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ArchGuy1
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Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 12:03 am

This weekend, dozens of people were seen at a pool party in the Lake of the Ozarks with no one wearing masks or practicing social distancing. This comes as the United States has 96,000 COVID deaths and 1.6 million COVID cases. This comes as social distancing requirements are being relaxed and the number of cases in the area increase. This shows that a huge outbreak may soon be coming to the Lake of the Ozarks region.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatod ... 5253242002
 
DLFREEBIRD
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 12:28 am

sadly, people are believing bots, to justify themselves.
 
NIKV69
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 12:39 am

The same thing happened in Daytona Beach.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local ... s-bridges/

With the weather breaking this will just become widespread. People can't stay in their houses forever. No matter how much you try to scare them with newscasts of doom and gloom and people wearing masks.
I am the Googlizer!!!
 
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WarRI1
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 12:51 am

NIKV69 wrote:
The same thing happened in Daytona Beach.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local ... s-bridges/

With the weather breaking this will just become widespread. People can't stay in their houses forever. No matter how much you try to scare them with newscasts of doom and gloom and people wearing masks.


Well, when they are laying there gasping for breath, maybe, just maybe they will understand how dangerous this is, when the death toll continues to climb above 100 thousand maybe you and trump can explain how it was all a hoax, fake news, a Democratic trick. Pure stupidity may also factor in to the equation. As I have mentioned before, my son who is 6 foot five and strong as an Ox damn neared died from it. Ask him how it was all fake news, a hoax, and a trick. Ask the parents, ask the Doctors, ask any one with one iota of common sense.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
alfa164
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 1:02 am

DLFREEBIRD wrote:
sadly, people are believing bots, to justify themselves.


:checkmark: Exactly. I posted this on another topic, but it is even more relevant here:

The sophistication of the misinformation campaigns far outstrip the cognitive thinking of their targets; the pliable public has become either too lazy or too dumb to question the information they are being fed - much less the sources of that information. The Coronavirus-deniers/anti-vaxers/let's-get-everything-open-now crowd are paying more attention to and being manipulated by malevolent parties with their own agenda - often bots, as it turns out, from places not particularly friendly to our policies an our way of life. To wit:

"Despite overwhelming popular support for stay-at-home orders, there has been a strong push online to end lockdown measures—which one study found has been driven largely by bots."

"The study analyzed over 200 million tweets in support of ending shutdown measures and found that 34% of accounts generating such content are “definitely bots,” while another 32% are “possibly humans with bot assistants.” The researchers also found that 82% of the 50 most influential retweeters of anti-lockdown content, and 88% of the top 1,000 retweeters, are bots. These bots, the researchers say, have been proliferating inaccurate stories about coronavirus and potential cures and dominating conversations about reopening the country. While the researchers couldn’t identify specific entities behind the accounts, they did note that the push “looks like it's a propaganda machine, and it definitely matches the Russian and Chinese playbooks.”



https://www.forbes.com/sites/andrewsolender/2020/05/22/bot-army-behind-reopen-america-push-on-social-media-study-finds/#c94daac39b2b[/quote]


Who would have thought.... propaganda bots from enemy countries would become the most important political weapon in a supposedly well-educated country?
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Aaron747
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 1:06 am

I like how conservative Tom Nichols describes this level of stupidity: ‘these people have a toddler’s understanding of freedom’.

https://twitter.com/radiofreetom/status ... 34048?s=21
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
joeblow10
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 1:40 am

Everyone knew the summer would be the breaking point for lockdowns. Had this begun in the US in January for example, no doubt people would have cabin fever and there probably would be an uptick for a hypothetical spring break. But that’s nothing compared to asking people to sit indoors when it’s 90 and sunny outside at the nicest time of the year... 2.5 months was a lot for most people, you’ll have some stupid ones (I.e. pool partiers), but by and large, many are still keeping their distance or wearing masks.

I know you aren’t like this and this is obviously just a discussion of this, but many I’ve run into amongst my friends are: if you seriously believe everyone will be able to sit in their homes until this is over without seeing scenes like this... you’re naive.

Doesn’t matter how long we all sit inside - all it took was one guy to start a worldwide pandemic, it’ll all begin once again until there is a vaccine or herd immunity
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 2:23 am

Can’t have people describing for themselves, obviously we need busybodies telling to stay locked down. Most Missouri counties have ZERO deaths and a whole 60 deaths under age 60. What’s the risk here?
 
