aerosreenivas wrote:

N583JB wrote:

aerosreenivas wrote:

I feel the situation has become so worse that every 'Afro American' should thank GOD every day for being alive the very next day. Because sadly, people like Arbery, Travon Martin, David Brown, and many others will be mistaken for as a criminal by some folks and be killed in the name of 'Self-Defence'.

Unfortunately, I feel the Arbery case also will end up this way with the shooters declared as 'Innocent' and the killing legitimate.

But the real reason that we all know is that they are getting killed because they are 'Black'. Period.

Who is/was David Brown?

Sorry for getting the name wrong. It was actually Michael Brown that I was talking about. The guy from Ferguson, Missouri that was killed by the white police officer, Darren Wilson in August, 2014.

Ah, I see. FWIW, Michael Brown was a criminal and was killed in self-defense after he violently robbed a store and then attacked the first police officer he saw afterwards. This was confirmed by multiple investigations, multiple credible eyewitness accounts, and forensic evidence.

For a clear account of what actually happened that day, I recommend reading the DOJ report on the shooting (link here: https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/f ... rown_1.pdf ). The "hands up, don't shoot" story that was prevalent in the aftermath of the shooting was determined to have been a complete lie. One black man who witnessed the shooting told investigators that if he had been armed at the time, he would have shot Brown himself.

aerosreenivas wrote:

I feel the situation has become so worse that every 'Afro American' should thank GOD every day for being alive the very next day. Because sadly, people like Arbery, Travon Martin, David Brown, and many others will be mistaken for as a criminal by some folks and be killed in the name of 'Self-Defence'.

Unfortunately, I feel the Arbery case also will end up this way with the shooters declared as 'Innocent' and the killing legitimate.

But the real reason that we all know is that they are getting killed because they are 'Black'. Period.

I honestly think its better than the past, maybe a slight uptick in the last decade but nothing like the 1920's to the 1960's. Chris Rock has bit saying this about 10-15 years ago.

The difference now is that everyone has an HD video camera in their pockets and more of these crimes and incidents are seen by the public.

aerosreenivas wrote:

I feel the situation has become so worse that every 'Afro American' should thank GOD every day for being alive the very next day. Because sadly, people like Arbery, Travon Martin, David Brown, and many others will be mistaken for as a criminal by some folks and be killed in the name of 'Self-Defence'.

The latter part is right, yet black people are much more likely to be be killed by a black person than someone else. So if they have thank GOD for still be alive on a random day situations like that aren’t the most relevant.

Jetty wrote:

aerosreenivas wrote:

I feel the situation has become so worse that every 'Afro American' should thank GOD every day for being alive the very next day. Because sadly, people like Arbery, Travon Martin, David Brown, and many others will be mistaken for as a criminal by some folks and be killed in the name of 'Self-Defence'.

The latter part is right, yet black people are much more likely to be be killed by a black person than someone else. So if they have thank GOD for still be alive on a random day situations like that aren’t the most relevant.

Anyone is more likely to be killed by their same demographic. That's just the nature of human interaction.

Jetty wrote:

aerosreenivas wrote:

I feel the situation has become so worse that every 'Afro American' should thank GOD every day for being alive the very next day. Because sadly, people like Arbery, Travon Martin, David Brown, and many others will be mistaken for as a criminal by some folks and be killed in the name of 'Self-Defence'.

The latter part is right, yet black people are much more likely to be be killed by a black person than someone else. So if they have thank GOD for still be alive on a random day situations like that aren’t the most relevant.

Racial groups tend to stick together. So, technically, yes, an Asian person is more likely to be killed by another Asian, a Native person is more likely to be killed by a Native person and so on. There are those minorities who decide to leave their own neighborhoods and live in a different neighborhood, where most people do not look like them.

wow, some of the comments here make me sick. It kind of reminds me of FBI profiling, on serial killers this desire to kill someone, but do it in such a way that it's declared
self-defense. How can it be self-defense, when they are actually hunting people. That is what Zimmerman did. That's what these two good ole boys did.

DLFREEBIRD wrote:

wow, some of the comments here make me sick. It kind of reminds me of FBI profiling, on serial killers this desire to kill someone, but do it in such a way that it's declared
self-defense. How can it be self-defense, when they are actually hunting people. That is what Zimmerman did. That's what these two good ole boys did.

Zimmerman had a much better case: he was injured, no video and no attempt to make an unlawful citizens arrest.

Contrast to what happened in Kentucky. Police conducting a "no-knock" (all-stupid) warrant shot and killed a black EMT and locked up and DA charged her black boyfriend for attempted murder because he shot his gun thinking a home invasion was taking place. He's still caged.

These white Georgia monsters were allowed to sit at home for 10 weeks after lynching an innocent young black man because of a corrupt, biased DA.

You can't make stuff this good up in Hollywood.

And people walk around acting like racism in the United States is a theoretical concept.

Pellegrine wrote:

Contrast to what happened in Kentucky. Police conducting a "no-knock" (all-stupid) warrant shot and killed a black EMT and locked up and DA charged her black boyfriend for attempted murder because he shot his gun thinking a home invasion was taking place. He's still caged.

These white Georgia monsters were allowed to sit at home for 10 weeks after lynching an innocent young black man because of a corrupt, biased DA.

You can't make stuff this good up in Hollywood.

And people walk around acting like racism in the United States is a theoretical concept.

Yeah that situation in Louisville sounds extremely messed up. And I agree that we have a major problem with racism in the United States at the moment, just as we have always had one. I feel like BLM missed out on a chance to really unify the country. Instead of trying to turn criminals into martyrs and instead of screaming "racism" at nearly every police-involved shooting before the facts came out, only to end up looking silly in the end, they should have focused on the clear-cut instances of racism that only the most prejudiced could defend. They didn't do that, though, and ended up creating further division instead of unity. You aren't going to win the common man to your side when you are blocking the streets preventing him getting home from work in order to celebrate a criminal who was killed while doing criminal things.

