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Kiwirob
Topic Author
Posts: 12802
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:16 pm

Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 7:33 am

Jetty wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
extender wrote:

More violence and mayhem? Are you nuts? Can, worms, large, one each. Open it. This is wrong on so many levels.


It already opened when we as a society allowed different treatment for similar situations based on class and neighborhood.


Explain the death of Justine Diamond to me please. Same city, upper class, white, not a criminal but the reporter of a crime and shot death for no reason whatsoever. People itt apply general statistics to specific incidents way too easily. We have no way of knowing if this would have gone down differently if there was a white upper class guy turning up with a fake bill.


What is there too explain, cop shot her and now he's in prison for 12 years.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 7:38 am

Things are very fluid now - Twitter has added public service warnings about ‘glorification of violence’ on 45’s tweets this evening and libertarian Rep. Amash (I-MI) has urged Guard units not to comply with any ‘unlawful’ orders.

https://twitter.com/justinamash/status/ ... 87136?s=21
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Jetty
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 7:42 am

Kiwirob wrote:
Jetty wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:

It already opened when we as a society allowed different treatment for similar situations based on class and neighborhood.


Explain the death of Justine Diamond to me please. Same city, upper class, white, not a criminal but the reporter of a crime and shot death for no reason whatsoever. People itt apply general statistics to specific incidents way too easily. We have no way of knowing if this would have gone down differently if there was a white upper class guy turning up with a fake bill.


What is there too explain, cop shot her and now he's in prison for 12 years.

What’s there for you to explain after your statement about class and neighborhood is how that could happen to an upper class woman in a good neighborhood.
 
Kiwirob
Topic Author
Posts: 12802
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 7:45 am

alberchico wrote:
https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2020/05/28/twin-cities-brace-for-another-night-of-unrest-violence-looting-after-death-of-george-floyd/

Looks like a local police precinct has been attacked

Image


This is just counterproductive, what the police did was incredibly wrong, violence and looting doesn't make it right and detracts from the issue. It also reinforces many people's beliefs that black people are violent.
 
JJJ
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 7:46 am

N757ST wrote:
How again is robbing a target bringing about change in America? Can someone help me that one?


Just like when they tried kneeling you mean? Achieved nothing and still stirred up all kinds of backlash.

This will end up achieving exactly the same, but comes with a free TV.
 
Kiwirob
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Posts: 12802
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 7:48 am

Jetty wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Jetty wrote:

Explain the death of Justine Diamond to me please. Same city, upper class, white, not a criminal but the reporter of a crime and shot death for no reason whatsoever. People itt apply general statistics to specific incidents way too easily. We have no way of knowing if this would have gone down differently if there was a white upper class guy turning up with a fake bill.


What is there too explain, cop shot her and now he's in prison for 12 years.

What’s there for you to explain after your statement about class and neighborhood is how that could happen to an upper class woman in a good neighborhood.


I never made a statement about class and neighbourhood, as far as I'm concerned an incompetent cop made another stupid error of judgement and shoot someone without checking why they needed to shoot. It's just another example of a gun ho poorly trained US cop, just like the idiot who killed Floyd. The fact that Diamond was white and the cop was black makes makes no difference to me.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 7:50 am

Jetty wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Jetty wrote:

Explain the death of Justine Diamond to me please. Same city, upper class, white, not a criminal but the reporter of a crime and shot death for no reason whatsoever. People itt apply general statistics to specific incidents way too easily. We have no way of knowing if this would have gone down differently if there was a white upper class guy turning up with a fake bill.


What is there too explain, cop shot her and now he's in prison for 12 years.

What’s there for you to explain after your statement about class and neighborhood is how that could happen to an upper class woman in a good neighborhood.


That was my statement - and psychosocially, perception is everything. You do the math.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
aerosreenivas
Posts: 147
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 8:07 am

seb146 wrote:

It kinda looks altered. Interesting how zero lives and zero buildings were torched and zero lives were lost when White "protesters" entered government buildings armed to the teeth. I wonder what the difference was? The national guard was not called out when armed White people stormed government buildings with loaded weapons but the national guard must be called out when armed non-White people storm government buildings. Just wondering what the difference is.......


The answer is obvious. The difference is that the Armed White Protesters reasons were more mild. For several decades they never had any problems of a police officer kneeling on the neck of a white person struggling to breath. Nor they had to face 'Police Brutality' on them.

Whereas, historically that's not been the case with all the 'Non-White Americans'. So the 'Tolerance Level' would have gone way down this time.

That is the main difference that has led to all these protesters to vent their anger against the authorities and damage all the properties. This may not be justified though, I agree but this had to happen.
 
aerosreenivas
Posts: 147
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 9:18 am

Trump, as usual, adding fuel to the fire by calling these protesters as 'Thugs'. Also, suggesting the police officers to shoot all the looters.

