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AA747123
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EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 2:46 pm

The EU is looking to permanently ban US citizens from entering the EU. Descision by July first.

https://www.theverge.com/2020/6/23/2130 ... draft-list
 
Reinhardt
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 2:50 pm

Indefinitely is completely different to permanent. The article says Indefinitely.

Indefinitely means it will be reviewed, and removed when the risk is reduced. EU shouldn't be allowing UK residents back in yet either tbh.
Last edited by Reinhardt on Wed Jun 24, 2020 2:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Dieuwer
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 2:50 pm

Travel from China, as well as some developing countries, will be allowed, the report states.


LOL.
Yeah, import those millions of hidden COVID cases from China and developing countries (no testing there, so nothing to see, people). Sounds like a plan!
Perhaps they should "Huge a Chinese" again, too!

https://in.news.yahoo.com/italy-launche ... 39340.html
 
JJJ
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:01 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
Travel from China, as well as some developing countries, will be allowed, the report states.


LOL.
Yeah, import those millions of hidden COVID cases from China and developing countries (no testing there, so nothing to see, people). Sounds like a plan!
Perhaps they should "Huge a Chinese" again, too!

https://in.news.yahoo.com/italy-launche ... 39340.html


The draft mentions banning people from countries with over 50 daily new cases/million or "abnormal patterns" which could be used for countries who just won't test.

Still, the US curve looks pretty bad.

Image
 
L410Turbolet
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:04 pm

Reinhardt wrote:
Indefinitely means it will be reviewed, and removed when the risk is reduced. EU shouldn't be allowing UK residents back in yet either tbh.


The fact that the EU is taking Chinese and Russian BS numbers at their face value is beyond ridiculous.
 
Dieuwer
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:06 pm

Of course this ban will play straight into the hands of Trump as he now got an even bigger excuse to slap sanctions onto Europe of his own and turn up the Trade War a notch. His base won't mind either as they are not the types that travel to Europe, if they travel at all (unless they are going to a Trump rally).
No, the only Americans Europe "punishes" with their ban are those that typically live in Blue States with ties to Europe (family or otherwise).

In addition to all the above, I assume TATL travel will simply crater with European airliners in the front lines of being hammered. After all, the domestic EU network has been dismantled by EU bureaucrats that demand EU citizens take trains. The EU better prepare another trillion euro bailout for their airlines lest their entire industry goes bust.
Last edited by Dieuwer on Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
JJJ
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:07 pm

L410Turbolet wrote:
Reinhardt wrote:
Indefinitely means it will be reviewed, and removed when the risk is reduced. EU shouldn't be allowing UK residents back in yet either tbh.


The fact that the EU is taking Chinese and Russian BS numbers at their face value is beyond ridiculous.


BS or not current Russian reported numbers are above the threshold.
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:08 pm

AA747123 wrote:
The EU is looking to permanently ban US citizens from entering the EU. Descision by July first.

https://www.theverge.com/2020/6/23/2130 ... draft-list

We must clearly sue the EU and have the SCOTUS rule that the EU can't ban US citizens from visiting, and if nothing happens, tariff the hell out of the EU. It's Keep America Great, not Keep Europe Great!

Bend countries to the US, not the other way around, even if Jack and Jill from the MAGA base don't even have the means to fly anywhere.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
luckyone
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:16 pm

JJJ wrote:
Dieuwer wrote:
Travel from China, as well as some developing countries, will be allowed, the report states.


LOL.
Yeah, import those millions of hidden COVID cases from China and developing countries (no testing there, so nothing to see, people). Sounds like a plan!
Perhaps they should "Huge a Chinese" again, too!

https://in.news.yahoo.com/italy-launche ... 39340.html


The draft mentions banning people from countries with over 50 daily new cases/million or "abnormal patterns" which could be used for countries who just won't test.

Still, the US curve looks pretty bad.

Image

Indeed it's not encouraging. I'm all for limited the spread of the illness to the greatest degree possible. Then there's Sweden which is in the EU, whose laissez faire approach has resulted in a death rate far higher per 100,000 than the US and their cases have only grown.
 
Reinhardt
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:19 pm

L410Turbolet wrote:
Reinhardt wrote:
Indefinitely means it will be reviewed, and removed when the risk is reduced. EU shouldn't be allowing UK residents back in yet either tbh.