LabQuest
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 2:29 am

Tomorrow will be the 3rd week of being open in my state. The numbers are flat or decreasing still. My county of close to 200,000 people has 6 active cases.

Take that as you will.
Last edited by LabQuest on Mon May 25, 2020 2:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 2:30 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Can’t have people describing for themselves, obviously we need busybodies telling to stay locked down. Most Missouri counties have ZERO deaths and a whole 60 deaths under age 60. What’s the risk here?


MO borders eight states, four of which have had spikes in the last 14 days. Logic says that’s reason enough to exercise caution, according to CDC and WH guidelines.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Kiwirob
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 5:15 am

Aaron747 wrote:
I like how conservative Tom Nichols describes this level of stupidity: ‘these people have a toddler’s understanding of freedom’.

https://twitter.com/radiofreetom/status ... 34048?s=21


1,5m Americans got it, 100,000 died, the chances of getting it, let alone dying from it are pretty slim. I think it would take another 0 added to both numbers to make most people take Corona seriously.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 1:48 pm

And today Donald Trump continues his Harassment and push for more of his legions of less than intelligent supporters to push for opening, by attacking North Carolina's Governor.
Trump is more worried about his beloved convention than actually saving people's lives from COVID-19.

https://www.wral.com/coronavirus/corona ... /19113007/


As long as people like Trump are in charge, the people that are most at risk from COVID-19 are in grave danger. They are pushing for openings and civil disobedience in order to push a political agenda
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
BlueberryWheats
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 3:02 pm

WarRI1 wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
The same thing happened in Daytona Beach.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local ... s-bridges/

With the weather breaking this will just become widespread. People can't stay in their houses forever. No matter how much you try to scare them with newscasts of doom and gloom and people wearing masks.


Well, when they are laying there gasping for breath, maybe, just maybe they will understand how dangerous this is, when the death toll continues to climb above 100 thousand maybe you and trump can explain how it was all a hoax, fake news, a Democratic trick. Pure stupidity may also factor in to the equation. As I have mentioned before, my son who is 6 foot five and strong as an Ox damn neared died from it. Ask him how it was all fake news, a hoax, and a trick. Ask the parents, ask the Doctors, ask any one with one iota of common sense.


NIKV69 wasn't justifying it. But anyway, it's the same here in the UK. No matter what the government say or whatever the media shows, people are starting to ignore lockdown more and more. People are going stir crazy.

And before anyone thinks I'm somehow justifying it, I work at a hospital and have been covered head to toe in suffocating PPE, leaning over ventilated covid patients gasping for breath. Some of whom are my age (early thirties), so I am fully aware of the severity of this illness.
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continental004
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 4:18 pm

The virus may be around forever, we need to LIVE again. Keep the old, weak and sick at home and May the rest of us keep on living.
 
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ER757
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 4:39 pm

The genie is out of the bottle. Here in the Seattle area, I've seen many large gatherings now that the weather has started warming up (today excepted). Last week I was walking near a park and there were about 30 people gathered setting up vollyball nets. There happened to be police car parked maybe 100 yards away and I casually asked the officer if organized sports were okay now since I'd been under the impression they were still forbidden under "phase one" of our state's re-opening plan. His response was, "no they are not, but we really aren't doing enforcement."
So at that point I figured it's game over for trying to further flatten the curve and we may as well brace ourselves for whatever may come next. May as well open back up since the idea of keeping places closed is to isolate from one another where possible.
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 5:00 pm

Is this mentality particular to the Ozark region?

Image
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52795447
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bgm
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 7:08 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
The same thing happened in Daytona Beach.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local ... s-bridges/

With the weather breaking this will just become widespread. People can't stay in their houses forever. No matter how much you try to scare them with newscasts of doom and gloom and people wearing masks.


Almost 100,000 dead in the space of a couple of months, with the death toll sure to climb much higher. How exactly would you put a positive spin on that?

Wearing masks reduce the spread of the virus. Not wearing masks does not.

Not wearing a mask is selfish and irresponsible.

continental004 wrote:
The virus may be around forever, we need to LIVE again. Keep the old, weak and sick at home and May the rest of us keep on living.