In these times of uncertainties, when someone looks upon you for 'Easing The Pain', here is a person who only wants to 'Stir More Hatred' amongst people of different color, faith and nationality.
Last edited by aerosreenivas on Fri May 29, 2020 9:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
ltbewr
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 9:25 am

I suspect many of the Black protesters would like to do to these police officers like happened to too many of them in history, find them and lynch them to death. Black people are not much different that White people in wanting blood revenge for crimes done unto them, the hell with a slow footed judiciary but that is dead wrong too. The wide media distribution of the video of the deadly arrest as has happened in too many cases is seen as the only evidence needed to cause a summary execution of the police officers. Allegedly the accused cops have 'pleaded the Fifth', likely directed by their union's well paid lawyers and good advice. The Great Pandemic will likely mean a long delay in bring charges and trial not likely until 2022. Justice delayed is justice denied for all.

That this is happening during the Great Pandemic just compounds the situation. I wonder how many will get Covid-19 from exposure to the large crowds of protesters and rioters. It takes away city and state resources, already crippled by losses of tax revenues, destroyed property and investments in the community, a loss of necessary retail and jobs.

These riots also will mean a further hardening of racial lines. Politically, President Trump took advantage of these riots to rally support for his re-election Tweeting 'when the looting starts, the shooting starts', implying that cops and National Guard troops have orders to shoot to kill any protesters. Sadly, these and related unrest by Black persons in other cities could lead to his re-election. Of course some will point out the relatively peaceful but extremely threatening protests by gun toting White right wingers against the several state's Pandemic emergency orders in fact endorsed by Pres. Trump. Those protests succeeded in likely ending Pandemic restrictions too soon and putting more at risk of getting Covid-19.
Last edited by ltbewr on Fri May 29, 2020 9:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
extender
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 9:26 am

Love the hypocrisy, many people bitch at a peaceful assembly/protest, but try to justify this fracas. I love seeing Holder refer to Fergusson, where a black wannabe hoodlum, committed strong arm robbery, then was confronted, tried to attack the cop, and got killed. Love that liberal narrative.
 
Derico
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 9:30 am

The US police system was paramilitarized a few decades ago, for what reasons who knows. This is the result.

In most countries I have visited, it is clear the police officers in the street are part of the civilian population, they engage their communities and make it clear they are not to feared. In the USA, I noticed the police absolutely DO NOT engage, and in fact are to be avoided (from the words of many Americans I talked to). They also self-segregate, hanging together in groups of several police officers near coffee shops of the like but making it clear they are separate from the general population and not to be approached. It's just a a bad system and culture than no one in the world has therefore imitated.

That said there are many good individual officers, who do great and kind acts you can see on youtube regularly.
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 9:44 am

extender wrote:
Love the hypocrisy, many people bitch at a peaceful assembly/protest, but try to justify this fracas. I love seeing Holder refer to Fergusson, where a black wannabe hoodlum, committed strong arm robbery, then was confronted, tried to attack the cop, and got killed. Love that liberal narrative.


Putting words in people’s mouths is straight up rude, especially when one has failed to grasp subtext or nuance.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Jetty
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 9:46 am

aerosreenivas wrote:
seb146 wrote:

It kinda looks altered. Interesting how zero lives and zero buildings were torched and zero lives were lost when White "protesters" entered government buildings armed to the teeth. I wonder what the difference was? The national guard was not called out when armed White people stormed government buildings with loaded weapons but the national guard must be called out when armed non-White people storm government buildings. Just wondering what the difference is.......


The answer is obvious. The difference is that the Armed White Protesters reasons were more mild. For several decades they never had any problems of a police officer kneeling on the neck of a white person struggling to breath. Nor they had to face 'Police Brutality' on them.

This is utterly false. Are you spreading fake news to ignite racial tensions? What about Tony Timpa: https://www.dallasnews.com/news/investi ... ssion=true or Daniel Shaver https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2017/12/1 ... ay-new.cnn ?
 
N583JB
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 10:17 am

seb146 wrote:
aerosreenivas wrote:
alberchico wrote:
https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2020/05/28/twin-cities-brace-for-another-night-of-unrest-violence-looting-after-death-of-george-floyd/

Looks like a local police precinct has been attacked

Image


Yup. I'm watching the live reporting of this scene right now on CNN.

In fact, there are 3 police precinct that are on fire including the one in this picture.


It kinda looks altered. Interesting how zero lives and zero buildings were torched and zero lives were lost when White "protesters" entered government buildings armed to the teeth. I wonder what the difference was? The national guard was not called out when armed White people stormed government buildings with loaded weapons but the national guard must be called out when armed non-White people storm government buildings. Just wondering what the difference is.......


The difference is the white protesters were protesting while these protesters are rioting.
 
N583JB
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 10:19 am

JJJ wrote:
N757ST wrote:
How again is robbing a target bringing about change in America? Can someone help me that one?


Just like when they tried kneeling you mean? Achieved nothing and still stirred up all kinds of backlash.

This will end up achieving exactly the same, but comes with a free TV.


And new TVs for the cops as well, that they can buy with their fat overtime checks that they are getting because of these riots.
 
aerosreenivas
Posts: 147
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 10:54 am

Jetty wrote:
aerosreenivas wrote:
seb146 wrote:

It kinda looks altered. Interesting how zero lives and zero buildings were torched and zero lives were lost when White "protesters" entered government buildings armed to the teeth. I wonder what the difference was? The national guard was not called out when armed White people stormed government buildings with loaded weapons but the national guard must be called out when armed non-White people storm government buildings. Just wondering what the difference is.......