N583JB wrote:

Pellegrine wrote:

Contrast to what happened in Kentucky. Police conducting a "no-knock" (all-stupid) warrant shot and killed a black EMT and locked up and DA charged her black boyfriend for attempted murder because he shot his gun thinking a home invasion was taking place. He's still caged.

These white Georgia monsters were allowed to sit at home for 10 weeks after lynching an innocent young black man because of a corrupt, biased DA.

You can't make stuff this good up in Hollywood.

And people walk around acting like racism in the United States is a theoretical concept.

Yeah that situation in Louisville sounds extremely messed up. And I agree that we have a major problem with racism in the United States at the moment, just as we have always had one. I feel like BLM missed out on a chance to really unify the country. Instead of trying to turn criminals into martyrs and instead of screaming "racism" at nearly every police-involved shooting before the facts came out, only to end up looking silly in the end, they should have focused on the clear-cut instances of racism that only the most prejudiced could defend. They didn't do that, though, and ended up creating further division instead of unity. You aren't going to win the common man to your side when you are blocking the streets preventing him getting home from work in order to celebrate a criminal who was killed while doing criminal things.

Let me handle you with tenderness.

When did BLM speak for all people? Are they now the spokesperson for all black people? Do you realize BLM is decentralized? I'm an individual person pointing this out and I spend less than half my time in the US under normal circumstances, although I was born here.

Pellegrine wrote:

N583JB wrote:

Pellegrine wrote:

Contrast to what happened in Kentucky. Police conducting a "no-knock" (all-stupid) warrant shot and killed a black EMT and locked up and DA charged her black boyfriend for attempted murder because he shot his gun thinking a home invasion was taking place. He's still caged.

These white Georgia monsters were allowed to sit at home for 10 weeks after lynching an innocent young black man because of a corrupt, biased DA.

You can't make stuff this good up in Hollywood.

And people walk around acting like racism in the United States is a theoretical concept.

Yeah that situation in Louisville sounds extremely messed up. And I agree that we have a major problem with racism in the United States at the moment, just as we have always had one. I feel like BLM missed out on a chance to really unify the country. Instead of trying to turn criminals into martyrs and instead of screaming "racism" at nearly every police-involved shooting before the facts came out, only to end up looking silly in the end, they should have focused on the clear-cut instances of racism that only the most prejudiced could defend. They didn't do that, though, and ended up creating further division instead of unity. You aren't going to win the common man to your side when you are blocking the streets preventing him getting home from work in order to celebrate a criminal who was killed while doing criminal things.

Let me handle you with tenderness.

When did BLM speak for all people? Are they now the spokesperson for all black people? Do you realize BLM is decentralized? I'm an individual person pointing this out and I spend less than half my time in the US under normal circumstances, although I was born here.

BLM certainly doesn't represent all people, but for nearly a decade BLM has been the most visible and outspoken group when it comes to racism and police violence (justified or not). With that visibility comes responsibility, and in my opinion BLM has set back race relations ten years in this country.

N583JB wrote:

BLM certainly doesn't represent all people, but for nearly a decade BLM has been the most visible and outspoken group when it comes to racism and police violence (justified or not). With that visibility comes responsibility, and in my opinion BLM has set back race relations ten years in this country.

I'm not sure how this post was intended to read, but your definition of "visible and outspoken group when it comes to racism" must be pretty different to mine. What with the bona fide torch wielding Nazi rally that we had back in 2017, or that guy who shot twenty people at an African-American church the year after. If you're looking at groups setting back race relations, why not start with the ones who are actually killing people?

Newark727 wrote:

N583JB wrote:

BLM certainly doesn't represent all people, but for nearly a decade BLM has been the most visible and outspoken group when it comes to racism and police violence (justified or not). With that visibility comes responsibility, and in my opinion BLM has set back race relations ten years in this country.

I'm not sure how this post was intended to read, but your definition of "visible and outspoken group when it comes to racism" must be pretty different to mine. What with the bona fide torch wielding Nazi rally that we had back in 2017, or that guy who shot twenty people at an African-American church the year after. If you're looking at groups setting back race relations, why not start with the ones who are actually killing people?

The difference is, none of the people you listed were part of a group. On the other hand, you had a dozen police officers shot in Dallas while trying to protect a BLM protest, with the gunman citing BLM before he was killed. You also had riots in several cities that BLM in my opinion had a major hand in. And on a less violent level, you had BLM protesters harassing everyday people all across the country for not mourning the deaths of their martyrs. Like I said, they had a chance to unite people based on clear-cut instances of racism and police brutality. They blew that chance.

N583JB wrote:

Newark727 wrote:

N583JB wrote:

BLM certainly doesn't represent all people, but for nearly a decade BLM has been the most visible and outspoken group when it comes to racism and police violence (justified or not). With that visibility comes responsibility, and in my opinion BLM has set back race relations ten years in this country.

I'm not sure how this post was intended to read, but your definition of "visible and outspoken group when it comes to racism" must be pretty different to mine. What with the bona fide torch wielding Nazi rally that we had back in 2017, or that guy who shot twenty people at an African-American church the year after. If you're looking at groups setting back race relations, why not start with the ones who are actually killing people?

The difference is, none of the people you listed were part of a group. On the other hand, you had a dozen police officers shot in Dallas while trying to protect a BLM protest, with the gunman citing BLM before he was killed. You also had riots in several cities that BLM in my opinion had a major hand in. And on a less violent level, you had BLM protesters harassing everyday people all across the country for not mourning the deaths of their martyrs. Like I said, they had a chance to unite people based on clear-cut instances of racism and police brutality. They blew that chance.

So you're more concerned with BLM affiliated people or people that claim to be BLM people "causing a ruckus" than people murdered in extrajudicial killings. I think I know where this is going and really it wouldn't make much sense to talk anymore.