Except for the pesky fact that ~ 100,000 people are now not living. They are very much dead.
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joeblow10
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 8:43 pm

bgm wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
The same thing happened in Daytona Beach.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local ... s-bridges/

With the weather breaking this will just become widespread. People can't stay in their houses forever. No matter how much you try to scare them with newscasts of doom and gloom and people wearing masks.


Almost 100,000 dead in the space of a couple of months, with the death toll sure to climb much higher. How exactly would you put a positive spin on that?

Wearing masks reduce the spread of the virus. Not wearing masks does not.

Not wearing a mask is selfish and irresponsible.

continental004 wrote:
The virus may be around forever, we need to LIVE again. Keep the old, weak and sick at home and May the rest of us keep on living.


Except for the pesky fact that ~ 100,000 people are now not living. They are very much dead.


It seems many do not understand the simple fact that regardless of what measures we take, unless we have a vaccine, effective treatments, or immunity, the same people will die regardless. All “flattening” the curve does is spread out those deaths over a longer period of time, so those with a chance to survive make it to the hospital. That’s all that can be done.

Just as the Spanish Flu killed 500K in the US, this will likely do the same. People have to learn to accept that. Soon there will be a lot more than 100K dead. It’s no doubt sad - but it’s not like the deaths will suddenly end until there is a real solution to this - not just staying at home (human nature, unfortunately)

You’re welcome to stay at home for the next indefinite number of months (IF we even get a vaccine). Many will learn to live with this responsibly wearing masks, keeping distance, etc. I may not be stupid enough to go to pool parties and bars, but some will. That’s just life...
 
cpd
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 8:50 pm

continental004 wrote:
The virus may be around forever, we need to LIVE again. Keep the old, weak and sick at home and May the rest of us keep on living.


You are living - you aren’t in a hospital gasping for breath.

You are alive and I’m guessing fairly healthy. You can still do things but in a sensible way by keeping a reasonable distance to others and exercising other precautions. I have ridden 10,135km on a bike this year and continue to average around 500km per week.

How active are the anti-lockdown advocates? A lot less I bet!
 
flyguy89
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 10:31 pm

joeblow10 wrote:
bgm wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
The same thing happened in Daytona Beach.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local ... s-bridges/

With the weather breaking this will just become widespread. People can't stay in their houses forever. No matter how much you try to scare them with newscasts of doom and gloom and people wearing masks.


Almost 100,000 dead in the space of a couple of months, with the death toll sure to climb much higher. How exactly would you put a positive spin on that?

Wearing masks reduce the spread of the virus. Not wearing masks does not.

Not wearing a mask is selfish and irresponsible.

continental004 wrote:
The virus may be around forever, we need to LIVE again. Keep the old, weak and sick at home and May the rest of us keep on living.


Except for the pesky fact that ~ 100,000 people are now not living. They are very much dead.


It seems many do not understand the simple fact that regardless of what measures we take, unless we have a vaccine, effective treatments, or immunity, the same people will die regardless. All “flattening” the curve does is spread out those deaths over a longer period of time, so those with a chance to survive make it to the hospital. That’s all that can be done.

Just as the Spanish Flu killed 500K in the US, this will likely do the same. People have to learn to accept that. Soon there will be a lot more than 100K dead. It’s no doubt sad - but it’s not like the deaths will suddenly end until there is a real solution to this - not just staying at home (human nature, unfortunately)

You’re welcome to stay at home for the next indefinite number of months (IF we even get a vaccine). Many will learn to live with this responsibly wearing masks, keeping distance, etc. I may not be stupid enough to go to pool parties and bars, but some will. That’s just life...

:checkmark: some people have seemed to develop a skewed understanding of just what the purpose of the lockdowns were for. The lockdowns cannot and were never supposed to be about eradicating the virus or halting its spread. The expert consensus: it cannot be eradicated, it's likely here to stay. All we can do is try and pace out the infections to not overwhelm hospitals and protect those we know to be most directly vulnerable until a vaccine or treatment is developed.
 
alfa164
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 10:37 pm

cpd wrote:
You are living - you aren’t in a hospital gasping for breath.
You are alive and I’m guessing fairly healthy. You can still do things but in a sensible way by keeping a reasonable distance to others and exercising other precautions. I have ridden 10,135km on a bike this year and continue to average around 500km per week.
How active are the anti-lockdown advocates? A lot less I bet!



:checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark: . This. Those anti-lockdown lemmings spend their time gathering, waving signs, and whining; if they truly wanted to "get out", they have ample opportunity to bike, run, and participate in individual exercise - all the while maintaining a safe distance from others and - god forbid! - even wearing a mask if it is necessary for everyone's health and safety. Spewing venom is not productive exercise. Ignoring (or denying) facts is not a solution. And spreading a virus - knowingly or not - is not "freedom".

Rage is not patriotism.


flyguy89 wrote:
All we can do is try and pace out the infections to not overwhelm hospitals and protect those we know to be most directly vulnerable until a vaccine or treatment is developed.



Unfortunately, getting together in large, unprotected groups does not achieve that goal.
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GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 11:02 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
Is this mentality particular to the Ozark region?

Image
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52795447


No, pretty much everywhere.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 11:06 pm

bgm wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
The same thing happened in Daytona Beach.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local ... s-bridges/

With the weather breaking this will just become widespread. People can't stay in their houses forever. No matter how much you try to scare them with newscasts of doom and gloom and people wearing masks.


Almost 100,000 dead in the space of a couple of months, with the death toll sure to climb much higher. How exactly would you put a positive spin on that?

Wearing masks reduce the spread of the virus. Not wearing masks does not.

Not wearing a mask is selfish and irresponsible.

continental004 wrote:
The virus may be around forever, we need to LIVE again. Keep the old, weak and sick at home and May the rest of us keep on living.


Except for the pesky fact that ~ 100,000 people are now not living. They are very much dead.


Masks are largely theater, there’s a hope that they might reduce an infected person from spreading the disease, maybe. Docs are divided and proper use is haphazard. Better than nothing but they’re being treated with religious faith.

100,000 dead is less than an average two weeks excess deaths. We don’t even know if that number is under or over, if it’s accurate and who died OF COVID versus who died WITH COVID. Hysteria all around,
 
flyguy89
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 11:21 pm

alfa164 wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
All we can do is try and pace out the infections to not overwhelm hospitals and protect those we know to be most directly vulnerable until a vaccine or treatment is developed.



Unfortunately, getting together in large, unprotected groups does not achieve that goal.

True, and I don't even see how crowding that much in a pool is even enjoyable, but I'm far less concerned there since they're outside than I am seeing some of the pics surfacing of crowded indoor bars.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Mon May 25, 2020 11:29 pm

Based on 38 million people unemployed for an average of six months (the dividing line for long-term unemployment) lockdowns may have cost 19 million person-years. At $5 trillion spent by Uncle Sam, the 100,000 lives cost $50,000,000 each. Then think about the average age of the deceased versus the average age and cost to the 38 million unemployed who might lose whole careers and futures. Then, add in the recent news on increases suicides, substance abuse, domestic violence, increased homelessness. Was the certainty of those outcomes worth the small risks based on the CDC’s estimate of the IFR?

GF
 
DiamondFlyer
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 1:27 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
bgm wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
The same thing happened in Daytona Beach.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local ... s-bridges/

With the weather breaking this will just become widespread. People can't stay in their houses forever. No matter how much you try to scare them with newscasts of doom and gloom and people wearing masks.


Almost 100,000 dead in the space of a couple of months, with the death toll sure to climb much higher. How exactly would you put a positive spin on that?

Wearing masks reduce the spread of the virus. Not wearing masks does not.

Not wearing a mask is selfish and irresponsible.

continental004 wrote:
The virus may be around forever, we need to LIVE again. Keep the old, weak and sick at home and May the rest of us keep on living.


Except for the pesky fact that ~ 100,000 people are now not living. They are very much dead.


Masks are largely theater, there’s a hope that they might reduce an infected person from spreading the disease, maybe. Docs are divided and proper use is haphazard. Better than nothing but they’re being treated with religious faith.

100,000 dead is less than an average two weeks excess deaths. We don’t even know if that number is under or over, if it’s accurate and who died OF COVID versus who died WITH COVID. Hysteria all around,



Exactly, not only are masks theater, they're giving a large number of people a false sense of security. Just take a stroll in an airport terminal, and you'll see more people than not, improperly wearing a mask, to the point that it's no better than having no mask.