The answer is obvious. The difference is that the Armed White Protesters reasons were more mild. For several decades they never had any problems of a police officer kneeling on the neck of a white person struggling to breath. Nor they had to face 'Police Brutality' on them.

This is utterly false. Are you spreading fake news to ignite racial tensions? What about Tony Timpa: https://www.dallasnews.com/news/investi ... ssion=true or Daniel Shaver https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2017/12/1 ... ay-new.cnn ?


Well, I don't believe in Fake News one bit. I'm only highlighting the fact what I come across in the news channels like CNN and few others.

Unfortunately, many news channels don't focus on reporting incidents that involved a White American being killed due to police brutality like the examples you have shared.

That has to change so that I can see the 'Holistic View' and not be biased towards a specific community.

I don't have to stir up any racial tensions here. I'm only stating my views what I am seeing.

Now, just check this link out where it shows the 'Live Recording' of one of the CNN reporter being arrested without any reason. He happens to be a Black guy.

Whereas, his colleague, Josh Campbell, identified himself as a CNN reporter who was a White Guy and he was not arrested.

I'm not saying this. This is coming from one of the CNN news anchor, John Bremen himself.

https://edition.cnn.com/us/live-news/ge ... 1d0f2a1552

Now, you please tell me how should I look at it.
 
Jetty
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 11:06 am

aerosreenivas wrote:
Jetty wrote:
aerosreenivas wrote:

The answer is obvious. The difference is that the Armed White Protesters reasons were more mild. For several decades they never had any problems of a police officer kneeling on the neck of a white person struggling to breath. Nor they had to face 'Police Brutality' on them.

This is utterly false. Are you spreading fake news to ignite racial tensions? What about Tony Timpa: https://www.dallasnews.com/news/investi ... ssion=true or Daniel Shaver https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2017/12/1 ... ay-new.cnn ?


Well, I don't believe in Fake News one bit. I'm only highlighting the fact what I come across in the news channels like CNN and few others.

Unfortunately, many news channels don't focus on reporting incidents that involved a White American being killed due to police brutality like the examples you have shared.

That has to change so that I can see the 'Holistic View' and not be biased towards a specific community.

I don't have to stir up any racial tensions here. I'm only stating my views what I am seeing.

Now, just check this link out where it shows the 'Live Recording' of one of the CNN reporter being arrested without any reason. He happens to be a Black guy.

Whereas, his colleague, Josh Campbell, identified himself as a CNN reporter who was a White Guy and he was not arrested.

I'm not saying this. This is coming from one of the CNN news anchor, John Bremen himself.

https://edition.cnn.com/us/live-news/ge ... 1d0f2a1552

Now, you please tell me how should I look at it.

You should assume that racism is one of the factors that causes police brutality and misbehavior, but not apply that with certainty to an incident involving someone black, exclude other factors or make generalizing statements like that white people don’t have anything to fear from police.
 
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scbriml
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 11:14 am

N583JB wrote:
The difference is the white protesters were protesting while these protesters are rioting.


Seriously, what do you expect?

After years and years of abuse and suppression (going back to slavery), through emancipation and alleged equality, to still be treated unequally is tough to take.

Then you try peaceful protest and what did that acheive? It didn't get the respect and understanding it deserved, but a doubling-down of hatred.
Image

The difference is the armed white protesters haven't had to endure 0.1% of what these protesters have over generations. How do you not understand that?

I'm not defending it, nor condoning it, just trying to explain the "subtle" difference.
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phatfarmlines
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 11:30 am

seb146 wrote:

Officers can not do both? Yell at the one officer to stop killing a man while telling spectators to stand back? Two officers holding off onlookers while a third takes the offending officer off the man's neck?


I agree that there needs to be a revision on how it was handled. Someone on an earlier post mentioned CRM-like practices which could have benefitted the officers.
 
extender
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 11:35 am

Apples and oranges. What has Kaepernic suffered besides a mediocre career? What happened when the Somali cop in Minnesota shot the white woman? Go ahead, I'll wait for your answer.
 
AirWorthy99
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 11:37 am

Trump’s tweeting again doesnt help, but if these people arent thugs whar are they?

Last night I saw the protest, most of them were white, which leads me to believe Antifa has descended into MSP.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister
 
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Mortyman
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 11:39 am

CNN journalist Omar Jimenez has been taken into police custody during a live broadcast at the site of the protests in Minneapolis, after clearly identifying himself to officers.

Jimenez's crew, including a producer and a camera operator, were also placed in handcuffs.

The CNN camera was also taken into custody and continued to record as the crew was handcuffed, with police seemingly unaware that the camera was still on.
 
aerosreenivas
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 11:39 am

Jetty wrote:
aerosreenivas wrote:
Jetty wrote:
This is utterly false. Are you spreading fake news to ignite racial tensions? What about Tony Timpa: https://www.dallasnews.com/news/investi ... ssion=true or Daniel Shaver https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2017/12/1 ... ay-new.cnn ?


Well, I don't believe in Fake News one bit. I'm only highlighting the fact what I come across in the news channels like CNN and few others.