The fact that the EU is taking Chinese and Russian BS numbers at their face value is beyond ridiculous.


I didn't say I agreed with allowing Chinese and Russian's back in, actually I don't. I was just correcting the mis-wording of what the article says, i.e that it's not permanent.

But for sure the US doesn't have this anywhere close to under control to be allowed in right now.
 
kalvado
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:46 pm

einsteinboricua wrote:
AA747123 wrote:
The EU is looking to permanently ban US citizens from entering the EU. Descision by July first.

https://www.theverge.com/2020/6/23/2130 ... draft-list

We must clearly sue the EU and have the SCOTUS rule that the EU can't ban US citizens from visiting, and if nothing happens, tariff the hell out of the EU. It's Keep America Great, not Keep Europe Great!

Bend countries to the US, not the other way around, even if Jack and Jill from the MAGA base don't even have the means to fly anywhere.

Countries do have a right to deny entry of foreign nationals. Best that US can do is to reciprocate. Which would be a moot point as quarantine requirements would dictate no travel in either direction.
 
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scbriml
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:47 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
Of course this ban will play straight into the hands of Trump as he now got an even bigger excuse to slap sanctions onto Europe of his own and turn up the Trade War a notch. His base won't mind either as they are not the types that travel to Europe, if they travel at all (unless they are going to a Trump rally).
No, the only Americans Europe "punishes" with their ban are those that typically live in Blue States with ties to Europe (family or otherwise).

In addition to all the above, I assume TATL travel will simply crater with European airliners in the front lines of being hammered. After all, the domestic EU network has been dismantled by EU bureaucrats that demand EU citizens take trains. The EU better prepare another trillion euro bailout for their airlines lest their entire industry goes bust.


Nice rant!

EU domestic air travel has been dismantled by EU bureaucrats? It seems they forgot to tell Ryanair and easyJet (amongst others). :rotfl:

Remind me, has Trump lifted the restrictions on EU citizens entering the US yet? It's a two way street.
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N583JB
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:51 pm

Can't really blame the EU. The United States has done a horrible job at getting COVID under control.
 
Dieuwer
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:04 pm

scbriml wrote:
Dieuwer wrote:
Of course this ban will play straight into the hands of Trump as he now got an even bigger excuse to slap sanctions onto Europe of his own and turn up the Trade War a notch. His base won't mind either as they are not the types that travel to Europe, if they travel at all (unless they are going to a Trump rally).
No, the only Americans Europe "punishes" with their ban are those that typically live in Blue States with ties to Europe (family or otherwise).

In addition to all the above, I assume TATL travel will simply crater with European airliners in the front lines of being hammered. After all, the domestic EU network has been dismantled by EU bureaucrats that demand EU citizens take trains. The EU better prepare another trillion euro bailout for their airlines lest their entire industry goes bust.


Nice rant!

EU domestic air travel has been dismantled by EU bureaucrats? It seems they forgot to tell Ryanair and easyJet (amongst others). :rotfl:

Remind me, has Trump lifted the restrictions on EU citizens entering the US yet? It's a two way street.


Rant? Simply facts.
Legacy EU have a hard time competing with LLCs. And EU "domestic" means inside ONE COUNTRY. France for instance definitely is banning/considering to block any air route from A to B within France (although it seems very long routes may be exempt).

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alexledsom ... 27e5c23a0a

You are right TATL is a two way street, but I think you would agree with me that Trump doesn't care.
Last edited by Dieuwer on Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
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OA412
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:05 pm

Thread title updated. The article does state that, if passed, this would be an indefinite ban, which is not the same as a permanent ban.
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OA412
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:11 pm

I'm suspicious of the Chinese numbers too, but that's what they have to go by at this time. I can't blame them for wanting to ban Americans indefinitely. The US response to this pandemic has been an absolute disaster. Scores of people won't do something simple as wearing a mask to stop the spread because they'd rather listen to an oaf than the scientific community.

JJJ wrote:
L410Turbolet wrote:
Reinhardt wrote:
Indefinitely means it will be reviewed, and removed when the risk is reduced. EU shouldn't be allowing UK residents back in yet either tbh.


The fact that the EU is taking Chinese and Russian BS numbers at their face value is beyond ridiculous.