Pellegrine wrote:

N583JB wrote:

Newark727 wrote:

I'm not sure how this post was intended to read, but your definition of "visible and outspoken group when it comes to racism" must be pretty different to mine. What with the bona fide torch wielding Nazi rally that we had back in 2017, or that guy who shot twenty people at an African-American church the year after. If you're looking at groups setting back race relations, why not start with the ones who are actually killing people?

The difference is, none of the people you listed were part of a group. On the other hand, you had a dozen police officers shot in Dallas while trying to protect a BLM protest, with the gunman citing BLM before he was killed. You also had riots in several cities that BLM in my opinion had a major hand in. And on a less violent level, you had BLM protesters harassing everyday people all across the country for not mourning the deaths of their martyrs. Like I said, they had a chance to unite people based on clear-cut instances of racism and police brutality. They blew that chance.

So you're more concerned with BLM affiliated people or people that claim to be BLM people "causing a ruckus" than people murdered in extrajudicial killings. I think I know where this is going and really it wouldn't make much sense to talk anymore.

If you define "causing a ruckus" as literally murdering people and burning buildings down, sure. Like I said, we have a serious problem with racism in this country, but the solution is not anarchy and lawlessness, nor is it shooting police officers because they happen to be police officers or shutting down cities because criminals get killed while committing criminal acts. BLM had a chance to move the country forwards and unify people, and instead they chose to do the opposite. Really a shame.

N583JB wrote:

Pellegrine wrote:

N583JB wrote:

The difference is, none of the people you listed were part of a group. On the other hand, you had a dozen police officers shot in Dallas while trying to protect a BLM protest, with the gunman citing BLM before he was killed. You also had riots in several cities that BLM in my opinion had a major hand in. And on a less violent level, you had BLM protesters harassing everyday people all across the country for not mourning the deaths of their martyrs. Like I said, they had a chance to unite people based on clear-cut instances of racism and police brutality. They blew that chance.

So you're more concerned with BLM affiliated people or people that claim to be BLM people "causing a ruckus" than people murdered in extrajudicial killings. I think I know where this is going and really it wouldn't make much sense to talk anymore.

If you define "causing a ruckus" as literally murdering people and burning buildings down, sure. Like I said, we have a serious problem with racism in this country, but the solution is not anarchy and lawlessness, nor is it shooting police officers because they happen to be police officers or shutting down cities because criminals get killed while committing criminal acts. BLM had a chance to move the country forwards and unify people, and instead they chose to do the opposite. Really a shame.

The majority of BLM protests are peaceful, with the police being the ones actually causing problems. That guy in Dallas was not BLM, he just claimed to be BLM, he was unaffiliated and a disgruntled lone wolf. This thread is about the shooting of an innocent black man, but you keep up bring up supposed BLM improprieties. That actually says a lot about you.

Pellegrine wrote:

N583JB wrote:

Pellegrine wrote:

So you're more concerned with BLM affiliated people or people that claim to be BLM people "causing a ruckus" than people murdered in extrajudicial killings. I think I know where this is going and really it wouldn't make much sense to talk anymore.

If you define "causing a ruckus" as literally murdering people and burning buildings down, sure. Like I said, we have a serious problem with racism in this country, but the solution is not anarchy and lawlessness, nor is it shooting police officers because they happen to be police officers or shutting down cities because criminals get killed while committing criminal acts. BLM had a chance to move the country forwards and unify people, and instead they chose to do the opposite. Really a shame.

The majority of BLM protests are peaceful, with the police being the ones actually causing problems. That guy in Dallas was not BLM, he just claimed to be BLM, he was unaffiliated and a disgruntled lone wolf. This thread is about the shooting of an innocent black man, but you keep up bring up supposed BLM improprieties. That actually says a lot about you.

I never stated that the majority of BLM protests were anything but peaceful. The problem is the ones that aren't end up being pretty disastrous. You don't get a membership card for joining BLM, and the Dallas shooter specifically cited Black Lives Matter as the motivation for his shooting spree. If you start demonizing the police at every turn, even when the police didn't do anything wrong, people are going to notice and bad people are going to do bad things. Like I said, they bear a lot of responsibility for the riots and other acts because they have been the ones pushing the narrative, even when facts didn't line up with their desired narrative.

This thread has become a thread about a broader issue. I assume that is what the powers to be want here as other attempts to start separate threads on things of this nature have been deleted. So, this is what we get.

How BLM protests and the killing of an unarmed non-threatening civilian and the coverup get conflated is beyond me.

Pellegrine wrote:

How BLM protests and the killing of an unarmed non-threatening civilian and the coverup get conflated is beyond me.

No one is conflating the two. This is a sidebar discussion, the origins of which are easy to trace if you go back in the thread and look.

N583JB wrote:

The difference is, none of the people you listed were part of a group.

You're saying that those white people at the Nazi rally in Va didn't see themselves as part of a group? Or that any other white people like these Georgia crackers that hunt down and kill black people don't see themselves as part of a "group"? You must've missed every single history class you were ever supposed to attend.
The ONLY reason white people are even inconvenienced with light jail time as they wait for trials with generally very predictable outcomes is because these murders are filmed in broad daylight. Roll back the clock just 25 years and these wouldn't even be news stories. White people have been chanting Nazi and KKK slogans in this country for 50-90 years and torturing, killing and raping black people by the thousands in that time. All of this was covered across many years of mandatory education in Middle and High School curricula across the nation.

How can we even pretend to have a semi intelligent conversations when people like you think BLM is a bona fide "group" but Nazi rallies, KKK meetings and the Tea Party aren't organized fronts for racial hatred?

wingman wrote:

N583JB wrote:

The difference is, none of the people you listed were part of a group.