Unfortunately, many news channels don't focus on reporting incidents that involved a White American being killed due to police brutality like the examples you have shared.

That has to change so that I can see the 'Holistic View' and not be biased towards a specific community.

I don't have to stir up any racial tensions here. I'm only stating my views what I am seeing.

Now, just check this link out where it shows the 'Live Recording' of one of the CNN reporter being arrested without any reason. He happens to be a Black guy.

Whereas, his colleague, Josh Campbell, identified himself as a CNN reporter who was a White Guy and he was not arrested.

I'm not saying this. This is coming from one of the CNN news anchor, John Bremen himself.

https://edition.cnn.com/us/live-news/ge ... 1d0f2a1552

Now, you please tell me how should I look at it.

You should assume that racism is one of the factors that causes police brutality and misbehavior, but not apply that with certainty to an incident involving someone black, exclude other factors or make generalizing statements like that white people don’t have anything to fear from police.


Yup. I agree with you on this point completely.
 
N757ST
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 11:39 am

seb146 wrote:
aerosreenivas wrote:
alberchico wrote:
https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2020/05/28/twin-cities-brace-for-another-night-of-unrest-violence-looting-after-death-of-george-floyd/

Looks like a local police precinct has been attacked

Image


Yup. I'm watching the live reporting of this scene right now on CNN.

In fact, there are 3 police precinct that are on fire including the one in this picture.


It kinda looks altered. Interesting how zero lives and zero buildings were torched and zero lives were lost when White "protesters" entered government buildings armed to the teeth. I wonder what the difference was? The national guard was not called out when armed White people stormed government buildings with loaded weapons but the national guard must be called out when armed non-White people storm government buildings. Just wondering what the difference is.......


The white protesters came in and did their protest and left. They didn’t burn down businesses, they didn’t loot. Whether you agreed with it or not, their message was conveyed. What’s the message here? This thread is a perfect example of how ineffective this rioting and looting is.... we’re no longer talking about this mans death and change, we are talking about the hooliganism taking place. Do any of you really think those looters gave 2 [email protected] about George Floyd?
 
extender
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 11:42 am

N757ST wrote:
Do any of you really think those looters gave 2 [email protected] about George Floyd?


Not one bit.

Fire bombing a police station? Nope. Should not be tolerated. Anarchy cannot be tolerated.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 11:48 am

N757ST wrote:
seb146 wrote:
aerosreenivas wrote:

Yup. I'm watching the live reporting of this scene right now on CNN.

In fact, there are 3 police precinct that are on fire including the one in this picture.


It kinda looks altered. Interesting how zero lives and zero buildings were torched and zero lives were lost when White "protesters" entered government buildings armed to the teeth. I wonder what the difference was? The national guard was not called out when armed White people stormed government buildings with loaded weapons but the national guard must be called out when armed non-White people storm government buildings. Just wondering what the difference is.......


The white protesters came in and did their protest and left. They didn’t burn down businesses, they didn’t loot. Whether you agreed with it or not, their message was conveyed. What’s the message here? This thread is a perfect example of how ineffective this rioting and looting is.... we’re no longer talking about this mans death and change, we are talking about the hooliganism taking place. Do any of you really think those looters gave 2 [email protected] about George Floyd?


Not sure what you're on about. In this video from Target, there are all kinds of people. Looters have three things in common: opportunity, poor morals, and limited bank accounts.

https://twitter.com/ohboywhatashot/stat ... 34433?s=20
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
N583JB
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 12:27 pm

scbriml wrote:
N583JB wrote:
The difference is the white protesters were protesting while these protesters are rioting.


Seriously, what do you expect?

After years and years of abuse and suppression (going back to slavery), through emancipation and alleged equality, to still be treated unequally is tough to take.

Then you try peaceful protest and what did that acheive? It didn't get the respect and understanding it deserved, but a doubling-down of hatred.
Image

The difference is the armed white protesters haven't had to endure 0.1% of what these protesters have over generations. How do you not understand that?

I'm not defending it, nor condoning it, just trying to explain the "subtle" difference.


Rioting won't get them what they want, either. Look at Ferguson, Charlotte, Baltimore. Riots broke out and the officers were (justifiably) vindicated. Look at Charleston...no riots, and the officer went to prison. Justice doesn't care about riots. Facts don't change just because a few buildings burn. The riots do nothing to help advance a cause....they only hurt the communities they happen in.
 
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scbriml
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 12:35 pm

extender wrote:
Apples and oranges. What has Kaepernic suffered besides a mediocre career? What happened when the Somali cop in Minnesota shot the white woman? Go ahead, I'll wait for your answer.


You're apparent lack of awareness is shocking.

Regardless of your opinion of his football ability, taking a knee wasn't about Kaepernick's personal suffering. It wasn't about "disrespecting the flag", it wasn't about "insulting the military" or any of those other bullshit reactions offered by those who refuse to understand. How do you not get that? Just how?

A white woman shot by a non-white cop is a rare incident that wasn't fuelled by centuries of unjust oppression, inequality and racism. How do you need that false equivalence explained to you?
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
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scbriml
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 12:38 pm

N583JB wrote:
Rioting won't get them what they want, either.


