement.
Obvious really.
And it's done deliberately to send a message.
Clear enough for you?