You're saying that those white people at the Nazi rally in Va didn't see themselves as part of a group? Or that any other white people like these Georgia crackers that hunt down and kill black people don't see themselves as part of a "group"? You must've missed every single history class you were ever supposed to attend.
The ONLY reason white people are even inconvenienced with light jail time as they wait for trials with generally very predictable outcomes is because these murders are filmed in broad daylight. Roll back the clock just 25 years and these wouldn't even be news stories. White people have been chanting Nazi and KKK slogans in this country for 50-90 years and torturing, killing and raping black people by the thousands in that time. All of this was covered across many years of mandatory education in Middle and High School curricula across the nation.

How can we even pretend to have a semi intelligent conversations when people like you think BLM is a bona fide "group" but Nazi rallies, KKK meetings and the Tea Party aren't organized fronts for racial hatred?

Very fair points indeed. Perhaps I should amend my statement to say that BLM was a "legitimized" group....the KKK and neo nazis are definitely very real groups, but they are fringe groups and aside from a few nutjobs here and there, those groups don't have any legitimate voice in the media or in politics. If a politician brags about being endorsed by the KKK, he/she is immediately condemned and justifiably so. CNN and the BBC also aren't going to have KKK members as panelists when discussing various hot button issues. The KKK has already alienated 99% of the population because they are complete jerks and always have been (I'd like to use a stronger term than "jerk", but am trying to avoid profanity).

On the flip side, BLM had that seat at the table, that voice, that representation. Instead of using that for good, they squandered that opportunity and alienated a lot of people in my opinion. That is my frustration with them. BLM started off with great potential to be a unifying force, but they alone are responsible for choosing not to unify and choosing instead to further division, in my opinion. A lot of that stems from the fact that BLM was intentionally disorganized, with different branches having wildly different voices.

N583JB wrote:

wingman wrote:

N583JB wrote:

The difference is, none of the people you listed were part of a group.

You're saying that those white people at the Nazi rally in Va didn't see themselves as part of a group? Or that any other white people like these Georgia crackers that hunt down and kill black people don't see themselves as part of a "group"? You must've missed every single history class you were ever supposed to attend.
The ONLY reason white people are even inconvenienced with light jail time as they wait for trials with generally very predictable outcomes is because these murders are filmed in broad daylight. Roll back the clock just 25 years and these wouldn't even be news stories. White people have been chanting Nazi and KKK slogans in this country for 50-90 years and torturing, killing and raping black people by the thousands in that time. All of this was covered across many years of mandatory education in Middle and High School curricula across the nation.

How can we even pretend to have a semi intelligent conversations when people like you think BLM is a bona fide "group" but Nazi rallies, KKK meetings and the Tea Party aren't organized fronts for racial hatred?

Very fair points indeed. Perhaps I should amend my statement to say that BLM was a "legitimized" group....the KKK and neo nazis are definitely very real groups, but they are fringe groups and aside from a few nutjobs here and there, those groups don't have any legitimate voice in the media or in politics. If a politician brags about being endorsed by the KKK, he/she is immediately condemned and justifiably so. CNN and the BBC also aren't going to have KKK members as panelists when discussing various hot button issues. The KKK has already alienated 99% of the population because they are complete jerks and always have been (I'd like to use a stronger term than "jerk", but am trying to avoid profanity).

On the flip side, BLM had that seat at the table, that voice, that representation. Instead of using that for good, they squandered that opportunity and alienated a lot of people in my opinion. That is my frustration with them. BLM started off with great potential to be a unifying force, but they alone are responsible for choosing not to unify and choosing instead to further division, in my opinion. A lot of that stems from the fact that BLM was intentionally disorganized, with different branches having wildly different voices.

KKK and neo-Nazis have a very clear voice. They are not fringe groups. They are main stream and part of the Republican party. Some in the Republican party whole heartedly endorse them. Others tolerate them. There are a few fringe people in the Republican party who have said they want nothing to do with KKK or neo-Nazis. But, go look at videos of right wing rallies. Look at the Confederate flags and military dress popular with neo-Nazis. These "very fine people".

BLM, on the other hand, started off as a hashtag on social media. They had no structure for a long time. They were labeled as a fringe group by right wing media and, to this day, are hated because of whatever reason seems good at the moment. BLM never "had a seat at the table" because they were seen as a passing fad in social media. Then, they were seen as alienating people. They were never a legitimate group, partly because of the optics of right wing media. The same right wing media who decided "all lives matter" and "blue lives matter" should replace or challenge BLM. Almost convincing reasons for supporting "all lives matter" and "blue lives matter" are still being thrown around.

It is funny, though, these same people who endorse "all lives matter" hate "black lives matter". It is almost as if they want to say "all lives matter but some lives matter more than others".

seb146 wrote:

N583JB wrote:

wingman wrote:

You're saying that those white people at the Nazi rally in Va didn't see themselves as part of a group? Or that any other white people like these Georgia crackers that hunt down and kill black people don't see themselves as part of a "group"? You must've missed every single history class you were ever supposed to attend.
The ONLY reason white people are even inconvenienced with light jail time as they wait for trials with generally very predictable outcomes is because these murders are filmed in broad daylight. Roll back the clock just 25 years and these wouldn't even be news stories. White people have been chanting Nazi and KKK slogans in this country for 50-90 years and torturing, killing and raping black people by the thousands in that time. All of this was covered across many years of mandatory education in Middle and High School curricula across the nation.

How can we even pretend to have a semi intelligent conversations when people like you think BLM is a bona fide "group" but Nazi rallies, KKK meetings and the Tea Party aren't organized fronts for racial hatred?

Very fair points indeed. Perhaps I should amend my statement to say that BLM was a "legitimized" group....the KKK and neo nazis are definitely very real groups, but they are fringe groups and aside from a few nutjobs here and there, those groups don't have any legitimate voice in the media or in politics. If a politician brags about being endorsed by the KKK, he/she is immediately condemned and justifiably so. CNN and the BBC also aren't going to have KKK members as panelists when discussing various hot button issues. The KKK has already alienated 99% of the population because they are complete jerks and always have been (I'd like to use a stronger term than "jerk", but am trying to avoid profanity).