I didn't say it would and I didn't condone it.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 12:57 pm

The rioters will hopefully be brought to justice. This is only serving to facilitate further issues down the line.
Was nothing learned in LA, Ferguson, Baltimore? We seem to have the same repeated issues occurring as time goes on.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
aerosreenivas
Posts: 147
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 1:05 pm

The 'Looting And Rioting' taking place is hardly surprising to me, considering the fact that people are frustrated with the 'Lockdown And Economic Problems'.

That would have also contributed to the burning of the building and looting other businesses.

Unfortunately, in all parts of the world, including in my country India, several 'Protests' that starts peacefully ends up being 'Hijacked' by 'Vested Interest' individuals that love to damage the 'Real Purpose' of the Protest.

Even in Minneapolis, what happened last night might have been done by some individuals that had nothing to do with protesting against George Floyd's death.
 
N583JB
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 1:17 pm

I do find it ironic that CNN is throwing a fit over the fact that one of its film crews was detained for about an hour. Normally, I would have sympathy on the network. After CNN shamelessly advanced the false narrative that led to Ferguson burning, though, I have none. CNN (and others) push division and push conflict because conflict generates views and clicks. The media is directly responsible for a lot of the hatred that is out there right now. So spare me, CNN. You helped cause this.
 
extender
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 1:19 pm

casinterest wrote:
The rioters will hopefully be brought to justice.


You're joking, right?

casinterest wrote:
This is only serving to facilitate further issues down the line. Was nothing learned in LA, Ferguson, Baltimore? We seem to have the same repeated issues occurring as time goes on.


Yeah, let it burn, because the alternative will make the shrinking violets wilt. Solution, establish a curfew, use non-lethal ammunition to get violators out of the area. Any violence towards LEO, break out the live ammo. If you're going to be stupid, be tough. Once there is a reality that your will die or get maimed by your illegal actions, maybe Darwin will sing to them to not do it. They get bold, and bolder when they don't get slapped down; nature abhors a vacuum.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 1:24 pm

extender wrote:
casinterest wrote:
The rioters will hopefully be brought to justice.


You're joking, right?

casinterest wrote:
This is only serving to facilitate further issues down the line. Was nothing learned in LA, Ferguson, Baltimore? We seem to have the same repeated issues occurring as time goes on.


Yeah, let it burn, because the alternative will make the shrinking violets wilt. Solution, establish a curfew, use non-lethal ammunition to get violators out of the area. Any violence towards LEO, break out the live ammo. If you're going to be stupid, be tough. Once there is a reality that your will die or get maimed by your illegal actions, maybe Darwin will sing to them to not do it. They get bold, and bolder when they don't get slapped down; nature abhors a vacuum.



How am I joking? Seriously?

As for your second part, you still ignore why all this happened. Stupid people being "tough/racist/unfair" is why we are in this mess.

The National Guard and police will settle the area down, and allow time for people to cool down.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
extender
Posts: 591
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 1:32 pm

casinterest wrote:


As for your second part, you still ignore why all this happened. Stupid people being "tough/racist/unfair" is why we are in this mess.

The National Guard and police will settle the area down, and allow time for people to cool down.


And you ask why nothing was learned in the past when you allow them to "cool down." They need a smack down, and it needs to be learned, that this behavior is not tolerated.
 
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casinterest
Posts: 11102
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 1:37 pm

extender wrote:
casinterest wrote:


As for your second part, you still ignore why all this happened. Stupid people being "tough/racist/unfair" is why we are in this mess.

The National Guard and police will settle the area down, and allow time for people to cool down.


And you ask why nothing was learned in the past when you allow them to "cool down." They need a smack down, and it needs to be learned, that this behavior is not tolerated.


Learned? a Smack down? Really? Go lay your smack down, just like Mississippi and Alabama in the 60's right? Right?



Riots happen for a reason, and in this case years of systematic abuse has creating a flash-point, where destruction is already occurring.
The national guard will step in and stop the riots, and camera footage will allow the perpetrators of arson and looting to be brought to justice. Cooler heads need to prevail, otherwise the system that is already fractured will be completely broken.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
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zkojq
Posts: 4277
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 1:50 pm

https://mobile.twitter.com/dyllyp/statu ... n003yyN9IE

A cop smashing windows, presumably to try and discredit protestors?

Kiwirob wrote:
The problem in America IMO is your life isn’t worth anything if you're poor and it’s worth even less if you’re poor and coloured.


I think that's fair. If you're poor and coloured you're unlikely to get justice. You're unlikely to have any political power/influence. You don't have means economically. Hard not to see how one might think that "the system" is rigged against them.

N583JB wrote:
I stated yesterday that the video looked bad but that I wanted to withhold judgment until I read some expert opinions on the case

There's too little of that these days.

LabQuest wrote:
This is why we still need the death penalty.


I'm still yet to be convinced that two wrongs make things right.

af773atmsp wrote:
I know people are angry and they have every right to be, but violence and property damage aren't going to help the cause.