Much like the TSA, masks are nothing more than security theater.
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Aaron747
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 1:32 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
bgm wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
The same thing happened in Daytona Beach.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local ... s-bridges/

With the weather breaking this will just become widespread. People can't stay in their houses forever. No matter how much you try to scare them with newscasts of doom and gloom and people wearing masks.


Almost 100,000 dead in the space of a couple of months, with the death toll sure to climb much higher. How exactly would you put a positive spin on that?

Wearing masks reduce the spread of the virus. Not wearing masks does not.

Not wearing a mask is selfish and irresponsible.

continental004 wrote:
The virus may be around forever, we need to LIVE again. Keep the old, weak and sick at home and May the rest of us keep on living.


Except for the pesky fact that ~ 100,000 people are now not living. They are very much dead.


Masks are largely theater, there’s a hope that they might reduce an infected person from spreading the disease, maybe. Docs are divided and proper use is haphazard. Better than nothing but they’re being treated with religious faith.

100,000 dead is less than an average two weeks excess deaths. We don’t even know if that number is under or over, if it’s accurate and who died OF COVID versus who died WITH COVID. Hysteria all around,


I’m just wondering what makes your emotional argument here more legitimate than the countless medical and public health professionals who have opined on the significance and meaning of the evolving data picture, and in many cases - researching them in detail. Their conclusion is not ‘hysteria’.

https://www.pharmaceutical-technology.c ... atalities/

https://www.economist.com/graphic-detai ... -countries

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 20096909v1

https://www.health.org.uk/news-and-comm ... omparisons

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... -counted1/

How do you justify discounting others’ expertise as ‘hysteria’?
Last edited by Aaron747 on Tue May 26, 2020 1:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 1:34 am

The hysteria is not medical, but political.

For more on the trade-offs and costs, here. My argument is not that COVID isn’t a killer, especially for those vulnerable people (myself included); the argument is that the trade-offs are really devastating and are likely not worth it. Unless you want to just ignore 38 million people, 40% of whom may not go back to work anytime soon.

https://thehill.com/opinion/healthcare/ ... rs-of-life
Last edited by GalaxyFlyer on Tue May 26, 2020 1:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 1:38 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
The hysteria is not medical, but political.

For more on the trade-offs and costs, here

https://thehill.com/opinion/healthcare/ ... rs-of-life


Fine that you added a qualifier, but you are still making blanket assumptions about the data that don’t jive at all with what those with expertise are reporting in research, as linked.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 1:44 am

Your Health UK link had this update.

In Spain and Italy, peaks of over 100% increase in deaths were also observed. The peak week and subsequent decrease in excess deaths were 2 weeks ahead of England and Wales.

The peak week figures for France and Sweden were much lower, at 55% and 46%, respectively. The figures are similar despite quite different approaches to lock-down.


Explain to me how Sweden has lower numbers than Spain with a very extreme lockdown regime?
 
ThePointblank
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 1:52 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Your Health UK link had this update.

In Spain and Italy, peaks of over 100% increase in deaths were also observed. The peak week and subsequent decrease in excess deaths were 2 weeks ahead of England and Wales.

The peak week figures for France and Sweden were much lower, at 55% and 46%, respectively. The figures are similar despite quite different approaches to lock-down.


Explain to me how Sweden has lower numbers than Spain with a very extreme lockdown regime?

Sweden's population is observing social distancing in general, but Sweden's death rate is significantly higher than Spain, and is significantly higher than it's neighbours, which is telling.

Also, Sweden's testing rate is lagging; the Swedes are mostly focusing in on healthcare workers and people whose cases who are serious enough to end up in the hospital, so we don’t know the number of people infected who suffer mild or no symptoms. It is generally acknowledged by the Swedish that their actual infection number is probably significantly higher, and that the reported rate isn't representative.
 