On the flip side, BLM had that seat at the table, that voice, that representation. Instead of using that for good, they squandered that opportunity and alienated a lot of people in my opinion. That is my frustration with them. BLM started off with great potential to be a unifying force, but they alone are responsible for choosing not to unify and choosing instead to further division, in my opinion. A lot of that stems from the fact that BLM was intentionally disorganized, with different branches having wildly different voices.

KKK and neo-Nazis have a very clear voice. They are not fringe groups. They are main stream and part of the Republican party. Some in the Republican party whole heartedly endorse them. Others tolerate them. There are a few fringe people in the Republican party who have said they want nothing to do with KKK or neo-Nazis. But, go look at videos of right wing rallies. Look at the Confederate flags and military dress popular with neo-Nazis. These "very fine people".

BLM, on the other hand, started off as a hashtag on social media. They had no structure for a long time. They were labeled as a fringe group by right wing media and, to this day, are hated because of whatever reason seems good at the moment. BLM never "had a seat at the table" because they were seen as a passing fad in social media. Then, they were seen as alienating people. They were never a legitimate group, partly because of the optics of right wing media. The same right wing media who decided "all lives matter" and "blue lives matter" should replace or challenge BLM. Almost convincing reasons for supporting "all lives matter" and "blue lives matter" are still being thrown around.

It is funny, though, these same people who endorse "all lives matter" hate "black lives matter". It is almost as if they want to say "all lives matter but some lives matter more than others".

Going to need a source for some of your claims....mainly that KKK and neonazis are "mainstream" and "part of the Republican party". Which Republican politicians, specifically, have publicly endorsed them? Seems like hyperbole more than anything.

I don't know which media sources you typically use (until very recently, CNN was my go-to), but BLM had a seat at the table from the get go. They had a huge voice. They were very close with many politicians. And they largely ruined that because they couldn't differentiate police brutality from justified instances of police use of force.

N583JB wrote:

seb146 wrote:

N583JB wrote:

Very fair points indeed. Perhaps I should amend my statement to say that BLM was a "legitimized" group....the KKK and neo nazis are definitely very real groups, but they are fringe groups and aside from a few nutjobs here and there, those groups don't have any legitimate voice in the media or in politics. If a politician brags about being endorsed by the KKK, he/she is immediately condemned and justifiably so. CNN and the BBC also aren't going to have KKK members as panelists when discussing various hot button issues. The KKK has already alienated 99% of the population because they are complete jerks and always have been (I'd like to use a stronger term than "jerk", but am trying to avoid profanity).

On the flip side, BLM had that seat at the table, that voice, that representation. Instead of using that for good, they squandered that opportunity and alienated a lot of people in my opinion. That is my frustration with them. BLM started off with great potential to be a unifying force, but they alone are responsible for choosing not to unify and choosing instead to further division, in my opinion. A lot of that stems from the fact that BLM was intentionally disorganized, with different branches having wildly different voices.

KKK and neo-Nazis have a very clear voice. They are not fringe groups. They are main stream and part of the Republican party. Some in the Republican party whole heartedly endorse them. Others tolerate them. There are a few fringe people in the Republican party who have said they want nothing to do with KKK or neo-Nazis. But, go look at videos of right wing rallies. Look at the Confederate flags and military dress popular with neo-Nazis. These "very fine people".

BLM, on the other hand, started off as a hashtag on social media. They had no structure for a long time. They were labeled as a fringe group by right wing media and, to this day, are hated because of whatever reason seems good at the moment. BLM never "had a seat at the table" because they were seen as a passing fad in social media. Then, they were seen as alienating people. They were never a legitimate group, partly because of the optics of right wing media. The same right wing media who decided "all lives matter" and "blue lives matter" should replace or challenge BLM. Almost convincing reasons for supporting "all lives matter" and "blue lives matter" are still being thrown around.

It is funny, though, these same people who endorse "all lives matter" hate "black lives matter". It is almost as if they want to say "all lives matter but some lives matter more than others".

Going to need a source for some of your claims....mainly that KKK and neonazis are "mainstream" and "part of the Republican party". Which Republican politicians, specifically, have publicly endorsed them? Seems like hyperbole more than anything.

I don't know which media sources you typically use (until very recently, CNN was my go-to), but BLM had a seat at the table from the get go. They had a huge voice. They were very close with many politicians. And they largely ruined that because they couldn't differentiate police brutality from justified instances of police use of force.

When the leader of the Republican party called them "very fine people" in Charlottesville. A person or group of people carrying a Confederate flag and wearing MAGA gear is a Republican. The same people also parrot what their leader says while carrying banners of oppression and racism like the Confederate flag or the Nazi flag.

Fox and AM talk radio moved very quickly to discredit BLM the way they do with anything that goes against Republican principles. They still have a huge voice on social media but are largely hated and not taken seriously by Republicans and right wing media.

The Liberal media is using this killing of one person to be some kind of touchpoint. As a white person, I never see the media making any kind of "whites slayed by blacks" a touchpoint. They always rationalize there way around those stories. Ooooops, racism exists on both sides of the equation, but it's only one kind of story that leads and leads and leads. Have fun.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

The Liberal media is using this killing of one person to be some kind of touchpoint.

Actually Fox is all over this as are other outlets traditionally seen as "conservative". They appear to want nothing to do with showing any support or defense of it. They are highlighting the reality of the situation, the hunting down and shooting, quite well actually.

The McMichael's honestly actually believed that they did not doing anything wrong. That the killing was "his fault" alone and not not theirs. They just can't get our of their own pre-made mind's eye that they had no choice but to go after a person they knew nothing about, take a firearm, chase him down, threaten him while armed, confront him directly with it, and expect him to just stand and do nothing. Not run, not defend himself. They are just dumb.