:checkmark:

blueflyer wrote:
What terrifies me is that I can see some day in the future, a so-called "good guy with a gun" walk into a seemingly similar situation where the detainee complains he is being asphyxiated or otherwise in lethal danger, the police officer does not appear to respond, and the good guy draws his gun against the police offer, arguing (later) defense of other as a motive. If you think relationships between law enforcement and the people they are sworn to protect are bad already, wait until police have to worry about innocent bystanders making snap judgement on their behavior and willing to engage. If that day will come, the four officers in Minnesota and any other officer like them who has either used excessive force or failed to intervene when a colleague did, will have (more) blood on their hands, including possibly a colleague's.


It's not only that, but now that trust in the police has been lost, surely more "interventions" from bystanders can be expected during arrests in the future if they think that they might be stopping someone being murdered. Even ignoring firearms and other weapons, that's got to make the job of regular cops far more tough. And obviously it is unlikely to end well for anyone.

Meanwhile, the moment that black people arm themselves and organise militias to protect their communities, you can be sure that Republican senators will finally find decide that the Second Amendment does have limits.

Aaron747 wrote:
No, stating reality: it’s inevitable given human nature when people are lied to for too long. Happens in all cultures.

What’s every kid told in school about equal rights under law for all? Outside it may not be the same.


Indeed inevitable. Violence is politics of last resort. When the political system fails and people feel that they have no other avenue to turn to then unfortunately that's going to be the result.

Travon Martin was murdered eight years ago already but the issue of institutionalized racism and law enforcement officers acting with impunity is obviously something that goes back much, much longer. Black Lives Matter is a more recent movement, pushing hard for change, but what has actually been achieved since then to advance the cause? Some police departments getting body cameras, a few getting de-escalation training meanwhile on the streets, people like Philando Castile get murdered and their shooters get off scott free.

And of course numerous hard-right pundits and politicians will tel anyone who will listen that BLM is racist against white people and that all their members advocate violence etc etc rather than actually trying to address the problems. Look at how athletes who took a knee in protest were demonized by the Right because apparently that makes them ungrateful and unpatriotic. How are people of colour supposed to feel about this? It's not really hard to see how they might feel that they don't have other avenues left to turn to.

For an extreme example, I think of the riots in Tibet - the CCP does all they can to crush Tibetans, to de-humanise them, treat them as second class citizens and imports millions of Han Chinese to displace them. And then they're surprised when the have massive riots (2008), terrorist attacks (the one in Kunming train station was particularly awful) and turn the situation into a low key insurgency. Same in Xinjiang.

Violence and rioting certainly isn't the answer but it shouldn't be a surprise.

ltbewr wrote:
This is just so counterproductive. Now the Mayor has asked for State Police and the National Guard to come in to get the situation under control. These jerks who take advantage of a protest to riot, cause major damage hurt their communities, jobs for them, access to goods and services

:checkmark:

ltbewr wrote:
and worst of all, just drive more racist hate toward Black communities making their economic and personal situation worse.


You can bet that the hard right will try and weaponize this to justify brutal tactics. They'll shout far louder about the riots than about the murder. Concern trolling 101.

wingman wrote:
You shouldn't rush to judgment. In some cases those "felonious" folk may have been part of a well-regulated militia defending themselves against a tyrannical government. I've said this before in similar cases, if the victim in Minneapolis had been able to free one of his hands in minute 6 of the execution, grabbed the officer's weapon and shot him in the forehead, I think For News and the NRA would be perplexed as to how to position the response for POTUS. Hmmm, NRA core tenet for everyone in the nation having 1000 weapons in the basement and 60,000 rounds of armor-piercing ammo or a black man who refused to die quietly in the face of a government employee's tyranny? That shit's a mind bender!


The harder the victim fights to be able to breath, the more that that law enforcement officer feels justified in crushing him further since he's "resisting arrest". What a paradox.


N757ST wrote:
Then a bunch of people riot, burn down businesses, and rob a target, and now THAT is the story. Even worse, everyone has looked at these videos and sees that just about every single one of those people with the exception of the morbidly obese white woman was black.


Here's a white cop doing it. Anything to invalidate the protests?

https://mobile.twitter.com/dyllyp/statu ... n003yyN9IE

N757ST wrote:
It’s hard to make real change when you’re given a platform and you go ahead and do this. This will just fuel people that have stereotypical racist views.


What real change was going to happen but was derailed by the riots?

N757ST wrote:
I agree. Do you think looting multiple businesses, and burning part of the city will help achieve that goal?


Where did anyone here say that they condoned rioting?

N757ST wrote:
A perfect platform was available, where everyone was on the same page.


A perfect platform was available with Philando Castile. That was four years ago. How long should people be waiting on this perfect platform? Why would anyone believe that this time would be different?

Aaron747 wrote:
Conflating things only reinforces lack of nuance when discussing serious issues that require a lot of it.

:checkmark: One person burning something makes another person feel justified in not helping/supporting thousands of others who aren't burning things.

blueflyer wrote:
500 National Guard soldiers were supposedly deployed to escort firefighters who cannot reach fires on their own without being the target of multiple projectiles. Which, to be clear, is totally unacceptable no matter what the circumstances are that led us to where we are tonight.