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WarRI1
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 2:31 am

Look you blind, hear you deaf, there are almost 100K US dead and growing, that says it all. When you are dead, you are dead, when you die of suffocation, that is a tough way to get dead. Ask the 100K if we did or are doing it right now. Ask the 100k US already dead if they wanted to die. I say to you Cavalier types, I hope you do not give it to somebody in the vulnerable age group which includes the young, the middle aged and the elderly and those who are suffering already from ill health and Lord forbid someone in those groups is in your family or friends and passes away because you did not wear a mask or use precautions. Death is not political, but how you got dead is with this calamity from the morons in charge here.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
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DocLightning
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 3:02 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Masks are largely theater, there’s a hope that they might reduce an infected person from spreading the disease, maybe. Docs are divided and proper use is haphazard. Better than nothing but they’re being treated with religious faith.


80-90% reduction in transmission.(1)

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
100,000 dead is less than an average two weeks excess deaths. We don’t even know if that number is under or over, if it’s accurate and who died OF COVID versus who died WITH COVID. Hysteria all around,


If you die in a hospital with COVID and comorbidities and were previously stable, you died of COVID. This ridiculous trope has been trotted around by the hoaxers and Russian trolls.

As for you not caring about 100,000 dead, I can't teach you basic morality or respect for human life.

(1)https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32355904/?from_term=COVID-19+mask+transmission&from_page=2&from_pos=4
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 3:49 am

DocLightning wrote:

As for you not caring about 100,000 dead, I can't teach you basic morality or respect for human life.

(1)https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32355904/?from_term=COVID-19+mask+transmission&from_page=2&from_pos=4



At this point, I would be mighty impressed with simple consistency there. In about three months, these same people will be mindlessly hollering never forget with memes showing burning buildings and muslims.

Fast forward nearly twenty years and sustain that many fatalities a day, and it somehow becomes theatre.

Alternatively, if the Covid victims were well paid, volunteer special forces types and we could use all sorts of magic to tie their plight to Hillary, perhaps then there would be some concern.

No, like most, I am well and truly past expending energy on expectations of any sign of morality there...
"Nous ne sommes pas infectés. Il n'y a pas d'infection ici..."
 
LCDFlight
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 4:35 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Based on 38 million people unemployed for an average of six months (the dividing line for long-term unemployment) lockdowns may have cost 19 million person-years. At $5 trillion spent by Uncle Sam, the 100,000 lives cost $50,000,000 each. Then think about the average age of the deceased versus the average age and cost to the 38 million unemployed who might lose whole careers and futures. Then, add in the recent news on increases suicides, substance abuse, domestic violence, increased homelessness. Was the certainty of those outcomes worth the small risks based on the CDC’s estimate of the IFR?

GF


It's not only the unemployed who have lost quality time. It's everyone. We are at 100 million person-years lost now (in the US)... over 1 million lives, in that sense.

Also, it would make more sense to count 100,000 lives lost in terms of years. If each person would have lived an additional 3 years (in my state that's how it looks - median age of a COVID death is 83), that makes 300,000 years. With an average lifespan of 80 years, this means around 4,000 lives have been lost.

So it is actually $1 Billion per full life saved. This is not a skeptic or a wing nut point of view, this is basic demographics, basic actuarial math. It is the way public health issues are measured and prioritized.
 
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stl07
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 6:11 am

Aaron747 wrote:
GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Can’t have people describing for themselves, obviously we need busybodies telling to stay locked down. Most Missouri counties have ZERO deaths and a whole 60 deaths under age 60. What’s the risk here?


MO borders eight states, four of which have had spikes in the last 14 days. Logic says that’s reason enough to exercise caution, according to CDC and WH guidelines.

That's because nobody lives in those counties. When you have a population of 5, it's unlikely to have a death. Almost every town in MO apart from KC and STL and some minor towns like Colombia and Springfield have a very low population and are nothing more than tourist towns. All those people in the videos live in STL, KC, Chicago, and Dallas. People come from Florida to the lake as well which I never understand. I fully expect a massive flare in the number of cases in nearby St. Louis shortly, which will then be blamed on liberal politics and the city's shut down orders these fools were trying to escape.
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
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stl07
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 6:19 am

The problem with these fuckheads is that on their drive back from the lake to where ever they came from, they will undoubtedly stop at all of our restaurants in STL and spread the virus to all the workers (most of whom are minorities and they have a higher death rate). And then when I (and everyone else) go out to support these small businesses and restaurants, I'll get it too. When the cases spike, it will be blamed on the city's liberal politics. Our county executive put a 14-day quarantine on anybody entering STL who has visited the lake, but I fully expect the Trump supporters to disobey him since he's a democrat and democrats made up this virus.
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
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stl07
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 6:22 am

https://www.stltoday.com/online/sam-pag ... 8a13a.html
Their employers will fuck them now. HA!
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
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bgm
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 7:30 am