You have a right to defend yourself against assault. Yes I get the risks, but that means the other party gets charged with murder.

Can you imagine how this would have been spun if Aubery had killed one of the McMichael's while wrestling with the gun? I suspect you would have been very please with the reporting based on your post (not your best post really).

Tugg

seb146 wrote:

N583JB wrote:

seb146 wrote:

KKK and neo-Nazis have a very clear voice. They are not fringe groups. They are main stream and part of the Republican party. Some in the Republican party whole heartedly endorse them. Others tolerate them. There are a few fringe people in the Republican party who have said they want nothing to do with KKK or neo-Nazis. But, go look at videos of right wing rallies. Look at the Confederate flags and military dress popular with neo-Nazis. These "very fine people".

BLM, on the other hand, started off as a hashtag on social media. They had no structure for a long time. They were labeled as a fringe group by right wing media and, to this day, are hated because of whatever reason seems good at the moment. BLM never "had a seat at the table" because they were seen as a passing fad in social media. Then, they were seen as alienating people. They were never a legitimate group, partly because of the optics of right wing media. The same right wing media who decided "all lives matter" and "blue lives matter" should replace or challenge BLM. Almost convincing reasons for supporting "all lives matter" and "blue lives matter" are still being thrown around.

It is funny, though, these same people who endorse "all lives matter" hate "black lives matter". It is almost as if they want to say "all lives matter but some lives matter more than others".

Going to need a source for some of your claims....mainly that KKK and neonazis are "mainstream" and "part of the Republican party". Which Republican politicians, specifically, have publicly endorsed them? Seems like hyperbole more than anything.

I don't know which media sources you typically use (until very recently, CNN was my go-to), but BLM had a seat at the table from the get go. They had a huge voice. They were very close with many politicians. And they largely ruined that because they couldn't differentiate police brutality from justified instances of police use of force.

When the leader of the Republican party called them "very fine people" in Charlottesville. A person or group of people carrying a Confederate flag and wearing MAGA gear is a Republican. The same people also parrot what their leader says while carrying banners of oppression and racism like the Confederate flag or the Nazi flag.

Fox and AM talk radio moved very quickly to discredit BLM the way they do with anything that goes against Republican principles. They still have a huge voice on social media but are largely hated and not taken seriously by Republicans and right wing media.

Trump didn't call the nazis "very fine people". He said there were "very fine people on both sides" protesting in Charlottesville. He also unequivocally condemned neo-nazis in the aftermath of the attack. MAGA gear isn't nazi anymore than Obama gear is communist. Your examples are weak, which is what I expected.

BLM has itself to blame for not being taken seriously anymore, for reasons I already outlined.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

The Liberal media is using this killing of one person to be some kind of touchpoint. As a white person, I never see the media making any kind of "whites slayed by blacks" a touchpoint. They always rationalize there way around those stories. Ooooops, racism exists on both sides of the equation, but it's only one kind of story that leads and leads and leads. Have fun.

Please, do us about the personal racism you’ve experienced throughout your life living in the US as a white male.

What systemic discrimination have you experienced both professionally and personally based on the color of your skin?

What rights did you have to fight for as a white male?

bgm wrote:

What rights did you have to fight for as a white male?

What rights did you have to fight for? For the record, I wasn't born in the US.

N583JB wrote:

seb146 wrote:

N583JB wrote:

Going to need a source for some of your claims....mainly that KKK and neonazis are "mainstream" and "part of the Republican party". Which Republican politicians, specifically, have publicly endorsed them? Seems like hyperbole more than anything.

I don't know which media sources you typically use (until very recently, CNN was my go-to), but BLM had a seat at the table from the get go. They had a huge voice. They were very close with many politicians. And they largely ruined that because they couldn't differentiate police brutality from justified instances of police use of force.

When the leader of the Republican party called them "very fine people" in Charlottesville. A person or group of people carrying a Confederate flag and wearing MAGA gear is a Republican. The same people also parrot what their leader says while carrying banners of oppression and racism like the Confederate flag or the Nazi flag.

Fox and AM talk radio moved very quickly to discredit BLM the way they do with anything that goes against Republican principles. They still have a huge voice on social media but are largely hated and not taken seriously by Republicans and right wing media.

Trump didn't call the nazis "very fine people". He said there were "very fine people on both sides" protesting in Charlottesville. He also unequivocally condemned neo-nazis in the aftermath of the attack. MAGA gear isn't nazi anymore than Obama gear is communist. Your examples are weak, which is what I expected.

BLM has itself to blame for not being taken seriously anymore, for reasons I already outlined.

Charlottesville was a rally organized by neo-Nazis and white supremacists

https://theconversation.com/why-are-whi ... omy-137044
https://www.vox.com/2018/7/9/17525860/n ... a-virginia
https://theintercept.com/2020/05/17/tru ... displayed/

All those White people and racists all gathering together. No White people asking, telling, demanding the racists leave. Some of them are even wearing masks but the point is: Republicans openly embrace racists.

BLM is "not taken seriously" for talking about unarmed Black people being killed. The EMT worker, Tamir Rice, Sandra Bland, Trayvon.... That is why BLM is not taken seriously. Their calls for Blacks being treated like Whites is drown out by "but.... but... but..." from the right wing media. And by people screaming "all lives matter". Ok, if all lives matter, that means Black lives matter, right? Apparently not. But, okay... whatever....

seb146 wrote:

N583JB wrote:

seb146 wrote:

When the leader of the Republican party called them "very fine people" in Charlottesville. A person or group of people carrying a Confederate flag and wearing MAGA gear is a Republican. The same people also parrot what their leader says while carrying banners of oppression and racism like the Confederate flag or the Nazi flag.

Fox and AM talk radio moved very quickly to discredit BLM the way they do with anything that goes against Republican principles. They still have a huge voice on social media but are largely hated and not taken seriously by Republicans and right wing media.