:checkmark:
First to fly the 787-9
 
AirWorthy99
Posts: 1054
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:57 pm

Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 1:54 pm

Its amazing how the MSM coverage of these violent protests compared with the peaceful protests over COVID lockdown.

And the local government response has been also abysmal. What ever happened to the curfews? stay at home orders? why can't they be established when a city is practically burning by violent thugs, which seem led by antifa?

What ever was the purpose of the peaceful protesters against police brutality, this is being replaced by violent protests that have taken all the attention from the larger issue. The thugs have hijacked this problem so that it keeps repeating and nothing gets done. Unfortunate.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister
 
AirWorthy99
Posts: 1054
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 1:57 pm

zkojq wrote:
https://mobile.twitter.com/dyllyp/status/1266166402521522176?s=21&fbclid=IwAR37ca5RbC6XURXTyYMbHOUxf10QQFegjx2J0FyOG6DpnhaYxn003yyN9IE

A cop smashing windows, presumably to try and discredit protestors?


How do you really know this is a cop? because some protester published this and says it?

Unless there is actual evidence this person is a cop, but there isn't.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister
 
aerosreenivas
Posts: 147
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2007 6:40 pm

Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 2:15 pm

I'm interested to know how the Minneapolis Police Department is going to restore all the 'Case Files' that either got Burnt or 'Slightly Damaged' due to one of the Police Precinct being torched by the protesters last night?
 
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Aaron747
Posts: 11806
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 2:38 pm

AirWorthy99 wrote:
Its amazing how the MSM coverage of these violent protests compared with the peaceful protests over COVID lockdown.

And the local government response has been also abysmal. What ever happened to the curfews? stay at home orders? why can't they be established when a city is practically burning by violent thugs, which seem led by antifa?

What ever was the purpose of the peaceful protesters against police brutality, this is being replaced by violent protests that have taken all the attention from the larger issue. The thugs have hijacked this problem so that it keeps repeating and nothing gets done. Unfortunate.


How strange, since you are no longer talking about the 'real issue' you claimed to be so interested in, and are now solely focused (again) on MSM and the rioters. See zkojq's post above: one person burning something makes one feel justified in not supporting/helping the issue that set everything off. That's just asinine.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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lugie
Posts: 853
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 3:05 pm

extender wrote:
And you ask why nothing was learned in the past when you allow them to "cool down." They need a smack down, and it needs to be learned, that this behavior is not tolerated.


What are you even implying by that? That's some grade-A authoritarian, racist dogwhistling.

Nobody needs a "smack down", they're all entitled to due process and their physical integrity. Just like the inbred rednecks from white ISIS who stormed the Michigan State Capitol armed with ARs were.

In case you forgot, the entire reason those protests started was because some Minneapolis cop decided that the uppity black he caught needed a "smack down" (or rather a kneel down). But this is where we're at already, mere days after the atrocious murder that the cop committed the right has spun this into another reason why the police force needs to be militarized even further and commit even more brutal transgressions against the citizens they swore an oath to protect (and whose taxes pay them).

Meanwhile those fine Minneapolis cops go around indiscriminately spraying protestors not involved in any riots with mace.


AirWorthy99 wrote:
And the local government response has been also abysmal. What ever happened to the curfews? stay at home orders? why can't they be established when a city is practically burning by violent thugs, which seem led by antifa?


Still pretending like "Antifa™" is some kind of trademarked organization, which seems to be the right's favorite fairytale story (especially when adding how they're obviously payrolled and coordinated by George Soros).
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zakuivcustom
Posts: 3446
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 3:05 pm

zkojq wrote:
A cop smashing windows, presumably to try and discredit protestors?


So US cops are learning from the popos in HK :duck:

zkojq wrote:
Violence and rioting certainly isn't the answer but it shouldn't be a surprise.


:checkmark: :checkmark:

Yes, violence doesn't solve a thing and in fact make things worse, but violence as a mean is also part of "action speaks louder than words".

Happens worldwide, Hong Kong just last year...
 
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scbriml
Posts: 18977
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 10:37 pm

Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 3:18 pm

extender wrote:
Solution, establish a curfew, use non-lethal ammunition to get violators out of the area. Any violence towards LEO, break out the live ammo. If you're going to be stupid, be tough. Once there is a reality that your will die or get maimed by your illegal actions, maybe Darwin will sing to them to not do it. They get bold, and bolder when they don't get slapped down; nature abhors a vacuum.


extender wrote:
And you ask why nothing was learned in the past when you allow them to "cool down." They need a smack down, and it needs to be learned, that this behavior is not tolerated.


Let's not pussy around, let's get right to it...
Image

zkojq wrote:
https://mobile.twitter.com/dyllyp/statu ... n003yyN9IE

A cop smashing windows, presumably to try and discredit protestors?


Looks like he's busted.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
N583JB
Posts: 521
Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:58 pm

Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 3:20 pm

lugie wrote:
extender wrote:
And you ask why nothing was learned in the past when you allow them to "cool down." They need a smack down, and it needs to be learned, that this behavior is not tolerated.


What are you even implying by that? That's some grade-A authoritarian, racist dogwhistling.