BS or not current Russian reported numbers are above the threshold.

Well and it's a moot point in the context of this discussion since the article clearly states Russians would also be indefinitely banned from the EU (along with Brazilians).
Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
 
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Dutchy
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:15 pm

This travel ban is about public health, not politics.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
LabQuest
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:17 pm

Nobody should be traveling anywhere around the world period. The only exception is for emergencies and air freight.
 
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OA412
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:02 pm

LabQuest wrote:
Nobody should be traveling anywhere around the world period. The only exception is for emergencies and air freight.

This! I don't know why some people are so desperate to go traveling all over the world right now. There's a global pandemic happening. Stay closer to home.
Dutchy wrote:
This travel ban is about public health, not politics.

Correct. Unfortunately in the US, this pandemic was politicized from day one, and some people are unable and/or unwilling to see it as a public health issue rather than a political issue.
Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
 
johns624
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:22 pm

OA412 wrote:
Correct. Unfortunately in the US, this pandemic was politicized from day one, and some people are unable and/or unwilling to see it as a public health issue rather than a political issue.
Correct, but I'd say it was politicized from Day One by the Chinese. They didn't want to lose face so they downplayed until it became so big that they couldn't really hide it anymore.
 
TSS
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:45 pm

On a slightly lighter note, the "Quarantine" song by Mat Best and Tim Montana- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3xpRZITi2w
Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
 
luckyone
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:48 pm

OA412 wrote:
Scores of people won't do something simple as wearing a mask to stop the spread because they'd rather listen to an oaf than the scientific community.

Welcome to a physician's daily life. Americans, like many people, are mistrustful of what they cannot understand. And most people have only a minimal understanding of health and science because we have a subset of our population that does not value education. How do you make somebody care?

It may or may not blow your mind at how many people don't know what they're taking, or what it's for. I would wager to say that only half of patients take their medication as prescribed. A great many people--who have access to insurance--only show up once things have already gone bad, and even still they refuse to follow recommendations, but they still show up...it's mind boggling.
 
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Aesma
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:54 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
Of course this ban will play straight into the hands of Trump as he now got an even bigger excuse to slap sanctions onto Europe of his own and turn up the Trade War a notch. His base won't mind either as they are not the types that travel to Europe, if they travel at all (unless they are going to a Trump rally).
No, the only Americans Europe "punishes" with their ban are those that typically live in Blue States with ties to Europe (family or otherwise).

In addition to all the above, I assume TATL travel will simply crater with European airliners in the front lines of being hammered. After all, the domestic EU network has been dismantled by EU bureaucrats that demand EU citizens take trains. The EU better prepare another trillion euro bailout for their airlines lest their entire industry goes bust.


This isn't about punishment, this is about not wanting our efforts being screwed by the lack of effort in the US. Trump can't even limit air travel inside his own country so that the virus doesn't circulate there.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Dieuwer
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:58 pm

Aesma wrote:
Trump can't ...


Trump doesn't care. You should know that by now.
This is a 100% pissing contest. Remember the old slogan: "When They Go Low, We Go Lower"?
Last edited by Dieuwer on Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
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stl07
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:21 pm

Bwhahahaha. When it's white nations calling Trump incredibly stupid, he finally wakes up. This should be a nice slap on the ass to Mr. don't wear a mask and stop getting tested. How are those poll numbers looking buddy? Maybe punting on virus care wasn't so smart after all
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
Dieuwer
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:24 pm

stl07 wrote:
Bwhahahaha. When it's white nations calling Trump incredibly stupid, he finally wakes up. This should be a nice slap on the ass to Mr. don't wear a mask and stop getting tested. How are those poll numbers looking buddy? Maybe punting on virus care wasn't so smart after all


Trump probably feels insulted by the EU and will retaliate with trillion dollar sanctions...
 
JJJ
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:44 pm

OA412 wrote:
I'm suspicious of the Chinese numbers too, but that's what they have to go by at this time. I can't blame them for wanting to ban Americans indefinitely. The US response to this pandemic has been an absolute disaster. Scores of people won't do something simple as wearing a mask to stop the spread because they'd rather listen to an oaf than the scientific community.

JJJ wrote:
L410Turbolet wrote:

The fact that the EU is taking Chinese and Russian BS numbers at their face value is beyond ridiculous.


