windy95 wrote:TTailedTiger wrote:BN747 wrote:
What he's saying is that your proposal brings what already exist in Mexico City is various private police forces (in Mexico they are private protective forces of the rich), each with different perspectives, rules, value systems, training, recruitment standards, etc...well ..what could possibly go wrong there?
Absolute mayhem, that's what.
Add more Cops?....to already immeasurable number of poorly trains ones in place and simply open the door for more...that's antithetical to intelligent thought.
The Add more police crowd are a really frightened bunch..such people should do Covid 247 and never leave the house.
I don't think any of the 'Add More Police' crowd live anywhere near as dangerous as the Chicago shootout neighbor hoods, nor do I think any of this expressed concern over crime is occurring anywhere near them. It's like complain about 'dating' but one never goes on dates.
Violent crime surges across the United States...is not new.
History charts the course of crimes ebbs and flows over decades and what that has shown us is that there is the intellectual approach to criminal containment vs the meathead approach of just clubbing people (in general) into fear.
The latter has always been the go-to method from days of the wild west to Bull Connor to Frank Rizzo to Bernard Kerik to Joe Arpaio to Sheriff Clarke to the George Floyd effect (aka boldly in-broad-daylight killing of innocents. Every single time.
It simply makes matters worse.
I want Cops to storm Beverly Hills High (post Covid) and shakedown those kids and tally up the illegal drugs flooding that place...oh yeah, well will never happen.
Or go into Calabasas and seek out high level drug dealing that always results in killing of kids of people like Bill Cosby and Carroll O'Conner (Archie Bunker).
Intelligent policing requires precision analysis of a specific area of concern and then runs into factual realities that really paralyzes police right in their shoes.
Ad seen on Chicago PD, where highly placed citizens are involved in a not so flattering way OR my real life surprise of walking with a neighbor who gets a call from his brother, a sheriff deputy in the Midwest who is just released from jail after a bogus prosecution by two judges he'd reported (after a 911 heart attack call) and tons drugs found at the scene exposing a massive drug/arrest/prosecute - repeat scenario. That deputy now wishes he never had called in what he stumbled upon after the heat they gave him.
Bottom line is 'violent crime' reaches far beyond the petty, stupid crap you see on Cops and your local news...it goes way beyond that and reaches into places you don't wish to accept or don't want to believe.
Violent crimes will rise and fall as society grows..the only serious approach? Start at the top and work your way down..low level petty street crimes form out of desperation, drug fueled and drug gangs - the hardest and most unpredictable? The acts of desperation..they aren't organized or unified like gang acts. Drug gang activity always ends up leading to dirty cops and corrupt city officials & politicians. As the TV show, Chicago PD showed on the last season, when it leads to high up that it threatens Law Enforcement itself...the LE has to step back and let it play out because 'the-powers-that-be' in the end ..prefers to keep it going.
Those kids on the streets protesting they know that, they know better than their parents how screwed up and corrupt the system is. The system must be confronted.
Those sitting at home bitching, complaining and unable to discern 'criminal looters from honest peaceful protesters' are the most problematic because of the intellectual laziness is simply unable to address the root cause and follow where it leads, no matter where it leads.
I don't want more police. They would all be let go if we allowed private security forces. There are real consequences for being a racist or performing poorly in the private sector. The unions are also much weaker. My proposal is to bring more accountability. And that just isn't possible with police unions.
BN747 pretty much nailed it and destroyed your argument. The idea that private firms would be more accountable than the current system is ludicrous. Like mentioned above we would become Mexico or Somalia with warlords for your police chief. The rich and the politicians would still have their own premium protection.The same politicians that are responsible for making the rules and laws for the current system would still be in charge and making the same decisions with your private force. Our current force does not need more officers or less officers it needs better trained and more educated officers that represent the city and neighborhoods they live in.
It already exist in those exact terms in Lebanon (and I'm certain many more places around the globe).
I have two Lebanese friends (both from Beirut but unknown to each other) and asked each about 'local police deployment and structure'.
Both told me in so many words 'sections or city blocks are under the auspices of an appointed or agreed upon local 'tough guy' , not an elected or state sanctioned appointed position mind you, but gang/mobster-style like selection and if someone from one area offended a person from another...the two honchos would decide on the just punishment'...I was like WTF?
Who wants to live under conditions that hark back to the era Cave men? That sure ass hell is not advancement in any shape or form.
Which is why western methods of humans policing humans is best model on the planet. I say Western because not necessarily America (which needs major reform) but mainly what from what I've seen in the Netherlands, the Dutch cops are some huge mofos, but not bullies..level headed patience, just don't piss them off or they crunch you if you give them no other options.