Nobody needs a "smack down", they're all entitled to due process and their physical integrity. Just like the inbred rednecks from white ISIS who stormed the Michigan State Capitol armed with ARs were.

In case you forgot, the entire reason those protests started was because some Minneapolis cop decided that the uppity black he caught needed a "smack down" (or rather a kneel down). But this is where we're at already, mere days after the atrocious murder that the cop committed the right has spun this into another reason why the police force needs to be militarized even further and commit even more brutal transgressions against the citizens they swore an oath to protect (and whose taxes pay them).

Meanwhile those fine Minneapolis cops go around indiscriminately spraying protestors not involved in any riots with mace.


AirWorthy99 wrote:
And the local government response has been also abysmal. What ever happened to the curfews? stay at home orders? why can't they be established when a city is practically burning by violent thugs, which seem led by antifa?


Still pretending like "Antifa™" is some kind of trademarked organization, which seems to be the right's favorite fairytale story (especially when adding how they're obviously payrolled and coordinated by George Soros).


Very little context for that eight-second video. For all we know the protesters could have been told to disperse and refused to do so.

Also, I don't think anyone is complaining about the protests. Protests are absolutely warranted in this case. Rioting is not. It is counterproductive and only hurts the minority communities that it occurs in. The cops don't give a damn...they are making overtime money to sit around and watch people burn their neighborhoods down. Rioting doesn't impact them in a negative way. It just hurts the small business owners who lose their stores and restaurants. It hurts the hourly employees who work at those restaurants and stores who no longer get paid. It hurts the neighborhoods as a whole when Target and Walgreens decide to leave and never come back.
 
extender
Posts: 591
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2007 2:52 am

Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 3:43 pm

scbriml wrote:
Let's not pussy around, let's get right to it...
Image


If that is how you roll, have at it. Me and Kluckers don't mix, I'm a mongrel. I don't think anyone is superior than anyone else. They can protest all they want, but loot and pillage; no don't buy that. If I had a business, I would be protecting it like the Koreans did in LA. Just because they are pissed, they have no right to the fruits of anyone's labors. You all may not approve of it, but your defense and excuse their abhorrent behavior says otherwise.

Reading another thread about all the Ozark hillbillies at the pool parties without masks sure aren't complaining about the rioter's lack of masks. And those who happen to be wearing masks, are doing it to hide their faces, not protect their health.
 
GalaxyFlyer
Posts: 5496
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 3:52 pm

If African-Americans have been suffering injustice in MSP, it’s been their nominal friends in the Democratic Party doing it—47 consecutive years of one-party rule there.
 
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Aaron747
Posts: 11806
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Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 3:57 pm

extender wrote:
scbriml wrote:
Let's not pussy around, let's get right to it...
Image


If that is how you roll, have at it. Me and Kluckers don't mix, I'm a mongrel. I don't think anyone is superior than anyone else. They can protest all they want, but loot and pillage; no don't buy that. If I had a business, I would be protecting it like the Koreans did in LA. Just because they are pissed, they have no right to the fruits of anyone's labors. You all may not approve of it, but your defense and excuse their abhorrent behavior says otherwise.

Reading another thread about all the Ozark hillbillies at the pool parties without masks sure aren't complaining about the rioter's lack of masks. And those who happen to be wearing masks, are doing it to hide their faces, not protect their health.


Nobody's making excuses - again, if you cannot identify nuance or acknowledge the frailties of human nature, that's not everyone else's problem. Complaining about observations of reality will not make them any less apt. The more important discussion here is how to get the stove turned down for good, but you're obsessed with the show and the boilover, because, emotions or something.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
bmartino99
Posts: 85
Joined: Fri May 18, 2018 7:57 pm

Re: Another day another police killing

Fri May 29, 2020 4:11 pm

zkojq wrote:

blueflyer wrote:
What terrifies me is that I can see some day in the future, a so-called "good guy with a gun" walk into a seemingly similar situation where the detainee complains he is being asphyxiated or otherwise in lethal danger, the police officer does not appear to respond, and the good guy draws his gun against the police offer, arguing (later) defense of other as a motive. If you think relationships between law enforcement and the people they are sworn to protect are bad already, wait until police have to worry about innocent bystanders making snap judgement on their behavior and willing to engage. If that day will come, the four officers in Minnesota and any other officer like them who has either used excessive force or failed to intervene when a colleague did, will have (more) blood on their hands, including possibly a colleague's.


It's not only that, but now that trust in the police has been lost, surely more "interventions" from bystanders can be expected during arrests in the future if they think that they might be stopping someone being murdered. Even ignoring firearms and other weapons, that's got to make the job of regular cops far more tough. And obviously it is unlikely to end well for anyone.

Meanwhile, the moment that black people arm themselves and organise militias to protect their communities, you can be sure that Republican senators will finally find decide that the Second Amendment does have limits.



As a CHL holder and person that regularly carries, drawing a firearm on a police officer committing unlawful act like this would be a long bridge to cross mentally. In this case with 3 other officers present, you would instantly have 3 guns pointed at you so you better be really confident in your ability to talk quickly and persuade them that the officer committing murder is actually committing murder. I would guess in this situation, had a good guy with a gun drawn on the officer, we'd have more than one dead person.
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