It's interesting that the same crowd who were loudest yelling:

- RAH RAH RAH BENGHAZI over 4 deaths
- ALL LIVES MATTER regarding black people being killed by police brutality
- LIFE IS SACRED, anti-abortion
- NEVER FORGET (after 9/11)

just shrug their shoulders at one hundred thousand deaths. The vile stench of hypocrisy. :sarcastic:

The top 4 countries with confirmed cases of Covid-19:

1,662,768 US
374,898 Brazil
353,427 Russia
262,547 United Kingdom

Look at the leaders of those 4 countries. It truly is a fascinating coincidence that they are all right wing, anti-science, narcissistic morons who are more obsessed with their own image than the well being of their citizens.
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bmartino99
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 1:44 pm

stl07 wrote:
The problem with these fuckheads is that on their drive back from the lake to where ever they came from, they will undoubtedly stop at all of our restaurants in STL and spread the virus to all the workers (most of whom are minorities and they have a higher death rate). And then when I (and everyone else) go out to support these small businesses and restaurants, I'll get it too. When the cases spike, it will be blamed on the city's liberal politics. Our county executive put a 14-day quarantine on anybody entering STL who has visited the lake, but I fully expect the Trump supporters to disobey him since he's a democrat and democrats made up this virus.



You don't seriously think all these young, college age, kids out at lake, river, beach, or pool parties around the country are all Trump supporters, do you? A large majority of those 30 and under would never support a Republican. Keep painting with a wide brush though.
 
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trpmb6
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 2:56 pm

So I was at Lake of the Ozarks this weekend as I am almost every year. Let me make just some general statements about what I witnessed while I was there.

1) This was by far the busiest I have ever seen it at the lake. The reasons why are rather simple. The type of people who have the money to afford a lake cabin are the type of people who work white collar jobs and are currently working from home. I talked around a bit and talked to one of the grocery store workers, he said their supply chain wasn't prepared for the number of people remaining at the lake 24/7. They usually only have to stock up for the weekend crowds.

2) The vast majority of places people were practicing social distancing. In reality, you're far better off at a cabin on a lake and riding around in a boat than you are in any sort of urban setting. Yes, I did see a couple instances of increased contact, but these were multiple boats anchored together in which those doing so are 100% doing so voluntarily and would likely see each other anyways. I didn't witness anything like what you would typically see in the Ozarks at Party cove, but I didn't boat around enough to gauge that - the water was far too rough for my liking - see comment 1 about how busy it was.

3) While I didn't go to any restaurants (because I knew this is what would happen) our neighbors did go to Captain Rons for some drinks. Most waited in their boats and ordered dock side. Some were dining at the outdoor seating and were for the most part well separated.

4) I've been in the pool shown in the clip, trust me, that is tame. I would actually classify this as "socially distancing" compared to what you normally see there.

5) We had a great weekend otherwise. Enjoyed nice relaxing time with the family. Did some fishing. The kids went swimming in the frigid water and had a blast. The weather was supposed to be terrible but it ended up being beautiful both Saturday and most of Sunday. I suspect that helped encourage people to go out. It was a good mental recovery tool. I've been very depressed the last 6 weeks. I'm finally optimistic about things again.

At some point you have to realize that people are still interacting with other people. You can't prevent that. I bet nobody at the restaurant was sick, and in 2 weeks it'll be a forgotten moment in history.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 3:13 pm

I finally looked this place up on the satellite, and it is rather large. Nice vacation area, but it all highlights what is occurring . We have people that are missing the social interactions, and while I understand it, it ultimately puts everyone at risk down the road. Look at Georgia's numbers this week, They will be a sign of what is coming.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
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trpmb6
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 3:27 pm

casinterest wrote:
I finally looked this place up on the satellite, and it is rather large. Nice vacation area, but it all highlights what is occurring . We have people that are missing the social interactions, and while I understand it, it ultimately puts everyone at risk down the road. Look at Georgia's numbers this week, They will be a sign of what is coming.