BS or not current Russian reported numbers are above the threshold.

Well and it's a moot point in the context of this discussion since the article clearly states Russians would also be indefinitely banned from the EU (along with Brazilians).


Yeah that's what I meant. Even if the numbers are cooked they're still above the level at which the ban kicks in.
 
Kiwirob
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 7:28 pm

Dieuwer wrote:

In addition to all the above, I assume TATL travel will simply crater with European airliners in the front lines of being hammered. After all, the domestic EU network has been dismantled by EU bureaucrats that demand EU citizens take trains. The EU better prepare another trillion euro bailout for their airlines lest their entire industry goes bust.


When did they do this? I travel throughout the EU from Norway, pre covid I have upwards of 100 flights annually, I’ve never used a train.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 7:30 pm

OA412 wrote:
Thread title updated. The article does state that, if passed, this would be an indefinite ban, which is not the same as a permanent ban.


I suggest changing the title again: E.U. May Bar American Travelers as It Reopens Borders, Citing Failures on Virus

It is the title of this article.

E.U. May Bar American Travelers as It Reopens Borders, Citing Failures on Virus

European Union officials are racing to agree on who can visit the bloc as of July 1 based on how countries of origin are faring with new coronavirus cases. Americans, so far, are excluded, according to draft lists seen by The New York Times.


Much less sensational than the current title and more realistic. ;)
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
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par13del
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 7:38 pm

When Trump banned EU traveller's did the EU reciprocate, from an airline perspective, did they allow USA airlines in while theirs were blocked?
When the EU puts their ban in place, will they be letting EU folks travel to the USA or will the bank be both ways?

If it is for public health reasons whether the ban is on the USA or EU side is irrelevant as long as there is no traffic between the two.
 
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stl07
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:00 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
stl07 wrote:
Bwhahahaha. When it's white nations calling Trump incredibly stupid, he finally wakes up. This should be a nice slap on the ass to Mr. don't wear a mask and stop getting tested. How are those poll numbers looking buddy? Maybe punting on virus care wasn't so smart after all


Trump probably feels insulted by the EU and will retaliate with trillion dollar sanctions...

He just cancelled guest-worker permits, meaning we just lost a lot of our smart and productive workforce and all we are going to have left are the unemployed who sit around all day drinking beer reminiscing the time when the confederacy ruled and waiting for Trump to make America great again. We won't have anything to offer Europe to trade with, so sanctions will mean nothing
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
dmg626
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:03 pm

This would be a good time to close all the European bases that house US armed forces and bring them back to US soil. The Europeans are more than capable of defending themselves, no need for US military on European soil.
 
VSMUT
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Re: EU may permanently ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:24 pm

luckyone wrote:
JJJ wrote:
Dieuwer wrote:

LOL.
Yeah, import those millions of hidden COVID cases from China and developing countries (no testing there, so nothing to see, people). Sounds like a plan!
Perhaps they should "Huge a Chinese" again, too!

https://in.news.yahoo.com/italy-launche ... 39340.html


The draft mentions banning people from countries with over 50 daily new cases/million or "abnormal patterns" which could be used for countries who just won't test.

Still, the US curve looks pretty bad.

Image

Indeed it's not encouraging. I'm all for limited the spread of the illness to the greatest degree possible. Then there's Sweden which is in the EU, whose laissez faire approach has resulted in a death rate far higher per 100,000 than the US and their cases have only grown.


Sweden is paying for its handling as well. All the neighbours have shut their borders to Sweden.
 
maverick4002
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:26 pm

dmg626 wrote:
This would be a good time to close all the European bases that house US armed forces and bring them back to US soil. The Europeans are more than capable of defending themselves, no need for US military on European soil.


I am getting a tone of supportive retaliatory action from you here. Will the Europaens even care?
 
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Dutchy
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:37 pm

dmg626 wrote:
This would be a good time to close all the European bases that house US armed forces and bring them back to US soil. The Europeans are more than capable of defending themselves, no need for US military on European soil.



true, but what has that got to do with. anything? This is a health issue, not. political.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
JJJ
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:47 pm

dmg626 wrote:
This would be a good time to close all the European bases that house US armed forces and bring them back to US soil. The Europeans are more than capable of defending themselves, no need for US military on European soil.