Trump didn't call the nazis "very fine people". He said there were "very fine people on both sides" protesting in Charlottesville. He also unequivocally condemned neo-nazis in the aftermath of the attack. MAGA gear isn't nazi anymore than Obama gear is communist. Your examples are weak, which is what I expected.

BLM has itself to blame for not being taken seriously anymore, for reasons I already outlined.

Charlottesville was a rally organized by neo-Nazis and white supremacists

https://theconversation.com/why-are-whi ... omy-137044
https://www.vox.com/2018/7/9/17525860/n ... a-virginia
https://theintercept.com/2020/05/17/tru ... displayed/

All those White people and racists all gathering together. No White people asking, telling, demanding the racists leave. Some of them are even wearing masks but the point is: Republicans openly embrace racists.

BLM is "not taken seriously" for talking about unarmed Black people being killed. The EMT worker, Tamir Rice, Sandra Bland, Trayvon.... That is why BLM is not taken seriously. Their calls for Blacks being treated like Whites is drown out by "but.... but... but..." from the right wing media. And by people screaming "all lives matter". Ok, if all lives matter, that means Black lives matter, right? Apparently not. But, okay... whatever....

None of those links prove your earlier assertions. Saying that Republicans openly embrace racists is like saying that Democrats openly embrace communists. It is hysterical hyperbole and only serves to weaken your argument.

BLM is not taken seriously because they used their power to push people to glorify criminals who were killed justifiably. If they had stuck to clear-cut cases of police brutality and wrongdoing against black people, the wouldn't have lost their credibility. Instead, they chose to try to lionize criminals who most people can't relate to and who were justifiably killed by the police while engaged in violent crimes. Sorry, but you aren't going to win the average person over when you are blocking the highway and preventing that person from going to work because you are mad that a criminal was killed while doing criminal things.

N583JB wrote:

seb146 wrote:

N583JB wrote:

Trump didn't call the nazis "very fine people". He said there were "very fine people on both sides" protesting in Charlottesville. He also unequivocally condemned neo-nazis in the aftermath of the attack. MAGA gear isn't nazi anymore than Obama gear is communist. Your examples are weak, which is what I expected.

BLM has itself to blame for not being taken seriously anymore, for reasons I already outlined.

Charlottesville was a rally organized by neo-Nazis and white supremacists

https://theconversation.com/why-are-whi ... omy-137044
https://www.vox.com/2018/7/9/17525860/n ... a-virginia
https://theintercept.com/2020/05/17/tru ... displayed/

All those White people and racists all gathering together. No White people asking, telling, demanding the racists leave. Some of them are even wearing masks but the point is: Republicans openly embrace racists.

BLM is "not taken seriously" for talking about unarmed Black people being killed. The EMT worker, Tamir Rice, Sandra Bland, Trayvon.... That is why BLM is not taken seriously. Their calls for Blacks being treated like Whites is drown out by "but.... but... but..." from the right wing media. And by people screaming "all lives matter". Ok, if all lives matter, that means Black lives matter, right? Apparently not. But, okay... whatever....

None of those links prove your earlier assertions. Saying that Republicans openly embrace racists is like saying that Democrats openly embrace communists. It is hysterical hyperbole and only serves to weaken your argument.

BLM is not taken seriously because they used their power to push people to glorify criminals who were killed justifiably. If they had stuck to clear-cut cases of police brutality and wrongdoing against black people, the wouldn't have lost their credibility. Instead, they chose to try to lionize criminals who most people can't relate to and who were justifiably killed by the police while engaged in violent crimes. Sorry, but you aren't going to win the average person over when you are blocking the highway and preventing that person from going to work because you are mad that a criminal was killed while doing criminal things.

For seb146 to say that Republicans openly embrace racists, is like saying that Democrats openly embrace pedophiles.
Just because you desperately need or want something to be true, doesn't mean that it is, in fact true.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

N583JB wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Charlottesville was a rally organized by neo-Nazis and white supremacists

https://theconversation.com/why-are-whi ... omy-137044
https://www.vox.com/2018/7/9/17525860/n ... a-virginia
https://theintercept.com/2020/05/17/tru ... displayed/

All those White people and racists all gathering together. No White people asking, telling, demanding the racists leave. Some of them are even wearing masks but the point is: Republicans openly embrace racists.

BLM is "not taken seriously" for talking about unarmed Black people being killed. The EMT worker, Tamir Rice, Sandra Bland, Trayvon.... That is why BLM is not taken seriously. Their calls for Blacks being treated like Whites is drown out by "but.... but... but..." from the right wing media. And by people screaming "all lives matter". Ok, if all lives matter, that means Black lives matter, right? Apparently not. But, okay... whatever....

None of those links prove your earlier assertions. Saying that Republicans openly embrace racists is like saying that Democrats openly embrace communists. It is hysterical hyperbole and only serves to weaken your argument.

BLM is not taken seriously because they used their power to push people to glorify criminals who were killed justifiably. If they had stuck to clear-cut cases of police brutality and wrongdoing against black people, the wouldn't have lost their credibility. Instead, they chose to try to lionize criminals who most people can't relate to and who were justifiably killed by the police while engaged in violent crimes. Sorry, but you aren't going to win the average person over when you are blocking the highway and preventing that person from going to work because you are mad that a criminal was killed while doing criminal things.

For seb146 to say that Republicans openly embrace racists, is like saying that Democrats openly embrace pedophiles.
Just because you desperately need or want something to be true, doesn't mean that it is, in fact true.

Confederate flags are flown by people wearing MAGA hats.

Pedophelia is not even in the same anything so don't.

seb146 wrote:

Confederate flags are flown by people wearing MAGA hats.

Pedophelia is not even in the same anything so don't.

The Confederate flag is not a KKK flag. The German flag isn't a Nazi flag. Don't confuse the two. If I wave a Cuban flag, does that mean I am pro-Castro?