Its sandwiched between two large metropolitan areas. About 3 hours drive from each. Highways are jampacked on holiday weekends with people trying to get out to their cabins. Similar to how Highway 35 north of the twin cities gets jam packed on people going to their cabins up north.

If you don't have a 35+ foot sea ray you don't really go out on the weekends between the Dam and the "four corners" (mile marker 32). The closer to Osage Beach you get, the bigger the boat required. My family has a smaller boat, at 25 foot. We don't go out on holiday weekends except very early.

You want to talk about people who just have money to throw around. That's the place it happens.
 
stlgph
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 8:07 pm

I was at a lake in Indiana this past weekend crowded with people from Indiana, Illinois and Michigan. All that stuff we've been doing for the past 2 months about wearing masks staying apart and not having orgies and having communal food and all that....? none of that was happening. Boats were packed, restaurants packed, bars packed, sandbars packed, swimming areas packed....people are done.
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trpmb6
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 8:11 pm

stlgph wrote:
I was at a lake in Indiana this past weekend crowded with people from Indiana, Illinois and Michigan. All that stuff we've been doing for the past 2 months about wearing masks staying apart and not having orgies and having communal food and all that....? none of that was happening. Boats were packed, restaurants packed, bars packed, sandbars packed, swimming areas packed....people are done.


Pretty much what I'm hearing from every person I know. "i'm done"

Right or wrong.. I understand
 
stlgph
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 8:17 pm

I hear you. You can put me in the "I'm done" category as well - not because I have any disrespect for the initiatives or the programs trying to combat this whole thing, but being in Illinois, it's still shut down while Indiana, Missouri and Iowa are wide open - not sure where Kentucky stands as it's way down south - but Wisconsin - even more so. There are hordes of people headed across the state line, just like this past weekend. So I'm done on the count of if we're doing to do it - let's all do it - if we're not all doing to do it - then I'll be more productive pissing into the wind.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
joeblow10
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Tue May 26, 2020 9:59 pm

trpmb6 wrote:
stlgph wrote:
I was at a lake in Indiana this past weekend crowded with people from Indiana, Illinois and Michigan. All that stuff we've been doing for the past 2 months about wearing masks staying apart and not having orgies and having communal food and all that....? none of that was happening. Boats were packed, restaurants packed, bars packed, sandbars packed, swimming areas packed....people are done.


Pretty much what I'm hearing from every person I know. "i'm done"

Right or wrong.. I understand


:checkmark: spot on. 2 months was long enough for most people. If a second wave doesn’t happen to emerge in the coming weeks, you can bet the amount of people who no longer care is only going to get larger
 
Ken777
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Wed May 27, 2020 1:05 am

The push by Trump to get people "back to work" and not warring masks strongly reminds me of the news articles about his hotels and resorts being hit hard
by the shutdown. The longer people are ar playing it smart the more his businesses are being hit. How many tens of thousands f employees do you think Trump has laid off so far.

And is there anyone here who actually believes that Trump "really' cares about your health - especially over his cash and profit?

It's the Dumb Trumpers at the pool who will help create the next surge in new cases and deaths. And if they get the diagnosis they will look around for someone else to blame.
 
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trpmb6
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Wed May 27, 2020 1:33 am

Ken777 wrote:

It's the Dumb Trumpers at the pool who will help create the next surge in new cases and deaths. And if they get the diagnosis they will look around for someone else to blame.


Do you really think all those people were "dumb trumpers"

I assure you, they are not. Far from it. These are rich lawyers and doctors from St. Louis and Kansas City with nothing better to do.
 
Pi7472000
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Re: Crowded Pool Party in the Ozarks

Wed May 27, 2020 3:11 am

Sounds like we need to bring back A full lockdown. This is not the flu or a conspiracy theory.

People need to shelter in place, only go out for essential goods and when they do they need to wear a mask. When one needs to recreate it needs to be done within a ten mile radius as to not spread the virus to other communities.

We are not even close to a vaccine at this point so we all need to continue to social distance and wear masks for our communities.

It is gross to see these people living in fear of data and science that gives us answers as to how to mitigate the spread of COVID19. We need to advocate for a better social safety net so we all can stay home and save lives.

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