Other than the immediate neighbors of the bases (i.e. most people) yup, won't care.
 
Jalap
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Wed Jun 24, 2020 11:06 pm

I don't understand the fuss.
Place A has little virus. What's there to be discussed if place A was to decide to limit/ban travel to/from place B where there's much virus?

You can discuss the limits and boundaries of course. Like travel to Sweden should be proably limited/banned too.
But in principle, imposing limits or a ban is the only correct action to take by govenments.

Not imposing these bans right at the start is what got us into this mess in the first place. Travel to/from China should have been banned in December.
 
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Aesma
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:05 am

maverick4002 wrote:
dmg626 wrote:
This would be a good time to close all the European bases that house US armed forces and bring them back to US soil. The Europeans are more than capable of defending themselves, no need for US military on European soil.


I am getting a tone of supportive retaliatory action from you here. Will the Europeans even care?


Personally I care, I don't understand how European countries (aside from the ones directly in front of Russia, with small militaries) even allowed this to continue after 1989.

But then my country asked the US to leave half a century ago.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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seahawk
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:44 am

dmg626 wrote:
This would be a good time to close all the European bases that house US armed forces and bring them back to US soil. The Europeans are more than capable of defending themselves, no need for US military on European soil.

Absolutely.
 
olle
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:28 am

seahawk wrote:
dmg626 wrote:
This would be a good time to close all the European bases that house US armed forces and bring them back to US soil. The Europeans are more than capable of defending themselves, no need for US military on European soil.

Absolutely.


The EU countries combined spend much more combined on military then Russia today.

I share the German view that it is much more important for the future stability of Europe to get the economy in South of Europe and Eastern states going then expand military from the levels that will be in 2022.

As long as EU do not plan to have a presence in Asia....

EU sits on the key by in practice paying both for the Russian military and people by the oil import. The problem from a EU perspective is that the Russian decrease in income shows for the Russian people not the military.
 
GDB
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Thu Jun 25, 2020 8:00 am

dmg626 wrote:
This would be a good time to close all the European bases that house US armed forces and bring them back to US soil. The Europeans are more than capable of defending themselves, no need for US military on European soil.


Go right ahead, seriously damage your own ability to gather intel, support operations with refuelling, medical evacuation and treatment for US personnel, sustain naval forces and much more.
Though the family of the 18 year old killed by the idiot wife of some US diplomat (or more likely intel), near a US base, as the dopey woman was driving on the wrong side of the road, might be pleased to see them gone. The woman was not diplomatically protected, nonetheless she was illegally spirited out under fake diplomatic cover and is driving around in the US. There is an international arrest warrant out for her.
This might have happened outside EU, though not at the time of the accident, however it has created a lot of bad feeling here.

But hissy fit responses are par for the course with the US these days, the world is getting used to it.
Responses caked in ignorance, (of course), US forces in Europe are a fraction of the Cold War, as you would expect, they are not there as direct defence against a monolithic enemy, they are to support US operations mainly.
Thinking they are otherwise? do try and keep up.
 
ltbewr
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Thu Jun 25, 2020 10:52 am

I am not surprised at the EU considering such a ban as to the USA, but it should include China too.

The Covid-19 pandemic is out of control in much of the USA due to the structure and culture of the USA, uneven quality of science and health education, the lack of financial safety nets, lack of access to health care, as well as politicians from Pres. Trump on down pandering to too many voters to win their next election to loosen up and for economic necessity.
 
tommy1808
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:05 am

ltbewr wrote:
I am not surprised at the EU considering such a ban as to the USA, but it should include China too.
.


Why should it include the PRC?

And dont just say "their numbers are fake, because they are low...."

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
maverick4002
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Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Thu Jun 25, 2020 1:47 pm

Aesma wrote:
maverick4002 wrote:
dmg626 wrote:
This would be a good time to close all the European bases that house US armed forces and bring them back to US soil. The Europeans are more than capable of defending themselves, no need for US military on European soil.


I am getting a tone of supportive retaliatory action from you here. Will the Europeans even care?


Personally I care, I don't understand how European countries (aside from the ones directly in front of Russia, with small militaries) even allowed this to continue after 1989.

But then my country asked the US to leave half a century ago.