DIRECTFLT wrote:

For seb146 to say that Republicans openly embrace racists, is like saying that Democrats openly embrace pedophiles.
Just because you desperately need or want something to be true, doesn't mean that it is, in fact true.

Still waiting for your response a few posts up. Very much looking forward to hearing your tales of persecution as a white male.

DIRECTFLT wrote:

The Liberal media is using this killing of one person to be some kind of touchpoint. As a white person, I never see the media making any kind of "whites slayed by blacks" a touchpoint. They always rationalize there way around those stories. Ooooops, racism exists on both sides of the equation, but it's only one kind of story that leads and leads and leads. Have fun.

Correct. It's their Method of operation and it won't change.

Race relations have gotten worse, you can thank Obama. The spillover is visible, you don't have to look very hard.

extender wrote:

Race relations have gotten worse, you can thank Obama. The spillover is visible, you don't have to look very hard.

You can't say something like this and expect everyone else to just know what you mean. Obama's been out of office for more than three years. What did he do that remains such an issue to race relations now? And I mean him specifically.

extender wrote:

Race relations have gotten worse, you can thank Obama. The spillover is visible, you don't have to look very hard.

What has Trump done exactly to improve race relations during the last 3+ years?

extender wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Confederate flags are flown by people wearing MAGA hats.

Pedophelia is not even in the same anything so don't.

The Confederate flag is not a KKK flag. The German flag isn't a Nazi flag. Don't confuse the two. If I wave a Cuban flag, does that mean I am pro-Castro?

Go read about the origins of the KKK. The Confederacy plays a big part in that. Considering that one of the reasons the South left the Union was slavery and oppression of an entire race, the Confederate flag is considered by many to be a symbol of racism and hate.

No where did anyone say the German flag is the Nazi flag. There are Nazi flags flown where MAGA hats gather. That's not to say that all MAGAs are racist. But MAGA does tolerate racists, at the very least.

And, yes, by Republican and MAGA standards, flying a Cuban flag can be a pro-Castro sign.

NIKV69 wrote:

DIRECTFLT wrote:

The Liberal media is using this killing of one person to be some kind of touchpoint. As a white person, I never see the media making any kind of "whites slayed by blacks" a touchpoint. They always rationalize there way around those stories. Ooooops, racism exists on both sides of the equation, but it's only one kind of story that leads and leads and leads. Have fun.

Correct. It's their Method of operation and it won't change.

Could it be because when it is "whites slayed by blacks" happens when both sides are armed?

Besides, I thought you guys were all about "all lives matter" and "we don't see race and color" and all that? Why is it you all that bring up race every time if you all don't care?

getting back on topic, they executed a search warrant for the father and son. Also it came out, that two people were in the same house the same day.
and weren't racially profiled by the father and son. I wonder what they are looking for? Also, they tried to throw the person who shot the video under the bus
saying that he blocked and pin the victim in with his vehicle, but we all saw the footage and that didn't happen. Plus the guy who shot the video passed a lie detective test.
That guy, been fired for his job, and is in hiding.

N583JB wrote:

Blue Lives Matter, on the other hand, promotes respect for law enforcement which absolutely saves lives on both sides.

Respect runs both ways, it’s hard to respect the police when the police don’t respect the people they are paid to protect.

N583JB wrote:

aerosreenivas wrote:

I feel the situation has become so worse that every 'Afro American' should thank GOD every day for being alive the very next day. Because sadly, people like Arbery, Travon Martin, David Brown, and many others will be mistaken for as a criminal by some folks and be killed in the name of 'Self-Defence'.

Unfortunately, I feel the Arbery case also will end up this way with the shooters declared as 'Innocent' and the killing legitimate.

But the real reason that we all know is that they are getting killed because they are 'Black'. Period.

Who is/was David Brown?

He was a tractor manufacturer, he also owned Aston Martin for a time. DB stands for David Brown.

N583JB wrote:

aerosreenivas wrote:

I feel the situation has become so worse that every 'Afro American' should thank GOD every day for being alive the very next day. Because sadly, people like Arbery, Travon Martin, David Brown, and many others will be mistaken for as a criminal by some folks and be killed in the name of 'Self-Defence'.

Unfortunately, I feel the Arbery case also will end up this way with the shooters declared as 'Innocent' and the killing legitimate.

But the real reason that we all know is that they are getting killed because they are 'Black'. Period.

Who is/was David Brown?

David Brown made tractors, he was also one of the many owners of Aston Martin, his legacy continues today DB is short for David Brown.

William "Roddie" Bryan has been arrested on charges of Felony Murder & Criminal Attempt to Commit False Imprisonment.

There was a conspiracy to capture and kill Ahmaud Aubrey.

https://www.actionnewsjax.com/news/loca ... KH5XQWLKM/

In the Breonna Taylor case, the police chief has resigned!!!!

The man that took the video of the shooting has been arrested. William "Roddie" Bryan Jr. is facing charges of felony murder and criminal attempt to commit false imprisonment.

Mods, let me know if you want a new thread.

The Trial has been held , and the three defendants have been found guilty of Felony Murder.

https://news.yahoo.com/jury-finds-men-g ... 35692.html

There will be a federal trial for hate crimes due to the racist nature of some of the statements made by the defendants to the police.

https://apnews.com/article/ahmaud-arber ... 6dcf89e7eb

uring a bond hearing in November, prosecutors introduced evidence that Travis McMichael had used racist slurs in a text message and on social media.

At the time Arbery was killed, Georgia was one of just four U.S. states without a hate crimes law. Amid the outcry over his death, Georgia lawmakers quickly passed a law allowing for an additional penalty for certain crimes found to be motivated by a victim’s race, color, religion, national origin, sex, sexual orientation, gender, or mental or physical disability.

The men charged with murdering Arbery won’t face hate crime penalties at the state level because the law was changed after the killing.