I'm with you. Maybe I wasnt clear but I was asking OP if he meant the US should do this as some sort or retaliation.
 
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einsteinboricua
Posts: 8503
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:11 pm

Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:45 pm

Jalap wrote:
Not imposing these bans right at the start is what got us into this mess in the first place. Travel to/from China should have been banned in December.

We're only as strong as the weakest link. There was no point in banning travel between China and the US if people could go through a 3rd country. It was the same reason the EU ban was so flawed: banning flights from the EU was one thing; banning nationals is another. But even then, there were plenty of exceptions that allowed potential cases to slip through undetected.

The fact that quarantine centers were not established for travelers from hard hit areas is what also doomed efforts.

So yeah...the bans could have made the difference if they had truly covered the bases.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
continental004
Posts: 437
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2014 11:53 pm

Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Mon Jun 29, 2020 6:55 pm

what I would like to know is why PRC will be potentially included in the list of clear countries, but not Taiwan or HK.
 
bennett123
Posts: 9742
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:48 pm

'Members are being strongly encouraged to adopt it or else the EU may consider reinstating stricter borders within the bloc to prevent travelers from countries on the list from entering into one country with looser restrictions and crossing the border into another'.

Clearly the EU has spotted that risk.


Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
·
Jun 23
We did a great job on CoronaVirus, including the very early ban on China, Ventilator production, and Testing, which is by far the most, and best, in the World. We saved millions of U.S. lives.! Yet the Fake News refuses to acknowledge this in a positive way. But they do give..

Apparently the US has done a great job, only 125,900 dead.

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html
 
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par13del
Posts: 10337
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 9:14 pm

Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:51 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
ltbewr wrote:
I am not surprised at the EU considering such a ban as to the USA, but it should include China too.
.


Why should it include the PRC?

And dont just say "their numbers are fake, because they are low...."

Best regards
Thomas

Last I read they were going through another surge supposedly caused by folks arriving from Europe.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-53216047
 
dampfnudel
Posts: 590
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:42 am

Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Mon Jun 29, 2020 10:41 pm

I can’t blame the Europeans. Had the US banned travel to/from Europe and strictly quarantined Americans returning from there in January, thousands of lives in the US may have been saved. Personally, I think the Europeans should maintain their EU bubble until next year and not allow anyone in from outside the EU, especially those countries with dubious data and known to be less than transparent/reliable. That’s what Australia is doing. A second wave in the EU will most likely have an origin in Asia like the first one or maybe even somewhere closer. Opening up prematurely will certainly make a second wave in Europe a strong possibility. We see what’s happening when states in the US open prematurely and now the EU is reopening to countries they believe are safe probably thinking falsely that they can close the border in time if they notice any alarming changes.
A313 332 343 B703 712 722 732 73G 738 739 741 742 744 752 762 76E 764 772 AT5 CR9 D10 DHH DHT F27 GRM L10 M83 TU5
 
Jalap
Posts: 640
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2007 4:25 pm

Re: EU may indefinitely ban US citizens from entering EU

Tue Jun 30, 2020 12:13 am

dampfnudel wrote:
I can’t blame the Europeans. Had the US banned travel to/from Europe and strictly quarantined Americans returning from there in January, thousands of lives in the US may have been saved. Personally, I think the Europeans should maintain their EU bubble until next year and not allow anyone in from outside the EU, especially those countries with dubious data and known to be less than transparent/reliable. That’s what Australia is doing. A second wave in the EU will most likely have an origin in Asia like the first one or maybe even somewhere closer. Opening up prematurely will certainly make a second wave in Europe a strong possibility. We see what’s happening when states in the US open prematurely and now the EU is reopening to countries they believe are safe probably thinking falsely that they can close the border in time if they notice any alarming changes.

I don't entirely agree.
Yes, keep borders closed for people originating in countries with (possibly) a lot of virus.
But not maintaining a true European bubble.
After all, we're not aiming for a zero-virus startegy. Whether new infections originate from travellers or local infections, that doesn't really matter. As long as we manage to keep the reproduction rate around 1, all is fine. I think travellers from relatively safe countries are welcome, as long as they follow the measures we still have.
If there's a second wave, it won't be travellers that are to blame (if travel is somewhat restricted), but local people neglecting the measures.

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